Comments on: Sony Officially Announces NR Series in U.S.

Didn't sony learn from Palm about pre-ordering?

Sony has always gave pre-orders on all of their pdas, and we haven't heard a single bad news article about it.

nXt's Clie Club
Place To Be For Sony Clie Discussion
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nxtclieclub

nxt,

I'm surprised that you haven't heard anything bad about SonyStyle.com's pre-ordering...

When they first released the N710C in the States, they only had a few products in hand. However, they didn't ship the PDAs to those that pre-ordered first, in stead, they ship those to Staples, BB, and stuffs.

Some of the pre-orderers tried to cancel the order, but because of their 'complicated processing system,' their orders weren't canceled, and they have to spend $100 for shipment return / re-stocking fee.

most countries allow you to purchase things from other countries... I believe you can do this with use of the mail in most places... sometimes the total cost is less... good luck!

Amen, there were a LOT of problems with the preordering in the past. Sony's cancellation policy is a joke, I think they just don't have one. So you will not be too happy when you pre-order and don't get your device right away, and the local Best Buy gets them instead.

you never know....

I don't know if this accounts for all of the price increase but it costs more to ship something a third of the way around the planet than it does to ship it down the street. These are too hot an item to go by cargo ship. I'll bet you every one of these has been flown here.

Don't just blame Sony! Other Palm/Handspring devices are also cheaper in Japan and other part of Asia. The Palm M100 was selling as low as $40 in Japan at some point.

Actually, with the Yen as low as it is against the dollar, I don't think shipping would affect it that much. Several US industries have said that the Japaneese government have been keeping the yen low to make their products cheaper in the US. But looking at the price, this isn't one of them.

PDAs are cheaper in Asia may be because they are produced in Asia?

IMHO

Its simpler than all the reasons listed above. It is $100 more because of marketing.

We pay $100 more because we will.

In Japan they have so many other gagdets and 3rd generation phones to distract the gagdet lover, they probably need to price it lower to compete. Here, there is not that much competition....

They have to pay a lot of import tax. It's the US who charged to much of tax for a product to get in here. Asia country don't charge them as much. US is charging high import tax for a reason, to keep US companies alive. If every Sony product is $100 cheaper, who is going to buy palm and handspring???

One possible reason is ,in many countries of Asia, there is almost no any good return policy, I mean you cannot return your stuff within 15 or 30 days if the product is not broken. That probably means the cost of the retailer in these countries is lower than US local retailers. So that's why you need to pay more to cover this cost of the same product. Just my guess ...

maybe the continuing recession in Japan and general economic softness in Asia has something to do with the pricing. The US economy is seen to be on the mend, so perhaps sony thinks the US marketplace can support the 100 dollar price difference.

Maybe the folks at Sony have been reading PIC. Seems to me that there has been no shortage of fools here salivating to throw away $600 on a handheld computer.

When it all shakes out, and those with money to burn have finished slobbering all over the display cases at Circuit City, the price of these new Clies will be more in line with what a more sensible Japanese consumer is willing to pay at the onset.

Don't forget that a dollar means different things in different parts of even the US too. You can get a nice apartment in some parts of the country for $400 a month, but try looking for housing in New York City or Silicon Valley.

I have no idea what this means for the Japanese/US pricing of the Clies, though. :P

Think yourself lucky you don't live in the UK..
The price will be the same in GBP as it is in US Dollars - work it out - UK gets shafted on prices for EVERYTHING.

mrscarey

palmist and visionary

For those people who said Asian countries charge less, it simply isn't true.

Hong Kong charge 3280, or 420 with Chinese OS for T615c. We all know that the Chinese OS is about 10-20 dollars in bulk order os the price comes to 400.

In Japan most stores sells T615C for 40,000 Yen, or 304 dollars.

So, not the U.S. government, not cheap cost in Asian, just that Sony decides to charge more in area outside of Japan.

Yes, I agree that it is because Sony belives that

>> We will pay for the extra USD100.

In Japan, the major PDA leader is Sharp. So they lower the price in Japan to attract the gadget lovers.

For myself in HK, we pay roughly the same as those in USA, USD100 more than in Japan domestics price.

regards,

QUOTE :
"We pay $100 more because we will."

Exatcly! In our history we have always been taken advantage of like that because :
1. We consumers have the money.
2. We will most likely pay for what we want without any fuss.

But in other countries you can buy stuff such as ice cream for only 10 cents! (in american money). I suppose Sony knows that it wont greatly effect us by settiing a higher price since the high-end pda's have reached over 400.00usd.

http://pdan.has.it

Same here in Hong Kong. I paid a little over usd400 for a T615C from Sonystyle. The T600 (Jap. version) is only usd300 here with store-only warranty.
Since the Sony product cycle is so short, next time I will just buy the Jap. version.

I say we bomb them.....oh, wait a second this is only a PDA we're talking about, sorry...carry on

Sounds like $ONY is simply subsidizing the cheap prices at home with our $$. If you gotta have one of these, then $100 isn't going to stop you. I'll wait until the OS5 x-scale comes out 2 weeks after this is released and then see if the price drops by about.... a $100.

Yes, complain about the 100 dollar price difference you guys! Cause when it hits europe, the price tag will be 200 dollar higher...

That includes my playstation 2 which was 250 dollar more in Norway, than in the States where my bro bought one....

Cheers :)

Hmmm ... yes, some kind of screen protector would be a must if you are going to use this thing as a PDA-like device instead of the mini-laptop that it is.

<< some kind of screen protector would be a must if you are going to use this thing as a PDA-like device instead of the mini-laptop that it is. >>

I think your "mini-laptop" phrase is very perceptive. Sony has released a number of VAIO laptops in the past that sought to push the small-size envelope. I suspect you're right in suggesting that they intend this to be part-PDA, part-superminilaptop. That would certainly explain the pricing.

Sony already had a mini laptop, not too much bigger than this with a built in camera.

Anyhow, my point was that many people were claiming that you could just keep this in the form with the screen exposed and it would be just like a normal PDA. While that is true, with the keyboard folded away, it then offers you no protection for the screen.

I wonder if the MP3 player uses it as a buffer...

As far as I know, the MP3 files will be on the MS and since it is solid state storge medium, there is no need for buffer (well, a little bit buffer may be needed for the MP3 decoding software to run). Besides, are ROMs too slow to be used as buffer?

Yeah, from the experience of someone who has self-upgraded Clies and Palms, and a frequent user of programs like JackFlash and BackupBuddy, that particular internal Flash ROM is too slow at WRITING to be used as an MP3 buffer. A proper buffer needs to be super fast at reading and writing so that the music doesn't skip. It would take ages to create the buffer, though it could read from it pretty quickly.

--JM

Using flash memory for buffers is a bad idea anyway, because flash memory has a limited number of write cycles. (Yes, it's in the millions, but as an MP3 is playing, it's conceivable that the contents of the buffer could change continuously.)

Could the built in apps have anything to do with this high ROM value? What of the higher res would it need more rom to support this?

Or maybe it will be os5 upgradable???

LG, I don't think it will be able to run OS5, because OS5 will be used in future PDA's with ARM chips. The new sony clie models listed on this article are not ARM chip powered devices.

I was wondering myself why they added extra flash memory. I expect that they might make a few updates or upgrades to make the Palm OS more personalized with multimedia functions. They already have done that with past models. Lucky future users can get jackflash and get a hold of all that memory!! :D

http://pdan.has.it

I still think it is interesting that it didn't get mentioned in the release that Sony sent to the press.

---
News Editor

*if* what they are saying is accurate, a 17% hit versus the T615 (10 days versus 12 days) probably isn't that bad considering the extra features.

Ahh, but means the actual runtime will now be close to 4 1/2 hours (20% less than the T615C's 5 1/2 hours).

Don't get me wrong, I love my T615, but Sony really needs to work on their battery life. The NR is feature packed, but wouldn't last a single day for me.

Alas, the cruel irony of it all; a Lexus with a five gallon gas tank...

If you can live with the battery life of PPC, you will not be too sad about this sweet baby.

Ah, but if you can live with the battery life of PPC, you just might be a PPC user, which means you won't be reading PIC unless you want to troll.

No, no inside info. But I keep hoping.

The Palm Desktop for OS X will allow some Sony models to HotSync. Of course, none of the specialized conduits are included. There is no way at this point to know whether the NR series will work with it.

I know Mark/Space is working on NR support.

---
News Editor

Thanks Ed. I just think it's a shame Mac users have to shell out $30 extra.

Depending on what you want support for, you may not need Sony. There is plenty of UNIX/Linux software out supporting the Palm, and I strongly suspect that all the new features of these handhelds will be supported soon as well. That code probably just works on OSX.

"There is plenty of UNIX/Linux software out supporting the Palm... That code probably just works on OSX" I don't know what's funnier - The idea of a Mac boy spending even MORE money on overpriced hardware because it looks cool, or their begging the open source movement to write software for them because Sony obviously can't be bothered with their platform. I'm surprised that somebody hasen't started recompiling Jpilot for OS X and selling it in MacWorld at $60 a box.

Palm Desktop 4.0 will sync with no problems to any CLIE with PalmOS 4 or later. If you have an IR port on your Mac, you can use it to sync to -any- CLIE. The only situation in which you need The Missing Sync is if you have a CLIE with PalmOS earlier than 4.0, and no IR on your Mac.

The only thing The Missing Sync does that Palm Desktop doesn't is to mount the CLIE's Memory Stick on the Desktop. For that, I already use Sony's Memory Stick PC Card Adapter in my PowerBook G4 in conjunction with my CyberShot camera, and it works like a charm in either OS 9 or OS X. I haven't tried the USB reader, but I assume it works pretty much the same, since the stick drive in the camera mounts up over USB without any problems. This has the added advantages of not requiring cables (and you wouldn't want to mount a volume over IR), and not using up any power on the device.

It's sad that because of a mistake in early CLIEs, Sony is still having trouble selling into the Mac market, even though the original problem is long since solved.

Maybe they're just saying "Backlit" on the site for simplicity's sake...

I'm sure people would be more freaked out by "Trans-Reflective Backlit LCD Screen"

I'm under the strong impression that it's Transreflective.

---
If you sing in french while hopping on one foot, the evil birds won't come out of your bathroom mirror.

The description for the NR series is exactly the same as that for the T-series. Based on that, I would assume that the screen is, indeed, transreflective.

Right.

Transflective *IS* backlit. It combines the superior backlighting of the traditional back-lit PDA, with the outdoor viewability of a side-lit PDA.

The Palm m130 has a screen like the 615, except the colors are perfect, and it doesn't have hi-res.

I'm an m505 owner, but I must say I'm jealous as h*ll of the m130's screen.

Yes,it's Transreflective with true RED & Yellow , no washed out anymore..

It is backlit. There is the lighting layer. Then the LCD layer. So, it is still an LCD screen at heart, with a light behind it. That is how it can also still turn off the lighting and see it in the sunlight.

The m130 does NOT have the same screen as a T615. The T615 has a transflective backlit screen, as opposed to a backlit LCD screen.

<< The m130 does NOT have the same screen as a T615. The T615 has a transflective backlit screen, as opposed to a backlit LCD screen. >>

No, the m130 has a TRANSREFLECTIVE backlit screen. It's not exactly like the T615, but it's the same technology. It looks a little different because it's plastic, not glass.

Perhaps you should check the facts next time before posting a comment that implicitly says "I'm ignorant."

That is the funny post I have ever read.

I think you flamed yourself.

Qoute:
"they'll say I'm some retard who's clearly stupid regarding the apparent superiority of Sony products, as though I'm somehow inferior as a person...."

Reply quote:
"I think you flamed yourself."

I....AM ......DYING .....LAUGHING
Flamed himself Haaaaaa.
That is right,never seen any one do that

Qoute original Post:
"I'll happily ignore the proclamations of the Sony-istas."

Never mind the "Sonyistas" you need a shrink, deal with your own self loathing.
LOL

Just kidding dude. Of course I know what you meant. Hope you have a sense of humor. You gotta admit the "Flamed yourself" comment is pretty funny when you look at your post. Couldnt help but add fuel to the "Fire."

<< "I think you flamed yourself." >>

No, I think that was an attempt at fire prevention. I think you need to reread the post.

$600 is insane, camera or no camera.

iPAQ 64mb sells for $499 (if not cheaper on discount)
Zaurus 64 also sells for $499. (it even come with mini office suits surprisingly)

It seems Sony is banking that people will pay that much money for style.

He/She said what most would have said - get it?

I, for one, get it. The initial post here is basically beating all the "Sony-istas" to the punch. It's no secret that there are at least a handful of pro-Sony loonies here at PIC who try to suggest that purchasing anything BUT a Sony is somehow criminal behavior punishable by death. I don't know that the original poster was engaging in self-loathing so much as he/she was saying, "I won't buy it. I know what you're going to say. Up yours."

Personally, I too am not interested in this device. I was looking toward a device in the T615 form factor with MP3 capabilities and hopefully the 66mhz dragonball. But now, I'm more inclined to wait till OS 5. I'm a Sony lover, I got my mom a S320 and my dad a N610. But I think I'm going to wait unless my Palm IIIc dies on me, which I fear it is close to. If it does die, I'd be likely to get a T615. I don't need a mini keyboard because I use Grafitti efficiently and if I do need to type something, I'd like the ability to type on a full size keyboard. I guess I'll have to wait till OS 5 for MP3 capabilities in a simple form factor.

To compare you MUST check similar features. The iPaq may be $499 but it DOESN´T include an expansion jacket which you MUST purchase separately, the iPaq DOESN´T include a keyboard or a camera or even 65000 colors... Not to mention battery life :-(

the jacket is only $50 if not cheaper, or even get a second hand. The darned thing doesn't cost $100. Plus it's CF. (as oppose to the useless Memstick.) On top of that the CF memory is cheaper than MS in larger size, if not the only option. Try getting a 512Mb Memstick. Good luck.

No matter how you spin it, this NR is very expensive compare to competition with more features.

the jacket is only $50 if not cheaper, or even get a second hand. The darned thing doesn't cost $100. Plus it's CF. (as oppose to the useless Memstick.) On top of that the CF memory is cheaper than MS in larger size, if not the only option. Try getting a 512Mb Memstick. Good luck.

No matter how you spin it, this NR is very expensive compare to competition with more features.

Yep, no doubt about it. The fact that the PPC trolls feel the need to come here and defend their precious iPaqs is a sign that they are scared.

In late April or early May Fujitsu-Siemans will intro the Pocket Loox. 400 MHz Intel Xscale processor, 64 meg of ram, 2 expansion slots and a 16 bit 320x240 screen and possibly integrated Bluetooth. Estimated price is around $600. How can the NR compete with this. Its just a gadget compared to a true hand held computer with network potential.

On discount iPAQ goes for about $399-450 on the net, plus $40 CF expansion, that's still far from $599.

With the spare money one can get 2100ma battery replacement, that should make the gadget last about 12-14hrs continuously.

Or maybe replace the internal memory from 64Mb to 128 or 256Mb. (just stuff everything, including 2 hrs of mp3, time sink softwares and last 10 vacations photos, with room to spare for that boring office files.

Or maybe just get that just announced tri-band sleeve. (GPRS anybody?)

well, that's a message from PPC troll to you. reminding what PDA can go with that much money these days.

I think it just shows how low this forum has come down to sometimes. PIC is known for childish flaming and frustrated venting of silly issues. This guy/gal probably tried to illustrate what it's like here. I guess one can hardly make a rational, objective comment here wihout getting one's character asassinated.

Perhaps some of the topics posted here hits a nerve but if you cannot give a coherent rebuttal, butt out.

To the original post-- sorry dude, but you are a "FLAME". Frankly, I would prefer that you keep your Palm so as to not ruin the image of CLIÉ users out there.

"In late April or early May Fujitsu-Siemans will intro the Pocket Loox." - And Danger will be releasing the Hiptop any day now. And don't forget the OS5 ARM units, and Bill's Webpads, or the communicators from Star Trek, for that matter. --- Boy, woulden't it be great if we could compute on THEORETICAL hardware, instead of having to use all this obviously inferior ACTUAL hardware?

well, LOOX is not a prototype or pre-Beta like 5.0. It' ready to market complete with website, press release (US in May,$599), show and tell in the last Cebit. And it's Fujitsu-Siemens, not exactly some no name outfit.

So, did you actually get to /use/ one? Hell, the Hiptop has had a website for almost a year solid now - dosen't make it any more real.
And there's a heck of a lot of diffrence between what you see at a trade expo and what actually happens - I mean, even PPC's manage to look at least half-assed in a demo enviroment like that.

Remember, friends, you don't have to buy the one with the camera! Save $100 and do without!

I would say that the folding clamshell design has more use than just for the sake of the built-in keyboard. It effectively eliminates the need for a case. I personally could care less if the metal on my Clie gets a bit scratched, protecting the screen is why I bought a hard case...

Of course not, but I was commenting on what seems like a poor trade-off involved in this kind of design. I'd rather wait for a simpler design and have the option of using a full size keyboard and greater connectivity.

Of course some people like thumb keyboards. But at least Blackberrys have wonderful email capability.

Thanks, Robrecht

Anyone who has ever dropped a PDA would probably want a case to protect this $500-$600 investment!

Thanks, Robrecht

Haven't you noticed? The case is magnesium! You can freaking throw this PDA against a wall and it won't break! After all, it's a Sony, and we all know they NEVER do wrong! The price is perfect, the screen is perfect, the case is perfect, the little twisty thing is perfect! Sony is God!

QUOTE :
"Remember, friends, you don't have to buy the one with the camera! Save $100 and do without!"

Agreed. I rather buy a digital camera using either mem stick or sd technology for my m500 or clie s360 (loan). I can even find one cheaper than 100 bucks.

http://pdan.has.it

<< Remember, friends, you don't have to buy the one with the camera! Save $100 and do without! >>

OR, save $500-600 by keeping what you've got if it does what you need. Face it--the NR series is a gadget-lover's dream, but it's hardly a product that expands the real functionality of a PDA (even though it might look like it does).

Here's what the NR series really does:
1) Adds processing power
2) Increases POSSIBLE screen size (you can't really argue that it has TRUE virtual graffiti YET--graffiti comes up automatically, so what it has is software-based graffiti)
3) Decreases battery life
4) Builds in a keyboard
5) Builds in a camera
6) Builds in an mp3 player

Here's what the NR series DOESN'T do:
1) Increase memory
2) Add a modem
3) Add built-in wireless
4) Employ TRUE virtual graffiti (like the Handera--a flawed, but innovative, device)
5) Add networking capability
6) Improve battery life, or at least add more function to existing battery life

Granted, some of the things the NR series doesn't do will require OS5, but that's partly my point. This is a neat device--a gadget-lover's dream. But please stop foaming at the mouth as though this is somehow as revolutionary a product as, say, the original Apple Macintosh was in its day. It's simply not--get over it, wipe off your chin, and change your shirt--the collar's soaked.

I ask you: is that innovation?

"Although the screen and soft graffiti are a great step forward that will, I hope, become a new standard .." ----

Using Sony's previous expansions (Memory Stick, and the 320x320 screen) as examples, all I can say is 'I hope to god not.' - Memory stick is slow and deeply flawed as an expansion technology compared to CF, or even the almost-as-ridiculous SD. Their 'screen expansion technology' is a battery sucking hardware kludge. The only reason they offered their 'screen expansion' for inclusion into Palm's OS was as a poison pill. Anybody trying to use it would be stuck with Sony's implemntation and resolution - and guess who the only current major manuf. of 320x320 screens is? If you guessed 'Sony', you're right!

We'll just have to wait for someone to dissect one.

My thoughts are that it either has to be unbelievably strong, or it has to have an easily detachable connection, so that if the wrong type of pressure is applied, it would safely snap off.

---
If you sing in french while hopping on one foot, the evil birds won't come out of your bathroom mirror.

It is the same tried-and-true pivot that is on their miniature video camera LCD screens.

"It is the same tried-and-true pivot that is on their miniature video camera LCD screens"

Very true, and they are tougher than they look. I have had one of them for about 4 years, and none of my kids have broken the flip-and-rotate screen yet.

Ok, wait about 6 weeks... ;)

I bet you think you're kidding. Just wait until the T615 shows up as "Sold Out" on the SonyStyle website.

Yes, they should be the same

Magnesium is much stronger and a good bit lighter than aluminum if that helps.

Also, if you ever get stranded in the mountians, you can use the case for tinder, scrape off little chips of the case into a little pile, get a spark to it, and the damn stuff will burn.

I bet thats one feature you didn't see in the brochure.

No idiot. The case is magenesium alloy, not the same manesium block one buys at REI!

Some people have no sense of humor.

lol

Well, if you have $600 for a PDA...

Is it a bid deal ? Do you want them to include 8MB memorystick ? It's useless anyway.

You didn't have to go searching through PDFs. It says right up there in the article: "They don't actually come with a Memory Stick, though."

But look how much flash memory you are getting! No big deal to tell the truth. If you can afford that PDA, you can afford a much cheaper mem stick.

http://pdan.has.it

If you're like me and a devoted Clie fan, then you already have two or three memory sticks so no biggie, IMHO.

I think the rubber is added around the hole not the stylus. Maybe I am wrong.

No, same stylus as T. Just rubber inside the stylus silo.

There was a website somewhere that showed how you can take apart a disposable lighter, and use the rubber o-rings on your sony clie stylii.

Anybody have a link?

---
If you sing in french while hopping on one foot, the evil birds won't come out of your bathroom mirror.

Here's the link

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/shaun.mcgill/cliestylus.htm

STAPLES, BEST BUY, OFFICE DEPOT... all preorders and just like we have all seen, thats where you see'm first.

The guy meant who is going to be pre ordering it, and he's not. he wasn't asking what stores are offering pre orders.

nXt's Clie Club
Place To Be For Sony Clie Discussion
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nxtclieclub

Just preordered 50 units of each model as my first order in NR series.

Did you also buy a t-shirt that reads "Sucker?"

I'll chime in here and risk the wrath of my fellow posters:

I pre-ordered an NR70V from Amazon.

There, I said it.

Yeah, I know it's $600 bucks, and that even thinking about buying one marks me as an idiot of the first order, but hey, it's my money and I don't feel like waiting for OS5 to ship before upgrading my m505.

And since we've already established that I'm an idiot, I can freely confess here that in addition to my m505, I also own both an iPAQ and an HP J568. As such, I am more than willing to accept the NR's (presumed) less-than-stellar battery life - though, truth be told, that damn 568 goes forever on a charge...

The NR Looks like a killer device to me. I can't wait to get my hands on it.

-Adam

>Did you also buy a t-shirt that reads "Sucker?"

yes I did get a T-shirt that reads "Palm Sucks" together with the order of 100 units of Clie NR70.

I'm an idiot,too.

The $600 is outrageous. The $500 is outrageous. That is what will make it so much fun.

Everything I ever wanted. Replaces

Paper
Typewriter
Photo Album
Diary
Gameboy (which I won't use myself, but it will make friends and family envious)
Music boxes of all kinds
Desktop computer
Camera
Tape Recorder
Remote Control for TV
Remote viewer for TV recordings

But even if it were just there for the Word Processing, I would pay $600 for it.

QUOTE :
"and I don't feel like waiting for OS5 to ship before upgrading my m505."

When OS5 comes out you are going to wish that you waited and didn't waste your money. I bought the m500 when it first came out, and NOW i wished I waited till the monochrome s360 came out first. But that's my problem.

http://pdan.has.it

What I meant by all those stores pre-ordering is that they "pre-order" way before everyone else and that from what I have read on this site and others, if you want to get one as quickly as posible, pre-ordering is not the way to go, it is to go camp out at the nearest store.

QUOTE:
"When OS5 comes out you are going to wish that you waited and didn't waste your money. I bought the m500 when it first came out, and NOW i wished I waited till the monochrome s360 came out first. But that's my problem."

Hardly. When OS5 comes out I'm going to wait like everyone else to see which company releases the most compelling device, and then, wait for the bugs to be ironed out of said device. We're talking at least until October here, if not later. And in the meantime, I'll be having a blast with my overpriced, underpowered PEG-NR70V. Besides, how does the release of OS5 detract from the functionality of the NR? There's ALWAYS something better coming down the pike. For instance, I'll also be replacing my HP J568 (purchased last October) with an XScale Fujitsu-Siemens LOOX as soon as they're released. Doubtless, another PPC2002 OEM will be coming out with an even more powerful PPC soon thereafter. And thus, the cycle continues.

-Adam

PS - Yes, a fool and his money are easily parted... But hey, it keeps me off the heroin.

Using Teal Movie 2.22beta on my T615 I have a full episode of The Family Guy (22 Minutes / 23 MB), The short film Troops (12 minutes / 10 MB), and a spoof StarWars/SouthPark Trailer (2 minutes / 2 MB) on my 128 MB Memory stick along with 8 MP3's encoded at 128kbs as some other files with 23 MB of free space). It is my understanding that the Japanese version of the T615 can use GMovie on the desktop and convert television programs for later viewing off of the MS. I don't see the quality as being great (or even good at this point), but it is there for "wow" and gee-whiz factor. I forsee this coming, but not as a "useable" feature until OS5 and the ARM7/XScale processor hit the market, as well as better battery life.

To keep everyone happy: I like my Sony, but its not for everyone. I'm not jumping on the NR-70 right now. Too much, too soon. It is good to see that there is a device out there for everyone though.

"We're a planet of nearly six billion ninnies living in a civilization that was designed by a few thousand amazingly smart deviants."

-Scott Adams

I think this is one of the biggest promises of soft graffiti--but we must wait for software developers. I wonder what Quickoffice spreadsheets look like on this SONY? Quickoffice developed a version of their spreadsheet program for landscape viewing on the Handera 330.

See the following link:
http://www.cesinc.com/quickoffice/handera330/

Thanks, Robrecht

Hey Palm Addict

Can I get a copy of these videos from you some how?

I would love to try that out. Most of the videos for teal are not great.

Thanks.

Yeah, if SONY could be bothered to actually do stuff the right way, they'd have made their OS/Screen compatable with the hacks, extensions and programs already out there and written for the H330. But they probably diden't. Heck, they coulden't even be bothered to write mac drivers. They won't even keep the same connector across three models.

I believe it is a program for reading POP email, not a replacement for the standard Mail Palm app. I've seen references to Clie Mail on Japanese sites, and what I think is a review of the program on muchy.com, which had a couple of pics that suggested POP email app.

Does anyone know where to get an English version of Clie Mail?

Have not really heard of English version of Clie Mail yet except with this handheld. Somebody did mention that it came with the modem for the S/N-series. I am not sure about that.

Clie Mail has been among the bundled software since the S-series for the Japanese models. It is multi-account POP mail client. Before the NR-series, it allows attachment in the format of PGP picture, .pdb, .prc files. The new version support jpeg attachment.

Summary Of Attachement supported:

From RAM
--------
* PG Pocket pictures
* address record (.vcf files)
* memo (.txt files)
* .prc files
* .pdb files

Directly from MS
----------------
* DCF (jpeg) files
* PGP pictures

- Eugene

Yes, Clie Mail did come with the modem, but it really sucks and I wouldn't waste my time trying to find it. The free email program from Eudora is much better.

The jog wheel stays in the same place (it is on the bottom half of the device with the keyboard. When you rotate the screen, the Clie automatically "flips" the display to show it "face up".

"We're a planet of nearly six billion ninnies living in a civilization that was designed by a few thousand amazingly smart deviants."

-Scott Adams

"If one has this thing all flipped around will the jog dial be useless? it wont always be in the same place."

Useless? In Portrait mode it's in the same place regardless of wether you're using the screen clamshell or flipped down. In landscape mode (if that's something they're going to offer), then you're right in that it'll be on the top or bottom, but it's still going to be in the vacinity of an index finger. The HandEra API lets you choose which way you want the rotation for landscape mode (90 or 270), so it'd be thoughtful for them to follow that template, except some apps like QuickOffice which only have a checkbox for "rotate" and force a particular orientation on you. Fortunately I believe only QuickOffice uses that restrictive approach.

-Craig Bowers

Remember, look at the picture, this Clie can flip and twist!

You open the clam, and FLIP/TURN the screen and then close the clam.

The whole bottom half (jog dial) of the clie stays put. you still have access to it.

nXt's Clie Club
Place To Be For Sony Clie Discussion
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nxtclieclub

I'd buy a Zaurus long before I'd buy one of these NR-series devices.

I agree. I'm really interested in trying out a Zaurus at Fry's, Best Buy, or Office Depot. My local Fry's had one on display, but it was not charged yet. The form factor is nice--much smaller than anticipated. I hope they've got it charged soon, so I can play around and try it out.

Of course, I'd also like to test-drive the new Sony, but my impressions right now are that the Zaurus would be the better PDA. At least it has a name.

Zaurus is $499, not to mention has built in SD/CF slots. That over time will cost less than Memory stick. And it plays real mpeg4, as oppose to some funny format.

> I'm really interested in trying out a Zaurus at Fry's,
> Best Buy, or Office Depot.

I got to try one out at Circuit City. Very nice. Includes apps to work with MS Word, PowerPoint and Excel.

Agreed, but this device will at least stop some current Palm users would otherwise migrate to the Zaurus. Of course, almost all of us have yet to use either device.

All six of the current Palm (or I should probably say Clie) owners who will migrate to the NR series, are probably the ones posting here. This device in the long run will be a small fraction of 1% of the market. I suppose even that small number matters though.

Palm and Sony users should shake hand. Both are doing their bid. Palm does not have enough money to put into R&D, so atleast in my opinion, their lack of innovation has an excuse. However the lack of innovation on the PPC platform is disgusting considering the fact that they have Compaq, Toshiba, HP & Casio on their list with gazillions of cash. I personally won't buy the NR series and will wait for OS 5 and an ARM based device. However I think the NR is good, we need a high end model. Right now, there is a Palm for every desired budget.

Palm m100 - $40
Palm m105 - $80
Palm m125 - $120
Palm m130 - $199
Palm m500 - $199
Palm m505 - $250
Palm m515 - $350
Sony Clie PEG-S360 - $199
Sony Clie PEG-T415 - $220
Sony Clie PEG-T615 - $399
Sony Clie NR70 - $499
Sony Clie NR70V - $599
Treo 180 - $399 (depending on airtime contract)
Visor Edge - $100
Visor Pro - $250
etc etc
This are probably the average price on the retail level/internet sales not the recommended price

The great thing is all of these runs on PalmOS. On the PPC level, the cheapest PPC 2000 model is around $300. There are other CE models that are around $100 but the softwares made for those are not backward compatible with the new PPC models with ARM processors. As for the Zairus, it's good, but it does not have the amount of 3rd party softwares available (yet!).

Go PalmOS!

"However the lack of innovation on the PPC platform is disgusting considering the fact that they have Compaq, Toshiba, HP & Casio on their list with gazillions of cash."

Lack of innovation? what innovation do you expect exactly? built in fusion reactor? portable time machine? or zero emission motor?

Are you referring to the innovative "vibrating alarm" in m5xx? or the non existance "SDIO" application in Palm OS? how about file system and multitasking?

meanwhile, in PPC-land where innovation is lacking, people can install 256Mb internal memory/40Gig external, having a GPRS connection, browse the web, open and manipulate office file. Oh, and that dubious "multimedia" I suppose.

I am sure the world is in awe over the latest Palm Inc m515 'innovative' offering.

Of course, I'd also like to test-drive the new Sony, but my impressions right now are that the Zaurus would be the better PDA. At least it has a name.

Clie is not a name?

Of course, I'd also like to test-drive the new Sony, but my impressions right now are that the Zaurus would be the better PDA. At least it has a name.

SL 5500 is a name?

"All six of the current Palm (or I should probably say Clie) owners who will migrate to the NR series, are probably the ones posting here. This device in the long run will be a small fraction of 1% of the market. I suppose even that small number matters though."

You can add me to those 6 (actually 20 MILLION potential upgraders who currently own Palms) and I am an Ipaq user who is sick, absolutely sick of this piece of junk. Mostly sick of it's pathetic OS.

How many people do you personally know that reads these sites? Probably not even a blip on the radar of percentage of ownership of PDAs.

Higgy

Doesn't Ed keep a count of how many reads he gets on this site?

> Now I can just save a few more bucks, wait for the targus
> stowaway adapter and look forward to a GREAT spring!

Another life saved by consumer electronics! Now my evening is complete!

Higgy

God........I can't believe how insignificant the IPAQ seems now. Go Sony GO.

Oh, please. I love the PalmOS, but the iPaq has some heavy-duty capabilities that this Sony simply doesn't have, no matter how cool it appears to be. PocketPC is flawed, but it simply does things you can't do with a Palm. Personally, I think many of those functions are unnecessary, but the fact that it can do those things makes it significant, and your beloved new Sony doesn't change that. Sorry.

no.

LoL .. Just in case you are yet another one of those Palm Trolls who are pretending to be a Clie Troll, Palm's Handhelds does suck comparing to any same level of Clie currently.

So partialy you are right about everyone should get a Clie :)

Ha ha! Sony fans troll around even more than iPAQ fans, which is sayin a lot!

As for Sony offerings being better than Palm offerings at evey level, what you trolls don't understand is that it depends on the user. I own a T615 and an m515, but I pretty much only use the m515. The T615 sits in a drawer at home. I am considering giving it to one of my relatives. Hopefully she won't become a troll =].

Just added it as a new poll. Thanks for the suggestion!

-Ryan
webmaster@palminfocenter.com