Rumor: More Info on Palm's Forthcoming Low-End Handheld

Posted By: Ed Monday, August 12, 2002 10:30:03 AM

Several sources have come forward with more information on the sub-$100 model Palm will release later this year. According to one who says he has actually seen a prototype, it is a very basic model with 2 MB of memory and no SD/MMC slot. It is not a member of the venerable m100 series. Instead, it has a shape which is described as being similar to Sony's T series. It will come in an all-white plastic casing.

According to a second source, who may contradict the first one, this model will have the standard Up/Down keys but only two app-launching hardware buttons, not the four that have always been on Palm OS devices.

As was revealed last week, yet a third source says this model will be available in October, which is in plenty of time for the all-important holiday shopping season.

All that is definitely known about this model is that, earlier this year, Eric Benhamou, Palm's CEO, said his company would release this fall a new low-end model which will debut for less than $100.

There is not yet any word of what size screen Palm will use with this model. The m100 series uses a smaller than usual one but, as mentioned earlier, this new handheld won't be a member of that series.

The first source says this model doesn't even follow Palm's system of naming its products a combination of letters and numbers. Instead, it has name that is a short word, though the source declined to reveal what it was.

There has been a great deal of debate recently on whether Palm is changing its method of naming its products. The image leaked last month of a future high-end Palm handheld is clearly labeled "Oslo", though this name could be for internal use.

In May, the company trademarked three words: Tungsten, Zire, and Veld. If Palm isn't planning to use these as actual product names, there seems little use in trademarking them. It may be a coincidence but at about that same time, Palm's CEO announced that his company would be releasing three new models later this year.

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not for me

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 10:50:11 AM #
Not for me, but this should be a great unit for people knew to the palm scene who just wanna "try it out" but aren't ready to shell out a few hundred bucks.

i'm glad to hear this'll be in the palm family

RE: not for me
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 10:54:25 AM #
Well, except for the serial port HotSync cable, I'd bet they'd be better off picking up one of those $99 m105s than waiting for Palm's new $99 unit. I doubt the new Palm will have 8MB, and it probably will be of cheaper construction than the m105, which was designed to sell for more than the price it's going for.

RE: not for me
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/13/2002 9:13:05 PM #
I think it will have 8 MB RAM, USB etc. If sony can put a high-rez screen, expansion, and all of the other features in their handheld and sell it for $150, then Palm can sell an 8 MB Palm for $99.

Excuse ME!

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 11:08:58 AM #
If no one bought the m1xx series to enter into this market, why would they buy a 2mb Palm now? Why not buy a used Palmpilot! Is Palm competiting with those Sharp organizers??? Like I said before, glorified organizers. That's all. Nothing new. Seems Palm is going backwards. Sorry guys, it's just my 2 cents.
RE: Excuse You
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 11:12:13 AM #
People bought the m100 by the truck-load. It was one of the most successful PDAs of all time... but not with the people who read PIC, who are hobbists and will spend big bucks on a PDA. Cheap models like this are why the Palm OS has 4 times the sales of PPC.

Pricing is all about profit margin. If it costs $90 to make a m100 and Palm sells it for $100, it makes an OK profit. But if they designed the new model to be even cheaper to make, like $70, and can sell it for $100, that's much better. Especially considering they will be selling it for $70 in less than 6 months.

People won't pay the same thing for a PDA that was released a year ago as they will for one that has just been released. But if what it costs you to make the PDA doesn't decline at the same rate, you got problems. That's probably why Palm is making a new low end model that will be cheaper to make and give a better profit margin than the m100 or m105.

Mind Reader
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 1:19:37 PM #
It's almost as if you stole my thoughts.

You nailed it, right-on.

People tend to get caught up in thinking that each new low-end release has to be a "better low-end model" than the last.

Not so.

It merely needs to be identical, or slightly better than yesterday's unit, but it has to be more PROFITABLE.

The m100 was not intended to be sold for $100, let alone $80 or $90 (as this new low-end model will be within 8 months).

This model doesn't suit us, but it suits many, many, many people. It will continue to saturate the market with Palm based PDAs, and what's good for the general Palm market, is good for you & I.

More development, more R & D, more CHOICES.

RE: Excuse ME!
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 2:19:20 PM #
I agree. I think that the folks on this board forget that there are about 18 million people out there who own Palms but don't want to watch streaming media on their GPRS-enabled PDA, and that many folks view the $100 price point as reasonable for disposable income.

To rant a bit, I'm one of those people. I got sucked in to the hype and bought a [non-Palm OS PDA] because I thought it would have all these great features that I need. Well, it doesn't. I miss my Palm V. Sure I like color, but the reason I loved my V was because it was small enough to take everywhere, held all my PIM data, and had a bunch of great software that did other valuable things, none of which were viewing or creating power-point presentations.

I'm coming back to the Palm camp, and soon. Maybe not with this low-end device, but I'm certainly never going to pay more than $200 for a PDA again.

RE: Excuse ME!
maven @ 8/12/2002 3:13:18 PM #
Someone called this device a "glorified organizer" - you know, it's funny, but thats EXACTLY the reason I bought my original PalmPilot. I needed a really good organizer. The Pilot was perfect for me, and I bet a "gorified organizer" if exactly what many consumers need, not some shrunk-down PC. At least not at first -- many of them will love their device so much they give their basic model to somebody else and upgrade to a super-deluxe version which opens new worlds to them. Thats what happened to me, now 4 years and 4 Palm OS PDA's later :)

RE: Excuse ME!
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 9:46:30 AM #
Well this is the same old thing that we have been hearing from Jeff Kirwen and the other M$ lackeys out there. On the basis of this logic, that piece of junk on my desk is just a typewriter, since I only use it for typing.


RE: Excuse ME!
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/29/2002 7:57:43 AM #
What's the problem with a low-end PDA? It's different strokes for different folks. Palm will STILL be making a high-end OS 5 model so those who want to run their office on a Palm still can, those who just want to get themselves organised and hold down a few apps at the same time then they're fine too. Everyone's happy, or that's the way it should be at least.

Another reason

abosco @ 8/12/2002 11:12:42 AM #
Since you mentioned those trademark names, Ed, I further realized that Palm probably won't use Oslo as their device name. If they were planning on it, they would've also trademarked Oslo along with the other three. It's definately just a codename for it.

I'm just curious as to why would Palm market a new device at the same price as an older device (m105) even though it doesn't have as many things??? I don't see a reason why somebody would pick this up as a 2 mb organizer if you can get an m105 for the same price with 8 mb. What features does this thing have that are better than the m105??? Or the m100???

________________________________________
Make it idiot proof, and somebody will make a better idiot.

RE: Another reason
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 11:28:41 AM #
Maybe it won't be as ugly as the m1xx series. Yech!
RE: Another reason
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:27:40 PM #
The reason why Palm would sell this is because it has "less stuff", it will be cheaper to make and give them more profits.

The reason why anybody would buy it is maybe the form is better. It isn't always about RAM and features. Sometimes people buy thigns just because it "looks cool."

RE: Another reason
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 4:56:35 PM #
if they only cared about looks. Why don't re-manufacture Visors Edge and sell these for 100 US-$?

They look sharp. I've seen some ex-demo models for about 190 euro. I'm wondering.. are they really worth it?

RE: Another reason
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 9:46:32 PM #
Visor Edge? If you're a technocrat, you probably will buy a Visor Edge. But remember that the sub $100 market doesn't care more about the screen and features like what the previous post. Within this market segment, Palm has definitely the advantage because of product mindshare. Palm is still "Palm". Just like how "Coca-Cola" sounds when it comes to Colas.
RE: Another reason
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/13/2002 3:32:13 AM #
Visor Edge?! That was one of the ugliest devices ever manufactured!!

RE: Another reason
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/13/2002 4:08:59 AM #
It is individual perceptions on what is ugly.....

Hey Palm good one.

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 11:13:53 AM #
It's not every April 1st either. Boy this should help raise their stock prices.....

Looks like they are clearing out old inventory from R&D. Spring cleaning coming early? Well maybe too late....

RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 11:31:03 AM #
I don't understand your point at all. Are you a snob, who believes that only $800 handhelds are "worthy"? At least four times as many people buy <$100 PDAs as buy >$500. Cheap PDAs are "gateway" models. Once someone buys an inexpensive palm PDA, if later they want an expensive one, they are much more likely to get another palm. This is a proven sales stategy for cars, computers, etc.
RE: Hey Palm good one.
Boze @ 8/12/2002 11:39:08 AM #
I agree. This is a great strategy. I am living proof. I had never even thought about buying a PDA, then my dad got me an m100 for Christmas 2000 (he bought the cheapest unit available, since he wasn't sure if I would use it). It only had 2MB memory, but it was great for keeping contacts, to-do lists, and reading AvantGo content. Also, I could connect it to my mobile phone and do some minimal web-surfing in a pinch. Less than 18 months later, I upgraded to a Sony N610, and have spent almost $100 on software since I bought it in February 2002. I am also now a loyal Palm OS user. This strategy works!

My only question: why white? I would never buy a white handheld.

====
Boze
====

RE: Hey Palm good one.
jjsoh @ 8/12/2002 11:48:49 AM #
: My only question: why white? I would never buy a white
: handheld.

Maybe to match the iPod? ;)

In all seriousness, wasn't there an article not too long ago (couldn't find it in PIC archives) stating that Palm and Apple were working on some joint project?


Jim

RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:18:25 PM #
How do we know iPod doesn't already run PalmOS?

Chew on that.

RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:28:42 PM #
The iPod doesn't run the PalmOS. It uses software by Pixo Inc. Someday though.....
RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:37:26 PM #
Agh, no not a snob. For a company that is whirling into a downward spiral, the last thing they need to do is release 2mb Palm models. White?? Like I said, R&D rejects.

Puhleeze, you can get an M105 BRAND NEW for $99. Used for around $30. So why release something like this. It must be a joke.

Fall cleaning for Palm's R&D dept. I would like to see a show of hands for anyone that would pay $100 for this thing and buy it instead of an M105.

.......yeah that's what I thought.

RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:53:49 PM #
> Puhleeze, you can get an M105 BRAND NEW for $99. Used for around $30.
> So why release something like this. It must be a joke.

I talked about this under another thread but I'll (briefly) repeat myself. If it costs $90 to make a m105 and Palm sells it for $100, it makes an OK profit. But if they designed the new model to be even cheaper to make, like $70, and can sell it for $100, that's much better.

I think the m105 is much too big and I don't like the screen. If the new one doesn't have these drawbacks, I'd consider it a much better model. A huge number of sales will go to the company that can get a good-looking monochrome screen in a $100 model.

> White??

The iPod is white and it is constantly praised for its good looks. You are (mistakenly) believing what you want is what everyone wants.

If it's smaller/thinner
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:58:01 PM #
Then lots of people would buy it. Even M100/105 owners.
RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 1:12:46 PM #
White is fine, I said white with two buttons....is odd.

SO let me get this straight. I paid $150 for my 105. So now when they release a "new model", lets call it protoype X. I, being an m105 owner will rush out and get it for two reasons:

1. Palm's cost is $70 so I should buy it at a $100 to give them a $30 profit. Compared to buying an M105 and only giving them $10. Agh no.

2. Because its another new cheap palm that "may" have a better screen. Agh no. I would have rather of spent the $150 and the $100 on a $250 palm.

SO again, I restate. This must be a joke.

Dumb or Blind?
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 3:35:41 PM #
Uh, no.....you will *NOT* be able to even FIND an m105 by the time this thing comes out, so your theory is completely wrong.

This unit makes total sense.

You clearly have no understanding of manufacturing, profit margins, or pricing strategies.

Dumb or Blind.Hmmm... tough one
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 3:46:07 PM #
Well I will say that you are both Dumb AND Blind.

Dumb becuase you believe this:
"Uh, no.....you will *NOT* be able to even FIND an m105 by the time this thing comes out, so your theory is completely wrong."

And this:

"This unit makes total sense."

And Blind because of this:
"You clearly have no understanding of manufacturing, profit margins, or pricing strategies."

You obviously are new here and missed this: http://palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=3975

So next time before you open your hotdog hole, read....read....read..... then try to get your GED kid. Then maybe you can post something constructive to these forums.

RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 5:43:52 PM #
Why do you people assume that Palm will still make the m105 by the time the new product comes out ?

In all likelyhood, they will discontinue the m1xx BEFORE this unit hits the market (watch for it to happen SOON)


RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 6:08:53 PM #
LOL trolls...it already is discontinued, in line with Sony's philosophy.
RE: Hey Palm good one.
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 10:38:58 PM #
> SO let me get this straight. I paid $150 for my 105. So now when they release a "new model",
> lets call it protoype X. I, being an m105 owner will rush out and get it

You are caught in the mindset that the only people who will buy a handheld are the people who are looking for an upgrade. There are many millions of people in the U.S. and billions on the Earth who don't already own one. These are the target market.

RE: Hey Palm good one.
formerlyanon @ 8/29/2002 10:26:39 AM #
i dont think you are supposed to buy it, it is for new users. you must spend more money to get better. the LEM introduces people to handhelds, like my palm III did.

__________________________________________________________________
My palm III was 50p from a charity shop, and introduced me to pdas

cool name.....

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 11:34:57 AM #
Tungsten could be the name for the new handheld. Slim, energy saving and the barest of bones model.
dumb-palm
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/13/2002 4:12:57 AM #
this sounds cool too.

Zip zilla

I have a better name

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:08:43 PM #
A 2 meg all-white PDA with called Tungsten, Zire, or Veld? I have a better name...Hoax!
RE: I have a better name
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:41:40 PM #
You are being to kind. Now stop it!!!

Call it Yugo,Pinto or Edsel. Seems Palm will have the same fate as these vehicles for dumping their R&D rejects on the public.

C'mon guys what's the real dope on Palm. A white PDA with two buttons. If that is not a "limited lot" of protypes then I don't know what is.....

RE: I have a better name
Beavis @ 8/12/2002 3:35:18 PM #
I don't think the Pinto was a reject. I recall seeing lots of them out on the road. It suffered from "Sudden Explosion Syndrome" when struck from behind.

Only Two Buttons?

kevdo @ 8/12/2002 12:12:06 PM #
Seems like a bad idea... espcially since low-end users are more likely to be game players who'll need or want all four buttons.

I've got to hope the source is wrong on this one. Only including two buttons would be a big, big mistake for Palm. Software makers would in theory need to try and support models with different numbers of buttons and now we're in PocketPC territory where the button layouts are all over the map. Woe.

-Kevin Crossman

RE: Only Two Buttons?
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/12/2002 12:23:49 PM #
I don't think you should put "games" and "low end" in the same sentence. In reality games are more likely to be HIGH END. Look at your average PC. The only reason why you need these Ghz processors and graphics accelerators is because of games.
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