Comparing Common Tasks Treo 650 vs 700w

Posted By: Ryan Tuesday, January 31, 2006 4:48:10 PM

The Washington Post has published an article titled, Palm OS vs. Windows Mobile: The Debate Continues. The author lays out an interesting comparison of the Palm Treo 650 and the Treo 700w. He tests the execution of common tasks on each smartphone in a step by step fashion and looks at the installation of new apps on each device.

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Oh yay!

EdH @ 1/31/2006 9:08:56 PM # Q
More tap counting by Rob Pegoraro.

For example, I spent an hour or so Thursday morning conducting the in identical set of tasks on the 700w and the 650, writing down each button I pressed, each key I tapped and each screen icon I pressed with my thumb, starting with the device off and finishing with the task completed and any input properly saved.

Dude. Get a life. It is over. Why don't you count the taps necessary to get EVDO running on Garnet? Or count the taps to transfer an Excel file from your LAN to your device through a VPN connection while you are listenting to a podcast in the background and checking email while the file is transferring? Let's see, Treo 700w, 82 clicks. Treo 650 - zero clicks. 650 wins, hands down!



RE: Oh yay!
freakout @ 2/1/2006 4:47:05 AM # Q
^^ Be fair! The man is paid to review and comment on products. It's nice to see something that compares the everyday usability of these products, and not just programming and UI philosophy.

"Or count the taps to transfer an Excel file from your LAN to your device through a VPN connection while you are listenting to a podcast in the background and checking email while the file is transferring? Let's see, Treo 700w, 82 clicks. Treo 650 - zero clicks. 650 wins, hands down!"

I assume this is a Palm criticism. Can I ask why you're trying to do such ridiculously complicated tasks on a handheld device, and not just using a laptop? Might I also point out that the obvious quickest way to get that Excel file onto your device is to just email it, rather than going through all that BS with VPNs and LANs to prove that WinMob is "better" than PalmOS? Might I also point out that DocsToGo will make for a far better spreadsheet editor/viewer once the file is actually *on* the device?

Anyhoo, not to start a flamewar or anything....

Tim Carroll
Your friendly customer service robot
(and big Treo fan)

RE: Oh yay!
EdH @ 2/1/2006 12:02:14 PM # Q
assume this is a Palm criticism. Can I ask why you're trying to do such ridiculously complicated tasks on a handheld device, and not just using a laptop? Might I also point out that the obvious quickest way to get that Excel file onto your device is to just email it, rather than going through all that BS with VPNs and LANs to prove that WinMob is "better" than PalmOS? Might I also point out that DocsToGo will make for a far better spreadsheet editor/viewer once the file is actually *on* the device?

Uhm.. because my PDA, having cellular built in, is always on, and I also don't always take a laptop with me. More than once I've needed a file on my device after I've left the office. I simply VPN in, map a drive, copy the file and close the VPN. If that is "ridiculously complicated" then all I can suggest is, perhaps an Etch-a-sketch is the mobile device for you. :-)

RE: Oh yay!
cervezas @ 2/1/2006 1:17:41 PM # Q
I simply VPN in, map a drive, copy the file and close the VPN.

AFAIK, you can do that on a 650 just fine. And listen to music or a podcast in the background while you do. Why do you need bloatware like WM5 to do something as simple as that? :-P

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
Software Everywhere blog
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Oh yay!
T_W @ 2/1/2006 3:47:43 PM # Q
>Or count the taps to transfer an Excel file from your LAN to your
>device through a VPN connection while you are listenting to a
>podcast in the background and checking email while the file is
>transferring? Let's see, Treo 700w, 82 clicks. Treo 650 - zero
>clicks. 650 wins, hands down!

Yes because that is a much more common use case for a cell phone than dialing a contact.

RE: Oh yay!
AdamaDBrown @ 2/1/2006 5:49:17 PM # Q
AFAIK, you can do that on a 650 just fine. And listen to music or a podcast in the background while you do. Why do you need bloatware like WM5 to do something as simple as that? :-P

You know, this is why I get annoyed by the Palm ultra-loyalist base. You insist that it's a-ok to need at least two or three third-party apps to accomplish a task, then accuse the other guys of being bloatware. You don't get the fact that the "zen of Palm" long since fell to the realities of modern mobile computing. If I hear one more argument of "why would anyone ever need X," I'm gonna start mining the PIC archives and digging out people's arguments against color screens and expansion slots. Good on you for liking Palm OS. But Palm has accepted the idea that maybe there should be more than one option in the mobile space, and that Palm OS is not suitable for all things. It would be helpful if you could too.

And Ed, is it really neccessary to thwack the hornets nest?

RE: Oh yay!
freakout @ 2/1/2006 9:15:17 PM # Q
^^ I think David was referring to WM5's (relatively) huge footprint compared to PalmOS. And the fact that MS software is generally bloated as a rule. And I didn't see any reference to 'Zen' anywhere... :P

(Then again, I'm probably wrong. Wouldn't be the first time.)

Tim Carroll
Your friendly customer service robot
(and big Treo fan)

RE: Oh yay!
EdH @ 2/2/2006 1:13:30 PM # Q
T_W said "Yes because that is a much more common use case for a cell phone than dialing a contact."

Hahahahahaha. Great example T_W. Let's see what Rob "Tap-Count" Pegoraro says about that:

First test: Look up my wife's cell-phone number and dial it.
* Treo 700w steps: Send, center, type "katie," down, down, center.
* Treo 650 steps: Send, center, center, type "katie," down, down, center.
The 700w wins this one, 5 to 6 (not counting the keyboard use), on account of it including a contact-search form right on the Today screen.


RE: Oh yay!
cervezas @ 2/2/2006 1:40:19 PM # Q
Feeling a little sensitive, Adama?

freakout had it right: I wasn't making a big ideological case for the Zen of Palm, I was just pointing out that to do anything on Palm OS you need about 1Mb of software for every 10Mb to do the same thing on WM. That and if all you want is to be able to listen to a podcast in the background while you check your email on the VPN you don't need WM to do it as Ed implied.

As for WM being more suitable for some things, I'll readily grant that, which is why my company develops software for both. From a user standpoint I miss not having a Skype client for Palm, for example. As a developer I miss not having a CDC Java ME environment, among other things. The list is short though.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
Software Everywhere blog
www.pikesoft.com/blog

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Reassignment/increase of contact key on Treo

vixensjlin @ 2/1/2006 12:54:11 PM # Q
First test: Look up my wife's cell-phone number and dial it.
(5)* Treo 700w steps: Send, center, type "katie," down, down, center.
(6)* Treo 650 steps: Send, center, center, type "katie," down, down, center.

Fourth test: Look up my friend Doug's home address.
(5)* Treo 700w: Send, center, type "doug," up, center, press and hold the down button until it scrolls to the end of the list.
(5)* Treo 650: Send, center, center, type "doug," center, down.

It seems both Treo can reduce one step if a hot key can be assigned as "Contact".--I assign the Email/Message hotkey as Contact and always dial from there, and assign my launcher "Today" to the Calendar hotkey.

RE: Reassignment/increase of contact key on Treo
Ronin @ 2/1/2006 3:23:28 PM # Q
Just wanted to point out that on both of these examples he adds extra steps for the Treo. Presumably because he did not know about the preference setting to allow "Typing starts Contacts search" under General Preferences in the Phone app.

In each of these instances for the Treo, the "center, center" before typing is unnecessary. Once in the Phone app, typing automatically opens the Contacts app and commences a search. In fact, this feature goes one step further and if your search does not yield any result or you exhaust the possible results and continue typing it will automatically interpret the entry as a phone number and switch to the dialer screen.

I have no idea but, as Palm made specific changes to WinMob to make it more Treo-like, I suspect that a similar feature exists on the 700w. So it may be it is a wash.

In the Spirit of Umoja,
Ronin

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Palm Usability Enhancements

whydidnt @ 2/1/2006 1:39:51 PM # Q
Leaving out the Palm vs. WM debate for a second-- I thought Palm was providing all sort of "usability" enhancements that no one else could do on the 700w. Nothing the reviewer wrote leads me to believe that things are easier to do on the 700 than my WM2003SE Samsung i730. Why is that?

Also what's wrong with that guy's Notes app on WM5 with all the down, down, down - I thought maybe he was talking to a special someone... I just hold the down button and it scrolls through all my notes automatically. Am I missing something?

RE: Palm Usability Enhancements
AdamaDBrown @ 2/1/2006 5:27:24 PM # Q
"Stuff that no one else could do" is a little deceptive. Palm's changes are mostly on the Today screen, with the fast Google search plugin, and the Today-based phone dialing app. Otherwise, as far as I can see, things are more or less stock Windows Mobile 5.

On the subject of Notes, I can't help you. I try to avoid it whenever possible.

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