How to Kill the (Pre) Buzz
Despite riding a strong wave of post-CES media and user buzz alongside several Best of Show awards, over two months have now passed since the initial unveiling of Palm's new Pre smartphone and WebOS at CES. Yesterday's highly-anticipated Sprint + Palm Webinar left many users, myself included, quite disappointed with the utter lack of new information presented about the device and its accompanying OS. US News & World Report now chimes in with their take on the situation.
Written by David LaGesse, "How to Kill the Buzz: Say-Nothing Briefings for the Palm Pre" gives a quick summary of the rampant disappointment online at the lack of new information or feature clarification during yesterday's webcast. LaGesse offers his own take on the quickly souring sentiment surrounding Palm's "hail mary" effort and offers some choice excepts from several industry analysts and media figures, including speculation from Tom Krazit at CNet that "…without revealing any of the important details, Palm is leaving room for skeptics to wonder if the Pre actually is far from finished".
The US News piece concludes with a reminder of Apple's plans to offer a preview of select features of the 3.0 version of the iPhone OS next week. The general consensus in rumorville is that Apple will release 3rd-generation hardware to accompany its OS refresh sometime in the June or July timeframe.
In addition to the dearth of new info yesterday, last month's MWC in Barcelona brought very little in the way of official Palm news aside from a spy shot of a GSM version of the Pre. CTIA 2009 in Las Vegas, the site of the Pre's unveiling back in January, is the next potential venue for new Pre-related information.
Frequently Tweeted Questions
Also of interest is Wednesday's Palm Blog post that offers a few vague FTQ ("Frequently Tweeted Questions") responses to some common questions posed to Palm. Palm reiterates the Pre's availability "…on the Sprint network sometime in the first half of 2009. Pre will be available outside the US, but no release date has yet been announced".
On the topic of future WebOS-powered devices after the Pre, Palm's blog offers: "Pre is just the beginning! The webOS operating system was designed to drive the next decade of innovative mobile products. Over the coming years, you can expect to see a wide range of devices with different features for all kinds of customers on various carriers.
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Tired of the hype yet?
RE: Tired of the hype yet?
Palm couldn't go another 6 mo. w/out saying anything. They struck at a good moment. Unfortunately the phone is still not ready so they are holding tight.
I wasn't there but how long after the 1st iPhone was the SDK? Palm now has Apples "say nothing" culture. They will talk when they are ready. Technogeeks are sooo impatient.
RE: Tired of the hype yet?
It was well over a year until the SDK was released. And then there was dev chaos reg over at the App Store - which continues anew as apparently renewals are backlogged.
I understand the impatience with the Pre. But we'd best wait. We want them to get it not just right - but, if possible, More Than Right.
DELIGHT THE CUSTOMER, Ed!!!
Time to trot out the attack ads
If I were Sprint and Palm, I would make some hay here. You might like the iPhone, but if the price is being chained to a crappy carrier, then its time to go with a Pre. This was an epic fail on the part of ATT as, any one with any sense of geek herding patterns would have know the system was going to get slammed in that area and could have brought in mobile units to scale up capacity.
Of course, having the Pre or at least a hard release date would make the ads more effective I suspect that they are being cagey about it in order to get some Treo Pros out the door, although anyone who has waited this fracking long for the next gen phone is not about to be derailed at the last minute by a WinMob offering. Then again, some people will pick up anythign shiny, so perhaps the marketeers have a twisted point.
"Many men stumble across the truth, but most manage to pick themselves up
and continue as if nothing had happened."
- Winston Churchill
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
Anyone who has been ignoring/avoiding their WinceMob phones the past few years is obviously not interested in THAT operating system. WebOS needs to appeal to both the PalmOS fanatics as well as many iPhone lovers, as it's basically an improved iPhone with a few ideas stolen from the Treo. It has a lot of shortcomings compared to the Treo, so they need to make it shine the best they can, hence the long delay.
Palm "Preh": as in "eh, where's the microSD and Garnet emulator?"
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
Also talk of "all the features of the Pre" being added too. Rip-off of Synergy? Card metaphor (a precedent there, sort of, is MultiFinder; but I don't think anyone here is old enough to know about *that*)? Who knows what else.
It'd really take a *lot* to get me not to get a Pre. A *big* LOT. And Apple must atone for the eBook debacle too.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
mikecane wrote:
Apparently iPhone OS 3.0 will add Cut/Copy/Paste....
Wow, that's amazing! Apple figured out how to get rid of that huge security threat after all. ;-)
"twrock is infamous around these parts" (from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
If Kevin Rose (via Gizmodo) is to be believed, it'll work by double-tapping/magnifying a word. Then you pinch the boundaries to make your selection, after which you get a choice of cut/copy/paste.
Sounds reasonable, although not especially better/worse than the usual hold-and-drag method. And how does it work for selecting more than one line of text?
They also say...
...the 3.0 update will have enough new features and additions to bring it up to the Palm Pre levels. Whatever Palm Pre has shown us so far, apparently, the iPhone will have too when 3.0 becomes official.
Intriguing... but I doubt it. If Apple add a Synergy-esque cloud sync, MMS, A2DP, integrated messaging and a Universal Search, I'll eat my hat. If they go one better and introduce video recording? I'll eat the rabbit in there as well.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
The 17th is a hiccup away - we'll find out what's coming then.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
implementation questions aside, this might give palm a window of a month or so - depending on when Pre is released from the labs.
Amazing that it's the middle of march and Palm still doesn't have a release date.
It would be absolutely ironic if the new iphone and os 3.0 beats Pre to market.
It's looking more and more like being able to multitask those four webapps on the pre won't be much of an advantage after all.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
jca666us wrote:
It would be absolutely ironic if the new iphone and os 3.0 beats Pre to market.
To borrow someone else's line, "Nah, that's literally uninteresting."
Seriously though, I don't see the irony in one product being released before or after another. I'm sure either Nokia or LG or HTC or someone will release some smartphone either before or after either the Pre or the iPhone 3.0, but what difference does that make? If the iPhone 3.0 or the Pre has got what you need when it's released, buy it. If it doesn't, what difference does it make when that release happens?
There is always something better coming along soon.
"twrock is infamous around these parts" (from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9708/#150605
http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9708/#150627
I'm literally shocked by the calmness of those posts. Everyone needs to take a page from Mike's book here and just relax. The Pre will show when it shows.
"twrock is infamous around these parts" (from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
No, that's now how I understood it at all.
Double-tap brings up a magnifier, yes. But it also brings up two *independent* - my term here - brackets. Put one bracket at start of selection, drag second bracket to where the endpoint should be. This means you can drag down as far as you want and grab as much as you want. It's brilliant.
OTOH, I'd like to see triple-tap for paragraph selecting. Don't know if this scheme will permit that,
If I'm understanding it correctly, Apple has really figured it out better than every other implementation I've seen.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
What's to be shocked about? Palm has clearly shown a revolutionary - for them and the entire damned cell industry - product and they need to nail it flawlessly. This thing needs to be as frikkin bug-free as humanly possible. That takes time. So although I'm still hoping like mad for a June release, I'm already thinking not until August. Which would really be frustrating as hell.
What Palm absolutely *cannot* afford to do is stick to a date like Nokia did with the 770 and push it out as crap and hope they can spew out stabilization updates ASAP. That is instant death.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
During the Worldwide Developer's Conference in June 2008, Apple announced they would be bringing something called, Push notification system. This basically gives an app the option of receiving notices, and messages even if the app isn't active. Steve Jobs stated that the service would be arriving by September 2008. Of course that update rolled by, and the Push notification was no where to be seen.
There has been quite a bit of speculation as to the reason for delaying the system. Many believe that Apple is trying to implement a better system, one in which the user can decide which apps can run in the background over others. The really spicy rumor is that Apple is just waiting until the next generation iPhone, before bringing background processes.
That was last year! To me, it is plain obvious that they removed the Sept 2008 deadline and began to incorporate a full multitasking system in 3.0. If they didn't, the 3.0 firmware will be a waste of time.
-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
Put one bracket at start of selection, drag second bracket to where the endpoint should be.
That does sound more logical. Wonder if it'll be iron-clad patented like pinch-zooming. ;)
bosco:
Many believe that Apple is trying to implement a better system, one in which the user can decide which apps can run in the background over others.
Sounds good. But a little too close to WinMob's task manager for comfort.
Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 -> Treo 650 -> Treo 680 -> Centro
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
It'll be interesting to see what they pimp.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
>before or after another.
It's ironic because Palm has been pimping the Pre as "the revolution" in mobile computing...they did this by initially mis-marketing the Pre as an iphone killer.
Still, after nearly three months, the revolution has yet to be released and details are sparse.
It's looking likely that the actual iphone killer will be coming from Apple, while it's anyone's guess where Palm will end up.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
>pinch-zooming. ;)
If it's not Freak, we can all be reasonably certain that Palm will try to rip them off.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
>with is copy/paste as the focal point. I see multitasking, and I see lots of it.
I think Apple will try and tie C&P in with multitasking to say that 3.0 has greater support for professional class applications.
On the basis of multitasking alone, I would expect Apple will demo a mobile Office-type suite tomorrow and show OS 3.0 to have several enhancements and refinements over 2.0 (C&P being one of them).
>I also see Palm stock going down tomorrow.
If the iphone 3.0 OS has a greater capacity for multitasking then the Pre's four multitasked webapps, then I'd agree.
It's frustrating that after nearly three months, the Pre is unreleased and many details are still vague. Still no native apps, and no mention of an app store.
Palm needs to push this out soon, or no one will care.
After OS 3.0 is demoed tomorrow, all eyes will be on Palm.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
jca666us wrote:
It's looking likely that the actual iphone killer will be coming from Apple, while it's anyone's guess where Palm will end up.
So again, let me point out that it seems speculation about the Pre can not be positive, but speculation about the iPhone can. How about having the same standard for both products? How come is it that the iPhone can be "the iPhone killer", but the Pre can't?
BTW, if the iPhone 3.0 isn't "the iPhone killer", what's Apple doing releasing it? By definition, the next version should best the current one. And I know that doesn't hold true for all products, [cough] Windows [/cough]. The whole notion of a "XXX killer" is nothing more than a hype game anyway.
Here's my personal feeling about the iPhone. When the iPhone performs all of the functionality of my Palm TX, I'll seriously look at purchasing it (well, except I'm not interested in having to sign some ridiculous service contract, but that's another issue altogether). So far the iPhone still won't do for me what my TX does, so I'm not interested. And if the Pre won't do for me what my TX does, I won't be interested in it either. This silly idea that any one product is better than all the others is just plain naive. It's only better for you if it is the one that best meets your needs.
So up to this point, the iPhone isn't even a "Palm TX killer" from my perspective. Look there, the iPhone isn't even as good as a product released way back in 2005! ;-)
"twrock is infamous around these parts" (from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
twrock wrote:
So again, let me point out that it seems speculation about the Pre can not be positive, but speculation about the iPhone can. How about having the same standard for both products? How come is it that the iPhone can be "the iPhone killer", but the Pre can't?
Apple has a recent track record of delivering good products that people want. Palm, unfortunately, does not. Therefore, it is easy to be optimistic and excited about Apple's products, yet pessimistic and demeaning about Palm's products.
Look at the comments on PIC vs MacRumors. There is a drastic difference in tone.
-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
>not be positive, but speculation about the iPhone can.
Because the iphone has a proven track record. Palm did have a proven track record - seven years ago. The intervening years have seen stagnant development, and a poor level of customer support and service.
It's easy to be optimistic about the iphone - Apple has delivered a quality product and supported it with *timely* firmware updates.
When was the last time Palm released a firmware update for a device that was a year and a half old?
I recall purchasing my Palm Tungsten and waiting for Cobalt to be released for it. How many others have been burned by Palm?
The Pre may well be the dawn of a new day for Palm, but one product release won't do it. There are so many potential stumbling blocks, that's it's difficult to embrace the Pre with the optimism one looks at the iphone with.
>How about having the same standard for both products? How come is it
>that the iPhone can be "the iPhone killer", but the Pre can't?
Because Palm should have announced the Pre within a month of releasing it. At this point if iphone OS 3.0 has a fraction of what the Pre is offering, it will dampen enthusiasm for the Pre.
Dragging out the initial release of the iphone worked for Apple - because there was no real competition. Pre is being released into a much more competitive market and Palm needs to be more responsive.
Say what you will about Apple, but they have steadily increased functionality and improved stability - from os 1.0 to os 2.2
Who knows when we'll see any firmware updates for the Pre? Based on past history, rarely or never. It is this past history and these preconceived notions regarding Palm, that Palm needs to work very hard to overcome.
>BTW, if the iPhone 3.0 isn't "the iPhone killer", what's Apple doing
>releasing it? By definition, the next version should best the current one.
Well, considering 3.0 is software only (until revised hardware is released), why wouldn't apple release it?
Improved functionality and new features will make it surpass previous os releases. It might be a pre killer, but we won't know until the Pre is actually released.
>And I know that doesn't hold true for all products, [cough] Windows
>[/cough]. The whole notion of a "XXX killer" is nothing more than a hype
>game anyway.
Agreed, but it was Palm that is marketing the Pre as an iphone killer - which if the Pre isn't, will surely bite them in their corporate ass.
>So up to this point, the iPhone isn't even a "Palm TX killer" from my
>perspective. Look there, the iPhone isn't even as good as a product
>released way back in 2005! ;-)
That may be true for you, but there are things the iphone does that trounce most Palm devices IMHO - the iphone isn't perfect, but the company developing it is working awfully hard to improve it.
Unfortunately, I can't say the same about Palm based on their track record; can you?
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
Palm also has a history of innovation and great products. Sure, much of the more recent history is not as noteworthy, but even in recent history there have been good products released. And dare I say it, some of those products have yet to be surpassed. My own criticism of Palm often is because I believe they should be able to best their own previous efforts (a Palm killer, if you will), and they don't. But that doesn't necessarily mean that I think anyone else has either.
But around here, the negativity is amazing. And I have never understood the weird phenomenon of people who have supposedly moved on the a better product who still think they need to hang around a Palm oriented website and tell us all how much better their choice is (or even don't use and won't ever use a Palm product; that's even stranger). What's the obsession? Maybe there's some weird psychological need to keep convincing themselves they were right, some kind of insecurity, not really all that sure they made the right choice. If so, dude, get over it already. It's just a phone.
"twrock is infamous around these parts" (from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
"twrock is infamous around these parts" (from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
jca666us wrote:
Unfortunately, I can't say the same about Palm based on their track record; can you?
You truly are ignoring what is happening right in front of your eyes. I know the history. I have lived through it. I'm ignoring neither the track record nor what I am seeing happening right now.
Will Palm be "successful" with this effort? I don't know, but neither do you. All of this is just speculation. Will you be willing to come back and eat a little crow if it turns out that Palm is "successful"?
"twrock is infamous around these parts" (from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
>the history. I have lived through it. I'm ignoring neither the track record nor
>what I am seeing happening right now.
I'm not ignoring it, I'm skeptical that it will be enough to save the company.
Palm never had an "A" game, and they are in serious need of one now.
>Will Palm be "successful" with this effort? I don't know, but neither do you.
Of course, but my idle speculation is just as valid as yours.
>All of this is just speculation. Will you be willing to come back and eat a
>little crow if it turns out that Palm is "successful"?
I would like Palm to be successful - and I would be more than willing to admit I was wrong - if in fact I am.
I'd buy a Pre if I thought it was the best device on the market. However, in my opinion, it will take more than a single *successful* product release - as I've been burned more than enough by Palm.
Here's what I consider a success for Palm (in order of precedence):
1. A successful launch of the Pre (by June) - by successful, no obvious hardware or software glitches that get past QA.
2. Timely firmware updates - I'd expect one or two within the first six months of release.
3. The release of an app store (within the first six months of release).
4. Some sort of SDK for compiled apps (for that class of applications that can make use of it).
5. Some signs of financial health for Palm - they'll probably never have 20 billion in the bank, however I'd like to have some confidence that Palm will be around two years from now when I decide to upgrade my Pre.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
> Pre's four multitasked webapps...
If Apple cares about Palm - and I haven't seen any hard evidence that they do, BTW - then I would expect Apple to point out the difference between a "web app" and an "app...pointedly.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
jca666us wrote:
Here's what I consider a success for Palm (in order of precedence): ....
That looks suspiciously like you are simply demanding Palm match the iPhone step for step or you will say they aren't successful. So if Apple had done it differently, would you have a different measure for success?
"twrock is infamous around these parts" (from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
Where? When?
Colligan said he had a "breakthrough level of innovation" and "game-changing hardware."
The Pre lived up to both of those in its intro (note I said INTRO).
I know how eager everyone is to trot out Colligan's Foot In Mouth line about his resistance to lowballing the price ("Why would we do that when we have the better phone?"), but that's COLLIGAN shooting himself in the head yet again, not PALM.
Anyway, in about 5 hours or so from the time I'm typing this, all will be revealed by Apple. I'm not excited, but I am curious.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
> revealed by Apple...
I think you're gonna be late to the party.
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
I think Apple is doing nothing more than playing up the 3.0 launch to try and steal some of Palm's thunder and to also capitalize on the utter lack of concrete Pre info (no actual price, release date, or anything new revealed since CES).
I see the 3.0 preview today as Apple's initial strike. They'll probably then release a 32gb iPhone 3G sometime around when 3.0 actually pre-installed on shipping devices but I doubt we'll see anything in the way of new formfactor or hardware improvements this June/July from Apple (unlike last year). And I still do expect a dumbed-down (2 or 4 gig, no wi-fi and/or no GPS, smaller screen) <$99 iPhone Nano this fall from Apple for the back-to-school season.
P.S. I am no way championing Apple over Palm or Palm over Apple. Both companies have nice devices with certain appealing specs but in many ways both lack the utter functionality, productivity and expandability available in a free Centro or even in an ancient Treo 600/650. Palm started off on the right track improving on some of the iPhone's hardware limitations with the Pre (removable battery, keyboard) but then mitigated those additions with the removal of the microSD slot. Furthermore, they're aping Apple by intentionally dumbing down their devices to appeal to soccer moms & teenagers by stripping out functionality available on older POS devices (video recording, voice memo, native apps) & arrogantly pushing users to the Cloud (not to mention Sprint).
As smartphones from all manufacturers become increasingly media savvy they are apparently becoming more dumbed-down and less capable for basic organization, prouctivity & PIM functions. I'd better go grab a spare Centro while I can still get one cheap!
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->?
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
Of course, but my idle speculation is just as valid as yours.
No, it isn't. Because you are an idiot. (How's that Apple-Palm lawsuit going?)
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
Did you check out iphone os 3.0 - seems to put a pretty serious crimp on the "revolutionary" features of the Pre.
Palm needs to get cracking!
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
[how long do folks think it's gonna take to write, test, debug, and get certified an application for the Pre? It's mid-March. June 30th? Uh huh...]
RE: Time to trot out the attack ads
There is nothing there in iPhone OS 3.0 to deter me from buying a Pre.
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Suspension Of Operations
http://prepoint.wordpress.com/
I don't feel that bad. Sammy started an iPhone blog after the announcement way back when and quickly ran out of steam due to lack of info. It happens. In my case, I want warm weather, dammit. I did the desk bit all of 2008!!
Hey, the Pre is still being worked on. I don't expect it til June, if not now August(!).
What will Apple unveil, I wonder. You just know Apple is doing that to push people like me back to the iPhone. But Apple must first *atone* for its eBook censorship:
http://mikecane2008.wordpress.com/2008/08/26/apple-forfeits-ebooks-by-banning-a-comic-book/
I'm glad to see other people following (ahem, no pun intended) my lead in using Twitter for intel. Good move.