Screenshots from OS 5 Web Browser Released

Posted By: Ed Wednesday, August 14, 2002 10:20:41 AM

In June, PalmSource announced that Access Systems America would make a version of its NetFront Web browser to be included in Palm OS 5. This browser will support numerous Internet standards, including the latest W3C specifications, HTML 4.01 and XHTML 1.0, dynamic HTML, SSL (Secure Socket Layer), and ECMA Script (JavaScript). Infosync has some screenshots from this browser that were put together by Access Systems to demonstrate its capabilities.

These shots were apparently taken from the Palm OS 5 simulator, not on an actual handheld running the new operating system.

Judging from these images, the browser doesn't seem to reformat webpages for the small screens on handhelds, as many handheld browsers do. Instead, it renders them as they would appear on a desktop browser, and letting the user scroll around on the webpage.

 

Be sure to click on the images to see the full sized versions. Thanks to the numerous people who sent in tips about this. -Ed

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Looks cool!

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:32:09 AM #
I think this is a big improvment over the clipped pages. Full pages which you can scroll around on gives you the full sense of the internet. Good job Palm and Access.

Disclosure: Palm IIIx user and planningon getting the "Oslo" to upgrade when its available. Love that thing!

RE: Looks cool!
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:53:09 AM #
I prefer this approach as well. I'd rather have to use a little effort to scroll around and have a "normal" web page rendering.
RE: Looks cool!
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 11:19:33 AM #
This can only be a good thing for 99% of the Palm users out there, especially as 3G-enabled cell phones hit the market, many of them GSM with IR ports.

Now Palm needs to keep up their recent track record with nice bundled software (Docs2go,Avantgo, etc) with the Oslo (or whatever it's called), throw in a full version game or two, and they'll start making some forward progress again. Anything's better than another white-shelled, 2-buttoned, el-cheapo, bottom feeder unit!

Although I do hope they implement a "zoom out to fit" mode so you can at least get a basic idea of what a web page looks like before you begin madly scrolling through the page. Also, I hope this browser supports Hotmail and similar sites (unlike Blazer and every other Palm browser thus far).

RE: Looks cool!
big_raji @ 8/14/2002 2:42:44 PM #
> Also, I hope this browser supports Hotmail and
> similar sites (unlike Blazer and every other Palm
> browser thus far).

Here's the link to use Hotmail in Blazer:

http://lc2.law5.hotmail.passport.com/cgi-bin/dologin? login=username@hotmail.com&passwd=password

Obviously, replace the "username" and "password" with your own.

It connects to the WAP version of the Hotmail site, so it's very barebones, but very effective.

---
Wooo!

RE: Looks cool!
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 3:26:39 PM #
Your Hotmail link does not work in Blazer.
RE: Looks cool!
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 6:18:47 PM #
Looks nice. Would be better still if they could allow use of the full screen by providing a toggle to turn off the title bar. Personally, I'd like to be able to get rid of the scroll bars too - ie, navigate by dragging the stylus. iSilo does this so maybe it's not too much to ask.
RE: Looks cool!
drw @ 8/14/2002 7:10:59 PM #
Here's what that link yeilded in blazer:

"Hotmail

Not compatible with .NET Passport
Mobile 2.0"

---
David

RE: Looks cool!
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:41:10 PM #
>>I think this is a big improvment over the clipped pages. Full pages which you can scroll around on gives you the full sense of the internet. Good job Palm and Access.

Yeah! Way to go Palm. This is going to be great. Almost as good as Pocket Internet Explorer has been since April of 2000.

Im a little worried.....

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:32:34 AM #
Is palm trying to do what microsoft did to developers?

Remember post-it for palm... now with the included note-pad no need to get that software... a free version comes with the palm (i.e. ie vs. netscape)...

now this is even closer to home.. ILINX put out Xiino, a web browser that does all that this one does and it will most likely be killed by this new "included" browser... This one thats included isn't quite as good, but its free. (again, sounds like ie.)

Why can't O.S. companies make the best platform possible and leave app development to the app developers that have been doing it all along. This kind of thing puts Palm in direct competition with its best friends.. the developers without which palm would not be the kind of platform it is today...

(leaving the soapbox here if anyone wants to hop on :)

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:42:41 AM #
Having to buy a decent browser for your handheld is silly. Palm should include a browser with their handheld. If you want another browser then buy it.
RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:45:53 AM #
Palm wants to expand their market. This requires getting non-PDA users interested in PDAs. New users will want an all-in-one solution (bundling) as that is the way it is for personal computers. They won't want to buy extra software. I've spoken to many a Palm user using them for PIM only, who didn't even know they could load new software apps! If they don't include a basic app like a browser, Microsoft just says "look over here, everything's included". Faced with that possibility, how can they not include a browser, considering wireless technologies are a key part of their future initiatives.
RE: Im a little worried.....
Boze @ 8/14/2002 10:49:20 AM #
First of all, I don't think Xiino does the same thing. Xiino resizes web pages.

Second, I have to agree that I like the idea of Palm developing their own web browser. This doesn't necessarily make them like Microsoft unless they start FORCING Sony, Handspring, and other licensees to use it.


====
Boze
====

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:50:13 AM #
Whatever happen to the browser that suppose to be release last April anyway?

Now we hear Palm is licensing browser from another company. what gives????

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:50:42 AM #
As far as they allow you to remove the application from the system and doesn't force you to use it like M$ does with Ie, for me will be ok whatever palm put on the bag.

If I don't like the free choice I'll buy a better one.

I think that what Palm tries to do is to have a solid release for it's OS 5 handhelds.

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:58:53 AM #
Well, this argument is fairly moot. Thanks to Gates & Co. a browser is basically a necessary built-in piece of an OS. It should be anyways. I just hope Palm, unlike the aforementioned, publishes proper APIs so that a developer can improve upon the built-in piece and replace it if so desired.

Netscape should have sued WAY before the states did, for exactly that reason. By the time it was raised in court, the browser issue was already dead and it saddened me that the far more insidious practices that are obvious to OEMs were underplayed as they were.

Hey! Wait! Isn't this a PALM forum? I should stop now.

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 11:39:12 AM #
I think this is an obvious next step for the PalmOS. Not just as a web browser but as a document reader as well. Let's face it, memo pad sucks if you want to read anything longer than a page or two and especially if you want any kind of formatting. Even Windows 3.1 came with a very basic word processing app, but PalmOS still has yet to provide anything more than a text file editor. It's clear that the PalmDOC format is horribly obsolete as well. If Palm can turn this browser into an XHTML editor (or allow 3rd parties to do so), then they can provide users with the application we should've gotten in OS4. If that same application also happens to be a web browser, then it's even better because we get two useful apps for the price (and memory space) of one.

Not only am I glad that Palm is making their own browser, I hope they extend it to provide editing capabilities and then we can finally dump the terribly primitive DOC format (and maybe even Word .doc file viewers) and finally have a coherent, useful standard for text/mixed-media documents on the Palm platform.

And yes, that will likely hurt the sales of products like iSilo, AvantGo and WordSmith. But we're talking about functionality that is so basic and used by so many palm users nowadays that not having it in the base package seems kind of silly. If these companies can't adapt to the changing environment of this industry, then they shouldn't have gotten started here in the first place.

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 11:44:30 AM #
Has it ever been said that this browser would be free and included with OS 5 units?
RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 12:13:38 PM #
Also Notepad was include on Palm brand devices but not on others like Sony.

Is this browser a PalmOS deal or a Palm hardware deal?

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 12:14:23 PM #
Xiino, while a good browser, does not come close to the level of standards support that this will have. Xiino is also a proxied browser, with no full-screen capability. Currently, all images are resized and reduced to 256 colors in Xiino as well.
RE: Im a little worried.....
Beavis @ 8/14/2002 12:14:37 PM #
"Netscape should have sued WAY before the states did, for exactly that reason."

Excuse me. Netscape only cried foul after MS surpassed Netscape in quality and usability. They were perfectly content to sit around on their behinds while MS played catch up. Once MS finally came out with an equal or better product, Netscape played the "Woe is me, please U.S. Government, please help us stop the MS juggernaut" card.

If they kept improving their browser, they could have won the browser war.

My 2 cents.

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 3:23:36 PM #
> Netscape only cried foul after MS surpassed Netscape in quality and usability.

Do you have historical records and/or corresponding feature lists to back this up? IE was pretty crappy until after it gained a majority share if I remember right. I also wouldn't confuse quality with added Microsoft proprietary extensions.

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 4:48:42 PM #
Isn't access made by a seperate company from palm source?? If I'm right then Palm source are nothing like MS. MS pushed Internet explorer because it was their own software. If Palm wants to use some other browser in OS6 they will. By using third party software they are free to stop using it when ever they want and aren't tied into their own software if it is poor.
RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 8:13:19 PM #
"Has it ever been said that this browser would be free and included with OS 5 units?"

It's been said by eWeek and Access on June 18th.

[quote]
Access next week will announce a multi-year deal with Palm Inc. subsidiary PalmSource Inc. to make Access' NetFront 3.0 the core Web browser technology for the Palm OS5 handheld operating system, according to sources close to Access Systems America in Fremont, Calif."
[quote]

So that also addresses the question someone else had, if it was only to appear on Palm inc. devices.

Ordinarily I'd have said that it may well be to the discretion of a licensee to include such a feature, as others are. But for the word "core", which would lend one to believe it may turn out to be ubiquitous.

www.access-us-inc.com/news/press_releases/2002-06-26_palm.html

You can thank MSFT
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 9:08:37 PM #
If it wasn't for Gates & Co. you'd be paying $100+ for Netscape Navigator with annual $25+ upgrade fees.
RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:44:55 PM #
I think the point is that Palm is actually using another developers software and perhaps tweaking it.
So while it will be harder for developers of other browsers now, at least one developer wins. Thats evolution for you, the best browser wins, and presunmably Palm picked what they thought was the best or most appropriate technology available. And to be fair to Palm there is a lot of software they could develop and don't. They do support the developer community very well in my opinion. A browser is really a vital component of the OS offering now and should be delivered with all future palms.
RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:50:40 PM #
that's funny...Netscape was always free for me
RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 11:08:42 PM #
>Do you have historical records and/or corresponding feature lists to back this up? IE was pretty crappy until after it gained a majority share if I remember right. I also wouldn't confuse quality with added Microsoft proprietary extensions.

IE3 was faster than Netscape 3. It wasn't until IE3 that MS started gaining significant market share and IE4 put the nail in the coffin.

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/15/2002 1:27:56 AM #
>>IE3 was faster than Netscape 3. It wasn't until IE3 that MS started gaining significant market share and IE4 put the nail in the coffin.

This is true. I really don't like MS (so many hrs of frustration at using many of their lamely designed products), but they have a few great products, and IE - version 4 and up (in my opinion) - became one. IE 4 made netscape feel slugish.

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/15/2002 8:51:36 AM #
It's one thing for Handspring or Palm SG to bundle a browser, but for PalmSource - the guys who put out the OS - to do it is really a backstab on its developers. What's next, a fully fledged email app? How about an e-book reader, a word processor, a spreadsheet... hell let's kill all the developers while we are at it. Let them all jump boat to PocketPC.

As a developer for this platform, I have to say one of the things that keeps us developing for the Palm OS is that we trust PalmSource not to compete with us. It's something we've never trusted Microsoft on - they have a reputation of killing any app category that looks profitable. We don't trust MS, this is not a good thing for PalmSource. It's a step in the wrong direction.

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/15/2002 11:20:57 AM #
Palm OS main competitor, the WinCE devices include IE!!! I mean, if Palm does not include a browser for free, then some people might buy a WinCE device instead, thinking it is "internet aware" and the Palm OS are not.

Only Microsoft is allowed to bundle browsers?

RE: Im a little worried.....
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/15/2002 8:19:48 PM #
> Palm OS main competitor, the WinCE devices include IE!!!

The correct way to bundle a browser is to let the licensees do it.. Handspring, Sony, Palm SG, etc. NOT the PalmSource OS guys. Let the licensees bundle a browser from 3rd parties or develop their own.

Why do you think WinCE has so little software? For starters they've ousted all the major software niches that developers and come in and make some money on. What do you get? Less solutions, less competition, less software. A struggling platform... Ummm... that sounds like PocketPC. What is that at? 10-15% marketshare?


Oslo D-pad

Boze @ 8/14/2002 10:55:45 AM #
It's a good thing Oslo has that d-pad--you're going to need it for all of the up/down AND left/right scrolling!

====
Boze
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RE: Oslo D-pad
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 10:59:39 AM #
Hehe Funny I was just saying the same thing to myself before I read your post.

Scrolling

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 11:47:57 AM #
Um.... Isn't this going to make it very very hard to read things of any length in the browser? Having to constantly scroll left and right, left and right, left and right, as you read each line of text. Perhaps there is an option to reformat. Otherwise, I can't picture myself reading anything like a news article on it. I guess I'll just stick with my Treo 180 for the time being. :)
RE: Scrolling
james_sorenson @ 8/14/2002 12:08:35 PM #
This is good actually. It keeps the Blazer software from Handspring in business. There is the occasional time when I'd use the Palm browser to be able to view the whole page with graphics (Mapquest, for instance). But the rest of the time I'd want to maximize speed and ease of reading my news mail, in which case I'd use Blazer.
Hey, with the new expanded memory in the Arm units, it's not such a bad thing to have two web-browsers installed.

-------
James Sorenson
RE: Scrolling
bcombee @ 8/14/2002 12:39:57 PM #
I expect that it will format things to the screen width when possible, but allow scrolling for page layouts that don't scale well. It may even be possible to toggle a page view/text view mode where it optimizes the layout differently. I don't think we'll really know until we actually get to play with the browser. Hopefully, that isn't too far off.

--
CodeWarrior for Palm OS technical lead
Programming help at www.palmoswerks.com
RE: Scrolling
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 3:31:57 PM #
It all comes down to how the pages you try to read are formatted. Far too many web designers pride themselves in forcing HTML to a fixed screen layout, instead of allowing it to flow the way it was designed to.

RE: Scrolling
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 5:00:27 PM #
But the ideal program would accomodate for many different views and allow to full, modified and text-only viewing of pages.

Don't worry too much about fit-to-screen

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 3:57:59 PM #
I use Pocket PC's and I've messed around with the beta version of ACCESS' NetFront browser. NetFront has an option whether or not to fit-to-screen which is easily changeable. However the NetFront browser seems to have a problem with opening links when in the fit-to-screen mode. I would imagine they fixed the problem for the PalmOS release. I went to some of the sites that they demoed on my PPC with NetFront and I noticed that fit-to-screen could do little to help in those cases due to the style of the frames. I imagine they have the option so don't worry...I'm anxious to see what this OS will be like.

Please, please provide high-res+ support

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/14/2002 4:42:56 PM #
All I ask is that this provide high-res+ support and the ability to flip to landscape (like the new Palm Reader).

O.K., it's not all I ask. How about an offline sync option as well. Wish I could ditch avant go and have one simple web browser.

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