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Comments on: HP Eventually Plans to Release New WebOS Tablets

hp tablets webos The dust has not even settled on today's mega-announcement from HP to open-source WebOS and we already have some new info straight from the mouth of CEO Meg Whitman and board member Marc Andreessen (of Netscape fame) regarding a possible return to WebOS hardware in the future from HP.

The Verge conducted a sit-down interview in with Whitman and Andreessen earlier today about the future of WebOS, both as an ongoing open-sourced project and as the possible basis for future HP Tablet hardware.

For the time being, only a few excerpts from the full interview have been posted. In short, Whitman stated that yes, HP would indeed be revisiting WebOS tablet hardware but stopped short of committing to it in 2012 or later. She went on to state that the team is going to be reorganized in "a quite different direction than we've been taking it in the past". Presumably this will be a much sleeker, highly-competitive piece of hardware compared to HP's mediocre TouchPad that was seemingly launched as a barely-updated response to the 18 month-old first-generation iPad.

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Sales..

rlutz @ 12/9/2011 5:14:35 PM # Q
I can't even consider buying one... I want one.... but the last thing I need is an orphan. when is this all going to shake out? even at the $99 range for a referb the gamble is too great with HP foundering around with no direction as far as webos goes
I think therfore I am overqualified to work here....
RE: Sales..
LiveFaith @ 12/11/2011 4:46:18 PM # Q
They are just posturing / spinning / lying again. They have no real plans to release a tablet on an open source OS that has yet to be stripped of it's proprietary components only to have those sewn back in so that a device will market.
I
The HP track record is simply lies upon more lies. This is nothing more than a way to make the announcement appear positive.
Pat Horne
RE: Sales..
richf @ 12/12/2011 7:17:18 AM # Q
You are absolutely spot on. I have waited long enough. Saturday I ordered an iPhone 4S. Now I will join the latest and greatest in phones. Too late in my life to travel second tier any longer. I will now find out how the upper class lives. The only thing that disappointed me was I could not walk out of a Verizon store with the phone in my hand. They must ship from warehouse and will take three days. Gives me time to figure how I will migrate and find apps that I have lived since I got my first Palm back in the old days.
Have a nice day!
HP 41CX->HP 75C->Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->Pilot Pro->IIIe->IIIc->M500->M505->M515->TC->T3->T5->Treo 650P->Treo 700P->Droid>Pre Plus>Droid
RE: Sales..
LiveFaith @ 12/12/2011 7:28:59 PM # Q
Yes, that day is upon me as well Rich. After Christmas, I'm go ing to probably get the Galaxy Nexus if it's coming to ATT. If not, I'll settle for an OS upgradeable GSII or maybe switch to VZW for the Nexus and the better coverage here in the south.

Pretty stoked about joining the world of the top-tier mobile experiences too. I love a lot @ WebOS, but it's truly over and I must surrender to the giant ecosystem.

Good luck in your iAdventure. Pretty amazing stuff there too.
Pat Horne

RE: Sales..
hkklife @ 12/12/2011 10:36:37 PM # Q
Pat;

I would recommend going with a 4.5" screen device if at all possible. I have been using a buddy's GSII (Sprint) and I must say that due to the thinness of the device, the 4.5" screen is VERY manageable and no more awkward than my Moto's 4.3".

Also, I'd try to hold out for a 720p screen (or at least qHD) if at all possible. 800x480 is soooo 2009, especially stretched across a big ol' 4.3" or 4.5" panel.

And you can never go wrong with a Nexus device! I just wish it had a microSD card slot but it's still light years ahead of anything Palm or HP could dream up, huh? ICS/Android 4.0 is FINALLY a version of the OS that we can all take seriously!

Richf, are you gonna keep your Droid around as a spare or wi-fi device?

I think it's been a pretty telling past few months when the final few WebOS diehards I knew finally threw in the towel. Either the allure of Siri on the 4S got to 'em or not being able to snag a cheap Pre 3 finished them off. Personally, I know one guy who is rocking a Pre and a TP, another guy with a Pre 2 and a gal with a Pre Plus. All of them are expecting to jump ship as soon as their contracts end or their devices die.
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RE: Sales..
LiveFaith @ 12/13/2011 10:34:31 PM # Q
Khris,

The Nexus has the sick 4.65" HD SAMOLED+ screen. Only the lack of expansion and pedestrian 5mpx camera (who really cares > 2 or 3 anyway) are the only things about it not on the bleeding edge. ICS looks pretty sweet in the reviews too. As you say the beauty of WebOS is inevitably being overtaken. But, I hear the GSIIs are getting ICS upgrades, so I could live with that device too.

Not on ATT, but I'm going to check into switching my entire family plan to VZW, because I am sick and tired of traveling and dealing with EDGE 1/2 the time. VZW has 3g almost anywhere in the south and that's worth a lot to me. Don't like losing the SIM, but would love to lose ATTs dropped calls and generally crappy network.

Finally getting a little excited.


Pat Horne

RE: Sales..
hkklife @ 12/14/2011 8:40:24 AM # Q
VZW LTE is awesome from a speed standpoint and the coverage is rapidly improving (at least for us bumpkins anyway).

Battery life DOES suffer greatly but I have a pretty solid plan in place to make it through a fullworkday away from a charger:

1. Buy the extended battery for whatever your device is. This is one reason I'd never touch the RAZR and its fixed battery

2. Buy a spare AC charger (preferably a 1A or bigger rapid charger) for work etc.

3. If you are a power user, buy another extended battery and an external battery charger so you can swap batteries later in the day

4. I keep my Bionic on 3G or wi-fi throughout the day and toggle LTE on when I need a burst of speed (YouTube, game or large attachment downloading, looking up a bunch of important stuff online). As a slight bonus, my Bionic pulls in slightly better speeds on 3G (up & down) than my old Droid X2 and X did!

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What HP is really saying
linds @ 12/16/2011 6:36:30 AM # Q
We made a really bad decision to invest 1.1 billion into Palm, we thought within 1 year we would be able to create a tablet that would take the market by storm. This didn't happen and now we have this investment doing nothing but hemorrhaging money. We asked every possible handset maker if they would like to license it from us for a ridiculous amount of money. They all said NO...we then ask them all if they would like to purchase it from us for some ridiculous amount of money and they all said NO. Now, we don't want to sell WebOS for a loss because that would make us look bad(if indeed someone did buy it and make it work)...instead we want to hedge our bets that if some entrepreneuring individual takes the code and makes something useful out of it, that we will have looked like the nice people making it free and will then have the first chance to actually put it into a product. If (and the chances are large) that it never becomes anything more we will at least have earned the good will of having opened sourced WebOS.

The End.

RE: Sales..
richf @ 12/16/2011 9:22:14 AM # Q
I think you forgot the part where they are more than happy to write it off as a loss and allow the American taxpayer to subsidize their stupidity and ineptitude. This my friends will adjust their tax bill downward. HP for the last decade has been a classic example of what MBA's will do for a corporation.
Have a nice day!
HP 41CX->HP 75C->Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->Pilot Pro->IIIe->IIIc->M500->M505->M515->TC->T3->T5->Treo 650P->Treo 700P->Droid>Pre Plus>Droid>iPhone4S
RE: Sales..
rpa @ 12/17/2011 1:22:25 AM # Q
Rich: so true. The smartest guys in the room only know how to destroy companies. The old HP was driven by engineering talent. Apple is driven by innovation. The whiz kids at HP only know capital destruction starting with the Compaq purchase.

After a year or so with an iP4, I am Ok with it: great at some things, so-so as a phone, Palm PIM still the best. Picked up a Pre3 for the heck of it as a spare....nice hardware and too bad the Pre3 wasn't released a few years back as the original Pre.

Reply to this comment

Don't give up yet

linds @ 12/14/2011 10:28:30 AM # Q
Come on guys...don't give up yet, a great Palm device is just around the corner with everything you could have ever dreamed of being included......


I jest..I jest


I purchased my droid incredible in April of 2010. My contract is coming due on Dec. 23rd. I am currently betwixed between the Galaxy Nexus and the iphone 4s. Oh which to chose...another thought is to just wait until Iphone 5 comes out next summer. (I prophecy such)

RE: Don't give up yet
richf @ 12/15/2011 3:02:32 PM # Q
I just got my iPhone 4S. It is great. The os is more polished than Andy at this time. Hardware is excellent. No plastic there. It is an example of great American engineering. It reminds me of early Palm smoothness. Apple has some of the best software engineers in the world. Check my sig, I've tried most of them and this is the best you can get right now. Can't believe it took me this long to get there.
Have a nice day!
HP 41CX->HP 75C->Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->Pilot Pro->IIIe->IIIc->M500->M505->M515->TC->T3->T5->Treo 650P->Treo 700P->Droid>Pre Plus>Droid>iPhone4S
RE: Don't give up yet
richf @ 12/15/2011 3:22:47 PM # Q
hk, trying to decide if Droid or Pre will be backup device. Could go either way. I have been a fan of AI since prof got me interested way back when. Been following progress for years. Finally it is on a device that is available to the public. Not to mention that it will something useful not just play answer the question games. Actually Siri and the test results on the speed of the 4S is what swung me to the 4S. This iOS is optimized to such a high degree. I am delighted with this phone.
Have a nice day!
HP 41CX->HP 75C->Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->Pilot Pro->IIIe->IIIc->M500->M505->M515->TC->T3->T5->Treo 650P->Treo 700P->Droid>Pre Plus>Droid>iPhone4S
RE: Don't give up yet
hkklife @ 12/18/2011 10:52:29 AM # Q
I'd stick with the Droid as the backup device due its better hardware, bigger screen, and availability of custom ROMs "just in case". Glad to hear you are so pleased with the 4S thus far. It's a walled garden, yes, but what a nicely cultivated garden!!

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RE: Don't give up yet
HyperScheduler @ 12/19/2011 9:32:11 AM # Q
@ richf,

I respectfully recommend the Android device as your backup device (over a WebOS device) because Android OS will have active developers for a longer period than WebOS developers (likely), so your backed up data will likely be more accessible for a longer period of time on Android.

RE: Don't give up yet
gmayhak @ 12/19/2011 7:01:43 PM # Q
As a backup to your data an iPod Touch or iPad would be the best bet, they are 100% compatible. Android is plagued with compatibility issues, I have lots of Android users wanting BattSix ported to Android but they still can't get a reliable bluetooth HID profile implemented to cover all devices.

Gary
http://www.BattSix.com

Tech Center Labs
www.talestuff.com
www.iTalentProductions.com

RE: Don't give up yet
hkklife @ 12/20/2011 6:52:33 PM # Q
@Gary;

True, true to the woes of Android fragmentation. However, it's STILL a far more viable option than the completely dead-in-the-water WebOS situation.

I've bought a couple of Android apps that had some initial fragmentation or incompatibility issues. However, waiting a month or two usually results in a few updates that clear things up. For WebOS, waiting a month or two might result in something nasty like HP shutting down their app store, activation servers, Palm profiles or similar.

On an unrelated note, I think Apple is missing a massive opportunity by not only failing to update the iPod Touch, but not releasing a 5" iPod Touch Max or a 7" iPad Mini.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro-> Verizon Moto Droid X2 + Palm TX

RE: Don't give up yet
gmayhak @ 12/29/2011 7:29:38 PM # Q
I still check PIC once in a while but I think there are only about 5 or so of us left :-/
It's a shame how companies can start out so good then let the bean counters and new college grads take over thinking they can do without innovation, (Palm, HP).
I think we will see some new form factors from Apple, Steve Jobs had a tight rein on their products.

Gary
www.BattSix.com

Tech Center Labs
www.talestuff.com
www.iTalentProductions.com

RE: Don't give up yet
rpa @ 1/2/2012 8:51:36 AM # Q
Gary: good point.....I use a MBP and backup my iP4 via USB and charge at the same time. It's seamless. Haven't tried Apple's cloud service which could be a viable alternative.

Now playing with e Pre3 as a back up phone.....not bad and a glimpse of what webOS could have been.

RE: Don't give up yet
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 1/2/2012 8:01:22 PM # Q
I still check PIC once in a while but I think there are only about 5 or so of us left :-/

Make that 6!

It's a shame how companies can start out so good then let the bean counters and new college grads take over thinking they can do without innovation, (Palm, HP).

Indeed. The innovation of Jeff Hawkins (Palm Pilot, Treo, Cloud OS) was ultimately stifled by Palm... THRICE!

I think we will see some new form factors from Apple, Steve Jobs had a tight rein on their products.

I hope Apple doesn't go crazy and try to compete with Android in terms of form factors. The only new products I'd like to see added to the mix are a 7 inch iPad and a 4-4.5 inch iPhone (and maybe a 2.5-3 inch iPhone Mini). Everything else is OK as-is.

FJH

RE: Don't give up yet
hkklife @ 1/3/2012 1:51:17 PM # Q
I'd like to see Apple field the following:

-iPhone "classic" with 3.5" screen but redesigned to have an overall smaller formfactor. That big physical button is comforting but could be made smaller (ala TouchPad or Pre 1) or removed entirely in favor of a small capacitive "button".

-iPhone 5 with a 4" or 4.1" or so screen, with 4.5" at the largest.

-iPod Touch "classic" with 3.5" screen, see above

-iPod Touch XL with a 4.5" or maybe a 5" screen

-iPad Mini with 7" to 8" (the ideal size, especially given the resolution Apple will be pushing) screen

-iPad 9.7" or maybe even bumped up to 10"
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro-> Verizon Moto Droid X2 + Palm TX

RE: Don't give up yet
gmayhak @ 1/4/2012 6:23:45 PM # Q
Sounds like you are starting to warm up to Apple a little now ;-)
I still can't find an Android developer, if I were looking for an iPhone developer they would be coming out of the woodwork (do people still say that?)

Have a great new year!

Gary
BattSix.com

Tech Center Labs
www.talestuff.com
www.iTalentProductions.com

RE: Don't give up yet
linds @ 1/18/2012 7:17:20 AM # Q
I would say Apple is going to stick with the existing form factors. They aren't the type to experiment .....although I suppose they are under "new" management.

RE: Don't give up yet
mijail @ 1/20/2012 8:10:32 AM # Q
..."they aren't the type to experiment"?

...what?? :D

Reply to this comment

I'm back!

cervezas @ 12/23/2011 10:04:40 AM # M Q
What did I miss?

Still rockin my pimped out Visor Platinum with the Sprint Digital Link module. 12kbps is faster than the 9kbps from the VisorPhone, and let's face it: the dropped calls are usually a blessing. Can't beat 7 days on a charge either!

David

RE: I'm back!
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 12/24/2011 2:16:35 AM # Q
What did I miss?

Not much: Palm died; Palm was resuscitated by EP; Palm died; Palm was resuscitated by HP; Palm was KILLED by HP.
Go back to sleep - nothing to see here, move along.

Still rockin my pimped out Visor Platinum with the Sprint Digital Link module. 12kbps is faster than the 9kbps from the VisorPhone, and let's face it: the dropped calls are usually a blessing. Can't beat 7 days on a charge either!

The Samsung i500 and European Sony CLIE TH55 remain the true caviar to the general. Not that you would know, Private.

FJH

Reply to this comment

RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!

Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 1/2/2012 7:50:04 PM # Q
I bought a couple of BlackBerry PlayBooks on sale last month and so far have been very impressed with the hardware and the OS. The screen is gorgeous (like a 7 inch version of my iPhone 4) and the OS is fast and intuitive. RIM seems to have copied the best parts of the webOS UI and sped things up tenfold compared to the Touchpad. The size and weight are perfect for portability and the build quality is superb.

Shortcomings? Only one: the limited selection of apps. But since I'm using my PlayBook mainly as a mobile web browser (hooked up to my iPhone's hotspot) I don't really care. I do wish TeamViewer made an app for the PlayBook, though. But even the app situation is getting better every month - the Angry Birds games were just released for the PlayBook.

All things considered, it's a great buy if you can still find one for $200 - $300.

FJH

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
hkklife @ 1/3/2012 1:46:42 PM # Q
FJH, what are you hearing about the "big" Playbook update coming soon? Is it still on track for next month? Is this near-mythical update truly going to address most of its inherent shortcomings? Adding a native email app would be massive.

Since I didn't care for the HTC Flyer's color scheme, I am now rocking an awesome black HTC Evo View 4G (no WiMax, just wi-fi mode) as my daily tablet and I LOVE it. It has replaced my Galaxy Tab and my Acer Iconia as my daily driver. Flawless HTC build quality, 1.5Ghz Snapdragon is fine for my needs, 1GB RAM + 32GB internal + microSD slot + charging over a standard microUSB port=bliss. For once, I prefer what HTC has done with Sense atop Honeycomb. This will absolutely hold me over very nicely until something more compelling arrives. I think something thin around 7.7" to 8.2" is the PERFECT tablet formfactor but for now I am fine with 7". A shame we never got to fondle a TouchPad Go. Given the proper infusion of $ and time, however, and I'd definitely pick up an iPad 3 in the coming months for a taste of the good life.


While I'm at it, might as well make my fearless predictions for 2012:

-Late 2012 is going to bring about a minor BB renaissance (at least from the die-hards and the reviewer community) when BB 10 devices finally launche and somehow manage to surpass expectations but it'll be too little, too late. The Playbook meets a quiet demise once existing stocks are liquidated mid-year.

-WebOS will remain dead, despite Whitman's promises to the contrary.

-Lazaridis and Batsillie are not ousted but are moved to a "secure location" as co-figureheads within the company. Again, too little, too late. Sanjay Jha is not ousted from Motorola Mobility, even though he should be. Balmer will get the boot from MS. After a quiet period, Rubinstein will again land on his feet...somewhere.

-Android will hit a pretty sizable rut amidst consumer complaints too many "me too" companies not supporting their devices with OS updates (Hello, Samsung) and unsucrupulous developers such as Gameloft not updating their apps in a timely fashion. Google TV will continue to be an unmitigated disaster with very little support.

-As it becomes increasingly clear that Google "sold out" Android to appease the telcos and their hardware partners, hardware manufacturers will rush to support Windows 8 tablets. ICS (Android 4.0) will take FAR longer to roll out than it should due to any number of the usual reasons.

-Amazon milks the Kindle Fire line to great success with new variants(higher capacity version, bigger screen version etc) while B&N's Nook Color/Tablet line slowly withers away, a victim of B&N's arrogance and complacency due to the Nook Colo'rs huge initial success in 2010 & early 2011. Apple first cuts the iPad2 price then counters with an iPad "mini" or an iPod Touch XL type device in the $300 neighborhood.

-Apple's Smart TV line is the company's biggest flop since the Mac Power Mac Cube, due to a stratospheric sticker price and expensive content. I expect a few of the traditional companies to leave the US market or turn into rebrands as knee-jerk responses to Apple's TV (Audiovox? Sharp? Funai? Toshiba?) but the remaining contenders will circle the wagons and undercut Apple in an area where it's not used to competing. Since 3D has not caught on like the industry hoped, expect cheap prices, integrated wi-fi and built-in integrated IPTV services to be the CE industry's counter to Apple's TV line.

-T-Mobile rebounds from the failed AT&T merger by entering talks with Sprint. Too early to tell if this will come to fruition but I would think it likely.
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RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 1/5/2012 3:36:55 AM # Q
FJH, what are you hearing about the "big" Playbook update coming soon? Is it still on track for next month? Is this near-mythical update truly going to address most of its inherent shortcomings? Adding a native email app would be massive.

It was scheduled for February, but RIM is synonymous with massive slippage these days. Of course they're in a difficult situation: prematurely release buggy beta OS (a la Palm [Foleo, LifeDrive, Tungsten 5, Treo XXX, etc.]/Google/HP/and almost every other manufacturer these days) and they'll get lambasted. Take their time and they'll be criticized for lack of features and slow "innovation". Catch-22. People are too stupid to realize that intuitive, fast OS is a better "innovation" than the 5 different horrid versions of Android out here with their hundreds of messy, Ritalin-deficient widgets. RIM are releasing incremental upgrades every for the PlayBook every few weeks - I think at least 2 updates since I got mine last month. The OS is already very fast and is as responsive as an iPhone, so they have a great foundation. The gestures for app switching are brilliant. I just hope they don't screw everything up by adding Android-esque bloatware to QNX.

To be honest while people bitch and moan about the lack of native email on the PlayBook, I don't care for reading email on tablets. Too awkward to hold and type on. My iPhone is already perfect for checking and responding to messages quickly on the go. Time that may have been otherwise wasted - standing in line, waiting in a restaurant, takling on the phone, etc - now can be used productively. But for more serious email tasks I want a 12 inch or larger screen and an attached hardware keyboard. While I bought a (TouchPad!) blutooth keyboard for my portable phone + tablets I never use it because lugging around a separate keyboard (and stand) defeats the purpose (portability). I guess a 7 inch tablet with a removable keyboard case (like the ASUS Transformer) and a TrackPoint might be the perfect device for me, but I would only buy one with Windows 8 - or less usefully iOS or QNX/BBX - on it.
Give me this with a keyboard case, TrackPoint and 6 (not 3!) hours battery life and I'll pay $1000:

http://tinyurl.com/cjfajbq

Since I didn't care for the HTC Flyer's color scheme, I am now rocking an awesome black HTC Evo View 4G (no WiMax, just wi-fi mode) as my daily tablet and I LOVE it. It has replaced my Galaxy Tab and my Acer Iconia as my daily driver. Flawless HTC build quality, 1.5Ghz Snapdragon is fine for my needs, 1GB RAM + 32GB internal + microSD slot + charging over a standard microUSB port=bliss. For once, I prefer what HTC has done with Sense atop Honeycomb. This will absolutely hold me over very nicely until something more compelling arrives. I think something thin around 7.7" to 8.2" is the PERFECT tablet formfactor but for now I am fine with 7". A shame we never got to fondle a TouchPad Go. Given the proper infusion of $ and time, however, and I'd definitely pick up an iPad 3 in the coming months for a taste of the good life.

But you're still stuck using nasty old Android. I'll pass. Compare the UI experience of iOS or QNX to Android. How do you tolerate using Android? Yuck. And did the Evo View 4G get Honeycomb in the last week or so? Last I heard Gingerbread was standard.


While I'm at it, might as well make my fearless predictions for 2012:

Bold predictions, but unfortunately I think you used "Auntie" Mike Cane's crystal ball to gaze into the future.

BBX has proved a lot harder than expected to integrate into RIM's back end cash cow. Trusting Adobe and depending on Air was a bit naive of RIM, though. RIM does have some GREAT ideas/designs with its BBX OS, but the development of a next-generation OS should have started on the day they learned about the existence of the iPhone. Instead, RIM's co-Village Idiots pulled a Colligan and didn't take the threat seriously, instead choosing the Patented Palm Tactic of Incremental Upgrades Ad Infinitum. Why do companies in the lead always seem to believe it's their birthright to have customers begging to "Shut up and take my money!" forever? Truly bizarre.

Getting the new OS on PHONES (not tablets!) should have been the primary target. What's odd is that huuuuge Nokia would choose to get someone else (Microsoft) to do the OS heavy lifting, while tiny RIM would try to come up with its own home made OS. They ended up out of the Palm/webOS sweepstakes, but ultimately showed that with enough time RIM's own people - and people it added from a few strategic software company purchases - could out-webOS webOS. Owning your OS is a differentiator and a Good Thing, which Samsung, HTC and the others suckered by Google now ruefully recognize. Only problem is Momentum Rules and the status quo is often difficult to distupt if you arrive too late to the Developer Party. Rubenstein prancing around in a low cut dress desperately to attact the attention of the leftover 3rd tier coked-up (Red Bulled-up?) deveoloper dorks is NOT a pretty sight.

RIM's cap has shrunk so much in the past year it's now a serious takeover target. Any more massive burn rates in coming quarters will seal its fate.

-Late 2012 is going to bring about a minor BB renaissance (at least from the die-hards and the reviewer community) when BB 10 devices finally launche and somehow manage to surpass expectations but it'll be too little, too late. The Playbook meets a quiet demise once existing stocks are liquidated mid-year.

RIM needs a sugar daddy with deep enough pockets to keep it viable long enough for QNX to properly launch. Sorta what we'd hoped HP would have done for webOS...

-WebOS will remain dead, despite Whitman's promises to the contrary.

Was webOS ever really alive? If a tree falls...

-Lazaridis and Batsillie are not ousted but are moved to a "secure location" as co-figureheads within the company. Again, too little, too late. Sanjay Jha is not ousted from Motorola Mobility, even though he should be. Balmer will get the boot from MS. After a quiet period, Rubinstein will again land on his feet...somewhere.

New board chairwoman supposedly has aleady been chosen.

Jha is an idiot and Motorola would have been soon killed off by the ruthless competition had Google not stepped in when it did. Of course, Motorola threatening Google that it might choose the nuclear option and start suing other Android licensees was a clever way to seal the deal...

-Android will hit a pretty sizable rut amidst consumer complaints too many "me too" companies not supporting their devices with OS updates (Hello, Samsung) and unsucrupulous developers such as Gameloft not updating their apps in a timely fashion. Google TV will continue to be an unmitigated disaster with very little support.

Android is garbage. But manufacturers were stupid/lazy enough sign on because Android was "free". And consumers are even more stupid to get Android phones because they are "free" (with contract). Ignore those pesky minor details about manufactures having to pay Microsoft licensing fees for every Android device. And the Oracle lawsuit? And WWJD (What Would Jobs Do)? to kneecap Android in 2012?

Apple realizes that ease of use, simplicity, content and brand cachet are the keys to success and avouding commoditization. Sony STILL can't seem to figure ou how to execute on this even though they have all the pieces of the puzzle in their increasingly ever-fumbling hands.

-As it becomes increasingly clear that Google "sold out" Android to appease the telcos and their hardware partners, hardware manufacturers will rush to support Windows 8 tablets. ICS (Android 4.0) will take FAR longer to roll out than it should due to any number of the usual reasons.

In 2012 buying an Android tablet makes ZERO sense. Either buy an iPad 3 for high res screen and apps and ease of use or else when prices will likely get more reasonable at the end of the year buy a Samsung or Lenovo Windows 8 tablet for Real Windows apps. My Touchpad - couldn't resist the price - sits barely used relegated to occasional web browsing in the living room, while my Playbook is with me around 50% of the time and my iPhone is with me 100% of the time. Broke into a cold sweat a few weeks ago when I lost my iPhone and realized how dependent I've now become on it. Of course I was able to use the brilliant little app called Device Locator to show me on Google Maps that the phone was "lost" in my house and remotely turned on an alarm to show me exactly where it was!

-Amazon milks the Kindle Fire line to great success with new variants(higher capacity version, bigger screen version etc) while B&N's Nook Color/Tablet line slowly withers away, a victim of B&N's arrogance and complacency due to the Nook Colo'rs huge initial success in 2010 & early 2011. Apple first cuts the iPad2 price then counters with an iPad "mini" or an iPod Touch XL type device in the $300 neighborhood.

Amazon will succeed and B&N will fail simple because of Amazon's unfair advantages of company size and access to content. If Amazon are wise they will use 2012 to flood the tablet market with at-cost Fires. Give away the razor and make huge profits selling the blades.
A 7 inch iPad could a very slick little device, but would Apple risk brand dilution or the potential for cannibalization of sales?

-Apple's Smart TV line is the company's biggest flop since the Mac Power Mac Cube, due to a stratospheric sticker price and expensive content. I expect a few of the traditional companies to leave the US market or turn into rebrands as knee-jerk responses to Apple's TV (Audiovox? Sharp? Funai? Toshiba?) but the remaining contenders will circle the wagons and undercut Apple in an area where it's not used to competing. Since 3D has not caught on like the industry hoped, expect cheap prices, integrated wi-fi and built-in integrated IPTV services to be the CE industry's counter to Apple's TV line.

Stay tuned for some interesting moves from Apple over the next few weeks. Winners in 2012 will be those who make it easiest to access CONTENT.

-T-Mobile rebounds from the failed AT&T merger by entering talks with Sprint. Too early to tell if this will come to fruition but I would think it likely.

T-Mobile's assets will eventually be sold off as its parent company realized long ago that it can't compete here.

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
hkklife @ 1/5/2012 12:17:59 PM # Q
Thanks for the comments!

Just for the record, I am not "in love" with Android and its ADD PIM apps, clunkily inconsistent UI or horribly fragmented landscape.

I simply hopped on board the original Droid 1 back in '09 because:

1. My Treo 755p was dying and I refused to go backwards with a Centro
2. Palm so foolishly stuck with their Sprint Pre exclusivity
3. The Droid had a big high-res screen, expandable storage, and a physical keybard
4. My brief flirtation with a BB Storm was an unmitigated disaster
5. Verizon only had WinMob rubbish for the rest of their smartphone lineup

I've invested a LOT in Android apps over the years and stick with it primarily due to the variety of hardware (where else can you get a big-screen LTE smartphone or a keyboard slider with LTE?) and the "openness" which sadly seems to be withering away on a daily basis.

Fragmentation and stagnant OS updates are rapidly undermining Android. I've known a number of first-time Android users who left for iOS or BB (or returned to those platforms) as soon as their contracts were up. On top of that, I have TouchWiz-owning friends who are jealous of their Sense coworkers or relatives or people like myself stuck with Blur who would give anything for vanilla Android and/or an unlocked bootloader.

Google should have cracked down HARD starting with ICS/4.0:

-No more $99 CVS or Asian no-name tablets not offering Maps, Gmail or Market access. Either let 'em all have access to the Market and the GAPPS or mandate that everything running 4.0 has to be "official". There are a lot of people out there who woke up very disappointed on Christmas morning to a Viewsonic, Sylvania, Coby or Pandigital "Android tablet" and found that it's a crude, pale imitation of the Android smartphones they have played with.

-Manufacturer UI skins are fine but Google should offer basic functionality in 4.0 to go "clean" and bypass all of the manufacturer UI elements

-The fragmentation madness is nearly unbearable at this point. I have a number of games that I purchased on my old Droid X or Galaxy Tab that do not appear for download on my X2, Evo View or Bionic. Yet if I sideload a warez APK of these titles I OWN, they play spectacularly! Google needs to offer a "YMMV" unsupported option to force install a purchased app to a user's device.

-Scale down the emphasis on widgets. I like the little "auto-rotate screen" or "3G/4G" data toggle widgets but not these bloated full-screen clocks or weather maps. Ugh.

-Mandate that every manufacturer support their devices (handsets or tablets) for a minimum of 12 months after its launch. Or pull an Apple and charge a minimal fee for OS upgrades. I would GLADLY pay $10 or $20 for a stable, supported official update to bring ICS to my Evo View . Instead, I am 99% certain it'll be stuck on 3.2 for the rest of its existence. (BTW, the wi-fi Flyer Honeycomb update came out earlier this week and the View's HC update arrived the day after Christmas or so). HC + Sense is a surprisingly nice spin on Android and the beefy CPU + RAM help plow through most tasks. And stylus integration is VERY nice (I would say that the stylus may make a small comeback in 2012 but people seem to DETEST them no matter what). If anything will bring the stylus back into vogue, it'll be the awesome Samsung Galaxy Note (imagine that running iOS, huh???)

But that still brings me to...

-Focus on OS responsiveness, smothness and battery life. Played with a colleague's iPad 2 last night and almost wept at how refined it feels. The Galaxy Nexus & ICS are decent steps forward but still far short of iOS.

************************
As far as RIM, I am not big on composing email on my tablet but I love to read it, especially if it's a nice 7" or 8" tablet like the Playbook.

I would LOVE to see a Transformer-style 7" or 8" tablet + keyboard dock (from anyone). If I am going to lug a 10" Asus TF around, I might as well carry a nice dual-core AMD Brazos Fusion netbook or ultraportable around and get some "real" work done.

If I had the choice between a $100 TouchPad or a $200 Playbook right now, I'd take PB all day and night long...

"Owning your OS is a differentiator and a Good Thing, which Samsung, HTC and the others suckered by Google now ruefully recognize". Truer words were never spoken!!

Do you think that a RIM sugar daddy with deep pockets will indeed step up to the plate to get QNX spit-shined and launched in a non-Palm circa 2009 fashion?

"Was webOS ever really alive?" For a few fleeting months (weeks?) post-CES 2009, yes it was very much alive and vibrant. NO ONE cared about the handful of HTC G1 Android devices at CES that year. The buzz was all about WebOS. Then 6-8 months later the vultures were already circling. Sad, sad, sad.

**************************
WWJD (What Would Jobs Do)? to kneecap Android in 2012? We can ask WWJD for just abut every situation imaginable.

For once, I honestly wish Apple would risk a bit of brand dilution or the potential of cannibalized sales to fill in the gaping void between the iPhone/Touch screen size and the iPad. But WWJD to respond to someone who requested a device with a 5"-8" screen size??

I am chomping at the bit to see what Apple manages to do in regards to LTE connectivity, for example. They can make a semi-compelling argument to stay with tiny 3.5" to 4" screen sizes. They cannot, however, afford to coast any longer than 6 months from now with just 3G connectivity. But as Moto's RAZR has shown, keeping an LTE connective alive will suck down a battery in record time, especially in a thin iPhone 4-esque formfactor. I can easily zap my Bionic's 2880 mAh extended battery in a full workday if I leave LTE on and brightness at 3/4. WWJD? My guess is some kind of intelligent (and seamless, if the handover goes quickly enough) switching between LTE and 3G depending on what task is being performed.

If you must have a tablet NOW, get a dirt-cheap Android 3.x tablet since retailers are likely swimming in unsold post-Christmas inventory. I recommend the View/Flyer or perhaps the Asus EEEPad TF101. Then hope and pray your device gets a timely 4.x update to extend its useful service life.

If you can wait a quarter or two, get an iPad 3.

Fort late 2012, Win 8 tablets will be the the hot ticket (perhaps perfectly timed with Balmer's ousting).
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro-> Verizon Moto Droid X2 + Palm TX

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 1/8/2012 4:31:08 PM # Q
My January, 2012 hardware recommendations:

Phone: iPhone 4 or 4s. Nothing else is even remotely close in terms of OS/apps/user experience/screen quality/build quality.

Tablet: 16 GB RIM PlayBook if you can get one for around $200. Otherwise wait for a Windows 8 tablet in a year or an iPad 3 in 3 months.

Android may just get sued into oblivion if Larry Ellison and the other vultures have their way over the next 6 months...

Fake Jeff Hawkins

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 1/8/2012 4:32:32 PM # Q
My January, 2012 hardware recommendations:

Phone: iPhone 4 or 4s. Nothing else is even remotely close in terms of OS/apps/user experience/screen quality/build quality.

Tablet: 16 GB RIM PlayBook if you can get one for around $200. Otherwise wait for a Windows 8 tablet in a year or an iPad 3 in 3 months.

Android may just get sued into oblivion if Larry Ellison and the other vultures have their way over the next 6 months...

Fake Jeff Hawkins

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
gmayhak @ 1/8/2012 6:32:35 PM # Q
I agree on the iPhone but also iPad over RIM for the same reasons.

As far as Android, Google is a bottom feeder stealing technology!

http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/can-oracles-court-challenge-derail-android/

Gary
BattSix.com

Tech Center Labs
www.talestuff.com
www.iTalentProductions.com

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
mijail @ 1/9/2012 5:30:35 AM # Q
Cannibalization? Tim Cook already said 1 year ago that they rather like it.
http://techcrunch.com/2011/01/18/apple-mac-relationship/

And I don't understand the bit about brand dilution. Every Apple product comes in different versions: Pro. Mini. 3G. 3GS. Shuffle. 24. Touch. Classic. Air. So, why would an, say, iPad Mini dilute anything?

T-mobile and Sprint?
Tuckermaclain @ 1/11/2012 10:45:42 PM # Q
"-T-Mobile rebounds from the failed AT&T merger by entering talks with Sprint. Too early to tell if this will come to fruition but I would think it likely."

T-Mobile is GSM isn't it? I wonder what Sprint would do? Have 2 networks? Go to all GSM or all CDMA? Would we get some awesome phones with a SIM card for each network? Sounds fun, but I wonder how it would play out.

Still rocking my TX and my evil Android EVO.

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
hkklife @ 1/12/2012 4:04:29 PM # Q
T-Mob's already selling off their towers. They could sell their spectrum & misc assets to someone else and convert all of their users over to new Sprint LTE handsets.

Sprint is already moving surprisingly swift to dump the last vestiges of the old iDen stuff this year and I would expect them to start some mega-offers to transition their WiMax customers to new LTE devices.

I fully expect Sprint to be all CDMA + LTE by the end of 2013, with WiMax for all intents and purposes phased out by that time, perhaps even sooner, if they can get their legacy users to give up their old EVOs.

One thing I continue to be pleasantly surprised about is the speed and (relative) reliability of VZW's LTE network. Wherever I travel, its speeds are consistently good. Once the next generation of radios start to appear (better 3G to 4G handover, less power consumption etc) then we should really be ready for Hawkins' grandiose vision of your "LifeDrive" in your pocket...if it weren't for those nasty data caps & throttling.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro-> Verizon Moto Droid X2 + Palm TX

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
nastebu @ 1/12/2012 9:57:10 PM # Q
mijail wrote:
And I don't understand the bit about brand dilution. Every Apple product comes in different versions: Pro. Mini. 3G. 3GS. Shuffle. 24. Touch. Classic. Air. So, why would an, say, iPad Mini dilute anything?

The argument might run that I mini-version would offer an inferior experience. If, for example, the interface that is fine on the current screen was more difficult to use at a reduced size, you could make the argument that the brand would suffer.

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
HyperScheduler @ 1/17/2012 9:36:28 AM # Q
@ Tuckermaclain:

That is cool that you are still rocking your Palm TX. May I ask: which specific programs or apps are you currently using on that device?

Also, I would like to suggest this as a topic for our Palm Info Center forum here. Given everything that has happened to Palm, given that here we are, I believe that it would be valuable to "take stock" for a moment and discover who among us is still using a Palm OS device (either full-time or part-time).

As for me, I bought a Treo 650 not too long ago (mainly for the apps that the seller included), but I need to get my home-computer situation more established before I can HotSync and otherwise re-incorporate a Palm OS device into my day-to-day reality.

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
hkklife @ 1/17/2012 5:54:59 PM # Q
I still have my 2nd TX (bought in '06) sitting here with all of my legacy PIM data & games/apps on it, though I must admit I have not used it with any seriousness in 6 months or so, maybe longer. I must say that having an available Windows 64-bit Hotsync USB driver is a comforting thought "just in case".

There is also another TX sitting in the box in reserve (in almost brand new condition) in a closet, as, circa 2008 or so, I felt it would be wise to have a spare Palm OS device but I may honestly never end up using it. I still have oodles of accessories for these devices but I may end up dumping the whole load of them one of these days if I could find a good home for 'em.

I also have my old 755p and a buttload of accessories for it but I have not had that as an active telephone since March or April of 2010 I think. On the nostalgia end, I still have a mint condition Palm Vx, a Pilot Professional w/ Palm III upgrade card, a Palm VII and one or two original Pilots (one w/ packaging!).

Additionally, I am keeping a Pixi Plus around just because I got it cheap and it's always good to have a spare VZW smartphone around if the wife breaks her Droid.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro-> Verizon Moto Droid X2 + Palm TX

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 1/19/2012 10:58:29 PM # Q
Given everything that has happened to Palm, given that here we are, I believe that it would be valuable to "take stock" for a moment and discover who among us is still using a Palm OS device (either full-time or part-time).

I've got a collection of around 50 PalmOS devices (several unopened) ready for museum duty. They cover the early models like the 1000, 5000, etc. and range up to the most advanced: TH55 and VZ90. A couple years ago I stocked up on Sprint Centro 2 when they were being blown out on eBay. (One of my lines is an old SERO plan and the Centro 2 is the last advanced PalmOS phone that you can activate on the SERO plan.) Nowadays it's easy to pick up some nice old PalmOS devices for next to nothing on eBay.

As far as active duty:

Samsung i500 - has been my main phone for several years, but I break one every 2 years (they all snap near the hinge) and I'll eventually run out of the backups I purchased when Sprint blew them out back in 2004 or 2005. DateBk5, Ultrasoft Money, Diddlebug and Launcher X are key apps. Unfortunately, text messaging doesn't work so well (you can't tell who sent you the message), the browsers (Blazer and then Novarro?) were deactivated several years ago, new apps are nonexistent and the screen is a pixellated 160 x 160. But the phone's voice quality and build quality are the best I have EVER experienced and the size is almost perfect.

Centro 2 - backup phone. Great size, easy one handed use, rugged.

Unlocked GSM Centro - backup travel phone. Far too plasticky compared to the Centro 2, though.

Zodiac 2 - scientific calculator and MP3 player.


Unfortunately, the iPhone 4 screen and apps have made it harder to justify sticking with Palm for any reason other than the voice quality of my i500. It's actually shocking to see the number of things you can do with a iPhone these days given its massive app catalog. And the "long tail" means there's likely to be an app out there to fit even the most obscure niche, incredibly usually for no more than $1. Even the legendary DatebK5/6 has difficulty competing with the flashy features found in the iOS app Week Cal.

You still can't beat PalmOS for PIM, speed, simplicity and one handed use, though. Pretty impressive for a 15+ year old OS.

FJH

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
mijail @ 1/20/2012 8:24:55 AM # Q


You still can't beat PalmOS for PIM, speed, simplicity and one handed use, though. Pretty impressive for a 15+ year old OS.

It's interesting to read that. I could never force myself to consistently use my T3... I found myself preferring a paper notebook in my back pocket and gradually using less and less the T3. (I tried to find uses for it! from reading to movies to games to language learning to maps ...)

But when I got a semi-capable smartphone, the T3 was finally forgotten.

I rediscovered it some weeks ago and still didn't get to put it to eBay. But it got me thinking about why exactly the iPhone now has taken roots with me as hard as it has. And I still don't know. I suspect something like simple use (no pen to fumble and loss, no graffitti, rugged enough that I don't need any case, acceptable battery life) and reliable syncing (it was never funny to sync the T3 with my Macs).

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
BaalthazaaR @ 1/31/2012 10:59:41 AM # Q
I thought I'd pop over and see what's new. I don't tend to visit this site regularly anymore since I had enough of Palm. It is a shame how many people I converted to Palm fans back in the day.

I switched over to using an HTC Thunderbolt last year and have the unlimited LTE plan (while it was still available). Once I switched over to using the Android PIM, I pretty much stopped using my TX.

Also, I would like to suggest this as a topic for our Palm Info Center forum here. Given everything that has happened to Palm, given that here we are, I believe that it would be valuable to "take stock" for a moment and discover who among us is still using a Palm OS device (either full-time or part-time).

I still sometimes use the TX because battery life on the HTC is pretty bad (it got better after a few updates, but this last one seems to have reverted). Believe it or not, but the main thing I use it for anymore is for Blazer to browse websites with simple layouts and only because of the HTC's lousy battery life. I never thought I'd admit to using Blazer :-) Again that is pretty rare since most of my browsing is when I'm out and about and waiting on something and my TX stays at home. Well I do occasionally play sudoku on the TX as well, but most of the software I don't use anymore.

P.S. I've finally gotten past writing using graffiti when using a pen and paper. Although I occasionally still find myself writing "v" that way. :-P

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
HyperScheduler @ 2/1/2012 1:19:55 PM # Q
@ BaalthazaaR:

Thank you for giving us an update on your use of Palm OS.

>I don't tend to visit this site regularly anymore since I had enough of Palm.

What you write is a REASON to visit this site regularly! Who among us HASN'T had enough of Palm, right?!?


>I switched over to using an HTC Thunderbolt last year and have the unlimited LTE plan (while it was still available).

That is cool! Your situation reminds me of a dude on the Pimlical forum who told us that he was grandfathered in on an unlimited data plan for his Treo 650 that he continued to use.

>Once I switched over to using the Android PIM, I pretty much stopped using my TX.

Even an Android PIM user should still back up his or her calendar into a Palm OS device, like so:
Android calendar PIM Google Calendar Pimlical Desktop Palm TX (or any other Palm OS device)


>Believe it or not, but the main thing I use it for anymore is for Blazer to browse websites with simple layouts and only because of the HTC's lousy battery life. I never thought I'd admit to using Blazer :-)

LOL! I was not expecting that. Wouldn't you agree with the following statement: Anyone still using Blazer (however rarely) ought to check in at Palm Info Center.


> P.S. I've finally gotten past writing using graffiti when using a pen and paper. Although I occasionally still find myself writing "v" that way. :-P

I hear you! I used to have that issue when I used graffiti on the Palm m515. Then I switched to a Treo 650 and then a Treo 755p and slowly got my own handwriting back.

Now I suffer from the modern-day equivalent of that effect: I will sloppily type on a physical keyboard on a PC and expect the Windows 7 program to automatically auto-correct my spelling the way that my iPhone 3Gs does.

RE: RIM's PlayBook is an AMAZING deal!!!
BaalthazaaR @ 2/2/2012 12:30:16 PM # Q
What you write is a REASON to visit this site regularly! Who among us HASN'T had enough of Palm, right?!?

Not really... Palm is dead. WebOS has flat-lined. It was too little too late and released on under-spec'ed devices resulting in an underwhelming user experience. But that is the way things are done these days. Companies want something out the door a week ago rather than spend the time to design things right. But I have moved on and no longer want to expend the energy reminiscing of the days of Rob Haitani. Back in the day, the longest I stayed away was about 3-4 days even if I didn't post a comment. Now I might pop on here once in a month or two.

Even an Android PIM user should still back up his or her calendar into a Palm OS device, like so:
Android calendar PIM Google Calendar Pimlical Desktop Palm TX (or any other Palm OS device)

It doesn't have to be Palm OS. Besides, these days my calendar is filled with work-related appointments that get sync'ed to my phone from the Exchange server. I might have considered it if Acceca had released the PDA32 with WiFi a couple of years ago despite their garishly colored plastic. But now that I've fully transitioned to Android, I don't feel the need for another Palm OS device.

LOL! I was not expecting that. Wouldn't you agree with the following statement: Anyone still using Blazer (however rarely) ought to check in at Palm Info Center.

I read your comment using Blazer last night. However, now that I'm used to the bigger screen of the Thunderbolt, I found the screen a little too inconvenient to post a reply, not to mention the crappy digitizer on the TX. The biggest reason I moved from the Visor Edge to the TX was the WiFi and my SlingBox. I still remember the fascination on people's faces watching live cable on my TX.
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