Comments on: Pocket PC Gaining on Palm

According to this Cnet article, Microsoft's Pocket PC now has 18% of the handheld market, up from 10% when the Pocket PC was released in April. IDC analyst Kevin Burden predicts that by 2004 Microsoft will have almost 40% of the market, compared with 51% for Palm.

The market research form Gartner is predicting that sales of Palm handhelds will wilt as consumers seek devices with more features. "We are predicting the death of single-function devices," Gartner analyst Ken Dulaney said.

Return to Story - Permalink

Article Comments


The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. PalmInfocenter is not responsible for them in any way.
Please Login or register here to add your comments.

Comments Closed Comments Closed
This article is no longer accepting new comments.


no change in 4 years?!?

GregGaub @ 11/29/2000 12:30:12 PM #
OK, I didn't read the whole article, just the quotes above. But if those accurate sample the tone of the article, then the whoever wrote it needs to get his hands out of MS's pockets.
He's making the assumption that Palm devices and the PalmOS won't make significant changes, if any, for the next four years. That's asinine, at the very least. In the last year alone, the OS and hardware options have changed dramatically. I'm not even touching on the 3rd party accessories.

What's even more ludicrous is that corporations will be afraid of "older OSes". What's up with that? Half the big companies I know are still using Windows 95 for chrissakes! If I were a corporate fatcat, I'd be MUCH more comfortable pouring lots of money into a KNOWN STABLE operating system, that I know will do what I want and keep doing it without significant downtime. The last thing I'd do is buy 1000 devices running PPC'04 for fear of the things not properly interfacing with the software my company already uses, not to mention the devices themselves crashing and dying.

As Beth Goza, member of the MS Mobile Devices Division (the PPC people!!!) said at a recent PSHUG meeting, "I've learned to appreciate the soft reset!"

I'm sorry, but a device where soft resetting is a "tool" for getting it to work properly is NOT a device I want to carry with me as my lifeline. :P


RE: no change in 4 years?!?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/29/2000 12:59:49 PM #
Its hardly asinine since Palm has made no major changes in four years. Jut minor OS upgrades and increased memory. They have also had many quality control problems. This company is arrogant and incompetent and is due for a fall.

RE: no change in 4 years?!?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/29/2000 3:11:20 PM #
Heaven only knows the Gartner group knows all. They and Madam Cleo. The Gartner group has a report entitled:

"Breakthrough PDA or Pet Rock of 1996?

The Pilot pocket organizer from U.S. Robotics presents a fresh and compelling design to the stalled PDA market. Its low price should ensure initial unit volume - but will it last? "

So being that they had such a handle on that prediction!!!

RE: no change in 4 years?!?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/29/2000 5:14:44 PM #
Now even though I love my Visor and it suites me FOR NOW, you have to admit, comparing apples to apples, Microsoft has made more significant changes to their OS inthe PDA market in the last few years than Palm has. Now I know the earlier versions of WinCE were less than desirable but the new PPC can pack a punch, and keeping in mind the Ipaqs and other devices we are seeing now are just the first generations of the PPC PDA. As far as Palm goes, I have read some of their future outlooks for their PDAs, and they seem to be more interested in wireless than making any big changes to their PDAs. And really in the last 4 years what big changes has Palm really done to their OS or their PDAs for that matter? And I will have to admit... My Visor suites me now and I love it, but soon I will want something which could do more than just a "single-function devices". It just makes sence. Technology is about moving ahead and getting more out of any device you have. Hopefully when that time comes Palm will be there for me and others to choose from.

RE: no change in 4 years?!?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 2:17:54 PM #
Who cares. why are people so hung up about being devoted to one company over another. Right now as it stands Palm will continue to dominate for 4 more yrs if and i mean IF the curent trends go the way they are. This is about as likely as my earning more then gates by not working 1 day further.

Palm has already anounced it will develop for stongarms, it has a Vc type palm device in the works slated for 01(usualy march when they anounce there new stuff) and more wireless access capabilities and new SD storage and Memory Stick storage development. As for corporate clients are concerned I need my employee's to have wireless access, a solid device that does't crash, long battery life, and I don't want them wasting time nore my money on GAMES!(iknow cuz thats all my ipaq is good for these days)

when you compare cost palm wins here.

then the average person who needs to get organized. do you need to sched when you want toplan nintendo gaems? then why do you need a $500 PDA for?
you need charts, Yes you need colour. you need graphics yes colour works here. you need to sched an apt @ 3, and a reminder for 4 to pick up the dog from the vet. why would you need colour for? to look kewl?

honestly most PDA users are like childern. this is the same as a PC VS MAC debate. BOring get a life.
it's only a PDA. if you feel so good about what you bought. well good for you. that and $1 will get you a coffee. stop posting how your choice was the absolute best and anyone who thinks diff is an idiot.

Palm needs more Multimedia!

Jay @ 11/29/2000 6:03:30 PM #
I think that the PalmOS is very great! Infact on the day I bought my Visor Deluxe I was originally gonna buy a Windows CE device, but learned, that in many ways, the palm based ones offers a whole lot more than the windows based devices, of course palm doesn't beat windows devices mulitimedia experience. On the mulitimedia part Palm offers not the top notch
quality graphics and sound but it's not bad (for exception of the Handspring Prism and the "pixelized" PalmIIIc on the graphics side). Windows devices have always had the spolight for Handheld Multimedia and just now they're getting paid for it.

What's he been smoking?

Lucky Dragon @ 11/29/2000 6:57:32 PM #
I've read more articles about PC Data analysts predicting the eventual defeat of Palm OS by MS Pocket OS, and frankly I don't see how they're rationalizing these projections. Furthermore, analyst Ken Dulaney desperately needs a clue if he thinks Palms are "single function devices." I use my Palm IIIx to balance my checkbook, manange, my time, store addresses, play games, as a pocket calculator, to read eBooks and as a replacement for the four or five different remote controls I would otherwise have to use to operate my home entertainment system... and that doesn't even begin to address the vast array of other applications available for some Palm OS PDAs out there. Just to list a few:

- GPS navigation
- Web access/wireless email
- Medical/technical reference
- MP3 players

PocketPC devices may have more "multimedia" features out of the box, but they cost an arm and a leg and when you really think about it, don't offer a whole lot more. For a device to fit my definition of a 'mutimedia' device, it would have to be able to play DVDs, Palm OS devices won't and neither will PocketPCs, but at least the Palms don't claim to be something they aren't. From what I've seen, the Pocket PCs aren't even an economical choice for MP3s: there are dedicated MP3 players and Springboard modules that are much more compact and offer more bang for the buck.
One thing the article didn't metion is that even Handspring, trailing Palm in the PDA market by a large margin, has more market-share than all the Pocket PC manufacturers combined. What does that say to you?

RE: What's he been smoking?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 12:30:27 PM #
I think the key word your missing between the lines here is "multi-tasking". I think thats what they mean by single function devices. Palm really can't handle this very well, if at all. Also.. when you do compare the the two, Palm and WinCE devices..... The WinCE does cost a lot more, But when you look at all the add ons you are paying for the Palm or Visors to do the same thing, you would of spent more than twice the amount over for what you paid for the Palm or Visor. Example... Visor deluxe, approx cost $250.00 Voice recorder Springboard, ( the cheapest I could find ) approx $70.00, Mp3 player..Approx $200, 8meg expansion, approx price $70.00.
That's about $340.00 extra you're gonna spend on top of your $250.00..Total $590.00 (and this isn't still counting that you still have a monochrome screen).
Yeah Maybe the PPC devices aren't great for using as an MP3 player, but you have to admit, you gett all of these things already built into them. Also would you really want carry all these Springboards around in your pocket along with the Visor??? You may never need all these functions...but I could gurantee you if they were already built into the Visor or any other Palm pda device, people would use them.

I personally own a Visor... I bought it because of all the Apps availible to it for the Palm OS which CURRENTLY outweighes WinCE. But it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize what you're getting between the two. Loyalty has little to do with my bank account and my hard earned money for what I am paying for.

is PalmOS the next OS/2 ??

DRBliss @ 11/29/2000 11:47:14 PM #
I'm reminded of the folks that said technically inferior Windows 3.x would never beat the true multi-tasker, OS/2. It's not the same argument, but marketing will eventually win in this case too. My 6 month old Palm IIIxe looks prettly lame next to an iPAQ. If Palm doesn't catch up, my next PDA may run (choke) Windows.

RE: is PalmOS the next OS/2 ??
CKMOOSE @ 11/30/2000 2:32:27 AM #
Gee, your $250.00 Palm doesn't look as good as a $500.00 iPaq....Hmmm. How can this be. Does this mean that my $22,000 Mercury isn't as good as a $50,000 Mercedes?!? Damn! I got ripped off!

RE: is PalmOS the next OS/2 ??
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 12:51:05 PM #
To be honest.... Yeah your right..

RE: is PalmOS the next OS/2 ??
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 1:04:42 PM #
Actually, PocketPC would probably be the next OS/2.

OS/2 (particular version 3.0) at the time offers true multi-tasking and an object-oriented GUI environment at the time when Windows was nothing more than a DOS shell. It can run Windows 3.1 programs, do Multimedia very well (at least in comparison to Windows) and bunch of other stuff. In short, it was superior to Windows 3.1 in every way AND And it had a year and half headstart ahead of Windows 95.

Now while there are differences between the two situations, the analogy is the same. Quite frankly, the only thing that is keeping the PocketPC in the game is that Microsoft is doing a better job of marketing it than IBM was with OS/2. Once the Palm comes out with an updated OS with support for the StrongARM processors (which should resolve the memory issues and other weaknesses with the Palm OS) in a year and a half; and when you factor in the competion from Epoc and the Cell Phone makers, then it is becomes much harder for Microsoft to dominicate the market, let along grab a large share of it.

- Rilindo

It will Happen.... Mark my words

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 1:24:13 AM #
It will happen before 4 years. If Palm doesn't get moving now on developing that OS, it will lose many consumers and followers. It's just life, deal with it. Consumers want something, some simple and some advanced. Palm needs to satisfy both in order to succeed. WindowsCE 3.0 runs on more than PocketPC, it's not just a consumer device. There's industrial needs and business needs out there. And the OS is configured for each device. Symbol does it too with PalmOs and barcode readers. But the hardware needs to improve also. Selling springboards for hundreds? People who like simple devices... remember don't spend more money to complicate them. That's why they bought it in the first place. Simple only, not attachments, nothing to carry around. For all of us who want more, I don't think we like spending hundreds more, carry attachments in pouches, than 6 months later do it all over again. I think we're going through a temporary process in time right now, and in the next few years I hope it all shakes out. Cell phones, PocketPc, Palm, wireless and internet appliances. No one can really hit the nail on the head, just missing it barely...

Palm is where it is

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 3:10:17 AM #
This story just goes to prove that there are just more dumb people out there than there were several months ago.
I would never buy a pocket PC device!
I have a Visor Prism and I can:
Play MP3's - using hardware acceleration instead of the main processor - which means I can truly multi task - or even
turn the unit off.
- Take digital pictures with eyemodule, and view them on my device.
I could get a pluthera of other items if I so desired
How many movies are you really going to put on that pocket PC device anyway?
Lets see... maybe you have like 100MB of memory because you went out and spent hundreds of dollars on memory..
so you could watch the same 5 or 10 minute video over and over again on your bus ride to work
Of course, when you really need to get a address or the like you have to quit the movie player and start the other application,
all of which takes time because windows is A HOG.
Friends don't let friends use pocketPC

RE: Palm is where it is
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 12:54:13 PM #
And how much did you after getting your pretty little screen for the visor, a lame..I mean big CPU boost, your dedicated Mp3 springboard module, and your digital camera?? I bet you could of found a Laptop that playes DVDs for the same price, or a (ooops) pocket pc that could of done the same but maybe even cheaper..
Just a thought.

RE: Palm is where it is
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 5:26:52 PM #
You're right, I could have bought a pocket PC, just like I could have bought a used laptop, but that's not the point.
I wanted something that DOES have multimedia - and I find that the springboard modules give me more than the windows devices,
plus I have the palm OS as an added bonus, in case I actually want to use my handheld as a planner.


Edward @ 11/30/2000 3:42:36 AM #
It's not who's got the best screen, the flashiest multimedia, or even the better OS -- the winner of Palm vs. PocketPC is going to be the platform which is going to be a staple in the enterprise! Sure, lots of people buy Palms for personal use, but those gains by PPC are b/c of the several-hundred/thousand-unit orders by large companies to outfit their salespeople, etc. Being a simple organizer will kill Palm. Being an overdeveloped MP3 player will kill PPC. However, being a wireless corporate database accessor, CRM client, and handheld collaboration tool -- that will decide the winner.


I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 11:27:12 AM #
Let's see, wireless capability, take photos, read books, change a Word doc, you call that a single function, apparently you can't count!
RE: What1
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 12:59:23 PM #
And you can't multi-task either..

Clarification about 18%....

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 12:46:22 PM #

The article meant 18% of *current* sales (which is believable), not 18% of current installed base (not believable). There's a gigantic installed base of PalmOS handhelds, and will take many years before there's significant installed base of PocketPC's.

Note: I own a Palm V an a Compaq iPaq PocketPC. I'm really taking a liking to the iPaq, though! Great multimedia machine. And since I am hearing impaired, I need a high resolution electronic scribble notepad for exchanging notes in the dark - the PocketPC wins here with its higher resolution display. And also, just got an Nintendo emulator for it that runs at 30-40 frames per second - take that, Liberty users! And it's the first PocketPC that's actually really good and really fast/instantaneous, unlike the older dreaded Windows CE 2.11 units... I keep my Palm V as a trusty 'ol backup. They've fixed 80% of my complaints about Windows CE. Hopefully PocketPC 3.1 will be even better...

I hope Palm goes multimedia, as I'll just go for the best overall platform that suits my needs. I'd very much like to see a 206 Mhz StrongARM PalmOS PDA with a 16-bit sunight-viewable 240x320 color screen and 14 hour battery life.

I've had ENOUGH!

Archituz @ 11/30/2000 1:33:37 PM #
I'm totally fed up reading comments from IM Anonymous. Where do you get off calling anyone arrogant? All your diatribes have been self-serving, offensive, boring, bad-attitude horseshit. I'm impressed, however, with the amount of free time you appear to have to express your crap. From now on, please print out your always-negative drivvel, throw in the trash can instead of sending it here and leave the rest of us alone.
RE: I've had ENOUGH!
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 2:00:05 PM #
Anonymous posts are comming from more than one person.... But I guess you would never know that because of you offensive, boring, bad-attitude horseshit. Besides, These are all the opinions of everybody and if your world is that narrow to not accept other points of view, than maybe you should check out where everbody is happy and agrees on the same things.
And what would you do with the posts of people who did have their names assigned to it that you didn't agree with?? Shoot them?? Spam them?? Stalk them?? Kick them off the discussion group?? Hmm.. Sounds like all the reason more to keep people Anonymous.

Long live the Palm...

RE: I've had ENOUGH!
I.M. Anonymous @ 12/1/2000 11:10:32 AM #

can we talk about the topic?

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/30/2000 4:08:09 PM #
you know what i have yet to see? someone post a comment about this message that actually pertains to the topic. which was PPC devices gaining more market share than palm. its so cute of you all to argue over which is better. ive been carrying a palmpilot for over 3 years now. ive kept up on what is hot or not technology for all that time as well. Palm has done little to advance palmpilots since their inception 5 years ago. minor OS changes and a color screen doesnt count. If palm doesnt get off their high market share horse and do something exciting soon, their market share WILL get swallowed up by PPC devices. period. What should palm do? faster processor, better resolution screen, better audio, and completely overhaul the OS. everyone pretty much replaces all the builtin palm programs with 2nd/3rd party apps anyway, doesnt that say anything? I love my palmpilot, i love that it can do alot of things with lots of different addon programs and devices. i would like it alot better if it was all in one. be "loyal" all you want, it only makes sense.

[ No Subject ]

don deweese @ 11/30/2000 5:42:32 PM #
i am still very much pleased with my palm iiix.and i found a comfortable amount of software out there on the web.once i get my extra extra pro chip installed i should have plenty a meg to fill.

Let's Rethink This

Alienseamonkey @ 12/1/2000 3:46:30 AM #
Ok, so I have been reading everyone's comments on which device is to be the choice of kings (and queens) in the next few years and it sounds like the old beer commercials where one
side of room says "Great Taste!" and the other side goes "Less Filling!" but we have to look at the facts first before we can say who will dominate what in the next four to five years. Right now Palm and the the Palm OS are the undisputed champions of the PDA's because they have built a device the caters to the needs of the people today, the present. They were brilliant in creating a simplistic approach to designing the Palm OS and I don't believe anyone can argue that point. Microsoft came out with their Windows CE that took a dive and barely made a dent in the PDA market. Again this is a fact that that can not be disputed. So where are we now? Well the Palm OS is realtively same and for good measure for the basic reason that it works. It works so well that to change it would be just plain dumb. Microsoft is saying that the Palm OS is going to fizzel out because they haven't changed and that will be their greatest weakness but what did people say when Windows 98 came out? More of the same with minor enhancements. What about Widows Me? A better OS, no doubt, but remember it is the same basic formula that was in Windows 95. Sounds kinda like the Palm OS is doing for PDA's for what Windows is doing for the PC. Taking it back to the PDA's you see the PPC movers and shakers have to create a clout saying the Palm OS is going to be outdated because that is going to be their only attack. My reply is don't believe it. Really??? come on now! A group of people with the brillance of dominating 60-70% of the market are going to just like back and take a nap? The reason why the Palm OS doesn't have all the bells and whistles of the PPC is because they ain't user freindly, yet. PPC is pushing the envelope to give you the latest and greatest to generate the "gee whiz" factor but is it really simple to use? Is it as simple as turning your device on and looking up a phone number? If not you probably won't find it on the Palm OS until it is. Remeber we still live in a world where VCR's blink "12:00" everyday of every second. People want simple devices that they can use to make their lives more enjoyable. Buying a VCR to watch a movie is simple..basic, purchased for the intent to watch and record shows. Not for the nice clock display. Think about it. Both system OS' are adaptable. Find the system that is simple and easy to use right out of the box, now and in the future for the single reason of making the user's life easier and more enjoyable, and you will find your winner.
RE: Let's Rethink This
I.M. Anonymous @ 12/1/2000 11:28:25 AM #
I can agree with much of your views, but their are a few things I think which should be made clear. Since the release of Windows 95, or shortly after Microsoft has been trying to make the migration away from the Win 9X operating system and move into the NT envirement as the only platform. Microsoft made statements to this and had been attempting this since before the Win98. Windows Mi was suppose to be the end of of the Win 9X OS. Microsoft has made announcements that this transition has been slower than they expected. To make comparisions to Palm's OS and Microsoft's OS releases are not even comparable. If you look at Windows NT 4.0 and Windows 2000, there have been significant changes made with that OS and thats been out shorter than then Palms OS has been, (more or less). Also Microsoft's stragitiy for releasing "minor changes" in Win 95, Win 98, and Win Mi, has played a huge part in Microsofts stocks and revenues as well the Justice Departments law suites against them. By the time the original Win 95 IE issue gets resolved in court MS would of had several releases of OSes, which could make much of the what the courts ask in regards to the Win 95 IE uneffectable. I think many people under estimate Microsoft. If nothing else just remember what happened to Netscape. They too Boasted over 85% of the market, and they made more changes to their browser than Palm ever did with their OS. It will be interesting to see what really happens over the next few years. Even with the simplicity use of Palms OS, ( because that's really all they have to brag about, since nothing else in compareds to what technology has to offer us today, verses what was avialble in 1995 ) MS's PDA's are in comparably the same in ease to use. In fact, I'd say anyone who can read this and post in this group can with ease use any of the WinCEs or PPCs on the market.. So why don't we just stop using that poor excuse of Simplicity and the lack there of in the PPCs.

just one thing

I.M. Anonymous @ 12/2/2000 1:45:12 PM #
First, excuse my bad english

I've just one thing to say: when you are not considering the price, pocketPC devices are just better than palm ones (but i really like my IIIc). In fact pocketPC devices are so hardware powerfull that the maniability issue is not a real problem. You can event think of a palmos emulator that would run perfectly on pocketPCs

I'm fully agree with Palm's chief's words.

I.M. Anonymous @ 12/5/2000 11:35:47 PM #
Battery Life does matter, and the Palm can let me install my desire AP.
AP for PPC still hard to find.



Register Register | Login Log in