Comments on: PalmSource: Giant Wrap-Up Article

During any conference like last week's PalmSource, the large stories tend to get lots of attention while there are many small stories that don't get the attention they deserve. This even includes new product introductions, updates, and notes on upcoming products. While Ed Hardy was at the conference, he made notes on numerous small stories, all of which are collected together into this large article.
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Sticks out...

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 11:17:58 AM #
HA! I figured it would. "Oh, no problem, I can just access the network and get that information for you. Let me just pull out my m505..." *SNAP*!

Of course, with the springboard slot, the Blade stick out not a whit, and is avaiable *now*. Why was that dead, again? Oh, right, because of HS statements. they'll make a statement with their next visor, mark my words.

RE: Sticks out...
mtg101 @ 2/12/2002 11:23:31 AM #
And it looks like the Sony BT MS doesn't stick out either. But that's only pre-release pics - we'll have to wait and see when it's released I guess. But if it's only the SDIO card that sticks out - that's going to be bad for SDIO.

Cheers
Russell

---
russ@russb.fsnet.co.uk

RE: Sticks out...
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 12:08:33 PM #
Hmmm ... well that's not good for the m125 and i705. I really didn't think it was a good idea to put those SD slots on the side, and this proves it.

RE: Sticks out...
Scott @ 2/12/2002 12:41:31 PM #
I was pretty sure this would be the case. Back when I saw the mock-ups of the SD and MemoryStick Bluetooth cards, I was very skeptical that they would hide completely inside the device. As others have said, sticking out of the device is bad. Sticking out of the side (for an m125) is even worse. Of course, the cost doesn't help much either. IMO, these things need to cost less than $75 in order for people to buy them, especially considering that there's not much software that can take advantage of them yet.

Scott

RE: Sticks out...
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 12:52:14 PM #
I'll up the ante by stating that the fact that these protrude as they do from the device and the projected cost makes them unusable and undesirable.

RE: Sticks out...
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 1:14:02 PM #
According to Infosync.no the BT SD card won't work with the M125. No idea why not though.

RE: Sticks out...
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 8:08:13 PM #
Aren't you guys getting a little extreme? I can see myself easily using this with the Picoblue network access point. Need the latest figures from your backend database? Just stick in the bluetooth card, walk up to the access point and hotsync. Then pull out the card and go on your way. Why would you assume that someone was going to leave it in the slot all the time???

RE: Sticks out...
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 11:18:07 PM #
Stop crying like babies...Unless you use the latest Nokia or Ericsson, the antenna protrudes out of the cellphone, what counts is what it gives, not how it looks. You can buy it now (as soon as available) and enjoy it now or wait until it doesn´t protrude...

RE: Sticks out...
mtg101 @ 2/13/2002 4:07:34 AM #
What counts is what it does, not what it looks like?

That's sort of true, although over here in the EU (cell) phones are basically a fashion accessory, certainly in the prepay / pay-as-you go teenage market. Here you'll see changable covers and no ariels as standard.

However, beyond how nice it looks there's the issue of practicality. Having an ariel or BT card sticking out of a device makes it awkward to use. You'll spend time jabbing yourself with the ariel, or worrying about the BT card breaking off. For the solution to be really usable day-to-day, you have to be able to use the things on the move, in bars, on the buses and so on. You can't do this if you're worried about the BT card snapping off, or your ariel snapping off or just poking you in the goolies while it's in your pocket.

Cheers
Russell

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russ@russb.fsnet.co.uk

VFS Support in PalmOS 5?

Flood @ 2/12/2002 11:33:38 AM #
Hi Ed. First post and I really appreciate your excellent efforts to thoroughly and objectively cover the Palm platform.

My question is:

Does the new PalmOS 5 include seamless support for SD/MMC cards (as in having the OS recognize programs stored and display them, and maybe even run them from the card without third-party apps) or do we still have to deal with the same shoddy support from PalmOS 4?

Thank you,

-Flood

RE: VFS Support in PalmOS 5?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 11:43:40 AM #
You're not the first post

RE: VFS Support in PalmOS 5?
Edward @ 2/12/2002 11:54:41 AM #
Maybe it is Flood's first post?


RE: VFS Support in PalmOS 5?
bcombee @ 2/12/2002 11:56:14 AM #
OS 5 has the same VFS support that OS 4 had, but I don't understand what you're asking. In OS 4, all you had to do is go to the launcher, choose the card, and run a program. It already was fairly transparent.

I don't think the OS will ever treat files on the card the same as in-memory databases. The performance characteristics of the cards just don't allow that to work well, and for a good user experience, programs just need to know where their data is.

CodeWarrior for Palm OS technical lead

RE: VFS Support in PalmOS 5?
Flood @ 2/12/2002 3:36:52 PM #
Edward is right, this is my "first post" as in the first time I write in the PalmInfocenter forums. I couldn't care less whether I am the first to post a response to an article.

As for bcombee's response, thank you for clearing that up. It is obvious that I phrased my question incorrectly, and that I needed to learn a bit more about the inherent limitations of the SD Card.

-Flood

RE: VFS Support in PalmOS 5?
TDS @ 2/12/2002 10:36:11 PM #
As a response to Bcombee:
Try PiDirect. It does allow the PalmOS to see the items on the Memory card as if they were in RAM. Very powerful program...Highly recommended. Also, programs accessed through PiDirect launch A LOT faster than any VFS Program.
Check out www.memplug.com for more info.
Doug

RE: VFS Support in PalmOS 5?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/13/2002 1:47:18 AM #
I think what the original poster was getting at is the poor support of the capabilitys of VFS. Eg without 3rd party applications such as McFile etc you cannot put stuff any where but in /palm/launcher.

There also should be a way (again without the 3rd party apps) to store any program including its data bases on the card in its own directory then load it to ram to use it then send it back when finished.
(whats the name of the program that does that again?)

Dean

Free Dataviz add on kit?

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 12:34:28 PM #
Ed you said that Dataviz as a free add on kit with the new programs and you evn provided a link. The only thing I could find was the add on kit that you had to purchase. Can you let us know where we can find the free add on kit?
Thanks
Jeremy

RE: Free Dataviz add on kit?
GeauxVols @ 2/12/2002 12:51:51 PM #
RE: Free Dataviz add on kit?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 7:33:13 PM #
its not free for bundled version

RE: Free Dataviz add on kit?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 11:40:27 PM #
The bonus kit is free for the Professional version, as the article clearly says. Except for the i705, all the bundles have the Standard version.

RE: NOT Free Dataviz add on kit...
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/13/2002 9:55:02 AM #
Or, for $29.95, you can still buy the "Best Office Suite", and the "Best Spreadsheet", from Cutting Edge: www.quickoffice.com

SecureCard support?

fleegle @ 2/12/2002 12:39:48 PM #
That SecureCard looks interesting. Unfortunately, it looks like it doesn't support all expansion card formats. The only cards mentioned on their website are: SD/MMC, the Handspring Flash Module, and the IBM Microdrive.

What about support for Compact Flash or the Memory Stick (it mentions Sony as a "System Requirement")?

RE: SecureCard support?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/12/2002 12:53:39 PM #
The Microdrive is a Compact Flash card, and I'm pretty sure it behaves to the device just like it is a CF memory card. So it seems like CF cards should work.

RE: SecureCard support?
fleegle @ 2/12/2002 5:09:20 PM #
I wouldn't really call the Microdrive a "Compact Flash card." Rather, it uses the CompactFlash form and connector. Yes, I don't see why it shouldn't work.

Too bad there isn't a trial program to try yet.

Sony Bluetooth Info/Memory Stick
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/13/2002 3:28:34 AM #
Sony Bluetooth stick soon here?
By: Jørgen Sundgot, 05.02.02 11:00

Sony has just recently gained qualification from the Bluetooth SIG for a product referred to as the "Infostick", which is a name that was mentioned back when Sony started promising a Bluetooth Memory Stick expansion module back in late 2001. However, the Infostick is listed under the product category Comp-HW-Integrated, which could indicate that the module is also targeted to be an integral part of new products from Sony - which again could indicate handhelds in the CLIE series showing up with integrated Bluetooth, particuarly with Sony's current pace of churning out new models.

http://www.infosync.no/news/newsbits/show.php?id=1404

Infostick Infostick Sony Corporation Components Comp-HW-Integrated 2002-01-30
http://makeashorterlink.com/?C2803226

picoblue internet access point

ahwong999 @ 2/12/2002 1:23:04 PM #
hmmmm....this product doesn't make sense to me. well...the 100m range seems kinda useless when the range of the device using it is just 10m. let's say we're 50m away from the access point. thre's a connection to another device but the other device is not connected to it coz it's too far away.

RE: picoblue internet access point
hadocon @ 2/12/2002 2:01:33 PM #
You just wrote

" picoblue internet access point
Posted by:  ahwong999 @ 2/12/2002 1:23:04 PM
hmmmm....this product doesn't make sense to me. well...the 100m range seems kinda useless when the range of the device using it is just 10m. let's say we're 50m away from the access point. thre's a connection to another device but the other device is not connected to it coz it's too far away. "

... what are you talking about? I can not even understand what it is you are trying to say.

It is my understanding that the 10m range is for peer-to-peer networks, or as they say: "your personal area network (pan)". The base station allows you to transmit over greater distances, because the base station augments the network. so to speak...

RE: picoblue internet access point
Ed @ 2/12/2002 2:02:39 PM #
That 100 meters is both coming and going. The device has both a powerful broadcaster to reach the handheld and a very sensitive receiver to pick up the weak signals from the handheld.

On the other hand, I'm assuming that 300 feet is through the air. Walls and such will interfere and shorten the distance. Still, this is significantly farther than the 30 feet typically quoted as Bluetooth's top range.

---
News Editor

RE: picoblue internet access point
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/13/2002 3:26:24 AM #
"picoblue internet access point
Posted by: ahwong999 @ 2/12/2002 1:23:04 PM

hmmmm....this product doesn't make sense to me. well...the 100m range seems kinda useless when the range of the device using it is just 10m. let's say we're 50m away from the access point. thre's a connection to another device but the other device is not connected to it coz it's too far away."

Posts like these shows us that people don't no s##t about WIRELESS.


RE: picoblue internet access point
ahwong999 @ 2/13/2002 10:31:33 AM #
let me rephrase this again. for a connection to be active, both devices must be able to transmit and receive. thre's no problem with the picoblue access point transmitting and palm receiving. but the problem lies when the palm is transmitting. this is because the range of palm's bluetooth or as a matter of fact most bluetooth device is just 10m. so this means that this is just a one way tranmission which doesn't work.

RE: picoblue internet access point
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/13/2002 11:05:58 AM #
No, NO, NO, NO!!!

Read, people, READ!!

The access point's receiver is sensitive enough to pick up the signals from the handheld's transmitter 300 feet away. This has been explained twice.

Jeez.

RE: picoblue internet access point
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/13/2002 2:35:04 PM #
the is a fortune... $500! i was hoping for some form of add on to my current router (from Linksys) that would give me Bluetooth broadcasting for my home... or even a direct USB attachment to my computer. considering full routers with 802.11 are under $200 i can't understand why the bluetooth version is soo pricey.

RE: picoblue internet access point
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/13/2002 9:10:51 PM #
checkout www.hcvwireless.com for an interesting developer oriented bluetooth device. there was a guy at PalmSource who was showing it around to people. It's very cool and very small. Can be setup as an access point - and it's way smaller than the PicoBlue device.

m505 vs m515

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/13/2002 12:24:43 PM #
So the show was a success but here I sit with a m505 having waited patiently for the m515... I have 2 weeks left to return the m505 for a full refund.

Should I return the m505 and then go Palm-less for 1-3 weeks waiting on the m515 or live with the only acceptable display of the m505?

Feed back?

RE: m505 vs m515
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/27/2002 3:03:01 PM #
man,id be happy just o HAVE a m505..im stuck with a lousy m500 =(

id return it and get a m515... thats just me ...

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