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Comments on: Demo of New 3D First-Person Shooter Available

ardiri.com has released a long-awaited preview version of its 3D first-person shooter Deity3D. This is the first official release of the game, though screenshots appeared on its website in late 2001.

The demo is monochrome but plays on handhelds with color screens. It's a fully-playable single level of the game. Mr. Ardiri said future versions of Deity3D will support add-on levels and color.

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Looks awesome

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 2:41:39 PM #
As always, Aaron is da man.

Can't wait for color!


The author(s) of Deity :)
ardiri @ 2/25/2002 2:48:39 PM #
i'd like to point out that i actually had very little involvement with this product :) - other than making it nicely packaged for you guys to enjoy :) this product is the work of Ivo Jager, at 20 years of age born and living in the netherlands - its amazing stuff. Chip Kerchner provided loads of optimization tweaks - and, deserves some credit as well. its important to realise it is a demo :) ever since we posted the screenshots, we have been nagged (which, is good) to release something, so - here it is! please do feel free to report any comments on the game itself to deity3d@ardiri.com. i personally cannot wait for the final version :)

// az
aaron@ardiri.com
http://www.ardiri.com/
RE: Looks awesome
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 2:50:33 PM #
yep, he is the man, when he is not spreading
palm viruses... ( i have this great idea of copy protection)

RE: Looks awesome
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 2:53:09 PM #
I believe you're referring to the trojan horse that only affected people who were trying to install PIRATED copies of the GameBoy emulator for the PalmOS. That wasn't a virus that he was trying to infect people with, it was a good joke that serves those people right. If you're gonna install warez onto your device, you should be prepared for the worst.

Anyway, this game really is cool. Much better looking than Dreadling, imho.

RE: Looks awesome
C @ 2/25/2002 4:28:18 PM #
Great effort...Ardiri always has something in store to surprise us...I was totally shocked about Nintendo making Ardiri take three of his games off of his site...I find the game to be hard to control...I have a visor edge...I wonder if Ardiri is going to make a death match similiar to the original doom and maybe even do it through the infra red...that would be awesome...

Support for Clie?

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 3:18:43 PM #
I installed the demo on my N760C and the screen just shows garbage. I turned off Hi-Res support for it in the OS under Prefs and still couldn't get it to work.

Any ideas?

Thanks;
Mark

RE: Support for Clie?
ardiri @ 2/25/2002 3:24:36 PM #
    I installed the demo on my N760C and the screen just shows garbage. I turned off Hi-Res support for it in the OS under Prefs and still couldn't get it to work.

it does work on the clie's - i am a proud owner of a n710c upgraded to 4.1 :) there is a program called 'switch dash' (or similar) which we know has problems :) try disabling that - i am sure there are other clie users out there too :)

// az
aaron@ardiri.com
http://www.ardiri.com/

RE: Support for Clie?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 4:41:01 PM #
I am using a 610c and the screen is just fine. I just want color.

RE: Support for Clie?
ssummer @ 2/25/2002 4:51:37 PM #
It works fine on my N760 (I use SwitchDash instead of HiRes-Assist) but I find the graphics unplayable. There's just not enough contrast for me between walls and floors. Maybe a color version will solve that problem.

RE: Support for Clie?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 5:15:24 PM #
[quote] it does work on the clie's - i am a proud owner of a n710c upgraded to 4.1 :)

-Aaron
[/quote]

Just wondering, Aaron... did you pay Sony the $50.00 for your upgrade, or did you get the *Warez* copy?! If so, was it bugged with a killer virus?

-pm

RE: Support for Clie?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 5:38:26 PM #
Layoff him. I've heard the story enough. It's not his fault. BTW... "Mr. Ardiri" that's pretty funny hearing that.

-M3wThr33

RE: Support for Clie?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 6:05:48 PM #
Being a developer, Palm, SONY, Handspring and HandEra all give you access to perfectly legal ROM-files for use with the emulation software (POSE).
It is also possible (if you have the knowledge and the tools) to flash them in a real device. That is not forbidden.

The only thing is that you may not give the files to anyone else, and the files are (usualy, depends on agreement) required to be kept at only on place (the development site), and may not leave that building.

This was the way I upgraded my old Palm III to OS3.5, and if I wish, I can even do OS4.1 in it now. :-) And it is legal since Palm gave me permission to download the ROMs.


History

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 3:39:27 PM #
In the beginning, there where RayGin. Hardcore optimized assembler written to squize every bit of preformance out of the Palm. The putput was only black and white, and the monsters where geometric shapes, but it was the first real 3D raycasting game for the Palm.
The authors also proved with hard execution time calculations that it would be impossible to make it any better that that.

And for a great period of time, they where right.
But for the players, they where not happy with the game. It sucked compared to mega hits like Doom on the PC.

An interesting project apeared. This dude was actually trying to make a raycasting engine for the palm, in 2-bit grayscale? In C? By writing it on hit linux desktop and porting it to Palm?
No way man, most of us said, but some of us eagerly followed the status reports on the homepage, marveled over the few released screenshots and waited. Waitd.
It took time, but the guy did not give up, and at last, Doomling was released.
Oh what a day it was. I still remember. And what a wow effect! Smooth 3D raycasting a'la Wolfenstein 3D, on a Palm!
Doomling was later renamed to Dreadling, but still ruled the very small category of raycasting games for palm.
It was proven that it was possible. It could really be done. And it could be done without assembler!

And today, today we take yet another step, a big step, on the path to Palm 3D gaming.
This time screen deapth is boosted to amazing 4-bit grayscale! And the raycasting engine is not just one plane!
Just like the DooM games we now have an amazing 2D mapped raycasted world with height-levels and dynamic celing and floor heights.
Also a lighting system never before seen on a palm!
Amazing technology, and it moves fast, damn fast, and smooth, on a standard 16MHz palm.

What is next?
Hopefully, 256 color support, just like in real DooM, is just around the corner, and maybe support for the HighResolution palms, (QVGA and SONY HiResAPI).

Amazing.

The future of 3D palm gaming has never before seen so bright!

Sure, the PPC-jerks have the real Quake ported over, but have you ever tryed playing it?
It's really slow, even on a 200MHz iPaq!

RE: History
Ivo @ 2/25/2002 4:18:38 PM #
Wow, you know your Palm-3D-Raycasting-engine-history dude :)

"What is next?
Hopefully, 256 color support, just like in real DooM, is just around the corner"

Can be done. Will be done. ;)

"The future of 3D palm gaming has never before seen so bright!"

Hey man, if even SEGA thinks this is the market to be (PalmSource announcement), you bet palm gaming in general looks bright !

Greetz,

Ivo Jager

ivo@ardiri.com

RE: History
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 5:16:46 PM #
Darn. I'm going to have to get myself a color palm then.
Preferably I would like a color QVGA one. (If they ever come...)
Will there be QVGA support in Deity3D?

And yes, I realised I forgot to mention the Serious Sam game in my little history, but the reason is probably just that I have never played that game.
I hear it's a really big download that needs lots of RAM though...
There are probably other games I forgot to mention.

And of course, there are some wireframe vector 3D games aswell.
But then again, vector 3D is not raycasting.

RE: History
Edward @ 2/25/2002 6:22:56 PM #
Serious Sam is good to play, but too big for my 8Mb Palm, until it runs off of VFS. What were they thinking?

The engine is pretty impressive, Wolf3d rather than Doom, but looks good, and is quick.

RE: History
I.M. Anonymous @ 4/8/2002 9:15:15 PM #
You forgot Escape!sky , duum and pamaze .. i think there are a few otehrs...

Serious Sam

Coyote67 @ 2/25/2002 7:25:52 PM #
Speaking of Serious Sam. Anyone have trouble playing it on a Visor Deluxe? I have a friend with a neo who has no problem. But I can't play it on my Deluxe with 4 megs free or my Solo, completely free.

---------------------------------------
When you have a Clie shoved up your mouth, you can only talk in vowels.
RE: Serious Sam
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/26/2002 10:16:35 PM #
I also have a visor deluxe and i havent been able to get Sam to work. It bombs when i scroll down to it...anyone know wtf is up with that game? i dounloaded the demo and it did the same thing too!
-CJ

WORST GAME EVER

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 9:24:16 PM #
First off its amazingly hard to move the graphics suck. Palm OS isnt ready for a game like this

WORST GAME EVER

RE: WORST GAME EVER
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 10:49:09 PM #
I gotta know... what's your recommendation? "Buy a PocketPC"? Personally, I'm just floored by this game. I cannot believe something like this could be done on a device with such a slow CPU. Good work, Ivo, Chip & Aaron!

RE: WORST GAME EVER
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 11:08:39 PM #
So why don't you write a better one?

RE: BUY
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/26/2002 12:03:29 AM #
Dont get me wrong there are pleny of good game for Palm OS. Now like I said the current platform is limitating. OS 5 will be able to compete with what PPC does. Id wait if I were you to buy until the fall when OS 5 comes out.

Palm finally has a lot of good things going and in the works and OS 5 should be very nice. Plus when you talk about programs there are not near as many for MSFT as for PALM.

And frankly its much easier to rip these off then the ones for MSFT PPC. And that is basically what I am all about sir.

Free Stuff

Just a Beta/Demo people... :)
Ivo @ 2/26/2002 4:26:22 AM #
This demo was released to let you know what we are working on AND have your say about things like controls & GFX. Mail us at deity3d@ardiri.com, telling us what you think. Feedback like this is valuable.

If you think the GFX suck =), try the renderer at high quality/high detail. If you still think it sucks go buy yerself a PPC (preferrably an iPaq, where you can't even use two buttons at the same time :P).

Controls can and will be improved, just a first beta people...

Greetz,

Ivo.

ivo@ardiri.com

RE: WORST GAME EVER
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/26/2002 4:33:21 AM #
It's programmer like Ivo, Chip and Aaron which makes the Palm Community shines! Keep up the good work :)

RE: WORST GAME EVER
Edward @ 2/26/2002 5:09:48 AM #
Talking of OS5 .. seems this doesn't work with it. Still a great game. Well done to those who wrote it.

RE: WORST GAME EVER
fkclo @ 2/26/2002 5:12:06 AM #
I just wonder wouldn't it make sense to have a hall of fame for all those bright and committed developers for Palm OS ?

Francis Lo, HKG
OS compatibility
ardiri @ 2/26/2002 5:51:15 AM #
    Talking of OS5 .. seems this doesn't work with it. Still a great game. Well done to those who wrote it.

keep in mind this is a demo :) its not at all final in anyway :) ivo is going on a little vacation to peru - and, we wanted to get something out to wet those taste buds :P there are a few small incompatibilities with OS 5 (i can name quite a few) - but, these are things we will be fixing in the near future :) when it comes to OS 5, we'll most likely be doing native ARM assembly - so, the current version wont matter so much *g*

// az
aaron@ardiri.com
http://www.ardiri.com/

RE: WORST GAME EVER
Edward @ 2/26/2002 1:41:51 PM #
You know it wasn't a real criticism Aaron .. just pulling your leg a bit.

I don't think you are expected to provide compatability with an OS that isn't even in the hands of all developers yet, let alone available to purchase in hardware!

Only two requests ..

1/ Colour
2/ VFS support for level packs please!

RE: WORST GAME EVER
ardiri @ 2/26/2002 2:09:13 PM #
    I don't think you are expected to provide compatability with an OS that isn't even in the hands of all developers yet, let alone available to purchase in hardware!

well, most of us (including myself) do have access to the OS :) had it for quite a while.. but, ivo, the guy doing most of the work on this engine, hasn't ;) when you mess with assembly.. your bound to cause problems for yourself regarding compatibility.. in any case, when the units are available - we'll have updates *g*

// az
aaron@ardiri.com
http://www.ardiri.com/

Well at least its not another Bejeweled like game

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 11:45:43 PM #
I havent tried this game buy any game that doesnt look like bejeweled is welcome. nothings wrong with bejeweled but i always come across with the same looking game tons of times.

FPS Controls?

kevdo @ 2/26/2002 2:41:57 AM #
I downloaded the demo and it is pretty hard to control things accurately (key word: accurately). Walking around is find but trying to move, strafe, and shoot at the same time is pretty dang hard.

I know DOOM and Quake are available for the Pocket PC. Does anyone have any experience with the controls and these games.

Seems to me this kind of FPS game would be pretty hard to control w/out a (at least) directional pad.

Now, if Sony would make a Clie with a good directional pad I might actually considering jumping off the Palm bandwagon.

-Kevin Crossman

RE: FPS Controls?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/26/2002 4:38:36 AM #
Under iPaq, you can't press two keys at the same time. In other words, when you move, you can't shoot; When you shoot, you can't move.

RE: FPS Controls?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/26/2002 8:47:02 AM #
>Under iPaq, you can't press two keys at the same time. In other words, when you
>move, you can't shoot; When you shoot, you can't move.

That's is something I've never heard, what a POS.
Is that because of the hardware or the OS ??

RE: FPS Controls?
ardiri @ 2/26/2002 8:49:49 AM #
    That's is something I've never heard, what a POS.

    Is that because of the hardware or the OS ??

i have an ipaq (actually, got two now, 3630 and 3875) - we are playing with the units.. and, unforunately, this is a feature of the ipaq only. the casio units are quite good with key handling, but, the ipaq has some small problems.. :)


// az
aaron@ardiri.com
http://www.ardiri.com/

RE: FPS Controls?
ardiri @ 2/26/2002 12:02:48 PM #
    Seems to me this kind of FPS game would be pretty hard to control w/out a (at least) directional pad.

there are a number of alternative input devices for palm units :) world wide widget works gamepad, game face for visor units and snap-n-play .. just to mention a few.. most of our games have support for them either direct, or are compatible using the drivers they provide. it is an alternative.. :)



// az
aaron@ardiri.com
http://www.ardiri.com/

Not impressed

teq @ 2/26/2002 12:40:46 PM #
I'm sure a lot of work has gone into this demo, so this comment is probably unfair - but after trying the demo on my m505, I'm not impressed at all.

Sure, the speed is ok (at least with afterburner), but the graphics - IMHO - are pretty terrible (at any level of GFX detail). Maybe I'm simply spoilt by color experience...

****** Pilot 5000 => Palm Pilot III => Palm Vx => M505 - Ive had them all and loved each one of them.

RE: Not impressed
ardiri @ 2/26/2002 1:25:25 PM #
i think it depends on what you like. personally, i dont like 3D games at all :) the last best game on the PC (in my honest opinion) was WarCraft 2 :) the world of 3D never really kicked into my preference.. never caught on the fun of networking with your buddies and blowing their brains out :) i prefer strategy in a way thats easy to use..

as for the demo, ivo has put a lot of effort into it, and, a lot of people are wetting their pants over it (cause its *cooool*).. i appreciate the amount of effort it has taken to make this happen (as i am a developer) - but, i am not fond of 3D games myself :) thats how it is :) 160x160 is hard to work with too..

the engine is rendered offscreen in 8bpp (for speed), so, technically, it is very possible to have 256 color - but, color adds a new dimension.. issues such as lighting, texture drawing.. eww.. get shivers thinking about it :)

each game has its place :) and, some people will love it, some will hate it - thats life.

// az
aaron@ardiri.com
http://www.ardiri.com/

RE: Not impressed
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/27/2002 3:40:09 PM #
People mean different things when then refer to graphics quality. Deity3D does not look as pretty as some newer 2D Palm games - but it is rendered 3D!!! With this in mind, the graphics capabilities of this engine surpass anything i thought possible on the current generation of Palm OS devices.

Ardiri, telling us you don't like 3D games isn't exactly great promotion for your product:)

Interesting that you're favorite game is Warcraft 2 - lets see a version of this for the Palm!!! Actually, i like 3D games but would never play them on any PDA because of the interface limitation (FPS games are meant to be played with a mouse). On the Palm, i don't like playing ANY action game (though i have dozens on my Vx cause i think its just so damn cool and i love to show them to people to demo what the Palm can do - which is really why i think deity3D is soooo cool!).

BUT i do play strategy games more on my Palm. So how about it!!! Lets see a real-time startegy came in the vein of WarcraftII!! This is not a new fixation for me - i have been waiting for a decent RTS since i got my Palm a year and a half ago and (unbelievably) nobody has risen to the occasion!!(Galactic Realms doesnt cut it in my opinion)

thanx and keep up the awesome work.



It's a nice start

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/26/2002 3:04:59 PM #
See, I remember Duke Nuke 'Em, and the original Castle Wolfenstein. Yeah, this one is slow, and the graphics are not the best, but the original Wolfenstein isn't all that impressive either by todays standards.

With OS5, ARM processors, and the increased RAM that'll come with it, I think you can expect this sort of game to really improve drastically in the future.

Don't discount it because it's rough now, be patient, and look at it as an incremental step toward playing something like Unreal on your PDA over WiFi in a couple years.

Looks good

jws @ 2/27/2002 1:03:48 PM #
The graphics look better than dreadling, but it is all pretty hard to see.
Looks good, but the graphic engine need some optimizing, especcialy the contrast.



_______________________________
by jws

PalmOS games need to abandon button control

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/27/2002 5:45:50 PM #
The best palm OS games (in my opinion) all have one feature in common - they do not rely on the buttons for movement.

This game would rock so hard if it used a control model like RaceFever, where the stylus tip position on the graffiti area gives *analog* control of steering and accelleration/braking.

Here, use the stylus position for turning left/right and moving forward/back. Use the buttons then for shooting/weapon selection/strafe mode (say, hold a button down to make the stylus L/R control strafe instead of turn).

Does this make sense?



palm IIIx ????

I.M. Anonymous @ 4/28/2002 2:13:33 PM #
i picked up a palm IIIx at the flea mkt. the other day.
it is new never used befor condition. every thing seems to work fine, but i have a question? over the past several days i'v processed tons of info into my built in pda (brain) reguarding all the things that you can do or expcet to do with a palm... my question is this all the specs i see posted with palm IIIx says the proc. speed is 16mhz. i installed sysinfo v1.2 on the palm and when i pulled up the sysatem info is said as follows.
"processor: kind: motorola dragonball ez"
"frequency: 18MHZ"
"clockspeed" 100%"
"version" v.3.3"

all the specs. i see posted re. the palm 111's says
" proc. speed 16MHZ"

is my proc. info right? 18mhz. if not is there a possible problem with my palm?
if anyone can tell me if this is an issue or not, or if i missed something somewhere i'd be ever so in your debt. thanks for any info you might give.

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