Comments on: iambic CEO Apologizes, Relinquishes Controversial Domains
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RE: good
Not good enough
RE: good
Now that we got what we wanted, the people who are still protesting are going to find a lot less support. It's like that one guy at party who's still dancing while everyone else has their coats on and is saying goodnight.
It's over. The good guys won, the bad guys lost.
RE: good
RE: People make mistakes.
RE: People make mistakes.
Agreed,
I'll never patronise Iambic again. Damage is done, apology or no apology.
It was a slimy move in which they deserve to get flamed for.
RE: People make mistakes.
RE: People make mistakes.
And people lie. . .
Sorry, I'm not buying it. Iambic is apologizing because it realized that this might actually hurt their bottom line. It previously defended the action, banned users from their discussion area for mentioning it, and blamed the whole thing on a misunderstanding. Perhaps when they examine their marketing practices they will discover that their customers (and former customers) are more ethical than they are and that there is a consequence to their actions.
Liars
RE: People make mistakes.
Do you still use Google? It sold these names to iambic. Complaining about one without complaining about the other is hypocrisy. If you are going to boycott iambic, you have to boycott Google. The whole idea of selling search results is on pretty weak ethical grounds.
And what about Register.com? They registered a trademarked name to a company that didn't own that trademark. How ethical was that?
google doesn
google doesn't sell search results (continued)
Yeah, Sorry.....Sorry for getting caught!!!
RE: Yeah, Sorry.....Sorry for getting caught!!!
Finally...
Mistake made, damage done, but no further damage due to quick rectification. I applaud this move by the CEO.
In any case, I think AND's simplicity had already drawn plenty of old Datebk 3 users over. They didn't need to resort to this.
RE: Finally...
RE: Finally...
After the space of a week's furore among Palm users and numerous petitions they finally came to their senses. I think it could've been sooner, sure, but the point is that they did an about-turn.
RE: Finally...
RE: Finally...
Damage has been done.
They backed out their original position since they are not as big as like Microsoft, a giant company who could afford the whole world's bashing.
if you lose customers like this, you will lose a whole lot in this small Palm community.
Do do they think they are, Microsoft?
Yay!
Dryden
RE: Yay!
I for one will not deal with this company, EVER.
RE: Yay!
RE: Yay!
How dare they suspend forum rights of REGISTERED customers because they spoke up about this? If a registered customer of Iambic's products was outraged by this then obviously it was pretty bad.
Letting companies get away with crap like this means that others will do the same. We should not lie down and take this.
RE: Yay!
Duh.
RE: Yay!
Unfortunately, part of what you are saying is true: there are a lot of shifty businesses out there, and since there are so many, it is hard--impossible, even--to keep up with whom to avoid. But every now and then someone does something memorable, and since I am a Palm enthusiast, Iambic has earned that dubious distinction for me.
RE: Yay!
Good Work Palmers- now let's move on
Now let's move on to what we're WE are about. We're Palm enthusiasts. We live Palm we love Palm! (most of the time).
Iambic makes great software. Pimlico makes great software. The fact is:
WE HAVE A CHOICE! Let's not do things that could change that.
The Road Warrior
RE: Good Work Palmers- now let's move on
RE: Good Work Palmers- now let's move on
Pious, Holy Palmers
RE: Pious, Holy Palmers
RE: Pious, Holy Palmers
Am I reading this right?
This had nothing to do with "Holier Than Thou". This was punishing a company for doing something stupid/immoral and that having the arrogance to deny that it was stupid/immoral.
A.M.
RE: Pious, Holy Palmers
How do I find Laridian, and Olive Tree software again.
Why do I post here you Pagans dont even know what kind if software they carry.
At least You arent PPC users. I know why color pictures are so important to them on a PDA. They need to have smut wherever they go 24/7. How dare one of their kind post on this board.
RE: Pious, Holy Palmers
Thanks.
RE: Pious, Holy Palmers
So long and thanks for all the fish...
RE: So long and thanks for all the fish...
RE: So long and thanks for all the fish...
RE: So long and thanks for all the fish...
Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
RE: Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
RE: Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
If they had thought about it the first thing out of Iambic's mouth would have been "Oops! We screwed up".
But since the PRESIDENT of the company defended the actions, and then their PR guy did the same, it does not matter how the "mistake" happened.
It was not acknowledged immediately as a mistake and they made attemps to cover it up within the OWN on-line forum and the YahooGroups ActionNames discussion group.
This was not a simple mistake by some guy in marketing.
A.M.
RE: Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
RE: Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
It appears that iambic may have devised a more elaborate plan to market its software than simply registering and redirecting a few domain names. Iambic also purchased Adwords Select in Google's popular search engine for trademarks of several of its competitors, including "quicksheet" (a trademark of Cutting Edge Software), Documents To Go (a trademark of DataViz), and MiniCalc (a trademark of Solutions in Hand).
RE: Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
This kind of Domain purchase is commonly called cybersqatting, and while not illegal shows a commitment to taking advantage of the ignorance of potential customers.
Recap Fact: A number of visitors to sites where Palm products are discussed, such as PIC, posted their disgust at the cybersqatting carried out by Iambic. Criticism on forums controlled by Iambic were removed.
That kind of behaviour is commonly called censorship, and while not illegal does show a commitment by Iambic to silence its critics in a manner calculated to show potential customers only the “good news” about its products.
Recap Fact: Iambic at first defended their Cybersqatting, and has now made remarks of an apologetic nature and have taken steps to release the domain names.
This kind of apology should be enough to placate the community of Palm users who were righteously indignant that they should be treated with such disdain by Iambic, whose software by all accounts is a good product.
For myself, this apology reeks, not because I think it insincere, but because it stands in such unremarkable contrast to the defense they made of their actions.
They tarnished themselves with little regard for the community of registered users on their forums, their competitors or the relative worth of their own product.
It will be some time before I forgive them.
RE: Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
RE: Good - end of story.
>cybersqatting, and while not illegal shows a
>commitment to taking advantage of the ignorance
>of potential customers.
Cybersquatting *IS* illegal. How many times do people have to say this before anyone listens?
Do a simple search on the Internet for the AntiCybersquatting Consumer Protection Act (ACPA) of 1999 and you will quickly discover that it was created specifically to cover cases such as this. Iambic *HAD* to apologize and release the domain names or risk fines of $100,000 or more.
RE: Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
If they are not then the actions taken by Iambic are not illegal.
RE: Good - end of story. Don't vilify the whole company.
company?
CEO/programmer/techsupport
Vidal Graupera didn't apologize
RE: Vidal Graupera didn't apologize
I think that counts as saying you are sorry. Iambic may have upset people and done something stupid. But they seem to have learned, and as an NR70 user, they do make good software for HiRes+.
Thanks to Vidal. Time to move on.
RE: Vidal Graupera didn't apologize
'for offending people' -- So they 'would like to apologize' that we are offended? Huh? Not that they did something wrong?
'This practice was not in keeping with our standards' -- Doesn't this just beg the question - precisely, what are their business standards?
Pathetic.
RE: Vidal Graupera didn't apologize
RE: Vidal Graupera didn't apologize
what does
".....Iambic is looking forward to getting back to the business of making excellent software and regaining the customer satisfaction we've enjoyed for nearly a decade."
Does this mean they are prepared to acknowledge the bugs in Alltime Reporter and provide support, instead of dismissing reproducable bugs as user error?
Don't Kill Iambic
RE: Don't Kill Iambic
If they spent as much time ironing out bugs and improving the UI as they do on adding increasingly useless features, perhaps they might produce software worth installing.
darn
Take note, this was an excellent move in heading off the competition and generating second look interest in your products.
Where's the apology ?
They not only carried out unethical business practices towards CESD & DateBk, but also to Palm users in general when they banned users and deleted postings in their forums. They should immediately "unban" everyone and put up an apology on their website.
RE: Where's the apology ?
But I think it's just another sneaky ploy that will bite them in the butt because word will get out here and there and when people go directly to their website and see no public acknowledgement of their error, it will make potential customers skittish.
RE: Where's the apology ?
Vidal Graupera -- Change your ways.
RE: Vidal Graupera -- Change your ways.
hmmm, but will Pimlico register them
nategall says "blah!"
RE: hmmm, but will Pimlico register them
RE: hmmm, but will Pimlico register them
RE: hmmm, but will Pimlico register them
RE: hmmm, but will Pimlico register them
>iambic. Either that or point them to porn. :)
>
>nategall says "blah!"
If this is true and not just huff from a whiney twit, nategall will quickly also find himself saying hello to a $100,000 fine for violating the anticybersquatting law.
Couldn't happen to a finer gent.
RE: hmmm, but will Pimlico register them
1.) This law is easily challenged.
2.) This law is rarely (translated: next to never) enforced.
3.) What kind of twit would destroy his business going after some no-name who decided to register a site to porn. It would just bring no attention to it. Hence you don't see the White House (www.whitehouse.gov) sueing or attempting to impose a fine on the porn site bearing their name (www.whitehouse.com).
You put too much faith in useless laws and decrees that don't pass the practicality test and will fail to stand the test of time.
RE: Very little, very late
RE: Very little, very late
RE: Very little, very late
time to move on
iambic bought Google Adwords with Competitors' Trademarks!
RE: time to move on
I agree it is time to move on. For days, you all asked for an apology and for iambic to give up the domains. They did that. Now you want more?
I'm beginning to think you won't be satisfied until the CEO commits harakiri so he can make it right with his ancestors.
RE: time to move on
Well....that would be a good start.
Give 'em a BREAK!
RE: Give 'em a BREAK!
This is fun, isn't it? )
I'm still banned from Iambic Forums
I'm still a Tinysheet user with no support forums to access right now.
Anyone still banned from the Iambic forums, raise your hands.
---
What's Wrong With This Picture?
http://raj.phangureh.com/picture.html
RE: I'm still banned from Iambic Forums
i sent them an email a couple hours ago, asking them to lift my ban. we'll see what happens.
Really regretful?
Anyway, I hope they'll continue to make good softwares, just do a better job on their business practice...
RE: Really regretful?
Sigh, everyone just needs to calm down...
RE: Sigh, everyone just needs to calm down...
>it got it's hands on pktpc.com or something
>like that.
No, no we wouldn't.
>No one (except PPC users) would be PROTESTING.
If you honestly believe that you are a very sad and pathetic person.
>Give me a break, you all are idiots for
>"never again buying a Iambic product".
Hey, if it counts any, I never would have bought an Iambic product before this latest fiasco because of their long history of fraud and deception (like, say, changing Action Names' name to Action Names Datebook, or telling their own customers to blame Pimlico because they were no longer releasing the free program that fixed an Action Names conflict with Datebook+ whereby all alarms played twice -- mainly because Pimlico fixed the problem in DateBk and no longer had to release it, and Iambic never bothered to fix it while Pimlico had a free fix).
RE: Sigh, everyone just needs to calm down...
RE: Sigh, everyone just needs to calm down...
RE: Sigh, everyone just needs to calm down...
If you honestly believe that you are a very sad and pathetic person.
[/quote]
It's so nice you are courageous enough to insult people anonymously.
_________________
Sean
It is not very comfortable to have the gift of being amused at one's own absurdity.
-Somerset Maugham-
RE: Sigh, everyone just needs to calm down...
Purchase either DOCS to Go or QuickSheet for a spreadsheet program and get rid of Tiny Sheet
Purchase Datebk4 because it is capable of a TON more than Action Names and it is the SAME price. I remember when Action Names was 15 bucks and it is now 25.
Let IAMBIC concentrate on GAMES.
Courage
But ALL of us make mistakes in our lives. It takes courage to admit a mistake, act to correct it, and live on. Regardless of what we may guess of Iambic's intention, whether it is to mitigate its legal exposure, or something for business damage control, the FACT that Iambic do apologise is a respectful and courageous deed.
I really hope we can now put things behind us and move on.
RE: Courage
RE: Courage
I live in Hong Kong, work outside the IT industry, and use a Palm OS device since 1997. I am using DateBk since the dates of v2, have registered AllTime and AllMoney from Iambic, but not ActionNames. This is ALL about how I relate to PimlicoSoftare and Iambic - as a customer of both companies.
I seldom post IMA and have been posting long before the incident.
Just a bit to clarify and clear up.
RE: Courage
RE: Courage
I wouldn't be suprised if this person, along with some of the other mindless-sounding posts, are from iambic's marketing department, trying to patch up some of the damages they know they've done...
[/quote]
Hmm...at least he was brave enough to use his own name...
Please cut out the vitriolic crap.
_________________
Sean
It is not very comfortable to have the gift of being amused at one's own absurdity.
-Somerset Maugham-
Action Names Datebook?
I've read about the iambic domain hijacking with interest. Since when did "Action Names"
get changed to "Action Names Datebook?!" I missed that one. Perhaps they're trying to confuse us with the
between the two products?
RE: I will stay with Iambic!
I say: You are a suc*er. I would like to appologize. "And the fact that I apologized is enough to show the high moral level of me", isn't it so?
I appologize again.
Signed by Anonymous.
PalmGear Censors comments on Action Names
PalmGear not only did not accept my submission, they apparently forwarded it to iambic, because I received their form-letter "we did nothing illegal" response.
Several days later, not only my comments are still not posted on PG, but some other comments that were already there have been removed as well (all of which talked about the product only, in unfavorable terms, but not about iambic's recent behavior).
Has anybody succeeded in leaving comments in PG about Action Names lately?
RE: PalmGear Censors comments on Action Names
PalmGear did not disclose what criteria they use to screen the submissions, but my impression is that harsh and comparative statements (e.g. the xyz function is miserable compared to that of ABC application) will have a less chance of appearing at PalmGear.
This is one of the reason why I am not posting any more at PalmGear.
RE: PalmGear Censors comments on Action Names
RE: PalmGear Censors comments on Action Names
RE: PalmGear Censors comments on Action Names
PalmGear support and online services sucks. The only thing they got is their popuarlity and user base.
RE: PalmGear Censors comments on Action Names
RE: PalmGear Censors comments on Action Names
RE: PalmGear Censors comments on Action Names
I will stay with Iambic!
University of Puerto Rico (Mayaguez Campus)
Computer Engineering Department
------------------
For inspirational messages visit:
RE: I will stay with Iambic!
RE: I will stay with Iambic!
Of course, rabid Palm forum-readers who notice things five minutes after the event would disagree.
RE: I will stay with Iambic!
Get off your moral high horses
I find the "oh my God they squatted on someone's domain I'm NEVER going to have anything to do with them EVER" types completely manic, obsessive and neurotic. Get real. Your over-the-top response is COMPLETELY out of proportion to the crime. They were lobbied against, petitioned against, and backed off. Lots of lousier companies didn't.
I also find it asinine that anyone supporting Iambic must be from their marketing department, and anyone trashing Iambic must be from Pimlico's marketing department. Whatever happened to free speech? What the heck is wrong with you people?
RE: Get off your moral high horses
RE: Get off your moral high horses
RE: Get off your moral high horses
In the same way that readers choose to ignore those "sony" jingoists :), we need not know the name or IP address of posters.
RE: Get off your moral high horses
What Iambic did is stupid, but they do make fine software. They cannot be forgiven because they are small and there is the other shining good twin called Pilimco to lavish all your love on. Hey, look at how unfair and ass-licking you bunch are.
RE: Get off your moral high horses
RE: Get off your moral high horses
Heads must roll!!
RE: Heads must roll!!
RE: Heads must roll!!
RE: Heads must roll!!
RE: Heads must roll!!
You guys are hypocrites
This overreaction from a small slice of the PDA user community will be forgotten, oh say, 3 weeks from now. There are probably only about two dozen people, in total, participating in this debate. Time to move on with life, OK?
RE: You guys are hypocrites
RE: You guys are hypocrites
Including or not including you? I would just like to know whether to categorize you under "Moving On With Life" or "Not Moving On With Life".
RE: You guys are hypocrites
RE: You guys are hypocrites
"Well, I for one do not use pirated software (or MP3s for that matter) nor do I give any copies of software to friends. Why? Because I am a software developer myself and know that doing so is stealing money that someone else has worked to earn. I don't care if it's a small-time developer like myself or Microsoft, I have values and just as I would never shop-lift, neither would I steal software. Nor would I *ever* think of doing something like Iambic did to try and steal customers. Far from it, when I post on user groups about people asking for recommendations in the area my software is written for (ecommerce) I will not only suggest my own, I will point them to sites where they can look into others as well. Because I am quite confident that they will not find one that does more for the price than mine does, and it shows honesty and confidence that will often do more to convince a customer than just pretending that mine is the only software out there."
That is such crap. Look everyone, God has joined the forum.
RE: You guys are hypocrites
NOT A BIG DEAL. Repeat ad infinitum to anyone who has lost his sense of perspective in this "crusade".
RE: You guys are hypocrites
"That is such crap. Look everyone, God has joined the forum."
It's a sad statement on your own morals that you would demean someone else for having some. Very sad.
RE: You guys are hypocrites
Dear Honest Software Developer:
The above statement is known as a generalization, not a challenge to your morals as an individual. Nor was it an invitation to go into a half-page explainiation of your software purchasing practices and your supremely honest business practices. I even acknowledged by inference that 10% of you DON'T use illegally pirated or copied software.
RE: You guys are hypocrites
RE: You guys are hypocrites
Oh, is this your board, that only you are allowed to post on? Everyone else stop posting, you have to have an invitation from this loser to post anything more than a one-liner.
I think the point was that many of us DO play fair and we prefer to do business with a company that does, at least in situations like this where we have a choice. I don't use pirated software, I don't need to, I can afford to pay for what I use. And I am one of those that is a registered user of Iambic products and am now banned from their Forums for questioning their actions. No, I don't expect them to point me to their competition. But I do expect that if I have questions about their actions as a company, they will answer them and not just ban me from their Forum for asking them. This in my mind is a much worse offense than the cybersquatting ever was. I detest a company that tries to cover up their actions. In my mind, it is indicative of a company that may be doing other things and hiding them that I would not care to support.
RE: You guys are hypocrites
"I just came by this page to see what all the new comments were over what I read last Friday, and wow! sure is sad to see it become into the typical PIC flaming of other users thread. are some people in love with Iambic that they feel the need to criticize anyone that says that they did not care for their actions? it sure is interesting, the difference here and at PDABuzz, where the bulk of the thread about the apology from Iambic is people agreeing that they will not forget this easily. interesting that all those that post otherwise are only on here where they can post without names (yes, me also). What a statement about American business that its just expected that they would behave this way. just as someone would say that 90% of people have pirated software (is there data that says that?) and even if they did, that wouldn't make what iambic did right. what's that saying, two wrongs don't make it right? I am glad to see the message from the one person who says they are not like that, even if others did not like it. not everyone cares only about making money."
A few points to make: first, just because the posts here are mostly anonymous (more out of convenience than anything else) doesn't mean that they are somehow less sensible or defensible than those at PDABuzz or other fora. Second, one could very much ask the same of you: are you in love with Pimlico such that you feel the need to criticize those who think cybersquatting is less of a deal than some people have made it out to be?
Iambic was wrong. No question about it. But quit acting as if they were Microsoft itself. They don't deserve their (very good, in my opinion) software being boycotted because of mere cybersquatting, not when they even backed out on that. Microsoft has done much worse, including illegal tying practices and NDAs that restrict competition. In fact, so have many other software companies. So why are some people acting as if they were the Devil incarnate, not to be touched with a ten-foot pole?
If you ask me, the gentleman who said that banning registered users from Iambic forums is a much worse offence than cybersquatting is perfectly right. Cybersquatting is simply not a big enough deal to merit the kind of boycotting that I see users fuming about, despite Iambic's apology.
time to move on
"From: "C. E. Steuart Dewar" <dewar@P...>
Date: Mon May 13, 2002 11:24 am
Subject: Iambic - some final thoughts before moving on
First of all, I want to express again my appreciation at the support that I
have received from the Palm Community over the events of this past week.
The Palm community spoke, and at this point Iambic has responded. Regardless
of how this response may have been received or perceived, it is important
that we all be in a frame of mind where apologies can be accepted. If we
don't accept an apology, then there is no incentive for the other party to
proffer one.
Obviously, it is not my place to try and control the nature of the responses
to the original actions taken, but I would like to emphasize that from my
own personal view, I do not condone any actions that go beyond the
professional expression of dissatisfaction at the events. In particular, I
do not like to see any personal attacks, nor any kind of "dirty tricks"
retaliations. There have been some rumblings about that, and I want everyone
to clearly know that both publicly and privately, this would dismay me to
see anything like that become a reality.
So, unless there is some specific new information regarding all of this, I
think we should consider that reason and ethics prevailed and that the final
resolution (assuming that promises that have been made are followed through
on) is satisfactory enough for us to move on and get back to the issues at
hand.
We have a new release of DateBk with all the attendant issues that a new
release typically brings. I need to get to work on the translation tables so
the translators can start work on the German and French versions of DateBk5.
We have some new and interesting devices, and with OS 5.0 just around the
corner, I think I have more than enough things to keep me busy! I don't
think that deciding to move on in any way diminishes the efforts made - I
suspect the events of the past week are not going to be forgotten that
quickly )
Cheers!
CESD, Pimlico Software, Inc.
========================================== "
RE: time to move on
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good