Comments on: Sony T600C and T400 Discontinued
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RE: Why???
The answer is no. It doesn't change anything. Don't whine and say "This innovation and wonderful new products at lower prices really sucks", because it's an attitude like that that keeps innovation from happening.
I own a Clie N760 (upgraded from a N710), and damnit, I am excited about seeing Sony make new products. My N760 is great. It has good battery life, mp3, bright screen, Hi-Res. Seeing the T series and the NR70 (and whatever model is coming next) doesn't piss me off, because those models being in existence don't take features away from my model. At least sony is raising the bar for some of the other players to innovate as well.
Kudos to Sony, and to any of the other companies who want to continue to innovate, be they Palm or Hanspring.
That being said, I'll wait for OS 5 before throwing down a few hundred on something new.
RE: Why???
How about a wireless Sony NR
RE: Why???
RE: Why??? new model?
RE: Why???
RE: Why???
RE: Why???
Im betting on the following... (just speculation):
33mhz CPU (maybe 66 but doubt it)
16mb RAM
320x480 screen with virtual graffiti
t615 style case/formfactor (but probably a bit thicker)
If priced correctly ($399 max) and they go with the 66mhz cpu it could be a killer unit.
Since no 600 series clie has ever had builtin MP3 i doubt it will play them, although its likely to have the beefed up audio of the t615 and NR70 series. Id guess to be designated NR60.
RE: Why???
>
> 33mhz CPU (maybe 66 but doubt it)
> 16mb RAM
> 320x480 screen with virtual graffiti
> t615 style case/formfactor (but probably a bit thicker)
I agree with the 33mhz. I don't think 66mhz and Hi-Res+ in the same form factor is do-able, because the battery life would be intolerable. OTOH, I think there's a strong possibility that they will go for 66mhz with a 320x320 screen. Just because we all want virtual graffiti to be the wave of the future doesn't mean Sony wants to integrate it into its midrange models yet.
One shorter...
It was a Japanese-language only release that didn't do very well at all, primarily because the screen was exceptionally dim (yes, even dimmer than the often-criticized m505).
Here's a PalmOS trivia question for all the "gurus" out there in PIC-land:
What PalmOS-powered device had the longest lifespan, and how long was it?
RE: Why???
Bring em' on!
RE: Bring em' on!
RE: Bring em' on!
This isn't some grand scheme on Sony's part to squeeze as much money out of people who have to have the latest and greatest. Those people do not buy enough units to make it worth Sony's investment. Sony is simply keeping the product up-to-date to ensure it's competitive... it's a good strategy.
I'm keeping my fingers crossed for a 480x320 66 MHz T615-like device. Whether it has PalmOS4 or OS5, I really don't care... I can do everything I need with OS4. I played with the NR70 and decided the clamshell design, while innovative and impressive, isn't for me.
RE: Bring em' on!
Just so you know, the "average" person who buys the models from Sony is not a Technophile who will always buy the newest, best model on the market.
If that were the case, then Sony could charge 200 dollars more than any Ipaq out there and still make money off their models. The people who read this board are very different from the average person, and you need to understand that to see what Sony is doing.
If Sony can make money by introducing new products to the market, then let them. If you're a sucker and have to buy the newest gadget to compensate for a lack of self worth, then pretend they aren't coming out with something new and you won't be so upset. Sony wouldn't be in business if they weren't making money, so let them make money and watch what they come out with in amazement as I and everyone else has.
RE: Bring em' on!
It's only more money out of your pocket if you consider this an upgrade. ITS NOT! It is a new product, replacing an existing product. There is no reason to go out and buy a new one just because they have released a new model in a series and retired the old one. Happy with your T6xx? Great keep it. Don't own a T615 and want to consider a new model? Great, either buy the existing model at closeout pricing, or hang back and buy the new one.
RE: Bring em' on!
RE: Bring em' on!
RE: Bring em' on!
RE: Bring em' on!
money out of your pocket?
only if you're mentally susceptable enough to let the technology and fashion industry reach into your pocket and make what you currenlty own suddenly less useful when the come out with this weeks latest fad.
my palm v works exactly the same and hasn't cost me a penny more, even when new models are introduced.
my palm v is superior to some of the most powerful room size computers available 20 years ago, and the newest palmos 7.5.1 dual hyper-arm based multiprotocol-wireless handheld is a junky toy compared to what you'll be able to buy 20 years from now, so why let the current bi-weekly introduction of new palmos models bother you?
RE: Bring em' on!
The S300 was another flop if you knew your CLIE history...
RE: Bring em' on!
To sony
If you are reading this forum please consider the following for the model to replace the T series:
1) Virtual graffiti
2) 10+ hours of battery life
3) real (usable) buttons
4) smaller.
If toshiba did it with the bloated PocketPC and Arm 206 Mhz procesor why can't Sony do it with the Palm OS.
The toshiba e310 is just .4 thin, thiner than the thinest color Palm OS and has 10 hour battery, I just wich it where Palm based instead of PocketPC crashware
RE: To sony
1) Virtual Graffiti
2) Cell Phone
3) Camera (or Memstick option)
4) SAME OR SMALLER FORM FACTOR
Anything else is gravy
RE: To sony
Afther what Toshiba did (.4 inch thick!) and 10 hour battery with the bulky power hungy Strong Arm 206Mhz
I am sure Sony can do better with the small low power Dragon ball.
Please Sony make this device .4 inch or thinner and shorter than the T series.
RE: To sony
Second, it makes sense for Sony to try a new niche, not one in which they already make the best machine. If you want a fast, colour, MP3-playing, 320x480 machine, it already exists! Sony make it! It's called the N70 (or something). I was hoping they would launch something with a built-in cell phone or e-mail to compete with the Treo and i705, which is the one niche they've never tried to enter. Then I remembered that Sony don't usually do that sort of thing. Their mobile phones are actually collaborations with Ericsson.
I actually wonder whether they weren't taken by surprise by the success of the T615C? Maybe they only ordered a certain number of components and those are all exhausted now...? It was certainly a very short-lived product to say it was so well-received.
RE: To sony
>>the N70 (or something).
For your information the people posting here are regulars in Palminfocenter and know perfectly what the NR 70 and 70V are.
What people here are asking for is a device with similar capabilities to the NR 70 but in a smaller form factor similar to the T series (NR70 is bigger than even some pocketpcs).
Toshiba has proved it is is possible, now is Sonys turn to make a device to compete directly whith the Toshiba e310.
Please review your facts beafore critizicing other peoples posting and taking them form low palm knowledge people.
RE: To sony
"While the e310 probably won't be able to match the battery life of high-end Palm-powered handhelds, it does compete well pricewise with those models and may help Microsoft convert more PDA owners--and potential PDA owners--into Pocket PC users." - CNet.com
It's so obvious you want a PPC!
RE: To sony
RE: To sony
"I was hoping they would launch something with a built-in cell phone or e-mail to compete with the Treo and i705".
The Sony-Ericsson P800 is due out this Autumn and looks amazing. Check it out at http://www.sonyericsson.com/uk/spg.jsp?page=start
I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
T615C is DISCONTINUED says Best Buy Rep
Posted by: I.M. Anonymous @ 3/28/2002 4:41:40 PM
The T615C had the shortest career since that Pope that got poisoned...
http://www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=3212
Can I have some props????
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
But two can play at that game. I say the NR7OV has been discontinued. Now when it actually happens, I'll claim credit as being the first to know.
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
6 weeks ago is different than now vs. when the NR70 is toast which will be a long time from now
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
-Igno R Amus
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
SD
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
RE: I posted this almost 2 months ago and nobody believed me
(That means "I also strongly agree" in response to "Word" which means "I strongly agree").
Absolutely Ridiculous!
Just imagine if Mcdonald's or Tacobell kept changing the recipes of their sandwiches and such every few months, They'd go broke. Now I'm not saying sony shouldn't innovate and make new stuff, but keep the old stuff alive a little longer along side the new stuff. Make a replacement for the T615 that's better, faster, whatever, then lower the price on the T615 and keep selling more of both products. Surely this is shouldn't be difficult for a company like sony to do. Imagine going to a car dealership with 2 or 3 different models ONLY. That's one thing I actually like about palm and compaq, they seem to have a much more reasonable lifespan for their products and this can help solidfy their customer base and increase their return customer percentages.
Think about all the people who just bought a T615 because it's the the newest and the hottest and now their pda is obsolete. A dinosaur. That's just sad.
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
You said imagine if McDonalds or Taco Bell changed their recipes every 6 months. You cannot actually compare taste to technology. I guess the better question is that if that is all you had to choose from, wouldnt you get tired of it? McDonalds everyday for 6 months? There are some who want something different. 6 months is just about long enough to keep consumers on their toes.
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
I agree with the other replier, your comments make no sense.
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
Can you explain why T615C become obsolete and dinosaur with a better version being released? Does it suddenly stop working? Do the hires screen suddenly become lores? Does the jogdial stop functioning? Or does the 16M suddenly becomes 8M?
You comment does not make sense. The T615C will continue to work as it before. It will even compare better than some other new palm devices. And try go to the Sony support web site, it even provide patches for the S300 if relevant. I just do not understand why everytime a new model comes out, the old ones will suddenly seems like it loose the functions that you bought it for.
Just see how Sony has pushed the palmos devices in 1.5 years.
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
It is a big issue because people will stop developing speciality apps that use the device's unique features and they will not useful peripherals for devices with a such a short lifespan.
Palm have stuck to the same form factor which is very conforting for users and means that a large number of peripherals continue to work.
I don't think we'll see many new programs with Hires support developed now they have dropped the T600 :(
[ Though it's admittedly in Japan, where they are ahead of the curve. I've just ordered a T625c here in the UK, with a BT memory stick today *- Still not going to cancel though :) ]
* = To replace my m500 with BT SD card, which I bought to replace a Visor Prisim which I lost in a Taxi (and bought to replace my 1st generation HP Jornada which had crappy WinCE) - I stayed away from the m505 (due to the dull screen) but days later the 515 came out, doh!). Oh well - my two cow-orkers have a m515 and a T625 and the 515 has nicer colours and better buttons, but T625 is has a much prettier screen and I can't tell there is a problem with the red unless I see them both together. Would get a NR70c but I know I can't afford it right now , so will have to be happy with the T625c :-)
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
"It is a big issue because people will stop developing speciality apps that use the device's unique features and they will not useful peripherals for devices with a such a short lifespan.
Palm have stuck to the same form factor which is very conforting for users and means that a large number of peripherals continue to work.
I don't think we'll see many new programs with Hires support developed now they have dropped the T600 :( "
Product continuity is not a big issue because Sony re-uses the same features and connectors. Case in point: 320X320 hi-res is available across most of Sony's models, and will surely be available with the T600's successor. Your analysis that new programs will not use hi-res is absurd. Many developers have developed with Sony's hi-res in mind, and it's not going to stop tomorrow. The T600 is not the ONLY hi-res Sony Clie, in case you weren't aware.
As for connecting peripherals, I agree that Sony has switched connector standards faster than Palm. But they also have a policy of retaining the same connector for a few generations. So far the T series and the NR series both have the same connectors. It is a certainty that the T600 replacement will have these connectors too.
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
Just compare the life cycle of the t415/T615 to that of the S300 series. Yes the latter has been upgraded periodically, but there are sufficient sales in the s300 range to keep pumping out these units.
No matter what ppl say about the feature set of the t615, they are just not getting enough market share, so Sony must discontinue and try again.
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
RE: Absolutely Ridiculous!
You write:
"sony seems to think that people will readily change pda's every six months or so."
An alternative interpretation:
Sony puts out product "X" (let's call it the N710/N760). Because only a certain percentage of the population bought that particular device, they're wondering how to improve upon its features and design (ala NR70 series). While I suspect that they expect some portion of the sales (of the NR70 series) to be from upgraders (of the N710/N760C), they want those people that didn't buy the original to take another look at their Clie lineup. In other words, they're looking to gain more market share by introducing new devices that will entice NEW buyers!
You write:
"keep the old stuff alive a little longer along side the new stuff."
Interpretation:
You have absolutely no business experience, do you? Rather than hypothesizing about a digital dream world, let's face facts:
Fact 1: It is a nightmare to track inventory of older models in the market (not impossible, but just a nightmare!)
Fact 2: Equally nightmarish is tech support (Granted, Sony's tech support sucks major, but I'm talking in general industry terms)
Fact 3: What's the incentive for the buyer to purchase a new device when the older one is seemingly just as good at a lower price. If no one buys new device, then this, in effect, chokes off product R&D.
''16 MB of RAM, the most a Dragonball processor can use''-not
RE: ''?????"
RE: ''16 MB of RAM, the most a Dragonball processor can use''-not
RE: ''16 MB of RAM, the most a Dragonball processor can use''-not
I also remember seeing that the Pro could be upgraded to 32mb. I'm not sure, but I think it was accessing the extra 16mb like a flash module. (?)
"Some older series of PalmIII™ and PalmVII™ use different style memory chips. I will not be able to upgrade those units. In order to determine if you have a newer version you will need to load this program into your unit. After you run the program it will tell you whether your PDA is upgradable or not. You can also run this program to determine if your Handspring™ Neo/Pro can be upgraded to 32 Mb of RAM. If it can be upgraded the program will indicate the "SDRAM" type of memory."
- http://www.palmpilotupgrade.com/faq.html (FAQ #34)
I also found some threads at VisorCentral:
http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20692&highlight=pro+32mb
http://discussion.visorcentral.com/vcforum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=21733&highlight=pro+32mb
"There's always hope, because it's the one thing nobody's figured out how to kill yet." -- Galen, Crusade (B5)
TWO TEAMS.....
Now that NR series just got off the shelves, expect the T-series team to come up with something interesting shortly.
RE: TWO TEAMS.....
my wild guess would be either integrated mp3, 64mb, or video accelerator.
RE: TWO TEAMS.....
nXt's Clie Club
Place To Be For Sony Clie Discussion
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nxtclieclub
RE: TWO TEAMS.....
MediaQ 1100 chip has 256kb of embedded SRAM on-board, so it is enough only for 320 x 320 x 16bit-per-pixel buffer, and that amount of memory is divided into video RAM, and transactional buffers for additional devices, like integrated USB hub.
The new NR70/NR70V have 320x480x16bit screens, and there is not enough memory in MediaQ 1100/1132 chips to power it. However there is a next generation chip called MediaQ 1168, with 320kb on board memory and some extra functionality - available to OEMs in large volumes since Feb 2002. Hope this is the chip inside NRs, this would be much easier for developers - all this chips are in most cases low-level backward-compatible.
What is very interesting, that MediaQ 1168 has integrated hardware support for mulitmedia, like color space convertion, bit-blit operations, etc.
Slightly off topic, I know :). All this are only my own presumptions, and I would be gratefull for any information.
OT: XBOX/PS2 Drops to $199....
Quit yer whining, At least with Sony, we can see the PDA ever evolving, not dead as a rock like Palm/HandSpring/HandEra is....
Remember the mastercard commercial.....
RE: OT: XBOX/PS2 Drops to $199....
At least with Sony, we can see the PDA ever evolving, not dead as a rock like Palm/HandSpring/ HandEra is....
[/quote]
Huh? Like Handera is? Please. Aside from being monochrome, the Handera 330 feature set is still miles ahead of anything else out there. What other PalmOS device gives you two expansion slots, allowing you to use memory cards and peripherals SIMULTANEOUSLY? Handera developed Hi-Res for the Palm before Sony, and used a scheme that directly scales to full VGA. The smallest fonts on the Handera are still readable, unlike Sonys. And Handera was the first to bring virtual graffiti to the market, in a simpler and cleaner interface than the "new" Sony iteration.
Keep in mind that nobody even knew the 330 even existed until about a month before it was available. Handera is a tight-lipped company. Just because they are silent does not mean they aren't developing something new (and hopefully equally well-engineered) today. And the 330 is still a very viable platform for those willing to think beyond glitter and what Sony tells them.
_________________
Sean
It is not very comfortable to have the gift of being amused at one's own absurdity.
-Somerset Maugham-
Sony is very smart to use "T" connection on "NR" devices
Sony is very smart to use "T" connection on "NR" devices.
Atleast people who choose to upgrade from the T series to the NR series can do so with the knowledge that most of their existing accessories will be functional with the new NR models.
Hopefully this will hold true for the new T series as well.
Just my 2cents,
Stronggeek
RE: Sony is very smart to use
RE: Sony is very smart to use
RE: Sony is very smart to use
RE: Sony is very smart to use
---
At least they are not stupid enoguh to give you a SUDS crap.
Good riddance
T6xx not dead, just refreshed - T650 (or so)?
As for hard facts, I haven't been able to get any either...
Wow, the warranty period hasn't even expired on...
Still, ya gotta love their designs.
WoW, that was quick!
i guess thats how they manage to stay on top of the game.
WOW!
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