Comments on: Palm To Have Largest Bluetooth Network in the U.S.

Pico Communications is going to install PicoBlue Internet Access Points in both the Palm Solutions Group's new offices in Milpitas and in PalmSource's new offices in Sunnyvale, both in California. This is expected to be the largest Bluetooth wireless network in the U.S. and the largest enterprise Bluetooth network in the world. It will be operational later this month.
Return to Story - Permalink

Article Comments

 (48 comments)

The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. PalmInfocenter is not responsible for them in any way.
Please Login or register here to add your comments.

Comments Closed Comments Closed
This article is no longer accepting new comments.

Down

Great way to spend money

WhoControlsTheMedia? @ 9/5/2002 1:32:49 PM #
Now when the news comes that they are getting bought by Sony, they will get it directly on their wireless Palm from anywhere in the building!

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 2:21:56 PM #
This is a stupid post. Why do people always have to have a negative spin on everything.
RE: Great way to spend money
Beavis @ 9/5/2002 2:45:29 PM #
Well, my first thought was "shouldn't they be spending more money on Research and Development?"

I guess at $500 per access point, it's really not a bad deal for a big company.

Now all Sony has to do is have some people sit in their cars in the Palm parking lot with their InfoStick equipped Clies and do a little corporate intelligence gathering.

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 2:45:29 PM #
"stupid post" ? aren't you being a little negative ? ;-)
RE: Great way to spend money
Taqi @ 9/5/2002 2:46:29 PM #
SPIN
Something we guys in the UK have a rather lot off. Perhaps it was originally from over the pond (spin for vast ocean).

Now the question is: is this a subtle way of advertising OS5 and its built in blue tooth? Or is that really spinning out of control?

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 2:49:50 PM #
I always said that the only way to populate
Bluetooth on Palm is making it built-in.

ted

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 3:01:55 PM #
I don't know about this. I think Palm is wasting their money and is going in the wrond direction here. Wasn't almost this time a year or two agao Palm was in a commitment to build a new building and than realized they couldn't afford it when their stocks came tumbling down?

I really think Palm could find different ways to use their money for their good than this. I can understand Placing Bluetoth in one of their buildings, but all of them? Isn't this kinda like a story where a corperation has all kinds of money to spend and they build an 18 hole golf course right behind their building so their execs and other people can get a quick round before days start and end? Becuase I feel Palm is doing the same thing here. Probably very few at Palm would use this for real outside of R&D and perhaps a few of the exec people, but do all the buildings just makes me feel like they are doing it for ohhs and ahhs than for any other real reasons.

I am shocked that no one at Palm has no forsight see the problem, and expense that they are about to get themselves into here.

Just my 4 and 1/2 Cents worth.

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 3:04:46 PM #
What makes you think Palm is paying anything for this? Pico could be giving them the hardware for the PR coup of having the World's Largest Bluetooth Network. Or at least a discount.
RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 3:32:31 PM #
Actually this can be a really good way to keep everyone in communication. The ability to get to your email from any meeting, or hallway, lunchroom etc is a big deal when it comes to keeping information flowing.

I would consider it as a test bed for built in BT, but also a way to improve Palm's efficiency.

If you've never had access to wireless on your PDA you have no idea how handy it can be. I used a Minstrel on my PVx for three years and was totally addicted. If I could have the same access within my work environment I would jump at the chance.

Mike

RE: Great way to spend money
jjsoh @ 9/5/2002 3:50:42 PM #
: I would consider it as a test bed for built in BT, but
: also a way to improve Palm's efficiency.

That's what I was thinking too. Wouldn't this be an indirect way of investing in R&D? What better way to test and work out the kinks of BT technology than to integrate and use it within your company.

In a sort of real world environment, rather than controlled test labs.

Jim

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 5:35:28 PM #
Another thing to consider is that they may actually SAVE money doing this. How? How much does it cost to wire all their employees? And what if they decide to move yet again? It's much easier to move a wisreless setup than a wired one.

And I agree about this beign part of their R&D. There's no better way to demostrate an idea than to use it yourself.

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 6:40:38 PM #
Check my math here. That's 160,000 square feet divided by access points with 300 square feet of coverage, and that's 533 access points? At $500 per, I guess they're not paying retail... ;-)
RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 6:52:50 PM #
From reading all you yutzes, I can see why you are posting here. None of you guys knows how to run a high tech company.
RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 7:18:40 PM #
"None of you guys knows how to run a high tech company."

And now you're going to tell us you're running a course on that for the low low price of $199us?

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 7:51:19 PM #
Well, their APs apparently have 100m range in open space, like the WIFI APs. To me that has always meant realistically 50ft range, which translates to a coverage area of pi x 50ft x 50ft = ~7500 sq ft

So recalculating based on that (and not the 300sqft - where the heck did you get that?) you get on the order of 20 APs. Add a few for their thick walled conf rooms and exec office, and you'll probably get 30-40 APs.

Not really that big a spend when you think about it. And probably a big productivity booster, since as someone else mentions, not all of them get freebie i705s. Many of their folks are probably on campus most of the time so that local coverage is good enough.

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 7:57:16 PM #
> Check my math here.

Sorry, your math doesn't check. Each access point doesn't cover just 100 sq meters. Each one's coverage has a radius of 100 meters or 300 feet.

That's 3.14 x 300 ft ^2 = 282,600 sq. feet.

So one could do it easily. :) Of course, walls will greatly reduce the coverage area.

RE: Great way to spend money
drw @ 9/5/2002 8:44:16 PM #
"From reading all you yutzes, I can see why you are posting here. None of you guys knows how to run a high tech company."

Maybe not, but I know how to make the stock price go up. Doing a 1 for 20 stock split will make the stock price go up twenty fold. I'll be on the cover of Fortune magazine.


---
David

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 8:52:55 PM #
"That's 3.14 x 300 ft ^2 = 282,600 sq. feet.

So one could do it easily. :) Of course, walls will greatly reduce the coverage area."

Wha? pi x 300 is 942 Sq. feet. You're saying the largest BT network in the US could be comprised of one access point?

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 8:56:23 PM #
er, 4, one for each building ;-)
RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 9:39:07 PM #
Would you trust a chef who won't eat his own cooking? Palm is a big supporter of BlueTooth, so it makes sense for them to show their commitment.
RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 9:56:20 PM #
>> That's 3.14 x 300 ft ^2 = 282,600 sq. feet.

> Wha? pi x 300 is 942 Sq. feet.

300 feet is the radius. The formula for the area of a circle is Pi * r^2. You didn't square the radius.

> You're saying the largest BT network in the US could be comprised of one access point?

Like I said, that's with no walls ceilings or floors to interfere. In reality, there will need to be many more, if for no other reason that only 7 (or is it 8) people can use a single Pico access point at a time.

RE: Great way to spend money
ahecht @ 9/5/2002 10:26:29 PM #
Dont forget to triple or quadruple that area since one access point can serve multiple floors.

RE: Great way to spend money
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/6/2002 12:54:48 PM #
YOU PEOPLE ARE IDIOTS! A great company has to innovate and expand thier IT infrastucture every couple of years anyway...why not spend $200K (the net profit from 4000 palm M125's) and show the viability of thier products in the real world!

BT SD card? Yeah right.

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 3:23:25 PM #
You really think all of Palm employees are using an SD card and losing all expansion possibilities?! Doubt it. I'd bet that they are being their own test group for a new built-in bluetooth model.
RE: BT SD card? Yeah right.
kezza @ 9/5/2002 3:34:40 PM #
You're probably right about using this to test built in BT models, but I seriously doubt everybody at Palm will be doing this. Microsoft was too cheap to give the Halo developers Xboxes, what makes you think Palm would give every one of its employees a prototype hush-hush handheld to play with?

--------------------------------------
"Well, if it isn't the leader of the wiener patrol, boning up on his nerd lessons"
http://stirwise.com
RE: BT SD card? Yeah right.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 4:24:23 PM #
i can tell you Palm has never been one to give all employees the latest and greatest devices. a number of times I have had a beta of the new palm and been in a situation where a number of palm employees haven't even played with that same device yet. i705 was a good example.
RE: BT SD card? Yeah right.
drw @ 9/5/2002 8:47:17 PM #
The next 8 people Palm hires will be given m130's. (sorry, can't reveal my source, nda, you know :)

---
David

Its also possible.

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 4:02:19 PM #
I'm out on a limb here, but I think it is possible to make PCs & Printers bluetooth compatable too. Also, Palm is supposed to be moving into a new building, or has moved already? So, is it possible they are enveloping there new office in a bluetooth network, so they dont have to string wire?

Yes, they could do 802.11 but, since I would guess every Palm employee gets a Palm, and with the new network a bluetooth card, it could be pretty cool.

No, I know they don't have to, but. Sometimes, companies do stuff cause its cool. Sometimes, its not just about the almighty buck. The almighty buck has completly taken over all decisions at my company so, I want to belive its true

RE: Its also possible.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 5:01:24 PM #
Good grief. What a waste. Bluetooth is not made for WAN or LAN - that is why it is called PAN - short cable replacements. WiFi/802.11b/a is what you need for a network, not bluetooth.
RE: Its also possible.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 5:11:29 PM #
> Bluetooth is not made for WAN or LAN

Handhelds were made to store some phone numbers. A laptop is what you should get for anything more. Sound silly? Of course, but that's the arguement you are making about Bluetooth and WiFi. No matter what the developers of Bluetooth "meant" it to be used for, it has grown beyond that.

Both Bluetooth and WiFi work for wireless net access. Until someone comes up with a way for 802.11 to use as little power as Bluetooth does, some will prefer Bluetooth.

RE: Its also possible.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 5:43:18 PM #
"Both Bluetooth and WiFi work for wireless net access. Until someone comes up with a way for 802.11 to use as little power as Bluetooth does, some will prefer Bluetooth."

I suppose you can cite the power consumption of the SD Bluetooth card? I know I've certainly been digging for that. My own PalmOS PDA uses around 45mA with a CF Symbol WiFi card active. Without the card it uses around 33mA (no backlight in either case). Thus the card itself is using about 12mA.

If you look at Socket's CF bluetooth card (Toshiba makes the BT components for both Palm's SD Bluetooth,
and Socket's CF Bluetooth), you see the specs quote power consumption as:

16mA idle
40mA typical
90mA maximum
http://makeashorterlink.com/?O5D6225B1

Also Sharps BT CF products list consumption in the 46-80mA range.
http://sharp-world.com/corporate/news/010131.html

It may well be that the SD version uses less power yet, though I'd like to read those numbers to prove it. But even if it does, I can still get well within the general BT specs of 30mA typical usage with my WiFi setup.

Sure I can make the card use more. Turning Power saving down 5 notches I'm up around 100mA (133-33). But then the above numbers would show BT can go nearly that high as well.

There are plenty of nifty things that Bluetooth can do, but let's start talking about those and less about the power issue. My backlight uses more power than my CF WiFi card, so lets put the power issue, in large part, to bed and talk about the more interesting details.

-Craig Bowers

RE: Its also possible.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 6:26:49 PM #
You can buy Bluetooth enabled PC's today, and you can retro-fit via USB adaptors. There are a couple of printers with BT built-in (and more on the way - a very nice portable one from - sorry under NDA), there are also BT adpators for older models.

So using BT just as you would 802.11 is entirely possible.

Good move - the best way to promote a technology is to actually use it yourself (eat your own dog food!). OK, so Palm don't own BT, but they are heavy supporters of it in the handheld space - this increases their perceived support. It's all good.

RE: Its also possible.
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 6:37:11 PM #
"OK, so Palm don't own BT, but they are heavy supporters of it in the handheld space - this increases their perceived support. It's all good."

And it's still their main SDIO option to legitimize their SD slot, so they pretty well have to dance with the one wa't brung 'ya (so to speak)

Bluetooth is dead. Give us 802.11
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 7:54:57 PM #
Palm really likes to make wrong decisions uh?
RE: Its also possible.
cyn @ 9/5/2002 8:45:00 PM #
(just clarifying)
12 with the card active - as in you're actually measuring that 12 while you are transferring over the card? I don't mean transferring, then popping over to a battery monitoring program when it's finished, and checking.

(like I said, take no offense, just clarifying. may be too late for anyone to come back and read this)

RE: Its also possible.
useybird @ 9/5/2002 10:12:12 PM #
"There are a couple of printers with BT built-in (and more on the way - a very nice portable one from - sorry under NDA), "

There are only about 3 printer companies. Only HP is known for that kind of innovation. Maybe his keyboard won't let him type HP. BTW, when is this HP printer coming out?

----------------------------------------
A few years ago at the Sony handheld Dept.:" That's the most stupid name ever. Who would want to buy something called a 'Clie'? You must be out of your mind!"

RE: Its also possible.
potter @ 9/6/2002 9:48:07 AM #
I thought the HP 995c had been out for about 6 months now ( http://products.hp-at-home.com/products/detail.php?prodnum=C8925A ). I had considered buying it a while ago, and opted for the 990 instead.
RE: Its also possible.
Token User @ 9/6/2002 12:38:02 PM #
www.blueunplugged.com/shop/department.asp?Department=11

Bluetooth printer adapters - turn any printer into a bluetooth enabled printer.

RE: Bluetooth is dead
mmmarkiep @ 12/4/2002 4:24:20 PM #
Really? Bluetooth is dead? Show me one 802.11x enabled mobile phone.


What a surprise: Done this a years ago!!!

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 8:08:37 PM #
I think this should have done this before when Palm started promoting BT. A PC user could do the same by just buying motherboards with built BT and use Linux.
Blahbity blah
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 9:37:21 PM #
Well, since none of you chuckleheads has caught on, I guess I will point that whatever Pico is setting up for Palm will not be any kind of functional wireless LAN. As WAS pointed out, BT is a PAN technology., More importantly, discovery and raoming in the 1.1 spec of BT supported in OS4.x and OS5 is , well, unbelievably lame. It just does not work well. More important still, the BT addressing scheme will limit an AP to 7 or 8 users, depending. So until Palm lays off a lot more people, they won't be able to flit about the campus and easily attach to the nearest AP to poll for mail or go to ****edcompany.com. Especially at those long company meetings.............

As far as range goes, EFFECTIVE range in most 1.1 APs is more like 30 ft. in radius, and often degrading quality at that distance.

RE: What a surprise: Done this a years ago!!!
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/5/2002 10:05:11 PM #
They are going to get more than one access point, you know. Did you think they'd only have one for 4 buildings? That's how they'll deal with the range and number of simultaneous connections. So yes, they'll be able to connect from anywhere on campus.
RE: What a surprise: Done this a years ago!!!
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/9/2002 7:06:00 PM #
I think Bluetooth is an amazing idea. The problem is, for it to be useful, everything needs to be Bt or some other wirreless lan. My dream is to have a bt module on every major street corner. To be able to walk down the street with my bt wearable computer where the headset with the little screen that goes over one eye and theres no conection between that, the processing unit and the imput device, and to be able to look at porn while I shop for groceries, lol. to enter the vicinity of my house and have my computer automatically open the garage doors, turn on the lights and A/C, boot up my PC. As soon as i leave the car it locks, closes the garage door, unlocks the main one, and have my palm synced and all the doc that i sent to print, printed. But this is a long time from now, even if we readly embrace wireless lan. but all this stuff is really completely useless, we don't neeed another way to become lazier and fatter N. Americans than we already are (think: segway? the scooter thing.) The only plus is the connectivity, to not need any physical connections, but then again I want to see if all those office workers at palm develop brain cancer 5 years from now, and their up to their ears in lawsuits. We just have to wait and see where it goes, besides, why would i want to check my email when I can just call someone?

bluetooth or 802.11

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/6/2002 3:23:40 AM #
No problem. The next Palm with OS 5 will be made with TWO slots SDIO !!!!! one for memory expansion, or anything else, and one for wireless communication, bluetooth ou 802.11, OR anything else.

And same size than M515, but in brown color (because oslo)

RE: bluetooth or 802.11
jjsoh @ 9/6/2002 10:32:29 AM #
: The next Palm with OS 5 will be made with TWO slots
: SDIO !!!!! one for memory expansion, or anything else,
: and one for wireless communication, bluetooth ou
: 802.11, OR anything else.

It has already been announced that the next Palm model will have BT built into the PDA. So I think your theory of dual SDIO slots is way off and most likely not very cost effective.

Jim

RE: bluetooth or 802.11
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/7/2002 9:43:41 PM #
I prefer 802.11b

Gg

PIC mobile user @ 9/10/2002 4:33:35 PM #
Gg

Gg

PIC mobile user @ 9/11/2002 4:34:05 PM #
Gg
Top

Account

Register Register | Login Log in
user:
pass: