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Comments on: Rumor: Sony Clie TG50, T Series Replacement?

Rumor: Sony Clie PEG TG50Information about a possible Sony Clie t665 replacement was leaked to the web today in a FCC filling according to this PCWorld article. The Sony Clie PEG-TG50 features an integrated keyboard, bluetooth and a flip cover.
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Why buy a Clie???

awdr @ 1/30/2003 6:28:26 PM #
proprietery standards= Memory Stick, WLAN card

no OS-updates

bad battery life

models change so fast that they canīt support older ones,accessory plugs donīt fit

the time you get an accessory(if you ever get one), your model is ancient

bad service


RE: Why buy a Clie???
Gekko @ 1/30/2003 6:46:48 PM #
Clies are a great value and provide a big bang for the buck relative to overpriced Palm and Handspring offerings. Case in point: $499 for a TT.

RE: Why buy a Clie???
strannik @ 1/30/2003 6:54:28 PM #
yeah, but the max size of memory sticks is laughable

RE: Why buy a Clie???
gfunkmagic @ 1/30/2003 7:57:45 PM #
quote:

"yeah, but the max size of memory sticks is laughable"

Well that argument may be mute if the TG50 supports MSPro. MSPro cards will come in 256MB, 512MB and 1GB capacities.

RE: Why buy a Clie???
rsc1000 @ 1/30/2003 8:17:34 PM #
>>models change so fast that they canīt support older ones,accessory plugs donīt fit

>>the time you get an accessory(if you ever get one), your model is ancient

i don't get this - do mean the disapointment factor from not having the latest Sony? They've been using the same connector for quite awhile now (for nr,nx,nz, t and sj series)- so what are you talking about?

RE: Why buy a Clie???
awdr @ 1/31/2003 6:30:04 AM #
Have you ever tried to get an accessory for a Sony Clie. I am quite shure that ths is no problem if you live in Japan or even the US.

In Europe its nearly impossible. They still sell the NR 70 for 570 Euros and claim its brand new!!

Thats a rather dissatisfactory situation!!


in case of palm handhelds its no problem, you get nearly everything, but still, the price is much higher compared to the countries mentioned above!

RE: Why buy a Clie???
a3 @ 1/31/2003 8:40:02 AM #
well, at least you can buy a Clie in Europe! In Latin America Sony doesn't sell that type of products. We have to go to the US to buy one and to tell you the truth it is worth doing so! (or it will be worth until somebody else comes up with a T615/665 form factor with virtual graffiti...
I mean why use that stupid thumbboard?????? it looks like a Blackberry...

_______________________________________
Nothing: the worst you can do.
RE: Why buy a Clie???
Rolando @ 1/31/2003 9:28:15 AM #
This is funny. People in America complain because Sony comes out with too many models, too fast. People in Europe are complaining that the models don't come out (to them) fast enough.

RE: Why buy a Clie???
sremick @ 1/31/2003 2:18:40 PM #
Gekko,

$499 for a Tungsten T? That's the retail price. No one pays retail. All the following have it under $350:

http://www.buydig.com/shop.php?prod_id=3COMTUNGSTENT
http://www.mpsuperstore.com/computer/indexMy.htm?discr24234.htm
http://www.compuplus.com/insidepage.php3?&id=1000531

RE: Why buy a Clie???
TvM @ 1/31/2003 3:09:02 PM #
" Well that argument may be mute if the TG50 supports MSPro. MSPro cards will come in 256MB, 512MB and 1GB capacities."

I do think the TG50 supports MSPro. But knowing Sony's development speed when it comes to memory, that's going to be years from now. And by that time your pda is already loads of generations behind. I wouldn't bother paying attention to MSPro now, unless you're interested in 16 to 64 mb cards, because they will probably be available before this TG50 goes obsolete.


RE: Why buy a Clie???
JonathanChoo @ 1/31/2003 5:17:17 PM #
I got a Tungsten T for Ģ280, and today I saw a NR70 for Ģ400 and a NX70 for Ģ550.
RE: Why buy a Clie???
Wollombi @ 2/3/2003 12:31:42 AM #
>"Well that argument may be mute if the TG50 supports MSPro. MSPro cards will come in 256MB, 512MB and 1GB capacities."<

Yeah, uh huh. Don't know about you, but I don't make my predictions, or buying decisions, based on things that are still vaporware.

_________________
Sean

It is not very comfortable to have the gift of being amused at one's own absurdity.
-Somerset Maugham-

RE: Why buy a Clie???
ig88b @ 2/3/2003 3:13:01 AM #
>>Yeah, uh huh. Don't know about you, but I don't make my predictions, or buying decisions, based on things that are still vaporware.

MS pro is not vaporware. Sony announced them formally at CES and IIRC had samples. The sonystyle website lists availibility as march.

Where is the virtual grafitti?

s360 @ 1/30/2003 6:38:04 PM #
It seems sony is not following what the consumer needs. From the pics, it must me 320 x 320 screen. So no virtual grafitti for this model.

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
strannik @ 1/30/2003 6:51:31 PM #
um?
how does one relate to the other?

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
gfunkmagic @ 1/30/2003 7:53:43 PM #
Not true! If its G2, then it could still be VG! G2 will include support for a new unified "virtual Graffiti" API that will allow licensees to replace the traditional silk-screened writing area with a software-collapsible.

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
rsc1000 @ 1/30/2003 8:36:08 PM #
>>how does one relate to the other?

Look - sony does 320x320 w/out virtual grafitti and 320x480 with VG. This has a square screen - so no VG. The reason that they would not do 320 x 320 with VG is because ALL of sonys model are a multiple of 160x160 - standard apps are going to take the full 320 x 320 leaving no space for the VG. This is freakin obvious. Yes THEY COULD pull a handera and use some weird resolution here. They could pixel double on the horizontal but leave the vertical 1.5 times (for backward compatibility w/ 160x160). thats possible - but damn messy.
They already have a system and they'll stick to it. I'd bet my life on it. Besides - do you think they would - after 2 years w/ 320x320 hires for the 'main' area of the screen, suddenly lower the res for this(320 - 80 pixels VG = 240)? Nah - not a chance.

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
zipwire @ 1/30/2003 9:06:32 PM #
With Graffitti 2 your ENTIRE screen is VG. No need for special VG screen estate. An integrated keyboard with Graffitti 2 - now, that's a good thing!

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
zipwire @ 1/30/2003 9:24:09 PM #
And... Sony just announced in Asia definitively they will include USB On-The-Go for their "future Clie handhelds". Wonder if this means the TG50 too...

SonyEricsson P800
RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
hotpaw4 @ 1/30/2003 9:58:55 PM #
Most consumers need better battery life. Virtual Graffiti plus the bigger backlight uses 50% more power than a square display, and thus requires a chunkier battery (the NZ and the iQue are bricks compared to an m550). What the market needs is more differentiation, not more of the same. I happen to like Graffiti classic, but...

This unit could be a win if it's thin, and OS 5.

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
swatts3413 @ 1/31/2003 12:05:18 AM #
Viritual graffiti is all about screen real estate people. I want a bigger screen. I don't care if you can write anywhere on the screen with graffiti 2. I want a 320x480 slim, light handheld. I want to see more information at once, like my entire week's schedule (ala datebk5))

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
cmoney @ 1/31/2003 1:55:00 AM #
You're confusing two things: Hi-res+ and Virtual Grafitti. Hi-Res+ is all about screen real estate.

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
cbulock @ 1/31/2003 2:10:01 AM #
"With Graffitti 2 your ENTIRE screen is VG. No need for special VG screen estate. An integrated keyboard with Graffitti 2 - now, that's a good thing!"

How do you figure that Graffiti 2 supports writing anywhere on the screen? Because it's based on Jot? The Palm website says that a Graffiti area will still be required with Graffiti 2. And there will still be a more featured version of Jot that you can purchase that will amoung other things allow you to write anywhere on the screen. I believe this is the same way they do it for PPC too.

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
Rolando @ 1/31/2003 9:32:23 AM #
Virtual Grafitti isn't writing anywhere on the screen. Virtual Grafitti means Virtual Grafitti Area. The Grafitti area can appear and disappear, based on the application and/or user's wishes.

This doesn't have Virtual Grafitti or Hi-Res Plus, since the screen is square, not rectangular.

Rolando

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
robrecht @ 1/31/2003 9:46:55 PM #
Maybe there's two models, one with a thumboard and the other with VG! Maybe the VG model is solar powered so battery life will not be an issue! Maybe Captain Kirk didn't really die! It's possible! Mr. Spock came back, didn't he?

Thanks, Robrecht
RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
abhinay @ 2/2/2003 5:21:28 AM #
lol! where did kirk and spock come from? anyway, its highly unlikely sony's making two models. they hardly do?

RE: Where is the virtual grafitti?
swinginjonny @ 2/4/2003 11:42:09 AM #
It's funny, people.
Humor.
SJ33
epall @ 2/14/2003 12:54:08 PM #
I agree that a HiRes+, slim, t665c form-factor CLIE would be nice but maybe Sony doesn't think there is a market for it. As for the Graffiti area, maybe the SJ33 is the answer there. Also, maybe Sony is just releasing the TG50 and SJ33 now but in a couple of months, considering their development cycle, they will release the T-Series of our dreams.

NOOOO!!!

jho4thclie @ 1/30/2003 6:38:56 PM #
;-) I wanted my virtual graffiti No-Flip PDA. :-(

Guess I'll have to get that INCREDIBLY cool (albeit bluetooth-less) Garmin. gotta like the GPS/VG/32MB

-JWH

RE: NOOOO!!!
sonicxracer @ 1/30/2003 6:47:38 PM #
I agree. What the hell is Sony doing??? This is a huge dissapointment to me...

RE: NOOOO!!!
carioca76 @ 1/30/2003 6:49:05 PM #
my t615 is the best pda I've ever had but if this is where sony wants to go (no virtual grafitti, no 480 screen) then hello garmin!

RE: NOOOO!!!
mashoutposse @ 1/30/2003 7:03:56 PM #
The Garmin may not have a clamshell design, but it is nearly as big as an NX. I don't see the benefit of ditching the clamsheel if it isn't gonna make the device any smaller.

RE: NOOOO!!!
doctor__no @ 1/30/2003 7:11:15 PM #
I personally don't see what the problem is with the flip-top, it looks like you could just flip it around. Doesn't seem obtrusive.

Personally, I'd rather have a flip-top just so I don't scratch the screen when its in my pocket. It'll save me money from not having to buy a leather case for my PDAs.

But I do wish it came with virtual Graffiti though, but then again I don't want to end up paying $500.

RE: NOOOO!!!
ganoe @ 1/31/2003 10:49:51 AM #
> I personally don't see what the problem is with the flip-top

Because it isn't just a flip-top, it's a flip-twist-fold top.


RE: NOOOO!!!
doctor__no @ 1/31/2003 11:39:16 AM #
>>Because it isn't just a flip-top, it's a flip-twist-fold top.

Actually no it isn't. If you look at the picture there is hinge on the very top, no twist. It's a flip-top COVER, not a clamshell design like N?-series that Sony releases. So it's just flip-and-fold.

If you need more convincing, even this article states "The TG50 comes with an integrated flip cover, like the recently announced SJ33." If you look at the cover for the SJ33 you'll see it's just a piece of plastic to cover the screen.

honestly, is it that difficult to flip open a cover when you take you PDA out? Most people with PDAs even buy their own cases to protect their investment, and when you put a third-party case on it tends to become thicker and heavier.

RE: NOOOO!!!
ganoe @ 1/31/2003 1:27:40 PM #
> Actually no it isn't.

You're missing the point. The original poster wanted a virtual graffiti PDA without the NR/NX design. When the poster said they wanted vg "no-flip", they meant they did not want the NR/NX design. Of course the TG50 has a flip-cover.

RE: NOOOO!!!
jcmorganstein @ 1/31/2003 1:36:17 PM #
mashoutposse,

The stats on the Garmin device state that it's nearly an inch shorter than the NX. That sounds considerable to me. This makes it about as tall as the T615 and only a bit thicker at the top. To integrate GPS, VG, hires+, 32MB, vibrating battery, and OS5... it's seems a pretty small trade-off for such a minimal size increase.

The problem with hires+/VG AND small form factor is that there's nowhere to put buttons if the thing is too small. I have a TT right now because size matters. But, the Garmin device seems only a bit bigger with so many advantages. I might take the plunge once I actually see it up close...

-jcm

RE: NOOOO!!!
jcmorganstein @ 1/31/2003 1:36:17 PM #
mashoutposse,

The stats on the Garmin device state that it's nearly an inch shorter than the NX. That sounds considerable to me. This makes it about as tall as the T615 and only a bit thicker at the top. To integrate GPS, VG, hires+, 32MB, vibrating battery, and OS5... it's seems a pretty small trade-off for such a minimal size increase.

The problem with hires+/VG AND small form factor is that there's nowhere to put buttons if the thing is too small. I have a TT right now because size matters. But, the Garmin device seems only a bit bigger with so many advantages. I might take the plunge once I actually see it up close...

-jcm

RE: NOOOO!!!
doctor__no @ 1/31/2003 1:42:07 PM #
>You're missing the point. The original poster wanted a virtual graffiti PDA without the NR/NX design. When the poster said they wanted vg "no-flip", they meant they did not want the NR/NX design.

Right, and like I said before this new PDA is NOT in the NR/NX design. It's just a plastic cover that you flip over, the NR/NX design had the LCD screen built into the cover, and the mechanics in the other, so you had to "flip-twist-fold", like you said before. This a plastic cover like the SJ-33 or the Treo, where you just flip it open, no twisting. You could probably just break off the plastic cover without any problems other than an unattractive PDA.

RE: NOOOO!!!
inalaop @ 1/31/2003 7:11:02 PM #
I bought one of the first TRGpro's when they first hit the market a few years ago, and have been waiting to upgrade badly. I was going to get the Sony T665 but didn't up/down button design or that fact that it didn't have virtual graffiti. Recently, my TRGpro broke and I have to upgrade; I got a Tungsten. Now that I've seen the possible replacement for the T665, I glad I got the Tungsten. Sony was hot for a while, but now they are really dropping the ball with their new handhelds. Don't they hear everyone screaming for virtual graffiti in a T series. I won't mention the virtual graffiti on their NX monstosity, which comes close to defeating the whole purpose of a 'handheld' computer. The Tungsten is not perfect, but it sure comes close. With ClickStart and GraffitiAnywhere I almost never have to open the Tungsten's slider. Now that I've loaded it up with programs and just got my flip case from EBcases I very happy. True, Palm did make a big mistake by not including an MP3 player, but overall they are heading in the right direction and know what users want. If Palm ever came out a Tungsten-like handheld with virtual graffiti, 32MB ram, and a decent MP3 player, they might finally hush all the criticism people sling at them.

RE: NOOOO!!!
mashoutposse @ 2/1/2003 11:24:44 AM #
Here are the thicknesses of the Garmin, Clie NX70V, and Clie T665C:

Thickness:

Garmin: 0.8"
NX70V: 0.6875"
T665C: 0.5"

So, the Garmin manages to be *even thicker* than an NX70V, despite the NX's clamshell design and the two extra walls that it necessitates. And it's a full 75% thicker than the T-series. People have been clamoring for a non-clamshell 320x480 PDA, but I'm not sure that this is what they had in mind.

Check this pic:

http://www.palminfocenter.com/ss.asp?f=CES03/garmin_3600_3.jpg

The Garmin looks to be an excellent PDA, but it's no T-series replacement.

AHHAAA!! Sony's fills vacuum left by Treo 90!!!

gfunkmagic @ 1/30/2003 6:52:36 PM #
Well, I think Sony is finally realising the potential of a Treo 90-type device with integrated keypad!! IF the TG50 is an OS 5 ARM Clie w/BT, high rez screen, 16+ MB Ram, MSPro and etc, then this thing will be a winner!! Of course all the hard core Clie owners wanted a T-series pda w/VG, but I think the SJ series (i.e SJ33) is meant for that space. I know most users here may not like or understand this device, but a whole lot of new consumers are gonna buy this thing for sure!!

RE: AHHAAA!! Sony's fills vacuum left by Treo 90!!!
Fly-By-Night @ 1/31/2003 6:16:42 AM #
Sony could also be doing a Treo with the option of a keyboard or Graffiti PDA. Some people may prefer a keyboard; others (most of us I suspect) would prefer the same model with a larger screen area and VG.

At least, that's what I'm hoping.

FBN

-----
Ceci n'est pas une signature.

RE: AHHAAA!! Sony's fills vacuum left by Treo 90!!!
rob_skomorucha @ 1/31/2003 12:08:56 PM #
I love it. I've been waiting for such a design since buying my first 3COM Palm Pilot. My wife has the Blackberry and the integrated keyboard is good. For me, a thumbboard is more useful than Graffiti. Hopefully, there will be a sufficient number of consumers, like me, to support the TG50 niche.

RE: AHHAAA!! Sony's fills vacuum left by Treo 90!!!
UZI4U182 @ 2/3/2003 5:42:52 PM #
I think the Treo sucked because of it's bad screen and no graffiti.

--Devan-- | Email me:
UZI4U182@suscom.net
www.devanstavern.tk
www.devandeshong.tk
Current PDA: Sony CLIÉ PEG-SJ30

i kinda like it

graph @ 1/30/2003 7:11:30 PM #
i always wanted a minikeyboard builtin like the treo 90 but with 320x320. my 2c

RE: i kinda like it
Scott R @ 1/30/2003 8:02:02 PM #
I agree. Especially if this is running OS5. When the Tungsten T came out the first thing I thought was missing was a thumbboard. To me, the combination of Bluetooth and a thumbboard is a must because if you have BT, you'll probably be hooking it up to a phone and if you're hooking it up to a phone, you'll probably be doing email, and if you're doing email, a thumbboard has a big advantage over Graffiti.

My 2 cents.

Scott

RE: i kinda like it
gfunkmagic @ 1/30/2003 9:39:22 PM #
I agree here with Scott,

This device seems to be squarely targeted at T|T users who want the ability easily type sms and email via keypad. Combined with BT, the TG50 offers a nice alternative to those who prefer separate pda + phone plus added functionality of keypad.

Now the only thing left is for this pda is OS 5 as hoped, then it will definitely be interesting...

RE: i kinda like it
graph @ 1/30/2003 10:42:50 PM #
i hope its not too big and too heavy. the t665cs weight is ok but lighter is always better. I wanna keep all the features of the t665c and some additions. battery life is a question too.



the virtual wait

swatts3413 @ 1/30/2003 7:15:29 PM #
The wait for a light and slim virtual graffitti device is killing me!! I never thought I'd jump ship, but pocketpc is looking better and better. Sony was our best hope. What that heck is THIS!?!
RE: the virtual wait
Juno017 @ 1/30/2003 9:56:21 PM #
Ditto here...

RE: the virtual wait
jho4thclie @ 1/31/2003 12:26:22 AM #
I sure hope that Graffiti 2 (write anywhere) and thumboards don't eliminate the trend of hires+ screens--- I'd like to see 320x480 extend into many devices so I can CHOOSE ONE! ;-)

-JWH
RE: the virtual wait
simond @ 1/31/2003 4:50:58 AM #
Graffiti 2 is not write anywhere, that's just Jot, G2 only uses the letter recognition part of Jot and leaves Jot to do the "write anywhere" part AIUI

RE: the virtual wait
kev @ 1/31/2003 6:19:29 AM #
give them another 2 or 3 weeks and they'll release what you're looking for... you know sony, so insecure about their range that they just keep adding to it over and over.
RE: the virtual wait
markpmc @ 1/31/2003 9:43:25 AM #
I got tired of waiting. Sold my N710C and bought the Razor Zayo PPC ($350 after $50 rebate). The Zayo gives me VG. The plus side is that I'll be ready to upgrade in another 12-18 months, so I'll be able to make an intelligebt decision about which camp (Palm or PPC) to remain in once OS 6 devices are released.

markpmc

RE: the virtual wait
jho4thclie @ 1/31/2003 10:43:38 AM #
PalmSource has indicated that they plan to implement writing anywhere in future versions of G2

-JWH
RE: the virtual wait
olgiati @ 1/31/2003 5:12:16 PM #
this is blue tooth - i like it a lot

10Wtech

THUMB KEYBOARD UGH!

Chameleon78 @ 1/30/2003 7:48:05 PM #
Nope, can't buy this. I absolutely hate the thumb keyboards. Wouldn't use one if my life depended on it. This is just dumb.

Well, guess I'll by holding on to my T665c for a while longer. Unless they have another version lurking in the wings that doesn't have this ridiculous thumb keyboard!

Chameleon

RE: THUMB KEYBOARD UGH!
hkklife @ 1/30/2003 10:25:01 PM #
Yup, I hate 'em too. If I want a full size keyboard, I'll lug around a laptop. if I want a "mini" keyboard, then I'll bust out my Stowaway, or even splurge and get the Palm ultra thin keyboard. That's my definition of "mini". Thumbboards just don't even register. Any smaller than a stowaway-size layout and I'll just peck away at the onscreen keyboard (or buy some Silkyboard labels) if I can't remember the Grafitti shortcut.

I never was a huge supporter of the much ballyhooed "Palm Zen" back in the good ol' days but lately I am starting to think that there is something to be said for it...laptops are getting cheaper and cell phones are becoming more versaitle. The PDA will eventually end up getting squeezed out, and I think that adding keyboards left and right will only hasten their departure, especially for a non-wired PDA.

RE: THUMB KEYBOARD UGH!
rickyspears @ 1/31/2003 7:36:10 AM #
I used to hate thumb boards too.

One of the first peripherals that I bought was the Stowaway Keyboard for my Palm IIIx and VIIx. In certain places and times, it was very convenient, but I used Graffiti for 95% of my data entry.

When I upgraded to the Palm m515 I debated between upgrading to a new Stowaway with the universal connector or to a thumb board. I looked around at the different ThumbBoards that were available and finally purchased a Sieko ThumBoard. It only cost $20, so I figured that I didn't have much to lose. Now, I love it!

Although it doesn't stay connected to the Palm all the time, it is much smaller and lighter than the Stowaway, and much faster to clip on as well. Because of this, I get more use out of it (about 60% of my data entry). I do hate that it covers the Graffiti area, because sometimes it would be nice to get to use Graffiti in conjuction with the ThumBoard.

I at least can't say that thumbboards are "dumb" any more. They do have their place.

RE: THUMB KEYBOARD UGH!
hkklife @ 1/31/2003 9:18:01 AM #
Sorry, I should've prefaced my comments with distinguishing between Treo/Blackberry style permanent thumbboards and snap-on ones, like the Seiko and Palm i705 boards. I see nothing wrong at all with attachment mini boards--I've even considered buying the Seiko model in the past. No problems there at all. I just don't like finding a nice PDA at the price I want, with the feature set I want, but with a keyboard offered as the main (if not sole) input option. Yes,yes, I KNOW everyone will mention Jot et al. but I am talking about an out of the box default configuration here. I guess it's just having two thorns in my side--one being having to drop Grafitti after spending years mastering it, and the other being the perceived increase in the overall girth/formfactor size of newer handhelds, as they eschew a writing area in exchange for a thumboard. For years I (and many other users) bemoaned the lack of a D-pad on handhelds and it took years for Palm to finally (sorta) integrate one. I just wish that the manufacturers had listened to those sorts of consumer complaints with the same attention they paid to those that just couldn't "get" Grafitti.

RE: THUMB KEYBOARD both GREAT! & UGH!
hotpaw4 @ 1/31/2003 11:35:25 PM #
Handspring mentioned doing focus groups on this very subject. Around half the test users preferred Graffiti and didn't like the thumb-board, ** BUT ** around half the test users prefered the thumb-board.

So, if you don't like whatever, you're just in the other half.

Sony (like any big company) is trying to cover its bases (e.g. doubling its potential sales) by marketing products to both halves.

Best of both worlds
Marshall Flinkman @ 2/1/2003 10:00:18 AM #
As someone who's had 2 Graffiti units (PalmPilot Pro and Palm Vx) and now a Treo 90, I can say that you can have it both ways, more or less, with a thumbboard and a program like Newpen or Graffiti Anywhere. I find I'm alternating between the two, since I've never had a Blackberry or anything else with a thumbboard.

The only thing this arrangement won't get you, obviously, is the larger screen of the Sony clamshells.

FWIW, I got the Treo 90 because it's the lightest Palm device ever (4 oz and no case) and IIRC, the only 4 oz device on any OS with a color screen.

Boring...really not exciting at all

TrafficGeek @ 1/30/2003 8:51:57 PM #
ack...what happened? Was there a recent mass defection in their design studio? How'd stuff like this gets out onto the market?

Thumbboard blows away Graffiti

dd61999 @ 1/30/2003 8:54:48 PM #
Anybody who has ever used a blackberry knows that a thumbboard is ten times better than graffiti for writing email, text messaging, instant messaging, or even taking quick notes. Its much more accurate and faster. As more people realize this, graffiti will soon be dead.

RE: Thumbboard blows away Graffiti
qurgh @ 1/31/2003 8:51:22 AM #
I agree. I have a two-way pager with a thumb board and I could write on that thing all day long without getting thr cramps I get after a 2 hour meeting writing with graffiti. I can walk and compose message, and because it's a qwerty keyboard I don't even need to look while I write most of the time. When using my clie I have a hard time walking and writing on it and I've tried graffiti, silkyboard and a slew of other applications.

I just can't wait until I get my NZ90, walking around the apartment, chatting away, emailing and web browser over a wireless network, and it has a keyboard to make those long evenings of on IRC enjoyable. Doing that with graffiti would kill my fingers.

RE: Thumbboard blows away Graffiti
Lidocaineus @ 1/31/2003 12:55:53 PM #
Grafitti won't die anymore than the keyboard prevented the mouse from being useful. They serve two different segments of the data input hierarchy. While you can replace one with the other, they work best together (or at least with the option of).

Keyboard difference

edeab220 @ 1/30/2003 9:01:06 PM #
From my comparisons of the picture and my NR, it looks like it uses the same technology as the NR/NX keyboard, just that it looks like the placement of the keys is a little different.

So, which would technically be better? The NR/NX or the TG50? It's basiclly an NR/NX w/o VG and clamshell styling (if you don't count the fliplid.)

----------
Proud owner of...(dead) Visor, Visor Dlx, Palm VIIx, (dead) Visor Prism, and a Sony Clie NR70!!

Senior Editor at: www.pocketloft.com

RE: Keyboard difference
Palm_Otaku @ 1/31/2003 8:42:06 PM #
I hope it has one difference from the NX70V - a backlit keyboard - having used the Treo 180, NX70V and Rim950, I have become convinced that it's a required feature.

- Dan

RE: Keyboard difference
big_raji @ 1/31/2003 9:47:09 PM #
I just hope it has a dedicated row of numbers.

If it does, I'll actually trade in my NR70 for this device.

---
George W. Bush at his best!
http://raj.phangureh.com/foolme.html

I want a Sony Palm phone !

delgard @ 1/30/2003 9:14:48 PM #
When is Sony going to make a Palm phone ? I would love to have a Clie palm phone with all the bells & whistles to boot ! My wish list would include VG, 2 MP camera with flash & 2X zoom, MP3 player, bluetooth wireless, Voice recorder, Enhanced speaker, Palm OS 5, & of course the 320 x 480 High Res display !

RE: I want a Sony Palm phone !
gfunkmagic @ 1/30/2003 9:31:57 PM #
I seriously doubt Sony will EVER make a smartphone b/c of their partnership with Ericsson. Sony Ericsson is commited to Symbian as witnessed by such mobiles as P800. I think Sony would much rather prefer you buy their TG50 and t68i/P800 and connect via BT so you can send SMS for example. I hope I'm wrong though...

RE: I want a Sony Palm phone !
gfunkmagic @ 1/30/2003 9:50:27 PM #
delgard,

Checkout this story on brighthand why Sony doesn't make Palm OS Smartphones:
http://www.brighthand.com/article/Sony_Ericsson_Partnership_Survives

RE: I want a Sony Palm phone !
gilbas99 @ 1/31/2003 12:47:30 PM #
But the TREO has been a success in Europe... And the market share for Palm OS Smartphones is above predictions. I think SONY will want to make something that sells and their joint venture with Ericsson is losing big bucks right now. We'll see

RE: I want a Sony Palm phone !
Timothy Rapson @ 2/2/2003 8:05:02 AM #
I love the way you think! There was a day when we all thought our Palm Pilots could be the center of the information universe, slip into our pockets at the ready and include hardware features that others would call us lunatics for desiring.

But, look how far it has come already from the 256k (or whatever they were)originals to the range of choices we have now. From phones to video cameras, from books to music, full motion video to Web surfing, wireless to bluetooth. It is all there NOW. And the future lies right where you are suggesting.

Post like this on a potential Sony Palm Phone make my heart leap, and my mind tingle at the potential.

Now, in the old days of anonymous posting here, this would have gone off into wacky land at this point. I kinda miss that.

RE: I want a Sony Palm phone !
xolstis @ 2/2/2003 4:50:36 PM #
Yes I kinda agree that Sony will not compete against itself by launching into the smartphone market. This is of course unless they see other palmOS smartphones achieving phenomenal success and/or they're partnership with Ericsson flounders.

While I really like the concept of a smartphone, I think smartphones are still in their infancy. As simple and fast as a palm is to use I think it is still simpler to whip out a dedicated mobile to make a call compared to making one with a 'smart' phone. I mean have not used a smartphone personally so may not be qualified to judge, but was just trying to imagine if my visor prism had built in phone capabilities. Of course if u are one who checks email and browses the web a lot on your PDA, then it would be a blessing in disguise, as for me, I am in front of a PC most of the time so there just isn't much need for that.



xolstis

FCC site

useybird @ 1/30/2003 10:18:57 PM #
Where on the FCC site is all this information located?

-------------------------------
Microsoft is the root of all evil.
Right, Bill?
RE: FCC site
Mr T @ 1/31/2003 1:17:45 AM #
Here you go, there's not much to see.

http://makeashorterlink.com/?J5A425A43


The Buttons Look Like the T6XX Series....UGHH!

stringbeanie @ 1/31/2003 1:17:12 AM #
The hardware buttons look as lousy as the ones on my T615. That is one of my biggest gripes with the T-series.
An aside: since it has Bluetooth built in, it will probably be OS5. Just an educated guess!

Still waiting...

HandyMan @ 1/31/2003 2:03:21 AM #
for the OS5 T series with 320x480 screen. And I think that goes for most T series owners.

Not once did I hear anyone complain that "the T6xx is nice, if only it had a keyboard". Everybody wants VG.

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure there'll be a market for this device... it's just not what we (T665 owners) are waiting for our next upgrade.

I don't think this replaces the T665... it wouldn't be numbered TG50. The T665 repalcement should be T_60 or something like that.

RE: Still waiting...
hotpaw4 @ 1/31/2003 7:58:59 AM #
But this unit isn't targeted at current T-series owners. It looks to be targeted at current Bluetooth cell phone (t68i) owners who have a bit of Blackberry or Treo envy, but prefer to buy Sony.

The NX/NR70 are for people who want virtual graffiti.

What's with the negativity?

Edward Green @ 1/31/2003 1:11:59 PM #
I can't see what everyone's problem is. This is probably no:2 out of 11 new devices Sony will release this year, and Sony have clearly go a market in mind.

With a bluetooth phone (which cost next to nothing) this device is a great alternative to a handheld with built in wireless. Maybe there is a version without a thumboard as well that has slipped through the net 'net'?

This device seems to suggest diversification on Sony's behalf.

As for people whining about VG and a T series style device, don't hold your breath. The 320x480 display may well be one of the main differentiators for Sonys Top of the Line products.


Edward Green
--
http://www.khite.co.uk

RE: What's with the negativity?
Palm_Otaku @ 1/31/2003 8:39:28 PM #
"This is probably no:2 out of 11 new devices Sony will release this year..."

Probably 4/11: NZ90, SJ33, SJ22, TG50,... which still leaves 7 (!) additional models. Lots of space for even more differentiation -- should be interesting.

- D

Hello Palm Tungsten T

rocketman6987 @ 1/31/2003 5:30:58 PM #
I hope the keyboard model is only 1 variant of the T665C replacemnt. Maybe (hopefully) there is a virtual grafitti variant (PEG-TG50k and PEG-TG50g?) - similar to the Treo 180s (meaning with or without keyboard).

If the keyboard model is the best Sony has to offer... Hello Tungsten!

RE: Hello Palm Tungsten T
macsnjets @ 2/1/2003 5:00:30 PM #
My thoughts exactly! How much longer can one wait???

RE: Hello Palm Tungsten T
xolstis @ 2/2/2003 4:37:07 PM #
*sigh* Ppl want a 320x480 screen, without a built in thumboard, with all the current features of the current T series and OS5. IS THAT TOO MUCH TO ASK???
BAH!

xolstis
RE: Hello Palm Tungsten T
xolstis @ 2/2/2003 4:46:20 PM #
ANd with a T-series form factor.

but then again sony, like most big companies I guess just wants to squeeze as much as they can out of the market. I mean if a device had all those specs I mentioned, who would buy the SJ33? Unless the SJ33 was significantly cheaper there wold not be much reason to do so now would there?

xolstis

RE: Hello Palm Tungsten T
hotpaw4 @ 2/2/2003 7:39:22 PM #
You didn't say how much(little) battery life you would accept. A hires+ display would require 50% more power and also leave less room for the battery than the current t665c. If it only had 2 hours battery life, I wouldn't buy it.

Even the thicker heavier m550(TT) only has 3 to 6 hours of battery life (depending on backlight usage), not even enough for a cross-country airline flight.

RE: Hello Palm Tungsten T
xolstis @ 2/3/2003 12:02:13 AM #
Hehe allrites with a removable battery and at least 4hrs of time? = ). While of cos lugging an extra batt pack is not the best of solutions nor the most economical judging frm batt prices, its a viable option I suppose.

Wonder when the next technological breakthru after the LCD and LPD will come making batt life last a whole lor longer.

xolstis

RE: Hello Palm Tungsten T
AI3 @ 3/21/2003 1:23:53 PM #
I just returned my Tungsten T to CompUSA and switched it for the TG-50. At the moment I think I made a big mistake. I have always owned Palm devices but never a sony, So the interface on the Sony will take some time getting used to even though it is the same OS. My big problem at the moment is getting my TG-50 to surf the net or get my e-mail VIA my T68i. The Tungsten set up was a million times easier. It asked you who your wireless provider was (T-Mobile) and it would connect to the phone through BT. After it connected with the phone it would than connect to the T-Mobile GPRS netwrok. The TG-50 does not even have T-Mobile as an option, Only dial up accounts such as AT&T. The TG-50 will connect with the T68i it just wont link up to the GPRS. Does anyone know how to do this? Please let me know so that I can have my e-mails back. Thanks

PDAphone or PhonePDA?

xolstis @ 2/2/2003 4:56:17 PM #
Just trying to get your opinion ppl. I believe that the PDA and the handphone will one day be one device. I mean there are such things around currently of course(though I personally don't think any of those devices will satisfy me as being either a PDA or a phone) but what I am saying is that ONE DAY, all PDAs will be a phone as well to make information on demand an easier thing.

And from the way I look at it there are 2 ways this is happening. PDAs are starting to incorporate phone features as witnessed first in the i705, communicator series and other smartphones. And the other side of the coin is of course that phones are getting more and more PDA like starting with simple PIM features, reminders etc etc and now we have the symbian based phones.

My question is which side do you think will prevail? The PDA-phone transition or the Phone-PDA transition? Hope I am making sense here LOL.

xolstis

RE: PDAphone or PhonePDA?
Fly-By-Night @ 2/3/2003 6:19:17 AM #
From research I recently carried out, it seems people want modular solutions -- a small (think T68i) phone 'server', linked to a very thin small (and collapsible?) screen, acting as a thin client to the phone and applications running remotely over wireless broadband. Link this to a headset and you have an all in one solution. Users can mix and match units; and add keyboards, bigger screens, small projectors, etc. as and when. These devices can work together to replace phones, PDAs, laptops, etc.

This of course does not mean there is no place for all in one 'smartphones'. My general feeling is that the phone manufacturers will prevail in this market. Their designs are more adventurous, product cycle faster, delivery channels better and ability to discount (by selling bandwidth too via network operators) mean Palm, HP/Compaq, Toshiba, etc. will be very much niche players. 417 million handsets were sold last year, of which over 37% (154 mill) were Nokia (http://www.hitech-news.com/news/TechnologyNews/5.09.02.tech.gmp.htm) -- compared to 20 million Palms since their inception! A Palm/Nokia battle would make the Palm/PPC battle seem trivial.

So there you go; just my thoughts.

FBN

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Ceci n'est pas une signature.

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