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Comments on: HP Power 48 Calculator Emulator

A Hewlett-Packard 48SX, 48GX, and now 49G calculator application has been released for high resolution devices. Power48 is a free, full featured Palm OS based HP 48 series calculator emulator. The app is now fully OS 5 compatible with an ARM native core.
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WOW!

i2oadi2unnei2 @ 4/9/2003 7:15:51 PM #
Now that is some serious calculator! Any idea how much it costs?...

...|3eep |3eep!!...

RE: WOW!
naturefreak85 @ 4/9/2003 7:23:21 PM #
GPL licesence means that IT IS FREE for distribution, if you want to pay the developer you can but he does not say you have to, but he would appreciate it if you do, i feel this is worth a fair amount of money, so i gave him 30 i use it in all my engineering classes, LESS TO CARRY AROUND

RE: WOW!
dhchung @ 4/9/2003 7:24:35 PM #
It is said in the article that it's free.
also, it's not the only choice and may not even be the best choice for serious calculation. PowerOne calculator supports color graphing for instance.

RE: WOW!
naturefreak85 @ 4/9/2003 7:28:43 PM #
yea but this is an allowed calculator for testing and powerone my teachers dont like, this way they are used to it, here is the link to the site http://power48.mobilevoodoo.com/

RE: WOW!
aaronchow @ 4/10/2003 2:47:59 AM #
I don't think you have any idea of what HP 48 series calculator is. It is specifically designed for engineers / engineering students, and it's so powerful that most people will unlikely know how to use it. My brother used to own a real one that costs him $100+, and I sometimes use it to do vector calculations.

For PowerOne Calculator, this is more tended to be a TI-83 calculator that you can plot graph and analyze it.

So, in simple words, these are completely two different calculators with two narrow audiences.

"I doubt, therefore I might be."

RE: WOW!
alee @ 4/10/2003 8:44:39 AM #
Agreed... the HP48 series calculators are _the_ engineering calculator. I paid well over $200 for my first HP48 calculator years ago, and still use it. There are plenty of reasons to still use the real HP48 calculator (rugged, tactile feedback on the buttons, external cards), but running Power48 on a TT makes calculations significantly faster than a real HP48.

I can't really offer as many good things about the HP49 though... I think those calculators took a step backwards in build quality and layout (no large ENTER key).

RE: WOW!
dhchung @ 4/10/2003 2:34:26 PM #
you are not the only ones who know how powerful HP48 is. The key is whether you need those functions, how easy to use the calculator. As you said, not everbody knows how to use HP48, so I guess you are saying HP48 is not as good as PowerOne in some ways. Also, PowerOne Graph is designed for palm. HP48 is not. So in terms of how convinence it is to use the graphic calculator, I think PowerOne win over HP48 a lot.
I am not saying that HP48 is not good in my first post. But you just don't need a 1GHz CPU with 512mb ram on your pda. Get what I mean? HP48 is not a good choice for most people.
Sorry, I don't mean to have a confrontation here.

RE: WOW!
slinger @ 4/10/2003 4:51:44 PM #
Don't worry - I don't think there's any confrontation going on! Just a reasonable discussion...

As it happens, I agree with you. Power48 isn't a good choice for a lot of people. My original reason for writing the program was just that I loved using the 48GX and wanted to have that capability on my new NR70 at the time that it came out. The project just kind of ballooned from there...

Anyway, that's why Power48 is free and not a commercial product. If it suits your needs or you are HP RPN fan then it's for you. If not, there are other great Palm calculators out there with less hardware requirements. The choice is yours!

-Robert Hildinger, developer Power48


RE: WOW!
csandifor @ 4/10/2003 7:19:10 PM #
I was an engineering student 13 years ago and even though I now only focus on software development I still use my 12 year old HPSX as my standard calculator. After spending countless days and nights with that thing, I can use it with my eyes closed. About a year ago I searched the web for a palm based emulation of my trusty HP without much luck. Now my HP48SX will follow me wherever my PDA goes. Great job!

Narrow User Demographic

MSTCrowT @ 4/10/2003 12:26:12 AM #
Acccording to the site, I'd need a Cliť with at least 320x320 resolution, 16-bit color, 33MHz CPU, 8MB storage space (does the program take up the entire memory space?) and a Memory Stick for storing RAM/ROM images. This is a very narrowly targeted user demographic. Many, if not most of us (regarding Palm user's in general, I'm sure PIC users are a bit more up to date, budget and importance allowing), are using older Palm units that are still grayscale, standard 160x160 resolution, possibly not a 33MHz chip, and of course Palm and TRG units don't have Memory Stick slots. I myself have a Palm Vx, overclocked to 28MHz, that works quite well for AvantGo, PIM, DTG and SimCity, thank you.

RE: Narrow User Demographic
Davy Fields @ 4/10/2003 12:48:38 AM #
Well, that's not their problem. It's progress... just like you can't do HDTV on an old set, you can't run programs like this on an old palm. Can you imagine trying to cram all the buttons that are shown in the screenshot, along with the names of what they did on a 160x160 grayscale device? It's not feasible... the Clie NX70 has 6 times the screen space, as well as 65k colors.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be nice to have a calculator like this on an old palm, but if it would cripple it to fit it on a III-series palm, what's the point, really?

The whole reason to upgrade to high-res is for programs that actually use the extra space to display more info, not to just look at sharper text.... this is why people get high-res screens.

Plus, it's free. It's not like the guy is targeting the mass market for product exposure, he's making a product for anyone who wants it.

Not to shoot you down, here, this sounds negative. There's tons of other great calculator programs, http://www.freewarepalm.com/calculator/calculator.shtml
has tons of great free ones... check it out.

-Davy Fields
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Palm_OS_5/

RE: Narrow User Demographic
VisorMiser @ 4/10/2003 7:39:40 AM #
This is decisively not for older Palms.

the VisorMiser
_______________________
Where will ya be when ya get where you're goin'?
RE: Narrow User Demographic
slinger @ 4/10/2003 11:23:32 AM #
The heavy device requirements have always been the biggest complaint regarding Power48, and while I can understand the frustration for older Palm device users, I make no apologies for the requirements. The nature of emulation makes high-powered hardware an absolute necessity. In all honesty, the 33MHz minimum CPU requirement is stretching the limits of useability already - anything less and you'd be able to do the calculations in your head faster.

Another thing to keep in mind is that Power48 was not created by a company with lots of resources to put behind it. It was created by one person - me - in my spare time. I simply don't have time to go back and try to support the myriad combinations of PalmOS devices.

My goal with Power48, and for all of my future programs, is to create software that utilizes the capabilities of the latest and greatest hardware; software that is not limited by constraints of backward compatibility. The new OS5 PDAs have vast barely tapped potential that I want to explore fully, and unfortunately this means I have to draw the line of compatiblity far closer to the bleeding edge than the decaying edge.

As for the narrow user demographic, I think you might be surprised to find that it's not so narrow anymore. The vast majority of people interested in Power48 have a device that's compatible with it. There are a few who don't and have written to tell me as much, and to those users I am sorry for the inconvenience, but this is the price of progress.

Regards,
-Robert Hildinger, developer Power48

RE: Narrow User Demographic
ritchie321 @ 4/10/2003 12:02:24 PM #
It seems like the demographic is even a little smaller: those with valid licenses for the HP48 ROM's? Isn't that simply the people who already own one of the calculators. Isn't this product stepping a little bit over the edge in that regard?
RE: Narrow User Demographic
river88888888 @ 4/16/2003 12:34:11 AM #
I can understand the problem with such a huge calculator. If you check out the link below for a great calculator for about $19.95 and a full license for only a fraction of the size, then I believe you will be pleasantly be surprised. I would like such a calculator if I were still in school... alas, I have graduated, so this little one works fine for me.

http://www.palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?sid=281671E5-7591-4B23-8218A398121CC31E&prodID=3515

Hey, it's my Bible and personal journal in one neat little package... now that's pretty cool.

RE: Narrow User Demographic
Nechasin @ 4/22/2003 3:07:25 PM #
The reason for the requirement that the user already own the rights to the ROM's is because the ROM's belong to HP and you cannot use the ROM's unless you paid for them.

Your mind resembles the wings of an Ostrich, It enables you to Run, though NOT to Soar! -- Thomas Babington, Lord Macaulay

great and needed innovation......need the business calcs

palmgator @ 4/10/2003 8:52:26 AM #
we know there area alot of other calcs out there guys, but I think the main point is that it emulates the HP. I train people in the real estate industry and during all training we are required to teach specific HP key strokes. I would love to see the HP business calcs emulated for palm, I carry several calcs on my palm, but still need to carry the HP for certain calcs and training......

Training novice sales and real estate professionals on effective palm use!
RE: great and needed innovation......need the business calcs
Patrick @ 4/11/2003 8:19:24 PM #
The KK-12C from http://www.kktechnologies.com is a pretty fair emulation of the HP-12C. It supports the full instruction set and programming function. It even allows you to save/load programs to files on your Palm.


patrick...thanks Ive been looking for that for years!!!!!!!!
palmgator @ 4/11/2003 9:29:21 PM #
I'll give it a try

Training sales and real estate professionals on effective palm use!
RE: great and needed innovation......need the business calcs
river88888888 @ 4/16/2003 12:48:53 AM #
I can understand the problem with needing an HP calculator. If you check out the link below for a great calculator for about $19.95, then I believe you will be pleasantly be surprised. I would like such a calculator if I were still in school... alas, I have graduated, so this little one works fine for me, especially with the financial calculations that I can do. I hope this helps.

http://www.palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?sid=281671E5-7591-4B23-8218A398121CC31E&prodID=3515

Hey, it's my Bible and personal journal in one neat little package... now that's pretty cool.

Excellent Work

maven @ 4/10/2003 10:40:43 AM #
Great implementation, and great job on this. I had considered doing a TI emulator myself, but I think this one has the HP down perfectly. Keep up the good work!

RE: Excellent Work
pistache @ 4/10/2003 12:42:11 PM #
Yes, great ... but maven, please, think again about a TI-92 emulator ...
I've switched from a HP48Gx to a TI-92 years ago, this one rocks for formal maths ... I still use it for my R&D work.
Anyway I'm happy to play again with RPN and perhaps I'll be able to find games I coded for the HP :-)

HP-41CV Palm Emulator

kpr @ 4/10/2003 1:31:19 PM #
There is also a very nice HP-41CV emulator at http://www.palmgear.com/software/showsoftware.cfm?prodID=40123

It supports the various HP-41 series ROM modules and you can input programs into Palm's Memo pad.

This calculator Rulz!

pistos @ 4/10/2003 1:41:40 PM #
Awesome job!

I am an engineer, and this is the best calculator I have ever seen on a Palm PDA, for a professional engineer or scientist. The only other calculator I have ever considered using is MathUPro by Creative Creek. (I have tried most of those available.)

I have used both algebraic and RPN calculators for years, and I continue to come back to RPN again and again. It is so much more efficient and intuitive (once you learn it) than the algebraic method. I think it is a shame that RPN has gone out of style with so many, and it is increasingly hard to find RPN calculators, real and virtual.


RE: This calculator Rulz!
worfworf @ 4/10/2003 2:40:11 PM #
I bought the 48sx like 12 years ago for $240. I consider it one of the best purchases I have ever made. It got me thru. so many engineering/math/science classes. One of my favorite features is doing matrix calculations, it does 6x6 simultaneous equations in no time!
Kinda funny, we "nerds" made fun of other engineering students that didn't have one and gave them peer pressure to buy one :).
Btw, once you get used to an HP, going back and using a normal calculator seems so idiotic.

Did you know you can even program it to play sounds (like 440hz) or do animations, play tetris, etc, etc. :D


RE: This calculator Rulz!
justauser @ 4/10/2003 10:05:42 PM #
I must concur with the approval of this application. I couldnít believe my eyes when I installed it on my TT. I have had my HP48G sitting beside my various Palm devices for 5 years now. AT LAST I am now happy to toss the HP aside. I canít wait to show it to my PPC buddies Ė I know at least one engineer who will be envious (I trust there isnít an equivalent PPC app). Congratulations to the Power48 team. Best app I have downloaded for a long time.

RE: This calculator Rulz!
web85705 @ 4/11/2003 6:30:54 AM #
This 48GX integration in the Palm PDA is ingenious! I travel alot with my subnotebook computer and HP48GX that I use as my pda. There are basic software programs similar to Palm for HP that allows me to store phone numbers, accounts, to do list, games, and other basic functions of Palm OS that it was not necessary for me to change to PDA yet. But now, I can look forward to replacing my handy HP that I had for over 10yrs with this emulator. What I'd like about the HP 48GX that I'm used to is that it has RPN and the stacking of numbers on the display, and I know where all the buttoms and functions are. This ease of use of 48GX made it difficult to let it go and always in my pack whereever I travel. But now, I'm replacing with the New Garmin IQUE. Thanks Robert for this insightful program.
RE: This calculator Rulz!
web85705 @ 4/11/2003 6:30:54 AM #
This 48GX integration in the Palm PDA is ingenious! I travel alot with my subnotebook computer and HP48GX that I use as my pda. There are basic software programs similar to Palm for HP that allows me to store phone numbers, accounts, to do list, games, and other basic functions of Palm OS that it was not necessary for me to change to PDA yet. But now, I can look forward to replacing my handy HP that I had for over 10yrs with this emulator. What I'd like about the HP 48GX that I'm used to is that it has RPN and the stacking of numbers on the display, and I know where all the buttoms and functions are. This ease of use of 48GX made it difficult to let it go and always in my pack whereever I travel. But now, I'm replacing with the New Garmin IQUE. Thanks Robert for this insightful program.
RE: This calculator Rulz!
BlueAnon @ 4/12/2003 1:49:48 AM #
>>>I must concur with the approval of this application. I couldnít believe my eyes when I installed it on my TT. I have had my HP48G sitting beside my various Palm devices for 5 years now. AT LAST I am now happy to toss the HP aside. I canít wait to show it to my PPC buddies Ė I know at least one engineer who will be envious (I trust there isnít an equivalent PPC app). Congratulations to the Power48 team. Best app I have downloaded for a long time.<<<<

ehrrr.......
HP48G emulator for PPC came out about two years ago including the HP49G when most Palm user was still amrveling over m500. And please look at the alternate screen configuration, there are 4 alternate for HP49G. You don't have to squint on 0.8 inch virtual display. Try landscape instead.
http://web.jet.es/leobueno/

The race now is to port TI-89. It's about 2-3 months away from first alpha.

other advance computational tool
http://www.rainer-keuchel.de/wince/maxx.html
http://www.saltire.com/xpander.html
http://www.symbolictools.de/public/pocketconsole/
applications/scm/index.htm

Who's got this kind of time?

WmFlan @ 4/11/2003 12:42:26 PM #
Sure looks nice on my T|T, but it takes 20s - for each emulator! - to boot before you can tap 2 + 2 (excuse me, 2enter2+): non-starter for me. I'll stick with the doinky B/W freewares.

The empty barrel makes the most noise
RE: Who's got this kind of time?
slinger @ 4/11/2003 1:17:56 PM #
Actually, I did some startup / shutdown time measurements on a friend's T|T, and got the following:

48SX: 1 sec startup / 2 sec shutdown
48GX: 1.5 sec startup / 2.5 sec shutdown
49G: 4.5 sec startup / 5 sec shutdown

Perhaps the SD card you are using is particularly slow.

-Robert Hildinger, developer Power48


RE: Who's got this kind of time?
pistos @ 4/11/2003 1:28:23 PM #
The other thing that he probably has failed to do is to turn off "verbose startup messaging" in the general preferences for Power48. That made a big difference for me.

RE: Who's got this kind of time?
joep @ 5/24/2003 12:36:48 AM #
Love the idea of the 49G emulator. Am a physics student, so use the functionality of a TI-89 every day, including symbolic integration. (although it doesn't handle the form x*exp(x) and Gaussians).

Used to use a 15C, so RPN is no problem.

Have a Clie SJ33, so have room for a memory stick, but don't own any.

Would love to see a version that loads into on-board memory.

Any chance of that?

Awesome program!

Joe Prizzi

tried on T615C

spaceman @ 4/11/2003 10:51:44 PM #
Installs OK. Needs about 3mb free ram to run. Crashed hard. Had to do hard reset and restore to get Clie to reboot.

RE: tried on T615C
Robotica1 @ 4/12/2003 8:35:37 AM #
spaceman,

I had to do a hard reset too. I've since removed the emulator. I'm not sure that I've succesfully removed the ROM image. If I could get Avantgo to run well off the SD card I would have 3MB free. This is another example of the limitations imposed by the skimpy 14 MB useable RAM that Palm gives us.

David

RE: tried on T615C
amuthan @ 4/14/2003 5:53:24 PM #
I am still getting the "Bandwidth Limit Exceeded" message. Is there any alternate site to get a copy of this program
(other than http://power48.mobilevoodoo.com/)

Thanks,
'a plamer'

RE: tried on T615C
stillaresident @ 4/17/2003 3:00:35 AM #
Hi,

Could anybody direct me to any other links hosting this power48 download? I'm receiving server messages stating bandwidth limits are prohibiting site access for the download.

BTW, IMHO, Hewlett-Packard calculators are truly the best. I'm not an engineer, but had been using my HP-41CX since I was 12 years old and my HP-48SX since I was 20 years of age. (I'm 31 now.) I was even able to obtain an old, working HP67 with the LED (vs. LCD) display and built-in magnetic data card reader!

These calculators are useful for just about anybody who currently benefits from the use of *any* programmable calculator.

Now, if only I can download the power48 application!

Looking for download?

JeffL @ 4/19/2003 7:55:37 PM #
Power48 [url="http://l2lan81.no-ip.info:81/pdalive/power48_090b.zip"]Download[/url]

Latest Version :)

JeffL, PDALive.com moderator and writer

RE: Looking for download?
rjarrell @ 4/22/2003 10:41:56 PM #
Do you have the version for the Tungsten T OS 5? The version I just downloaded is only compatible with the Sony.

Unable to download Power48

rjarrell @ 4/22/2003 10:11:35 PM #
Can anyone help me out by allowing me to download the program from someone's FTP site? Unable to log onto the main site due to bandwith problems. Must be a popular place. Thanks.

that answer on the screen is WRONG!!! hahaha

drew22 @ 7/25/2003 8:17:23 PM #
yeah the definite integral of cos(x) with lower and upper bounds 0 and 1 equals the sin(1) or about .84147 radiansÖ48.21 degrees. Nowhere near 2.5478 radians. Great advertisement, sold me on this purchase. : )

RE: that answer on the screen is WRONG!!! hahaha
ryebrye @ 12/25/2003 5:35:38 PM #
The image is not showing the problem and then the answer. What it is showing is the input of a standard HP calculator. It's in RPN - the number that the guy was putting in was for another thing...

The bigger text on an HP is what you are inputing - the smaller text is on the stack... I think he's showing how it is really like an HP calculator.

I specifically upgraded my Palm - and this program was one of the main reasons I did it. Now I don't have to lug my HP everywhere - just my palm.

i want it

hat_sepsut @ 9/6/2003 2:48:45 PM #
i want it what do i have to do

RE: i want it
cadmaster59 @ 8/1/2004 3:12:02 PM #
go to power48.mobilevoodoo.com to download.
works great in palm nx70 and others

power 48

cadmaster59 @ 8/1/2004 3:13:52 PM #
works great, if I could just get some of the applications I already have on my 48, then I could sell the HP. I am in civil engineering and could use the emulation for applications like traverse, cogo, vert curve, hydrology and others.

Any programers want to make some cash? I have tried to contact Robert Hildinger (original programmer of this great product) but it has gone unanswered.

cestockton@everestkc.net

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