MobileInfocenter

Comments on: palmOne Raises Q2 Revenue Outlook

There is a good financial piece in the Dow Jones Business News that talks about palmOne's heightened financial expectations following the PalmSource spin-out and Handspring acquisition. The company now expects to break even in its fiscal Q2.
Return to Story - Permalink

Article Comments

 (44 comments)

The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. PalmInfocenter is not responsible for them in any way.
Please Login or register here to add your comments.

Comments Closed Comments Closed
This article is no longer accepting new comments.

Down

At least....

momon526 @ 11/9/2003 2:15:06 PM #
Yup! am the first! anyway, at least the spin-off works...

Please Think Before Typing

Hippocrates @ 11/9/2003 3:24:25 PM #
480,000 Treo 600 shipped in September and October.

That's not a bullish statement - it's a bullsh**tish statement. It's a typo added to "creative" press releasing. Let's see, Sony Ericsson sold 1,000,000 P800 in a year or so and little Handspring miraculously is able to get half a million Treo 600 out in two months? Yeah right. How do you think a company that has lost boatloads of cash for several years could even bankroll the manufacturing costs for half a million phones? (Pretend each phone costs Handspring $200 to have produced. Simple grade school math: $200 x 500,000 = $100,000,000. Sure.)

They may have had 50,000 phones produced, but only a tiny fraction of those have been sold so far.

Palm has used some pretty "creative" accounting in its statements. Ask youself if those (unsold to consumers) Treo 600 that were shipped to wireless carriers were included in the quarter's "profit" column. So if they don't "sell" any more Treo 600 to carriers for the next six months (as the carriers gradually sell this inventory), what will happen to profits in the next two quarters?


Don't believe everything you read. And THINK before spewing out total nonsense. Please.

RE: Please Think Before Typing
Nebrie @ 11/9/2003 3:51:04 PM #
That's exactly what they said. They shipped half a million units not sold half a million units. It's the only hard number they have. If they wanted sales numbers, they would have to poll retailers and guestimate. Almost every company I've seen that sells primarily through retail channels uses shipped not sold.

RE: Please Think Before Typing
Konstantin @ 11/9/2003 3:57:01 PM #
And theughleethrut strikes again.


Looks like there some people that cant wait to start writing bool shee it every time they feel themself without selfesteem

Why is that happening ???

RE: Please Think Before Typing
Hippocrates @ 11/9/2003 4:11:36 PM #
That's exactly what they said. They shipped half a million units not sold half a million units. It's the only hard number they have.

I'll bet you $480,000 that those numbers are wrong. Do you think Handspring could have sold over $100,000,000 worth of equipment in two months? What were their sales in all of 2002? Less tan $200,000,000. It doesn't add up. Don't be so gullible.

Ska

RE: Please Think Before Typing
Konstantin @ 11/9/2003 5:53:27 PM #
Hyppo you are sooo cool how come no one is worshiping you for your AMAZING skills ^o^ ^_^ ^0^

Keep up expressing youself here so I can take care of you. Thank you for the books You are so nice
Hug theughleethrut

Hippocrates: Please Read Before Replying
I. M. Anonymous @ 11/9/2003 11:09:02 PM #
That's exactly what they said. They shipped half a million units not sold half a million units. It's the only hard number they have.

I'll bet you $480,000 that those numbers are wrong. Do you think Handspring could have sold over $100,000,000 worth of equipment in two months? What were their sales in all of 2002? Less tan $200,000,000. It doesn't add up. Don't be so gullible.

Ska
---------------------------------------------------
Don't think you are smarter than everybody else.

RE: Please Think Before Typing
abhinay @ 11/9/2003 11:40:42 PM #
In case you didn't realise after all this...
Shipping is different from Selling... they didn't sell 400,000, they shipped 400,000. Whether they're sold or not wasn't mentioned

RE: Please Think Before Typing
frauen1 @ 11/10/2003 9:06:31 AM #
HandSpring has been hyping the Treo 600 for months, and I bet you they were also manufacturing a ton of these units. 480,000 is a reasonable figure.

Others are right - the vendor ships the units to outlets (Sprint, Cingular, etc.) who then have to sell it to customers. The Treo has gotten a lot of good press, and I've seen a lot of them out in the public.

Look at the Nokia N-Gage - Nokia has shipped 400,000 units. Now also look at the sales figures - people haven't bought many of those 400,000 N-Gages (they know what it is when they see it, probably...). It's been out about as long as the Treo and is a good illustration of the difference between shipping and selling units.

RE: Please Think Before Typing
hoodoo @ 11/10/2003 9:52:27 AM #
"(Pretend each phone costs Handspring $200 to have produced. Simple grade school math: $200 x 500,000 = $100,000,000. Sure.)"

Let's pretend! Although I have no idea how much the 600 or any electronic device costs to produce, I would highly doubt it's $200. Probably more like $20.

RE: Please Think Before Typing
twalk @ 11/10/2003 4:30:26 PM #
It's definitely more than $20. The screen alone probably cost them $40. I've got pretty good knowledge about how much these parts cost, and my guess is it's somewhere between $100 and $125.

Palm/HS doesn't need to put up $50M+ to make these devices either. There are a lot of tricks that you can play with cash flow to float enough so you can do this with a fraction of that amount.


RE: Please Think Before Typing
EdH @ 11/10/2003 7:30:22 PM #
Is it possible they sold contracts to sell 480,000 of these things over a period of time with the carriers? Given the cash situation of both companies, I too highly doubt that they've already manufactured and sold to distributors (shipped) nearly half a mil. units.

RE: Please Think Before Typing
phalanx @ 11/11/2003 2:50:46 AM #
It's a typo first showing up in reuter headlines. It's actually 48,000 based on the Q&A session of the last week PalmOne investor briefing.

You can hear the web broadcast archieve in Palmone.com investor relationship section. It's section II, Q&A, very last part.

Let's jsut say there is no way HS can ship 480K unit. HTC sold 400K SPV for the entire 2003, and they are selling double the rate of treo 300. And HS can ship 480K unit in 2 under 2 months? Nokia will go bankrupt if they do.

RE: Please think before reprinting more Palm press releases
Hippocrates @ 11/11/2003 4:40:46 AM #
Let's pretend! Although I have no idea how much the 600 or any electronic device costs to produce, I would highly doubt it's $200. Probably more like $20.


If you really think the Treo 600 costs only $20 to produce, you really have no concept of the realities of manufacturing. Think about it: Wireless radio, SD, digital camera, keyboard, metal case, color screen. All for $20. How droll.

It costs Palm that much in shipping costs alone to get these to their customers.

RE: Please Think Before Typing
hoodoo @ 11/12/2003 11:04:10 AM #
Quote - If you really think the Treo 600 costs only $20 to produce, you really have no concept of the realities of manufacturing. Think about it: Wireless radio, SD, digital camera, keyboard, metal case, color screen. All for $20. How droll.

Don't worry, I wasn't necessarily trying to be funny. I qualified my statement by saying I didn't actually know how much it would cost, but I admit I was trying to exaggerate the point in the other direction.

It doesn;t really matter now that we see the number is 48,000, which makes more sense. :)


Company-related news items

Strider_mt2k @ 11/10/2003 9:39:46 AM #
Does any company ever release a news item saying they're in trouble, or that the outlook ISN'T good?


RE: Company-related news items
frauen1 @ 11/10/2003 10:44:06 AM #
Yes - it's amazing what a little SEC oversight might drive a company to do... ;)

RE: Company-related news items
Admin @ 11/10/2003 11:45:41 AM #
the article is not based on a company issued news release. It comes from their latest figures and financial expectations.

-Ryan

RE: Company-related news items
Strider_mt2k @ 11/10/2003 3:34:03 PM #
While I can't say that we've never seen negative news of this type, I think you'd have to agree that we see FAR more stories like this than anything stating things are bad for a comany.



I believe the figure is 48,000

mes700 @ 11/11/2003 4:15:32 PM #
I was at the palmOne Finanal Analyst Day presentation. While I do not have my notes, I thought I heard Judy Brunner say they shipped 48,000 units of the Treo 600.

Michael Steinberg
New Eng Palm User Group - Boston
http://www.nepug.org

RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
phalanx @ 11/11/2003 4:45:06 PM #
Not to worry, the 480K number will stay, and PIC will quote itself in the future repeatedly pointing to this number as if PSRC has gain enormous market share and went unrecorded by statistic.
RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
Admin @ 11/12/2003 9:45:20 AM #
Ska, shut up and stop spreading your lies and false information. How dare you criticize my editorial practices, when you so often use lies, false information and slander to prove your own so called "points."

The figure was misquoted in the original article I linked to and have now made the correction. I was unaware there was an error.

Ska aka Hippocrates is a troll and liar
Admin @ 11/12/2003 11:37:26 AM #
I realize my comments above may seem a little harsh to anyone unfamiliar with the situation, so let me explain...

this user "Ska" aka BlueX, Hippocrates, phalanx, etc... has numerous accounts on PIC that he uses to spread outright lies and misinformation about the handheld industry. He is a known troll, and consistently has to resort to slander and inane posting.

Why, i have no idea, but this person has been doing it for over 2 years now and myself and many PIC readers are _very_ sick of it. It is a waste of my time to moderate your crap and you pollute the PalmInfocenter comment boards and forums.

This is your last warning to leave for good or stop posting, before the situation gets serious.

-Ryan

RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
phalanx @ 11/12/2003 12:34:16 PM #
1. I only have one account at one time.
2. what you called lies are available publicly to check.
3. I only react to BS, never start one.
4. If you think the numbers of people who react to bogus information as just one person or don't think Palm is shooting straight, I can't help you there. It's paranoia.
RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
mikecane @ 11/12/2003 1:05:00 PM #
I wish it were possible to definitely link ska to MS's payroll. It'd be a very nice lawsuit.

RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
mikecane @ 11/12/2003 1:05:54 PM #
Then again... if we can link ska to *anyone's* payroll and his posts here to *that* company's PC, that'd also make a very nice lawsuit.

RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
Admin @ 11/12/2003 1:46:46 PM #
Big Brother is watching you!
RE: I believe the figure is 48,000 - RELAX, everyone.
Hippocrates @ 11/12/2003 2:21:28 PM #
This is your last warning to leave for good or stop posting, before the situation gets serious.

-Ryan



RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
phalanx @ 11/12/2003 12:34:16 PM

1. I only have one account at one time.
2. what you called lies are available publicly to check.
3. I only react to BS, never start one.
4. If you think the numbers of people who react to bogus information as just one person or don't think Palm is shooting straight, I can't help you there. It's paranoia.


RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
Admin @ 11/12/2003 1:46:46 PM

Big Brother is watching you!


Oh dear!

For the record, ska is not Hippocrates. As much as you may dislike ska/phalanx's posts, there is truth to several of of his/her points. If you disagree and are capable of debating, simply deconstruct their arguments.

Losing your cool and name calling is what people that have lost an argument often do.


RE: I believe the figure is 48,000 - RELAX, everyone.
Hippocrates @ 11/12/2003 2:21:28 PM #
This is your last warning to leave for good or stop posting, before the situation gets serious.

-Ryan



RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
phalanx @ 11/12/2003 12:34:16 PM

1. I only have one account at one time.
2. what you called lies are available publicly to check.
3. I only react to BS, never start one.
4. If you think the numbers of people who react to bogus information as just one person or don't think Palm is shooting straight, I can't help you there. It's paranoia.


RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
Admin @ 11/12/2003 1:46:46 PM

Big Brother is watching you!


Oh dear!

For the record, ska is not Hippocrates. As much as you may dislike ska/phalanx's posts, there is truth to several of of his/her points. If you disagree and are capable of debating, simply deconstruct their arguments.

Losing your cool and name calling is what people that have lost an argument often do.


RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
twocents @ 11/12/2003 4:26:18 PM #
"RE: I believe the figure is 48,000 - RELAX, everyone.
Hippocrates @ 11/12/2003 2:21:28 PM

For the record, ska is not Hippocrates. "

Did you forget to switch accounts when you wrote this or are you actually using yourself as a reference? :)

RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
abosco @ 11/12/2003 6:52:03 PM #
>>If you disagree and are capable of debating, simply deconstruct their arguments.

If only this were the case. Seeing as how you're relatively new, hippocrates, I'll let you in on a little secret. You see, ska isn't normal. Period. You prove him wrong, he won't give a damn. He'll pick something else to ramble on about. In every comparison thread, he is there. In every "What should I choose?" between two definitive Palm OS models, ska will bring up some inane PPC and talk about how it can do WMA while Palm is still stuck on MP3 and Ogg, even if the original thread creator hasn't mentioned anything in the least about multimedia. Honestly, there are way too many examples of trolling this 'guy' has done. If you want to find some proof, just search any "H1910 vs TT" or "Palm vs PPC" thread. Actually, search ANY thread. He's probably there with almost 3000 posts under 15 names. I can't remember the exact figures, but I actually spent a few minutes about a month ago to recall all the ID's I've positively identified as ska, and calculated up the post counts. It's startling how much time can be spent on such an idiotic campaign! You'd think he would get bored of it after a while, but no, he keeps right on going. I would not be totally surprised if there was some tangible proof of this guy being attached in some way to Microsoft.

I remember hearing a site admin taking a troll on his site to court to force him off. Ska, I'd recommend discontinuing your trolling before one of these site admins that you so graciously torment decides they want to IP Nuke your ass.

-Bosco
NX80v + Wifi + BT + T616

RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
Gekko @ 11/12/2003 7:23:54 PM #
yes, too harsh. but it's your site and you can do what you want. I think it's all harmless debate and I think it's good to see someone argue the other side. We are all intelligent enough here to check the facts. This is just a technology discussion, not religion or politics or world peace. Nobody should take this stuff so seriously or personally.


RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
abosco @ 11/12/2003 7:35:27 PM #
Alright, in order to simplify what I mean by ska, I think an apt analogy would be a person going to see one particularly well-known comedian just for the sake of constantly heckling them, and doing it for years.

I don't know about you, Gekko, but when I first started visiting forums, I thought a post count was an accurate representation of that person's opinion and/or reliability. While I soon learned this was not the case, there are many instances where unsuspecting new members asked for advice, and ska came in polluting the thread. This is not a simple representation of another viable option. The way he presents it is true misinformation. It's blatantly obvious he makes baseless accusations about the capabilities of Palm OS.

-Bosco
NX80v + Wifi + BT + T616

I believe the figure is 480 (Rebuttal by Ska Smith, Esq.)
Hippocrates @ 11/12/2003 10:30:46 PM #
"RE: I believe the figure is 48,000 - RELAX, everyone.
Hippocrates @ 11/12/2003 2:21:28 PM

For the record, ska is not Hippocrates. "

Did you forget to switch accounts when you wrote this or are you actually using yourself as a reference? :)

OK. I'll admit it. I'm Ska and I work for Microsoft in ths Spec-Ops Misinformatics Division. Actually, several of us are "Ska" and we work shifts. It took a month of training to perfect that unique semi-Asian writing style you've come to know and love. That certain "skavoir faire" that keeps you all coming back for more. I haven't been banned because the site moderators know people love the controversy trolling stirs up. Breaks up the monotony of the endless press releases (masquerading as "news") from company X announcing they've released version 2.121 of program Y - a dramatic improvement over version 2.120.

I might stay or I might go. Maybe I'll come back as TAFKAS (the as*h*le formerly known as Ska). Or maybe I'll come back as Sybil. Either way, you know you love it. Admit it: my posts are the only ones you read here.

Ska Smith, Esquire.



RE: I believe the figure is 48,000
TASKA @ 11/12/2003 11:23:47 PM #
Neo did you take the wrong pill again? It's BLUE one! This is Smith, btw.

Is this story going to be retracted?

Hippocrates @ 11/12/2003 4:06:33 AM #
Or will we just pretend that Handspring has half a million Treo 600 out there, just waiting to be purchased tomorrow?

RE: Is ska going to be retracted?
mikecane @ 11/12/2003 9:46:56 AM #
I thought we were rid of you. We soon will be again.

RE: Is this story going to be retracted?
Admin @ 11/12/2003 11:23:00 AM #
not until you retract every post, account and lie you've told here ska
RE: Is this story going to be retracted?
abosco @ 11/12/2003 7:07:12 PM #
Sorry guys, that's not ska, just someone that doesn't fully understand who ska is and is posing as him.

-Bosco
NX80v + Wifi + BT + T616
RE: Is this story going to be retracted?
Hippocrates @ 11/12/2003 10:47:50 PM #
Sorry guys, that's not ska, just someone that doesn't fully understand who ska is and is posing as him.

Please let me be Ska.


RE: Is this story going to be retracted?
TASKA @ 11/12/2003 11:20:22 PM #
you can't be yourself.

I am me, just like you are you, and I and you me.

RE: Is this story going to be retracted?
Hippocrates @ 11/12/2003 11:33:27 PM #
So happy... TOGETHER!


;-)

RE: Is this story going to be retracted?
mikecane @ 11/13/2003 8:59:23 AM #
>>>Sorry guys, that's not ska, just someone that doesn't fully understand who ska is and is posing as him.

Too bad for him. He'll be treated as if he was ska.

RE: Is this story going to be retracted?
Solo @ 11/13/2003 10:30:14 AM #
Or maybe it's a case of split personnality...

They have pills for that :D (at least, I hope)

- Solo

Top