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Comments on: Use a PDA as a Desktop Platform via Blue Dock

A new company has released initial details about a future product called Blue Dock, that allows a Palm OS handheld to function as a full computing environment with external desktop hardware.
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Hmmm. Emulator's Free :)

DevPOV @ 1/23/2004 12:32:24 PM #
'Nuf said :)

Wha?

Hal2000 @ 1/23/2004 12:41:47 PM #
Please explain to me why I might need this. Who is it aimed at? People w/o pc's?

Zodiac2/T616
RE: Wha?
statik @ 1/23/2004 1:00:40 PM #
Personally, I like the idea of having my PDA as my primary computer. This is a bit too limitted for my needs, but once this technology matures it may just replace the desktop PC all together.

For now, I could see this being a good solution for anybody who wants to browse the internet, do e-mail, basic word processing or spreadsheet work but doesn't want the learning curve associated with one of the desktop Operating Systems. (What do you mean I have to right click?)

Crazy 'bout a Mercury
http://clubs.hemmings.com/clubsites/henryshaulers/

RE: Wha?
BUDD @ 1/23/2004 1:06:25 PM #
How about someone who wants ONE solution in their life and a solid, reliable one: palm users. I personally am not in love with microsoft stuff for all sorts of reasons. I base my business on Palm OS (Dana laptop alternative, Handera stuff. Would be great to have that unit's processor be the core and engine of bigger peripherals, when I need to run and go I just pull the palm unit off the dock and take it with me.

This is a really slick idea (I've spoken of it as a dream of mine before, personally). If you think about it it would extend helpful computing into all parts of your life (make it more pervasive)--unless you also like having information stored on different computers (syncs are slow and not as efficient).

RE: Wha?
kpr @ 1/23/2004 1:08:32 PM #
I think this is a good idea for someone who:

1. does not want to spend a lot of money on a desktop or laptop computer,

2. wants an extra computer in an other part of their house, like the kitchen, TV room, garage, guest room, kids room, or even the bathroom,

3. has a spare monitor, keyboard, and mouse that they want to make use of,

4. wants to add a computer to their mini van, SUV, or motor home,

5. does not have a computer at all, like many elderly people who did not grow up with computers,

6. is tired of all the problems they run into with their PC,

7. does not want to make Bill G even more rich.


What would you rather have your parents or grandparents use:
a Palm via Blue Dock or a Microsoft Windows-based PC???

What platform do you think is easier to support and easier to use:
a Palm OS based device or a Microsoft Windows-based PC?

RE: Wha?
a3 @ 1/23/2004 1:32:05 PM #
If you tie this idea with David Nagel's info about a Palm OS based laptop we could be seeing the future PC replacement.
Anyway, the info published is very limited so there is not much to discuss, just ask questions:
- This thing needs an additional software to help out with the resolution difference (320x320 -> 800x640)
- If a PPC version becomes available what will happen with Tablet PC?

____________________________________________
Former Tapwave's Helix fan, now a T|T3 fan.
RE: Wha?
Shotokan @ 1/23/2004 4:30:45 PM #
I could see that the sales reps that I support could really use something like this. Most of them do not have a computer, in fact they will not buy a computer unless the computer puts up the money. With the ability to surf the web, most of their interaction could be through a browser. Now if Palm OS (all devices) could support Flash, it would make life much easier than html, dhmtl, and css front end. If it would charge at the same time, it would be great.

I did like the idea of using this with a motor. Those can be cramped and anyway to save space would be great. Yes, I know several people who travel in motor homes and the only way to communicate is through email and they like a better screen size.



RE: Wha?
DWD @ 1/23/2004 4:40:18 PM #
Yep, I read it and just had one question.

Why?

RE: Wha?
Beavis @ 1/23/2004 8:02:54 PM #
Q4, 2004

I will bet that this thing never sees the light of day.

RE: Wha?
MGogesch @ 1/23/2004 9:11:31 PM #
Some of you are talking about a cost advantage over a real desktop, but i paid $250 for my zire 71, and that would cost another $250. You can get a reasonable computer for that same $500. Plus you still need the montor keyborad mouse etc...
RE: Wha?
stephen007 @ 1/23/2004 10:23:39 PM #
I have to agree with Beavis. This thing is complete vaporware.

Stephen

RE: Wha?
Rome @ 1/23/2004 10:31:47 PM #
This concept is really nothing new. This was frequently discussed on Compaq's iPaq team all the way back in 1999.
RE: Wha?
acaltabiano @ 1/24/2004 12:37:44 PM #
Some things take time to mature. I hope this is one of them. I think that both sides of the argument are exactly right! Considering current tech, this really isn't all that feasible at the moment, not for what we all want to do. But, the technologies that led to this started among much different paths; PDA's were not originally designed with power, Multimedia, and the ability to replace desktops in mind. And Desktops were not designed to be mobile. This is a convergent device that might take these technologies to new places! But, as was noted further down the page, trying to do all this through the PUC is-a not-a gonna work-a. Maybe, if enough people like the IDEA of it, we will see companies try to conform to techs and standards that will make this much more of a possibility in the near future.

I like the idea of taking the brain of my computer with me, but that is not going to happen in the present. Stuff like this needs to develop and mature; but it has to start somewhere, and this device is as good as anything else trying to accomplish that at the moment. That is what this device is: a starting point for the tech.

RE: Wha?
Ezra4no1 @ 1/26/2004 3:37:52 AM #
I think this is an excellent idea... I hope this does see light of day and they build upon it and make this concept even better.

Think about this for a moment... Whether you like this concept or not, or your needs for a computing platform is beyond the scope of what current Palms can do, every thing about is a good idea.

Palm PDAs are known through out the world. They are the most widely used PDAs in the world and have the largest library of software for any PDA. I persoanlly would love to see palm grow beyond grow beyond just a handHeld PDA (not to get rid of PDAs, but to expand in other directions).

I can see this concept being used by students. I already can see how this could totally compete and replace microsoft's webtv set box. Not everyone need's a highend computer with WinXP. Many people could make do with Win 95 and maybe a 400 mhz computer.. I couldn't see why this could appeal to those users. You can surf, check your email, even use office documents to view and even edit. Best of all it's portable and you can take it with you where you are.

I think this would also help push palmOne in to new directions and create new markets and opportunities.


Nice in theory but...

hkklife @ 1/23/2004 2:31:11 PM #
As long as you can pick up a 2nd hand PII 233 w/ 64mb ram and Windows 98, the basic home user/grandma/neophyte will always lean towards a standard PC instead of something like this. I mean, Wal-Mart sells those Lindows desktops for $220 or so for a Celeron/Duron 1.xghz machine w/ 128mb. And for a bit more, you can get an E-Machines w/ XP preloaded at your local B&M retailer. Like it or not, non-power users will continue with the above options for the same reasons that people don't buy Segways or Gator/Mule type 4x4 utility wagons-you can simply buy a 2nd hand car or truck for substantially less and have much more versatility and ownership costs.

However, for schools or institutions that have deployed PDAs on a wide basis, this dock makes perfect sense. Remember the flurry of K-12 private schools two or so years ago that gave every student a IIIc to use? I wonder how that ended up working out...

RE: Nice in theory but...
JonAcheson @ 1/24/2004 12:41:50 PM #
You've got the right idea, but I quibble with your second conclusion.

For the cost of this adapter, I could just buy an entire Wal-mart pc and plug my PDA into it. And have a fricking PC. And, when I buy a new PDA in three years, the PC will hook up to that too.

For schools, this is the worst of all possible systems, because it will a) tie up classrooms with all the monitors and keyboards for these adapters b) cost almost as much as PCs c) not provide anything like the functionality of a PC and d) have a working life of three years maximum, after which the new PDAs won't work with this adapter any more.

This is dead on arrival.

Jon Acheson

"All opinions posted are my own, and not those of my employers, who are appalled."

RE: Nice in theory but...
hkklife @ 1/24/2004 5:00:35 PM #
Well, yes, I concur with your thoughts as well but I was primarily thinking of schools/institutions that had already spend (or were in the process of) spending mega-$ on large volume PDA purchases. Or say, in a hospital where the nurses/docs had PDAs and there could be a few of these "stations" on each hall where they could plug in, charge, upload/download patient info etc. Of course, PPCs and Tungsten Cs are seen so widely now in many of the larger hospitals & can do all of this with wi-fi so this thing might really be completely DOA. Now, desktop docks for laptops, I see as an entirely different animal. Those will only increase in popularity in the coming years.

RE: Nice in theory but...What?
Ezra4no1 @ 1/26/2004 4:07:39 AM #
You guys are missing the point here.. the question companies will ask.... is not where can we stick a cheap PC, but where can we eliminate having a PC all together. Just because this route may be more costly to you or I, doesn't mean a company or an education institude is going to go out and look for 25 second hand PCs running Windows 98 over the blue Dock solution.

There are very real purposes where this could be a better solution than a PC. The fact that one Blue Dock can be purchased for a company on a sales floor, while their sales associates can each be given a Palm and when needed can connect to a Blue Dock terminal when needed makes this an attractive, a secure, and cost effective solution, still allowing their employees to take their data with them in the field and or home. I can even see this being used in a medical clinical setting, (seeing how I have 2 brother inlaws both Doctors and both use their Palms for work could also work for that purpose as well).


Keep in mind.. Just because an older PC is cheaper and can still do more, it's still may not be the solution and can still add up in costly expense to support it and maintain it.


RE: Nice in theory but...
a_nonamiss @ 1/26/2004 10:32:41 AM #
Also keep in mind that the $250 price tag is the pre-release price. It will never be wildly successful at that price. But that price is for a product that is probably at least a year away from actual release. There is nothing inherent about thie device that makes it that expensive. You're talking about an extremely low-end video chip and USB or PS/2 controllers for the keyboard/mouse. Hardware-wise, this thing doesn't really command a price of $250. I would envision these being released at a slightly lower price point, and I would see them eventually coming down to somewhere around $50. At this price, all the "PC vs. Palm Docking Station" arguments fall apart. This would be a great device at $50. At $250, it will be a "look what I can do" toy. They might sell enought to stay in business, but they won't revolutionize computing.

Arthur

Palm Pilot 1000 > Palm Pilot Professional > Palm III > Palm M100 > Sony Clié PEG-T415 > Palm T|T3

Another technology focussed company waiting to die

Louis Berk @ 1/23/2004 2:55:23 PM #
It never fails to amaze me how endemic is the malaise of technology driving the IT industry rather than sound marketing ideas.

Who needs this? Just how big could the market size be? By the time you add on the peripherals (screen, keyboard, mouse, storage etc) I doubt there will be any economic difference between this solution and an entry level Dell.

Yes, it sounds fine, it even looks kewl and there will be some gadget junkies who will embrace the idea with missionary zeal. But enough for this to be successful? I doubt that very much.

Sony's recently announced "soft" Palm environment makes considerably more sense - after all there are several gazillion compatible desktops out there that you could sell the software to. That's called marketing. This thing is called "mental masturbation" and I can only assume it has been developed by a bunch of well meaning, very technical but commercially unaware engineers.

I'll eat my socks if this goes anywhere so please save this post!

Louis

RE: Another technology focussed company waiting to die
BUDD @ 1/23/2004 4:32:22 PM #
You just don't get it--this is not about money. It is about having a central 'core' to your computing experience no matter where you are. The already ubiquitis hardware out there would be usable by a palm. But you are sitting at your desk looking at a big plasma screen and need to go into the field. So you take the 'brain of the system' (the palm) out of the dock and slip it into your pocket. The whole thing is a like a morphing computer experience. Could give a rats but if granny likes it or it costs nothing less (though I think it would if you had any of the hardware it could use with this--assuming you all are interacting with a keyboard and not an implant of some kind).

RE: Another technology focussed company waiting to die
jhintonh @ 1/23/2004 5:50:28 PM #
Salutations-
I agree with Louis. This thing was imagined in a vacuum. Something like this:
Techie A: Man it would be so cool to have like a cradle that I could plug other stuff in to and control my Palm.
Techie B: No doubt!
Techie A: Can it be done?
Techie B: Certainly.
Techie A: Let's do it then. My mom will convince my dad to put up the start up coin for it!
Techie B: Sweet! We rock!
Meanwhile in Gotham City, six people are eagerly awaiting just such a device and they do not even realize it yet.
And BTW, "mental masturbation" is by far, going away, hands down, the BEST blurb I have ever read on PalmInfoCenter forums. Very nice. Very Michael Savage-esque (not sure if you know who that is, but I meant it as a compliment).
-Jhintonh (the "J" is for Juggernaut...Jabberwocke...Justice...)
RE: Another technology focussed company waiting to die
Louis Berk @ 1/24/2004 6:16:05 AM #
>You just don't get it--this is not about money.

Budd, talk about "laugh out loud"!

Unless I did my economics degree at the wrong university, I beg to differ. It is all about money. My point is that most technology companies, and this one in particular share your view.

And for that reason they are doomed to die.

Sorry to be a hardbitten, hardnosed businesman but believe me in the real world, the only thing that matters is money and too few consumers will be able to justify the premium over the cost of a basic computer for this type of solution to sustain the company.

Cheers

louis

Ahead of its time?

Verteron @ 1/23/2004 3:26:10 PM #
I think that in a few years, PDAs will be able to support USB peripherals the same way desktops can (i.e. mouse, keyboard). They already have audio-out. Adding a DVI or VGA connector wouldn't be a huge leap, it's already possible with current technology. I'm sure you can already do this kind of thing with a Sharp Zaurus.

Handspring Visor Neo --> Sony CLIE PEG-T665C --> palmOne Tungsten T2
RE: Ahead of its time?
BUDD @ 1/23/2004 4:30:25 PM #
Few years nothing. You may be aware that the AlphaSmart DANA already has 2 USB ports that work with drivers for modems and printers--and anything else anyone wanted to write a driver for. And that's with OS 4.1

RE: Ahead of its time?
Verteron @ 1/23/2004 4:43:26 PM #
I didn't know about the AlphaSmart's USB ports, but it's not enough. Imagine if you could plug a USB Hard Disk Drive, a printer, a scanner or a CD-Burner into those ports. It would certainly make the device more useful.

Handspring Visor Neo --> Sony CLIE PEG-T665C --> palmOne Tungsten T2

Buttons?

bsquare @ 1/23/2004 3:31:38 PM #

Now, do I need to remove the buttons from my Palm in order to use this? Seriously, why would they use an empty Palm Shell with the buttons obviously gone in the promo pic?? I'm really surpised they didn't have this M505 running WinCE complete with Start Bar.

RE: Buttons?
Strider_mt2k @ 1/23/2004 5:50:17 PM #
What they appear to have done is taken an m500 and superimposed a color screen onto it, while at the same time removing the markings.

Hmmm, A 33Mhz desktop. Very inspiring.

Couldn't they have at least borrowed a newer model to put a fake screen on?

Plus, don't a growing number of the newer PalmOne handhelds devoid of the UC?


RE: Buttons?
helf @ 1/23/2004 6:08:16 PM #
Nothing wrong with 33mhz.. You can do a ton of stuff on the old neXt systems and amigas and they are around 33mhz...

RE: Buttons?
bsquare @ 1/23/2004 9:28:59 PM #
33Mhz NeXT?? Wow, you must have a Turbo Cube. My lowly old cube only runs at 25Mhz.

RE: Buttons?
Strider_mt2k @ 1/24/2004 8:02:29 AM #
NeXT, Amiga?

Ten years ago called, they want their computers back.
;)

RE: Buttons?
jss1432 @ 1/26/2004 2:31:59 AM #
But NeXT and Amiga had real operating systems and real window systems. The problem with Palm for these kinds of applications is not the hardware, it's the software. Palm just isn't up to it.

A neat trick

cbowers @ 1/23/2004 3:22:41 PM #
I first saw this product announced in conjunction with a PocketPC device. There I can see it fly. But not on an OS5 or pre-os5 (as shown) device.

"the Blue Dock will work with any SDIO enabled Palm Powered handheld. It is used in conjunction with any full size monitor, keyboard, mouse, ethernet network connection and supported USB devices. The dock will have a SDIO interface for additional storage and will export video at VGA (640x480) and 800x600 modes"

Given that the SDIO slot is for extra storage (though as pictured that doesn't seem to have been taken into account), that leaves the universal connector for all of the rest of the functionality.

Video (ala iGo Pitch Mirror app sort of a thing I guess), network, and keyboard, seems a bit of a stretch on such a narrow bandwidth port. As for USB, at least they say "supported USB" devices. Except for the Alphasmart Dana, this is exactly "0". We don't have USB Master functionality on PalmOS devices apart from the Dana.

Nice idea, and doable on PocketPC, but unless they're targeting OS6 devices, I can't see it flying here.

That said, I already do this as much as it's possible, with a Tungsten C on a PPC, with Margi Mirror outputting to a monitor (though the Mirror part is rare unless I'm demoing something).

I wish it was a more doable concept on our platform, I just can't see much likelyhood of success yet (perhaps in an OS6 world).

As it stands it's in the same category as all those SD accessory moch-ups on Palm's conference boards.

Looks like vaporware to me!

dacreativeguy @ 1/23/2004 4:18:27 PM #
Has anyone seen this product in person?

The photo posted above really looks like a 3D rendering, and the photos on their web site look like a mockup. For example, check out the photo of the rear of the unit. Looks like some of the models I made in design school where I incorporated real i/o ports into a wood and plastic model. The fit and finish just doesn't look like a molded plastic unit.

I also noticed how the unit is created to exactly fit the shape of the PDA it is attached to (m505 and ipaq in their examples). Are you telling me that they are going to make a specific model for EVERY PDA out there? I can't imagine a small company (or any large one either) doing this. On the customer side, that means that when I upgrade from a m505 to a Tungsten, I won't be able to use the same unit for my new handheld.

And from a marketing point of view, wouldn't it be a lot easier to sell these things to companies if one unit could accommodate any PDA out there? I could easily imagine a company drop-in center having a few of these 'docking-stations' which traveling employees could hook up to with any PDA. That won't happen if the thing isn't universal.

I agree with the poster above. This is a product without a market.

DELL Dimension 2400 = $399

Gekko @ 1/23/2004 8:52:49 PM #
DELL Dimension 2400
Intel® Celeron® Processor at 2.4GHz with 400MHz front side bus
Microsoft® Windows® XP Home Edition
17 in Monitor
FREE Shipping!
FREE CD-Burner Upgrade - ONLINE ONLY!
$399 After Rebate

http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/features.aspx/advertised_dimen?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs



RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
Rome @ 1/23/2004 10:40:16 PM #
You are missing the point. The same computer that you described in notebook form will easily cost twice as much. Size does matter in this case:))

RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
Gekko @ 1/23/2004 10:54:22 PM #
DELL Inspiron 1100 Notebook = $699

http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/inspn_1100?c=us&cs=19&l=en&s=dhs

$250 Palm + $250 Blue Dock + $250 Monitor = $750+ and limited functionality.

Can you hear me NOW?


RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
Hal2000 @ 1/23/2004 11:22:13 PM #
Dell Wins.

Zodiac2/T616
RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
Gekko @ 1/24/2004 1:07:28 AM #
Wow...I just realized something...PCs have become as cheap/cheaper than PDAs...

DELL 2.4GHz PC = $399

Palm T3 PDA = $399

We've crossed some kind of inflection point!


RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
palm0045 @ 1/24/2004 1:27:05 AM #
don't forget, though, that with the dell dimension 2400, you need to purchase a mousepad: $399 + $6 = $405.

the tungsten wins!

Palm Vx --> Palm m500 --> Sony Clie T-615 --> Sony Clie NR70V

RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
Rome @ 1/24/2004 10:08:39 AM #
Dell Notebook vs. Dell Desktop

$300 more expensive than desktop
Smaller HD
Sammler screen size
Slower bus speed
No CD ROM burner

Why would anyone want to buy a notebook over a desktop? More money for less features. That doesn't make sense, does it? Not to mention that the price difference between notebook and desktop used to be much wider.

Form factor does matter!!! What was the last time you put your notebook in your pocket?



RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
phoneboy @ 1/24/2004 12:53:21 PM #
This device is useless.

Why would anyone buy a notebook over a desktop?

I have never owned a desktop, EVER! This is just personal preference, but I can't stand being chained to a desk. I use my computer in the kitchen, bedroom, garage, TV room, friends house, in-laws, bathroom (my laptop has been flagged for being in the bathroom), in the car... etc. Sure, I paid tiwce as much for equal performance, but I use it three times as much as I'd use a desktop.

Desktops are great for gaming, but Call of Duty works great on my Centrino Vaio (though gaming is low on my list.)

I still use my Palm even more, but it does plenty without a blue box to plug it in to.

RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
Rome @ 1/24/2004 6:22:51 PM #
You may have missed my points. I am not saying that notebooks are useless, nor am I saying that desktops are irrelavent. Each form factor serves its purpose and has its market.

It was only 50 years ago that a computer with the power of a modern day calculator took up the space of an entire room. And it is quite likely that, in not too distant future, a pda/smartphone will meet all our personal computing and communication needs. When that day comes, a docking station for my pda/smartphone will probably as common as a TV.

RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
a3 @ 1/26/2004 8:47:58 AM #
Ok and are you going to write in Notepad? and do your charts in MS Paint? do not forget about the US$300 you have to spend in MS Office to make your Dell as functional as your TT3 with Docs to go!
Besides, I will accept that you can travel with your laptop, hell I can even accept that you can get a lightweight laptop for that money but you will not get a mobile solution as versatile as a Palm. I mean, don't get me wrong but PDA's sort of rule for the mobile employee. This blue-thingy just has to improve the office experience of a Palm and it will beat a laptop. I can think of a couple of things: hard drive, media drives, keyboard, screen, mouse, et al under the Palm OS... do your math and will see.

____________________________________________
Former Tapwave's Helix fan, now a T|T3 fan.
RE: DELL Dimension 2400 = $399
Gekko @ 1/27/2004 12:47:47 AM #
>"Ok and are you going to write in Notepad?..."

WordPerfect, Quattro Pro, and more useful software is included in the DELL "Productivity Pack" offer.


Help me! I have the VAPORS!

;-) @ 1/23/2004 8:59:18 PM #
Man it would be so cool to have like a cradle that I could plug other stuff in to and control my Palm.

That faux-junior high scool design concept is so totally RETRO, it rocks! Cubism is white hot this year and these guys are [B]all[/B] over it. They should team up with Unilear™ Corporation and make the ultimate PC alternative. When I whip out my Unilear Parachute at the bars, chicks always get weak-kneed with desire.



It's just too big.

Reminds me of IBM Meta Pad

Gekko @ 1/23/2004 10:42:49 PM #
IBM plays with chameleon-like computer

By John G. Spooner
Staff Writer
http://news.com.com/2100-1001-830173.html

Story last modified February 5, 2002, 9:00 PM PST

IBM Research is experimenting with a chameleon-like computing device called the Meta Pad, designed to easily convert from a desktop machine to a handheld to a notebook and back again.
Representatives of Big Blue's research arm demonstrated the gadget for CNET News.com on Wednesday. The 9-ounce, wallet-size Meta Pad aims to lighten the load for device-laden technophiles by providing a unit that contains all of a customer's software and applications, but only the most basic hardware, such as a hard drive.

The device serves as a core module--containing a processor, a hard drive, memory and a docking connector--that can be inserted into a number of different computer-hardware modules, such as a PDA or a desktop module, allowing it to play different roles.

"The idea is that this is the computer," researcher Ken Ocheltree said, holding the small black core, "and everything else is an accessory."



RE: Reminds me of IBM Meta Pad
Wollombi @ 1/27/2004 1:56:58 AM #
It's not like this is a new concept, OQO was working on this at least 3 years ago.

The IBM and BlueDock concepts are essentially the same thing.

_________________
Sean

Always remember that you are unique. Just like everyone else.

Great Idea

ELiTe @ 1/24/2004 6:13:32 AM #
I think this is a great idea.

Of course, it'll be of little use to the home consumer, but in an enterprise, it's fantastic! All the mobile execs (sales, marketing, PR etc) will be able to just dock their Palms into the cradle and do what they got to do, and keep everything all in one place. When they have to get going to see customers, just pluck the Palm from the dock and go, with ALL THEIR STUFF still in there!

Of course it'll be too much to "take away" their PCs... but gradually, they will be weaned from the PC in the office... I bet after a while they'll tell their MIS Depts to get rid of that junk that's taking up so much of their desk space and want only the docking station on it.

:)


Not off the wall but floating in the middle of the room!

RhinoSteve @ 1/24/2004 12:06:06 PM #
This definately goes in the "WTF File" of product ideas. Any Joe can crank out a tool injection mold for make this. Apparently from the almost amature industrial design, someone did.

There is an incredable software / systems engineering issue that not even a hundred offshore developer or two good software developers can handle.

Guys, give this one up quick before you spend the next four years chasing system glitches. You are never going to get your money back on this one.

RE: Not off the wall but floating in the middle of the room!
Ezra4no1 @ 1/26/2004 5:27:35 AM #
Funny thing is that I find the Blue Dock more Floatable, usable, practable, and acceptable than the Fossil Wrist PDA watch - Which has got to be the GAYEST product to ever have been thought of.

You geeks just don't get it. ;)

Dr Opinion @ 1/26/2004 5:31:15 AM #
I haven't read such a lot of drivel for a *long* time.

What you guys are missing is that:

(1) You can get a decent color palm for around $100 that will travel with you wherever you go, play MP3s, take photos, edit word and excel spreadsheets, read email, and surf the web. Internet connection required, of course.

(2) This device is being *launched* at $250. This is the entry retail price, not what a school or any other institution will have to pay in bulk, and not what the price will be 6 months after launch: probably no more than $100, and people pay that just for a fricky keyboard.

(3) The biggest cost to run a farm of PCs is support. Not hardware. Any businessman knows this: PCs suck. They are too complicated. They need IT geeks to care for and feed them. People just need to edit office docs, surf, and check email. A *palm* already does this, and it doesn't need a damn IT department to take care of it. Now this might be a bit of a wake up call for you PC support d00ds... but it might be time to find yourself another job. ;)


"...I looked up "antediluvian", and they had a picture of a Pocket PC." ;)

RE: You geeks just don't get it. ;)
ThunderCracker @ 1/26/2004 7:27:45 AM #
As an IT "D00d",

The fact is that you simply do not understand that this product has absolutly no chance in the average business world.

My users expect me to provide them with the tools to be productive. This means software that they are familiar with, and that keeps the cost of training down.

That is why I use Microsoft's OS and Office products. All of my users have 10 years of experience using Microsoft's products. And it cost me nothing to train them. If I were to replace those products with this, I would be hung from the highest tree.

This product is DOA, Except in very limited vertical markets. If any product wants to eliminate MS, they will have to duplicate the user experience.

This product has no cost advantage, no flexibility advantage over desktops, and no user experience advantage. Bottom line: This is a waste of time.


Palm III --> Compaq Areo 1550 --> Palm IIIc --> Visor Edge --> Casio EM500 --> Sony T415 --> Compaq 3670 --> Dell Axim x5 Advanced --> Sony SJ20 --> Palm T|E --> HP H1945/T610

RE: You geeks just don't get it. ;)
Ezra4no1 @ 1/26/2004 2:01:34 PM #
Well Mr. ThunderCracker,

The fact is that you simply do not understand the full spectrum and scope of what an IT "D00d" really does..

And this is comming from someone who has held support contracts with Cisco Systems, Baynetworks / Nortelnetwors, Microsoft, and different hospital and clinical offices in my city.

The User experince doesn't mean jack dittelly when dealing with newbies and non technical people. The same holds true with the Palm interface, Windows, Apple, Linux, PPCs, or anything else you're not familare with.

And the fact that you may be working with users with at least 10 years of experince if anything would make them more qualified to use this product because that would mean they are already familare with things like what a program is, menues, opening a program, using a mouse, saving files, and so on.

Also keep the following inprospective...

Blue Dock is not a product that is going to challenge the PC or even Microsoft. People are posting as if this is going to be the next big OS and shake their little fragile lives.

Chances are, that Blue Dock will not even be marketed for people who don't even use a Palm OS PDA..I mean Think about it. It is designed for people who USE the Palm OS. It is being designed for companies that have already invested the time and money in using the Palm OS PDA. Theonly learning curve this will present is the same learning curve any one else will have to learn in using their own Palm anyway. It isn't like a Fortune 500 comapny is going to look at the Blue Dock and say..."Ok, we need to remove our Microsoft servers and workstations, and buy 200 of the these Blue Dock devices and Palms"..

Geesh..You'd think some people would figure this out them selves... But than again, I guess that's why they really need IT "D00d"s.


RE: You geeks just don't get it. ;)
Wollombi @ 1/27/2004 2:03:07 AM #
>"My users expect me to provide them with the tools to be productive. This means software that they are familiar with, and that keeps the cost of training down.

That is why I use Microsoft's OS and Office products. All of my users have 10 years of experience using Microsoft's products. And it cost me nothing to train them. If I were to replace those products with this, I would be hung from the highest tree."<

If you're that committed to bug riddled, inferior products, then I'd say you're really not much of an "IT DooD".

_________________
Sean

Always remember that you are unique. Just like everyone else.

RE: You geeks just don't get it. ;)
ThunderCracker @ 1/27/2004 9:43:43 AM #
"If you're that committed to bug riddled, inferior products, then I'd say you're really not much of an "IT DooD".

No. I am not committed to such products. That is why I don't use Linux or Open Office.

The truth is that No MS competitor has shown me an alternative that has the same appeal as Microsoft. The bootom line is that I am looking for feature for feature 100% compatibility with as little retraining costs as possible. I have never received a request from any user to take away their Windows Desktops to replace them with Linux ones.

The bottom Line is that technical coolness does not trump user functionality. I do not want to get in their way.

Bashing MS for religious reasons does not replace logic. If Apple would port OSX to x86 hardware, then we have something to talk about. Until then, we are stuck where we are.


Palm III --> Compaq Areo 1550 --> Palm IIIc --> Visor Edge --> Casio EM500 --> Sony T415 --> Compaq 3670 --> Dell Axim x5 Advanced --> Sony SJ20 --> Palm T|E --> HP H1945/T610

Why I would use this

devildoc @ 1/26/2004 11:00:55 AM #
Couple the Blue Dock with a MP3-playing Palm and a USB 250GB external HD and you have a large audio collection for your car. No boot time , no crashes, could probably add an 802.11 connection, small in size [this could fit in the glove box]. No need for RCA cables hanging out the dash to the iPod or the severe music limitation of the iPod [file format and number of files]. No more scratched, unlabeled CD-R kibble in the car.

I envision using this in my 1978 RX-7. There is a hidden space behind the seats where this could be placed [wireless networking, HD, cabling, power inverter, etc], Blue Dock and Palm Device are mounted in the glove box, a modified keyboard goes to the faux stereo with the tape deck buttons controlling the play, FF, Rew, next, previous. I don't use play lists so this the only control I would need. Hop in the car, put the Zodiac in the Blue Dock, turn the car on, hit play.

Would like to have the ability to use FLAC files for this project though.

I'm sure some gear head would use a PS2/serial port to control fuel mixture, reprogram the car's computer....

Obviously, this is predicated on two things: 1) that the product actually ships and 2) that the Palm would be able to use the HD [I don't see why this isn't possible as the HandEra can use 1GB MicroDrives].

RE: Why I would use this
cbowers @ 1/26/2004 2:27:21 PM #
Well because we don't have fully supported CF slots on PalmOS devices anymore, and because we don't have 250GB flash cards yet.

Futher we don't have USB Master ports (except for the Dana), thus can't use *any* usb accessories, be they keyboards, mice, HD's, or whatever. A PalmOS PDA *is* a USB accessory.

You may have better success with this product and a PocketPC.

RE: Why I would use this
devildoc @ 1/26/2004 3:27:52 PM #
Palm SDIO-->Blue Dock-->USB port-->USB HD.

>>You may have better success with this product and a PocketPC.

I suppose, if I were attempting to attain nil productivity or in this case ensure the ruination of a perfectly good drive home.

But seriously (OK I was being serious), don't get your panties in a bunch, I agree with most posters as to the ethereal qualities of the product.

RE: Why I would use this
Wollombi @ 1/27/2004 2:07:08 AM #
>"Well because we don't have fully supported CF slots on PalmOS devices anymore, and because we don't have 250GB flash cards yet.

Futher we don't have USB Master ports (except for the Dana), thus can't use *any* usb accessories, be they keyboards, mice, HD's, or whatever. A PalmOS PDA *is* a USB accessory."<

Uh...that's why the dock would be there in the first place. The USB master controller would be incorporated into the dock unit.

_________________
Sean

Always remember that you are unique. Just like everyone else.

RE: Why I would use this
Texonite @ 1/27/2004 10:30:34 AM #
So, then this thing would be nice idea, but couple of years later... :)

Future Online!

Sorry for my ENG :(

hmmmm...

LittleJoe @ 1/26/2004 12:10:31 AM #
Perhaps this is silly, but there are these odd circumstances (the too-specific fitting to particular and even older pda models; the m500 palm without buttons but a fake overlay for the screen; and no info about drivers or software; and the site is a little flaky) that make me think that this is a hoax or joke. It all seems fishy. And I checked out that IBM thing mentioned earlier and I would expect that to be the real destination for computing.
RE: hmmmm...
cobrakon @ 1/29/2004 6:17:50 AM #
My comments are based on whether this is ACTUALLY going to be developed.

As a system analyst in a worldwide company, I use my Palm Zire 71 for work EXTENSIVELY. I have DTG Pro and use ALL of my workbooks and Docs on my Palm almost exclusively. If I had WiFi or BT access, I wouldn't need my desktop at work 95% of the time. (Dammit Palmone, relase the OS5 BT SDIO card already!!) At $100 or less it could definitely have a place in the tech world.

Blue Doc - $100
120-key internet kb - $8
Optical 4button mouse - $12
17" .25dp monitor - $70-80 (or since it's only 800x600 a 15" for $35)

Total investment = $205 ($155)

Combined with an Palm Device you get

-MS Office compatibility
-Email with Outlook compatibilty
-Access db's
-MP3 playback (OS4 or better)
-Gaming (albeit limited)
-Multimedia (T3, Zodiac, etc.)
-Encyclopedias, Dictionaries, Reference, Databases, etc, etc.

I'd say for those things listed, you really can't go wrong. And remember, it's not that this is for people to go *BUY* a $400 T3 and the BD unit, this is for those that HAVE a PDA already and want to add functionality. And lest you forget, this is for just a little more than a Palm kb will run you and you can view your work on a larger screen and use normal peripherals. The Palm would only need drivers as the BD would house any additional interface hw inside.

Zire 71, 120 apps loaded and counting...

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