Comments on: Palm Reports Q3 FY 2010 Results
"Our recent underperformance has been very disappointing, but the potential for Palm remains strong," said Jon Rubinstein, Palm chairman and chief executive officer. "The work we're doing to improve sales is having an impact, we're making great progress on future products, and we're looking forward to upcoming launches with new carrier partners. Most importantly, we have built a unique and highly differentiated platform in webOS, which will provide us with a considerable - and growing - advantage as we move forward."
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RE: OUCH!
Here's hoping they can create some compelling devices while they still can.
Hopefully they can gain some traction before windows 7 devices hit the market.
RE: OUCH!
So that "$500+ million cash" isn't quite as rosy as it appears.
RE: OUCH!
With 400k devices gathering dust, it'll be a while before we see any new hardware.
Palm had better start looking for a buyer - quickly.
RE: OUCH!
My fearless predictions for the next 6 months of 2010:
1. AT&T will either not launch the WebOS devices at all or have a very, very, downsized launch with zero fanfare. These units will be overlooked entirely in the hysteria around iPad, iPhone OS 4.0 & multitasking, new iPhones, and the announcement of the renewal of the AT&T iPhone exclusivity.
2. T-Mobile will NOT launch any new Palm products.
3. The mythical C40 will not appear this May/June for Sprint as rumored. If it appears at all, it will be pushed back until October.
4. The WebOS twins will make a rather abrupt disappearance from Verizon shelves sometime in the next few months.
5. Palm will not release a WiMax device on Sprint anytime this year.
6. Palm will attempt to reposition themselves as a "rogue" independent hardware provider and will push slim-margin unlocked GSM handsets (ala Google & Nexus One but without the margins) on their website. Think a GSM Pixi Plus for $299 and a Pre Plus for $399. If the AT&T deal falls through, we may even see a repeat performance of the Treo Pro saga. As you may recall, AT&T never officially sold it as a carrier-sanctioned or endorsed device, but Palm sold it unlocked online & through various other retailers. Best Buy also sold AT&T "compatible" Treo Pros at a subsidized, discounted price w/ 2yr contracts despite the fact that att.com or AT&T retail stores didn't offer the Pro.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: OUCH!
> hardware plans on the horizon and were going to make it through the year
> w/ Pixi & Pre...
!!!
I don't know of this - certainly goes against just about every Palm-the-stock's Pumpers' stance on what's coming Real Soon Now!
I think you might be mistaken.
In other news, the transcript is now available:
RE: OUCH!
"with what appears to be roughly 12 months of cash on hand, an accelerating burn ratio, a complete lack of earnings visibility and substantial debt and preferred equity, we no longer see any value in the company's common equity."
Ilya Grozovsky, Morgan Jospeh: He downgrades the stock to Sell from Hold, and reduces his target to zero.
RE: OUCH!
That is an even bigger OUCH!
Maybe Asus would like to buy them? They could morph it into a tablet OS and have a unique product. Certainly the hp Slate is going to be a loser -- Win7 on a frikkin *Atom* CPU? Android on Tegra2 will kick its ass. webOS on a Tegra2 might be even better. Just ... drop the Gesture Area!
RE: OUCH!
http://www.semiaccurate.com/2010/02/11/asus-pegatron-spin-drawing-close/
The above article address all of that, plus Tegra/Android stuff.
So, yeah, some Asian firm flush with cash and itching to make big inroads into the US market could still conceivably gobble up (ie overpay) Palm. So far, Acer's riding high on PCs but has stunk it up the handheld & smartphone entries. Asus is definitely a possibility. So is Foxconn but i don't think they'd want to jump right in and compete with with the likes of Apple, Google, HTC and RIM.
SV, I would certainly swear I read such a comment from Ruby back in January or early Feb! I would not make such a thing up, especially in light of the "C40" rumors for Sprint. Of course, he already likely knew of the looming inventory pileup issues back then so it's not like he was going to let the cat out of the bag w.r.t. any future releases that would Osborne the current lineup. But I really do recall one of the (EverythingPre? Palm Addicts?) enthusiast sites I don't regularly frequent posting such info. IIRC this was after the "I've never used an iPhone" and after the Pre Plus & Pixi Plus announcements/
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: OUCH!
The "family of products" lines have been ambivalent and blurred on the two calls prior:
Ruby says dedicated to "family of products" for WebOS:
http://seekingalpha.com/article/162120-palm-f1q10-qtr-end-8-29-09-earnings-call-transcript?page=4
"We have talked about families of products and yes, I am a big believe(r) in families of products and we will continue to evolve our product line into the future and have a variety of products that support Web OS."
and a bit further:
"Well, as we've said, we are going to be focusing all of our effort in the future on building Web OS products and so while there are still Centros and Treo Pros moving through the channel right now, our future engineering efforts are based around Web OS because we are absolutely confident in where we are going with Web OS."
3 months later Ruby changes his slant:
"Well, we're not going to talk about specific products in the future but let me say in general we don't believe in building large portfolios of products. Our focus is around having a small family of really great products. Right now we have two great products in Pre and Pixi and our objective right now is to expand with more carriers and more regions"
Also sadly shook my head on love & love lost with Sprint between Aug and now...
Not "Pre-verted"- Android Assimilation?
RE: OUCH!
popper - a toilet bowl with a built in dockng station for the pre and pixie devices along with a mypoop web app - for remote control of the pooper - a real game changer! lol
seriously, I think ruby had some good ideas when he started at Palm, however he's not CEO material - implementation of his plans was sub-par.
RE: OUCH!
Thanks much for the linky. I was searching furiously in Jan 2010 for Ruby's comments. I was a month off. Time flies when you're trying to adapt to a new platform, no?
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
Not a good call
Since Verizon only sold Palm products for part of the quarter, by my calculation, Palm needs to increase its Verizon sales by nearly 50% in order just to clear its channel inventory during the current quarter. This seems a tall order. On the other hand, it does seem to be about in line with analysts' original expectations for the Q3 run rate and management does seem appropriately focused on getting its products into the hands of both sales reps and customers. Should make for consumers getting some great deals. I just hope that Palm can pull it off.
I also wonder how much a drop off in sales at Sprint might have hurt results given that they are left without the latest Palm phones and seem not to be promoting them as much at present. Or is my impression not correct? They seem to me to be promoting their Android phones now more than the Pre or Pixi, which is sad but not surprising given the phones' recent success at generating consumer interest.
RE: Not a good call
"After Jeffries revealed the revenue forecast in a conference call, the shares fell 74 cents, or 13 percent, to $4.91 in after-hours trading. If the shares stay at that level in Friday trading, they will set a new 52-week low. The shares have traded as high as $18.09 in the past year.
Palm was a pioneer in the smart phone business, but it lagged as BlackBerry maker Research in Motion Ltd. gobbled up the corporate market and Apple Inc.'s iPhone charmed consumers. More recently, Google Inc.'s Android software for smart phones has gained traction at Palm's expense."
If there is a moral to this story it's 'you don't piss on those that helped you succeed ! '
Most of us have moved on to iPhone or Android.
Gary
ps, I ordered my iPad today :-)
Tech Center Labs
RE: Not a good call
gmayhak wrote:
If there is a moral to this story it's 'you don't piss on those that helped you succeed ! 'Most of us have moved on to iPhone or Android.
Gary
ps, I ordered my iPad today :-)
Amen to that!
RE: Not a good call
Palm had a huge software development community, some had dedicated years producing superb software tools for Palm OS (Orbforms is an example, http://www.orbworks.com/orbforms/ )
Palm changes to web OS with no regard for the thousands of man-hours that have been devoted to Palm OS by their supporters and development community, for what?
Apple introduces a totally new product, iPad. Guess what, compatible with existing apps and will support higher resolution versions = Happy developers.
Gary
Tech Center Labs
RE: Not a good call
RE: Not a good call
For the record, I'm (terribly delayed, unfortunately) still working on a "Longtime Palm user's experiences migrating to Android" piece for PIC. And I just got a like-new Centro for my secondary line in case my 755p dies, so I'm still going to keep a foothold in Garnet for the forseeable future.
Personally, I feel that Android the lesser of all the current smartphone evils. iPhone is too restrictive in the hardware choices & carrier offerings. I demand a removable battery and a physical keyboard. WinMob 7 isn't going to be any better and is far too dumbed-down for my tastes. BlackBerry OS is terribly antiquated. Symbian/Maemo/MeeGo is dead in the water in the US market. So that leaves Android and WebOS. And for the time being, I feel Android has the edge due to the flexibility/customizations available to users, wide variety of hardware, a lot of new momentum this year, and the deep pockets of Google. PIMs still suck compared to Garnet, unfortunately.
If I was overseas, I might think differently. But basically being tied to Verizon for network/coverage reasons, I'm making do decently well on the Droid but I know I'm not going to ever be as productive as I was in inputting or recalling data as I was on my old Treo...
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: Not a good call
Today my Quantum Computer was approved ;-) http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/qubits-clock/id361966323?mt=8
22 apps so far and just getting warmed up!
Gary
Tech Center Labs
RE: Not a good call
Even =I= am interested in that device...and THAT is saying something!
RE: Not a good call
SV, from what I see using the simulator the higher resolution makes a huge difference, apps look great in 2X and when they are re-written for the iPad you get much more image detail.
Gary
Tech Center Labs
RE: Not a good call
I am a bit stubborn and contrary myself, probably why I am not about to abandon a phone I really like and which is a great value for me, and why I find these calls for Palm to fail and go away a bit like all the other times analysts yell "sell" at the bottom. I recall that one of the best buy signals ever was when the brokerage firm I used dropped coverage of a stock. While a couple stocks might have floundered subsequently, 80% were significantly higher one to two years out. Of course, so many hedge funds in this name both long and short, analysts are not dropping coverage, so they are dropping their price targets to zero; so seems this is essentially the same thing. Not for the short term or conservative, but for longer term spec, may have some appeal.
Big question is whether Palm can pull off a strong comeback. With the stock hitting new lows, they must be awake now and realize that their survival is at stake. If nothing else, will be very interesting to see how they respond.
RE: Not a good call
I assume 1024x768 chosen for easy up-scalability with the current 320x480 on the iPhone/iPod Touch?
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: Not a good call
http://lowendmac.com/musings/10mm/12-inch-successor.html
If they optimized the aspect ratio for watching widescreen videos it might not be as well suited for ebooks or surfing and the pop up keyboard might be awkward in landscape mode.
I think in the long term it won't make or break the success of the iPad.
Gary
Tech Center Labs
Best case/worst case scenarios
1.) everything goes very right
2.) everything goes very wrong
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
2. Palm no longer exists and has filed chapter 11 or has been acquired or both. Probable.
Next.
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
Everything goes very right: a year from now Palm is a significant and profitable player in the smartphone market.
Everything goes very wrong: After a string of bad quarters and non-existant sales, the company's assets are put up for sale in bankruptcy.
There is also the possibility that things just drag on for many quarters, with some being up, some down, before one of the above occurs.
If someone gives you a one sided, dismissive answer, they have an ax to grind. The fact is no one knows the future. There are many factors such as the economy, technological innovation and consumer tastes, among many. Good managements find a way to survive and then thrive. This current management team is relatively untested, has made some errors and is now facing a big challenge. Can the company turn things around? Stay tuned. Should at least be interesting watching.
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
We now know Palm's has 1.15 MILLION phones in inventory or MORE (by far) than an entire quarter's worth of superlative sell-through.
That's simply pitiful.
It means NO ONE'S gonna be buying enough Pres and Pixis to help Palm pay the bills for a LONG time - maybe TWO quarters!?
Palm said cash burn this quarter would be $150+ million yet they remain $400 million in debt - at SOME point their creditors may start making noises. as their cash dwindles to well below their debt level. If the creditors think there is little value in Palm OTHER than their cash (as the Market appears to think right now) they may be in for a FORCED liquidation.
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
Palm needs to go ahead and mimic Google (out of sheer desperation, naturally) and go "rogue" and start selling these things unsibsidized/unlocked on palm.com ASAP at a steep discount. Or partner with someone (BB? Amazon?) and move these guys out en masse at retail or some other avenue.
$250 for all Pixis. $299 for all Pixi Pluses, $350 for all Pre, $399 for all Pre Pluses. No contracts, no subsidies, no B.S. Just selling these things as straight-up retail devices. If AT&T takes a pass on the WebOS devices, then dump whatever inventory was earmarked for AT&T via the same method. Ruby blamed Verizon last month for their Plus rollout woes and now they are blaming Sprint for their Verizon woes. The finger-pointing with AT&T will begin soon enough. So, c'mon, Ruby, give those nasty carriers a fat middle finger and do an end-run entirely around them to show 'em that lil' Palm can still shake up the system!
Furthermore, release some kind of WebOS 1.4.2 update that will let users "officially" and "legally" bypass the onerous device activation and use them as wi-fi tablets. Also let users access their device data even if the data service is cancelled. This will do wonders to stir up interest from guys like Gary who don't/can't want another contract + expensive monthly service but want to play around with a WebOS device. Finally, release some kind of one-way "dump to desktop" sync utility in case Palm goes tits-up and users want to move their PIM data back to their PCs as a .CSV file or something.
All of the above recommendations might not get them in the black but it'll clear inventory, shake up the moribund wireless industry from its stagnant "contract + subsidy" model, stir up some developer interest, make Google look brilliant, and put Palm's name back in the limelight if only for a few more fleeting moments.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
http://digitaldaily.allthingsd.com/20100319/palm-inventory-issues/
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
From the transcript:
== "...And so, if you look at Q4, you should look beyond the operating
== results for Q4 in terms of cash burn and include in there. Some
== portion of the Q3 liabilities that will be paid in Q4.
==
== Ehud Gelblum – Morgan Stanley
==
== Okay. So the working capital didn't reverse itself the way we thought it was
== going to. So we are going to get that $80 million of hit from working capital,
== whatever it was plus the normal cash burn that would have come out with $150
== million quarter. So we could be looking at something north of $200 million. Is that
== cash burn?..."
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios
See my calc below for channel inventory. Reasonable on your part to quote an analyst, but his numbers seem suspect.
RE: Best case/worst case scenarios for pretastic
That Android Train ...
http://www.tbray.org/ongoing/When/201x/2010/03/17/Nexus-One
Still Calendar delays with webOS these days?
RE: That Android Train ...
Also, I think it's more of a Nexus One CPU thing than an Android 2.1 thing. Every with all of the eye candy turned on, the N1 is quite simply a blazing-fast device no matter how you look at it. The guy in your link above is right on pretty much every count. The N1 is also a lousy-sounding device. It echoes and voice calls sound tinny. The Droid also has digitizer issues and has terrible reception (especially for a Moto CDMA device!). Maybe there's something amiss in the Android telephony stack?? The Pre sounds tons better than the Droid or N1!
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
10% chance of a Hail Mary pass and they survive
Halftime Report: Take A Stab At Palm?
Published: Friday, 19 Mar 2010 | 1:28 PM ET
By: Lee Brodie
Producer
Halftime Report
With a miserable earnings report, even worse outlook and at least two analysts now calling for the stock to trade to $0, are you just dying to take a stab at Palm [PALM 4.01 -1.64 (-29.03%) ]?
Many traders think there could be fast money in this stock as Wall Street whispers about the company's demise.
And we're not just being dramatic, Canaccord Adams analyst Peter Misek, says in a note, 'we no longer see any value in Palm's common equity.'
Also Morgan Joseph analyst Ilya Grozovsky tells the desk ‘the death spiral is accelerating' and in mid-2011 he expects Palm to run out of cash.
Make no mistake, trading Palm is not for the faint of heart.
How should you trade Palm, now?
I've been short Palm for quite some time, explains widely followed hedge fund manager Whitney Tilson of T2. As far as I can see there is just no room for Palm products; they're being crushed by Apple's iPhone [AAPL 222.13 -2.52 (-1.12%) ] and RIM's BlackBerry [RIM 0.018 0.001 (+5.88%) ].
Nothing could help this company at this point -- that is unless they come up with some miraculous new product and I put the odds of that happening at 1% so I'm holding onto my short, Tilson explains.
However, I would not short the stock to $0, Tilson adds, because they've got some cash. My sense is the stock falls to around $1 and then somebody buys them, Tilson speculates.
I'd say the odds are 60% that somebody buys the carcass for a song and 30% that they file for bankruptcy, he adds. And there's a 10% chance of a Hail Mary pass and they survive.
Instant Insights with the Fast Money traders
If you play this name, it's important to understand there's huge short interest in Palm, adds Steve Grasso of Stuart Frankel. In fact shorts are 44% of the shares outstanding. As far as I'm concerned the stock is nothing more than a trading vehicle and I wouldn't stay in it for more than a day. Don't think if the stock rallies, you're safe.
If you're even thinking about a long position in Palm I'd only play it with options, counsels Brian Stutland. Your upside is capped but so is your downside.
As an investor I'd move on, there are better ways to play this space, says Patty Edwards of Storehouse.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/35948740
Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets Sitting Around Waiting For Buyers
Dan Frommer | Mar. 19, 2010, 11:39 AM | 835 | comment 15
Palm gave a disappointing forecast yesterday, and today, shares are down 18%, with one analyst cutting his price target for the stock to $0. Clearly, the turnaround isn't happening as fast as Palm had hoped, and now it may be toast.
One of the company's biggest problems now, thanks to weak sellthrough last quarter by carrier partners, is a massive glut of cellphones stuck in channel inventory.
Specifically, Morgan Stanley analyst Ehud Geldblum estimates in a note today that Palm's total channel inventory is an "alarming" 1.15 million units. That is approximately half a year's worth of retail sales, at last quarter's rate.
Geldblum estimates that if Palm reduces its channel sell-in to 400,000 units this quarter (down from 960,000 last quarter, when it filled Verizon's channel) and if sell-through to consumers increases to 575,000 (up from 408,000 last quarter), Palm will still be stuck with "a full quarter of excess inventory" after the May quarter.
The trouble is that while all those Pre and Pixi devices sit in their boxes waiting to get sold, Palm's rivals keep developing and releasing new, better phones.
"Given the vast inventory overhang, we see little relief for PALM shares in the near-term, and expect the stock to trade closer to our $4 bear case scenario despite the potential longer term value of PALM's webOS platform," Geldblum writes.
RE: Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
RE: Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
In any case, he brought the number up at the earnings call (though the transcript says "$1.1 million" rather than "1.1 million" and the CFO did not argue with it.
RE: Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
RE: Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
RE: Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
They offered Palm to North America first now it may be time to offer Palm to others too.
E-T
RE: Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
It's arleady been tried. Palm had a European design studio going for a while. Initially we had the Treo 750v (preceeding the domestic Treo 750) on Vodafone. That didn't do too terribly well. Then Palm produced the Treo 500, Palm's only non-touchscreen device ever, and it was pretty much a flop back in 2007.
Then there was spposed to be the "Wanda", its replacement, but that never appeared at all (probably a casualty of the great product purge by Rubinstein in 2008). All of these devices ran Windows Mobile, by the way.
Palm has never had a sizable Asian presence, to be perfectly honest. They realize their home turf is their strongest market. Devices with virtual keyboards such as the iPhone are the safest bets for the Asian market as they can be easily and dynamically reskinned and modified for different character, whereas a device with a QWERTY keyboard has to have different keyboard designs fabricated. IMO Palm's mandated QWERTY physical keyboard will always hold them back from any serious inroads in Asia etc.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro
RE: Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
Would a Palm Classic offer a larger market for Palm including Europe?
Would a reunion of the best of Palm produce a product marketable to the globe?
Palm is a pioneer they helped to build a vibrant industry that employs many innovative people. We need to keep out intellectual content in North America too. We may not be able to compete price wise though quality can set us apart. More metal in Palm will bring up the quality while offering more for metal to do too.
E-T
RE: Palm's Huge Inventory Problem: More Than ONE MILLION Handsets
Secondly, they would need to drastically overhaul WebOS for its 2.0 incarnation. It needs to SURPASS Garnet in PIM functionality & capability as well as at least equal iPhone OS & Android for speed. I still maintain that developers will come once they see a compelling platform. Palm may have to cough up some $ to convince Dataviz et al to jump back on the Palm bandwagon.
As far as hardware is concerned, Palm needs to dramatically rethink their hardware approach. Either get out of the hardware biz entirely, or else partner with someone whose hardware is their strength (Asus?). Perhaps lightning can strike twice with a new Ideo-designed device?? The "new classic" Palm needs to at least match HTC for cutting-edge hardware designs. They need to stop playing footsie with the carriers and all of these B.S. exclusives and release EVERY device to EVERY posssible carrier and not drag their feet in the critical European market. When that's not possible, release them unlocked or just retreat from Europe entirely and focus on North America.
Third, they need some sort of "Touch" non-phone device to target the vast amounts of users (not just teens) who cannot/do not want a costly monthly data plan + contract. Palm's name & branding has all but disappeared from retail. A nice $200 4" "WebOS Touch" device and a $400 9" WebOS tablet would help matters tremendously.
Finally, they need to develop their own bulletproof desktop sync/store/encode/import media/storefront tool or at least partner with someone like Nero, Roxio or Doubletwist for some kind of Palm-branded solution.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro
too little, too late
way too little, way too late. to use a football analogy, the clock says two seconds left and Palm is down by 56. 56-0. and they are on their own 1 yard line. i don't care what players you bring in, there's no way they can win in time.
hkk - by the way, where's my radio app test results? i know you Southerners LOVE to take your good old time but my test request post is now buried below a million posts and long forgotten.
when i logged on to Sprint.com i saw this message today -
http://i911.photobucket.com/albums/ac319/ajac09/newscoming-1.jpg
"Sprint Premier Customers: Visit us tomorrow for an exciting announcement about a groundbreaking new device."
IT'S COMING!!!
Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
"I always think of mobile computing as personal computing. This long-term vision has led us through everything -- first the organizers and now through the smart phone space. It's like everything a personal computer is. Continue down that path. What are the implications of a world where everyone has a super high-speed Internet connection in their pocket and many gigabytes of storage, super-fast processors, audio, visual and multimedia? What are the consequences of that? How will that change computing when you have all that stuff available to you all the time? I try to think into the future. That's how we come up with new products." – Jeff Hawkins – July 2005
-----
Sprint to Unveil 4G WiMax Phone
By: Zacks Equity Research
March 19, 2010
Sprint Nextel (S) is on the verge of revolutionizing the US smartphone marketplace as the operator has revealed its plans to introduce its first 4G handset at the CTIA wireless trade show on March 24, 2010, in Las Vegas.
The dual-mode (3G/4G capable) smartphone, called "HTC Supersonic", will run using Google's (GOOG - Analyst Report) Android platform. The device, which is set to be the first 4G compatible phone in the US, has been reportedly included in Sprint's handset inventory list.
Sprint offers its 4G service under the "Sprint 4G" brand leveraging the WiMax (a wireless broadband technology) network operated by Clearwire Corporation (CLWR - Snapshot Report) in which it holds a 51% stake. The network offers average download speeds of 3-6 megabits per second (Mbps) with peak speed exceeding 10 Mbps.
HTC Supersonic (also dubbed HTC A9292 WiMax) features a 4.3-inch touchscreen display, a 5 megapixel camera, HTC Sense user interface, GPS and Qualcomm's (QCOM - Analyst Report) 1 gigabertz (GHz) Snapdragon processor. The device will be targeted at enterprise and government markets besides consumers.
Sprint leapfrogged over its larger US peers Verizon (VZ - Analyst Report) and AT&T (T - Analyst Report) by becoming the first carrier to deploy 4G services in the US, which was launched in Baltimore in October 2008. The company's 4G services now cover 27 markets and 32 million people in the US and are expected to address 120 million people by 2010.
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
Back in 2005 that was still pretty much a dream. My god -- the iPad will have 64GB and the iPhone 4G and iPod Touch III probably will too.
One thing Hawkins didn't see was the social and location-based aspects it would birth.
Eh, but what does he care now? He playing with neuro-algorithms.
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
Also, consider this. AT&T and Verizon have both chosen to go with LTE as their preferred 4G standard. Going with WiMax on Sprint will lead you down the path to another proprietary technology. I know how much you love that.
And before anybody asks, I'm staying in tonight, thus the Friday night post. I've got an early morning flight tomorrow, **** off.
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
>AT&T offers 7.2 mbps on limited handsets
i'm skeptical. source? specifics? phones? real world actual speed consistent? coverage area size of postage stamp? i highly doubt AT&T's shit network comes close to Sprint's 4G.
Sprint 4G is NOW. others are still vaporware. i'll take NOW over vaporware.
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
Most newer 3G phones can take advantage of the enhanced speed. My iPhone 3G does 3.6 mbps, but the iPhone 3GS does 7.2 mbps.
Don't fall for the marketing gimmick. Sprint isn't this lightspeed company that releases technology decades before others are ready. 4G is nothing more than a silly label right now.
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
never confuse "theoretical" and "tested". you're the one that's falling for marketing gimmicks and propaganda. you should know better.
we shall see when the Supersonic arrives. maybe i'll even take mine over to the Apple or AT&T store just to break some balls.
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
hmmn. this is a new rumor - from our old friend the bearded wonder -
"The Supersonic will reportedly be on store shelves a week or so after CTIA comes to an end."
http://www.brighthand.com/default.asp?newsID=16339&news=HTC+Incredible+HTC+Supersonic+HTC+HD2+CTIA
if so, i wonder if the good people at Sprint will let me upgrade early???
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
Aren't you a Sprint premier customer? If so you should be eligible for an annual upgrade. You did just pay "discounted full retail price" for your Centro ($250ish) so you didn't renew your contract at that time, did ya?
I'm just worried that they are going to clobber people with either mandatory 4G service on the SS or exhorbitant $/mb charges when in a 4G area.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
yes, i bought the Centro off contract.
BUT my annual "Premier" upgrade anniversary isn't technically until June 1. hence, April 1 would be 2 months early.
i don't think Sprint will charge extra for 4G service for smartphones. although they might require a minimum monthly $ plan - ie $69 or $99 plan. my guess is $69.
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
Android, outside of Archos, does MP4/3GP video, period (just like the iPhone -- grrrr, don't get me started...).
RE: Jeff Hawkins' Dream Come True
i don't know. i don't watch video on my Centro. i only listen to live radio (via pockettunes). i don't really care about video. but maybe i will start with a 4.3" display????? i'm not big on downloading/buying/collecting audio and video files. i like live streams. Sprint TV is included in my plan but i never watch it. 99% of what's available is garbage. in fact, 99% of ALL TV and movies today is garbage.
i like to stream Bloomberg Radio or Hot 97 as i surf the web and check email. this makes a 2+ mile hike go very quickly. i made some posts today from my Centro while out in the sun out in the wild.
Palm Garnet -> iPhone
http://www.macosxhints.com/article.php?story=20100317095036825
Any other posts like this elsewhere? What did others do? Hello abosco?
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
PalmOS to iPhoneOS migration notes
http://web.me.com/flashsheridan/postings/PalmOS_to_iPhoneOS_migration_notes.html#Notes
Centro---------->Android
CENTRO TO ANDROID PIM MIGRATION
1. Backup Centro to microSD Card via BBVFS.
2. Delete All Contacts on Centro.
3. Use Versamail App EAS to Sync Centro Calendar to Gmail Calendar.
4. Hard Reset Erase Centro.
5. Restore Centro from microSD Card via BBVFS.
6. Use Synthesis SyncML App to Sync Centro Contacts to Gmail Contacts.
7. Sync Android Device to Gmail Contacts and Calendar.
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
notes -
1. Synthesis SyncML only supports Contacts - NOT Calendar.
2. Versamail EAS to Gmail Contacts adds gobbledygook "****PLMO****" in a field on the Contacts transfer. hence, the need to use SyncML for the one-time Contacts Sync transfer and not EAS.
3. the hard reset ensures that you are not attempting to sync Contacts twice.
hence - the above gymnastics are contortions are required.
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
It's virtually painless and it's been done many, many times in the last three years. I can't wait to upgrade, my old 3G is starting to get long in the tooth. The back has lost some of its shine since I don't use a case, and the power button needs a harder press these days. I pressed the power button on my girlfriend's 3GS and it felt like switching to a new razor blade. Crisp and luxurious. Also, my screen and glass are still in perfect condition.
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
Don't mess around with all of this complexity. When you get your Android unit, reinstall Palm Desktop onto your PC. Do a final Hotsync from Centro to Palm Desktop. Then just use Companionlink to do a one-time sync from Palm Desktop to the cloud. Then do as I have been doing and manually do some "spring cleaning" and truncate any extraneous gobbledygook or jumbled Contacts fields or data. Easy, fast and painless. Well, the manual pruning and editing of your contacts isn't that fast & painless but it's a good thing to do a few times per decade. I figure we have at MINIMUM 2years on Android, so we might as well make the platform leap with both feet.
Are you going to keep your Centro 128mb around without active service as a spare device with your PIM data still on it? You should, as it's arguably the finest Palm OS device ever made. You cannot do that with a WebOS device without resorting to all kind of silly hackery, you know!
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
hkk -
1. i have a 32 Bit Windows 7 Netbook. not sure if Palm Desktop and sync works. i've never installed it.
2. how was the CompanionLink sync? was there much garbage in the transfer? SyncML works good for Contacts and Versamail EAS works good for Calendar - but only for the first sync. i get errors thereafter. AND i have to do the gymnastics to do sync with both and get the proper transfer. but i like it because it's all OTA from Centro-->Google and i don't have to download any software on my Netbook.
3. my Sprint Centro will get deactivated and go back in its box and be stored in the closet as a backup in case i lose or break my Supersonic. i went through the trauma already once of breaking my phone and having no backup only to be at the mercy of Sprint and other Retailers wanting to charge me MSRP for a frickin new Centro! luckily, i was able to schmooze the kid at Best Buy to give me a new Centro for $250 instead of the $500+ MSRP because it was on closeout. luckily, they still had one left and luckily, they cut me a deal. albeit $250 was still painful. but when you need a phone and you have no backup or landline or Contacts/Calendar you pay what you have to pay! no time for eBay in those situations! i'll never let that happen to me again. my Contacts/Calendar only existed in the broken Centro and on two microSD cards via BBVFS backup. hence, i was anxious to get my hands on a new Centro quickly and do a Restore. AND i'm anxious to get an Android device so i can start doing a regular OTA sync with Google so i can re-sync with any device should this happen again.
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
No, Palm Desktop only works on 32-bit versions of XP & Vista. Let me rephrase that: IIRC, Hotsync via USB doesn't work on 7. I've personally never tried it and reports vary if it works when in compatibility mode on 32-bit (x86) versions of 7. I know for a fact Hotsync doesn't work under any 64-bit versions of Windows.
Palm Desktop 6.2 on its own installs and works fine under 7 and you can do a BT Hotsync. You just cannot do a hardwired USB sync. Palm and Access never bothered to develop a proper driver for 64-bit Windows OSes and it's not like MS is going to bother developing one for inclusion with the OS.
The CompanionLink sync worked surprisingly well, to be honest. I had some junk to clean out (probably is more in there that I haven't gotten around to catching yet) and it wasn't as seamless as Palm's one-way Palm Desktop migration tool for WebOS devices but it still works rather well.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
Con - you've been reading too many post-apocalyptic, George Orwell type books. nobody wants your data.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZdXfkkyI1nQ
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: Palm Garnet -> iPhone
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: androidforums.com
Have a nice day!
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->Pilot Pro->IIIe->IIIc->M500->M505->M515->T3->T5->Treo 650P->Treo 700P->Droid
RE: androidforums.com
http://www.droidforums.net/
Have a nice day!
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->Pilot Pro->IIIe->IIIc->M500->M505->M515->T3->T5->Treo 650P->Treo 700P->Droid
RE: androidforums.com
Have a nice day!
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->Pilot Pro->IIIe->IIIc->M500->M505->M515->T3->T5->Treo 650P->Treo 700P->Droid
This wasn't revealed until the Good Friday holiday
Note the Sprint change. Imagine the Verizon change to come.
RE: This wasn't revealed until the Good Friday holiday
RE: This wasn't revealed until the Good Friday holiday
As a cynical Palm-pessimist, of course, I see this holiday release of such news to be both purposeful and right up the same alley as The Infamous Chinese New Years shutdown.
YMMV, of course.
RE: This wasn't revealed until the Good Friday holiday
Where does that leave Palm? International carriers, going rogue and selling unlocked handsets, prepaid/MVNO offerings, and a Pixi on T-Mobile?
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro
Time to pull the trigger. Buyout at $1.50
Where does that leave Palm? International carriers, going rogue and selling unlocked handsets, prepaid/MVNO offerings, and a Pixi on T-Mobile?"
None of the above. Foleo 2 drops shortly and is gonna rock your world harder than a Chinese tanker filled with iPads.
Evo Schmevo*...
*If it wasn`t for Evo, Droid, iPhone, RIM, etc Palm would be selling Pres and Pixis like hotcakes. Instead, the creative accounting charade could only continue for so many quarters before the (partially masked) truth slipped out. Chinese New Year, only selling less than 20 million dollars worth of product outside USA last quarter, publicly turning on Verizon and blaming them for Palm`s failures, Verizon cutting its losses and dumping Palm for good, the channel getting ``cleverly`` stuffed with over 6 months worth of product, Sprint freezing Pre + Pixi orders for several months, the impending need for Palm to eat a few hundred million dollars worth of inventory and landfill them like the good old days circa 2001, the iPhone coming out on Verizon in a few months, the stock rapidly heading to sub-$1 levels, Elevation Partners losing its shirt... the hits just keep on coming.
Palm will be bought out very soon. Poor Rubes has a fatal case of Helsinki syndrome.
RE: This wasn't revealed until the Good Friday holiday
Are you going to replace your Sprint Centro with the Evo?
For the first time in.....forever, I'm considering jumping ship from VZW. The Droid is decent but it still needs a jolt in terms of RAM & CPU along with screen size.
The Sprint combination of cheap 3G + voice, optional 4G (it's available where I am already), and the scintillating Evo hardware makes that a hard combination to pass up. I've been playing with an HD2 for the past few days and it's quite impressive. Most of my complaints can be attributed to its creaky WinMob 6.5 underpinnings.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro
Palm to be sold to Nokia. Announcement coming soon?
Are you going to replace your Sprint Centro with the Evo?
For the first time in.....forever, I'm considering jumping ship from VZW. The Droid is decent but it still needs a jolt in terms of RAM & CPU along with screen size.
The Sprint combination of cheap 3G + voice, optional 4G (it's available where I am already), and the scintillating Evo hardware makes that a hard combination to pass up. I've been playing with an HD2 for the past few days and it's quite impressive. Most of my complaints can be attributed to its creaky WinMob 6.5 underpinnings."
Not right now. I bought a couple of new 128 MB Centros from fleaBay a while back and will probably use a Centro as my main wireless-connected PDA for a long time. Palm did a nice job coming up with the small-but-signficant improvements seen in the Centro 2: keyboard feel, rubberized paint, doubled RAM, etc. I like the small size, the coating on the case, the speed, the grippy buttons on the keyboard and the fact that I have all of my familiar old apps and PIM at my fingertips. The Centro also has one of the best form factors I've seen for a smartphone and I see no reason to give up on such a solid package just because there's something newer on the market. Furthermore, last I heard WiMAX isn't scheduled to arrive in SF for a while yet.
I also have an unlocked 64 MB white Centro bought from Newegg when they were blowing them out for peanuts in 2009 and use it occasionally on AT&T. The hard plasticky keyboard and the lack of rubberized paint make the GSM Centro feel like a cheap toy compared to the Sprint Centro 2. And the GSM Centro's voice quality sucks compared to most CDMA phones.
FJH
Latest Comments
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OUCH!
Man, that must have given some people a sinking feeling in their stomachs.
>>>The company shipped a total of 960,000 smartphone units during the quarter... Smartphone sell-through for the third quarter was 408,000 units, down 29 percent from the second quarter of fiscal year 2010 and down 15 percent year-over-year.
That's also not good. The population is small and the percent keeps dropping.
Ouch.