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Comments on: palmOne Sells 1.5 Million Tungsten E Handhelds

palmOne has announced that the Tungsten E handheld has sold 1.5 million units worldwide in just 14 months. The TE has proven enormously popular with budget-conscious professionals and consumers alike, helping it achieve a remarkable 21 percent of all U.S. handheld sales in its first year on the market, according to The NPD Group.
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E

drw @ 12/22/2004 8:46:09 PM #
replace the hard graffiti with a thumbpad, add bluetooth, sd wifi drivers, all for $199 and you got me sold...

---
David
RE: E
abosco @ 12/22/2004 11:00:34 PM #
Yes, that's what the market needs now, but you know what, for the past year, the T|E has proven a great device. This is the moneymaker for PalmOne right now. This just goes to show you what a good value for the money can get you along with some strong advertising.

-Bosco
NX80v + Wifi + BT + T637
RE: E
Calroth @ 12/23/2004 6:23:57 AM #
"replace the hard graffiti with a thumbpad, add bluetooth, sd wifi drivers, all for $199..."

If PalmOne did all that for $199, they would probably be losing money. So they have no incentive to do it...

RE: E
MoveableTech51 @ 12/23/2004 12:47:29 PM #
Gee, maybe we throw in the kitchen sink too for $199? Seriously, I'm glad that the TE sells so well. The success in the marketplace of the TE shows that what the public wants is Simple To Use, not a lot of expensive features (like Windoze Mobile). The under $200 handheld is desired by many.

Most handheld users I've talked to seem to use the darn things for contact lists, appointments and an occasional game with an easy to see color screen. This group also includes WindozeMobile users too, so let's not hear any griping from the WinCEHeads.

RE: E
vesther @ 12/23/2004 1:08:54 PM #
Drw

The Thumbpad, 802.11x Certification, Bluetooth 1.x compliance would only add more to the cost and also the following on your wishlist were more of high-end features and not beginner-friendly features. The only think I want changed on the Tungsten E on the revision is the implementation of the Multi-Connector. The Processor and Memory is all up to PalmOne, but I'd rather see palmOne not implement NAND Flash and/or the controversial NVFS File System at all, since the Tungsten T5 and Treo 650 is plagued with this kind of controversy.

Powered by Palm OS since March 2002

RE: I thought the TE was the best value Palm has ever made
Cheetah @ 12/24/2004 4:31:52 AM #
The TE was basically the successor to the Vx (505) that everyone wanted. After the success of the Vx (505) everyone asked for these features:

Vx form factor
Hi Res Screen
Long battery life
Virtual Graffiti area

Although the TE did not have a virtual graffiti area, it was only $200 making it the best VALUE of Palm history.

I really liked my T/E, and only just upgraded to the T5 which is like the T/E in many ways, except it does have the virtual Graffiti area (although not as good a value)

NIce job palmOne

twizza @ 12/23/2004 12:28:46 AM #
Nice job palmOne with the TE. There is nothing fancy about it, it just works and they made it a heck of a value. The only improvements that I would like to see to it are the NAND memory and a larger battery for better battery life. I think that the amount of space within it is quite well for a $200 device. And I do not think that a VG device at $200 will look good for the T5, lest the t5 is dropped to the more TE2-liek price of $300-$325. I could see that working for palmOne. Then they can have their Tungsten 7-series running Cobalt, and whether it sells well or not, it gets the prices of the Garnet devices down even more and [hopefully] breathes life back into the PDA sector.

About that Knowing you TE book; it would be better if it came as an ebook in eReader or even as an application and print book. In that way a person could go with the book for some things and just the PDA for others (making a smoother transistion).

Welcome back Ryan. It is good to see you back here. Hope that you are feeling better :)

antoinerjwright.com

Tungsten E was meant for Beginners
vesther @ 12/23/2004 10:21:28 AM #
First of all, the Tungsten E is supposed to be a Entry-Level, Beginner-Friendly Model. Using NAND Memory (with the controversial NVFS File System) would only add more cost to the already affordable Tungsten E. I would stick with "Classic" Memory, but replace the USB/Power Connector with the Multi-Connector.

Second of all, not too many people favor the Thumbboard whatsoever. Only extremely hardcore Palm Enthusiasts would like the Thumbboard, but most of the time, favor the Active Input Area with 33% more screen than typical Palm-Powered Handhelds.

Third of all, not too many beginners use Bluetooth and/or Wi-Fi. The Tungsten E (like the Treo 600) is supposed to be marketed as a Beginner's device, so I think that the absence of Wireless is a welcome feature because there is still a segment for handhelds that are suitable for beginners. Bluetooth and Wi-Fi are highly regarded as Advanced Features, and I don't think that beginners would welcome those features yet.

Finally, the only likely features that will be implemented on the Tungsten E2 (likely the Tungsten E2 will also be a Beginner-Friendly Handheld) will be the following:

* Palm OS Garnet (Latest Possible Version)
* Multi-Connector


Powered by Palm OS since March 2002

RE: beginners and...
Cheetah @ 12/24/2004 4:38:00 AM #
yes, the TE was intended for beginners (although probably business beginners), but I had one and really liked it. I am certainly not a PDA beginner, and in fact usually snap up every other Palm produced.

However I didn't buy a T1, T2 or T3 because I didn't like the battery life nor the slider.

When the T5 came out it bought it at it's pre-introduction.

RE: NIce job palmOne
theog @ 12/27/2004 1:41:14 AM #
You can get the T5 brand new on the net already for $330... still too high, but I got one... after a nightmare week with a Dell X30 mid.

Vote for John Kerry... best man for the job.

Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q

Gekko @ 12/23/2004 8:21:28 AM #

My Prediction? MORE PAIN.

Palmsource Inc (NASDAQ NM:PSRC)
11.75 -1.48 / -11.18% 6:27 PM ET
12/22/2004

"Donít wait for the Last Judgment. It takes place every day." - Albert Camus



RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
relyons @ 12/23/2004 9:31:11 AM #
In Gekko's world, achievements are not recognized.

In Gekko's world, good news must be drowned out by bad news.

In Gekko's world, people must be berated with their failures.

In Gekko's world, horses continue to be beaten well after their death.

I am blessed that I donít live in Gekkoís world.

RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
relyons @ 12/23/2004 9:42:49 AM #
In my world, I am thankful that the Treo 600 and the Tungsten E are the solid foundation of Palm's continued success.

In my world, I am thankful that the healthcare application we're developing looks great on our Tungsten T5 device.

In my world, I am thankful that Palm continues to emphasize the "Zen of Palm" over unnecessary feature bloat.

In my world, I am genuinely concerned about Palm's future but still believe they are the best of breed today and will be the best of breed at the end of 2005.

I am thankful for Palm this year.

RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
mikecane @ 12/23/2004 10:59:54 AM #
>>>I am blessed that I donít live in Gekkoís world.

What country are you in? I'm the USA where George the Cowboy currently reigns. This *is* Gekko's world!

RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Gekko @ 12/23/2004 1:30:05 PM #

In my world, you either do it right, or you get eliminated.



RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Strider_mt2k @ 12/23/2004 3:05:13 PM #
I'd like to live in world in-between the doom and gloom and the rose colored glasses.

One that's more real.



RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
RhinoSteve @ 12/23/2004 7:27:46 PM #
Yes, but what is "right"?
RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Gekko @ 12/23/2004 7:33:38 PM #

>"Yes, but what is "right"?

Delivering value/innovation to customers and delivering earnings/returns to shareholders.



RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
svrontis @ 12/23/2004 9:29:05 PM #
> In my world, you either do it right, or you get eliminated.

If so, then M$ ought to be extinct by now. Think again.

RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Foo Fighter @ 12/23/2004 11:16:34 PM #
God help me, I almost want to see the Palm platform fail and disappear forever just to see where Gekko will go from here, with no adversary to contend with. I have him pictured as a manic soccer mom still sitting in the stands long after the game is over...staring at an empty field, mumbling to himself.

-------------------------------
Editor, http://Pocketfactory.com
Contributing Editor, http://digitalmediathoughts.com
RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Gekko @ 12/24/2004 8:34:12 AM #

I'll probably jump to Windows Mobile 2005 on a Dell Axim VGA/WIFI in Q1/Q2 2005.

I'm just hoping that MSFT polishes out most of the rough edges of Windows Mobile in the 2005 version.



RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Foo Fighter @ 12/24/2004 10:32:04 AM #
I just got an Axim X50v. One word: SWEEEEEEEEEEET!. PalmOne had better introduce VGA screen models next year, because this thing even makes the lovely HVGA T5 screen look like yesterday's oatmeal by comparison. I have NEVER seen a screen so crisp and razor sharp on a mobile device. The new high-res icons are quite nice too.

-------------------------------
Editor, http://Pocketfactory.com
Contributing Editor, http://digitalmediathoughts.com
RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Gekko @ 12/24/2004 12:15:03 PM #

>"If so, then M$ ought to be extinct by now. Think again."

You are in the minority. ~96% of PC users out there disagree with you.



Welcome to "Gekkoville"
mikecane @ 12/24/2004 4:57:51 PM #
RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
svrontis @ 12/24/2004 6:02:16 PM #
> You are in the minority. ~96% of PC users out there disagree with you.

Like the majority, I have Windoze on the office laptop and my home laptop. The latter runs on WindozeME. It's garbage. Before that I have a desktop which ran Windoze98. That was even worse. So, my experience shows that M$ has been producing dud products for at least 6 years. They have not got it right the first time or, from what I have seen, ever. And yet M$ is a prosperous company. So your conjecture is clearly false. Think again.

RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Gekko @ 12/24/2004 8:50:12 PM #

svrontis - so go buy a crApple and shut up.

Merry Christmas!

RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Gekko @ 12/24/2004 8:51:01 PM #

hey MikeCon - Merry Christmas!

Scrooge Defended
by Michael Levin

It's Christmas again, time to celebrate the transformation of Ebenezer Scrooge. You know the ritual: boo the curmudgeon initially encountered in Charles Dickens's A Christmas Carol, then cheer the sweetie pie he becomes in the end. It's too bad no one notices that the curmudgeon had a point-quite a few points, in fact.

http://www.mises.org/fullarticle.asp?control=110&month=3&title=Scrooge+Defended&id=3



RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
svrontis @ 12/26/2004 2:43:14 PM #
Gekko, I have responded to late to wish you a Merry Christmas, but I hope Old Saint Nick did the right thing by you. Wishing you a very happy and prosperous New Year.

By the way, I'm seeing more and more positive reviews of the T5 on the net. Here is another one:

http://lifesway.blogspot.com/2004/12/my-new-palm-tungsten-t5.html

Looks like more and more people are getting over the petulant 'WAAAAAAAAA, NO WIFI' initial reactions.

RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
svrontis @ 12/26/2004 3:12:20 PM #
Well, Gekko, you have proved me wrong. I expected that none of the regular visitors here would be aware of the Von Mises website, let alone read its articles. If you haven't already done so, get the download of 'Human Action' - there is some good economics in that text - and it will knock the socks off that Anthony Robbins trash you have been reading. (BTW, memoware.com has versions you can read on your palmpilot!)
RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
Gekko @ 12/26/2004 6:29:05 PM #

svrontis -

1. That schmo on blogspot upgraded from a Vx to a T5. If a totally-blind man goes to 20/200 vision, of course it will look great to him - even though 20/200 sucks. In other words, it's all relative. You know he's blinded to the T5's faults by seeing color and hi-res for the first time. And of course there's the self-justification of the purchase that dies hard.

2. Anthony Robbins? I don't think so.



RE: Shipments of Palm OS devices fell another 8% last Q
ackmondual @ 12/27/2004 10:21:21 PM #
"
svrontis - so go buy a crApple and shut up.

Merry Christmas!
"


"
I'll probably jump to Windows Mobile 2005 on a Dell Axim VGA/WIFI in Q1/Q2 2005.

I'm just hoping that MSFT polishes out most of the rough edges of Windows Mobile in the 2005 version.
"

>
U can apply the same type of advice u gave to svrontis for yourself. Go buy a Dell Axim VGA/WIFI when it comes out and shut up!

Better yet, get the Axim v50 NOW so that u can shut up NOW.

Happy Holidays :D :)

Last throes of no connectivity...

pkuhns @ 12/23/2004 9:52:46 AM #
there is no way a device like this will ever sell again. Palm did a great job of beating this IR-only dead horse.

Nokia 3650 bluetooth magnate
RE: Last throes of no connectivity...
hotpaw4 @ 12/23/2004 2:27:52 PM #
someone wrote:
> there is no way a device like this will ever sell again.

There is no way any high tech device will sell well after technology advances a bit (collectors artifacts excepted). This includes whatever fancy Nokia/HP/etc. device you are looking forward to buy next year, it will be soon be more cruft in the junk bin. The game (unless you are a monopoly acting illegally) is to milk the market for as much profit as you can while you still can: 1.5 million units at $199 a pop, retail, is a lot of cream, even if they never sell another unit. But they will.

BTW, IR-only devices can be connected to the net quite easily, even on the road.


RE: Last throes of no connectivity...
twrock @ 12/24/2004 2:23:51 AM #
"there is no way a device like this will ever sell again. Palm did a great job of beating this IR-only dead horse."

Disagree. It's still selling now. And so are PDA's with far less features. Granted, I'd like to see a TE2 with Bluetooth, full screen and two card slots, but I think that'd probably hurt the T5 sales too much for p1 to dare.

On the other hand, trying to sell the T5 at a premium price-point when the top of the line Dell sells for only slightly more and is packed with everything but the kitchen sink is asking users to pay for a thoroughbred race horse when their really only getting a Shetland pony. Who know? Maybe I'm wrong and they'll pull it off.

The TE is what it is, and the price reflects that.

RE: agree with twr
Cheetah @ 12/24/2004 4:40:56 AM #
Not everyone wants a PDA/Phone, nor WiFi, etc.

I am a huge gadget guy, and love my Palm and Cell (Motorola with Bluetooth which is essential for me as it connects to my car audio system) but I don't use my PDA to go on the internet, and I want my PDA and Cell to be separate units.

For me, I hope Palm continues to make stand-a-lone yet high end PDAs

RE: Last throes of no connectivity...
RhinoSteve @ 12/29/2004 1:54:22 PM #
There is always a market for connectionless PDAs. Most of you live it too much of a technically sophisiticated world to realize there are lots that don't want this technology around them. I predict there will be more good selling, low end PDAs like this for years and years to come.

No more dedicated input areas!

Strider_mt2k @ 12/23/2004 10:41:43 AM #
VG is the way to go, and we all know it.

It's time.

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
vesther @ 12/23/2004 1:05:21 PM #
Active Input is NOT for all Palm OS users as there are some who are more used to Dedicated Input Areas. Active Input is more of a High-End Feature that including that with the Tungsten E2 would only add extra cost to a $200 Handheld. I'd say that Active Input is more of an Advanced Users feature.

Oh on a side note, I found out that Decuma would only crash the Tungsten T5 so for those of you who want Decuma on Tungsten T5--DON'T DO IT--it will only cause problems. My Tungsten T5 became more stable after I deleted it.

Anyway, Active Input is pretty much a High-End Feature. Dedicated Input is pretty much a beginner's feature.

Powered by Palm OS since March 2002

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
Ou_Boet @ 12/23/2004 1:48:07 PM #
I have to lend support for VG. I don't think it's an advanced feature, it's an basic feature.

OB

-------------------------------------------------
Any device can have one more useful feature added.

HandEra Moderator at [url="http://www.PalmVenue.com/forum"]PalmVenue[/url]

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
twrock @ 12/23/2004 9:46:41 PM #
Yep, OB's got it right. After a forced "downgrade" from a HandEra 330 to a TT2, the #1 feature I miss is VG. I can't imagine now that the p1 has put out the T3 and T5 it would cost them more than a couple of bucks a unit to put out a TE2 with VG. Sheesh, add VG and you could sell TE2 right now for $25 more and the market would go for it. Better yet, keep the $199 and make it up in volume sales.

(I doubt they'd do it though; they've now got the T5's to unload, and a TE2 with that addition would look too attractive.)

Oh, and p1, two SD slots, please?

Tapwave? How about a non-game-based machine? HandEra? Please come back.

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
Foo Fighter @ 12/23/2004 11:25:45 PM #
Vesther, stop regurgitating palmOne press releases. Adding virtual input DOES NOT increase cost; neither does adding WiFi. Hell, Pocket PC vendors have been doing it for years at price points far less than palmOne charges for the T5. And we are now seeing VGA-screened PPCs dangerously approaching the T5 in price as well, which is further proof that palmOne is simply trying to pad margins by chiseling its customer base out of features that are STANDARD on "other" platforms...which is likely the reason why we are seeing a parallel fall of PalmOS handheld sales in contrast to RISING Pocket PC sales. Go figure.

HVGA is no longer a high-end feature now that PPCs offer even higher res VGA screens. PalmOne should deliver HVGA at a lower price since it can only be considered a "middle-of-the-road" screen resolution. And before another moron here tries to says it can't be done, just look at Tapwave; they already offer a $299 model with such a screen as well.

Wake up and smell the pixels.

-------------------------------
Editor, http://Pocketfactory.com
Contributing Editor, http://digitalmediathoughts.com

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
ocspub @ 12/24/2004 1:19:46 AM #
> And before another moron here tries to says it can't be done,
> just look at Tapwave; they already offer a $299 model with
> such a screen as well.

That would be $269 for the Zodiac 1 after the recent price reduction.

Oliver


Visit www.tapland.com for Zodiac news and discussion.

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
Strider_mt2k @ 12/24/2004 7:51:52 AM #
One of the problems I will be facing when my beloved TH55 dies (it can't last forever) is what compromises to accept in it's replacement.

A 320x480 screen with VG is going to be very hard to give up unless the alternative is much cooler.


RE: No more dedicated input areas!
vesther @ 12/24/2004 10:33:33 AM #
...which comes to a conclusion why we are paying more for less...is because we are actually paying for the PalmOne Name. Certain companies can charge really high for less features so that people can end up paying for a particular company name. Like with every Tungsten T5 we are paying a lot for the palmOne company name.

Maybe Tapwave, Handera, and even some newer licensees (Oh, I hope I see more Palm OS Licensees in the future) can get an affordable handheld with robust features--which would force me to get out of the palmOne bandwagon...

I just hate it when I have to pay less just because the majority of the money I spend is to pay up for a company's name--just like Intel is making us pay the Intel Name for every processor we buy.

Powered by Palm OS since March 2002

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
Gekko @ 12/24/2004 12:03:34 PM #
>"I just hate it when I have to pay less just because the majority of the money I spend is to pay up for a company's name--just like Intel is making us pay the Intel Name for every processor we buy."

Don't you dare compare Intel to those knuckleheads that run palmOne/PalmSource. Look at what Intel has done over the years - doubling processor power every ~18 months (Moore's Law) - along with providing super high quality products as well as all of the other patents/innovations they've created throughout the years - that's what you're paying for. Intel delivers value to the customer. Are they the cheapest? No. But some products offer a quality edge that are worth paying a little extra for. If you want CHEAP, go buy an AMD machine.



RE: No more dedicated input areas!
Ou_Boet @ 12/24/2004 12:34:57 PM #
Hey don't slam AMD. I've only ever had AMD processors in my home computers and I've never had a problem with them in nearly 10 years. And when I was doing my buying they were significantly cheaper and Intel stuff of similar performance.

OB

-------------------------------------------------
Any device can have one more useful feature added.

HandEra Moderator at [url="http://www.PalmVenue.com/forum"]PalmVenue[/url]

So is it VG or 320*480 that we want?
tfftruoa @ 12/24/2004 12:57:31 PM #
Out of curiousity, do people want a 320*480 display or just a display without a dedicated graffiti area?

How about a 320*320 screen with no dedicated graffiti area? It would make the device slightly smaller than the TT without a slider and with OS5.x graffiti anywhere (And a toggle of some kind to control it), most people would hardly notice the difference.

Sharp Wizard-->Handspring Visor "Deluxe"-->Sony Clie SJ30-->Palm Tungsten T3 w/ SE T68i

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
Ou_Boet @ 12/24/2004 1:53:27 PM #
Having portrait and landscape modes is very usefull for document editing and spreadsheeting - as well as photo viewing.

Adding VG gets you that without adding length or size to the original PDA.

OB

-------------------------------------------------
Any device can have one more useful feature added.

HandEra Moderator at [url="http://www.PalmVenue.com/forum"]PalmVenue[/url]

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
twrock @ 12/24/2004 11:29:20 PM #
"Out of curiousity, do people want a 320*480 display or just a display without a dedicated graffiti area?"

If we are taking a poll, I want a full VGA screen in a sub-$200 unit. But I do try to be a bit of a realist.

So, since that isn't likely possible in the near future, I agree with OB (once again). The bottom line for me, regardless of the resolution, is to have a retangular screen with virtual graffiti. (Incidentally, HandEra was doing some interesting things with their VG implementation in beta versions of OS4.)

Oh, I almost forgot, give me Graffiti 1, at least as an option.

RE: No more dedicated input areas!
hotpaw4 @ 12/27/2004 3:18:06 PM #
Dedicated input areas save significant power (backlight and refresh). Some customers prefer longer battery life for a given device volume and weight.

The active matrix panels with less pixels also have higher manufacturing yields which can lead to higher profits.


1,5M sold, .5 returned?

mikecane @ 12/23/2004 11:00:45 AM #
I hope the quality of those other units are better than mine! The screen is contracting paralysis, the G area is just garbage, and the OS stability leaves a lot to be desired...

RE: 1,5M sold, .5 returned?
mikecane @ 12/23/2004 11:05:22 AM #
...I also forgot: the squeal of that screen is driving me mad! Louder every day...

RE: 1,5M sold, .5 returned?
tfftruoa @ 12/23/2004 1:07:23 PM #
About the screen squeel, I'm having the same issue with my T3. PXA clocker seems to eliminate that and I'd assume lightspeed for the TE would be able to do the same.

Sharp Wizard-->Handspring Visor "Deluxe"-->Sony Clie SJ30-->Palm Tungsten T3 w/ SE T68i
RE: 1,5M sold, .5 returned?
LiveFaith @ 12/23/2004 4:12:01 PM #
tff,
You're rightabout the clock speed & screen whine. The TE doesn't have a lot of room to slow like the T3 tho. I just got a brand new T3 and it had a quite screen. After a week now it is starting to ramp up the whine. Strange.

Pat Horne; www.churchoflivingfaith.com

discussion forums

pgmr1 @ 12/28/2004 11:08:57 AM #
I am chagrined to see the disappearance of the discussion forums. Without this, people will find other forums ie PPC. Does anyone know if this is permanent, or just temporary. It seems like censorship.

RE: discussion forums
Strider_mt2k @ 12/28/2004 11:45:20 AM #
Leaving a PalmOS site to go to a PPC site, right.

Censorship, right.

I don't think you are even close to the target on those shots.


RE: discussion forums
pgmr1 @ 12/30/2004 8:44:27 AM #
I just miss the forums and see no logical explanation for pulling the plug. Do you? Lack of this kind of support is not the way to maintain a loyal customer base.

RE: discussion forums
hkklife @ 12/30/2004 11:22:44 AM #
Ryan's been having some technical issues with the forums. They are a very resource-intensive area of the site. It could also be $-related and/or an issue of bandwidth costs. I've said it before and I'll say it again---offer a "donate to PIC" PayPal link on the main page and many of the regulars, myself included, would cheerfully make a donation or two. Just don't make site-wide "subscriptions" or block off parts of the forums to subscribers only. That elitist country-club atmosphhere ends of driving away the lurkers and stifling the open-minded banter and discussion for 99% of sites that attempt it.

Maybe one reason for the sales numbers on the TE

joad @ 1/2/2005 4:45:32 PM #
Maybe one reason for the sales numbers on the Tungsten E is that PalmOne doesn't seem to have anything much better than it available for people to purchase. Their current lineup:

*Treo 600: Low-res screen, minimal memory, poor camera, very inconsistent build quality. Still the most usable smartphone, even though the 650 is touted as an "upgrade."

*Treo 650: Nice improvements over the 600, but $599.99 for 33-40% LESS memory than the already underpowered Treo 600 makes it a non-starter except to people without much to use it for, or very patient, wealthy and forgiving Palm users that are willing to buy and implement numerous hardware and software workarounds in order to create enough usable memory to do anything useful with it.

*Tungsten "T3": (Hopefully) last of the hardware "slider" devices, which were nearly unusable 1-handed, bad build quality which results in lost screws (that P1 ignorantly refuses to cover under warranty- charges innocent users $125.00 to fix!). Nice screen and memory specs, problems implementing many applications into it's rectangular screen.

*Tungsten "T5": Some nice improvements (dumped the flaky "slider", thinner, beautiful screen), but the fact P1 DROPPED the vibrating alarms is a good indication that they pinched a few pennies in other areas they should not have. Plastic case a bit cheap-feeling for a $400 device.

*Zire 72: Not too bad, though thick and has a vibrant blue coating that loves to peel off (and of course, it's not PalmOne's fault when it does). Memory a bit on the low side, but for the price it's understandable.

*Zire 21 and 31: Forget it, unless they came out of a gumball machine....

Tungsten C: Best handheld of a year-and-a-half ago. Last P1 device with wifi built-in. Sufficient memory to ride out the improving applications, but it's getting a little long in the tooth.


Many of the long-time PalmOS promoters are hoping that 2005 brings some truly improved handhelds and smartphones to the PalmOne line-up. When the last well-designed and well-built "Zen" device I can point to was the M515 of a few years ago, it makes me cry to see how little PalmOne has built on their successes.

If I didn't really need the Treo 600 data access, I'd probably spend the $150-200 for the Tungsten E and wait for something better, too....


RE: Maybe one reason for the sales numbers on the TE
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 1/3/2005 2:23:27 PM #
That's a fairly accurate summary of the current state of Palm's hardware. All things considered, the Tungsten E would have been a good value if only it had much higher build quality. (Just ask Mike Cane how poorly built the Tungsten E is. By now even he must realize the Tungsten E is as odious as the m130 and Hungarianô m505 were.)

Unless Sony re-enters the PDA market, we'll probably never see another high quality PalmOS PDA released. (Sorry, but Tapwave won't survive with their current business model.)

While I now have pretty low expectations of the company, I hope to see Palm regroup in 2005 and narrow its focus by paring the lineup to 3 PDAs and two smartphones:

1) Zire 32 - with a MUCH better screen and improved build quality. $129.

2) Tungsten E≤ - with Bluetooth and improved build quality. $199. Or consider a Zire 73 for same price.

3) Tungsten 7 - with Bluetooth, Wi-Fi, 320 x 480 screen (ideally Sony's OLED), vibrating alarm, voice recorder, at least 4 hour battery life, 128 MB "normal" RAM, PalmOS 5.5, dual SD slots, solid build quality, backup app (like BackupMan) included in the ROM, black magnesium case. $399.

4) Treo 200 - modified Sony Ericsson T630 running PalmOS. $199.

5) Treo 700 - "Fixed" Treo 650 with improved build quality, 64 MB "normal" RAM, internal antenna, fixed voice quality, backup app included in the ROM, "bonus" (yee-haw!!!) $5 128 MB SD card. $499.

The above lineup is feasible and could quickly revitalize Palm. The alternative is to continue the status quo and qradually watch the market disappear.

If Palm brings out just one of the above models in 2005, it should be the Treo 200. Such a inexpensive smartphone could singlehandedly save Palm's a$$ and mark Palm as a major player in the cellphone world. Pinning the company's hopes on the sales of expensive boutique smartphones like the Treo 650 and Treo 600 is a recipe for disaster.

Unfortunately, Palm's hardware lineup for 2005 has already been decided, and I expect to see more "Made in China" junk being dumped onto consumers. Oh well.


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Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.

RE: Maybe one reason for the sales numbers on the TE
Strider_mt2k @ 1/3/2005 3:18:40 PM #
As a former owner of both the m125 and m130, I wholeheartedly agree, although odious is spreading it a bit THIN. ;)

The E is basically the modern version of the m130.

RE: Maybe one reason for the sales numbers on the TE
JonAcheson @ 1/3/2005 3:44:04 PM #
The big reasons for the success of the E versus the others is size and price.

My E is slimmer than any of the Zires, or the Tungsten C, or the slider Tungstens. Even with the hardcase on, it's pocketable.

Also, it's much cheaper than the other Tungstens, while losing no features that I care about (I don't want a camera or a phone in my PDA).

I wish it had the Tungsten C's thumbboard, but the C is way too bulky, and too expensive, and I have no use for the wifi.

All the same, it would be nice if Palm released an upgraded version of the E that fixes its major problems: the screen buzz flaw, the stupid extra power connector (just get power from the mini USB port, which has power connectors already), and the flaws with the hardcase (latch breaks, no access to ports).



"All opinions posted are my own, and not those of my employers, who are appalled."

RE: Maybe one reason for the sales numbers on the TE
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 1/3/2005 4:24:10 PM #
The Tungsten E (like the Treo 600/650 and the Tungsten 3) is a GREAT design, spoiled by poor execution. If only Palm would make quality a priority, they would still have a fantastic mid-level PDA with minimal effort expended in updating the TE. Add better case, digitizer, Bluetooth and the Tungsten E is easily the best PDA you can buy for under $200.

As is, I can't recommend ANY current pa1mOne products these days due to quality control issues. It amazes me that Palm seems oblivious to the damage it's doing to the Palm name by selling poorly made hardware. I wonder how many other people bought a Treo 600 like I did and are now afraid to buy anything else with a palmOne logo? Once bitten, twice shy.

COME ON, PALM! YOU CAN TURN THINGS AROUND IN 2005!


******************************************************************
Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.

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