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Comments on: New Palm OS Smartphone from ITM Technology

PalmSource and new Palm OS licensee ITM Technology AG, today launched the Palm Powered hagenuk SmartPhone S 200. ITM plans to offer the hagenuk SmartPhone S 200 to wireless customers in Germany through its retail channels beginning in April.
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It's basicaly GS PDA m68

mbuhboot @ 3/10/2005 2:05:11 PM # Q
Rebranded :-D

RE: It's basicaly GS PDA m68
Token User @ 3/10/2005 3:27:25 PM # Q
Yeah - that strikes me as odd. A company that rebrands a handset manufactured by someone else needs to be a licensee?

Are Verizon, Sprint, Cingular, etc licensees as well?

~ "Don't be too proud of this technological terror you've constructed." - DV ~

RE: It's basicaly GS PDA m68
mbuhboot @ 3/10/2005 3:38:03 PM # Q
If PalmSource can generate a PR out of it.. what the hack!

RE: It's basicaly GS PDA m68
AdamaDBrown @ 3/10/2005 7:34:24 PM # Q
They don't need to be a licensee to rebrand something, but they may have needed to be in order to do the German-language localization. Either that, or they're trying to build their own models, and this is a first move to make a quick entry into the market.

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Palm phones in euorpe

macbert @ 3/10/2005 4:53:54 PM # Q
When are some of these palm os phones going to be available in the US? I see that the treo 650 is doing well and I assume that someone else is going to get into the palm smartphone market here. I just haven't seen it yet. Every time I read about a new phone in the US it's running Win Mob, and every Palm OS phone comming out seems to be Europe only. Send them here, send them to ME!

RE: Palm phones in euorpe
asiayeah @ 3/11/2005 2:13:09 AM # Q
I guess Palm OS is stronger in Europe than in the States and that most Palm OS phones are targeting in Europe?

Or is it because Europeans can afford more expensive phones than the Americans?

--
With great power comes great responsiblity.

RE: Palm phones in euorpe
AdamaDBrown @ 3/11/2005 4:52:05 AM # Q
Actually there's a strong Windows presence in Europe, too. I'd guess that most of these models stay over there because Europe is a far better market for cell phones--they buy more, spend more, and are more interested in data and expandability than the U.S. is. The vast majority of U.S. cell phones are still the cheap-and-expendable kind.

RE: Palm phones in euorpe
benamy @ 3/11/2005 5:06:46 AM # Q
asiayeah @ 3/11/2005 2:13:09 AM

I guess Palm OS is stronger in Europe than in the States and that most Palm OS phones are targeting in Europe?

Or is it because Europeans can afford more expensive phones than the Americans?

Dear Asiayeah,

The Palm OS is almost non existent in Europe. The only model available on my last visit was the T600 and it was only offered by Orange. It was sold by CarWarhouse but with the Orange service. But the T600 lacked a primary feature of what Europe wants Bluetooth.

The T650 is now available and does have the Bluetooth that is almost a European requirement but it is limited in its distribution.

The Palm OS in a smartphone is very unknown. Over 90% of the European smartphone market is Symbian but it is known locally as the phone manufactures product like Nokia, LG, etc.

Palm does not have any marketshare in Europe unless you consider a low single digit percentage significant.

It is too bad Palm has failed to deliever.

This new M68 rebranded is pretty meaningless but anything they do is better than what Palmsource has been doing so far-NOTHING!


RE: Palm phones in euorpe
Masamune @ 3/11/2005 5:27:28 AM # Q
In answer to the first post - there is a US model - check the GSPDA website.

RE: Palm phones in euorpe
Tamog @ 3/11/2005 7:26:37 AM # Q
Hi,
Austria and Germany is an entirely PPC zone almost, because our local discounter ALDI/Hofer is offering PPC's via its house-manufacturer Medion.
My personal reason for why the smartphones target europe: 1 Infrastructure(GSM) everywhere. In the USA there are multiple technologies(MobTex, etc) and adjusting a device to all of them costs lots of $. And who knows if the carrier will then subside it. However, a GSM version will almost 100% find at least one carrier!
Best regards
Tam Hanna

Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog:
http://tamspalm.blogspot.com
Reply to this comment

Poor design

hobbes1257 @ 3/10/2005 6:25:30 PM # Q

I welcome every new Palm device (I know it's a rebranded phone), but this one looks, um... ugly. Maybe they should hire a new design team...

Anyway, we need new stuff right now. Isn't there still a single rumor about new palmone handhelds?

RE: Poor design
joad @ 3/11/2005 12:07:55 AM # Q
YES... where's any more of that "family of new Treo's"? That retarded stepchild Treo 650 is rather cute, but where's the brains and brawn? How about 128MB or 256MB internal memory in the next one, and quick!! Purchasers of the 650 have nearly burned up 1/3rd of their warranty, and still no sign of any "fix" as promised...

Maybe that five dollar SD card that "sealed the deal" was the promised fix, afterall....

Don't MAKE me buy another PDA just to hold what doesn't fit into a $650-750 device.... for that kind of ca$h decent internal memory should be a GIVEN.

RE: Poor design
jackpipe @ 3/11/2005 12:57:33 AM # Q
Ugly ? Compared to a treo ?
I have a treo because I plan to develop for it. I endure the titters of all that see it for that reason.
But I have something else for when I go out socially.
At least this one looks fairly normal.

Reply to this comment

Where's the black?

sub_tex @ 3/10/2005 6:30:58 PM # Q
Why are they pushing the uglier gray instead of the smoother looking black one?

http://www.infosyncworld.com/news/n/5816.html

RE: Where's the black?
Masamune @ 3/10/2005 7:35:23 PM # Q
Never mind the colour:

WHEN IS IT GOING TO BE AVAILABLE IN THE UK????????

RE: Where's the black?
Strider_mt2k @ 3/10/2005 9:24:49 PM # Q
It does look considerably better in black.
Slimmer, as black tends to do.


RE: Where's the black?
rsc1000 @ 3/10/2005 11:40:43 PM # Q
Definitely better as black. Nive review there - they speak very highly of the dpad integration and compare this favourably to the Treo 600/650. It also states something in the review about 64 mb of non-volatile memory (plus the 32 mb normal ram) thats not list above. interesting.

RE: Where's the black?
asiayeah @ 3/11/2005 4:32:15 AM # Q
Did they mention that they would only offer the silver model, but not the black one?

--
With great power comes great responsiblity.
RE: Where's the black?
mbuhboot @ 3/11/2005 9:06:38 AM # Q
Rumors are (pretty confirmed) that O2/SmartGlobal will be offering them shortly - in a VERY competative pricing too :-D

RE: Where's the black?
Masamune @ 3/11/2005 6:49:15 PM # Q
O2?! As in O2 UK?! :D Something like this would go great with a T3 or my Zodiac!

Reply to this comment

Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i300?

The_Voice_of_Reason @ 3/10/2005 8:08:39 PM # Q
http://www.infosyncworld.com/news/n/5849.html


I can't see a lot of people flocking to the three or four feeble PalmOS smartphone offerings now that there are probably 20 options available from the Windows side. Why is Palm squandering yet another lead by failing to supply the hardware people want?

Thanks for nothing, PalmSource. At least things would be a little better if Samsung would finally release a REAL (not vaporware) PalmOS smartphone. It's a shame to see the best OS (PalmOS) losing for reasons that have NOTHING to do with its capability.





*************************************************************************************

Press release: CUPERTINO, California — February 11, 2005 — Apple® announced today that Steve Jobs will begin selling his own feces to Apple Cultists beginning March 1. Apple's new iPoo™ lineup is expected to easily surpass the iPod shuffle as the company's most popular product. Yes, Apple Cultists can already easily create their own iPoo™, but feces didn't seem cool until Jobs told them it was cool. Remember, kids: the ONLY cool feces is Jobs' highly individualistic, rebellious iPoo™ (coming soon in six different colors/flavors, including the red [hematochezia] and black [melena] U2 GI bleed model)

*************************************************************************************





******************************************************************
Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.

RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i300?
Masamune @ 3/11/2005 5:28:55 AM # Q
The Windows Mobile Smartphones don't appeal to everyone. Windows Mobile is already a trimmed down version of a buggy OS, trying to cram it into a smartphone with no touch screen or keyboard input makes it almost unusable. I've experiemnted briefly with th Qtek WMS and found it a nightmare just trying to find where everything was. Having a full Palm OS is a great ifea and if it's not leading the market - who cares? I just a good Palm OS smartphone like the M68 is promising to be and everyone else can take a running jump.

RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i30
otter @ 3/11/2005 6:51:29 AM # Q
"I can't see a lot of people flocking to the three or four feeble PalmOS smartphone offerings now that there are probably 20 options available from the Windows side. Why is Palm squandering yet another lead by failing to supply the hardware people want?"

I can't figure this out either, but within a year it will probably be a moot point unless P1 pulls its collective thumb out of its a$$. With so many increasingly attractive Windows choices, and very little new from P1, they shouldn't be surprised when their customers jump to the Other Side.

RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i30
lobotomic @ 3/11/2005 7:02:56 AM # Q
> there are probably 20 options available from the Windows side

> With so many increasingly attractive Windows choices, and very
> little new from P1, they shouldn't be surprised when their
> customers jump to the Other Side.

Who cares about the Windows side? There may be 20 CE options or 200, but I have yet to see one in actual use. It is Symbian that Palm has to beat. There are many VERY attractive smartphones using Symbian system 60, from Nokia and from others, and in Europe they DO sell in large quantities. You can get a Nokia NGage, with a growing catalog of pretty nice 3D games and the full system 60 smartphone suite for 150€. And no camera, too!

RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i300?
Masamune @ 3/11/2005 7:21:34 AM # Q
Now that's an answer right on the money! Symbian is whipping WM Smartphone at the moment and with smartphones like the Communicator series and SE P-series, WM has its work cut out.

RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i30
Tamog @ 3/11/2005 7:29:20 AM # Q
Hi,
the smartphone version of WM without a touchscreen is IMHO a dead child. A touchscreen greatly simplifies operation-trust me, I prefer my IIIc to a SX1..
Just my 2 cents though
Best regards
Tam Hanna

Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog:
http://tamspalm.blogspot.com
RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i300?
Rome @ 3/11/2005 1:06:06 PM # Q
"I can't see a lot of people flocking to the three or four feeble PalmOS smartphone offerings now that there are probably 20 options available from the Windows side. Why is Palm squandering yet another lead by failing to supply the hardware people want?"

How many Microsoft(WMA) based portable music player models are available out there vs. Apple iPod? 5X perhaps? And who is the king of portable music players?

It is not the quantity, but the quality that matter.


RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i30
Masamune @ 3/11/2005 6:50:45 PM # Q
Exactly. Just because Dell and hp have shoved out hundreds of different models doesn't mean they're any good. This was part of the problem with Sony - they put out a new model almost every month and this meant there was no "upgrade cycle" which could give Palm enthusiasts bank accounts a chance to recover. Also, the myriad variants got people confused about which particular one was right for them...

PalmOS abandoned by the rats?
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 3/11/2005 7:49:06 PM # Q
- "Who cares about the Windows side? There may be 20 CE options or 200, but I have yet to see one in actual use."

- "Symbian is whipping WM Smartphone at the moment and with smartphones like the Communicator series and SE P-series, WM has its work cut out."

- "How many Microsoft(WMA) based portable music player models are available out there vs. Apple iPod? 5X perhaps? And who is the king of portable music players?

It is not the quantity, but the quality that matter."

- "Just because Dell and hp have shoved out hundreds of different models doesn't mean they're any good. This was part of the problem with Sony - they put out a new model almost every month and this meant there was no "upgrade cycle" which could give Palm enthusiasts bank accounts a chance to recover. Also, the myriad variants got people confused about which particular one was right for them..."

You people must be in denial. I'd love to see your reaction when pa1mOne announces its Windows-based Treo. What will you say then?

Look around. Windows-based phones are starting to catch on. Good hardware compensates for a bad OS. Palm, on the other hand, depends on having a good OS compensate for bad hardware.

Most Symbian sales are to people not using them as real smartphones. Shipping Symbian in regular phones pads the sales figures + makes Symbian look good.

iPoo is a fad sold on image that will disappear almost overnight in a year or two. Apple is fcuked when that happens. Comparing iPoo to phones smells of sophism. And as for sales, quantity - NOT quality - is all that matters.

This nonsense about "the problem with Sony" being their constant innovation and rapid model release cycles get more and more laughable every time some simpleton posts it. Try THINKING before you post next time...







*************************************************************************************

Press release: CUPERTINO, California — February 11, 2005 — Apple® announced today that Steve Jobs will begin selling his own feces to Apple Cultists beginning March 1. Apple's new iPoo™ lineup is expected to easily surpass the iPod shuffle as the company's most popular product. Yes, Apple Cultists can already easily create their own iPoo™, but feces didn't seem cool until Jobs told them it was cool. Remember, kids: the ONLY cool feces is Jobs' highly individualistic, rebellious iPoo™ (coming soon in six different colors/flavors, including the red [hematochezia] and black [melena] U2 GI bleed model)

*************************************************************************************





******************************************************************
Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.

RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i300?
benamy @ 3/11/2005 9:46:19 PM # Q
The voice is right on with the PALM OS enthusists being in denial.

If Palm does not start releasing some new units that can carve out market share what point is their even being a fan of the best OS, the Palm OS.

Palmsource is the leadership that is failing to drive this plateform. You'all that think the Treo line and a phone or two from GSPDA is enough are crazy.

Quality is important but being lost in the sheer quantity of MSFT or Symbian will ensure the PALM OS is some hiden secret that the majority will not care about. Palm is always bragging about how many developers and before that how many Palm devices had been sold. That is the only bragging that brings more users not some secret OS that is unknown and forgotten.

Start showing PSRC how pissed you all are or watch the fall. YOur choice. Because PSRC is failing the plateform and this is not hyperboly but reality.

Tell me the bright spots if you disagree because I want to hear some good news but CEBIT is not telling me anything good for the Palm OS.



RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i300?
Surur @ 3/12/2005 7:15:56 PM # Q

The momentum is really with windows mobile phones these days (especially vs palm). Due to the Zen of palm, they are just not considered to be powerful devices. Easy maybe, but not powerful. When a phone network want to appeal to business users they either go blackberry or the various forms of XDA's (II, IIs, IIi, mini, and now MDA IV)

There is a very broad range of phones available now or soon running windows mobile. I think Palm enthusiasts probably dont keep an eye on the competition as they should. Check out this website (ignore the anti-symbian editorialization) but just count the number of devices available or available soon.

http://msmobiles.com/

Symbian shares the same perception as Palm, due to their huge consumer presence. They are associated with ring-tones and games, not word and excel. And if there is one thing which MS has learned, if you win the business market the consumer market eventually follows.

MS's biggest competitor now isn't Palm or Nokia, its blackberry, which is growing explosively in MS's home territory, the back office. Fortunately blackberry is playing very nicely, and has licensed its software to a number of device makers.

I regularly see very nice adverts on TV by O2 for the XDA, comparing the XDA to a ferrari, ad there are XDA billboards all over the place. Anyone in UK can confirm this. In Europe palm is an also ran.

Investors of PalmOne agree, as its stock continues its downward trend. See:
http://surur.sytes.net/index.html

Surur

RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i30
Masamune @ 3/13/2005 11:07:36 AM # Q
"This nonsense about "the problem with Sony" being their constant innovation and rapid model release cycles get more and more laughable every time some simpleton posts it. Try THINKING before you post next time..."

My POINT was that it is difficult to keep a good level support for each specfic type and bring out a good range of accessories for each type when the design is being constantly modified. I have absolutely nothing against innovation and new products - I just want to make sure that it isn't going to become obselete within a couple of months.

Oh, and please don't call me a simpleton. I have never tried to pick a fight with you and if there is an element to my arguement that doesn't add up, explain it to me, don't insult me with it.


RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i300?
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 3/13/2005 2:14:10 PM # Q
I have absolutely nothing against innovation and new products - I just want to make sure that it isn't going to become obselete within a couple of months.

If you buy Sony Model X today and two months later Sony Model Y is released, who cares? Does your model X suddenly stop having the features it had or doing the things it did? Is it suddenly useless to you just because it's no longer "the latest and greatest"?

That is "an element to [your] arguement that doesn't add up". An intelligent person would realize this. Do you?





*************************************************************************************

Press release: CUPERTINO, California — February 11, 2005 — Apple® announced today that Steve Jobs will begin selling his own feces to Apple Cultists beginning March 1. Apple's new iPoo™ lineup is expected to easily surpass the iPod shuffle as the company's most popular product. Yes, Apple Cultists can already easily create their own iPoo™, but feces didn't seem cool until Jobs told them it was cool. Remember, kids: the ONLY cool feces is Jobs' highly individualistic, rebellious iPoo™ (coming soon in six different colors/flavors, including the red [hematochezia] and black [melena] U2 GI bleed model)

*************************************************************************************





******************************************************************
Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.

RE: Why can't we get a PalmOS phone like the Samsung SGH-i30
Masamune @ 3/13/2005 5:26:59 PM # Q
Point taken, but again, you could be a bit more polite about it. I used to have a TJ37 and it was a great PDA, it's just a shame Sony didn't develop a Bluetooth module for it or I could still have it to this day....

Reply to this comment

Why the US is less attractive for a smartphone maker

Tamog @ 3/11/2005 3:44:01 PM # Q
Ever had this question? Did you ever come to blame the network topology? If not, you should!
TamsPalm has the answer for you-tune in at:
http://tamspalm.blogspot.com/2005/03/benefit-of-gsm-why-europeans-get.html
Best regards
Tam Hanna

Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog:
http://tamspalm.blogspot.com
RE: Why the US is less attractive for a smartphone maker
cbowers @ 3/12/2005 12:36:39 AM # Q
There are amply large GSM networks in the US and Canada too. If the R&D's done for a large carrier in the EU, then what's the trick to pop in a North American carriers sim and sell it here. And yet can a brother get an affordable GSM handset with Bluetooth please? My own provider had a choice of two.

RE: Why the US is less attractive for a smartphone maker
Masamune @ 3/13/2005 11:13:22 AM # Q
The UK has also been something of a dry area for Palm smartphones. I know there is a definate US model on the way, hopefully it will make a UK debut as well.

RE: Why the US is less attractive for a smartphone maker
jaibe @ 4/1/2005 7:13:01 PM # Q
I am utterly confused by these "why does europe have more palm than the US" posts. I have been waiting for a phone like the kyocera 7135 to come to Europe forever. Last I knew it had equal sales with the treo in the US, but I like it better because it actually has a graffiti site & it's a clamshell -- but it works on every continent EXCEPT Europe. If I lived in the US I would have bought that years ago.

If there's any anti M$ bias in europe it's because M$ actually charges more for non-US licenses, effectively levying a huge tax on every computer sold (which goes to the US as well as M$.) But I would say palm PDAs have much better penetration in the US.

Reply to this comment

Great, but it's time for 3G

treo007 @ 3/14/2005 2:57:45 PM # Q
It's great there are more Palm OS based smartphones being introduced, but it's time for at least one of them to be UMTS/WCDMA capable.

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