Comments on: GoTreo Releases SafeGuard for Palm OS

SafeGuardGoTreo Software has released a new application for Palm OS. SafeGuard is designed to troubleshoot, prevent and help diagnose software problems with Palm OS devices, namely the Treo and Centro. The program aims to identify misbehaving 3rd party applications in order to remedy system crashes, software conflicts and device reset issues. It can maintain a history of application usage and all device crashes and resets, and can show you detailed information about what processes are running in the background. You can quarantine troublesome apps and GoTreo even claims it will help stop the dreaded "Reset Loop of Death" scenario.

SafeGuard v2.01 is available now for $19.95. It comes with a free trial period. It is compatible with the Treo 650, Treo 700p, Treo 755p, Treo 680 and Palm Centro.

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SafeGuard

Treo Musketeers @ 3/11/2008 4:58:39 PM # Q
"and GoTreo even claims it will help stop the dreaded "Reset Loop of Death" scenario."

Its not an idle claim after the second reset, SafeGuard jumps into action and awaits the next reset and automatically quarantines that app. I was one of the beta testers and this app has already proven its worth to me. It has stopped a couple reset loops, and it has helped me identify which background apps were running so I could figure out which app was running down my battery (turned out it was my Chatteremail's repeated attempts to sign on, as I had forgotten to change the password). I highly recommend this app and believe it is a must have. Since its release, new SafeGuard users have run into a couple issues of incompatibility with other third party software that didn't show up among the 100 beta testers. Jeff Gibon both expected this and is working to resolve these issues. He has already resolved several of them and will be releasing an update later today. So even if you try it and have issues, contact Jeff and you'll get 1:1 attention to resolve your problems. I have never felt so strongly about an app's worth as I do about SafeGuard. If you try out a lot of different software, get it. You won't be sorry in the long run. It will be the best $20 you ever spent on your Treo.


RE: SafeGuard
danceman @ 3/12/2008 1:14:48 PM # Q
Treo Musketeers if you can please tell the developer on my Treo 650 all works well except with it installed no button works to turn on screen when its off. I have to take out card to get the screen to turn on and get into then Palm. I have noticed after a reset after about 3 hits on the power button it will turn on but after the screen turns off again I can't get it to turn on just with my card hack :)

RE: SafeGuard
danceman @ 3/12/2008 1:22:40 PM # Q
I just uninstalled Safeguard but still the power thosed work. I'm going to try to found out if its another app, I guess it most be.

RE: SafeGuard
danceman @ 3/12/2008 1:37:38 PM # Q
I'm sorry it was Butler, the key mapping was not right. For now Safeguard is work well.

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That didn't take long.. not long at all..

husk3y @ 3/11/2008 5:01:37 PM # Q
Problem with these Palm quickfix applications that are suppose to detail you the problem, is... THEY RUN ON THE PALM!

A 19.95 ellaborate hoax. There are few applications that I trust, but after staying current and fixing then refixing problems, I'd really have to say Lightwav is one of them. Since putting Safeguard on the phone, (trial) it has reset my phone for every text message I recieve, and then simply blames Lightwav. See, I've had the typical resets.. I'd like to have the claimed 5 day no reset glamour that people ooze about, but I'm working on 24 hours.. and I'd be satisfied with 48, but I know lightwav didn't reset my phone prior to Safeguard being involved.

Oh, and if safeguard is correct, just about every application I have runs in the background. At one point it told me docstogo runs in the background? I mean really? Oh and I "quarantined" (so misleading, like it's antivirus software or something), fontsmoother.. and it removed the fontsmoother applications, but all my fonts were still being used on the phone... I'm pretty sure it was suppose to remove those.

Anyway, best article I read, came from 2005, or 2006, can't remember, it said.. empty the palm phone.. add one app at a time.. I prayed for safeguard, and now that's it's here, I say be careful what you wish for... you just might get it.. .

Keep trying Safeguard guys.. interface is beautiful at least.

RE: That didn't take long.. not long at all..
Treo Musketeers @ 3/11/2008 5:45:22 PM # Q
Jeff says he has the Lightwav issue fixed and that a new version will be out later today. Also, on one of the beta versions I had a similar situation where everything was showing up as a background app. However, it was due to improper deletion of an earlier version. Once I deleted everything SafeGuard and reinstalled, everything worked well and as advertised. You might try that.

I can't say it enough...this is a good product and its developer is willing to assist in working out any further bugs. It will save a lot of angst with other 3rd party resets. What more could you ask for? I would be surprised if a single beta tester finished the beta test without thinking that it was worth every penny. I invested a lot more time in beta testing then the $20 this product costs and I still think it was worth it.

One final point that is not covered in the review is that the card mounting software in SafeGuard is better then what he wrote into Card Keeper, CradleCare, and RingCare.

RE: That didn't take long.. not long at all..
leathernuts @ 3/11/2008 7:19:50 PM # Q
3 musketeers- will safe guard automatically force a soft reset if the treo freezes? Ive been trying out "crash" and in a week, I only had to pop the batt cover off and remove the batt once. I have that Seidio rubber hard case, so pulling the batt is a pain.

I can vouch for the one on one Jeff offers for support. Ive had problems with my treo in the past that had nothing to do with his software and he was right there help out.

RE: That didn't take long.. not long at all..
happyPalm @ 3/11/2008 8:56:33 PM # Q
If the app does reset loops then why would i have it installed? I would just delete it.

would this "safegod" fix the reset for me and let the app continue running or just avoid it?

I would think twice before installing hacks like this. It may do more harm and actually helps.

RE: That didn't take long.. not long at all..
Treo Musketeers @ 3/11/2008 9:17:37 PM # Q
happyPalm, that assumes you know what app is causing the reset loop. SafeGuard gives you a good indicator of what app caused the reset. Other reset apps such a TraceCrash, or even the ##377# will only tell you the app that was running in the foreground when an app crashes. The problem is, that it is usually an app in the background that causes the crash. Deleting a new app because you suddenly have a reset, may sound reasonable on the surface, but actually it may be another app's interaction with that app...and others yet to be tried on your device, that may be causing the crash. Furthermore, SafeGuard allows you to send a crash report to the app's (that caused the crash)developer, so that they can possibly fix the problem. This opens all sorts of doors including apps that sound inviting but for whatever reason have some stability issues. Finally, Jeff Gibson, does not do "hacks!" He follows the book on code writing and has corresponded with Palm extensively prior to developing this app. But suit yourself, if you don't like the app, go without it.

Leathernuts, no, I'm afraid it doesn't cause a reset for a freeze...that might be a nice addition to the app. Not sure how the device would detect it though, since it would be frozen.

RE: That didn't take long.. not long at all..
husk3y @ 3/14/2008 6:27:21 AM # Q
@leathernuts

No, I'm sure I'm not crazy about all of the applications showing up in the background. It's a bug, not a big deal.

quoting Treo Musketeers, " Also, on one of the beta versions I had a similar situation where everything was showing up as a background app. However, it was due to improper deletion of an earlier version. "

ALSO

@leathernuts.. ..

Any application that you pay for, or request that you pay for is up for scrutiny. Freeware is free, take it or leave it. However, if I pay for a service, especially 20 dollars, that could be used for rising gas or electicity bills... enough said.

I'm sure that the application "Safeguard" will soon be a coveted addition to every palm nvfs hardware pda/phone. Just right now, it' sgetting the kinks pulled out.. . .it should probably still be considered beta.. . with the option to buy/lifetime upgrades IMHO.

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RE: That didn't take long.. not long at all..

happyPalm @ 3/11/2008 10:04:28 PM # Q
"Finally, Jeff Gibson, does not do "hacks!" He follows the book on code writing and has corresponded with Palm extensively prior to developing this app"

WOW does that mean palm is actually alive and kicking and you work for gotreo?

RE: That didn't take long.. not long at all..
Treo Musketeers @ 3/11/2008 10:52:55 PM # Q
Hey dude,

I don't work for GoTreo. I just was one of the beta testers as I stated previously. I'm just trying to help other users with what I think is a very useful product. I guess I don't understand why people want to knock it if they haven't even tried it. By the way, for those following this. The Lightwav fix (amongst others)is posted tonight in a new version.

RE: That didn't take long.. not long at all..
leathernuts @ 3/11/2008 11:22:39 PM # Q
Why would anybody be downplaying or questioning this app in the first place? If you dont want it, dont download, but quit knocking it. This is an app from a very reputible developer. ITs not like its a new app from a developer no one knows. The app hasnt been out- what- a day? And people are saying its no good. Even if it has problems, Jeff will fix it.

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Active Application List

leathernuts @ 3/11/2008 11:31:40 PM # Q
Husk3y- I think you might have confused the "active applications" tab. it will list all 3rd party apps, however, only the ones with an icon with a man showing, I believe are the ones running if I understand it correctly. When I first opened it, I thought the same thing, then noticed the icons.

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Why just these?

mikecane @ 3/12/2008 9:39:27 AM # Q
>>>It is compatible with the Treo 650, Treo 700p, Treo 755p, Treo 680 and Palm Centro.

Why just those? No TX or even (shudder!) LifeDrive?

RE: Why just these?
PacManFoo @ 3/12/2008 11:58:52 AM # Q
Check! Added to my list of developers I will never buy from. Welcome to the ShytList GoTreo!

PDA's Past and Present:
Palm TX (Number 2)
Palm - IIIxe, Vx, M500, M505, Tungsten T, TX
Handspring - Edge, Platinum, Deluxe
Sony - SJ22, UX50
Casio-EM500
Apple - MP110, MP2000, MP2100
RE: Why just these?
mikecane @ 3/12/2008 1:41:30 PM # Q
I wasn't planning to buy it anyway. But I was curious if devs themselves are now ignoring PDAs and only going after the Treo market.

RE: Why just these?
BaalthazaaR @ 3/12/2008 2:21:08 PM # Q
What PDAs? The old stock that hasn't been moved in three years?
RE: Why just these?
mikecane @ 3/12/2008 3:29:21 PM # Q
Just three years? Seems longer! Ha!

But OS 5 units are still being sold via ebay and people are still buying them. And fatfingers here keeps extolling his vaunted TX, so devs are writing off people like him too.

RE: Why just these?
twrock @ 3/12/2008 8:04:20 PM # Q
"Extolling"?! Are you kidding? Just because someone hasn't made something that would work better for me doesn't mean I'm "extolling" the TX. I had to personally rebuild the thing myself just to get it up to par with previous Palm units (mic and vib mods). And the stock digitizer is bad as well. No, it definitely is a love/hate thing for me.


"twrock is infamous around these parts"
(from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)
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Multiple crashes

grahamnind @ 3/12/2008 4:25:54 PM # Q
My Treo 650 usually crashes once every 2 or 3 days. I installed Safeguard, and it crashed 18 times in about 3 hours. With the 'Keep SD Card Mounted' it goes into a crash reset loop. I had to remove card to get it to boot so that I could uncheck that option. It flagged some programs I know are rock solid as possible causes. Disabled it and everything is fine now. Don't think I'll buy it just yet!

RE: Multiple crashes
happyPalm @ 3/12/2008 5:58:58 PM # Q
wow! 18 times in 3 hours? Imagine the time you have wasted with this app.
it is really worth it?
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SafeGuard

GoTreo @ 3/12/2008 6:56:14 PM # Q
All,

I wanted to jump in here and first introduce myself and my company. I am Jeff Gibson and I formed GoTreo Software almost 7 years ago now. GoTreo has been my full time job for the last 4 years. I take great pride in the solutions developed under the GoTreo name. In fact, GoTreo has just gained the highest development status within Palm. Palm just elevated GoTreo Software to Select Partner status at the beginning of 2008.

Some of the more popular titles from GoTreo are: VolumeCare, RingCare, ProfileCare and LauncherX. LauncherX was a purchase I made from Little Mobile Solutions after the untimely death of the developer.

SafeGuard is my newest offering. I developed the product after hearing for years about user's frustrations with device resets. Until now, there has been no solution to pull back the covers and understand why Palm devices crash. SafeGuard is developed to address this need. Much of SafeGuard was developed in ARM code so it can gather data about application behavior that has previously been unavailable.

SafeGuard does several things very well that no application so far has been able to offer:

1) Detects and fixes the Reset Loop of Death situation.
2) Logs all crashes and resets for future analysis
3) Provides a listing of all 3rd Party applications stored on your device
4) In real-time, provides background status on all of the above 3rd party applications (and yes, Docs-2-Go runs in the background)
5) Introduces 3 real-time crash monitors (Palm Event Noticiation, Phone Event Notificaiton and Alarm). These monitors will capture failure conditions that applications make that cause crashes when they run in the background.
6) Introduces a Knowledge Engine that tries to sort through all of the crash data to help identify the possible causes for any particualr crash.
7) A REMOTE SUPPORT feature allows you to send all SafeGuard data to remote support desks via a secured website to help the remote support organization more effectively trouble shoot a problem you may be having on your device.

I really hope everyone will give SafeGuard a chance! Version 2.01 did have a bug that caused problems that were not found in the beta program. That bug was quickly fixed and version 2.02 was released within 24 hours of the first problem report. My organization is dedicated to developing and selling high quality software products. We are equally dedicated to providing the highest quality customer support in the industry! Our support desk email account is support @ GoTreoSoftware.com. Even if you are trialing the software, we want to hear if you are having ANY issues. I give you my personal commitment that all issues get attended to and fixes developed if that's what it takes to deliver a quality product. GoTreo does not hold fixes like some companies. We release updates as fixes are made to the product.

I welcome any and all feedback. All I ask is that the feedback is professional.

Jeff Gibson
Support @ GoTteoSoftware.com



RE: SafeGuard
PacManFoo @ 3/12/2008 8:50:50 PM # Q
OK I'll bite. Why isn't the TX supported (even in 320X320)? We've heard several times now that TX users buy software more then Treo users yet you don't include the TX. If the software can be used on the TX why isn't it included in your list of devices?

PDA's Past and Present:
Palm TX (Number 2)
Palm - IIIxe, Vx, M500, M505, Tungsten T, TX
Handspring - Edge, Platinum, Deluxe
Sony - SJ22, UX50
Casio-EM500
Apple - MP110, MP2000, MP2100
RE: SafeGuard
happyPalm @ 3/12/2008 8:57:02 PM # Q
"...GoTreo does not hold fixes like some companies. We release updates as fixes are made to the product."

hmmm...if you had done a better job at QA then you wouldn't have these problems.
Wonder which companies hold fixes... i wonder.

RE: SafeGuard
GoTreo @ 3/12/2008 10:09:50 PM # Q
With any software there will be problems. I ran a 6 week beta with 100 participants. Yes a problem slipped through but the problem was fixed in a matter of hours. HappyPalm, why are you being so negative? I am an independant developer that is trying very hard to deliver high quaility products to the Palm community. I had one bug in a released product and that makes GoTreo a bad company? I can assure you there will probably be more bugs discovered in all of my products. When I find out about them, I will fix them as quickly as possible and release updates. QA'ing in the the Palm environment is nearly impossible. There are more combinations of devices and software than any other software platform. Plus with an unprotected memory architecture, any application can over write the memory space of any other application. That is why I created SafeGuard. This is the best attempt the Palm envioronment has ever seen to understand and quantify why Treo/Centro devices crash.

I try my very hardest to release software that has little to no defects.

The reason I did not address the TX market is because I have limited development time and each device has differences. These differences become even more significant at the level of programming SafeGuard requires. If there is a big enough demand for SafeGuard on the TX, I will make the software available on this platform.

Jeff



RE: SafeGuard
PacManFoo @ 3/12/2008 10:39:08 PM # Q
Maybe I'm just naive but explain to me how an application running 320X320 on a TX is a different platform then a Treo? Are they not both running at least Palm OS 5.4? Is there that much difference between the OS that runs on a Treo and that of the TX? As far as I am aware the answer is no and so developers are ignoring TX users. I for one will not forget this in the future when we are using new devices and developers have jumped to those platforms. Of course the TX market is on decline because Palm also is ignoring it, although that doesn't stop them from selling them.

It's funny how much software made for OS 3.0 and 4.0 I have running just fine on my TX but somehow current software is just incompatible.

PDA's Past and Present:
Palm TX (Number 2)
Palm - IIIxe, Vx, M500, M505, Tungsten T, TX
Handspring - Edge, Platinum, Deluxe
Sony - SJ22, UX50
Casio-EM500
Apple - MP110, MP2000, MP2100

RE: SafeGuard
twrock @ 3/12/2008 10:45:34 PM # Q
Jeff, thanks for coming in to explain a few things.

Re: the TX, I would be curious how much of demand there would be for SafeGuard for the TX. Apparently my TX is relatively stable and doesn't crash very often at all. (But of course nothing close the the extremely stable earlier Palms I owned.) So I for one wouldn't be looking for something like SafeGuard because I don't perceive the need. As my dear old dad used to say, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." YMMV


"twrock is infamous around these parts"
(from my profile over at Brighthand due to my negative 62 rep points rating)

RE: SafeGuard
GoTreo @ 3/13/2008 12:20:23 AM # Q
PacManFoo,

Yes it is true that the Palm OS level is 5.x but the actual hardware in the devices is different. For one the Treo/Centro has a phone and the TX does not. This difference eliminates the Phone Crash monitor and it also eliminates the REMOTE SUPPORT feature. Next, I am uncertain how the TX actually responds to Palm notifications. I would need to research to see if SafeGuard's core components operate the same on this platform. That would take R&D time to validate and it would take extra QA time to develop a quality product. I am not opposed to this effort in any way. At the end of the day its not a technical problem as much as it is a time problem. I guess, the "real" truth is that I have not concidered this market since I have been focusing on the Treo market for so long. You may have a very valid point that I have have had blinders on when it comes to the other Palm environments. Can you help me quantify the sie of the market? Based on your persistance, and that's a good thing, I will also investigate with my partner distributors the sales volume they are seeing in this market. I would be happy to invest the development time if the market is there!

Jeff


RE: SafeGuard
danceman @ 3/13/2008 7:41:41 AM # Q
Great work Gotreo. Thank you for your efforts. I'm testing out safe guard but my Treo 650 is stable at the moment and I haven't had a crash to see your app in action.

Last night I even fired up Opera Mini but no crash. Most be on a lucky day, lets see today.

I'm have a problem with my turn on screen power button. It stopped working well yesterday. But I update 3 apps, Butler, Technician and Safe Guard. I think it has nothing to do with Safe Guard but still testing out.

RE: SafeGuard
leathernuts @ 3/13/2008 10:43:19 AM # Q
me too "man of many moves", my power button pauses a good 2-3 seconds before turnign on the screen. Just started. Cant remember if before or after I added safeguard.

One more thing, safeguard helped me during a reset loop yesterday. Quaranitined the culprit and all is well. Thumbs up to safeguard. ITs only gonna improve from here on out.

RE: SafeGuard
GoTreo @ 3/13/2008 2:09:42 PM # Q
Thanks all! Glad to hear another success story for SafeGuard in action.

As for powerup delays. It "might" be SafeGuard effecting the delay. To check, just disable the Palm Crash Monitor and see if the delay stops. If it does stop, this means that you have one or more applications on your device that use the 'hede' palm event notification. SafeGuard's Palm Crash Monitor will monitor all background applications and those apps that use 'hede' events, will cause SafeGuard to do more processing. If you are not actively having problems on your device, its OK to disable this crash monitor. But as soon as you do start having problems, turn the Palm Crash Monitor back on and let SafeGuard find the application causing the crash. But this method is ONLY needed if you notice a performance problem while the Palm Crash Monitor is enabled. Otherwise just leave it enabled and let SafeGuard search for crashes all the time.

Now if the Crash Monitor is not the cause, then you have an application installed that is causing the delay. You can use SafeGuard to track down this application! First look in the Active Apps screen and sort by Running applications. Then look for applications that use 'lazy' or 'worm'. These are the events that cause applications to run in the background when the device wakes up. If you find any, just quarantine them to see if the problem disappears. Then re-activate them one at t aitme until you find the one that causes the problem!!! It is really an easy process.

Jeff


RE: SafeGuard
hgoldner @ 3/13/2008 4:05:39 PM # Q
Just want to say that I had an issue with SafeGuard and Jeff addressed it; we engaged in an email exchange, and actually spoke on the phone for a good half hour.

I haven't decided whether it will have a permanent home on my Treo (although I'm pretty impressed so far, and it has identified some thorny stability issues which CrashPro, ResetPro, RLock, and TealScan couldn't figure out). But, I am going to purchase it because this is the kind of support and relationship we used to enjoy with software vendors, not just on the Palm platform but on many other platforms as well in the 'good old' days of computing (when Gates' comment about 640K being all the RAM anyone would ever need made sense, and a 10 megabyte hard drive was all the storage space anyone could ever hope for.)

If we don't support these kind of efforts and this kind of user relations, then we deserve what we get. Two gigantic dominant computer companies which are busier slugging it out with each other than genuinely caring what the user really thinks.

Harold



RE: SafeGuard
BaalthazaaR @ 3/13/2008 6:39:26 PM # Q
Hard drives??? I remember having two floppy drives only and having to swap back and forth. And the good old RAM drive idea for performance.
RE: SafeGuard
danceman @ 3/14/2008 7:16:54 AM # Q
I found the prob with the screen not turning on, it was PXA Clocker.

I turn on Safeguard and yesterday night got a crash, its says it was Nexter which has the SMS icon. I think its Palms messenging app but SafeGuard calls it Nexter. It was the first time I saw this crash and it was em REM (Device Status) which Safeguard says it was will the phone was turn off. I had turn on Reset Doctor Cache Clean, I have turn ed it off again. For now, no more crashs.

RE: SafeGuard
PacManFoo @ 3/14/2008 9:15:42 AM # Q
Floppy Drives!!! I remember have only a cassette tape drive and having to load programs.

TI-99/4A Specs:
RAM: 16K
CPU: TMS-9900, 16 bit
Running at 3MHZ
Graphic Resolution: 256x192

Bought it in 1984. Parents said I was wasting my time with this computer thingy.
I actually still had this until last year when my wife made me throw it away.


PDA's Past and Present:
Palm TX (Number 2)
Palm - IIIxe, Vx, M500, M505, Tungsten T, TX
Handspring - Edge, Platinum, Deluxe
Sony - SJ22, UX50
Casio-EM500
Apple - MP110, MP2000, MP2100

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