Comments on: Register Article on Palm's Diminished Windows Mobile Focus

An intriguing article concerning a possible lessening of focus by Palm on Windows Mobile has appeared on The Register. As is the Register’s usual M.O. when writing gossipy news items, the author of the article may or may not be privy to a number of rumors not mentioned in the article -- so any and all analysis of the piece should be taken with equal amounts of interest and skepticism.

While a bit rambling in places, the article makes several interesting and possibly accurate suppositions concerning Palm’s new-found shift towards a new “Palm OS-on-Linux” successor platform. Palm promised during their recent Analyst Day conference to not only continue shipping new Garnet-based devices but also introduce the first Linux-based product later on this calendar year. That would bring the number of OSes requiring support by Palm from two to three.

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WM going slowly out the door?

VampireLestat @ 4/23/2007 11:57:47 AM # Q
Good Fn ridance!

WM is a good OS but it should never have been adopted by Palm Inc.

Palm has massacred its developer and fan base by a DOUBLE massive attack from within:

1) Adoption of WM.
2) Abandoning handhelds.

Like I said from DAY 1, adopting WM meant

1) Diluting R&D resources away from Palm OS.
2) Encouraging Palm OS fans to migrate to WM, where they can then easily choose from not 1 but then many device makers.
3) Remove all incentive for developers to make Palm OS programs. And end up with a bunch of poor WM 320x240 to Palm 320x320 program ports. No true Palm OS optimized software.
4) Drag down all the developer companies towards a logic that it only make economic sense for them to make more and more, and then eventually solely WM programs. I see big Palm giants converting to WM e.g., Dataviz. This is all Palm's fault.

on and on and on, but you guys know all this stuff already.

The Palm Inc split many years ago now was a disaster #1. Disaster #2 was WM. Disaster #3 is abandoning handhelds.

And of course, disaster #4 will be a possible UMPC in May should it be even 1 milimeter larger than the Palm TX.

Nonetheless, the Palm OS OVER Linux (and not bs like Linux with Ghost) is indeed fantastic constructive news. However, sometimes I wonder if it is too late. But hey, let's hang in there for the ride; sounds like fun!


RE: WM going slowly out the door?
vip_m @ 4/24/2007 12:41:38 PM # Q
One of the biggest mistakes of Palm is not having wi-fi support on their Palm phones. That was totally idiotic--imagine, not even supporting Palm wi-fi cards. Dumb!

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Reduced licensing costs makes total sense

SeldomVisitor @ 4/23/2007 12:16:48 PM # Q
Endusers don't, in general, give a damn what OS is running on their phone, for Pete's sake, thus using "free" Linux with now-free PalmOS "enhancements" makes absolute total sense, IMHO.

We recently got an idea just how costly MS or PalmOS was on a per-unit basis (and, damn it, I forget WHERE that datapoint came from and what it actually was - I think a PSRC filing but don't hold me to it! Is probably somewhere here on PalmInfocenter but the damn search function here is so poor (AFAIK) that I hesitate to look for it). The savings by having "free" everything will be significant.


RE: Reduced licensing costs makes total sense
VampireLestat @ 4/23/2007 12:29:07 PM # Q
ah ha! Notice you said "PHONE" consumers don't care.
That is why the Treo base is not translating into a reinforcement of the Palm OS fan and developer bases. Many are phone-centric and they couldnt care less about Palm OS or development. Traditional handheld aka true mobile-computing power fans care more about the OS because they either develop and/or like constant application upgrades, hacks, etc. to improve PIM, ebooks, music, video, games and hundreds of other program categories.

I know how Treo people think. Trust me, I see them at work all the time (and I am responsible for most of them even considering Palm). They are phone users. I can tell a Treo friend something like "Hey, did you try the latest CorePlayer?" Answer: "Coreplayer? What's that? *interrupted by phone ringing*" And they usually end up never downloading it.

Sometimes FREE costs you a LOT of money...
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/23/2007 1:03:15 PM # Q
Riddle me this, hengeem/SeldomVisitor/Eve:

Does it make more sense to license a supported, relatively stable OS versus cobbling together a new OS from "free" scraps/leftovers? What if the people who are charged with doing the cobbling are incompetent/untalented/naïve/lazy? Would you bet your company's future on the cobble-together OS? The last time Palm made a bet like this they got f**ked up the a$$ by a lovely operating system by the name of Cobalt. Are Palm executives dumb enough to repeat their mistakes? You bet!

a) Cobalt -> PalmSource PalmLinux -> Access ALPOS -> Palm PalmLinux

Vs.

b) Windows Mobile + StyleTap Platform + Palm-style tweaks


Imagine where Palm would be right now if they had chosen "b" in 2003...


TVoR
(Anxiously awaiting the new PalmLinux Powered™, Jeff Hawkins-inspired, Inventec-produced PalmPad™...

Your life... your way.
Simply Palm. [cue music])


RE: Reduced licensing costs makes total sense
ballistic @ 4/23/2007 1:07:03 PM # Q
SeldomVisitor wrote:

We recently got an idea just how costly MS or PalmOS was on a per-unit basis (and, damn it, I forget WHERE that datapoint came from and what it actually was - I think a PSRC filing but don't hold me to it! Is probably somewhere here on PalmInfocenter but the damn search function here is so poor (AFAIK) that I hesitate to look for it). The savings by having "free" everything will be significant.

I believe Andy Brown let it slip that Palm was paying PalmSource a licensing fee of 2.5% for every unit that shipped:

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9291/#130875

Brian

RE: Reduced licensing costs makes total sense
SeldomVisitor @ 4/23/2007 1:40:53 PM # Q
Yup - that's it. Thanks.

RE: Reduced licensing costs makes total sense
SeldomVisitor @ 4/23/2007 1:41:35 PM # Q
> Riddle me this, hengeem/SeldomVisitor/Eve:

Just SeldomVisitor here, but "Hey you!" works.

> ...Does it make more sense to license a supported, relatively
> stable OS versus cobbling together a new OS from "free"
> scraps/leftovers?

At 350,000+ units per quarter maybe it does make sense at 2.5% per unit!

RE: Reduced licensing costs makes total sense
ballistic @ 4/23/2007 1:48:22 PM # Q
I also believe during the Analyst Day presentatoin Andy Brown mentioned that Palm was paying about $40 Million USD per year in licensing costs to Access.
RE: Reduced licensing costs makes total sense
SeldomVisitor @ 4/23/2007 1:51:56 PM # Q
Yeah, working backward from historical words on PalmOS licensing costs and dividing through by "2.5%" licensing cost and ASP might give an estimate of PalmOS units sold. For some reason, however, I'm dead tired today so don't even know if that's a coherent thought...

Giggle.


RE: Reduced licensing costs makes NO sense
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/24/2007 10:57:39 PM # Q
> ...Does it make more sense to license a supported, relatively
> stable OS versus cobbling together a new OS from "free"
> scraps/leftovers?

At 350,000+ units per quarter maybe it does make sense at 2.5% per unit!

What if your company lacks the brainpower to produce its own STABLE OS? Does the equation still favor dumping the licensed OS?

[Retorical question]


TVoR

RE: Reduced licensing costs makes total sense... SOMETIMES
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/24/2007 11:01:05 PM # Q
And another rhetorical question:

If you can make profits selling otherwise-identical devices running several different hOSes, should you limit yourself to one OS?

What if you lack the brainpower to properly support even ONE OS?


TVoR

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blog.palm.com updated--possible hints?

hkklife @ 4/23/2007 10:00:41 PM # Q
"Or put them in reverse: When I'm on the PalmOS, I'd really like to multitask, and when I'm on WinMo, I'd really like the direct control off the application buttons."

This is from today's official Palm blog update.

Are they hinting at a multi-tasking Palm OS future?

Could Palm be working with M$ to tweak WM6 app launching?

Or could this be a TVoR-style Styletap-by-Palm option for WinMob Treos?

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

RE: blog.palm.com updated--possible hints?
nybble @ 4/25/2007 10:32:52 AM # Q
I blogged a little bit about that palm post. But here's the question I have about it - is the thing that this product manager loves so much about Palm OS, the one feature he's going to use to sell this amazing phone to the world.. this one amazing feature is ... the buttons?

http://comments.deasil.com/2007/04/24/palms-take-on-palm-os-vs-winmob/

my blog: http://comments.deasil.com/">#comments

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