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Comments on: Assessing HP's Cloudy Tablet Future

HP cloud Things are remarkably quiet in Palm-land, especially concerning the initial plans in store for the combined HP/Palm group. However, All Things Digital is reporting that HP's Android-based tablet is delayed until 2011 at the earliest, if not cancelled outright.

So how should we read the tea leaves on this one? Perhaps we are going to see a new HP tablet as the first WebOS 2.0 device, possibly the Hurricane tablet mentioned in May. To add to the confusion, a Microsoft presentation earlier this week indicated that HP is still a Windows 7 tablet launch partner but is no longer a Windows Phone 7 launch partner.

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webOS future

mikecane @ 7/16/2010 5:13:45 PM # Q
>>>To date, HP's only shipping Android-based product is the European- exclusive Airlife 100 smartbook wearing Compaq branding.

And that will go nowhere. Because even though HP added smart touches to it, overall it is a failure, due to Android not scaling to that form factor.*

That is what was important to HP in regard to webOS: scaling. Will this sucker fall apart on a larger screen? Can it work on tinier than Pixi screens too?

HP has photos, audio, ebooks, and now video under its roof. It has all the components necessary to rival Apple's all-in-one solution. I've fondled webOs and Android. While neither is perfect, there's a hell of a lot more wrong with Android than webOS.

What no one is understanding is that there are many people with Android phones out there right now. They're being bruised by that experience. You really think they want that punishment *again* in a tablet? They'll go iPad -- or webOS.

HP said they'll double-down on webOS. That doesn't sound like they'll do what all the craptastic Android tablet makers have been doing -- put out the cheapest tablets with the cheapest (read; weakest) CPUs.

HP virtually created the niche for netbooks above the price point of the Asus, with quality components (once they dumped the initial VIA CPU offering). They'll do likewise with a webOS tablet. I can't wait to get my hands on one!

* Even Chippy at UMPC Porta/CarryPad -- who is THE expert in these things -- was greatly disappointed in it.

RE: webOS future
jca666us @ 7/16/2010 5:27:31 PM # M Q
HP has all of the components necessary, but none of the finesse or skill required.

I keep hearing how HP bought the technology and the talent when they purchased palm, yet everyday more and more of that talent is moving on to greener - and more stable - pastures.

If this talent had any faith in HP they'd stay put - obviously they didn't like what they were seeing.

As far as scalability - I believe it when I see it (in a shipping product).

RE: webOS future
hkklife @ 7/16/2010 6:55:28 PM # Q
Mike;

Read between the lines and you'll find that that's basically what I was saying. They (HP) *barely* have an Android-based product now. To quietly euthanize it (ala MS' Kin) wouldn't cause any ripples or fussing at all.

As I have mentioned before, the only implemtnations even close to impressive for Android right now are 3.7", 4", and 4.3" smartphones. Everything else--eBook readers, PMPs, tablets, smartbooks etc.--doesn't scale well or would be better suited running something else.

I think that WebOS 1.x doesn't even factor into HP's overall plans. Just for starters it's missing SO much---no virtual keyboard, weak landscape screen orientation support, no support for external storage volumes, no support for high resolution screens/aspect ratios, no voice dialing (Bluetooth or otherwise), probably no cannot handle BT 3.0 or 802.11n either. I am sure much of that was in the works for WebOS 1.5 or beyond but HP will probably get the Pre/Pixi line to 1.5 then let 'em die. WebOS 2.x+ is where the action is. Look an Android: Utter shit at 1.5 and below. A few glimmers of hope at 1.6, the first truly usable implementation at 2.0, widespread adoption at 2.1, and performance boosts at 2.2, with 3.0 promising an overhauled UI and, presumably, much better scalability.

I basicallly agree with your statement with more being wrong with Android than WebOS. However, Android is like the Wintel market--it has so much marketshare, compelling hardware and momentum that it just cannot be stopped. But IMHO WebOS beats Android for PIM, UI, and multitasking (and memory management!)

The largest I'd ever go with Android would be a 4.3" smartphone. Anything larger and I'd go either iPad (unlikely) or wait for something like a Core i ULV Windows 7-based convertible 11.6" or 12" machine.

HP's netbooks are decent, especially the Mini 311 series, but I still give the nod to Samsung, Acer or Asus, though I have admittedly never played with a higher-end HP Atom machine likr the 5102, just the cheap plasticky ones they have at Costco, BB, Staples etc.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro

RE: webOS future
jca666us @ 7/16/2010 7:24:24 PM # M Q
"WebOS 2.x+ is where the action is."

Who's drinking the koolaid now??

RE: webOS future
hkklife @ 7/16/2010 11:04:10 PM # Q
A bloodbath can constitute action too, y'know. ;-)

What I meant was that WebOS 1.x was essentially a non-starter. Sluggish, feature-deficient OS, little developer support, and very underwhelming hardware. I will consider WebOS 2.0+, just like Android 2.0+, the first release worthy of any real attention.


Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro

RE: webOS future
LiveFaith @ 7/17/2010 7:08:03 AM # Q
My WebOS phone has virtual keyboard and runs at 720mhz. The homebrew guys are awesome and I think Palm is not only tolerating, but promting / funding it. Really really cool.
Pat Horne
RE: webOS future
LiveFaith @ 7/17/2010 7:08:43 AM # Q
My WebOS phone has virtual keyboard and runs at 720mhz. The homebrew guys are awesome and I think Palm is not only tolerating, but promting / funding it. Really really cool.
Pat Horne
RE: webOS future
mikecane @ 7/17/2010 7:37:37 AM # Q
>>>However, Android is like the Wintel market--it has so much marketshare, compelling hardware and momentum that it just cannot be stopped.

Pardon me for moment while I do this:

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Yeah, at one time WinMob had that momentum. At one time, Palm OS had that momentum. Then Blackberry.

Then "PC guys" -- Apple -- waltzed right in and slayed all of them.

Android is just *training wheels* for people looking for something *better*. And webOS will be that better.

And that WinTel market? Microsoft just added ANOTHER DECADE to the life of WinXP. Not even Win7 is saving them.

And I don't know what anyone means by HP lacking the finesse. They pioneered touchscreen PCs, trying to add some lipstick to that Windows pig. Now they finally have an OS that can *match* their aspirations. They will not screw this up or they will go down in history as one of the biggest business failures ever. Stop thinking HP is ACCESS, Mark Two.

And HTML5/CSS3 is going to bring changes to the Net none of you will bloody believe -- pushed their by the iPad, but benefiting all. Especially benefiting webOS.

Save your pfennigs for this Fall and HP's webOS tablet, kiddies.

RE: webOS future
LiveFaith @ 7/17/2010 7:46:32 AM # Q
My WebOS phone has virtual keyboard and runs at 720mhz. The homebrew guys are awesome and I think Palm is not only tolerating, but promting / funding it. Really really cool.
Pat Horne
RE: webOS future
LiveFaith @ 7/17/2010 7:47:29 AM # Q
My WebOS phone has virtual keyboard and runs at 720mhz. The homebrew guys are awesome and I think Palm is not only tolerating, but promting / funding it. Really really cool.
Pat Horne
RE: webOS future
hkklife @ 7/17/2010 9:31:45 AM # Q
Mike;

Touchscreen PC monitors have existed for years, HP was just the first to try and take it to the masses via B&M reail chains. And I would not at all think they've made a massive sales success of it. In fact, other than BB, I cannot think of a retail chain where I've recently seen any HP Touchsmart products.

Have you actually played with one of the HP Touchsmart all-in-one PCs or notebooks? Even with massive hardware behind them, they are horribly sluggish and unresponsive. Think iTunes on Wintel but WORSE! And I don't mean on netbook specs; we're talking 4GB + RAM, 7200rpm HDDs and fast Core 2 Duo (or even Core i) CPUs and dedicated GPUs. A stock, stripped-down Win 7 install isn't anywhere close to such a slow performer.

HP has never had a history of being a software company. They just did software as something that came along for the ride as a necessity for their hardware to operate. Their PCs are slow, bloatware-laden abominations and even their printer driver packages are huge, flaky, and clunkier than the competition. A shame, as the company has produced some superb hardware over the years. But if I had a new HP anything right here, the first thing I'd do is a clean install or some kind of de-crapification process. I sincerely hope that the "new" post-Palm HP gets it and goes back to a leaner & meaner philosophy.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid + Verizon Palm Centro

RE: webOS future
mikecane @ 7/17/2010 10:10:26 AM # Q
Right, out comes the knife now.

>>>Touchscreen PC monitors have existed for years

Duh. There's a hell of a difference between a piece of frikkin touchy *hardware* and a *UI* for touch. FAIL!

>>>And I would not at all think they've made a massive sales success of it. In fact, other than BB, I cannot think of a retail chain where I've recently seen any HP Touchsmart products.

I never argued it was a success. I said they *pioneered* trying to bring that to a mass-market. They went and created a whole overlay of Touch for that crappy Windows. And it's a better UI than I've seen from Asus. The trouble happens once you select a damned program and drop into the non-touch pig of Windows. This was also the case with all the terrific lipstick phone manufacturers covered WinMob with.

>>>Have you actually played with one of the HP Touchsmart all-in-one PCs or notebooks? Even with massive hardware behind them, they are horribly sluggish and unresponsive.

Yes, I have. That depends on the CPU, but the larger issue is the *type* of touchscreen they're using. It's IR-based, not a big capacitive screen like an iPad has, so it doesn't have that accuracy or slickness -- but that's a technology limitation out of their hands. Try an Asus or MSI touchy PC. They're not as responsive as a full-blown capacitive screen, either.

>>>HP has never had a history of being a software company.

So what? MS never had a history of being a hardware company and cleaned up with mice, keyboards, and some other crap. HP doesn't have to do the software, they just have to STFU and let Palm do that.

>>>Their PCs are slow, bloatware-laden abominations and even their printer driver packages are huge, flaky, and clunkier than the competition. A shame, as the company has produced some superb hardware over the years.

I can't speak to the entire PC line, just the ones I've fondled locally and at the high-end they're no worse than the crap Dell sells. As for their printer driver software, it's a frikkin abomination! But so is the printer driver software for Kodak's printer. This makes me wonder how much is the fault of HP & Kodak and how much is really the ongoing fault of Microsoft's shoddy code. We have no idea of what bugs are lurking there that each company has to patch or workaround. That could also account for many of the complaints with iTunes for Windows too.

>>>But if I had a new HP anything right here, the first thing I'd do is a clean install or some kind of de-crapification process. I sincerely hope that the "new" post-Palm HP gets it and goes back to a leaner & meaner philosophy.

I doubt we'll see webOS clogged up with stuff. There might be some icons to join HP music, photo, video, but since all that is cloud-based, a Delete should purge them. As for eBooks, I expect them to use the B&N Nook software, since they have that joint-venture going, and including that software would not be a bad thing.

Next!

RE: webOS future
gmayhak @ 7/17/2010 5:52:51 PM # Q
>>Save your pfennigs for this Fall and HP's webOS tablet, kiddies.Tech Center Labs
www.talestuff.com
www.iTalentProductions.com
RE: webOS future
gmayhak @ 7/17/2010 6:10:02 PM # Q
trying again...

"Save your pfennigs for this Fall and HP's webOS tablet, kiddies"

or, get an iPad and quit dreaming that Webos or andRoid will ever catch up!

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Webos
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HAEMORRHOIDX.JPG

;-0


Tech Center Labs
www.talestuff.com
www.iTalentProductions.com

RE: webOS future
mikecane @ 7/18/2010 11:02:36 AM # Q
Oh, I don't diss the iPad! It's bloody wonderful.

But just as the frikkin iPhone is wonderful, there are still people who won't buy it, for whatever reason. Some of those same people might harbor similar stupid prejudices against the iPad (I peer at Gekko). Android won't cut it -- at least this year -- in tablet form. So instead of saving up for one, go for a webOS tablet.

RE: webOS future
Gekko @ 7/18/2010 6:07:38 PM # Q

iPad has no front facing camera and it does not support Flash. i was on vacation and my buddy brought his new 3G iPad. we wanted to listen to Mel Gibson's rants and my buddy only had big white spaces where the Flash audio was supposed to be. of course i whipped out the EVO and saved the day.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2010/07/exclusive-new-audio-mel-gibson-completely-loses-it-btch-cnt-whre-gold-digger


RE: webOS future
Gekko @ 7/18/2010 6:09:13 PM # Q

p.s. it's sad and pathetic to cling to the past. let it go. move on. embrace the future and new technology and the new tech winners of the world.


RE: webOS future
CFreymarc @ 7/18/2010 6:30:53 PM # Q
HP is going to leverage the hell out of this buyout. My guess is that you will only see Windows 7, HP-branded laptops, desktop, servers and nothing else. Tablet on down, it will be HP WebOS devices with very nice integration into the Windows 7, HP devices.
RE: webOS future
gmayhak @ 7/18/2010 7:52:26 PM # Q
"p.s. it's sad and pathetic to cling to the past. let it go. move on. embrace the future and new technology and the new tech winners of the world."

Gekko, android and webos ARE the past, they aren't the present and sure as hell won't be the future (a lot of wishful thinking won't change that).

Developers won't flock to an os that's obsolete or fragmented. It's cool that you're happy with evo and you are able to watch Mel Gibson's rants (whatever turns you on;) but Apple has the bucks and the talent to continue building the best mobile devices on the planet and the foresight to lead the industry.
Why fight it? The more bucks we dump into Apple the more advancements we will see, supporting want-to-be companies seems not the wisest decision.

Gary
Tech Center Labs
www.talestuff.com
www.iTalentProductions.com

RE: webOS future
mikecane @ 7/19/2010 7:31:13 AM # Q
Gary: You will pry my AVI video from my cold, dead hands!
RE: webOS future
BaalthazaaR @ 7/19/2010 7:40:55 AM # Q
>>>HP has never had a history of being a software company.

>>So what? MS never had a history of being a hardware company and cleaned up with mice, keyboards, and some other crap. HP doesn't have to do the software, they just have to STFU and let Palm do that.

HP has some great software people. However they are in the enterprise space and not the consumer space. Given that WebOS is Linux based, I'm sure that they can leverage some of their UNIX expertise from the enterprise side.

RE: webOS future
gmayhak @ 7/19/2010 8:48:12 AM # Q
Mike, it's not perfect yet but there's an app for that (avi on iPad)
http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/yxplayer/id373751560?mt=8

Gary
Tech Center Labs
www.talestuff.com
www.iTalentProductions.com

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