Comments on: CNBC on Palm's Last Throw of the Dice

SV, are they really ancient? I caught this at midnight last night and was way too tired to go Googling, but I couldn't recall having seen quite a few of them before.

Ya know the whole build quality thing is kinda like going to a Chevy site and hearing them talk about Fords and visa versa. If folks think Palm stinks then they'll center up on every single issue. No matter which device it is, there are going to be thousands of physical defects etc. Yes, some more than others. But for a 1st gen device brought to market ahead of schedule, the Pre seems to be acceptable. It feels a little cheap to me, but it's certainly no deal killer IMO. If Palm even comes close to the toughness of my 680 (minus headphone jack), then they will be in fine shape. As we have seen they are attentive to OS and hardware updates already. So righting of the ship may be underway with the new management.

More immediately important is the statement, that they are selling the devices as fast as Palm can produce them with a low amount of advertising. If he's not just outright lying, then this is the target that they are after. If that's true, then I don't need to look much farther to see success.
Pat Horne

Freak,

The Chevy vs Ford analogy is flawed.

Pre's cheap-ass build quality makes it a Ford, however the iPhone (as with most Apple products) have much better build quality.

There are sometimes duds in a production run - however given the relatively small Pre run thus far and the larger number of complaints - Palm still has a way to go.

Unless FUD stands for "FU David" - another flawed post from Freak.

I read a few analyst reports stating return rates as high as 11% for the Pre (compared to 4% for the iphone 3gs).

As I stated earlier, given the Pre's much smaller production run, an 11% return rate on a device with poor build quality is pretty bad.

Freak, at times, you're almost intelligent.

I would think that the real battle for Palm's survival was the stock price. Even if the high return rate rumor on the Pre is true (and there really is nothing but anecdotal evidence) Palm's stock price is up quite a bit, so Elevation and everyone how bought in during the dark months must be quite happy. And there's no reason to believe that Palm is overvalued.

On build quality: subjectively, the Pre seems cheap to me. But then as has been said, most cell phones aside from the iPhone are cheap plastic crap. Kudos to Palm for coming up with a form factor that is interesting, even if the execution is kind of crappy. That took design sense and risk.

>Let's not even get into how disingenuous it is to compare return rates of
>third-generation hardware manufactured in the millions, to first-generation
>hardware manufactured in the hundreds of thousands.

Again, Freak - even given the quantity differences in their respective production runs, that just makes the build quality and return rate an even bigger issue for Palm.

Also the 3gs isn't a refinement of the 3g; it's all new hardware internally.

Instead, being the Palm apologist that you are, just stick your head in the sand and say everything is great - there's always room for improvement.

>Far more instructive would be to compare return rates on the original
>iPhone, for which I can't find any info. (Bet that won't stop you from
>claiming it was 0.001%, though!)

Far from it; I believe the return rate for the iphone, while not spectacular, were up there.

>But all of this is beside the point, which is: most modern consumer
>electronics are manufactured by the same handful of companies with the
>same components (Pre and iPhone are both from Foxconn, for example),
>and defect rates are not going to vary wildly except in the case of massive
>design flaws, of which there is scant evidence WRT the Pre.

Scant evidence? Ha - there is more than enough evidence - with several analysts mentioning high return rates. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

Ha - there is more than enough evidence - with several analysts mentioning high return rates.

Sigh.

Kevin Dede says 40%, based off (1) his "impromptu checks" of "local retail outlets" and (2) a Precentral forum poll. Hardly scientific.

Mike Abramsky says 8 - 15% are exchanged and 2 - 3% returned forever, based on "two dozen Sprint stores".

Changewave Research says 11%, based on a survey of 38 Pre owners, which is far from a representative sample.

Those are your "several analysts". Feel free to dig up more (even though you won't, because you're an AI troll parody programmed to disseminate rubbish). I have little doubt that their guesses will be based on similarly spurious evidence.

FWIW, Precentral themselves don't think their polls are the best measurement: http://www.precentral.net/analyst-claims-palm-pre-return-rates-are-high-were-not-so-sure

The second poll they ran collected 3022 votes (445 of which were "I don't own a Pre) and recorded an 18% exchange rate. If 300,000 Pres have been sold (low estimate) that's a 1% sampling, which is still pretty low.

SeldomVisitor wrote:
> ...And there's no reason to believe that Palm is overvalued...

I literally laughed out load when I read that.

Probably woke everyone in the house.

You know, I wrote that sentence, erased it, and wrote it again. There really isn't. WebOS is worth the company. It's the only iPhone competitive OS out there, and that's not something you can throw money at and just come up with. Even if the Pre turns in low sales numbers or gains very little momentum, Palm gets several more shots at wide market success before the stock market will lose all faith. That means the valuation is fine.

freak = long, *long* time PIC commenter. Troll-ish comments, but altogether entertaining. One of the few reasons to even visit PIC (including the others: SV, LiveFaith, etc).

JackA66us = recent apple fanboi who makes it his personal duty to provide endless entertainment to all of us. Kinda on the ignorant side, his name describes him best (jacka**).

Thanks guys, keep it up!

cstamper. Uh...... thanks? :P

^^ I'm too tired to argue, and I'd be a hypocrite if I didn't admit I've argued the same line before (specifically, when there was a mass protest to evict The Voice of Reason when I first started commenting here oh-so-long-ago...) But this particular troll really chaps my ass.

It's one thing to be a fanboy; we've got plenty of those around here. It's another thing to be dumb. Offensively so, IMO.

But that's an argument for another day. It's 1.30am here in Oz and I need my beauty sleep.

freak,

if I "chap your ass" that's bc I call you out on your bullshit.

As for cstamper - I could give a crap what you have to say regarding anything.

Re: build quality - the Pre is cheaply made and feels poorly constructed.

All we have to go on is anecdotal evidence and analyst checks until Palm releases that info.

Hehe. Looks like another one has figured out the game.

A sucker may be born every minute, but with enough years and a little willingness, none of us has to remain in that category.