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    Palm OS US Retail Lead Gains 10 PointsPosted By: Ryan on Tuesday, November 23, 2004 4:23:15 PM
Palm OS is the market share leader in the U.S. retail handheld market. Based on new data from the NPD Group, the Palm OS US Retail share grew 10 points over the year, mainly on strong sales of the palmOne Tungsten E.
According to NPD, Palm OS market share was boosted by strong sales of palmOne's handheld products, particularly the Tungsten E, which accounted for 29 percent of all handheld sales in the month. Other Palm OS licensees also contributed, with the Garmin iQue 3600 standing out as the most popular handheld priced over $400 in September. Retail sales as measured by NPD include sales through retail stores, e-commerce, and distributors. NPD tracks retail sales of handhelds through a combination of domestic retail sales reports and weekly surveys of approximately 35,000 U.S. consumers.
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 RE: Wireless T|E
Just goes to show that the hardcore addicts here (including me)are not the only ones driving the market... RE: Wireless T|E
"Mausoleum @ 11/23/2004 8:08:57 PM "...strong sales of palmOne's WIRELESS handheld products, particularly the Tungsten E,..." Something's fishy here. The T|E doesn't even have BT. MST" ---- Where did you get the word "WIRELESS" from? 
 Just retail, not the whole picture
While this may appear to be good news for Palmsource and palmOne, all it really shows is that they continue to dominate the consumer PDA market. Retail is where PDAs are mostly bought one unit at a time. It would be interesting to see what the unit volumes are behind these percentages. I'm not disputing the accuracy of the data, just that it only presents a partial picture of US PDA market activity. What is missing from this data are Dell Axim direct sales, the vast majority of RIM BlackBerry sales and perhaps half of all HP iPAQ sales. Not to mention the minor brands that cannot get major retailers to carry their products. A good measure of PalmSource success is their quarterly financial statements. Their revenue has been trending mostly sideways since they became a public company about a year ago. In mid-December we will be able to get a 2004 vs. 2003 comparison of comparable quarters for the first time. RE: Just retail, not the whole pictureTimothy Rapson @ 11/24/2004 1:36:11 PM #
Good points all Ginsberg.
I for one have bought only one of the dozen or so PDAs retail. The vast majority of them came from the Internet retailers. Even the one I got from Circuit City locally was a demo closeout that may not have gotten in these numbers. So the bottom line? PalmOne is in trouble and even though PPCs are taking more market share the overall market is still dead and each maker is selling fewer and fewer models at lower and lower profits. Note that HP has raised prices on their bottom end models by nearly $100. That portends even further lowering sales. I hope the Treo line makes it or we may just not have any handhelds left to run full apps the way we are used to.
RE: Meaningless
Now Gekko, you and I both know if the headline was "Palm Lead Drops 10 Points", you would have written a two page commentary! ;) Meaningful
It's very lkely that the majority of PDA sales are at retail, and consists mostly of lower-end models (Z21, Z31, and T|E). The reason no one here thinks PalmOS sales are doing well is that no one here buys low-end PDA's at retail stores. I wouldn't be surprised if a least small part of the reason for the pricing of the T|E2 wasn't to sell T5's, but to make the Z31 and T|E look like great deals in comparison, mostly to retail consumers, since the lower-end models probably constitutes a much greater revenue opportunity than a new high-end PDA running Garnet. And any fashion/jewelry buyers seems to have migrated to Treo 6xx's. RE: Meaningless
Hi,
I think that PalmONS's main income definitely comes from the low Zire line. Eveybody can afford one, and they are still damn cool and can do enough for eveyone(Z31 and TE). The Tungsten T3,T5,C, and even the Zire72(s)-see my blog about it- are more appealing to business or richer customers. But, as people het pooere, prices need to drop, not rise! Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog: http://tamspalm.blogspot.com
RE: Long Live Palm OS....Palm OS is DeadFoo Fighter @ 11/24/2004 1:58:19 AM #
It's the dead cow bounce. ------------------------------- Editor, http://Pocketfactory.com Contributing Editor, http://digitalmediathoughts.com RE: Long Live Palm OS....Palm OS is Dead
Speaking of dead cows, Foo, howzat hp treatin' ya? Figured out you can do screen rotation just by pressing ONE button and making ONE tap yet? Buried option indeed... RE: Long Live Palm OS....Palm OS is DeadFoo Fighter @ 11/24/2004 10:02:33 AM #
>> "Figured out you can do screen rotation just by pressing ONE button and making ONE tap yet?" If you're referring to HP's built-in "iTask" utility, that doesn't count. It's up to Microsoft to build a fast switch feature of some form into the OS itself. RE: Long Live Palm OS....Palm OS is Dead
Oh stop picking nits. As long as you CAN do it THAT way, why whine? I mean, this is like saying PalmOS should have a filesystem. Oh, uh, wait a minute... RE: Long Live Palm OS....Palm OS is Deadjust_little_me @ 11/25/2004 12:30:38 AM #
>>I mean, this is like saying PalmOS should have a filesystem.
All the wringing of hands over the T5/650 memory layout are reminders of why the Palm OS should NOT have a filesystem! They chew memory, and slow everything down!!
Where does it come from?
Never saw those data before. Don't really understand. Those data doesn't match any published data from last year to last month.
NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?The_Voice_of_Reason @ 11/24/2004 1:27:02 AM #
"the Garmin iQue 3600 standing out as the most popular handheld priced over $400 in September."
Enough BS statistics. All that really matters is: Money talks. You know what walks. Wake me up when Palm is actually making any profits again. - Rip van W.
RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?
Utter bollocks! I've seen more Zodiacs (two) than I have seen Garmin GPS PDAs out "in the real world" (none). If the T|E sales are SO strong, then why the **** did P1 not call the T5 the T|E2, price is at $300ish and just have 64mb of "normal" RAM? Hmmm.....perhaps a silver-colored T5 minus the extra ram & BT IS in the works as the big non-Treo release ($200 MSRP) for spring '05? RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?Foo Fighter @ 11/24/2004 10:06:48 AM #
You're lucky then because I've never seen either PDA (iQue or Zodiac) outside a retail store. And I've been told by the sales reps that both products are horribly unpopular and in the case of the Zodiac, has a high return rate. ------------------------------- Editor, http://Pocketfactory.com Contributing Editor, http://digitalmediathoughts.com RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?
One of the Zods was bought by one of those "console maniacs" who has made it a mission to own one of every portable gaming machine made. The other was, I think, being used as a stopgap machine by a frustrated T3 owner. I'd not consider either a "normal" handheld owner and certainly not the type of person who might stroll into a CUSA, be pleased with the Tapwave retail display and decide to buy a Zod instead of a T|E, for example. At my local CUSA the Zodiac display has fallen into increasing disrepair and neglect and the unit on display wasn't even working last time I was there. Not a good sign! RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?JonathanChoo @ 11/24/2004 11:21:51 AM #
I have seen three American tourists in London using the iQue while never ever seen a Zodiac (until 2 weeks ago but that is in the store - man its huge). RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?The_Voice_of_Reason @ 11/24/2004 4:22:17 PM #
I don't know how Tapwave's doing with Zodiac sales, but I stiil say they should consider releasing a small non-gaming PDA with similar specs as the Zodiacs. They seem to be fairly well constructed and would probably get quite a lot of sales to those people who have given up on Palm and its poor quality/limited features.
RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?
"Small" as long as it has everydamnedthing -- minus funky buttons -- the current one has: metal case, 2 SD slots, 128MB (256 is better!), graphics/sound co-CPUs, fat battery. Oh, yes, and a *stylus silo*. Of course, I wouldn't object to WiFi (BT is a given, as that's what's already in there). Oh -- but I *MUST* have 32K Memos. RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?The_Voice_of_Reason @ 11/24/2004 5:35:24 PM #
Small" as long as it has everydamnedthing -- minus funky buttons -- the current one has: metal case, 2 SD slots, 128MB (256 is better!), graphics/sound co-CPUs, fat battery. Oh, yes, and a *stylus silo*. Of course, I wouldn't object to WiFi (BT is a given, as that's what's already in there). I think they could fit everything into a shell the size of the Tungsten E. Add an OLED screen to save battery life + appear cutting edge. I'd gladly pay $400 for this Tapwave Tsunami™*. I'll let you comment about 32 KB memos go.
RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?
There are plenty of iQue's 'out in the wild', a guy I work with has one, I've got one, and I've seen two people on the road that have one. We also have a very active forum over on PDA Street devoted to the iQue. I was surprised to read that they merited mention in the Palm OS sales figures, but I know people are buying them. They're a gread PDA, and the GPS is nice, too! ************************************** Ann - happily using her Garmin iQue3600 RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?
Watch me use my zodiac live, M-F eating while eating lunch on the west side of NYC. Just stop asking me where to get it. Be amazed as the slim built unit effortlessly fits in a front jean pocket. Relive the days of NO PROBLEMS and fun. Thrill as your palm handheld saves the day in front of Donald Trumps' nearest competitor in real estate (my boss). F. OS6. Zodiac2/T616 2.128 gigs under the hood. Cobalt, Schmobalt!The_Voice_of_Reason @ 11/25/2004 12:00:09 AM #
Funny, I initially misunderstood what you meant by M-F. Twice. I really need to get away from San Francisco area! ;-O F. OS6 I hear that's exactly what Tapwave said to PalmSource. With good reason. The Tapwave version of PalmOS 5 should become the standard version for regular PDAs just as Handspring's Treo OS should become the standard for smartphones. Who needs Cobalt? Cobalt, Schmobalt!
RE: NPD Group = Nagel's Palm Disinformation Group?
Again, if anyone from Tapwave is reading this, please see if you can PRY the UC standard from P1's nearly-dead fingers. The Zod fans are chomping at the bit for a better selection of travel chargers, car chargers, retractable sync cables etc etc. This would fit the bill perfectly and guarantee a sale to nearly every existing Tungsten owner out there looking to upgrade. Don't worry about not fitting sleds or cradles--cable compatability would be enough! And please, a better web browser too! Zodiac Users: Does Netfront 3.1 run on Zodiacs?The_Voice_of_Reason @ 11/25/2004 3:45:28 PM #
Netfront 3.1 is the best PalmOS browser around. See if it works on the Zods.
About the Ique sdales
Personally, I am a little confused about the comment about the Ique Sales. I think that the Ique sells more to people who want an intelligent GPS system then a PDA. Thus, they will use their handheld as GPS machine, and not somuch as appontment planner, gaming tool,.... Altough this may not be the exact purpose of the Ique, it seems to boost sales pretty well! Maybe the Palm OS will get itself a firm stand in the GPS sector. It is way more usable than the Vxworks and other systems that are commonly used in this sector. They may be stable, but they lack 3rd Party Support! Find morePalm Info in my blog: http://tamspalm.blogspot.com RE: About the Ique sdalesSeldomVisitor @ 11/24/2004 5:48:48 AM #
It's always important to know what a "report" is reporting and whether or not the report is even accurate at all or reflects some sampled population that might not even be representative of the general population. This report, as pointed out previously by another poster, is for retail sales in the US only and does NOT even mention unit sales but simply percentages of total sales. And we have no idea how accurate it is anyway! So the numbers could be way wrong and the market for which marketSHARE increased could have shrunk to next to nothing. that is, 70% of 100,000 units is not as nice as 50% of 200,000 units, right? RE: About the Ique sdaleswhitemiata @ 11/24/2004 8:25:21 AM #
The Ique numbers are reported as best-selling unit over $400 How is that surprising? What did Palm offer that was OVER $400 in that month? Last I checked the T3 is under $400 and so is the TC. Alessandro P.S. Now if they're saying that the IQUE kicked >$400 PocketPC PDA's butt too... that'd be funny RE: About the Ique sdalesMichael Mace @ 11/24/2004 1:48:09 PM #
>>It's always important to know what a "report" is reporting and whether or not the report is even accurate at all or reflects some sampled population that might not even be representative of the general population. You can get lots of info on NPD at their website: http://www.npdtechworld.com/ They are the main sales-tracking service covering the US consumer electronics industry, and they track sales directly by collecting the info from the resellers. Pretty much everyone in the industry uses them to track sales.
That is what the report says -- that the iQue was the best-selling handheld model in that price range for the month.
RE: About the Ique sdales
Michael, A little background information on "Seldom Visitor," who actually frequents many of the Palm-related boards. He is also known as Hengeem on the Yahoo Finance board. SV/Hengeem is an admitted day trader, who is only interested in rumors and innuendos, not facts or reasons. If I were you, I wouldn't even waste my time trying to explain things to SV/Hengeem. It is like trying to convince Saddam Hussein that he was a ruthless and ineffective dictator. RE: About the Ique sdales
I think that the Palm Os will soon mover to the GPS sector and embedded devices....
It hasd all it needs: 3rd Party Support Good Apps available Stable Would definitely beat most RTOS's butt!! Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog: http://tamspalm.blogspot.com
Success is relative
"Success is relative: It is what we can make of the mess we have made of things." - T.S. Eliot
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Based on data released by the NPD Group, a retail sales tracking firm, U.S. unit share for Palm Powered handhelds in September 2004 was 76 percent, exceeding that of all of its competitors combined, and gaining roughly 10 points since September 2003.
Something's fishy here. The T|E doesn't even have BT.
MST