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Comments on: Sony PEG-N710C Review

Since the release of the N710C, the flagship of Sony's Clié line of handhelds, readers have been asking for a review. News Editor Ed Hardy has been been using one for several weeks and brings us this in-depth look.
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Sony Clie N710C: $420 at Egghead.com

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 8:46:05 AM #
Someone has posted this Egghead.com link in one of the Clie boards, selling for $420.

http://www.onsale.com/ShowPage.dll?page=prod_page_p&ItemEDP=153884

RE: Sony Clie N710C: $420 at Egghead.com
wayne @ 7/26/2001 5:31:11 PM #
Sold out.

RE: Sony Clie N710C: $420 at Egghead.com
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 6:39:18 PM #
geesh, it sold out that fast...

RE: Sony Clie N710C: $420 at Egghead.com
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 1:36:27 PM #
RE: Sony Clie N710C: $420 at Egghead.com
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/20/2001 10:25:41 PM #
There are still several stores which sells under $420.

check

http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php?masterid=437805&search=clie&ut=8898c4c927c4fc11


Jay

128mb Memory Stick for $142

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 9:40:48 AM #
A nice upgrade to your Clie would be a 128mb memory stick for $142. Try finding a SD or MMC card for that price.
http://shopper.cnet.com/shopping/resellers/0-7085-311-5759180-3.html


RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 9:44:39 AM #
That's a good price. It works out to be a $1.10 per MB. The best price I could find on a MMC card was $1.11 per MB and the best SD card was $1.25 per MB. The largest SD or MMC card I could find was 64 MB.

Memory
VH @ 7/26/2001 9:58:31 AM #
Memory prices are very competitive so I'm sure that size will increase and cost will decrease.

64 meg MemoryStick = $70 = $1.09/meg
64 meg MMC = $74 = $1.16/meg

I don't mind paying an extra 7 cents a meg for a MMC since it isn't proprietary like the MemoryStick.

As for price, I would compare the SD card with the MagicGate version.

64 meg MagicGate = $128 = $2.00/meg
64 meg SD Card = $89 = $1.39/meg

You wouldn't want to compare apples to oranges. ;-)


RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:25:37 AM #
really? i saw an sd for under a buck a meg! it was a 64 meg one for just $63.01

RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 11:53:12 AM #
Let's see sd card's run at 12.5mb per second and sonysticks run at 2.45. Well I think I am going to buy a m505 forget the sony!!

RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 3:28:43 PM #
-> Let's see sd card's run at 12.5mb per second and sonysticks run at 2.45. Well I think I am going to buy a m505 forget the sony!!

Well, SD cards run at that speed but do you know how fast the m50x reads/writes them??? You'll be surprised!

Here are snips from an article where the MemoryStick is heading:

"Device manufacturers are also supporting this flash-memory format. In Japan, Sharp is shipping an MP3 player that uses Memory Sticks, and car-audio maker Alpine is shipping in-dash players with a Memory Stick slot. Epson has printers on the market in the Untied States that support the Memory Stick, allowing consumers to save documents onto a Stick and print them by simply placing the Stick in a slot on a printer."

"In 2002, a 256MB version of the Memory Stick will be available, followed by 1GB and 2GB versions by 2003. (Sticks are currently available in 8MB, 16MB, 32MB and 64MB versions.) Sony will also push data transfer rates from the current 2.5MB per second to 20MB per
second by 2003. "

Source: http://canada.cnet.com/news/0-1006-200-6135310.html?tag=lh



RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 3:45:14 PM #
>>64 meg MagicGate = $128 = $2.00/meg
>>64 meg SD Card = $89 = $1.39/meg
>>You wouldn't want to compare apples to oranges. ;-)

The main difference between the MS and the MG is that the MG can hold ATRAC3 files -- and you are comparing an MG to an SD????!! Duh! As you wound say -- don't compare apples to oranges!


RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 3:50:36 PM #
>> "...Alpine is shipping in-dash players with a Memory Stick slot..."

An alpine with a memory stick slot? That rocks!! Go Alpine! Go Sony! Woohoo!

RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 3:59:27 PM #
Anyone have anymore info on the alpine unit??? I run a cva-1005 in my car and would love to be able to play my MP3's without having to run the pc in the trunk.

RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 12/5/2001 12:31:40 PM #
I don't like spending $142 on something the size of a stick of gum.

RE: 128mb Memory Stick for $142
I.M. Anonymous @ 12/5/2001 12:32:29 PM #
I agree - I suppose people would also pay $1000 for a 1Gb MS, too - I just couldn't bring myself to spend that much for something so small.

Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 9:57:26 AM #
Are the main advantages of devices using the Palm OS that the Windows CE operating system is unreliable and the battery life is poor?

I've been hearing that applications designed for real power users, eg, doctors wanting large clinical libraries close at hand, will primarily be developed for the Windows CE operating system.

Comments, please.

Thanks, Rob

RE: Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:13:59 AM #
I don't know if you've seen, but there's a huge base of medical apps for PalmOS. Palmgear even has 3 "Medical" categories.

RE: Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:28:00 AM #
It's too late, the applications to let Doctors keep huge databases of clinical information in their handhelds have already been written... for the Palm Here's some of the apps available from ePocrates.

qRx is the world's leading clinical handheld application providing over 250,000 health care professionals with point-of-care information every day. qRx gives you everything from indication-specific dosing to drug interactions to packaging and pricing info.

qID is a custom-built infectious disease application designed specifically for Palm OS handheld devices. Fast and comprehensive, qID helps you find antimicrobial recommendations in a concise and clinically relevant format -- at the point of care.

RE: Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:28:37 AM #
I am aware of many of the medical apps available for the Palm OS devices, but when companies try and put them all together in an easily used suite of products, it seems a bit daunting.

We need easy wireless connectivity for wireless prescribing, normal web browsing for sites that are not optimized for web-clipping, and lots of easily accessed storage for clinical libraries that can be read with high resolution screens.

The Handera 330 seems to about the only Palm OS device that might be capable of doing all of this fairly easily, but people who follow all of the new medical apps in development are telling me that everything is being demoed on Pocket PCs.

Appreciate all of your comments.

Thanks, Rob

RE: Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:36:59 AM #
Most doctors today use Palm OS devices. There are huge databases out there for doctors in Palm-compatible formats. More so than WIN CE

RE: Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq
mikecane @ 7/26/2001 10:40:46 AM #
I must echo the above comment. I have come across *many* doctors using Palms -- and now specifically CLIEs. Check out the CLIE YahooGroup or pop into the CLIE board at http://www.palmblvd.com and ask about doctors -- you'll find out! (These comments are not to disparage Pocket PC -- but right now, PalmOS is the thing for docs. It has the software.)

RE: Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 11:43:20 AM #
My wife is a Dr. at a major reserch hospital in the Pacific Northwest. Palm OS is definitely the platform of choice there, outnumbering WinCE 20 to 1.

The killer app that drives everyone to Palm is Epocrates' qRX and qID. Also, the general feeling is that Palms are the easiest handhelds to use. The majority of Dr.'s aren't very techie and wan't something that is very easy to use and maintain.



RE: Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 3:09:18 AM #
There is even a site for docs using pda's: www.pdaMD.com
It has tons of info, including a buyer adviser.

RE: Palm & Sony & Handera vs Compaq
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 10:17:46 AM #
Where I used to work some of the monitored beds were outfitted with wireless connections so that Docs with palm VII could have instant access to their patients vitals. I think it was trial and Im not sure how it is working out. But it is a great idea.

Tips for New Clie Owners

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 9:46:11 AM #
After owning the Clie N710c for a month, I have the following observations:

The back button can be user programmed to turn the Clie on and off which is a nice feature. The cradle cable power supply can be plugged directly into the serial port, thus becoming a nice travel charger. You can use a program called PowerRUN to launch many applications residing in the memory stick, thus saving precious internal memory. The screen scratches easily. Buy a screen protector from someone like Brando HK. A nice replacement to the default launcher is called Crs Launcher, which is hires and freeware. The case scratches easily and the front cover is poorly attached to the case. Buy a leather case/cover.

With all the added features, this PDA is one of the most complex to set up and run to utilize all its potential. Otherwise, I think that it is the best Palm PDA currently out there, at least until the N610c comes out.

RE: Tips for New Clie Owners
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 8:23:39 PM #
I got to add that dust particles can get into the inside of the screen. It bugs the hell out of me and I don't know what to do to get it out. Anyone got a idea of how to clean it or hot to prevent more dust particles to get in.

RE: Tips for New Clie Owners
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 10:14:10 AM #
to seal dust go here...it will void warranty though and takes a bit of know-how.
http://www.geocities.com/jhc19104/710C/Mainpage.htm

RE: Tips for New Clie Owners
I.M. Anonymous @ 12/5/2001 12:34:23 PM #
OK.

Speed 710 vs 505

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:42:59 AM #
One thing you didn't go into was the speed of the devices, which is one thing I really disliked about the 710. Having a 505 and wondering if I should upgrade, the first thing I noticed is switching between the built-in apps is much slower on the 710. You might say you could but Afterburner on it to make it faster, but doing the same to the 505 would make the 505 faster still. I know the 710 has to push more pixels out, but that's part of the trade off, so I just thought I'd throw that in there. Switching between apps isn't any scientific way of testing the speed, but my un-overclocked 505 could display a full screen full of data before the 710 could display on empty one. So...both are awesome devices though. No need to argue.

RE: Speed 710 vs 505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:51:10 AM #
Try using Benchmark 2.0 on your m505 to find the relative timing. I am getting 300% using Afterburner 3.0z on my N710c and am happy with its speed.

RE: Speed 710 vs 505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:54:46 AM #
What MHz do you run it at on the 710? Or rather, what is the fastest it can sustain?

RE: Speed 710 vs 505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 11:02:50 AM #
47 MHz and it is stable

RE: Speed 710 vs 505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 11:40:03 AM #
What are your settings? I can only get 284% @ 54 Mhz

Fast Mpx=on
Fast Page=opn
Slow Mpx=off
Fast Hotsync=off
Adjust ticks=on
Default=54Mhz
Find=54Mhz
Lcd/n=1
Gray=off
Accel=Always
Slow=Never
LClk/2=Never

Hints?

RE: Speed 710 vs 505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 11:48:05 AM #
Hmmmm... Interesting comment. The speed between switching apps. Sounds like you should get an iPAQ, the speed is much much much faster and the screen is much much better than m505.

BTW, I have owned 710C since it's very early debut in US, I can't say there is speed problem between switching the apps. The photo is indeed slow, but the end results are excellent.

RE: Speed 710 vs 505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 12:37:46 PM #
Biggest issue here is the OS.... I tried a demo 610c sent to Rush Pres. here is Chicago (trying to sell to nurses and Doctors here) and it is faster then my 710c is. Being a tech geek I love the hi-res display and and the memory stick is not a problem because the only SD handhelds are the palm. Plus I have a sony digi camera and the sticks work for both ;)

RE: Speed 710 vs 505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 4:18:58 PM #
>>
I tried a demo 610c sent to Rush Pres. here is Chicago (trying to sell to nurses and Doctors here) and it is faster then my 710c is.
<<

That may be due to Palm OS 4.0 on the 610c; supposedly 4.0 contains faster database access routines and possibly some other speed increases over OS 3.5.

RE: Speed 710 vs 505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 5:18:40 AM #
Yeah, M505 and n610c are running OS 4.0. Try comparing FPS of two identical comps, but one running Win95 and one WinXp. Besides, is 3/10 of a second that long? Back in my day, it took 20 minutes to boot to MS Word!

Medical Applications for Palm OS & Pocket PCs

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:44:14 AM #
I could be wrong about the future of medical applications tending to be developed for the more robust (& less reliable?) Pocket PC operating system.

I think the strongest expression of this point of view that I've heard was the current article by the Edward M. Zabrek, MD, the medical editor for Pocket PC Magazine.

I would very much appreciate any comments that could address the in-depth review of medical applications that he has published.

Thanks, Rob

RE: Medical Applications for Palm OS & Pocket PCs
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 12:42:17 PM #
Palm is the standard here at Rush Pres. in Chicago. There updates being done in the "High Traffic" rooms to add IR ports to retreve info from a database server. Helps for billing and retreving info for out of state doctor recommendations.

The software Palm is growing as well with vendors making software that reads from MS and SD cards and the small form factor is a big plus (no sleds to add for more memory) and the ease of use. The number of different devices that work alike is helping people chose the device thats right for them as well.

RE: Medical Applications for Palm OS & Pocket PCs
EGarrido @ 7/26/2001 3:11:42 PM #
Rob,

You may want to take a look at the keynote address Carl Yankowski made at TechXNY this year at the Jacob Javitz Center in NYC. In it, Carl explained (with the aid of other people in the Palm industry and several movies) how useful Palms are in the medical community and how they are already being implemented to hospitals as if they were normal business enterprises.

You can find the speech (in two parts) at:
http://www.zdnet.com/special/stories/report/0,13518,2780771,00.html#

Eric Garrido

RE: Medical Applications for Palm OS & Pocket PCs
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 4:32:33 PM #
Thanks, Eric, but your link does not seem to work.

Rob

RE: Medical Applications for Palm OS & Pocket PCs
Ed @ 7/26/2001 4:34:20 PM #
Sorry, that's the site's fauly. It doesn't deal well with commas in URLs. If you cut and paste the entire link into a new wndow, it works fine.

---
News Editor
Palm Infocenter
RE: Medical Applications for Palm OS & Pocket PCs
mikecane @ 8/1/2001 11:33:54 AM #
To post long URLs, *convert* them using:

http://www.makeashorterlink.com

-- it works!

Hi Res Version of Atom Smash

Ed @ 7/26/2001 11:33:17 AM #
Speaking of games written to work on the N710C's screen, Red Mercury is looking for beta testers for Atom Smash 2.0, which offers high resolution 320x320, 60FPS play. Send an email to as_apply@red-mercury.com to apply or go to
http://www.red-mercury.com/as20info.html
to learn more.

---
News Editor
Palm Infocenter

Battery Life

safron @ 7/26/2001 11:37:58 AM #
Sony claims that the Clie710 can sustain 15 days without recharging (if the mp3 player and backlight are off). Can the 505 do that?

As for the speed issue that was brought up... if you have a 505 and you like the fact that you're only looking at 160x160res with adequate frontlighting then thats your thing. But i dont mind waiting the extra second (not that i have to with afterburner @50mhz) for it to load. I really like the sturdiness of the 505.. the 710 has that "plastic feel".. but when it comes to playing mp3s (no problem with overclocking) and games at the same time i choose Sony.

---
doug@tekno.nu

RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 12:24:00 PM #
> Sony claims that the Clie710 can sustain 15 days without
> recharging (if the mp3 player and backlight are off). Can the 505 do that?

Yes, if its sidelight is also turned off. But this isn't a realistic measurement. Neither one is very useful without having its screen lit up. And Sony isn't claiming that the 710 can run for 15 straight days without being turned off. They mean with something called "regular use" it can go 15 days without needing to be charged. Nowhere is "regular use" defined. Half an hour of use a day? One hour? Who knows?

RE: Actually the Clie's battery life is substantially longer
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 1:21:17 PM #
Ive had both the m505 and the clie 710c, and performed extensive battery life tests on both units.

The m505 with its backlight OFF will last approximately 1 hour longer than the clie with its backlight on LOW. But enabling the backlight on the m505 nearly cuts its battery life in half.

See my site at http://gizmo.digital-alchemy.net for complete battery test results in the m505, Clie, Jornada, etc.

The m505 has alot going for it, but its not longer lived than the clie.

RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 1:27:18 PM #
The battery life of the Clie lasts 13 hours with the sidelight ON and at minimum. at ON and 50% brightness, it lasts 8-9 hours. Seeing as how the m505 is equivalent to the Clie's 20% brightness setting and only lasts 7 hours, the Clie gets much, much better battery life.

Make 7.............Up Yours!
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 2:14:19 PM #
Look at your own tests. The m505 has a longer battery life, and can recharge faster. Nobody uses the Clie or m505 without a backlight, and people rarely use anything lower than medium on the Clie.

RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 2:34:29 PM #
Speak for yourself. The backlight on my m505 is seldom on. My office is adequately lit, and so is my home. The only time I really need the backlight is in the evening, after the sun goes down.

RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 2:53:59 PM #
>>> Look at your own tests. The m505 has a longer battery life, and can recharge faster. Nobody uses the Clie or m505 without a backlight, and people rarely use anything lower than medium on the Clie.

Oh my God, another false statement. I have been using my Clie for more than two months, I set the brightness to around 1/4 (in between the minimun and medium) and it always stays there.

you probably don't know how to interpretate the results, the m505 without backlight is only one hour longer than Clie WITH BACKLIGHT ON at minimun. It is amazing since backlight eats much more power even it is set to the lowest. A fair comparison will be both set to no backlight and Clie should last longer than m505.

The Clie backlight set to a little higher than lowest is as bright as m505 with backlight on, and Clie clearly last longer than m505.

The m505 charge fast, hmmmmm... we finally found another advantage for m505 in addition to the only form factor advantage.

Clearly, the battery used in m505 is smaller than Clie (interpretated from the results), and what is amazing is that Clie is only 20 g heavier than m505, and if m505 use the same capacity battery, m505 may lose all the trivial form factor advantage and still with 160*160 dim, dull screen.

From many perspective, Palm did not do a good job on m505, and it is very easy to see without much intelligence.

RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 3:11:35 PM #
What Gizmo is saying is that with an EQUIVALENT backlight, the Clie lasts much longer (over 14 hours compared to 7). The m505 backlight is equivalent to the Clie backlight on low. That shouldn't surprise anyone - the Clie is much bigger than the m505, so presumably it has a larger battery. But when you crank up the Clie backlight to full, it sucks a lot more power and now has a shorter life than the m505. Again, that shouldn't surprise anyone - the backlight is much brighter, and there's no free lunch. Thanks much for the tests, Gizmo.

RE: Battery Life
itai195 @ 7/26/2001 3:11:55 PM #
You use your m505 without the backlight on? Wow, that's amazing. I hope your health insurance has fantastic vision coverage :)

I usually leave my Clie on maximum brightness and I've never had a problem with battery life. When I had an iPaq I'd leave it on the second lowest brightness setting and the battery would last less than 1/3 as long as it seems to on the Clie with max brightness, which is pretty amazing in my opinion.

The m505 is a nice device, but I wish m505 owners could give credit where credit is due. The Clie's display absolutely blows away the m505's, people just look silly trying to say otherwise. The m505 has some great features of its own, but it's ok to sometimes admit its shortcomings.

RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 5:15:47 PM #
Note that you CAN turn off the Clie's backlight (just hold down the power button). Although there were no tests for the Clie without backlight on that web site, I imagine it would blow away the m505 w/o backlight.

RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 6:56:05 PM #
Admittedly ive never gotten around to doing a Backlight Off test on the Clie... it seemed pretty apparent from my other tests that the Clie would last longer with backlight off as well, and the 12hr+ tests are kind of a pain to run. :)

The Clie with backlight at minimum lasts nearly as long (about an hour less) than the m505 WITHOUT the backlight on at all. Turning the backlight off should yield significantly more run time on the clie, if you so choose.

One of my favorite features of the m505 is its RECHARGE TIME! it recharges faster than any other handheld ive ever used, and makes it reasonable to pop it on the charger for 10-15 minutes while i sync it and never have to worry about batteries. The clie isnt bad recharge wise, but the m505 defintely has it beat.

One inconvience about the clies charging is that if its on the cradle under charge, the battery always reports 100%. This makes it hard to see exactly where it is in the charging process, since you have to take it out of the cradle to get an accurate reading. A minor issue, but can be annoying.

Another wierdness about the Clie recharge, is that the battery reports full at 4.0 volts while it will actually charge to 4.24. That extra .24 actually accounts for the first 2-3 hours or so of battery life so its worth leaving it on the charger for this.

Btw, in case you folks havent noticed, battery life is my thing in a handheld. I go way back to the HP 200lx where I was spoiled with its wonderful battery life. The palms approach it, but the PPC's just don't cut it IMO.

RE: Battery Life
Cheetah @ 7/26/2001 8:18:38 PM #
With all batteries, simplying keeping a device on is not the true test of battery life (although it may be good for COMPARATIVE purposes...not sure).

For example, I bought a Sony Digital Video Camera (PC5) and in the manual it showed two charts for battery life. One for when the device was on continuously, vs. one for when it was used under typical conditions (on, off, zoom, etc.). The difference was huge.

I use my Palm all day but typically only for short reference, or adding a calendar date. Almost always it's on for 3 minutes or under. If I get 12 hours on one charge that would equate to over a month of usage which is clearly not the case for my 505.

Again, I think it's ok to compare devices from these benchmarks, but I wouldn't expect anyone to actually get 12 or 15 hours of REAL usage from their Palm (or Sony).


RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 8:58:32 PM #
Cheetah,

You are correct that 'continuous on' vs normal usage will yield different results. But i would like to make a couple clairifications.

1. The battery tests I performed were NOT simple rundown tests where the device just sits there. They were tests performed under a continuous application load (scrolling a 400k ebook) providing more of a real world result than just sitting there at the apps screen.

2. The On/Off behaviour you describe, using a device for a few minutes at a time will likely yield BETTER performance than if used continuiously. The reason for this is that todays battery technologies tend to bounce back a bit when left without a significant draw... for example... using your palm for a few minutes and the battery drops to 17%... you turn it off and come back an hour later to find it at 19%. Its wierd but I see it alot in todays handhelds (except PPC's which just kinda such every ounce of power they can find)

RE: Battery Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:18:42 PM #
Another more realistic and heavy duty test will be run the slide show of the 320*320 resolution photos continuousely and also plays MP3 songs repeatedly at the same time and see which one last longer......


Oops, m505 doesn't have 320*320 high resolution photos to show...

S***, m505 doesn't have MP3 either, what a f*** %^%*%*%*#%**#%^#

Eagle-eye Ed

jkirvin @ 7/26/2001 4:10:44 PM #
Ed writes: "Don't let anyone tell you it doesn't have a grid. I can't really call it a black grid because it is more of a light, light gray, but if you look at any area of white you can see the individual pixels outlined in gray."

I've been using a N710C for about six weeks now, and I certainly can't see one, and my vision is 20/15 with my glasses on. If Ed can see a grid *between* pixels packed 150 to an inch, maybe he's in the wrong line of work. Dentistry, maybe.

Seriously, the grid--assuming you can see it--isn't anywhere near as noticable as it is on 160x160 color Palms.

Ed also left out perhaps the best reason to go with the hi-res color screens in the N710C and N610C (which is cheaper than the m505): WordSmith with FineType fonts looks as good as paper.

JK

RE: Eagle-eye Ed
mikecane @ 7/26/2001 5:07:38 PM #
What does your CLIE screen look like in sunlight, Jeff, w/o the backlight? With both the m505 and the CLIE, there are wide variations in screen quality. I've seen some unbacklit CLIEs with a white bg, others with a sickly yellow. Now Ed has seen one that tends towards brown.

RE: Eagle-eye Ed
jkirvin @ 7/26/2001 7:01:18 PM #
Mine's yellowish to tan depending on the light intensity. Not unlike the hue of the m100, but much sharper. Of course, turn on the sidelight and it's paper-white.

JK

peripherals

arnstein @ 7/26/2001 7:49:11 PM #
Still no cable for a Startac phone. I think that peripherals are a problem for non-Palm units. I'm sticking with Palm for now.
RE: peripherals
itai195 @ 7/26/2001 8:21:41 PM #
That's kind of short sighted. As the new Clie PDAs gain popularity, which they will, peripherals for them will start popping up.

RE: peripherals
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 9:49:34 PM #
But until there's more peripherals, not as many people will buy Clies, and until more Clies are sold, nobody will make more peripherals. It's a quantum flux, straight out of Star Trek, that'll fling the Clie into the 24th Century. (it kinda looks like their little pads)

RE: peripherals
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 1:08:22 AM #
It's called a "Catch 22" not a quantom flux. The quantom flux "capacitor" or the quatom flux "warp drive" in Star Trek is a fictional technology term for a device that moves people rapidly through space. It has nothing to do with the chicken and the egg, or any of your philisophically impossible scenarios. Simply this, if there is a will, there is a way.

-= SAM =-

RE: peripherals
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 1:20:14 AM #
I'm sorry to correct your opinion with my own, but I couldn't resist. Those little pads in startrek have much larger screens than the average palm pilot, to me the clie is more like a tri-corder. (a block looking device (on each of the startrek shows) that fits in the hand and scans people, places, and things.)

I think those "little pads" have more in common with the super thin web tablets everyone will have pursuint to the markets embrace of super-thin screen technology like O-LED(Organic Display), and EDIO (Electronic Paper), and the markets embrace of webpad's in general.

Hate to admit this but, the technology we have today is awesome, but the common citizen won't even be able to take advantage of it for 2-3 years when the markets finally catch up. It will be the same situation 2-3 years from now. Unfortunately too many people expect the economy to go into a recession, and expectation creates reality (or didn't you take macro-econ?)

The length of technology coming to market may infact reverse and become longer, it seems unlikely, but you never know, this could be the peak of all civilization now. What happens when we don't have enough resources (electricity, petrolium, etc...) to power the world, what happens when we consume faster than we can renew renewable energy resources, when their is no where else to expand? Will we evolve in time, for that matter will we evolve at all? Maybe the government will patrol the streets looking for reasons to kill people like they are rumored to do in China. Will war heat up, will we instintivity seek to create mass population control like they do now in China (only two kids per couple in china, ouch!) Will we grow old while our children grow old, hoping only that the race to build giant human helper robots will succeed before there is no one left to take care of our aging population (like what is going on in Japan). I'm sorry what was I talking about again? Palm pilots?

RE: peripherals
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 6:10:45 AM #
Interresting view!

But let me correct you, it is only one kid per couple, in China, 2 or more kids you'll have to pay more tax!!

BTW doesn't that decrease the potential Palm user base?

robbb

The best site I've seen for CLIE users is on Yahoo Groups:

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/26/2001 10:50:03 PM #
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/CLIE_Users_Group


Informed discussion, all the latest CLIE files, and frequent contributions from prominent Palm program developers. No wonder the membership there is skyrocketing. (Over 2200 members in less than 3 months.)

Someone should tell Sony about this group and have them take part in the discussions. Sony needs to start playing a more active role in supporting the CLIE.

RE: The best site I've seen for CLIE users is on Yahoo Groups:
mikecane @ 7/27/2001 9:42:01 AM #
According to a rep I spoke to from Sony, they do indeed read the various boards and sites. But it is their strict policy not to comment. (Waving to Sony rep!)

Best m505 group
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 12:48:42 PM #
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/m505

Everything the Clie group has, plus a larger files section!

Clie group? Who-hoh! 2,200 members in 3 months! How many versions of Clie's are there, 2 NC PEG 700-710, PEG 300/Peg 320, PEG 620. There's like 6 of them! That's about 4 members a day coming in with a Clie. The m505's groups membership has gone up over a thosand over a few days last week. Which is way more for one handheld!

Without nxt, there wouldn't be a Clie Group!

RE: The best site I've seen for CLIE users is on Yahoo Groups:
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 11:25:50 PM #
Uhh ok, it grew 1000 in a week, so how come it's still at 1505 members?

m505: May=151, June=439, July=1005, Current=1505
Clie: May=222, June=1870,July=1533, Current=2326

Anyways, whatever..



RE: The best site I've seen for CLIE users is on Yahoo Groups:
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/28/2001 4:47:27 PM #
Make that 2350 members.
;-)

Looks like 20 - 30 people are joining every day. At that rate they'll be able to take over the world by the end of the year!

The N710C is a better "business" Palm than the m505

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 12:33:09 AM #
Ed, I'm afraid you've been suckered into believing the marketing spin that people are now trying to use to rationalize the m505.

You said
"The N710C is a multimedia handheld. It has the DSP so it can play music and a great screen so it can show high quality video. It is perfect for people who use their Palm as an entertainment device and, to me anyway, seems best suited for college students, twenty-somethings, and those still young at heart. While Sony didn't ignore business users, this device wasn't made with them in mind."

WRONG. The N710C was made with *everyone* in mind. Don't try to minimize its quality by pigeonholing it as a young persons PDA just because it plays MP3s. This is merely a bonus, and one that will be enjoyed by professionals as they wait for meetings, in airports, in their hotels, relax after work, etc.

To work as a business PDA, a handheld should be small, reliable and have a screen easily visible in all lighting situations. The Palm m505 screen fails this lithmus test miserably. The CLIE, on the other hand does everything a business PDA should do. It just happens to also mave an MP3 player. Given a choice between staring at the dim, dull m505 screen and a CLIE, which one do you think the average businessperson would choose to use? The CLIE. If anything, the MP3 feature will make it even more likely for employees to carry their PDAs with them all the time. Just substitute a pair of small "bud" type earphones.

The only thing missing are programs to sync with Word +/- Excel. If Sony wants to absolutely OWN the business market, they'll release a version of the N610C and N710C with WordSmith and Minicalc included. At that point, the two remaining Palm zealots would probably keep claiming the m505 is a better business PDA because it's 1.5 oz lighter and 2 mm thinner (made up numbers).

What defines a good "business" PDA is functionality, and the CLIE has this in spades. Palm needs to come up with another angle for selling their m505. Maybe they could start doing some designer colored cases like "off-white", "murky red", "faded blue", "dull green" and "blurry gray".

;-)

By the way, video is currently useless on the Palm platform. It's only for demonstration purposes and Sony knows this. They're only marketing the CLIE with this spin because they're an entertainment company.


RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 1:37:41 AM #
I'll give one thing to Palm - they sure have a lot of guts trying to sell the m505 for $450. I thought that after the V and Vx, no-one would fall for buying overpriced Palm PDAs again.

I wonder how long it will take before they start cutting prices. I'm betting that once the $400 N610C is available in numbers (seems to be backordered everywhere now), Palm will slice $50 - 100 off the m505's list price.


WHATEVER THE MARKET WILL BEAR! Isn't economics fun?

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 3:06:56 AM #
"At that point, the two remaining Palm zealots would probably keep claiming the m505 is a better business PDA because it's 1.5 oz lighter and 2 mm thinner (made up numbers)."


well said :)

RE: The N710C is a better
EdwardGreen @ 7/27/2001 3:19:36 AM #
This place is like a PalmOS vs PocketPC war - but Palm vs. Sony! Does it really matter which is better?

Palm and Sony are not cut throat enemies, if anything Sony is Palm's favoured hardware manufacturer at the moment.

The Clie nx10c's arent about in europe yet, (although the n710c has just been reviewed in PCW uk so they will be soon) so i can't compare it to the m505 as I don't have them in hand, but at last we have some decent variety in the PalmOS scene, with great stuff from Palm, Handera, Sony and Handspring. Why do we have to say which is best?



-
kHiTeDev

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 9:27:17 AM #
To the person who started this thread:

You make some good points but whether you realize it or not, you didn't take an unbiased look at both handhelds. You lightly brushed over the 710's flaws while playing up the 505's.

The 710 doesn't come bundled with the applications businesspeople need. You dismissed that as unimportant but one of the major ways salespeople talk companies into standardizing on WinCE is by telling that they can use Word and Excel files right out of the box. You are correct, it should come with these apps and then the 710 would be a much better for business people than it is now. But that hasn't happened yet.

You've bought into the anti-505 propaganda. I have a 505 and there has never been a situation where I couldn't see what was on the screen, as you assert. Yes, the 710's screen is much better but a BMW is much better than a Lexus but that doesn't mean the Lexus is bad.

But this Palm against Sony competition is really useless. You think what you think and I think what I think and we're not likely to change each other's minds. I believe the only hope for determining a real "winner", if there is any such thing, is to see which model is selling better.

Chris

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder!!!!!!
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 11:05:12 AM #
Who says "BMW is better than Lexus"??? Who says "Sony is better than Palm"??? It's all realtive. To each is own. Different strokes for different folks!!!!! I have a Lexus AND a m505 and I am happy!!!!!! While it may be right for me, it may not be right for anyone else. Each one has there own criteria and usage needs. There is no "best one" of any consumer product because - it's all relative to each consumer. Now stop this nonsense and get something constructive done.

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 1:05:01 PM #
"The N710C was made with *everyone* in mind."

WRONG. Take away the MP3 player and the N710C is just another Palm with a higher-res screen and a MemoryStick slot. Its' screen is smaller than many other handhelds. Its' buttons are poorly laid out, and it's on the thicker side of handhelds. It doesn't come with any useful productivity software. Expansion options are limited for it, and who knows when or if there will be anything else for things like I/O and connectivity that will work with it. There's even talk that the 4.0 upgrade won't be user installable. If I were looking for a PDA to buy for my employees, these would be significant downsides. Add that it's the most expensive Palm available, and it comes up considerably lacking.

Don't delude yourself into thinking that fancy, but small, hi-res screen and a high price tag makes it something for everybody. It's not. It's a flashy multimedia handheld for people who want to look cool.

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 7:28:51 PM #
Uh the S300 clie DOES have a way smaller screen than the Palm VX, but the n710/610 the screen is about 1mm if not smaller than the m505. so no it does not have the smallest screen of all palms. And anyways, if you think about it, the 710/610 is actually is 4 times bigger than the m505 because of the 320x320 resolution rather than 160x160, but anyways, you probaby dont' care, you can look at your ugly pixelated, dim but "very thin" m505

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 7:45:09 PM #
One of my points was that at some point it becomes a waste to add resolution if the screen doesn't get any bigger (or in this case, apparently it gets even smaller). I realy meant in comparison to handhelds with larger screens like PocketPC. Thanks for the m505 comment, but I have a larger screened, hi-res Palm. Anyhow, don't dwell on the screen, it's not the only thing the N710C is lacking as a "business" Palm.

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/28/2001 9:05:32 PM #
But you CANT take away the MP3 and the high resolution and the memory stick. That is what makes the Clie the Clie and that is what makes it better than the 505. What kind of response is that? You must be one of those people that bought a 505 and is looking for reasons the bash the Clie so it makes you feel better. There arent any more SD I/O devices available than the MS at this point. In addition, the Sony is selling better than the 505 so tell me what expansion slot you would rather produce I/0 connectivity products for?

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/28/2001 9:30:30 PM #
I bet his silence will be deafening...

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/29/2001 12:42:57 AM #
> the Sony is selling better than the 505

Do you have any figures to back that up? I've been trying to figure out which one is selling better for weeks and no one seems to know.

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/29/2001 3:12:07 PM #
>> it becomes a waste to add resolution if the screen doesn't get any bigger


Ridiculous. Whoever said this is totally a MORON. The important thing is the pixel size, if you increse the size and the resoultion at the same time, the size of the pixel also incresed, and you will still see the jigsaw fonts. Look at iPAQ, the size of the screen is much larger than Clie N710C, but the resoultion is lower and if you look at iPAQ same sizew font, you will see the font is not as beautiful as Clie's.

BTW, the screen size of Clie is only very little smallr than m505's, I have measured Clie, m505 and Prism. Clie screen does look smaller, I guess it is because the case is smaller (m505 is very wide, even though it is thinner)

RE: The N710C is a better "business" PDA than the m505
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/31/2001 1:48:32 PM #
Prediction: Sony will license WordSmith 2.0 and include it with the N610C/N710C.

I feel sorry for Palm. Even the Palm fanatics have run out of reasons to recommend the Palm flagship. Right now, the m505's only advantage is : it's thin - if you don't use a case. $450 for thin? I don't think so.

RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/5/2001 9:08:41 PM #
All the fools fighting for the Clie are forgeting its main strenght, the OS. Palm makes the OS for the Clie, simply if the Clie sells well Palm wins anyway.


RE: The N710C is a better
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/29/2001 5:16:13 PM #
Cmon, PocketPC is way too much better than this trash called Palm OS...

Clié Internal Speaker ?

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 7:11:42 AM #
Can anyone tell me how strong is the Clié's internal speaker for the alarms ???
I have a Vx for about a year now and I only have one complaint about it. If I don't have the Palm with me, I can't trust him to remind me of anything... The alarm is just too damn low :-( I end up beaming important stuff to my Nokia Phone!
That's probably the one thing I've noticed more about the new PocketPc's (from Compaq)... Their internal speaker is very loud!!!

RE: Clié Internal Speaker ?
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 9:44:29 AM #
Its Pretty Loud!!! I was playing Zap 2000 on my friend's CLie and it rocked!!!

I'm gonna have to get one !

RE: Clié Internal Speaker ?
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 12:34:59 PM #
I used to use my cellular phone as morning alarm, then I switched to Palm but went back to cellular phone for morning call. All the Palm PDA speakers (should be called buzzer) suck until I got Clie, I have used the Clie for morning call alram everyday, never missed one.

One complaint though, does anybody know how to turn the volume down, it is a little too loud for me.

RE: Clié Internal Speaker ?
Ed @ 7/27/2001 1:07:41 PM #
I compared the alarms on the m505 and N710C and I think the m505's is just a tiny bit louder, but I had to play them about 10 times to find any real difference.

If you want a really loud alarm, get a HandEra 330. It's amplified speaker puts out some real volume.

> One complaint though, does anybody know how to turn the
> volume down, it is a little too loud for me.

Go into Prefs > General > Alarm Sound

---
News Editor
Palm Infocenter

RE: Clié Internal Speaker ?
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/28/2001 9:17:15 PM #
The Clie is louder than the 505, by far.

Portable Keyboard & Fliptop Case for Sony CLIE

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 1:39:29 PM #
Here are a couple of links for accessories

Sony CLIÉ Flip-Top Carrying Case - PEGA-USC10
http://www.smartshop.com/cgi-bin/main.cgi?c=13&o=89116&ssa=5652

Targus Stowaway Portable Keyboard for Sony CLIE
http://www.smartshop.com/cgi-bin/main.cgi?c=13&o=98769&ssa=5652



710 rocks

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 9:46:10 PM #
The only way you can like the 505 better is if you don't like music and don't use your palm to carry pics or use avantgo. Otherwise, the 710 wins hands down.

RE: 710 rocks
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/27/2001 10:17:38 PM #
Who the h*** cares? Get a life.

Australia?

Andrew Harper @ 7/27/2001 10:31:44 PM #
Australia has only just received m500 series & Handspring range, but no word on when Sony N610 & N710 models are coming. Any ideas??
RE: Australia?
bitwareoz @ 7/29/2001 9:10:21 PM #
I spoke to Sony Australia a month or so ago and they told me they won't be shipping the Clie "until the third or fourth generation" ... .

RE: Australia?
nic @ 8/31/2001 7:53:03 PM #
Yeah its a pity that Sony Australia are selective about the products they bring in.

My tip - Go Grey!

Get one off ebay. I got mine for less than $500 US inc GST. Thats a shade under A$1000, but hey its tax deductable.

As for Sony warrranty - its pretty good, global, and touch wood I haven't had to use it yet through 3 years of gadgets from them.



RE: Australia?
I.M. Anonymous @ 12/10/2001 3:38:14 PM #
Australia will ship at third or fourth generation?? How do they define a generation. The Clie' started with the PEG-S300 which was replaced by the PEG-S320. The PEG-N710C has come and gone and was replaced by the PEG-N760C. In there somewhere was the PEG-N620 and now the PEG-T415 was released a few weeks ago. When you consider that each model in turn had improvements over the previous models, it would seem that in a very short time Sony has released more than four generations...with possibly another on the way to replace the T415 already?

Which is the better Business-Palm?

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/28/2001 8:40:39 AM #
For business use, the high-resolution-screen of the clie lets you have a much better usability for example when you use a street-map- (Navin'YouPocket) or subway-map-application. And think about browsing the web with a browser (palmstation) showing you 3times more of information on the same screen (remember surfing just on vga-mode on your pc?).

How bad that these programms, which are delivered with the japanese clie n700c dont seem to exist in an american version. Instead of palmscape they deliver avantgo in america.

It seems, that our japanese neigbours can take a lot more benefit concerning sw- or hw- add-ons.


NavinyouPocket

http://www.zdnet.co.jp/mobile/palm/sp/0103clie/0304.html

Palmscape

http://www.zdnet.co.jp/mobile/palm/sp/0103clie/0305.html

PS: Im a happy m505-user, but: If ever sony brings out (after their partnership with ericsson) a high-res-screen-clie with build in mobile-phone. I'll get one!

RE: Which is the better Business-Palm?
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/8/2001 7:08:34 PM #
I also want the phone feature too and I want a GPS hookup to the Sony PEG-N710C. I can't find any programs that will use Microsoft Office on the Clie, although I installed the 128MB chip. With all the talk about excelent video,is there no need for Power Point?

RE: Which is the better Business-Palm?
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/8/2001 8:26:40 PM #
> I can't find any programs that will use Microsoft Office on the Clie, although I installed the
> 128MB chip. With all the talk about excelent video,is there no need for Power Point?

Documents to Go (http://www.dataviz.com/) syncs fully with Microsoft Office, including Word, Excel, and PowerPoint. It does a heck of a lot better job that the pile of puke programs that come with PocketPC.


RE: Which is the better Business-Palm?
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/21/2001 10:29:38 PM #
> I can't find any programs that will use Microsoft Office on the Clie

If you don´t need powerpoint, you can use wordsmith (the best worprocesor for PDA´s) and tinysheet or minicalc

Palm OS and the Colors of Life

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/28/2001 1:53:23 PM #
I don't understand why everyone says you need Palm OS 4.0 to display more than 8-bit color. I have a Visor Prism running Palm OS 3.5.2 and it is capable of displaying 16-bit color, in fact most of the built-in apps run faster when in 16-bit mode than they
do in 8-bit mode.

I'd be happy to hear from anyone who can explain this to me. Or why they never discuss this capability that HandSpring seemed so "intelligent" to include.

ThirdSon@mac.com


RE: Palm OS and the Colors of Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/28/2001 2:10:21 PM #
The Prism isn't running a "standard" Palm OS. Handspring added some stuff to let it display 16-bit color. Sony could have done this too but chose not too. Possibly because they knew OS 4.0 was right around the bend which takes care of the problem.

RE: Palm OS and the Colors of Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/29/2001 3:51:02 PM #
Palm took Handspring 16-bit color support and add it to Palm OS3.5 (plus some other minor features) and becomes OS 4.0.

RE: Palm OS and the Colors of Life
I.M. Anonymous @ 8/21/2001 10:32:14 PM #
Sony didn´t include the 16 bit suport because Hansprig had exclusivity for it for sometime, and now that it is over, they already have os 4

Problems with Sony Clie

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/28/2001 11:17:17 PM #
My wife returned the Sony Clie 710c in favor of a Palm m505 on account of two problems which made it impractical to use at our home. First, it would not run on Palm Desktop 4.0.1 which my daughter uses for her Palm m505. Second, it would not run off our USB hub but had to be plugged directly into the USB which meant we had to manually attach it each time she wanted to hotsynch (not an easy task with all the cables attached to the back of the CPU which is normally tucked out of the way and so difficult to get at). Hope Sony fixes these problems the next time round.

RE: Problems with Sony Clie
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/29/2001 7:29:39 PM #
from a posting on palm boulevard which allowed me to sync my vx and 710 using 4.01: http://www.palmblvd.com/boards/Sony-Clie-710C/messages/1236.html

when you right-click on the hotsync icon in the windows system tray, is "local" checked?

if it is, and your palm vx won't hotsync, try using palm desktop 4.0.1. in addition to a better interface, it has a better hotsync manager.

make a backup of your c:Program FilesSony Handheld folder and then uninstall palm desktop for clie thru control panel. download palm desktop 4.01 for palm 3/5/7 from www.palm.com and install that. copy USBSwt.exe (from the backup of your sony handheld folder) into your C:Palm folder, and put a shortcut to it into your windows startup folder. reboot windows. you should see both the new hotsync manager and usbswitcher in the system tray.

right click on hotsync manager and make sure local serial is checked. if you have a usb cradle for your palm vx, make sure local usb is checked too.

although i don't have a palm vx, i do have a palm IIIxe (serial) and a visor deluxe (usb) in addition to my 710 (pseudo-usb/serial), all hotsyncing thru this same setup. i hope you find that it works for you.


RE: Problems with Sony Clie
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/31/2001 2:23:19 PM #
Try a 610 then. It runs Palm OS 4.0 so Palm Desktop 4.0.1 should work fine. In addition, it gets rid of that stupid USB switcher and provides full, native USB support.

Btw, I have a Clie 710c now and Palm Desktop 4.0.1 works fine. Maybe you should try figuring things out before returning them so quick. Have fun with that dim, pixelated, plain-looking m505 screen.

RE: 710 rocks

altema @ 7/29/2001 12:51:06 AM #
I agree, the 710 is a great machine, but I would not buy it for the music feature. I can't use the music player at work, I have an 8 speaker Infinity sound system in my vehicle, and a 1,400 watt studio system at home. I don't use headphones unless mixing live sound, or in the studio checking tracks without bothering others. I know the audio quality of the 710 is pretty good, and I even have quite a few Sony audio devices, including the home theatre setup in the basement. But music on a PDA is not my idea of a great listening experience.
RE: RE: 710 rocks
I.M. Anonymous @ 7/29/2001 8:36:05 PM #
ive been wanting an mp3 player for a long time, but the cost of the solid state memory was just too high. now that prices are falling fast, its not so bad.

the reason ive been wanting one is for when i work out at the gym. granted ill have to be careful with it, that just means ill need a case with better protection. :)

but i am totally happy with this purchase. the high res is just staggering.

I am from france ,Where can I buy the 710c in USA

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/31/2001 4:49:15 AM #
THANKS to email: k9000@ifrance.com

RE: I am from france ,Where can I buy the 710c in USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/20/2001 10:23:23 AM #
You can buy it from bestbuy.com or staples or CompUSA

Windows NT

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/31/2001 11:50:42 AM #
Does Sony make a serial cradle for the N710C? I have heard that they do not inten to make one and without, you can't syn to Windows NT.

RE: Windows NT
I.M. Anonymous @ 10/14/2001 7:17:21 AM #
Yes you can buy one from www.CompUSA.com for 59.95.

Have not tried it though.....

RE: Windows NT
I.M. Anonymous @ 10/14/2001 8:32:12 PM #
I have just checked CompUSA and did not find the cradle. The n710c i have has become a useless tool. It has not simplyfied my life. If anyone can let me know where i can get a serial cradle for the N710C, please let me know.

Thankx

U should have checked on serial cradle b4 you bought Clie.
I.M. Anonymous @ 10/14/2001 9:56:54 PM #
Moral of the Story: Get a Clue B4 you get a Clie.

Palm OS 4.0

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/1/2001 2:56:11 AM #
Sony now has 4 NEW Cliés, right, according to thier web site anyway (and two only differ in case color). Anyway, why is the 710c the only one running 3.5? I want 4.0, 16bit color and all the 4.0 benefits, but I want the 710 and it's audio capabilities....

Anyone know when the 710 will get 4.0 and 16bit, 68k colors?


RE: Palm OS 4.0
I.M. Anonymous @ 10/21/2001 1:45:01 AM #
There are os updates available to update the n710c to a n760c.

RE: Palm OS 4.0
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/3/2001 3:39:48 PM #
yes but where ?????


Memory stick modules coming soon?

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/1/2001 8:31:05 AM #
Take a look at these memory stick modules examples.

http://www.memorystick.org/msinfo/eng/io/index.html#5

Are they just examples or do they actually exist ( and work ) ?

I would really want the microphone and the bluetooth thingy... = )

Anyone have any info on these??

RE: Memory stick modules coming soon?
Ed @ 8/1/2001 9:41:21 AM #
Besides what I said in the article above, this article has all the info I have on MemoryStick peripherals:
www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=1778

Here's more on the Bluetooth MemStick:
www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=1781

---
News Editor
Palm Infocenter

whoohoo

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/1/2001 7:25:19 PM #
this thing sucks

excellent purchase

sony usr,ex-palm/visor @ 8/2/2001 4:12:29 AM #
I had a palm first, then a visor and considered an ipaq, but decided on a Clié. It is a pleasure to use, as opposed to the first two- the screen + some details like the jog dial make a huge difference.

reply from SONY on Palm 4.x upgrade for N710C QUESTION!!!

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/29/2001 4:43:13 PM #
Thank you for contacting SONY.

Currently the Palm OS 4.x is not available or supported through SONY on the
PEG-S300/N710C models. Should an upgrade to Palm OS 4.x be released from
SONY for your CLIE Handheld, the upgrade will be accessed from the SONY
CLIE support website:

http://www.ita.sel.sony.com/support/clie/

1. Click the "Software Updates" link for your CLIE model.

2. Locate the update you are interested in, and click the ".exe" link.

3. Print and read the installation instructions.

Please bookmark the support site and visit it periodically for any new
releases.

IMPORTANT!: SONY does not test third-party software or updates on our
CLIE Handhelds. We also do not support, or recommend, any
software or updates from any site other than our own.
Although third-party applications may be installed, issues
with, or resulting from the use of such software will not
be supported by SONY.

Thank you for the opportunity to be of assistance.

The SONY Internet Group
Customer Information Services Center

At last the OS 4 is confirmed!!

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/8/2001 10:00:18 PM #
Acording to sony ther WILL be an update, not for sure whwn and not for sure for how much, but WHO CARES! check: http://www.infosync.no/en/news/n/459.asp

RE: At last the OS 4 is confirmed!!
EvanCG @ 9/11/2001 2:03:55 AM #
The following URL also states an upgrade is nearly available for the N700, the Japanese version of the 710.

Given, they state it's going to cost 10000 yen, which is roughly equivalent to $84, but I'm sure that won't be the case in the states.

Sony, if you can get us an OS upgrade for $30 or less, I love you! :)

Evan

Clie 710C Display

I.M. Anonymous @ 9/14/2001 8:49:07 PM #
I'm not sure what happened but reciently I have realized that my display is not pink eyed! I thought it was only my imagination but was confirmed when I showed it to other. Not sure what the problems is? Could it be the forecent (sp) lights, UV filtered lights, a form of Palm virus?
I have absolutely no Idea what the problems is.
But if anyone has incountered this problem please assist.

Thanks

RE: Clie 710C Display
I.M. Anonymous @ 9/28/2001 6:02:52 AM #
What!!!

clie n610 AND HOTSYNC

I.M. Anonymous @ 8/6/2001 7:05:38 AM #
Try as I might, I simply can't get this thing to hotsync.

I tried the native palm desktop that comes with the clie
I tried palm desktop 4.01
Nothing seems to make it want to sync
It sits there and says it can't make a connection
The hot sync manager has both USB and serial checked off (even though I am using a USB port)

No USB hub, just a single port

Otherwise the device works great
?????
would appreciate any help



RE: clie n610 AND HOTSYNC
I.M. Anonymous @ 10/13/2001 2:10:11 AM #
"The hot sync manager has both USB and serial checked off "

if you arent synching with your serial port then dont have serial checked off.

Clie 710 is not compatible with XP!

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/4/2001 1:27:04 PM #
In case anyone is rushing out to buy either Clie 710 or Windows XP - they are not compatible with each other at this point.
Not a major problem as one is being discontinued while the other just born.
Anyway, I have both and is still waiting for a solution so that I can hotsync.

RE: Clie 710 is not compatible with XP!
Ed @ 11/4/2001 1:34:38 PM #
You should read this article on the Clié and WinXP:
www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=2542

---
News Editor
RE: Clie 710 is not compatible with XP!
I.M. Anonymous @ 1/5/2002 3:02:01 AM #

Sony CLIE 710C

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/13/2001 2:47:13 AM #
I just bought one. The screen is incredible. The high resolution screen displays JPEGS at 320x320 pixel resolution. It is just amazing. You can have pictures that actually produce a clear picture. The memory stick is much cheaper and higher capacity than the SD card. Lexar 128MB card sells for $100 landed through Buy.com. The unit is slighly thicker that the 505 and longer but is narrower and has a better hand feel (depending on the size of your hand though). Still a much smaller form factor than a Handspring (if we're comparing expandable card platforms). The MP3 player is the bomb. It plays for 10+ hours. Kind of nice when sitting at the airport and other time killing opportunities. You can also read a book, check its dictionary and look up encyclopedia entries. Check out memoware.com for these items under reference. The M505's screen is terrible, low resolution. Ditto for the Prism. The major benefit of the M505 is its thin all metal case. The 710C has a metal face plate with plastic back. Still pretty rigid with no flexing. I considered the M505 because of its thin metal case, but the additional features of the CLIE' makes it a really nice unit to have. Corporate buyers should just get the M125 which are cheap and expandable. I think the M505 and the 710C are for power users and I think the 710C is just a better package to carry around. I just installed Backup Buddy VFS, PiDirect VFS (to access the Memory Stick programs seamlessly) and Filez (to move programs back and forth) and the package just rips. Backup Buddy VFS copys (backs up)on board RAM files to the Memory Stick keeping all of your information in non-volatile memory. Gotta love it!

Sony Clie N710C

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/20/2001 10:18:04 AM #
Is the ROM flashable for future fixes and upgrades of OS

RE: Sony Clie N710C
I.M. Anonymous @ 12/5/2001 6:57:42 PM #
It runs the fastest processor available for the Palm platform, the 33MHz Dragonball VZ, has 8MB of RAM, and --> 4MB of flash ROM. <--

Wrong Keyboard Update

I.M. Anonymous @ 1/23/2002 6:15:48 PM #
I performed a wrong keyboard update. How can I reset my ROM memory. I tried hard clean and it´s not working.

We need to buy Sony Clie Handhealds

bb_cor @ 1/25/2002 6:28:48 AM #
Hello this is closed stock compony B&B corp. We need a good deal on Sony Clie handhealds. We need any models like n610c, n710c, n760c, T415, T615. We will buy new and used product. We pay cash. This masige is 4 Bay Area citisens only! Please write us if you have anything that we need.
B&B corp.
bb_cor@hotmail.com



We need to buy Sony Clie Handhealds

RE: We need to buy Sony Clie Handhealds
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/27/2002 3:25:18 PM #
Dude, the things are garbage. When you have problems,
and try to work with Sony's support line, they think
their **** don't stink.

Junk 'em, and get a good palm pilot. You'll be a damn
site happier.

sony clie 710C

I.M. Anonymous @ 6/8/2002 11:09:09 AM #
..I am very disappointed with my 710C. I've had to soft reset it five times, and have performed a hard reset (losing everything) twice.

Why? It simply won't play MP3's.!!! I've tried a variety of files. They play great on my Sony desktop - play great on the memory stick, but wont play on my 710C??

Any ideas? One or two will play ok, then the third will start to skip and the device will "lock up".

Help...hilfe!
respond to:
bill@dlobonn.org

RE: sony clie 710C
gwoods @ 8/1/2002 12:10:33 AM #
You need to be using a mememory stick and you need to install the Clie audio player version 2.0. On the installation CD; when it launches click "Install Clie Audio Software" then click and then click "Install Clie Audio Player" then it will ad them to the list of files to be installed on your next hotsync. then put the clie in transfer mode, and drag MP3's that have bit rates of 128 kb/s or less into Memory stick /palm/programs/msaudio

I hope this works for you. I had the same problem (I think) but I couldn't even install the freakin audio plyaer because some how I got the wrong installation CD. I took me hours with sony tech support but it turned out fine.

Good luck :)

this should work

George

Install Software

picobal @ 10/30/2002 10:49:19 AM #
I just bought a used n710c off ebay but it came without the install cd. Does anyone know a site to download this software (other than paying $8 on sony.com)?

Thanks
Andrea - picobal@hotmail.com

dont have the installation cd n710c

spikee @ 4/9/2004 1:02:50 AM #
plz tell me where can i get the audio player ver 2.0 inorder to play the mp3z .
Help!!!!

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