Comments on: Rumor: Palm m515, m130 Coming in April

What?? No cooking capabilities?? (Get back to your paper planner, trolls...)

Here's why: the picture is obviously shot with a point and shoot with direct flash. You can see the shadow on the screen created from the man sitting in front of the shooter. This means that the direct flash would have blown out the rest of the screen to pure white, resulting in no image on the screen. Flash almost always overpowers the projected image.

I know, because I've shot many in images in this sort of situation. The photographic solution is to turn off the flash or to aim an off-camera flash so that it doesn't hit the screen at all. Perhaps, the power of the point and shoot flash was so weak that it didn't blow out the projected image, but I doubt it.

Seems to me it's much like that rumored Apple pda at Spymac.

***

Let me guess. Back in the good ol' days, you probably thought a DOS command line meant serious work and a GUI was just a toy.

Gimme a break. Let me clue you in.

An MP3 player can be incredibly useful even if you don't listen to music. Yes, I know your imagination is limited but it can be useful for things like audio books, learning a language, old time radio, etc...

This isn't the first person to mention that Palm will have an m505 replacement out with a brighter screen. A previous source said last fall the new model would also have a better battery to power the stronger sidelight.
www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=2256

---

News Editor

-- The source

My friends call me "Bill"

If you are a Palm rep, why is it called the i705 and not the i700? Makes no sense.

Where does this leave us? I guess it depends on what naming convention Palm decides to stick with. IMHO the new B&W wireless device will be named, as previously reported, the i705. Then any future color version will be the i715.

_________
Paul C.

That is the most truly sad, funny thing I have read in months.

-a future Sony PDA owner-

Because the roadshow happened in Germany.

> so did the source say where he saw this at?

Yes, but I'm trying to protect their identity as much as I can. I was trying to not even point out that this came from Germany but I was pretty sure that was too much to hope for. Palm didn't seem to care at the time but I believe in being cautious about keeping people who ask to be anonymous as anoymous as possible.

> also dont ya think its kinda funny that the m505 only has 700k free

No. Why would this be odd? It is probably the presenter's own handheld. That would explain why it is running Launcher III, too.

> it seems they've taken a lot of posts and produced products from what we've been saying

How do you know the mentions of the m300 on the site yesterday weren't from this source? They are a regular reader. Also, they weren't alone at the roadshow.

---
News Editor

I hear they're coming out with a Folgers springboard module. It uses the power of the HS to activate its micro-brewing technology, and dispenses the gourmet brew out the microphone into a detachable cup. Or you can buy a little thingie to use it alone if your Visor's not available.

Maybe that'll help, eh? :-)

...In accordance with the prophecy...

Quik_Fix
quikfix@hotmail.com

really a coffee mod for the HS i'm all over that

Extended Systems has licensed its Bluetooth software development kits to more than 110 companies for implementation in next-generation products. Customers include *Palm, 3Com, Motorola, Hewlett-Packard, Fujitsu, FlashPoint, Xircom, Red-M, Nissin, Taiyo Yuden, NEC, Mitsubishi (TRIUM, France), Crossbow, Visteon, and JVC just to name a few.

Products that utilize Extended Systems' protocol software include:

-NEC's connectBlue serial port printer adapter and AtermITX92BT ISDN terminal adapter
-Red-M Bluetooth Products:
3000AS access server
1000AP access point
Bluetooth clip-on adapter for the Palm Vx
Bluetooth Module for Visor
Geno Software (802.11 and Bluetooth)
-3Com's Wireless Bluetooth PCMCIA card and Bluetooth USB Adapter
-Pico Communications' PicoBlue access point
-Primax's Blueport access point and wireless modem.
-Palm Bluetooth SDK
-AmbiCom's PC and CF Card solutions
-HP Notebooks with integr. 3COM Bluetooth Solution
....just to name a few

*Palm uses XTND Bluetooth Software on any Palm device regardless of CPU or radio H/W (Silicon Wave, TI, Ericsson, Infineon, CSR, Broadcom)

Extended Systems (already a Bluetooth Partner of Broadcom) is working very closely with Broadcom to have there Software work on Broadcoms Embedded and WIN OS specific radio H/W.

At your sevice.

The rest of the world can buy Handspring Treo instead.

>And what about the future in the US when they've >finally given in and joined the rest of the world >doing GSM?

The US is still big enough a market to launch devices like an i705 and follow up with GSM/GPRS when the time is right (i.e. sufficient network provider support)

>Anyone got any ideas why they'd do this?

It's a balance between what's available 'ready to release' and the 'needs further development first'.

>1 - Palm will be buying Handspring soon, and will use
>their communicators (Treos) for GSM/GPRS devices.

Can you tell what Palm will offer to buy Handspring?
Apples? Cheers? Or maybe money which they don't have?

>The i700 is just being rolled out in the meantime to >cover the Blackberry competition.

I don't think they succeed with the i705 if the target
is to compete w/ RIM, rather than to simply replace
the VII/VIIx.

>Handspring's VCs get a good exit, and Palm gets some >proper leadership, in the form of Jeff and Donna.

They left Palm to start their own innovative business, why would they want to work for Palm again?

>2 - Sony is buying Palm.

That's wishful thinking. ;)

>Ericsony will drop Symbian and use PalmOS instead.

That's wishful thinking, too. Sony has WinCE PDA devices in the pipeline that'll be released quite soon.
Then, why should EricSony drop the Symbian platform knowing that it's much more capable for communicator-like devices than PalmOS ever was?

>Nokia buys Symbian outright.

Why buy the whole whereas you can have the pearls of it much cheaper?

>Sony get to kill M$ in the PDA arena, and Nokia in >the communicator arena.
>:-P

ok, just saw your smiley.. sheds a different light on it, indeed! :)

you seem to forget that the US is far far behind Europe when it comes to wireless - trust me, I'm there right now. Mobiles - sorry, cell phones - are by far not as common a view (not surprising, if it is a major that is advertised in the papers here that you don't have to pay for incoming calls, wow! hehe) Apart from that it is technology and product design that is virtually non existant here. Nobody neems to mind to carry bricks around on their belts where you still have to pull an antenna out. You see, Palm may be excused for thinking that pda/phones actually are not the market to go for. I'm still wondering what the wireless connectivity of that i700 thingy you be in say - Germany. Knowing Palm a bit I fear that you have to buy a separate device for each country you travel to.

Did Handspring do it right - you bet, get rid of Graffity, add a GSM/GPRS phone with SMS and make it work. Except for expansion slots the treo is pretty much what is needed and it is a smart choice to roll it out in Europe first (duh - now that I'm here in the US you get something in Europe 'frist', arghh!)

Pretty much every licensee of PalmOS shows much more innovation that Palm.

an european in america -
cheers, oli_f

For Americans, I would not think that built-in BT would harm them anyway. I have the impression that if BT personal networks will take truely off, that would be in America.

As for Treos and other such palm/phone combos, well.., haven't used them, but aren't they too big for phones and too big for pda's as well? At least I am perfectly happy to carry my small m505 AND Ericsson T29s. For a while I thought that it would be a good idea to plant a mobile phone SIM card into Palm for always-on wireless, but then again I realized I would rather _check_ the mail when I wish, than let the mail come in on me when it wishes. So BT would be ideal.

Add to m505 that soft graffity and some RAM, and I would bet Palm will sell in Europe (where are you in Europe, anyway, Palm?).

I'm assuming the m505 being shown off is the presenter's own handheld. It was probably only on display for a few seconds as a quick comparison between the two.

---
News Editor

What? I think Sony has released more models in the past six months than Palm has since it was spun off from 3Com.

If you meant "Palm" in the generic term then I agree.

I think that the most perfect Palm (for its time) was the Palm Vx. I'd love to have a modern replacement for my Vx:

16 MBytes of RAM
Improved legibility
Fast CPU
Solid mechanicals:
- Fat stylus that stays in its silo
- Great buttons
- Casing that feels like a solid block of metal
- Thin form factor

The best example of this I can think of is from Handspring. When the Visor Deluxe was introduced, it was the company's high-end model. As better models were released later, Handspring didn't stop selling the Deluxe. It just dropped the price and it became their mid-range model. Eventually it became a low-end model before finally being put out to pasture.

---
News Editor

I don't think you will see an ARM based palm anytime this year. Just look at the i705. Everyone said it would be out in late 2001...well its 2002 and no 705! All you people complain on how palm does things. Well, palm is not selling to you, the Palm PDA Geek (yes, I am one too. I'm here reading palminfocenter.com). They are selling to people who think they want a PDA and walk into a store to learn more about handhelds. Those who shop for a PDA don't say "WOW the m505 screen sucks and no ARM processor. I'll wait to see what Palm has in 6 months". No they buy whats on the shelf.

A Palm in hand is worth two in your pocket.

You might not, be plenty of people surely will. Here's what they'll likely see in stores(prices are all TOTALLY guesses on my part):
1) m515 - color, 16mb, about $450 (I'm guessing)
2) m505 - color, 8mb, about $375 (maybe less)
3) m500 - monochrome, 8mb, about $300
4) m130 - color, 8mb, about $300
5) m125 - monochrome, 8mb, about $225
6) m105 - monochrome, 8mb, about $125
7) m100 - monochrome, 2mb, less than $100

Now, layer onto that 3 other models, the i700/705(whatever it's called) at around $400-500, the m525 at $500 with hi-res, and an ARM-based model or 2 for over $500. That's a pretty formidable lineup of products targeting almost everyone in the market. Granted, under this scenario, the T615 would look better on some counts, but not all (buttons, customer support, etc.). The sheer ubiquity of Palm would be impressive. The question for the consumer would become NOT "Palm or PPC?" but "Which Palm?"

What'd make it REALLY interesting would be if 1)Sony would release many different models concurrently, instead of discontinuing gems like the N610C, and 2) if Palm ditched the m100/105, went for full universal connector/expansion card models, and bumped prices down about $75 per model. Either way, lots of choices for the TYPICAL PDA buyer, which is not what most of us who frequent PIC are.

Yeah, but they're doing it anyway, as evidenced by that ridiculous e-mail they sent everyone hinting about the i700/705. I thnk Palm knows they are taking a risk of repeating last year's debacle, but I think they have no choice. They are in such trouble already that they feel they have to get the word out that great things are coming. If this story is true, the description of a "Be-like" OS 5 kind of confirms this, because there is no way that they had enough time to really integrate the technology (consider how quickly any kind of innovation has come out of Palm). They would be saying this to keep people from jumping ship. They're paranoid.

Think about how long it will take most software developers to port their software to work with the ARM processors. I have a feeling that the first ARM-based handhelds won't be worth having because there will be some software that you are used to using that won't be compatible for a while. I still haven't filled up half of my SD card because it's hard to find software that supports it!

Scott

Top marks to Palm though for good R&D/marketing tactics on the M105 which enabled the likes of
me to whet their appetites on what is a superb starter PDA for the price.

The downside is that turning the brightness level up high tires you out and can also cause blindness. Also, you need the palm input surgically implanted (available ONLY from Sony Med-Tech, Inc.), and that runs around $5,000-$6,000, depending on genetics.

Hey, I've SEEN it! You can't deny that this is coming!

I'm sorry if this joke falls flat -- T2 came out when I was about 11.

K. Tran

hahahaha.. now, this is the funniest thing i have read here for a while.. hahahahah..

// az
aaron@ardiri.com
http://www.ardiri.com/

I think they're real. If you notice in the first pic, the light coming from the right does in a way wash out the picture from the projector. If you look in the shadow from that light, you will note that the projected pic is much clearer and darker, meaning that the rest of it was affected by the light.

I'm wondering whether the light is a flash at all. It might be a backgroung light of some sort. It's also possible that the projector is at an angle.
To answer your question, the show was in Germany and that's why one of them has German OS. You'll note that it's the two new versions with the German OS; the 505 they use for comparision is in English, and they probably took it from one of the presenters to use as an example.

I think...

...In accordance with the prophecy...

Quik_Fix
quikfix@hotmail.com

I have a confession to make. I picked the Palm over the Sony because I did not like the Sony screen. The Sony screen was much nicer to look at for hi-res photographs, but the Palm screen was easier to read, faster, and had a better feel (firm and responsive without being spongy).

If I was a photographer, I probably would have bought the Sony, but since I do more reading and database management (Wordsmith and ThinkDB are beautiful on the 505), I had to choose accordingly.

I agree completely about the virtual graffiti. The 5xx series face is almost all screen, it's a shame to waste the graffiti area. In addition to extra spreadsheet space, think of viewing video in landscape mode!

This was by Foo Fighter on PDABuzz:

In a press conference held at its Palo Alto headquarters today, Palm announced a partnership with Apple to license the company's vaunted RDF (Reality Distortion Field) technology. Using RDF, Palm hopes to achieve great success with, what would otherwise be lackluster products. A spokesperson for Palm had this to say..."We believe that by using Steve Jobs trademarked phrases like Simply amazing and incredible or unbelievable that our new products will set the market on fire, while covering up the fact that there really isn't anything new or innovative about these particular products. The spokesperson also went on to say they had already successfully licensed Apple's pre-launch hype technique. When asked what Palm had up its sleeve next, CCO Mike Mace said.."Shhhhh".

BeOS has a nicer feel to the desktop. More like osX than anything else out there. TO get a good idea of BeOS without installing it...download the WindowBlinds trial and it has a BeOS skin that will give u a pretty good idea of the looks.
~twizza

Yes, I'm disappointed too.
Basically, as an early previewer of OS 5, we're going to have nothing more than a faster date book and address book.

I would tell most of you consumers out there to NOT hold your breath for anything multimedia related. Sorry. If you need multimedia, I would recommend you get a PocketPC.

I develop for both platforms and OS 5 is not impressive though you will see a "real" file management system and multi-threading.

Good! The Palm UI is very clean and very simple. No, you can't add all kinds of customized psychodellic colors. No, you can't put a background image in the launcher (but you can with some 3rd party launchers). Um, why is that a problem? It makes it smaller, faster, and easier for new users to learn. You want them to change a UI that is easily THE most novice-friendly UI currently available on any general purpose computing device? Are you insane?

Beef up the hardware. Provide new options. But for god's sake don't **** with the interface that 20 million users already know and are comfortable with. When Microsoft does that we get upset at them changing every other week.

--
This post is ROT26 encrypted. Reading it is a violation of the DMCA

Mario

Palm wants everyone to pick up the m125 instead of m10x. Once Palm used up the components for the m10x series, the m125 will serve as the entry level model.

That can create more sales for Palm because $199 is not that expensive after all for a PDA, as long as it has 8MB RAM and SD slot and UC. We know more accessories will come for the UC and SD.

If Palm decides to make the m130 and continue to sell m505/515 or whatever, they have to make sure that these products must be substantially different in features and content. Make the price gap be less than $100. One for $319 and one for $399. Kill the m500. It just does not fit in any price range.

Then please surprise us by rolling ARM-based handhelds in May or June without telling us first. $499 to start with and topped at $599 with either bluetooth or 802.11a built-in. Make sure you sell all the m505/515 (those $399 units) and use all the inventory of its components because no one would consider buying it anymore.

Whoa! Hold your horses... If the price is right, the m505/515 would sell just fine, even after the introduction of ARM-based units. Not everyone will want to go to OS 5 immediately, and there will be plenty of software and support for OS 4. What's more, not everyone finds 802.11, Bluetooth, etc., to be absolutely necessary in their PDA.

Just because you wouldn't buy an OS 4 machine doesn't mean everyone would.

What I mean is that three color handhelds (two OS4 and one ARM) will be extremely difficult to be marketed, given the price range of these units within $200-300.

graph

I have a IIIxe. My next Palm will (hopefully) have the same size screen or larger with a form factor no bigger than the III (which removes most of the PPCs from the running).

the prices of all the palms will drop from $20-$50. the m500 will be the first of the m500 series palms(meaning that there will be more in this line) to be discontinued, most likely going to be replaced with a color another color palm. the spot that the m100 empties will be replaced by a midrange palm.

After the 2nd calendar quarter, most of palm's handhelds will be priced at $350 or lower with a good number of them being color. the higher end palms, like the "m525" or the i700 *series*(again, more in this line) will be priced from $350 to $499.

There will be at least 2 new palms(including the i705) released by April, 2002. Palm plans to have as many as 4 new palms (including the 2 just mentioned) by the end of 3rd calendar quarter or beginning of 4th calendar quarter.

The images that were in this article can be confirmed by my one of my sources, but he doesn't want to risk posting here....

that iwas -IASEDA posting that info for you ;-)

Highly doubtful seeing that the m500 is one of the best selling current Palms. Maybe they would replace it with one with Bluetooth built-in.

The m110 and m105 will be discontinued soon, in that order, leaving the m125 as the low end model.

by august, the lineup of the palms, i think, will look like this, from lowest-end to highest end

m125
"m1xx", ie color version in m1xx mold
"m5xx", ie a better version of the palm m500
"m5x5", ie a better version of the palm m505
i705, being announced a week from today
"i705", color version of monochrome palm, possibily with major improvements, but still wireless

after this there will be 2 handhelds, geared for the more multimedia type person, both in color.

-IASEDA <<

You might be getting confused about names. The m500 is the monochrome version, the m505 is the color. The m505 has sold very well. The m500 has hardly sold at all so its only a matter of time before it goes away. I think soon.

The reason why they spin off their OS subsidary is they want to focus on more high-end, enterprise products. Not something you could sell @$99 for almost no profit at all. Palm will probably license to other entry manufacturers to manufacture some bread-and-butter, low-price handhelds. The Palm OS could keep the $8 or more for royalty instead.

Palm should and will focus wireless capabilities on their next generation handhelds, which profits are made.

That would be incorrect. Although the m505 is the better selling Palm, the sales numbers for the m500 have been quite good as well.

Jonh Reevo, Palm Sporkeperson said in unnoficial note than there's no palm device named M515. New models will be available just in April, and rund OS 5, in a ARM machine.

Please, Stop panic!

Palm isn't stupid.

This is totally wrong. The beta of OS 5 will be ready late spring. The final version will be done early fall with hand-helds using it out late fall.

For the rest of us with normal hands and fingers, a Clie's size and stylus are just right.

Anyway, I am 99% convinced these are Palms next models. It is so simple. They have nothing in the $200-$300 selling range. They will never be able to keep sales of the 505 up with the Sony T615c so vastly superior. 16 meg and a brighter screen are the minimum they need to sell any thin form-factor PDAs for the next 10 months.

The M100 is selling for $40 in Japan. They are getting rid of them to keep the entry price above $100 in the US.

None, of this is likely to get them any of my money, though. I want a Sony T715C with dual slots, big battery, soft grafitti, and full sound capabilities.

Hmmm... Posted by IM Anonymous...courageous. Mature, too.

...In accordance with the prophecy...

Quik_Fix
quikfix@hotmail.com

Of course many of those who post anonimously talk **** (like me, but not now), but some talk real business and they have to stay anonimous to have that little bit of protection for THEMSELVES _AND_ THEIR sources.

TEO (future Pocket PC user and ex-Palm veteran)

----

You know what you just wrote is ridiculous, right? So, it's the best but the screen sucks. So, logically it is NOT the best, right?

Take a logic course, my friend.

>You know what you just wrote is ridiculous, right? So,
>it's the best but the screen sucks. So, logically it
>is NOT the best, right?
>Take a logic course, my friend.

He said that his M505 is the "best looking designed PDA *available*", not the PERFECT pda. What else is available to compare it with? The CLIE 615? It may have a better screen but perhaps he prefers and puts more weight on the m505's stylus size and shell design (eg: it's an opinion).

Take an english course. (sorry, couldn't help it!)