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Comments on: Bluetooth SD Card on Palm's European Site

The Palm Bluetooth SD Card is now listed on the company's European website. It isn't on the U.S. site yet. This is just a product description, it doesn't appear to be available for sale. This card should be out soon, though. According to Palm reps at PalmSource earlier this month, it will come out this week for $120.
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typo

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 3:26:13 PM #
it says the m130 is absent, i think u mean m125 since the m130 is rumored

RE: typo
Ed @ 2/20/2002 3:30:55 PM #
Thanks. Keep in mind though, when you see that "Breaking News" at the beginning, what it means is I'm still writing the article. I've just posted it so you don't have to wait another 30 minutes or so while I continue to edit it and add more. In general just the basics are there. I try to remember to spell check it first. :-)

---
News Editor

Bluetooth speed

mstur @ 2/20/2002 3:35:11 PM #
I cannot find any data on the bandwith of the Bluetooth connection compared to the IrDA infrared port.
I am currently using a T39 connected to my Vx with infrared. Works nicely when it works ;-)

Want a new Palm anyway, the m515 would fit all my needs. The question is, has the Bluetooth any spoeed advantage over the IrDA port ???

RE: Bluetooth speed
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 3:53:59 PM #
Throughput for Bluetooth is rated at 1 Mbps under optimal conditions. With error correction overhead and other environmental factors, however, the real throughput should be about 700 Kbps to 800 Kbps.

Several other factors can influence Bluetooth's speed. The presence of other 2.4-GHz devices, such as an 802.11b WAN, can degrade performance of a Bluetooth piconet.

RE: Bluetooth speed
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 5:48:06 PM #
> Several other factors can influence Bluetooth's speed. The presence
> of other 2.4-GHz devices, such as an 802.11b WAN, can degrade
> performance of a Bluetooth piconet.

My understanding of this was that it is the other way around. 802.11b performance can be degraded by Bluetooth devices, but that 802.11b devices do not typically interfere with Bluetooth.

RE: Bluetooth speed
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 6:02:41 PM #
Truth of the matter is that other devices running 2.4 gig do have a little play with Bluetooth. But then, so do microwave ovens. :-)

The fun of a T39 with a bluetooth enabled Palm OS device (I saw a demo of the memorystick version long time ago, whatever happened to that?!) is that the phone can be in your pocket and the palm browsing the web in your hand. Wheeee....

For security, the palm to phone connection is protected with a 14 digit code so security is ok there. But if you have your bluetooth enabled on your palm device and don't have it 'hidden' from the network, anyone with a bluetooth device can find you and send you stuff... without your permission.

Palm Source had several cool palm and phone connection demos running. The sad one was the Palm Bluetooth to bluetooth printer demo where someone in the audience took over the printer and the demo person couldn't stop them.

RE: Bluetooth speed
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 7:06:17 PM #
hee hee - that was me! :-)

the HP printer has no security in it. Which is kinda flakey, but not a major problem really - it's only a printer. All other devices I've played with have user authentication. don't blame BT/Palm for HP's near-sightedness.



RE: Bluetooth speed
sir_tez @ 2/20/2002 7:09:39 PM #
Are any of the phones listed above available in the US? I want a Bluetooth enabled phone dangit!

---

Sir Tez
IT is a rough life

RE: Bluetooth speed
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 8:32:55 PM #
some friends in the US have the T39, so it must be available somewhere. i think they are with Cingular...?

RE: Bluetooth speed
Xian @ 2/20/2002 9:15:35 PM #
Cingular doesn't sell T39 phones, but you can get one from other sources and use them on Cingular's network. I just got one from Primate Systems a week ago to replace my T28World and I love it.

You can also find them on PlanetOmni and eBay.

RE: Bluetooth speed
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 3:57:42 AM #
This shouldn't be much of an issue. The bottleneck will be the airspeed of your uplink. Here in Europe, the current max speed is 43.3 (three of the wide GSM/GPRS timeslots available from a few operators). Most of the time they seem to stick me with a pesky 9.6 connection. With syncs/dl's going beyond 5 minutes, it will be a blessing not having to keep the phone and Palm's IrDA eyes aligned.


peace,
airwhale

RE: Bluetooth speed
Synwpn @ 2/21/2002 1:46:21 PM #
I got my T39 off the net and have it working on Voicestream and Cingular (when I'm on the west coast). I LOVE this phone. So far, with the extended battery, I can run for almost 3 weeks without recharging it! Already put in a request for this bluetooth SD at my local vendor.

m125's absence

Scott @ 2/20/2002 3:41:23 PM #
My take on it is that the m125 is probably compatible but because the card sticks out and the slot on the m125 is on the side, Palm, Inc. realizes that it would offer poor usability, so they're only stressing m5xx compatibility. Of course, that's just my guess.

Scott

RE: m125's absence
madhatter @ 2/20/2002 3:52:03 PM #
"The card was demonstrated at PalmSource working with the i705"

Scott, the only problem with that assessment is that the i705 also has it's card slot on the side. As far as being usable, I think that Palm expects for people to take the card out when not in use. This would save a lot of calls from people who forget to sign off the net and the person's phone minutes are eaten up by a Palm that is sitting in their pocket.

A Palm in hand is worth two in your pocket.

RE: m125's absence
AzureGuy @ 2/20/2002 4:46:32 PM #
I want bluetooth for my m125.....

* * *
OW, my BLUETOOTH!!!! I lost my blue tooth..... :(
RE: m125's absence
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 6:02:15 PM #
it's BOOTHTOOF

RE: m125's absence
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 6:10:23 PM #
To protect that longer SD/bluetooth card coming out the side of your palm handheld, you could cut a slit in a tennis ball and put that over it. The ball should protect it as well make your palm device easy to find amongst other till they see what a great idea you had and copy cat you. Ha... just kidding there, no one would copy such a great idea go ahead and be the first.

RE: m125's absence
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 6:11:58 PM #
My guess is that it will not be compatible with the m125 since the m125 (and m130?) does not have Flash ROM. The software for the Bluetooth drivers may need to be applied as a patch to the OS in ROM, and thus require Flash ROM.

RE: m125's absence
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 7:28:32 PM #
BBZZTTT! WRONG!

It works just fine in a 125. The only issue is that it sticks out the side. If you have a 125 and want BT you CAN use the card.

The software DOES NOT go into flash, it uses main memory.

RE: m125's absence
Scott @ 2/20/2002 11:51:29 PM #
"Scott, the only problem with that assessment is that the i705 also has it's card slot on the side. As far as being usable, I think that Palm expects for people to take the card out when not in use. This would save a lot of calls from people who forget to sign off the net and the person's phone minutes are eaten up by a Palm that is sitting in their pocket."

Ed said that the i705 wasn't listed, either. I didn't argue that it wouldn't work with the m125, just that they were probably not listing it because it would be kinda clunky since it would stick out of the side. Quite honestly, it seems to me that it will be worse than clunky, it will actually be uncomfortable to hold an m125 or i705 with the card there, since that's where your hand is supposed to wrap around the device. I also have to disagree with you a bit on the issue of connecting wirelessly. Sure, accessing the internet via a Bluetooth phone will no doubt be one of the biggest uses of it. But, the beauty of Bluetooth, to me, is with a lot of the other things people haven't even thought of yet. Actually, Palm did think of one. Remember the idea about scanning other local Palm OS devices for a list of someone's favorite software? You won't get very far if everyone's walking around with the Bluetooth card in their pocket.

Overall, I'm disappointed. Not just with the fact that it sticks out, but also with the cost. Until Bluetooth PDAs are widespread (enabling the neat stuff I mentioned above), most people are going to be using this basically as a cable-replacement. Is a cable replacement worth $130?

Scott

RE: m125's absence
mtg101 @ 2/21/2002 4:30:21 AM #
Scott - yep - US$120 is a lot for a cable replacement. Assuming you already have a cable. I know few people over here in the UK who've bought a cable because of the huge cost, around £50 ($70).

Also, every time you change phone or PDA you have to buy a new cable. And the cables don't come out for ages after the devices do.

So, if you don't have a cable and may be upgrading your phone or PDA within the next year or so, a BT card might actually be a good investment.


---
russ@russb.fsnet.co.uk

RE: m125's absence
Scott @ 2/21/2002 11:38:51 AM #
Good points mtg101. Sorry to hear about the excessive cable costs. Surely, 3rd party cable makers make them cheaper, no? While your arguments may make sense for European customers, here's why I wouldn't go for it:
1) If I buy it with the hopes of not having to worry about buying a new cable with every new PDA I buy, I'll be locked into SD devices.
2) With the diminishing costs of Bluetooth, it's possible that future devices will have it built in anyway.
3) The card still sticks out. By the time I got around to buying another PDA without Bluetooth but with an SD slot, I'd be willing to bet that a newer, smaller, cheaper SD Bluetooth card would be available.

Personally, I hope they (and everyone else) get moving on integrating Bluetooth into all of their PDAs ASAP.

Scott

HandEra 330

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 6:42:09 PM #
Anyone know if this card will be supported in the HandEra 330? HandEra has been very good about producing drivers for many of the CF devices out there... what about the newer SD devices?


RE: HandEra 330
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 9:04:46 PM #
At a minimum the card requires Palm OS 4.x, so at least for now the answer would certainly be no.

Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 6:41:27 PM #
The only Nokias that are available now AND have bluetooth are the 6310 and the 8310 - however, only the 8310 is triple band allowing it to be used in the US.

Can't wait to use my T39 with the Bluetooth card, BUT I want to see it WORKING first.

RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 6:48:31 PM #
I just saw Palm's website - I didn't realize it was their mistake, not Ed's. It MUST be a typo...

RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
skytraveler @ 2/20/2002 7:48:32 PM #
The Nokia 6210 does have a bluetooth add-on.

The SkyTraveler
RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 7:49:58 PM #
Yes but so does the T29s and other phones. I find it strange that there is no driver for the 6310 or the 8310 with built-in bluetooth, although the fact that they were relatively recently released would explain it...

RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 8:00:25 PM #
according to the nokia website the 8310 is not tri-band... only 900/1800 thus cannot be used in the US
http://www.nokia.com/phones/8310/index.html
The US equivalent will be the 8390 which is only 1900

RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 10:57:27 PM #
I have a Nk8310 right here and definately no bluetooth capability out the box.

RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 12:12:08 AM #
Nokia 8310 = dual band GSM 900/1800
supports GPRS
IR enabled
***NO BLUETOOTH***

RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 3:52:49 AM #
You can buy that as an option - it's a battery with Bluetooth capabilities. However, I don't like the card sticking out so much. It won't fit in my case, so it's a bit annoying. If I'm gonna use an add-on for Bluetooth that adds to the form factor, I might as well go with the TDK Blue m - then I will have access to all the apps and stuff I keep on my SD memory card at the same time.

Anyone know if the m515 will have built-in Bluetooth?

peace,
airwhale

RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 4:46:55 AM #
Nokia 6210 can have bluetooth. Nokia sells a connectivity pack for the 6210, which includes a bluetooth module for the phone and a bluetooth PCMCIA card.

RE: Nokia 6210 does NOT have Bluetooth
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 5:34:43 AM #
Sorry, you guys are right about the 8310. For some reason I was under the illusion it was triple band and had bluetooth, simply because a lot of people were comparing it to the T39!! It does have GPRS though :P

Phone Compatibility in the USA

skytraveler @ 2/20/2002 7:45:26 PM #
It appears that the drivers the module comes with are for European phones. Does anyone know what phones the bluetooth module will be compatible with in the USA?

The SkyTraveler
RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 7:59:18 PM #
Well the T39, the T68, as well as 8310 are all triple-band GSM phones, so they can be used in the US too. If I am not mistaken, Voicestream and Cingular are both GSM? All three have GPRS which is another plus.

Aren't these sold in the US?

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 8:47:53 PM #
I just got the t39 and the only place it is availible seems to be from online retailers. I got mine for $175 from ustronics.com (with voicestream activation). It was the best deal I could find. The only problem is they sent me the t39mc which is actually a chinese version of the phone. So that means no t9 text input. I have heard that Ericsson will upgrade your firmware for free so I am looking into that.

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/20/2002 8:52:42 PM #
It's too bad there isn't more GSM competition in the US. The price of the phone without activation is about $300. In parts of Europe you can get it for free with activation.

Ericsson does upgrade the firmware for free (in my country anyway), and since you got it with activation it should have already been the English version! Anyway, look into your nearest service center - the upgrade takes about 30 minutes. If it's just a matter of firmware change, you have no problems.

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
Xian @ 2/20/2002 9:20:46 PM #
Voicestream is all GSM, and depending on where you are, Cingular can be GSM. When SBC and BellSouth merged into Cingular, the company has been operating with both GSM and TDMA, if I remember right. All depends on where you are in the country.

And as far as GPRS goes, it's not everywhere that Cingular has GSM at.

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
He||Raiser @ 2/21/2002 2:40:31 AM #
Does anyone have the T39 in California? In addition, what processes did you guys have to go through to get the phone. How did you get the phone with activiation if you bought it from an online retailer, did you buy the phone direct from this website and then Voicestream reimbursed you or...?

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
TypeMRT @ 2/21/2002 3:34:22 AM #
I'm in LA and it took a few minutes with Google and a telephone to find a local retailer to sell it to me for $300.

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
Xian @ 2/21/2002 4:37:14 AM #
I'm in San Jose/Sunnyvale. I bought my T39 from Primate Systems and once I got it, I just took the SIM chip out of my T28World phone and placed it in my T39. Once it was powered on, I was ready to go.


RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 10:20:03 AM #
Motorola sells a model 270 which is CDMA and they say its available thru Verizon however I can't find in my area. Also, the phone will cost you $399 and the bluetooth add-on is another $299 (ouch). But the bluetooth kit includes a PCMCIA card you could use in your laptop so you are getting more options.

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 10:29:01 AM #
An update to my previous posting: I just checked Motorola's web site and they are advertising the Timeport 270c with the Bluetooth phone module and a Bluetooth headset as a kit for $489.99. They say the phone is available for Verizon.

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 1:42:08 PM #
Motorola Timeport 270: Bluetooth is built into the phone (and costs about $200 from verizon), and the kit is only to connect it to your laptop. you shouldn't need anything but the phone to connect to the bluetooth palm card.

RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 5:20:41 PM #
From Motorola's web site:

Timeport 270c Bluetooth™ Value Pack

The Timeport™ 270c phone is Bluetooth enabled and packed full of features to increase your productivity. The sleek, over-the-ear headset incorporates the latest Bluetooth wireless technology to deliver lightweight, hands-free convenience and cordless compatibility. The phone module lets you communicate between your Timeport 270c phone, the Motorola Bluetooth Wireless Headset and a host of other Bluetooth enabled PC's and PDA's - without wires!

Value Pack Includes:

Timeport™ 270c phone for Verizon Wireless
Bluetooth Wireless Headset - 98405
Bluetooth Phone Module - 99332

Bluetooth™ Phone Module - 99332 / SYN8705

Turn your Motorola Timeport™ 270c phone into a Bluetooth™ phone!

The Motorola Bluetooth™ Phone Module lets you communicate without wires between your Timeport™ 270c phone, the Motorola Bluetooth™ Wireless Headset and a host of other Bluetooth enabled PC's and PDA's.

This accessory is easy to use. Simply remove the battery door on your Timeport™ 270c phone and replace it with the Bluetooth™ Phone Module. Now you are ready to start communicating without wires!

User Manual

COMPATIBILITY:
For use only with the Motorola Timeport™ 270c phone. Also compatible with the Bluetooth™ Wireless Headset.
The Bluetooth™ Phone Module will not work with any other phone.


RE: Phone Compatibility in the USA
I.M. Anonymous @ 4/26/2002 3:51:06 PM #
Have you found how to configure the palm to drive the Motorola 270c modem?

please contact me at herrick@hglightingdesign.com

More information

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 8:09:17 AM #
Hi

There are more information available not covered by this article. According to a review (asaik it's first one about the card) on http://www.nexave.de/reviews/bt-sd-card.php the card will work with PalmOS4 and will support m125, m500 and m505. The site tested a card from the bluetooth developer kit from palm. Handera 330 is not supported yet but drivers may be published bei Handera itself.

Delivered Applications:

Blueboard (use memos with up to 4 palms)
BlueChat (chat for up to 4 palms)
BtPrint (print)
Web-Clipping-Applications
Telephone drivers for Sony Ericsson T39, T68, R520M and Nokia 6310
Printer driver for HP DeskJet 995

The review mentioned above includes some screenshots of the bluetooth-pairing-process etc., you just have to click on the small palm icons in the text. There are photos, too.

Range

The tester said that the card works in the range of 18 metres and 10 metres through walls

Excuse my bad English, I just like to give you the most useful information that is possible

Greetings from Germany

RE: More information
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 8:20:52 AM #
Btw, the writer of the review agrees that pic may use the photos or screenshots...

Best Wishes from Hannover, Germany.
Torsten Bergemann
Webmaster Nexave Palm Site

Available in the US now @ CDW

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 11:24:34 AM #
The card is listed as a 4/6-day item on CDW right now. If the following link doesn't resolve just search on www.cdw.com for "palm bluetooth card".

I already have a TDK BlueM, which allows me to use the SD slot for expansion, including Internet apps. I'm curious to see if I can get by with these apps on my 8 MB 505. If so, please see my auciton on eBay for a slight-used sled :)

http://www.cdw.com/shop/products/default.asp?EDC=362137

RE: Available in the US now @ CDW
Xian @ 2/23/2002 1:16:13 AM #
I just bought one today at Fry's Electronics in Sunnyvale for $129 + tax.
It comes in the now standard blister pack with the Bluetooth SD card, install manual, and Windows/Mac installation CD containing the BT drivers, BT apps, Web Clipping, and WAP program.

Are there any palm bluetooth games?

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 6:20:12 PM #
Does anybody have any info on bluetooth apps in the pipeline? Before I spend the $$$ on bluetooth I wanna know that I'm going to be able to secretly play games with the guys in the cubes surrounding me.

I'm looking forward to not having to face people I play, or even not having to be in the same room.

Maybe, somebody will release a turn-based civ?

What games would you want?

RE: Are there any palm bluetooth games?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 6:58:38 PM #
there are already 2 that i know of. biplane ace from astraware, and scrabble from...?

RE: Are there any palm bluetooth games?
peter167 @ 2/21/2002 10:35:14 PM #
AS long as the range allows you to do so, you could play games even the floor below you. I think it is theoretically possible. But I have not tried it myself. I will tell you when I bought the card.

Okay, finally of course more games will come out in the future because bluetooth is designed for wireless networking in a short-range for a low throughput. It is cool also if we are able to play majong (yes, I am a Chinese) or bridge or poker. How about some gamble games (for real money)?

Hey, I am too excited. Who cares whether the card stick out. My floppy disk always stick out of my FDD.


******************
Lie is the future.

RE: Are there any palm bluetooth games?
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/21/2002 10:45:26 PM #
i have used some of the demo apps (blueboard etc) through multiple plasterboard walls with colleagues over 10 metres away (ie he was 2 rooms away). pretty cool.

bluetooth and palm

dc-k @ 2/22/2002 2:28:07 PM #
I've been using tdk's blueM bluetooth adapter with my palm m505 and ericsson t39m. they work very well together but I can't configure the kit to use my gprs account for wap browsing. I'm still waiting for palm's 24 hour response (two weeks and counting!) but would welcome help from anyone who has acheived this.

RE: bluetooth and palm
I.M. Anonymous @ 5/24/2002 10:22:32 AM #
Hi!!!...

I also have a Palm M505 with the Bluetooth card, and a ericsson T39m. But they don't work!!!... I did to follow all steps to configure both devices, but when I try to comunicate them, it doesn't work.

Did you have any problem?? ... I'm still waiting an answer form Palm Support.

Thanks.

RE: bluetooth and palm
I.M. Anonymous @ 5/25/2002 3:33:34 PM #
Did you ever get you phone and the Palm to work with the GPRS service. I too have tried without success and also did not get a promised call from Tech support.

www.expansys.com shows BT card "in stock"

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/23/2002 3:02:26 AM #
for what it's worth, expansys shows the bluetooth SD card as "in stock". a few days ago it was only available as "pre-order" shows for £99 plus tax

RE: www.expansys.com shows BT card
Xian @ 2/23/2002 11:07:49 AM #
I picked one up locally at Fry's Electronics yesterday.

Saw it at Fry's today

pdagal @ 2/23/2002 8:35:35 PM #
Fry's (Sunnyvale, CA) had a few forsale! The packaging says that the Motorola Timeport 270c is also supported.

http://www.pdabuyersguide.com
Your online buyer's guide for PDAs
Bought it at Fry's today
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/24/2002 11:58:21 PM #
Now I just need to get that bluetooth cell phone. <g>

how much??
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/25/2002 6:48:30 AM #
what was the price at fry's?

RE: Saw it at Fry's today
I.M. Anonymous @ 2/26/2002 12:45:44 AM #
$129 + tax.
I picked up 2 tonight.
It seems to be the last two on shelf.

Those salemen there don't even know there is
such a thing for Palm.

ted

Question-About the 8310 Series of The Nokia

I.M. Anonymous @ 2/23/2002 8:51:07 PM #
I just would like to know when the 8310 series of the nokia will be coming to the u.s.?

expect driver for HandEra

PIC mobile user @ 3/26/2002 5:16:24 AM #
anyone has "inside" tips about when it supports HandEra 330?
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