Comments on: Rumor: Macromedia Flash Player Coming for the Palm OS

At a recent seminar a put on by Figleaf Software, a close partner of Macromedia, it was revealed the Macromedia had developed a version of the Flash Player for the Palm OS, but it was too slow to be usable on the current crop of 33 MHz processors that are in just about all Palm OS devices. However, the project hasn't been totally dropped. When Palm OS handhelds with faster processor are available, Macromedia will release it.
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Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 12:35:35 PM #
Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go before users would even want to install Flash software on their PDA. I can see why this app would be attractive on an OS like Windows CE, but Palm is sort of a barebones, minimal device at this point... and doesn't seem to be making any obvious headway to become something more "whiz-bang" and functionallike Pocket PC.

Don't get me wrong, I'm happy with my Clie, but I'm becoming increasingly frustrated with the slow implementation of processing power for Palms.

I guess the analogy would be, I'm happy that my old school VW Bug gets me where I need to go, but it would be nice to have a car with an AC unit, a stereo, and some power steering.

Hopefully Palm will catch up.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
Ed @ 3/8/2002 12:44:14 PM #
Early this summer, PalmSource will release Palm OS 5, which has been re-written to run on ARM-based processors. To give you an idea of what this means, Intel recently announced two new processors that Palm OS 5 could run on. One is 200 MHz, the other is 400 MHz. We could see handhelds running these before this fall.

www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=2984

---
News Editor

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 12:48:01 PM #
Hey, I'm sick and tired of developers trying to turn the PalmOS into a bonafide PC.

I like the instant on and speed of my Palm m515 and we don't need to burden it with eye candy and other junk. Let's leave everything pristine and leave the eye candy and other molasses for the PocketPC idiots.

ZEN OF PALM !!!

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 12:49:51 PM #
"Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go"

That would be true if they didn't even begin working on faster processors. But this isn't the case, now is it?

I guess there is no pleasing some people, it seems like they're addicted to bitching. I'm getting sick of it.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 12:52:54 PM #
Sorry man... I'm the author of this thread and I wasn't bitching. I'm Pro-Palm all the way, and I'm not thinking about migrating to Pocket PC or anything... I just would have at least liked to see some 66mhz processors in Palm Devices (Clie 415-615, etc) a while ago.

More processing power could allow Palm to add to the simple elegance of the Palm OS. I'm just an anxious consumer.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 12:55:05 PM #
Man, my m515 does what I need it do. It does basic PIM stuff, some games, etc. That's all I need. I don't care about Flash on a PDA anyways. Sheesh! Are we forgetting that these are suppose to be simple machines...get the info you need and run. Get a laptop, if you want a functionality of a PC.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 1:02:56 PM #
> Man, my m515 does what I need it do.

The telegraph did what it needed to do before the telephone. The horse and carriage did what it needed to do before the car. Monochrome screens did what they needed to do before color screens.

The fact that the current generation of products do what they need to do does not excuse a lack of innovation. And because of this Palm (and to a much lesser degree, Sony) can be rightfully criticized.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 1:07:39 PM #
"Man, my m515 does what I need it do. It does basic PIM stuff, some games, etc. That's all I need. I don't care about Flash on a PDA anyways. Sheesh! Are we forgetting that these are suppose to be simple machines...get the info you need and run. Get a laptop, if you want a functionality of a PC."

I so totally agreed. What do you want in your palm device? everything that your laptop or pc can do into that little handheld? and keep the cost down?

Yeah right, get those stuffs in your D.I.Y and fix one yourself and stop bitching about it.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 1:08:07 PM #
"The telegraph did what it needed to do before the telephone. The horse and carriage did what it needed to do before...BLAH-BLAH-BLAH"

OK! What else do I need to do on this besides look up information like dates, contacts, memory jogging things I write in memopad, etc? Do I need Flash? Do I need multimedia presentations? Do I need to watch movies on this? Damn...let's get realistic here. The Palm will evolve when need be, just like those things you mention but for what now...it's fine to me and countless others.


RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 1:08:53 PM #
> The fact that the current generation of products do what they need to do does not excuse a lack of innovation.

I agree partly with you. I too am the owner of a m515 and it's good enough. If I need to do more, I use my 3.4 lb Portege notebook which has MS Office, games, and everything else including Macromedia Flash.

I'm not against innovation per se, but the problem is trying to shoehorn a PC into a form factor of a Palm. PocketPC tried this and while the platform is impressive and innovative enough, it isn't enough for me to switch. Yes, it's cool that you can play MP3 files and play a Gameboy emulator at full speed with color on a Jornada, but basically I just use Datebk 4 on my m515. I've tried reading ebooks, but the screen is just too tiny and that goes for PocketPC also.

And for those that lament the lack of quality games, just go and get a Gameboy Advance that blows away the Palm and PocketPC for quality games. I got one for my nephew and almost picked one up for myself and I played Advance Wars.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 1:46:28 PM #
"I'm not against innovation per se, but the problem is trying to shoehorn a PC into a form factor of a Palm."

So true! This will not happen because...well...damn, look at the bleeding battery life. The battery technology is to support this is not there! Look at the PPC, it last what...a couple of hours just listening to music or playing games. We're gonna need some other energy source that comes from an Alien race if we want to start carrying PC-like PDAs in a form of the m515. It just not gonna happen until the technology arrives.


RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 1:56:19 PM #
Power, power... Do I read some kind of sexual complex? Just like those old men who need a V12 sports car in order to feel masculine ???

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 2:44:31 PM #
Hey Guys/Gals,

For everyone who wants their Palm for nothing more than DateBk4, there's no need to get angry! The answer for your type is NOT to whine about Palm making more fully-featured devices, but SIMPLY to just buy a model that does ONLY what you need! It's all very simple. Go buy a Palm Vx, or stick with your m505 for the rest of your life! It will do your data organization happily and bring no more to your table than you want.

The rest of the world, however, has PocketPC envy (whether they admit it or not). We all want devices that can do everything. We all want the laptop in our pocket (just not Pocket PC size). We all want better screens (seems like a lot of you have 515s). If Palm can somehow do that and keep it down to a PalmV size, then by all means LET THEM. If their models start ballooning up to gargantuan PocketPC size, GO BUY SOMETHING ELSE, or stick with your older models. Seriously, all this bickering is so bloody lame.

Saying that Palm should essentially stop at what they've got because it 'does the job', is so non-progressive I could spit! (in fact, I just did!)

For those who say the 'technology just isn't here yet', I just have one question: How do you think the technology gets here in the first place?

Relax about them changing the Palm. Worst comes to worse, you still have the model that does everything you need, right?

And the world is now a better place.

C-lo

I am married to my m505, btw.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 3:19:19 PM #
"How do you think the technology gets here in the first place?"

Out of necessity?

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 4:12:33 PM #
I'm looking foward to the day when Palm devices have the same hardware as PPC. PPC fans can make fun of Palm now but we all know that once Palm gets off dragonball, they can have hundreds of mhz and 64 megs of ram and all the other 32 bitness. Once this happens (and it will) it will all come down to software choice. If you think Pocket Word is better than Wordsmith, Docs to Go, Quickword and all the other Palm apps and you believe Pocket Word will always be better no matter how the others upgrade, then you'll get a PPC. But if you believe competition leads to better products then you'll get a PalmOS device

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 4:13:36 PM #
If processing power is a real concern for you, then you shouldn't have bought a Palm in the first place. If you had enough understanding of Palm's philosophy, you would have known that Palm tries to be a companion to the Desktop. Its exsistance is not to replace the Desktop. So this is why we have conduits.

We have better ways to enter our data (using keyboard and mouse) and a much better processing powers to calculate arthimatic and stuff. What Palm tries to be, is when we want to see some data on the go, then we can *immediately* see that data and able to do some simple modify to it. And this is why there is a minimal changes of hardware every since 1996.

If you really need such processing power, get a pocketPC of a laptop instead.

"Quick and Simple"
- Zen of Palm

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 4:41:47 PM #
ok, I have palm device. I got it because of better software available, even though I can afford IPAQs and anything else. but, I do want MY PDA, which I always carry with me to be FAR FAR mroe powerful, as powerful as it can be, I dont care if you only use it for datebook - dont buy new versions and stop whining.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 4:50:39 PM #
C-lo, you make a good point, but you seem to forget that Palm is in business. Its business depends on selling PDAs; not being at the forefront of whiz-bang tech.

The plain fact is that, for many customers, gizmos like MP3, flash, etc, are not very useful and they don't understand why they need to pay for them (both in terms of purchase price and, indirectly, through the complexity of the PDA). Remember this: Newton had all the latest features, but the unsophisticated little Palm buried the Newton. For that matter, PPC has all the latest features, but despite the best efforts of some of the biggest computer manufacturers, they are struggling to make any real headway against Palm.

Your suggestion, on its face, looks attractive as a compromise. Certainly, if Palm promised to keep making sensible units like the m500 (for people who don't want useless "features" like color screens, etc), then I will be able to replace my old Vx when it inevitably wears out. If so, then I don't mind if Palm goes off and produces units loaded with all the latest toys for other customers. That's fine, so far as it goes.

The problem your suggestion is that it carries a great deal of commercial risk. Risk in the sense that Palm would need to devote considerable resources and most of its R&D efforts to bringing out the new whiz-bang units. If they don't sell well (and the experience to date with the Newton and the PPC is that they won't), then Palm would have wasted a lot of time and money to produce loss making products.

This is the high road to bankruptcy.

Speaking for myself, I would prefer to see Palm continue to be a successful company, so I think they should think very carefully before taking the approach you advocate.


RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 7:44:46 PM #
I don't understand all of the whining about Palm moving to a faster, more 'multi-media' capable standard. MP3 playing and flash may not be useful - so what? The whole reason that i (and i think many people) work is so that i can afford to play / enjoy myself. I suppose those who dont want this also don't like using PC's for entertainment purposes aswell? It's the same thing - only for when yr on the go. I use my Palm for business - but i clock the most hours on it while travelling on the subway to and from work - playing games! There is nothing wrong with this. I am not the only one. Sure most people don't know what they want - they just look for the device with the 'biggest numbers' - but this has always been the case. I for one, am happy they are moving to hi-res, faster processors, MP3 support, and that Sega is releasing it's PalmOS game API. I want as much of my desktop as possible to be crammed into the Palm V form-factor. Why anybody wouldn't is beyond me - you can always continue to use it the same way you always have if thats what you want. Obviously, if i'm near my desktop i want to use that because of the better screen and interface. But if Palm can let me view web content that is closer to how it is supposed to viewed - then this is great. As for the notion of 'that's what a laptop is for' - i (and many others) hate dragging around a large 4lb+ laptop everywhere we go. In short - where ever it is appropriate (ie: wherever the interface limitations aren't a hinderance) I would prefer to carry a 5oz device that fits invisibly in my pocket. Everyone else should just relax and realize that even if you dont need or want this - other people do. And there is nothing wrong with that.

RE: Palm OS and Hardware has a long way to go...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 8:20:18 PM #
Amen. I don't think it's been said better.
Long live Palm in all of its future incarnations and capabilites!

Is it me or...

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 12:50:44 PM #
Is it just me, or is the timing of this interesting in light of the news that a new Clie (or two) will be announced next week?
Could they be 66mhz? Will Flashmedia then be released?
Stay tuned...

RE: Is it me or...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 3:37:14 PM #
I find it funny that the some Sony pusher always have a Sony angle whenever a story is posted.

RE: Is it me or...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 5:43:50 PM #
What else could Sony POSSIBLY release? While a T-series with MP3 would be cool, it seems like Sony is making this a major release device. I have a gut feeling that this will bring the new Dragonball processors...

RE: Is it me or...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/10/2002 4:32:01 AM #
"While a T-series with MP3 would be cool..."

cool = Completely Otiose and Obviously (another) Loser

Get the disgraceful "paperwhite" screen on the T415 fixed first, then we will talk.

PPC Troll

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 1:55:18 PM #
Why is this even a news? *lol* Heck even a smart phone can play Flash. This just to show how primitive palm is. (never mind 5.0. It's big hype vaporware.)

Now if somebody ports QuakeIII to a handheld THAT would be news. (Quake II is an old news)

anybody want to bet that when 5.0 comes out it won't even play MP3? Because nobody knows how to write an efficient MP3 player for Palm.

I suggest Palm users should get used to the idea of Zen and blotchy 160*160 pixelated screen till the end of eternity.

heh heh

RE: PPC Troll
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 2:08:46 PM #
heh heh...dumb***

RE: PPC Troll
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 2:56:32 PM #
"Because nobody knows how to write an efficient MP3 player for Palm."

Well Palm has a 33Mhz 68000 compatible CPU. I think there was a Deliplayer plugin for a 680x0 ~28Mhz Amigas which could play mp3 at least at 22Khz.

An overclocked Clie Tx15 or M5xx may be enough for this as well.


RE: PPC Troll
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 5:28:55 PM #
"dumb***"

No need for that, I think he's joking. Would a PPC troll start a message with the subject "PPC troll"?

It is difficult to recognize jokes like that however, because there is a never ending army of idiots who actually think the exact same way but then not as a joke.


What you can do with Flash...

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 2:08:24 PM #
Let's not forget that Flash is NOT just for making annoying animated banner ads for web pages! Flash can be used to develop applications as well. Look at the description new Flash MX functionality and you will get the idea.

There are a TON of reasons why and why not to use Flash for development, but the fact that its resolution is fully scalable, and Flash players exist for multiple platforms, conceptually makes this an attractive idea. And Flash is relativly compact. It may not be a replacement for other programming environments, but it's defiantly worth a look!

Realistically, the only problem with the Palm platform is its speed.


RE: What you can do with Flash...
Scott @ 3/8/2002 2:58:16 PM #
Flash is also good at making annoying intro screens on web pages. I usually look for the "skip intro" button. Personally, I don't see much real use for Flash on the web, and I question how useful it will be on a PDA. I agree that for product demos and training, it could be useful on the desktop. But, what specific types of uses do you see it having on a PDA? I'm thinking maybe some mini Flash cartoons or something. Other ideas?

Scott

RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 3:01:53 PM #
"Other ideas?"

Nothing comes to mind except maybe running a fully charge battery to empty. LOL!

RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 3:05:35 PM #
How about developing training apps for palm? I'm chomping at the bit waiting for the palm player to be realsed so I can start porting some of the courseware I develop to palm.


RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 3:08:40 PM #
"Nothing comes to mind except maybe running a fully charge battery to empty. LOL!"

I wonder why palm users are soo good at nothing but throwing insults.

Flash could do alot of stuff
You can make a totally Vector based movie, that's fun
You can make a full blown game with it, that's fun
You can view more webpages with it, that's fun.

Flash means more multimedia on palm, but as a palm user you probably don't want your beloved platform to grow to something that's more up to date.

RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 3:25:51 PM #
"Flash means more multimedia on palm, but as a palm user you probably don't want your beloved platform to grow to something that's more up to date."

As of now, Flash is nothing I need on my Palm. Once Flash or multimedia becomes a necessity ie. datebook, contacts, etc. then it'll be consider. But as of now...Flash is no use to me.

RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 3:39:41 PM #
Actually, an IDE like Macromedia Director, Authorware or RealBasic would be ideal for budding PalmOS developers who aren't knowledgeable in working with C code.

The problem with Flash is that, like Java, it needs an engine to handle interpretting and running the files. If there was a way to compile directly to a palm app, it would be much faster.

Both Macromedia and RealSoftware should be looking into this market. It's probably much bigger than they realize.

RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 4:52:37 PM #
"As of now, Flash is nothing I need on my Palm. Once Flash or multimedia becomes a necessity ie. datebook, contacts, etc. then it'll be consider. But as of now...Flash is no use to me."

ok according to your reasoning you don't even need a palm, all you nee is a pen and paper, which saves you like let's see ... cheapest palm out there about $100 minus 1 dollar for a pen and about 3 dollars for a really think deck of paper. ok that saves u about $96.

RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 5:07:47 PM #
"ok according to your reasoning you don't even need a palm, all you nee is a pen and paper, which saves you like let's see ... cheapest palm out there about $100 minus 1 dollar for a pen and about 3 dollars for a really think deck of paper. ok that saves u about $96."

LOL...no you idiot! Actually, my Palm replaced my DayTimer which was paper and pen. Man, do you know much it cost to get DayTimer replacements every year...just to have printed times and other references already printed on them? It was more feasible to just spend the money on a Palm which did everything my old DayTimer did and even more.

RE: What you can do with Flash...
Scott @ 3/8/2002 5:42:59 PM #
Back to the useful discussion about what Flash would be good for...

To the guy commenting about courseware: Please elaborate. I'm curious what kind of courseware you're talking about. Aside from the issue of processing power, I'd imagine that the 160x160 resolution could be a major issue.

Scott

RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 8:04:02 PM #
Hey ludites - its OK - God won't strike you dead if you actually HAVE FUN using your Palm. Its not a sin - honest! Embrace - Embrace! It's OK. I checked the bible - there's nothing in there about using yr Palm for entertainment - it's ALRIGHT!!

RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 8:13:20 PM #
> I checked the bible

I don't believe in the Christian Mythology,

but having said that I agree about luddites. It's OK to have fun even for Atheists and Agnostics.

RE: What you can do with Flash...Courseware elaboration:
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/11/2002 9:45:46 AM #
Okay I'll give two examples of coursware I've done I'd like to port to palm.

1. I did a very simple piece that was nothing more than explaining how to synchonize a Novell password with a Windows NT password. It was so simple and small to begin with that I see it moving to palm devices so Execs could always have this tidbit of training at their finger tips. This simple piece of training reduced calls to our help desk significantly.

2. A very complicated training regarding a brand new data wharehouse. I see the training being broken up in to smaller chunks users could access while in the environment. We've already got a PDF manual available for the palm but wouldn't it be great if the palm could show how to select a particular measure instead of just explaining it with text?

These are both page turner examples. Essentially giving the user a very interactive user manual on the palm device.



RE: What you can do with Flash...
I.M. Anonymous @ 4/23/2002 10:55:05 PM #
Palm as well as other HandHelds needs to get in a point that can substitute a full computer. There is a lot of reasons why.

Imagine the following: You are in an Airport... They have those little workstations where you can plugin your handheld and get access to the world... You log in your computer, get the information you need, edit it and etc. It would be very useful. As well as interfaces to cars and etc...

Life would not be easier if we could exchange data more easily? What if your car could understand your appointments and could help you with the logistics to get faster in the different places you need to be by using the GPS in the car?

And we are not so far away. Battery life is something that can be fixed... Don't you think? The other day I was reading about a paint in Japan that is capable to convert Solar Light in power.

Also, Palms and others handheld are getting very expensive. Today you can buy a Dell notebook, brand new, non refurbished for US$ 900. I bought my Palm 500 for US$ 369 when launched... Compared to the notebook with TFT screen, lots of memory, hard disk, the palm is just a little PC board with an small screen and slow CPU.

Let me know what you think,

Rom

OK, after reading all this crap above

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 5:06:15 PM #
OK, after reading all this crap above...I want the last five minutes of my life back.

RE: OK, after reading all this crap above
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 6:47:38 PM #
MWAHAHAHA, I now have taken enough lost 5 minutes to live another 2 days!!!! MWAHAHAHHAHA, cough, hack.

Rememeber, all your Palm are belong to me

Off topic (once again) but should be quite critical

peter167 @ 3/8/2002 5:23:01 PM #
With the launch of the OS5, can anyone predict that a third-party browser company (e.g. Opera) will port its software on OS5? How about Quicktime, Realplayer and things alike?

Just curious.

******************
Lie is the future.

RE: Off topic (once again) but should be quite critical
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/8/2002 8:15:06 PM #
Porting Quicktime and Realplayer will be a problem with OS 5 because the API is virtually the same as OS 4. There are no hooks for multimedia. You're going to have to wait until OS 6 in 2003 sometime.



RE: Off topic (once again) but should be quite critical
misteralfie @ 8/18/2003 3:38:40 PM #
real player is now ported to OS5 on tungsten T2, also, its surprisingly non proprietary and plays all bitrates of mp3's.

Price of bandwidth...

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/9/2002 8:36:13 AM #
The price of mobile bandwidth isn't cheap at the momment. Just look at the GPRS prices of the lead dutch telecom provider:

Bundel 1 MB 10,00
Bundel 5 MB 15,00
Bundel 10 MB 25,00
Bundel 25 MB 45,00

If you exceed your monthly bundel you have to pay extra per MB.

Bundel 1 MB 12,50
Bundel 5 MB 4,25
Bundel 10 MB 3,50
Bundel 25 MB 2,25

As far as I know the prices are pretty much the same in other countries.

I think flash and online ad's for PDA browsers or applictaions won't be a success till the price of mobile bandwith drops.

RE: Price of bandwidth...
misteralfie @ 8/18/2003 3:39:46 PM #
although completely true in most respects, here in the UK, I get 2mb of bandwidth via gprs on my palm for 2...

Contrary to Palmheads belief

PIC mobile user @ 3/17/2002 6:08:28 PM #
PPC's dont eat batteries like they want to believe. I get great life out of my Casio EM500 using it heavily, and for 45 minutes a day listening to mp3's and reading Avantgo while exercising. The device is never in the cradle longer than 30 minutes a day. Im not saying they last as long as a palm but its not the concern many try & make it out to be.
RE: Contrary to Palmheads belief
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/17/2002 6:46:52 PM #
...of course, you can always tell the Microsoft employees by their willingness to rally to the defense of their beloved company as well as their...ah...unique grammar. Hey, sing us the company song, salaryman. Bill Gates, Bill Gates, uber alles!!

True, but Visor's fine

PIC mobile user @ 3/21/2002 2:57:44 PM #
Frankly I don't need to see Flash on my Palm. My favorite websites don't use it, and my Visor's functional enough and simple enough already as a nice organizer, not to mention hundreds cheaper than a PPC. Even a Clie isn't worth the $. If you want a portable power just get a laptop.
RE: True, but Visor's fine
misteralfie @ 8/18/2003 3:40:29 PM #
for my thinking, its more about entertainmetn and long term interactive viability of the handheld - as we progress, less people will beusing the handhelds they do for organising, and more for mobile entertainment. Just my opinion mind.

flash

I.M. Anonymous @ 7/16/2002 6:13:55 AM #
i want a man speaking with another man with mobile phone
RE: flash
misteralfie @ 8/18/2003 3:41:29 PM #
looks to me like you just want a man, oops, make that two! =)

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