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    Comments on: Palm OS 6 To Be Released in Late 2003According to new statements out of PalmSource, Palm OS 6 will be released to licensees before the end of late 2003. The new version will focus on wireless technology standards, security and multimedia. Update: Possible screen shots of Palm OS 6 have been posted.
Detailed Comment View (214 Total Comments)
The following comments are owned by whoever posted them. PIC is not responsible for them in any way. login or register for free in order to post comments.  RE: wireless , security and multimedia?xtremist5150 @ 5/7/2003 2:35:59 PM #
Methinks more security for Wi-Fi traffic, etc. Just because Palm has a good hardware setup with the Tungsten C for wireless right now doesn't mean that there isn't room for improvement on the software side. RE: wireless , security and multimedia?
>>I can't think of anything of wireless other than 802.11 and BT.. Hoping from one connection to another, protocols, ect. >>For multimedia, palm already got a fast CPU, good speaker, and camera on their PDAs. what else can they add? That does not mean it is as good as it can be. My guess is new UNIVERSAL APIs (meaning media players that work on every device), support for diffrent codecs, ect. security? So what are the security holes Palm has so far? A whimpy password is not good security. REAL 128 bit encrytion is security. Did you really think the OS was perfect? Its good, but not perfect. Technology moves on, and operatins systems must keep up. RE: wireless , security and multimedia?xtremist5150 @ 5/7/2003 3:03:50 PM #
I have an excellent source who claims that OS 6 will be better than OS 5. Shhhhh, don't tell anyone. Our little secret. RE: wireless , security and multimedia?
There's lots of room to grow into in both wireless and security. It will be good to see some of the concepts discussed come to the platform. Code/message signing/verification, file permissions, better use of encryption. As for wireless, at this point other there are multiple directions. Palm seems inclined to wait until cellphone chips come down to $10 and include them. But they might well in the short term, relent and include a CF slot, so that for *today* the user can choose best of breed solutions for themselves, and/or mix and match. For example the pocketPC camp can add a tri-band GSM phone to any CF slot: But in the mid-term the better solution might be the now FCC approved software definable radio. It takes more horsepower and battery (but we have lot of both currently in the platform), but one DSP array can be any wireless technology, or given sufficient resource availability, be multiple wireless flavors at the same time. Imagine now your PDA is a IS-95 or CDMA2000 phone by day with an office number, a GSM phone by night on a personal account, or when overseas on a trip. And all while offering BT and or WiFi in the background as needed. RE: wireless , security and multimedia?
I was thinking more along the lines of cellular as well. Maybe it could be a 2.4ghz mobile phone when in use around your house. I've long wanted a single device that would be programmable to accept multiple RF signals so I wouldn't have to have separate devices. When I'm working in the yard I'll sometimes have my cordless phone, baby monitor and radio. Wouldn't it be something if you could have a Palm phone be all of these at the same time? Of course I don't know squat about RF signal processing, antennas, etc. RE: wireless , security and multimedia?
Funny how in some ways we've moved back in time with the loss of the HandEra 330, and HandSpring Visor lines, when it comes to expansion. As for 2.4Ghz cordless phone around the house, there used to be just that, in fact, as a Visor springboard module from a local company. Pop it in, and voila, a cordless phone. Some of the models even gave internet data abilities to the Visor in addition. RE: wireless , security and multimedia?gfunkmagic @ 5/7/2003 11:09:32 PM #
Quote: "I can't think of anything of wireless other than 802.11 and BT.." Are you serious? How about 802.11b, 802.11g, 802.11a, other 802 stantards, BT, TDMA, GSM, GPRS, EDGE, UMTS, CDMA, CDMA2000 1xRTT, CDMA2000 1xEvDo, CDMA 2000 1xEvDv, GMRS/FRS radios, 5.8 GHz DSS, 2.4 GHz DSS, 2.4 GHz, 900 MHz DSS/digital etc, DGPS, WAAS GPS, IR, FM modulators, various RF modulators, UWB or "sneaky wave" and on and on... RE: wireless , security and multimedia?gfunkmagic @ 5/8/2003 1:28:58 AM #
Oh, I forgot to add mobitex, and Huntec's Reflex netowrks as well...
 Great News!
If PalmSource manage to pull this off well (what with the expertise from Be and all), things look bright for PalmOS devices future, I think... My wish list of features would be: - Improved support for WiFi, BT, and plug-in 3G and GPRS for devices that want to support it with seemless connection hopping RE: Great News!
I've also heard that the Palm OS 6 would have support for Landscape Mose (Currently it only has support for Portrait Mode). The new Sony UX40/50 operates in Landscape Mode (I really like that). With the New APIs that Palm is going to put out, Developers of Palm OS will be able to take advantage of the Landscape Mode. Infact I've also heard that the Tungsten T3 (The one after Tungsten T2) would possibly have support for the Landscape Mode. Some apps make more sense to view/operate in Landscape Mode.
RE: Palm OS 6
The strange thing is, the title bars of programs under both operating systems actually look quite similar :D RE: Palm OS 6
I think Palm is sad, becouse the invested money in buying BeOS. I am pretty sure about that. It's allready old. RE: Palm OS 6
"I think Palm is sad, becouse the invested money in buying BeOS. I am pretty sure about that. It's allready old." Unless, of course, technology from BeOS was used to develop OS6. Did you expect that they would just dump BeOS on a Palm device without modification or without making is compatable with the vast amount of software already written for OS 5 and earlier? Possibly, if it hadn't been for the purchase of BeOS, OS 6 might be a couple of years away? RE: Palm OS 6
I understand that, but 11million , they can produce better os by themselfs. It's handled not PC. Well I beleive if they had another chance they wpuldn't buy Be. They would invest in better marketing and better UI on PalmOS 5. And yes, UI could be better and i dont want to buy Aeroplayer, LauncherX.....ETC. RE: Palm OS 6
>>It's allready old."
'Old' is PPC legacy win32 code bloating out every PPC device their is. My 144mhz OMAP driven T|T feels snappy compared to the latest PPC.
RE: Multitasking?xtremist5150 @ 5/7/2003 3:11:25 PM #
Yes OS 6 will allow multitasking. For instance, you can have your Palm device lock up intermittently on you while you're on the phone with tech support. But don't tell anyone I told you. Shhhh, HUGE industry secret. RE: Multitasking?
Riiight. Palm OS 5 can actually selectively multitask, but OS 6 is supposed to support full multitasking, as in programs running in the background. -Bosco Proud Member of the Top Non-Mods Members: abosco and ImpReza M3 Now accepting new applications RE: Multitasking?
That thing about programs running in the background sounds to me like Pocket PC. Oh no! I just hope OS6 devices are stable. PPC, as many know, can be very unstable with lots of programs running in the background, forcing people to be aware of the need to close the programs every once in a while RE: Multitasking?
Don't think of PPC multitasking, think of EPOC/Symbian multitasking - rock solid. I've recently replaced my Psion 5 with a Tungsten|T, because the Psion was starting to fall apart. In six years of daily use I had to reset the Psion two, maybe three times. RE: Multitasking?
I still don't think they understand they could have crushed Palm and gutted Microsoft if they had only added a portrait device to their lineup instead of stubbornly sticking to the keyboarded landscape units. EPOC/Symbian is a tragic case of what might have been. (But don't feel too sorry for them; they are coming on strong with cellphones, no?)
How about Java?DessertProfessor @ 5/7/2003 3:23:07 PM #
I think Palm has been awfully quiet about progress on Java support for its platform. I had more or less expected it to be available for OS 5. Is there any word on built-in support for J2ME/PDAP in OS 6? - Rene RE: How about Java?
You can already get the J2ME for Palm OS from Sun's Java website. Also, the reason PalmSource may have been quiet about Java is because they were/are thinking about integrating M$'s Mobile .NET framework. Thomas RE: How about Java?Foo Fighter @ 5/7/2003 3:44:19 PM #
Where? I don't see anywhere to download J2ME on Sun's site. RE: How about Java?DessertProfessor @ 5/7/2003 3:50:39 PM #
Sun only has J2ME/MIDP 1.0 for Palm OS (java.sun.com/j2me, search for "Palm"). I'm more interestend in J2ME/PDAP, since it is supposed to be a tool for developing applications that are typical for PDAs. For instance, it offers easy access to the built-in calendar and address book databases. RE: How about Java?
I doubt we will see .NET framework support. You know, Microsoft does make the OS for the competition. Java support should be built in. Should have been in OS4. Should have been in OS5. If they build it in, the programs would run "faster" since they wouldn't need a interpreter (unless that what was built in). Apple did something similar for OS X. RE: How about Java?
Palm has already licensed .NET, that's no secret. And while Microsoft does make a competing PDA OS, that is nothing compared to the stakes of it has in .NET and making sure it reaches as many platforms as possible. Windows CE and Pocket PC lose money for MS, but .NET is supposed to carry them for the next few years. RE: How about Java?
Go to the palmsource java page at: http://www.palmos.com/dev/tech/java/ Moreover you get more information on this thread at brighthand: The Sun Java impelementation of MIDP for Palm is only supported on POS 3.5. It's old stuff that is not going to be updated. It may work on OS5 devices, but there will be no update for any problem it might have.
RE: How about Java?Token User @ 5/7/2003 4:30:15 PM #
> I doubt we will see .NET framework support. You > know, Microsoft does make the OS for the > competition. .NET is a misunderstood beast. On one level it is a programming framework allowing for allowing "buzzword compliance" between networked devices and applications (B2B, P2P, LAN, WAN, etc). This is .NET Gold Level partnering. Taking a step back, .NET is a communication "standard" that makes heavy use of XML/SOAP to allow networked devices to communicate. Adhereing to the communications guidelines, but not using the underlying .NET framework will get you a .NET Silver Level partnership. I'd guess that Palm fall into this camp (as do Sun Microsystems, and the company I work for). It is possible for individual apps to be .NET apps independant of the OS, so you might see these on the PalmOS BEFORE a formal integration at the OS level.
Java: no way
"Java support should be built in. Should have been in OS4. Should have been in OS5." Palm has no interest in making it easy for people to write cross-platform applications. Palm has consistently tried to create a franchise of proprietary APIs, and they still have the developer base to get away with it. If PalmSource has anything to do with it, Java isn't going to ship with Palm until Palm has absolutely no other choice. However, PalmSource now faces a dilemma: if they do a reasonable job with PalmOS 6, then porting Java and cross-platform toolkits will be easy. If they continue shipping the kind of weird architectures they have been shipping until now, they are going to lose market share and developers. RE: How about Java?
I hope we see better Java support from Palm. Java will be huge in PDAs and mobiles. The day we have JSR75 compliant PDAP in Palm is the happiest one in my life. RE: How about Java?
Well, I've sat through a few meetings in the last weeks where I've basically told our group to forget about Palm for the time being with respect to Java. I have seen no positive signs of things improving soon. For those of you waiting for PDAP, it was essentially dropped. The main APIs from it (for accessing PIM info and FileConnections, if I remember right) were kept as optional API packages. The PIM APIs will be nice if/when they ever see the light of day on a device. In the long run, I think they made the right decision, but it is also hard to not see it as a setback. Instead of dragging their feet to a J2ME CLDC MIDP 2.0 with the FileConnection and PIM APIs implementation, which is where I can only guess they are heading (since JSR-75 was for CLDC). Why don't they get Insignia to do a PersonalJava port for OS 5 (like is available for nearly every other PDA) and/or head toward J2ME CDC Personal Profile with the PIM APIs (which is where I'm assuming everyone else will head in the future)? The CLDC stuff is nice for an OS 4 device, but I fear it is going to be too little, too late for the OS 5 (or 6) devices. Microsoft and their promises.
Palm has already licensed .NET, that's no secret. And while Microsoft does make a competing PDA OS, that is nothing compared to the stakes of it has in .NET and making sure it reaches as many platforms as possible. I think that Microsoft would probably be more interested in stringing Palm along as long as possible in order to delay them from introducing a technology that competes in the same space on a platform that numerically outnumbers them in deployment. If you need an example, MS pulled it's support for Microsoft Reader from the eBookman at a VERY late stage, which has done a LOT to assist in the tanking of the platform. MS' announcement on Reader support for the eBookman: Franklin's rather terse FAQ answer to the ubiquitous 'Where is the version of Microsoft Reader for the eBookman????' RE: How about Java?
In future, when you want to post URLs, use http://www.tinyurl.com to shorten them. Long URLs distort the Comments formatting. I've emailed Ryan and he'll no doubt fix them.
Screenshots?Foo Fighter @ 5/7/2003 3:46:30 PM #
Are there any screenshots available of OS6? I'm dying to see what, if any, updates have been made to the UI. RE: Screenshots?
Whaaaat?! I looked at that and my first reaction was: SYMBIAN!! OTOH: HOLY COW!! *SOFT* Graffiti!! Make it SKINNABLE, dammit! And I can see this isn't a hoax: I see the WiFi signal strength icon from the Tung C there. RE: Screenshots?Foo Fighter @ 5/7/2003 10:55:05 PM #
Wow! That does look like Symbian, but I LOVE IT! I hope this is something along the lines of what we see in the new OS. It looks much more "modern" and robust compared to the current geriatric user interface. RE: Screenshots?
Nah, nah, nah. Things always look better on monitors than on these teeny-weeny PDA screens (well, except for maybe in the case of the hp 1910 PPC!). I'm not keen on having *two* rows of titlebars in editing an Address. Look at how inefficient that is. What a waste of space! I also think the Soft Graffiti area should allow the things I mentioned in my article. Plus, I see they now have room on both *sides* of the area -- let us cram some user-defined icons in that area too. Like maybe Cut/Copy/Paste icons. Even better: ditch the damned time of day at the bottom and put those icons *there* so you don't have to bring up the SG area or tap on an icon to bring up the Command Bar! This thing still needs lots of work. LOTS!! RE: Screenshots?Foo Fighter @ 5/7/2003 11:23:27 PM #
>This thing still needs lots of work. LOTS!! Actually, Mike, I think this is merely a concept rather than the finished product. Look at the date, and the title "Sahara Design studies". Sahara could be the codename for the UI concept..one among many. RE: Screenshots?Foo Fighter @ 5/7/2003 11:28:10 PM #
It's nice to see PalmSource is moving towards 3D UI widgets and getting away from the current 2D wireframe objects. About bloody time. RE: Screenshots?
I like the way the menu looks. If Palm OS 6 looks like this and offers an efficient way to fully multitask, I'll leap. -Bosco Proud Member of the Top Non-Mods Members: abosco and ImpReza M3 Now accepting new applications RE: Screenshots?
Did anyone else notice the 100% ~23 hours?! Heh. That would truly be a much welcome upgrade. But if only that were true. Sadly, it probably isn't... which means this is just a mock up and not an actual screenshot (not that I had to tell you guys). I just thought it would be amusing to point out. Jim RE: Screenshots?
Ryan--In your "Update" commentary, you used the phrase, "and a soft input area". Is this a euphemism for "virtual graffiti"? "640K ought to be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates (1955-), in 1981 RE: Screenshots?
Thanx Ryan :-) I guess we could start calling "Soft Input Area" an SIA which would be yet another TLA (Three-Letter Acronym)! LOL (just teasing!) "640K ought to be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates (1955-), in 1981 RE: Screenshots?
Yeah I noticed the 23hrs left too. I did hear somthing about better battery optimization a long time ago, but this could be a PC POS6 emulator. Anyway... COOOOOOOOOOOL! Look at that scrollbar! awsome! Evarything looks great! Look at the date though. Year 2002. Sounds like a prototype to me. Rest assured that will all these months since those shots, the real OS will look even better! RE: Screenshots?
Just a few more things I noted (and these are assuming the pics are real). 1. The division between screen and Graffiti are a little fuzzy. I say this looking at the picture on the right. It blends into the rest of the screen. No solid line division. Nice touch. 2. It seems as though the launcher is no longer treated as a normal application. It has no title bar, or other such markings. I wonder if 3rd party launchers will have to change. RE: Screenshots?
Heh, did anyone notice that the graphic battery meter is only 2/3 filled while it says 100% ?
The ~... hours thing is nice though. -- jws
upgrades
All I can say is that it better be compatible with current OS 5 devices, or I'll be pissed at Palm. UZI4U182@suscom.net www.BigDumbPalmReviews.tk Main PDA: Sony CLIÉ PEG-NX70v WiFi setup coming soon... RE: upgrades
>>I'm still waiting for OS 5.2 for my Tungsten T. But I really want that SD 802.11 card!
RE: upgrades
Why would you be pissed off at Palm? Its not their problem to put it out for CLIE. The group that creates the OS doesnt even release to customers! It is released to the hardware manufacturers to tailor it to their hardware THEN release it. That being said ... Sony has had a VERY poor track record of supporting their units as far as OS upgrades are concerned ... so I wouldnt hold my breath if I were you. CLIE users will most likely NOT get a 5.2 update if history repeats itself. RE: upgrades
Why would you be pissed off at Palm? Its not their problem to put it out for CLIE. The group that creates the OS doesnt even release to customers! This is exactly the problem: Palm doesn't ship a modular operating system (vendors supply drivers, developers supply applications). Instead, they just dump a bunch of code on hardware vendors and tell them "hey, you hack it till it works with your hardware". That's Palm's problem, not Sony's (other than that Sony signed up for it). RE: upgrades
First of all, when there is an OS problem, it is not Palm's problem. Its PalmSource's. Second of all, they DO NOT just give the licencees some code, and the licensees must hack it up. Licencees only change it if they need to add support for extra hardware, like a camera. RE: upgrades
>>This is exactly the problem: Palm doesn't ship a modular operating system (vendors supply drivers, developers supply applications). Instead, they just dump a bunch of code on hardware vendors and tell them "hey, you hack it till it works with your hardware". That's Palm's problem, not Sony's (other than that Sony signed up for it).
Wha? In particular since OS 5 - PalmSource has made the OS code quite modular. This has been at the request of and for the benefit of, licensees. Why you are painting a picture of 'poor sony' held hostage by PalmSiource is beyond me - its up to Sony to support the OS with their devices in whatever way they see fit. And they do - they have their own version of the app launcher for example. This is not a 'hack' - why do you use this term? Licensees have full access to the OS / built-in app source code and permission to modify it. So how is this a hack?
I was excited for OS 6 a year ago, but now...
I don't care at all unless OS 6 gives us back Graffiti. I will not ever buy a PDA that only has JOT/"Graffiti 2". RE: I was excited for OS 6 a year ago, but now...
This seems like such a petty comment, but having used the Zire now for two weeks I'm still struggling with Grafitti 2 myself (it doesn't help that three of the letters in my first name, plus T all changed). I'd gladly pay a few bucks for a seamless "grafitti 1" compatibity utility. Any developers got something like this? RE: I was excited for OS 6 a year ago, but now...
*sigh*.. people still whining bout g2... Why not go look for a 3rd party app thatll let you use g1?!?!? Tealpoint is the one I use . works great. RE: I was excited for OS 6 a year ago, but now...
Hmm....where can one get a "Graffiti 1" profile for use in Tealscript? _________________ Sean It is not very comfortable to have the gift of being amused at one's own absurdity. RE: I was excited for OS 6 a year ago, but now...
I tried Tealscript for 3 days, and with hours of tinkering, I still couldn't get it to work as well as Graffiti. RE: I was excited for OS 6 a year ago, but now...
The new OS has interchangeable input methods. BYE BYE GRAFFITI 2! RE: I was excited for OS 6 a year ago, but now...
Thank goodness! Let's hope Graffiti is one of them...
Then Graffiti 2 can die a slow, painful death :)
OS5.2??
Ok, I know that I keep harping on getting an answer as to when OS5.2 will come out. But I'm beginning to think that if OS6 is due out later this year, do you think it's safe to say that they'll turf 5.2 and make us wait till OS6?
Which then brings up another question. Do you think we'll be able to upgrade our T|T to OS6? Or are we stuck?
For what shall it profit a man if he were to gain the whole world, but lose his own soul.
Donesn't sound like there's a great deal of change
Didn't some times last year, Negal also made a statement saying OS6 will have change like how OSX was for Apple? Wireless, secruity, multimedia change sound promising, but I tend thin these are like standard approach with any platforms that has been, or is in development. RE: Donesn't sound like there's a great deal of change
Thats not all thats changing. Multitasking, new UI, ect.
I actually prefer the old stuff now...sonicxracer @ 5/7/2003 6:29:45 PM #
I used to be the type that was all over the brand new Palm stuff, and would run out and buy it right up immediately, and put my old PDA on eBay (which would normally be about a new PDA every 6 months or so) and I did this for a good few years... Now, with this new style Graffiti CRAP, and with Sony's lack of OS5 Models (I DO NOT WANT OR LIKE THE LITTLE KEYBOARDS!) I can not believe we have OS6 on the way already. Give me a new Sony model, with virtual graffiti (NORMAL kind!), OS5 or 6 or whatever, and without the bulky ugly flip around doohicky. I want a design like my T665! I am happy with it! Why must they go all crazy and put these ugly keyboards on asll the new models? This is so frutsrating to me lol... Does anyone hear what I'm saying? I'm stickin with my T665 it looks like it'll be a long while... Luckily I really like the thing. RE: I actually prefer the old stuff now...killah fury @ 5/8/2003 4:02:07 AM #
Seconded. I have a T665C as well (my 8th Palm OS device) and am not upgrading until Sony bring out a T665C form factor machine maybe with virtual grafiti and not silkscreen input area.. and also, Palm OS 5.2.1, 64mb of RAM, that new Intel processor, voice recording and all the usual gubbins. C'mon Sony! We need one of these! RE: I actually prefer the old stuff now...Marshall Flinkman @ 5/8/2003 10:45:20 AM #
Go for Garmin or Tapwave's devices... RE: I actually prefer the old stuff now...
I'm with you. My T-615 is definitely starting to feel dated. But I won't spend my money on an upgrade until the right unit comes along. I like everything about the TG series except the keyboard and lack of virtual Graffiti area. RE: I actually prefer the old stuff now...killah fury @ 5/8/2003 4:32:52 PM #
I like everything about the TG-50 too apart from the lack of virtual graffiti area, that annoying flip lid and built in keyboard.... but it needs more than 16mb of RAM really, and now that the faster Intel PXA255 400mhz processor is available - I'll have one of those too please.
320 x 480fabio@pandin.com.br @ 5/7/2003 6:40:58 PM #
When Palm will develop devices with 320x480 screens and virtual graffiti area? RE: 320 x 480
Probably for OS6 -- if MS sits on is @ss like it's been doing and doesn't improve screen resolution, then Palm's going to clean house when OS 6 hits the shelves.
Why hasn't Palm and Sony put 320 x 480 into their devices yet? Palm is simply thinks they know it all when they really don't. Sony is a mystery -- they SHOULD know it all, but have made some rather idiotic moves as of late with their zepplin NZ-90 and blimpy NX-70 models.
RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
My God! I just looked at it again -- it was published about SEVENTEEN MONTHS AGO! And NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING from that list has made it into PalmOS. Thank you, Palm, for wasting more of our time... RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
1. 4k+ memo 2. native PIM encryption/security I hope these make it in by 0S 7. RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
Oh PLUUUEEAAASE Mike. For one I doubt everything in the OS is revealed yet. It says nowhere that those things you want ARE NOT in OS6. In fACT I guarantee you some of that stuff WILL be in it, COMMON SENSE. I tell you here and now the category thing for one will be done. Save my response and see. Just because YOU want it does not make it nessesary. Palm aint browsing this sight saying, "we gotta put everything this Cain guy wants cause he is the voice of the people." Palm is on the right track despite your bellyaching. They can wait untill OS ten and you will just TALK about a switch to PPC. They are right to concern themselve with BUYING customers who are much more realistic in their expectations. The biggest things are integrated WIFI, and increased Ram which are done already. The Blackberry stuff is gonna be HUGE. OS5 ALREADY has enough to match it competition, despite its limitations. WE DONT KNOW all that OS 6 will have. That is why Mike you are so scared to actually buy a PPC. You know its true. RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
Real mature Mike. You put your views out there. This is a "discussion board" dude so expect people to counter your views. When someone disagrees with you you aught to be able to take it. If you are right, you will embarass me with logic. Thats the best you can come back with? Come back with substance. Its just that your post on this topic was WAAAAY premature and faced with the FACTS you cannot debate the matter because I am RIGHT and you know it. RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
Listen, twit. I looked up your profile and looked up other (illiterate, stupid) msgs you posted, and I treated you as the cretin you are. Now go play with yourself somewhere else. RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
Ooh. I'm crushed. Another illiterate who doesn't know the difference between "your" and "you're" -- or worse, and more likely, is a slob who doesn't care. RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
Mike, man, chill... for the sake of your articles' credibility. I know it's hard, but people like us need to bite our lip every now and then. -Bosco Proud Member of the Top Non-Mods Members: abosco and ImpReza M3 Now accepting new applications RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
Sorry, abosco, but I will not take sh*te from morons on this -- or any other -- site. Let them jerk off elsewhere. Are you sure these are BlueAnon's cousins? RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
Let them slob their knob if they want to. You stay out of it. Just chill. -Bosco Proud Member of the Top Non-Mods Members: abosco and ImpReza M3 Now accepting new applications RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6Foo Fighter @ 5/8/2003 12:17:05 AM #
Reminds me of a skit from Monty Python..."Oh, I'm sorry. This is Abuse. You want the room down the hall". RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6killah fury @ 5/8/2003 4:07:01 AM #
>> Reminds me of a skit from Monty Python..."Oh, I'm sorry. This is Abuse. You want the room down the hall".
RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
This is a stupid thread. Mike - most of yr predictions are obvious and instead of coming on hear acting like some pda guru / prophet, why don't you wait til OS 6 is actually out - we KNOW OS 6 has some of the obvious things on yr list (multi-tasking, VG). So what are you on about here with this post? Everything in yr list aside from VG, mult-tasking and better file sysetm, doesn't require a new OS - they require changes to built-in apps and can already be obtained with 3rd party apps AND may exist in the OS 6 versions of the built-in apps. So back to the point - why are you declaring that yr wish list is not met with OS 6? You have inside info? lets hear it.... RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
>>1. 4k+ memo 2. native PIM encryption/security I hope these make it in by 0S 7.
RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
>>*sigh*.. So close.. >>helf @ 4/25/2003 11:03:35 AM >>If the zire 71 didn't have a camera and instead had a CF slot it would be perfect.. hell, even if it didnt have either.. would be like the size of my m505..*sigh*.. >>Guess I'll keep dreaming... -- still pining for it ,huh? RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6ActionJackson @ 5/9/2003 4:07:42 AM #
Mike the way you go on and on about how brilliant and insightful your wish-list article is, maybe you should consider changing your name to mikevain. RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
The man gets a 10! Best comment so far (but the night is young and I am scrolling through this in order). There are things I want added to PalmOS and I'll not stop b*tching until they are in there. ALL of them. RE: Scratch the 5: make it 6
Before this thread, I had some respect for Mike Cane. Sure, I thought he was kind of bitchy after reading his posts, but now I also think he is immature, arrogant, and vain.
Mike, you probably don't care what I, a random reader thinks of you, but know that it reflects very poorly on any sort of credibility and integrity you have. I'm certain I'm not the only person who thinks so. Congratulations.
Hyper-Upgrade Cycle
"PalmSource expects to debut major OS releases every 12 months to 18 months after the first hardware ships." This is very stupid. Not even MS pumps out a new OS every 12 to 18 months, they call those "service packs." Instead of adding value to the existing userbase, some users will be forced to go out and buy a new Palm every 12-18 months for new capabilities and features that should have been built in or added into existing releases. I don't even want to think what this will do to developers. While PalmSource may think they can make some cash off of this, I predict that they're development costs will spiral out of control as more and more users refuse to upgrade every year or so. RE: Hyper-Upgrade Cycle
You forget that the devices become cheaper over that timeframe, relative to their increased power. And not everyone is going to want The Next Thing. Plenty of people are out there today buying the mono, no-backlight Zire (God help them!!). RE: Hyper-Upgrade Cycle
>" Not even MS pumps out a new OS every 12 to 18 months, they call those "service packs.""< That's only on Desktops, which is like comparing apples to oranges. If you look at MS's PocketPC, you'll see that they are in fact working on that time schedule. Remember when PPC2002 was released? And now there is talk of PPC2003 by the end of the year. It is not very comfortable to have the gift of being amused at one's own absurdity. RE: Hyper-Upgrade Cycle
No, that's the end of this MONTH. PPC 2003 is rumored to be introed in June. Everyone is awaiting the hp 2200s -- PXA255s in a 1910-form factor with *dual* slots: SDIO & CF. RE: Hyper-Upgrade CycleSaabCaptain @ 5/9/2003 9:21:20 AM #
You know what... I could care less about PalmSource's 12-18 month cycle when you have to admit OS5 is the same darn OS pretty much as OS3!!!! The ARM enhancements are nice for speed but we need a real multi-threaded OS, with support for full ARM apps, with a more modern updated GUI, and for the first time since OS1 pretty much UPDATED PIM APPLICATIONS!!!! So while you can all get hissy and complain about the quick update cycle you should be getting excited about the first REAL update of the OS in 5 years or more... OS6. owned: Pilot 5000, PalmPilot Pro, Palm V, IIIc, m505, Sony T615, TUNGSTEN T!! RE: Hyper-Upgrade Cycle
One of them is now known as the hp 2215: $399.99. Next month. Apparently in the Best Buy inventory control system already...
from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built injcalcazaren @ 5/8/2003 12:19:21 AM #
What do you think guys?! =) RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
Well, it doesn't look very "virtual" to me. It looks like it is silkscreened on the glass to me. I sure HOPE it's VG, though!! :-) "640K ought to be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates (1955-), in 1981 RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
I'd be intrigued to know how or why you think they would silkscreen the time of day or the signal strength directly on the glass. Perhaps you just didn't notice. RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
I'm pretty sure PalmSource has already announced that VG will be in upcoming versions of os 4.x and 5.x. So one would hope that it'll also be in OS 6. RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
"Silkscreened on the glass" At first, I thought your comment was dumb. Then I went back to look again -- hmmm.... why is there an UP ARROW in the upper-right corner of the G area? If this was Soft Graffiti, wouldn't that be pointing DOWN so the area would COLLAPSE? OK, so who has the best guess about why that arrow is pointing UP? And what's that icon at the LOWER right of the area?! And what happened to the Calc icon?! The emphasis on wireless is clear: the Tung C WiFi icon is there and now a mail icon too. But what's that ! do?! RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
"why that arrow is pointing UP?" Good question. Maybe to shift the virtual graffiti area to the top of the screen? "what's that icon at the LOWER right of the area" It looks like a pencil icon. Maybe to activate handwritten notes like Diddlebug maybe?? "what happened to the Calc icon?!" Probably not enough room to display the Calc icon on top. It may be just another application on the app menu RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
Oops. The calc button HAS been moved to the app menu. It's the second icon on the right screenshot. "640K ought to be enough for anybody." - Bill Gates (1955-), in 1981 RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
>>Well, it doesn't look very "virtual" to me. It looks like it is silkscreened on the glass to me. I sure HOPE it's VG, though!! :-) Oh come on! Use your brain and look at the second picture. If it was not VG, could that popup be there?
RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
>>Oh come on! Use your brain and look at the second picture. If it was not VG, could that popup be there? Magic? But seriously, you're right! DUH on me for not looking at the second picture. RE: from the pic, looks like OS6 finally has VG built in
Oh, and sorry Mike. I didn't mean to be rude about it.
OS 6 ahead of schedule!
Yes indeed. Previous announcements suggested an OS 6 release to licensees before the end of the year (that's December 31st). Wednesday afternoon, at the PalmSource conference, they said publicly that the release to licensees will be this Fall. Fall ends on December 20th. So they seem to have advanced the schedule by at least 11 days. Other items mentioned during the public presentation included the removal of the 15 category limit and many of the 64k data size limits. I think both multithreading and multiple processes were mentioned, but nothing about multiprocessor support. It also looks like OS 6 will be secure enough to allow a licensee to build models implementing full DRM, where the hardware can only be directly accessed by software that has been certified and digitally signed by the licensee. RE: OS 6 ahead of schedule!
Could but won't; they'd be crazy to give up one of the primary advantages of Palm OS, the enormous number of small 3rd party developers. They might have some little whiny warning message that you can turn off that you're running unsigned code, but that's it. RE: screenshots
Oh my! I certainly hope these aren't screenshots of OS 6. I don't like the looks of that at all. UZI4U182@suscom.net www.BigDumbPalmReviews.tk Main PDA: Sony CLIÉ PEG-NX70v WiFi setup coming soon... RE: OS 6 ahead of schedule!
Why? The screenshots don't exhibit that any fundamental change from the current look. So they've added some colors and tabs to it. Is that your problem with it? I would imagine color "themes" will become more commonplace in OS6, so you can go to a look you like more. RE: OS 6 ahead of schedule!
>>but nothing about multiprocessor support. What - no quad cpu systems ?! Thats OK - XP home edition doesn't support that either:) RE: OS 6 ahead of schedule!
>Why? The screenshots don't exhibit that any fundamental change from the current look. You're insane. Look at an OS 5 screenshot compared to those, and I dare you to tell me that there isn't any cosmetic changes. RE: OS 6 ahead of schedule!SaabCaptain @ 5/9/2003 9:26:45 AM #
The PIM applications were promised to be enhanced and they better be... 1) assign multiple categories to the same contact. RE: OS 6 ahead of schedule!
>>>Why? The screenshots don't exhibit that any fundamental change from the current look.
>>You're insane. Look at an OS 5 screenshot compared to those, and I dare you to tell me that there isn't any cosmetic changes. He did not say no cosmetic change. He said no fundamental change, and he is a little right. Still title bars, buttons, selector triggers, ect. Although, the launcher does not look like any other app anymore, because it has no title bar, and is blended into the writing area. Also, it seems tabs are added.
Is Palm OS 6 the answer against PPC
After 6+ months being a daily reader of PIC and 13+ months owning a Clie T615C, I've been noticing for quite a time now that a lot of bad comments are arising against PalmOS. Obviously most of PIC readers are power users and maybe that's why we hear so much stuff. Anyway, I'm very concerned so I decided to go to a Pocket PC site in order to watch if their power users had complaints of their OS and apparently they don't. Most probably I couldn't get a good look at "their" sites because I was there only for an hour or so but I'm still worried. After all this exciting, evolution-packed years Palm still has an advantage? Since Microsoft is catching up how much advantage do we really have? Microsoft, HP, Toshiba and PPC in general rule or do we still have technology at our side? Thanks in advance for all your comments... RE: Is Palm OS 6 the answer against PPC
>>Since Microsoft is catching up how much advantage do we really have? Its the opposite - when PPC was introduced several yrs ago, MS leap-frogged Palm in terms of technology (multitasking, faster processors, hi-res screens, mp3 etc). In the last 2 yrs Palm has caught up and passed PPC in some ways (screen res). By comparison, PPC has changed very little (PPC 2003 is basically a bug fi release). RE: Is Palm OS 6 the answer against PPC
Take a look at http://www.cewindows.net/bugs/pocketpc2002.htm and http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/archive/24531.html and also http://www.ipaqpetition.com/petition/index.htm and you will see that PPC users also have complains about their OS and hardware. If you take a broader (5 year or more) look, both CE and Palm devices have evolved a lot. And both are still very far from the "perfect" device. Daniel RE: Is Palm OS 6 the answer against PPC
once PalmOS 6 comes out and hopefully has multitasking along with the other features we've been hearing, Palm will be able to cruise past PPC. We already have 400 mhz, 64 megs and hi-res color screens on a Palm right now even without POS 6. (there's no reason why Sony couldn't do the same but with 320X480 virtual graffiti right now if they wanted to) And the office apps and netfront web browser rival what Microsoft offers with the PPC. I've followed the BeOS for many years and while the "pointy heads" didn't know what they were doing, the engineers are top notch. This is just the beginning RE: Is Palm OS 6 the answer against PPC
Hey thanks a lot for giving me hope again!!! :D
Nice links and very good overall information
New Developers Framework neededMountainLogic @ 5/8/2003 12:36:44 PM #
There is a reason you see so many four button/one field apps on PalmGear: writing real apps is hard on Palm. And Palm seems to think that thousands of trivial hobby examples is cool. Until Palm sees the light and lowers the barrier to developing professional applications Palm will not flourish like it should. RE: New Developers Framework needed
I like the direction PalmSource has been moving in and think people have been overly critical without truly looking at what PalmSource needs to / is trying to do. That said, i couldn't agree with you more. POL was nice but with OS 6 PalmSource needs to move to a true OO, class based API. Its safe to assume that they are aware of this - time will tell if they act on it.
Switching to Palm!!!
If thats what Palm OS 6 is going to look like, I'm definelety switching to palm and leaving pocket pc behind for good. I have been waiting for 320x480 support and VG or silk screen for the longest time. Looks like that time is coming. I am not particularly a fan of Grafitti, since I have been working with pocket pc which has a good hand writing recognition. But I do like CIC's Jot for Palm which comes pretty close to Transcriber. You can write naturally as you would on paper. If only Palm did this earlier, a lot more people would stay with Palm. RE: Switching to Palm!!!
POS6 has interchangeable input methods. You don't have to put up with anything you don't like anymore.
Hey Mike ol pal
Mike said: "My God! I just looked at it again -- it was published about SEVENTEEN MONTHS AGO! And NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING from that list has made it into PalmOS." Mike said to me: My response (Islander) Mike notice that those "possible" OS6 pics have your beloved VIRTUAL GRAFFITI? Isnt that on your wish list? If it is in OS6 I was right huh? Still wanna disrespect me for calling you on your premature rant? Rather than call me names, you should have just kept quiet. You dare question my intellect when I continue to toy with yours. You dare insult my previous posts when for you reading my words amounts to a "HIGHER EDUCATION." I too can looks up your previous............. Wait a minute. You cannot address THE FACT that we both have no idea what is going to be in OS6, and it is WAAAY to soon to rip it. Do the smart thing for a change huh pal. Have a good day :) RE: Hey Mike ol pal
Poor Islander! He seeks my approval sooo much, the empty-lifed, illiterate cretin. He creates an entire thread that shrieks "Look at me, Mike! Doesn't someone as insignificant as ME matter?" Well, no. The Eejit went on to drool: Schmuck! Go see a comment I posted earlier today. That is most likely NOT Soft Graffiti. Another silkscreen jobbie.
-- yes, you should have taken that advice to begin with. You still can. Go away. The Blithering Cretin then went into a full-blown psychotic episode with: -- you know that medication your stopped taking? Refill the prescription. When you have a full bottle, take it. The FULL BOTTLE. RE: Hey Mike ol pal
Alright, so a few things are cleared up, PalmSource officially implemented virtual graffiti in OS 5.2. It's not mandatory, but the API is there for the taking, and if I remember correctly, it uses the same API Sony used since that is based on the OS 5 320x320 API "elongated". Mike, you've got to chill out. Use your indoor voice! RE: Hey Mike ol pal
Well then, go to an islander and use your killah fury with your indoor voice. Too much HTML. Maybe Aww. (You know, I thought I was the only one who made material threats of violence when it comes to PDA OS's.) RE: Hey Mike ol pal
heh. Nice one. He will probably get all over you about you putting a s on the end of look ;) RE: Hey Mike ol pal
"Time *and* hair..." You talkin' smack on my not-so-straight from the hood fro?
RE: Hey Mike ol pal
Put the bat down and we'll talk. (Damn, this thread is OUT there!) RE: Hey Mike ol pal
"Someday a real rain will come and wash all this scum off the streets." -- Travis Bickle; Taxi Driver. RE: Hey Mike ol pal
Don't jinx it... ah... too late. -Bosco Proud Member of the Top Non-Mods Members: abosco and ImpReza M3 Now accepting new applications RE: Hey Mike ol pal
Mike said: "Poor Islander! He seeks my approval sooo much, the empty-lifed, illiterate cretin. He creates an entire thread that shrieks "Look at me, Mike! Doesn't someone as insignificant as ME matter?" Oh but my opinion already seems to matter since you got so bent over my first post. Musta hit a nerve, huh Mike. You on the other hand LIVE HERE, and on every other PDA board. When you get some REAL friends, and a REAL life, you wont have the time to spend all your time in your little PDA cyberworld. "Look at me" you say. But again the bottom line is I'm right RE: Hey Mike ol pal
"When you get some REAL friends, and a REAL life, you wont have the time to spend all your time in your little PDA cyberworld." You know, it really takes no time at all to post a few hundred (or in my case, a few thousand) messages, especially when you have years to do it. As long as it doesn't become an obsession, a post count really means nothing. I just recently found out someone on Extreme Overclockers Forum has over 23,000 posts, yet still maintains a family. I don't think Mike's few hundred post count over the course of a few years as being a guest editor at PIC means he has no friends. RE: Hey Mike ol pal
Ha! If only this creep Islander (who I suspect I have encountered in, if you will pardon the obscenity, person) knew how LITTLE I was actually online! He mistakes speed for time.
I was offline from 11PM Thursday until 8PM Friday. But I'm sure Islander kept checking PIC over and over and over to see if I replied. The loser. (Hey, it's Friday! Porn tape night for you, Islander!)
ugly!
is this the best the "Be" people could do? they should have a bunch of UI designers out these.. this is just... very ugly :-/ RE: ugly!
>>is this the best the "Be" people could do? Something non-developers don't understand: the look of the OS is the tiniest fraction of the work that goes into an OS. Beos are not a team of graphic designers - the 'look' will doubtless be somebody else job (constrained by the need to meet reuqirements dictated by the OS's functionality). Palm OS 7 SHOULD NOT be completely different for the sake of geeks wanting to see something 'far out'. Palm is what it is because it was the first PDA OS to make sense and have a simple interfaxce for the average user to understand. The trick is supporting advanced features, while maintaining an interface that people know and that supports backward compatibilty for old apps. I like the new look (if the screenshots are true) - much nicer and cleaner than PPC which always makes me feel claustrophobic. RE: ugly!
i didn't mean to say the Be people are only a bunch of designers. in OS5 for example, the icons are heavily Be-inspired. i keep hoping that the whole look of the OS might become "Be-inspired" because I like their style. i still like the current UI better than the ones in the screenshots.. RE: ugly!Jarrod Cifer @ 1/8/2004 12:17:47 PM #
The man with the big, pointy head spoke thus:
[i][b]Poor Islander! He seeks my approval sooo much, the empty-lifed, illiterate cretin. He creates an entire thread that shrieks "Look at me, Mike! Doesn't someone as insignificant as ME matter?"[/i][/b] Mike you lost, take it with a bit more dignity. The only person that looks like a cretin right now is you. Please remember the old Usenet rule number 1: The spelling lamer automagically loses. There are more countries on this earth than the USA, and you would do well to remember that PIC is an international forum and not every one speaks English as a first language.
RE: Icons in screenshotskillah fury @ 5/8/2003 4:40:54 PM #
don't they look pretty much the same as the OS5 icons ?
It's a FAAAAAKE!
Reasons these screenshots might be fakes or early concepts rather than anything substantial: - Aspect ratio of the screen is slightly too small for 320x480 resolution. Enough room for someone to add the Graffiti area and the tabs in the top of Address Book. RE: It's a FAAAAAKE!
>>Why hasn't the awful up and down buttons been given a makeover like the rest of the graphical controls? This is probably the most annoying aspect of the current interface, and I'd have thought it'd be high on the list of priorities to change -- good one! >>Where has the dropdown meny button gone from the virtual silkscreen? -- VERY good catch! A+. Kind of PIC reader I like! |
For multimedia, palm already got a fast CPU, good speaker, and camera on their PDAs. what else can they add?
security? So what are the security holes Palm has so far?