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Comments on: Palm Debuts New Tungsten T3, E and Zire 21 Handhelds

Palm today has launched their new fall handheld lineup. Palm has introduced two new Tungsten handhelds, the T3 and Tungsten E and a update to zire line with the new OS 5 Zire 21. Palm has also dropped prices on some of it's current models and has discontinued the m515 and m130.
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T|E and Z21 have the same proc?!

gfunkmagic @ 10/1/2003 2:04:30 AM #
Wow, that pretty interesting! Anyway, I think these model will do very well for Palm! The Z21 should be a good replacement for the Zire and the T|E will finally give Palm something to compete against the h1935 and forthcoming TJ25/35 from Sony as well the the Dell X3. However I think at $399, I would rather get the Zodiac II over the T3...

Visit http://goodthatway.com/
-better living through better technology.
RE: T|E and Z21 have the same proc?!
bcombee @ 10/1/2003 2:28:07 AM #
I'm curious about the sound capabilities of the Zire 21. While is doesn't have an output jack, it does have a speaker; is this speaker and sound system just capable of making alarm beeps, or can this actually play back digitized sounds? With 8MB, there's room for a small Ogg or MP3 file, stored as a file stream. Not too practical, but useful to know for game developers that might want to target this device.

--
Ben Combee, CodeWarrior for Palm OS technical lead
Programming help at www.palmoswerks.com
RE: T|E and Z21 have the same proc?!
hotpaw4 @ 10/1/2003 3:33:01 AM #
Interesting that the T|E and Z21 CPU's are said to run at 126 MHz, or 7/8th of the T|T's 144 MHz. Also, the OMAP 311 appears not to be listed on TI's web site; only the OMAP 310, for which there seems to be no online data sheet or technical reference. A special low-power low-cost part just for Palm Solutions?
RE: T|E and Z21 have the same proc?!
zirefan @ 10/1/2003 4:51:52 AM #
Being a Zire owner I was hoping that the Zire21 will support Mp3 playback. This will give me a good reason to upgrade!

I guess Palm just want Zire owners like me to upgrade to higher end models like the T|E. There is no upgrade path for the 99 dollars model. Too bad!

Low end and the mp3
Quik_Fix @ 10/1/2003 9:48:06 AM #
I don't think we should ever expect to see mp3 support in the lowest-end models. I say this only because there is a contingency of people out there who really want simple Palms and they may actually NOT buy a Palm because it has mp3 support. I think they're trying to keep that end of the stick real basic. Just my $.02

What i'm interested in is seeing how the Zire21 competes with the original Zire. Now that the Zire is only $79, it may just keep being the top seller!

Oh my God. They found me. I dunno how but they found me...
RUN FOR IT MARTY!

Quik_Fix
quikfix76@msn.com

RE: T|E and Z21 have the same proc?!
JKingGrim @ 10/3/2003 2:30:36 PM #
Good point. Why would a new user that knows nothing about the difference between ARM and 68k buy the Z21 over the Zire now that the Zire is only $79?

Cnet Video of new Palm Handhelds!

gfunkmagic @ 10/1/2003 3:23:14 AM #
Cnet posted a nice video overview of the TE and T3! Check it out!

http://news.com.com/1601-2-5084682.html?pref=yes

Visit http://goodthatway.com/
-better living through better technology.

RE: Cnet Video of new Palm Handhelds!
Quik_Fix @ 10/1/2003 9:57:59 AM #
Nice link. Killer video!

Oh my God. They found me. I dunno how but they found me...
RUN FOR IT MARTY!

Quik_Fix
quikfix76@msn.com

SIZE of Tungsten E

antikryst @ 10/1/2003 4:36:37 AM #
can someone post pictures of the tung E side by side with v/vx and the 505/515 form factors...im just curious

thanks

RE: SIZE of Tungsten E
gfunkmagic @ 10/1/2003 5:09:15 AM #
Here you go:

T|E vs. M500
http://www.geocities.com/noodlenet/


Visit http://goodthatway.com/
-better living through better technology.

RE: SIZE of Tungsten E
Admin @ 10/1/2003 10:51:50 AM #
Here is one, there will be more in my review:

http://www.palminfocenter.com/ss.asp?f=TE/TE_side_1_l.jpg

-Ryan

RE: SIZE of Tungsten E
LiveFaith @ 10/1/2003 12:57:02 PM #
Uggh. Awesome device at good price point. But, size is growing and screen real estate remaining the same. Seems to me that the ideal portable device would maximize the screen real estate and minimize the "waste" around it. Ergonomic considerations notwithstanding.

Pat Horne; www.churchoflivingfaith.com

Universal Connector

Dennizlerim @ 10/1/2003 5:14:19 AM #
This sucks.
Palm has told everybody how proud they were to have a platform third-party developers could ount on, and now they bring out a Tungsten without the Universal Connector.
This is just like Sony has done it...... I really had hoped that Palm would not got the same way

RE: Universal Connector
gfunkmagic @ 10/1/2003 5:24:04 AM #
Well I think you're being to harsh here. I think the point Palm is trying to make is that if you want to use PUC peripheral, you're going to have to spend a little bit more. Palm is trying to get all the old V/Vx and M Series users to upgrde to the T2 or T3 not the T|E. Also, if you recall the M515 when initially released was priced at ~ $399 USD, so it is pretty disingenuous to expect an upgrade at a lower price than what M Series owners previously paid for their devices! The T|E is meant for all the new Zire owner etc. Anyway, Palm did release the new IR keyboard for users...

Visit http://goodthatway.com/
-better living through better technology.
RE: Universal Connector
Dennizlerim @ 10/1/2003 5:36:52 AM #
Sure, it's a great price, no doubt of that.
But IMHO telling everybody that the Tungsten series is the business solution for them doesn't shine through here.
How can it be that they take away one of their most proudly presented innovations on their Tungsten line?
With the UC, it would have been a killer device.
Now we have to hope that people don't care much about a docking station, a nice keyboard(not the one with extra batteries), the extra battery pack and all the other nice things that one can buy out there

RE: Universal Connector
nipaworni @ 10/1/2003 12:28:51 PM #
I like the idea to move to mini-USB. I used to ask myself why don't all PDA have USB slot so that when I want to print something I don't need to transfer to PC. I can connect printer with PDA and then print. Or I can use my PDA to access files in external HDD via USB. So mini-USB may be the answer since it is more standard than Palm Univeral Connector. I wish in the future all USB peripheral will have USB to mini-USB adapter come with it (the same as mouse has USB and serial adapter).

RE: Universal Connector
skennedy1217 @ 10/1/2003 3:32:25 PM #
Another benefit of the lack of UC on the T|E is portability. No longer do you have to go buy a separate travel charging cable or take your clunky cradle with you. With the T|E you just grab the cord it came with and go.

Scott

RE: Universal Connector
DougG @ 10/1/2003 11:40:39 PM #
I keep hearing people whine about the UC, but really how many people use attachments to their Palms....
Seriously.....When at work or out on the town, have you seen people in large numbers whip out a key board for their Palm or other Palm attachments. I would say not often.

You guys need to realize Palms are maybe sold to 10% computer geeks. And 90 % to people who want color screens, great organizing software, IR capabilities, and hardware that can be accidently dropped 4 or 5 times a year.

So you 10% of Palm buyers chill-out about the UC jive.

P.S. Where is the cellphone....as part of the new Tungstens. :-) That is true functionality for the masses. he heh ha

RE: Universal Connector
tthiel @ 10/2/2003 6:15:58 PM #
No UC is a bull**** move on Palms part. Big mistake.

RE: Universal Connector
henryp @ 10/5/2003 12:44:33 PM #
No U/C means no cradle. My current handheld spends a good part of my work day in its cradle on my desk. I love having a cradle.

-- -
Henry
RE: Universal Connector
joejoe @ 10/5/2003 1:06:04 PM #
Not just no cradle which comes with but no cradle ever, period. This is not a small oversight on Palm's part.

Yes, maybe Palm does want everyone to upgrade to the T|2 or T|3 but that supposes that people will be willing to sacrifice battery life & pay for features they may neither want nor need.

At least the upcoming TJ25 & TJ35, although they don't come with cradles, will offer the opportunity of adding these rather basic accessories for about $30.

IMO, the T|E delivers more for less money but its Achilles heel may turn out to be this "avoidable" omission.

RE: Universal Connector
Griffman @ 3/14/2004 5:11:00 PM #
Everyone that is complaning about teh UC really should stop and look back at when there was a diffrent Connecter for Each Serise...I"ve owned palms sence 1996

a Palm Pro, Palm III, Palm Vx, Palm M100, Palm M105, M130, and now a Palm T|T3

I've bought 3 Diffrent Keyboards...now I have to get a new one, I bought a Camra...now I have to get a new one...I have other devices too, but those I think are the ones that are kinda popular with us Freaks...and we are freaks by the way...Palm is now starting to move away from a "Universal Connector" to and accuall Universal Connector...USB will evenchually end up on all the Palms, give it time, and then when the next thing come out we'll all be here...complaning again...I mean I had my complants too, but I mean really who cares...its cheaper for them to make it this way, it will be cheaper for you to buy them, they are coming out with this that won't use the damn port anyway so you can use it on modles yet to come, so why complane...shell out another 100 bucks on a new keyboard like I know I will and shut your yapper. We're freaks...but we have a sence of pride about this...I just admited that I"ve owned 7 types of palms...I didn't menchon that some of those I had to reaplace...I'm on my 9th palm...a palm a Year I average...you have to figure I've spent a 1000 on hardware alone, then about 500 on Perifels...and I'm Proud of that...so what...they changing, change with them...thats all I have to say about that.

Tungsten E case - plastic or metal?

Helek @ 10/1/2003 7:56:07 AM #
Some uncertanity about material T|E's case is made of

Infosync writes in review "the TE comes in a slick metal casing".
BargainPDA writes about "silver plastic"

Can somebody make this clear?

http://www.infosyncworld.com/reviews/n/4130.html

http://www.bargainpda.com/default.asp?newsID=1651&showComments=true

RE: Tungsten E case - plastic or metal?
Admin @ 10/1/2003 10:47:31 AM #
I'm holding it now, it's definitely some sort of plastic. I will find out exactly what for my review.

-Ryan

RE: Tungsten E case - plastic or metal?
Helek @ 10/2/2003 3:28:25 AM #
Ryan, what is estimated time for this review?
One more thing, will there be a review of Palm's IR keyboard? That would be great to have some info about this thing
RE: Tungsten E case - plastic or metal?
The Ugly Truth @ 10/2/2003 3:44:23 AM #
Some uncertanity about material T|E's case is made of

Solid gold.

Palm will lose money on each one of these they sell.


Sometimes the truth just isn't pretty™

automobile maintenance app?

ganoe @ 10/1/2003 10:37:11 AM #
So what's the auto maintenance app that comes with the new Zire? Is it new or a licensed 3rd party app?

updated core PIM applications

feranick @ 10/1/2003 10:43:07 AM #
What does exactly mean: "updated core PIM applications"?
Nicola
RE: updated core PIM applications
Quik_Fix @ 10/1/2003 10:45:04 AM #
They've added additional fields to the PIM core apps for better syncs with Outlook and overall usage. Word has it that they may have removed the 4k limit on memos and notes too... Isn't that it the article above? I forget.

Oh my God. They found me. I dunno how but they found me...
RUN FOR IT MARTY!

Quik_Fix
quikfix76@msn.com

RE: updated core PIM applications
Admin @ 10/1/2003 10:58:35 AM #
You can read my Tungsten T3 review to learn more about the updated PIM apps:
http://www.palminfocenter.com/view_story.asp?ID=6073
RE: updated core PIM applications
JKingGrim @ 10/1/2003 7:37:57 PM #
I saw a screenshot of a TT3 running datebook. It has a today page!

RE: updated core PIM applications
rojo @ 10/1/2003 8:22:43 PM #
The T|E has the today page as well. They call the Agenda view. It is the default view for the calendar which can be changed to day, week or month if you don't like hte Agenda view.

T|E 5-way navigator

Galley_SimRacer @ 10/1/2003 11:33:40 AM #
I played with a T|E at Office Depot, and it seems that the 5-way navigator really is as bad as people say it is. That one was hard to go both up and down. I went to CC and the dude opened up a T|E since they didn't have one on display yet. That one would go up OK,but the down button was hard to press. I decided to buy a T|E, and mine seems to go down OK, but not up! Palm really screwed up by not either putting the 5-way navigator that the T|T uses or the way-cool joystick that the Zire 71 uses. :-(

--
"Life is what you experience between racing games"
Galley

Imagine a TE with VG and UC!

Gekko @ 10/1/2003 1:15:51 PM #
Thoughts?

RE: Imagine a TE with VG and UC!
ganoe @ 10/1/2003 4:26:30 PM #
I'd probably rather have a Tungsten E with Bluetooth.
RE: Imagine a TE with VG and UC!
Wollombi @ 10/1/2003 5:08:34 PM #
I'd buy it. All I could possibly want then would be a 2nd SDIO slot, but it's not a necessity for me.

I'm thinking that if PalmOne did put VG and a UC on the T|E, then T3 sales would suffer badly, and so they decided to go the mini-USB route with a 320x320 screen.

Just my $0.02.

_________________
Sean

"They're smoking crack."
-Linus Torvalds on SCO group's copyright claims against Linux-

RE: Imagine a TE with VG and UC!
hotpaw4 @ 10/1/2003 5:30:23 PM #
A T|E with VG/hires+ would be bigger, have too slow a processor to update that big a display crisply, too little memory for webpro 3, no wireless, no microphone, smaller buttons, a battery life almost as bad as the T3, and cost a more. Might as well buy a T|T3.
RE: Imagine a TE with VG and UC!
Gekko @ 10/1/2003 5:52:12 PM #
the point was a T3 with NO slider.

RE: Imagine a TE with VG and UC!
adamrichman @ 10/5/2003 2:58:31 PM #
Yea, T3 with no slider would kick ass. I actually thought about trading my TT for a TE just because of the no-slide. No-slide with VG, UC, etc. etc. would sell tremendously, I honestly don't know why PalmOne is so stupid... Get rid of the stupid thing! I liked it at the beginning, but looking back, a VG with no slider is what I want! Ugh.. maybe it's time for a Sony...

To those wanting a Tł that doesn't slide:
The Ugly Truth @ 10/5/2003 3:26:12 PM #
You can make a No-slide Tł with this new Palm accessory:

http://www.walgreens.com/store/product.jhtml?PRODID=16883&CATID=100434


www.rubegoldberg outlines what you need to do in order to convert a stupid, idiotic Tł into a perfect shiny new No-slide Tł.


Sometimes the truth just isn't pretty™

Additional software and non-Windows users.

malus42 @ 10/1/2003 2:20:28 PM #
How much of the software that ships with the Tungsten E can be installed without using a Microsoft Windows box?

I'm a Unix user who hasn't used Windows since Windows 95 (and am d*mn proud of it). I have software to hotsync from my Unix box and copy files to and from memory card via a card reader. But I don't have Windows.

So how much of the bundled palm software am I going to be able to use? Do they make separate .prc and .pdb files available or is everything in a Windows exe?

Thanks for any information.

No Zire SD

Kesh @ 10/1/2003 5:15:55 PM #
Damn. No SD slot in the Zire. Looks like my next PDA is going to be a refurb Sony Clie SJ10 or SJ20, since I can get those for about $100 and I already have a 128Mb Memory Stick.

I just want a PDA for ebooks and scheduling at the moment. Though that T|E is pretty sweet. :)

BT

ander80 @ 10/2/2003 8:53:47 AM #
is Tungsten E bluetooth compatible? is there any BT expansion card or not yet available, like Zire 71?

good pda from a dynamic student point of view (or thats what i think)



Ander Zabala, MSc Student

T/E cannot charge with USB?

mapaman @ 10/2/2003 11:14:55 AM #
According to this article
http://www.apcmag.com/apc/v3.nsf/0/D7962EF151FCC12BCA256DB2001F99EA
the T/E's USB cable cannot be used to charge it?

Please confirm in your review!!

RE: T/E cannot charge with USB?
Enzo @ 10/2/2003 11:27:39 AM #
I have no factual basis, but if it is anything like the mini usb cable for the zire, it will maintain a slow charge, but nothing in comparison to the three hours it takes to charge with the seperate ac adapter


--
hows my spellign todai?

···

RE: T/E cannot charge with USB?
rojo @ 10/2/2003 12:26:39 PM #
The USB cable can be used to charge it, but it is a slow tricle charge. I've been doing it all week and was a nice suprise to know it can be done. In fact I was confused the first day I had the T|E, because it was about 75% charged and when I left work, it was fully charged. It took a few hours for that 25% top off.

RE: T/E cannot charge with USB?
MintPower @ 5/17/2005 8:06:50 AM #
I can confirm my Tungsten E does not charge with my USB cable and I am very upset about it. I can use the same cable which also fits my Creative Muvo Slim 256 to charge it. The cables are identical in all respects. I was that paranoid I bought an official Palm car charger which came with a USB connector which goes into a cigarette socket and that didnt work either. I am so frustrated cos on the move, the battery will go flat.
The only effective way to charge it was via the plug pack.

RE: T/E cannot charge with USB?
manekr00 @ 5/21/2005 9:16:59 PM #
Dear Mr.MintPower
I recently bought T/E on eBay. I have the same problem. In your reply you say that
>>The only effective way to charge it was via the plug pack.
What is plug pack?

Thank you.

Rao

RE: T/E CAN and DOES charge with USB
svrontis @ 5/22/2005 2:36:08 AM #
Of course it charges through the USB cable.

I can't think how many times my TE has given me a 'low power', at which point, I plug it into the USB port on my laptop and about an hour later I have about a 1/3 to 1/2 of a full charge.

NB - because it recharges so slowly through the USB cable, the 'battery charging' indicator in the launcher is not activated. However, if you load Filez and use it to check the % charge, you will see that it gradually rises over time.

RE: T/E cannot charge with USB?
manekr00 @ 5/27/2005 11:57:11 AM #
well! mine doesn't. It used to charge slowly but one fine day it decided not to charge at all. I hooked up my T/E to USB cable for whole day. It did not charge. 2 days .. it did not charge. Just to check the USB port is working or not, I hooked up my digital camera to download picture to my desktop, it works. So USB port of my desktop is working. I reconnected my T/E through USB cable to USB port of my computer. I left it like that since I sent my previous mail on 5/21 till now. I try to turn T/E's power on - it doesn't turn on!

-rao

Does Tungsten E play mp3's?

jbeedham @ 10/2/2003 5:25:06 PM #
Does Tungsten E play mp3's?

-------------------------------------------------------
currently using Palm m125 and waiting for Garmin iQue.
RE: Does Tungsten E play mp3's?
JKingGrim @ 10/3/2003 2:34:47 PM #
Yes.

No backlight for the Z21? Zuh?

Strider_mt2k @ 10/2/2003 5:20:31 PM #
I'm sure to draw the ire of many a rabid Zire lover, but what's with the no backlight?

The White Elephant is evolving into what could be considered a useful PDA, but people move in dark places too!
Does that mean that they don't get access to their data? I guess so!

Maybe they could give away a free flashlight with the Z71 so you could use it in the dark?
Palm could include a little thing so you could hang it on that ultra-hip messenger bag they're offering, and folks could be Zired up real purdy like.



RE: No backlight for the Z21? Zuh?
ganoe @ 10/2/2003 7:58:29 PM #
> Maybe they could give away a free flashlight
> with the Z71 so you could use it in the dark?

How about they just sell you an illuminated stylus instead.

http://www.palmone.com/us/products/accessories/styli/P10956U.html

RE: No backlight for the Z21? Zuh?
Strider_mt2k @ 10/3/2003 6:35:31 AM #
That certainly is a sloution.

RE: No backlight for the Z21? Zuh?
bringer @ 10/3/2003 3:21:56 PM #
As long as any PDA has no backlight, it's a doorstop as far as I'm concerned. I would absolutely NEVER promote this to somebody who is looking at their first PDA purchase.
I say spend a little extra money and get the TE.
I mean, how much would it have cost them to put in a backlight??

T|E and win95

cperers @ 10/3/2003 4:05:14 AM #
I'm new to the Palm-world and have a question regarding Tungsten E and win95.
I know that USB is not supported in win95 but is it possible to sync T|E with a PC running win95 using a serial? How about the desktop software? Are there any versions available for win95 and is that version compatible with the T|E?
RE: T|E and win95
Dmitri_J @ 10/3/2003 6:41:53 AM #
I think that T|E isn't compatible with COM port.

I wish you good hangover.
RE: T|E and win95
cperers @ 10/3/2003 12:34:06 PM #
I've heard of ways to activate the USB on PCs running win95 (USBSUPP.exe and USBUPD2.exe). You think that might work? Also, there is a Palm Desktop software 4.1 for win95. I'll give it a try tonight and report back after the WE.
RE: T|E and win95
ganoe @ 10/4/2003 5:08:45 PM #
You could possibly use IR.
Sync T|E via IR?
Marshall Flinkman @ 10/4/2003 10:24:20 PM #
I thought it took one sync, plugged in, first to set up IR... or if you sync with a USB capable computer, can you then just sync via IR with another machine?

RE: T|E and win95
ganoe @ 10/5/2003 4:38:20 PM #
I can't imagine why you couldn't just use IR from the start. The desktop installer probably encourages you to sync with the cable/cradle when you first install, but I doubt it's necessary.
RE: T|E and win95
Gekko @ 10/5/2003 10:38:11 PM #
USB and IR is virtually IMPOSSIBLE to use on Win95. There are some workarounds, but they are buggy and conditional at best. Buy a TT1/2/3 and a serial cradle.

RE: T|E and win95
ganoe @ 10/6/2003 7:59:08 AM #
I'd probably recommend spending any extra money on an upgrade to Windows 98 and then just use USB. You can probably buy a copy for about the same price you'd pay for the non-existant serial cradle/cable. Windows 98 is much, much better supported than Windows 95.

Extended Systems has IrDA drivers for Windows 95. They are not buggy, and it's certainly not impossible (not free though either).

RE: T|E and win95
JohnKes @ 10/6/2003 11:51:38 AM #
Win98SE would be a great, cheap upgrade to Win95 (if you can find it). Don't get WinME - it freezes all the time! WinXP is nice, but expensive.

Tungsten E review?

songdog @ 11/3/2003 9:59:23 AM #
OK guys, it's been a month since you posted "A full hands on PIC review [of the Tungsten E] will follow shortly." Are you still planning on doing this?
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