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Comments on: palmOne Releases Tungsten T3 Update

palmOne support has released a new software update for the Tungsten T3 handheld. The update addreses the previously mentioned SD card problems and audio interrupt bug.
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Does this update actually work?

Hippocrates @ 11/7/2003 1:51:59 AM #
there were some situations in which data transfers to SD Cards could fail.

Lawyerspeak?

A few burning questions:
- Does this fix all of the previously reported problems?
- What is Palm's official explanation for what happened?
- When will fixed T3s be sent to retailers?
- What is being done to compensate people who had SD cards charcoaled by their T3?
- Will there be any hardware changes in the fixed T3s?

Ska

RE: Does this update actually work?
PalmAddict @ 11/7/2003 2:26:09 AM #
No. It only fixes what is mentioned. You still need to use the AppSlipRotate and StatusBarLib patches to allow some of the applications written to the PalmSource VG standard to work. Couldn't they have integrated that in too? Wouldn't have been that tough.

-

"If it weren't for electricity we'd all be watching television by candlelight." - George Gobol.

RE: Does this update actually work?
Jax_fr @ 11/7/2003 5:34:11 AM #
PalmAddict, please check before posting wrong.
This patch actually contains AppSlipRotate and StatusBarLib.

RE: Does this update actually work?
IanJD @ 11/7/2003 5:55:12 AM #
Yes, the update does contain those two files, as did the original ROM image; however they are still the old (14/Aug/03) versions of the files, so you will still need the updated (5/Oct/03) versions in RAM.

RE: Does this update actually work?
Mister Groove @ 11/7/2003 10:22:05 AM #
Thanks for clearing that up IanJD! Where do you find the latter update?

RE: Does this update actually work?
IanJD @ 11/7/2003 11:18:56 AM #
RE: Does this update actually work?
shrike4242 @ 11/7/2003 4:45:16 PM #
So, are the updated AppSlipRotate and StatusBarLib installed with the new update, or will those files still need to be added to RAM to replace the ROM versions?

---- Jeff

RE: Does this update actually work?
Hippocrates @ 11/8/2003 11:04:11 AM #
Looks like Palm's customers will get screwed again. Palm is being very clever about not accepting any responsibility for this whole debacle.

Has anyone yet got Palm to reimburse them for their barbecued SD cards? ANYONE? The "Go ask SanDisk" line Palm's been giving out may be good enough for the obedient sheep here that still worship people like the late Carl "Shiftchanger" Yankowski, Eric "Two-Face" Benhamou, David "Lefty" Nagel, and Todd "Tommy-Gun" Bradley. More intelligent people will be avoiding Palm pruducts until quality control issues are finally addressed by Palm.

Rushing crap out to be sold to unsuspecting customers and using these victims as virtual beta testers should not be an acceptable business practice. Something's rotten in the state of Milpitas.

RE: Does this update actually work?
mikecane @ 11/8/2003 4:26:42 PM #
>>>Rushing crap out to be sold to unsuspecting customers and using these victims as virtual beta testers should not be an acceptable business practice.

This coming from a troll who for months under a variety of IDs has been bashing Palm in favor of PPC. Give us a break. That Everex Palm-Size PC I bought on ebay two months ago for $15 is still way overpriced.

RE: Does this update actually work?
MichaelSD @ 11/9/2003 8:53:33 AM #
Hippocartes, what don't you spare your useless comments? If you like PPC, fine. But this is a Palm forum (I know it is an incredible relevation), and no one is interested in your Palm bashing.

Thank you for your kind understanding.

RE: Does this update actually work?
Hippocrates @ 11/9/2003 2:53:10 PM #
Hippocartes, what don't you spare your useless comments?If you like PPC, fine. But this is a Palm forum (I know it is an incredible relevation), and no one is interested in your Palm bashing.

Thank you for your kind understanding.

Me no bash Palm. Me reporter tell what Palm do.

Thank you for your kind understanding.


Wi-Fi SD card for Palm in December! Bluetooth soon to come?
Hippocrates @ 11/9/2003 6:27:38 PM #
http://www.infosyncworld.com/news/n/4266.html

Is this for real or more vaporware? This would make the T3 a lot more useful. And that new Tapwave device (with dual SD slots and a great screen) could be a mini-laptop for the Starbucks generation.

Wonder if Bluetooth will soon follow?

$400 Tapwave with 128 MB RAM, $150 Wi-Fi card + $99 Bluetooth card = finally competition for the CLIE UX series.

RE: Wi-Fi SD card for Palm - never? Bluetooth SD - never?
Hippocrates @ 11/11/2003 5:02:06 AM #
It soon won't matter - these will be obsolete by next summer. The future is built-in dual wireless (like the CLIE UX-50) Once again, Palm's SDIO falls flat on its face.

Conspiracy theorists will ask if Microsoft is calling the shots in driver development. Maybe...
The wolves are circling.

RE: Does this update actually work?
Munan @ 11/11/2003 12:30:43 PM #
Actually, Hippocrates makes a valid point.
I had been a loyal Palm user for five years before I got my first T3. I've since gone through three others and now have an iPaq myself.
I'm not going to bash Palm, because I think their other hardware is fine.
I honestly wish my Tungsten T hadn't failed requiring a replacement anyway. That little machine is sorely missed, but after four T3s in less than a month, I simply had to draw the line.
I just feel dirty that I had to cross to the dark side, but so far, I am actually pleased with my decision.
Obviously, not EVERY T3 is fraught with problems, as evidenced by those owners who think the complainers are nuts, but I can assure you that the good units appear to be the minority, at least in Seattle.

I use a T3. Why isn't it listed??

Finally, I can buy a T3!

Mr T @ 11/7/2003 2:16:28 AM #
Took you long enough, PalmOne. I hope this fixes the issue once and for all
RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
GearHead @ 11/7/2003 3:13:41 AM #
I would wait a little longer. What if PalmOne release a wi-fi + bluetooth built-in Tungsten T4.

I don'tkow if HP can make it in such small form factor at h4155 why can't PalOne make it. Like I said rather wait instead of feeling sorry around Christmas time.

Good Luck!

Free 802.11 No More Wires!!!
Support your local WAN!

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
mikecane @ 11/7/2003 11:20:11 AM #
>>>I would wait a little longer. What if PalmOne release a wi-fi + bluetooth built-in Tungsten T4.

Oh you bloody bugger! How did you know I'd rather have *this* over the current T3? I'm getting very jealous of the current iPaq 41xx owners with their WiFi built-into that teensy-weensy (that's a technical term!) form factor!!

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
Sleuth255 @ 11/7/2003 12:12:55 PM #
get a T3, the WiFi SDIO and a battery sled. You'll need one anyway when you try WiFi on a handheld. Or... wait for the T4 which may have dual SD slots...

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
Foo Fighter @ 11/7/2003 12:43:24 PM #
Quote: get a T3, the WiFi SDIO and a battery sled.

That's an awfully damn expensive solution, don't you think?

-------------------------------
My blog: www.pocketfactory.com

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
Altema @ 11/7/2003 1:58:06 PM #
Battery sled (Power To Go) is $53 online, and I don't know how much the SD wi-fi is going for, but it does stack up to be a pretty expensive soution... at least $600 when you add everything up. It would be more convient to go with a device with wi-fi built in, unless the wi-fi is just for ocassional use. At least the battery sled would give you more runtime than the extended battery for the new Toshiba. Just be aware that the T3 flip cover needs to be removed to attach and use the sled, and it act more like a portable charger than an extended battery. You Still, being able to go 30 days of normal use without AC is a kick. That is without wi-fi and based on the standard "30 minutes per day" use: if you want wireless on all that time then you can knock those times in half.

The easiest way to use the Power To Go in that situation (constant use) is to start with the Palm and sled charged, use the Palm until it gets low (5 or 6 hours runtime) then clip the sled on and keep going. When the sled gets low, the Palm will be on its own again, but will have a full charge. I've not had mine long enough for a torture test burn down yet, but I get two full charges out of the sled, on top of the total runtime from the Palm's initial charge. One charge lasts me between 5 and 6.5 hours, so you just multiply that times 3...

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
Altema @ 11/7/2003 2:20:19 PM #
Excuse all they typos, some words must have been hiding in the little box :(

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
mikecane @ 11/7/2003 4:07:00 PM #
>>>That's an awfully damn expensive solution, don't you think?


To say nothing of the bloody huge size!! It'd make it like a Classic iPaq with sleeve!

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
Altema @ 11/7/2003 4:15:41 PM #
"It'd make it like a Classic iPaq with sleeve!"

Depends on which sleeve, one card or two. The two card sleeve is gigantic... making the iPaq almost as thick as it is wide. The one card sleeve, while a lot thinner, is still thicker than the Power To Go, which adds about a quarter inch to the back and about a half inch to the bottom. It is narrower than the T series and actually looks nice compared to the iPaq sleeve or the Toshiba (not so) extended battery, but you WILL feel the difference in your pocket!

You may be better off with the T|C or a PPC in terms of looks and convienence for heavy wi-fi use.

Be forewarned though if you plan on using the PPC for site surveys and plugging the data into Pocket Excel; long cell entries may not be useful because there is no way to show the entire cell contents if it exceeds the screen width. I know from experience.

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
Tuckermaclain @ 11/7/2003 8:01:53 PM #
Anybody know if a T3 ordered today will have the fix?

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
mikecane @ 11/8/2003 4:28:44 PM #
>>>You may be better off with the T|C or a PPC in terms of looks and convienence for heavy wi-fi use.

Bite your tongue! I have eyes only for the T3 (although a WiFied T4 is something I'd easily cheat with!).

RE: I STILL can't buy a T3!
Hippocrates @ 11/8/2003 5:53:12 PM #
Mr T @ 11/7/2003 2:16:28 AM

Took you long enough, PalmOne. I hope this fixes the issue once and for all

"I pity the fool that buys a T3! I pity you! Fool!"

- The REAL Mr. T, Palm afficionado. November 8, 2003.

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
Mr T @ 11/9/2003 1:03:26 AM #
"I pity the fool that buys a T3! I pity you! Fool!"

- The REAL Mr. T, Palm afficionado. November 8, 2003.

Hey Hippo, are you trying to be funny?

Get a life!

RE: Finally, I can buy a T3!
EthiopianFlash @ 11/9/2003 10:36:35 AM #
Has any one tried this wireless solution? ould add WiFi, battery and a case for 169.00.

http://www.enfora.com

SJ30 > T|T3

translation...

jss1432 @ 11/7/2003 2:26:55 AM #
The translation of this seems to be "We don't really know what caused the problem, or if we do, we aren't going to admit that we screwed up and have to reimburse you for the SD cards. We're putting out this fix without knowing whether it really works to have you field-test it; if it doesn't work, we'll try again."

As a T3 owner, I was hoping for a more clear-cut explanation of what was wrong and a more definitive statement that it was fixed now. My recommendation to prospective T3 buyers: wait until Palm does something more definitive, or just buy a Sony instead.

RE: translation...
Palm4u @ 11/7/2003 10:11:27 AM #
Although I do not have the T3, so fortunately no wasted SD cards.

I agree with you totally. From a user point of view, users have been using the SD card in the T3 as normal usage, and the T3 obviously rendered it unusable.

Palm1 should be held responsible for frying these SD cards and replace all of them.

================================
PDAs rule the world !

RE: translation...
alee @ 11/7/2003 12:40:52 PM #
a. Palm has addressed the issue. Whether you choose to believe it works or not is up to you. Their responsibility to the customer is to address the problem. I would assume the technical details behind the patch are confidential -- as they are with all other software patches I've seen from other software vendors.

b. From the posts I have read, Sandisk and the like are replacing dead SD cards with no fight or problems -- only a slow turnaround time. For all we know, they have a prior arrangement with Palm on how to address this.

RE: translation...
Munan @ 11/7/2003 4:26:04 PM #
"b. From the posts I have read, Sandisk and the like are replacing dead SD cards with no fight or problems -- only a slow turnaround time. For all we know, they have a prior arrangement with Palm on how to address this."

Care to explain how or where?
I contacted SanDisk directly and their attitude was "thanks for buying two cards. sucks they don't work now."
If there is a procedure for getting them replaced, I'd love to know what it is.

I use a T3. Why isn't it listed??

RE: translation...
jss1432 @ 11/7/2003 5:05:39 PM #
a. Palm has addressed the issue. Whether you choose to believe it works or not is up to you.

Right. And all I'm saying is that other people should choose not to believe it either.

I would assume the technical details behind the patch are confidential -- as they are with all other software patches I've seen from other software vendors.

Yes, we both agree that the patch is "confidential". But why is it? There isn't some rule that says "patches need to be confidential". There isn't any important intellectual property in whatever they fixed. The patch is confidential because either (1) the bug is embarrassing, or (2) the bug exposes them to liability, or (3) they don't know whether the patch fixes the bug. Which is what I was saying. If they didn't have something to hide, they could give technical details. And, yes, lots of other companies do give lots of technical details on their patches.

RE: translation...
JKingGrim @ 11/8/2003 9:39:16 AM #
The translation of this seems to be "We don't really know what caused the problem, or if we do, we aren't going to admit that we screwed up and have to reimburse you for the SD cards. We're putting out this fix without knowing whether it really works to have you field-test it; if it doesn't work, we'll try again."


Hmm, you don't seem to be too inteligent. If they don't really know what caused, the problem, how can they fix it? And why do you think it doesn't really work? Have you tried it? And why would they not test it? You are a very odd person.


As a T3 owner, I was hoping for a more clear-cut explanation of what was wrong and a more definitive statement that it was fixed now. My recommendation to prospective T3 buyers: wait until Palm does something more definitive, or just buy a Sony instead.


If Palm gave you a clear cut explanation of the problem, chances are, uless you are a programmer, you would not understand a bit. Stop being naive or go somewhere else.


RE: translation...
Boogaboo @ 11/8/2003 4:25:46 PM #
Actually, jkinggrim, the previous poster had a good point. When you have a flat tire on your car, you can easily fix it or replace the tire, but neither solution would help you if the problem is due to your driveway being littered with nails. The real solution is to identify the nails as the problem, clean the driveway, and then fix or replace your tire.

The other poster's point is just that. If these issues with the SD cards is actually a more insidious OS problem or hardware problem, then the patch does not really address the issue completely. We know that the problem was, but what caused it to develop in the first place?

Also, I find it rude that you called jss1432 "odd" and "not intelligent." Who are you to speak to someone that way? Mutual respect is how civilized people interact.

boogaboo

RE: translation...
Garfie1d @ 11/10/2003 7:05:24 AM #
The fact that Sandisk are now replacing corrupt cards says a lot (in my mind). If the problem had been entirely with the T3, would Sandisk be replacing their cards? Wouldn't they be telling us to take it up with Palm?

I get the impression that, although Palm did have a slight problem, it shouldn't have corrupted any cards and perhaps these cards did not meet their required tolerable level to avoid them burning up. In other words, Palm's problem may have caused cards to become corrupt, but perhaps those cards that were completely destroyed simply were not up to standard.

RE: translation...
Boogaboo @ 11/10/2003 7:16:47 AM #
Garfield,

I have been looking for a new POS device, and of course my interest in the T3 was lessend by reports of these issues. I am wondering, have you seen (or do you know of) any official statements by either Sandisk or palmOne concerning who will replace the card? Also, are there any figures showing which cards had more problems with the T3?

Boogaboo

RE: translation...
mj6798 @ 11/10/2003 9:09:15 AM #
Hmm, you don't seem to be too inteligent.

I'm a programmer. I know software.

If they don't really know what caused, the problem, how can they fix it?

They may not have fixed it, which is my point. They may have identified the general area in which the problem occurs, adjusted some timings, and perhaps reduced the problem.

And why do you think it doesn't really work?

Because Palm hasn't us given us any evidence that they (1) understand the problem and (2) have tested their fix enough to make sure that it is actually fixing the problem.

Have you tried it?

No. My T3 has developed other hardware problems as well and I can't try anything with it.

And why would they not test it?

Well, whatever testing procedures they are using, the first bug slipped through, right? These are intermittent problems that probably involve subtle timing and hardware issues. They simply may not have the resources to test it enough to make sure the problem is gone. Hence, my suggestion that they may be throwing out a fix and then waiting for more reports from the field.

It's the way this industry works. Microsoft does a lot of their testing that way as well.

You are a very odd person.

Yes, people who know software actually may seem odd to people like you.

If Palm gave you a clear cut explanation of the problem, chances are, uless you are a programmer, you would not understand a bit.

I am a programmer. I would understand it. And programmers like me can then communicate to people like you whether (1) Palm actually knows what they are doing, and (2) whether their fix will work. That's why it is important for companies to be open and clear about technical problems even if only a small fraction of their user community understands what they are saying, because that fraction can evaluate it and pass on their impressions and analysis to the rest of the user community.

The fact that Palm hasn't been clear about what is wrong and how they fixed it raises big suspicions that they still don't know what is really going on and are just trying different hacks. And that was my point.



RE: translation...
JKingGrim @ 11/11/2003 12:19:13 PM #
mj6798, are you jss1432?

I am sorry. I did not mean to be disrespectful, and I admit the namecalling was childish. I understand your point now.

I have been looking for a new POS device, and of course my interest in the T3 was lessend by reports of these issues. I am wondering, have you seen (or do you know of) any official statements by either Sandisk or palmOne concerning who will replace the card? Also, are there any figures showing which cards had more problems with the T3?

From what I hear, SanDisk is replacing damaged cards. It was only SanDisk made cards that did not work. And just because the label says another company, it could still be SanDisk made.

I am a programmer. I would understand it. And programmers like me can then communicate to people like you...

People like me? I'm a proggrammer too! ;)

Oh the irony!

matthias @ 11/7/2003 2:34:38 AM #
It's quite amusing that this patch refuses to install on some T3s, citing that they are not compatible devices.

Could the T3 be one of the most problem-fraught handhelds that Palm has released to-date? It smacks of a hurried job and a great lack of testing, just like the patch.


- Matthias

RE: Oh the irony!
hotpaw4 @ 11/7/2003 2:38:20 AM #
Make sure to get the latest version of this update. There apparently were earlier versions on the palmone.com website.
RE: Oh the irony!
jca666us @ 11/7/2003 4:33:35 AM #
I sympathize here. I downloaded the patch last night and the damn thing refused to install.

Luckily it installed today (attempt #4), but my SanDisk SD card is still *smoked* - I don't see why - based on the info. PalmOne has put on their web site that SanDisk should replace my SD card...I already wasted time contacting SanDisk to replace my SD card and got no help from them.

PalmOne screwed up - PalmOne should bite the bullet and replace these cards that the T3 mangled.

Oh well, gotta run and send another e-mail to SanDisk.

RE: Oh the irony!
icy jamie @ 11/7/2003 5:22:59 AM #
But still, I want a T3 :))... The coolness factor is still there...

RE: Oh the irony!
Strider_mt2k @ 11/7/2003 6:46:28 AM #
Yes, it's killer.
Just kill the slider and the bugs, and I might be on board.


RE: Oh the irony!
Palm4u @ 11/7/2003 10:26:08 AM #
Kill the slider and bugs? Is there any coolness left?
Just switching back and forth from portrait to landscape? :P

I played with the T3 at a store, and got bored after 2 minutes. There just so many times you can slide it in and out until you get bored. Same with switching from portrait to landscape. Functional sure, but man... borrrring...

Was at Sony Store, playing with the UX-50, after 10 minutes playing with it, I still wanted more time on it. Trying out the camera, connecting to the instore 802.11b router, trying out the keyboard, take movie clips, transforming it into tablet or laptop mode.

================================
PDAs rule the world !

RE: Oh the irony!
mikecane @ 11/7/2003 11:22:33 AM #
>>>Was at Sony Store, playing with the UX-50, after 10 minutes playing with it, I still wanted more time on it.

With that bloody awful stylus it has, I can see why you'd need more time... "Hey, that %$#$@# stylus slipped out of my hand again!" Hah!

RE: Oh the irony!
Altema @ 11/7/2003 4:28:29 PM #
Mike, don't you know they planned this all along? The thin stylus makes the screen look bigger!

Besides, who needs to use the stylus when every command and function has a button? oh, wait...

RE: Oh the irony!
mikecane @ 11/7/2003 5:38:38 PM #
>>>Mike, don't you know they planned this all along? The thin stylus makes the screen look bigger!

Hahahah! You must have been in Marketing!

RE: Oh the irony!
sdf @ 11/7/2003 7:46:21 PM #
Compared to broken digitizers for the original Tungsten, this doesn't seem that big a deal. I think every release has a few problems and people have short memories.

SD card still shagged

petew @ 11/7/2003 6:04:46 AM #
Hmm, I use my Sandisk 128mb card for nearly a year in my T1, the second I insert it into shiny new T3 it goes pop.

Somehow I can't see sandisk putting their hands up and saying "yeah, it's a fauly card."

RE: SD card still shagged
Altema @ 11/7/2003 9:40:34 AM #
I'm about to install the patch now, but just so you know; the card does make a difference. My wife and I have been running a pair of T3's and have four SD cards. One is a SanDisk, one is a Lexar made by SanDisk, one is a Lexar, and one is a Toshiba. The Lexar and Toshiba will handle anything the T3 can throw at them, and I have been doing two full bakups a day.

I don't have to mention which two fail.

RE: SD card still shagged
nzjss @ 11/7/2003 4:09:03 PM #
Both my SD256 cards have been replaced - have you tried to get yours replaced?
RE: SD card still shagged
Altema @ 11/7/2003 4:31:54 PM #
My first 512MB SanDisk was replaced with no question at CompUSA. I did backups on my Lexar card until today. The 512 works fine now.

RE: SD card still shagged
petew @ 11/9/2003 3:38:27 PM #
I phoned Sandisk, who said they'll send a replacement.

Hopefully

vesther @ 11/7/2003 8:02:22 AM #
...this is going to end the SD Card and Audio Suffering for many Tungsten T3 Users out there. Hopefully, the Tungsten T4 or C2 will get it right the first time.....

In a Desolate Forest, an enchanted Palm-Powered Handheld is waiting to possess a helpless soul in the wake--The Palm-Powered Handheld's name is EURENZANNIG.

T3 Update

LEDO @ 11/7/2003 8:25:50 AM #
Is this fix really 20MB??? I'm sure glad I bought the T3 for all that extra memory! I just might have enough left for a game or two!

RE: T3 Update
johnwin @ 11/7/2003 8:55:18 AM #
It's a rom update so once you go through the update the 20mb is freed up again :-)

http://johnspalm.blogspot.com/
RE: T3 Update
snark @ 11/7/2003 8:56:16 AM #
The install for the fix is 20 MB. Once installed, this memory is released. What the fix does apparently is to flash a new corrected "BIOS" in ROM, thus the needed 20 MB.

RE: T3 Update
LEDO @ 11/7/2003 9:11:31 AM #
Whew! Thanks for clearing that up. I'll give it a try.

RE: T3 Update
LEDO @ 11/7/2003 10:07:35 AM #
Well, everything installed just fine (after I figured out that I also needed to install the english program besides the update). It even breathed the kiss of life back into my 64MB Sandisk card that passed away the first day I owned my T3. Break out the tents! I'm a happy camper once again. All in all, it seems that the update is doing all that it's supposed to. But really, this entire ordeal never should have happened in the first place.

RE: T3 Update
RAMdŽd @ 11/8/2003 3:39:12 AM #
But really, this entire ordeal never should have happened in the first place.

Of course not. In a perfect world it would not have.

But Man is not perfect, and neither is Life.

So we update and move on.

______________________________
An armed society is a polite society.

RE: T3 Update
attas @ 11/10/2003 4:22:57 AM #

I installed the update and run it on my T3, it started checking my ROM and I think it updated my T3. Later I found the update application still there occupying 20MB, when I deleted it released the 20MB from my RAM.

The question is, was my T3 updated or not?. how can I tell if the update was successful?.



TT3 Update

one @ 11/7/2003 9:01:40 AM #
The long-awaited TT3 update installed flawlessly and has corrected the audio-interrupt slowdown problem completely (I've deleted the 'T3 Optimizer' program as a result). So far, my Sandisk 256MB SD card is working normally for the first time (destroyed the first card before this update, and this is the second one). I'm keeping my fingers crossed because aside from the SD card problem, the T3 is the best PDA I've ever used, hands down.
RE: TT3 Update
Ronin @ 11/7/2003 9:44:15 AM #
Amen, Brother!

In the Spirit of Umoja,
Ronin
RE: TT3 Update
Altema @ 11/7/2003 4:57:01 PM #
I'm right in there with you! Won't be looking for anything else for a while.

RE: TT3 Update
acaltabiano @ 11/7/2003 8:04:33 PM #
Yeah. Despite the glaring oversights on palms part, this is still the best PDA out there. It really is fantastic, and while I haven't installed the patch yet, I am still highly impressed with the functionality of the unit, save for the battery life. Though, if I use it like I did my 515, same programs and us time, the battery life is about equivalent. So, in reality, the battery life isn't all that bad. It is just that we now have new alternative toys with which to drain it with...

RE: TT3 Update
Torael_7 @ 11/7/2003 8:42:27 PM #
>>>>...I am still highly impressed with the functionality of the unit, save for the battery life.

No *kidding*. I'm a "palm n00b" (but also a turbo-geek), and I absolutely love everything about the T3.

Except said battery life. :
Still, its not probably not really anything that we're going to see 'fixed' until battery technology improves.

RE: TT3 Update
Palmary @ 11/8/2003 4:45:07 PM #
Yep, best Palm ever.

Update worked perfectly (admittedly I didn't try the Mk1 file), and I didn't fry any of my cards in the meantime.

I'm just waiting on Proporta to finish working on their aluminium case and I'll be in hog heaven. And the free neoprene case they gave me while I wait for the hard case is quite good. Kudos Proporta.

Vx-> M500-> M505-> M515-> TT-> T2-> TC/T3

Keep us posted!

mikecane @ 11/7/2003 11:24:23 AM #
Those of you who have installed the fix, please continue to check in to let us know if everything is functioning properly (as it should have been from the start!). There are people here Still Waiting To Buy...

RE: Keep us posted!
Munan @ 11/7/2003 11:56:45 AM #
The update worked for me, but as soon as I try writing to the card, I get a "bad sector or sector not found" error.
This on two different cards above 128 megs.
The 64 works fine, but it always did.
I'm afraid Palm has failed again.
The T3 goes back tonight and I'm leaving with a Clie.
Palm can suck an egg at this point for all I care.

I use a T3. Why isn't it listed??
RE: Keep us posted!
Sleuth255 @ 11/7/2003 12:16:48 PM #
Ummm... did you do as PalmOne suggested and reformat the card [b][i]using the T3?[/i][/b]

RE: Keep us posted!
Altema @ 11/7/2003 2:25:51 PM #
I did the update, then did 10 backups on cards which did not work before. One card that had severe failures and bad blocks on my laptop failed until it was formatted, but it just did a full 30MB backup with no problems. T3optimizer shows no interrupt problems either (disabled it before the update). Looks good so far.

Note: If you have a card which had bad blocks or severe errors, it may need a full format in a card reader, as the Palm format is a only a quick format.

RE: Keep us posted!
Munan @ 11/7/2003 2:31:34 PM #
In fact, yes.
Twice. Then I assumed it was leftover from the inital fry, so I put in my new backup card and it is now dead too.

I use a T3. Why isn't it listed??
RE: Keep us posted!
mikecane @ 11/7/2003 4:09:10 PM #
>>>I did the update, then did 10 backups on cards which did not work before

Er, uhm, not to incite panic -- but could you also Restore from those cards?

RE: Keep us posted!
Altema @ 11/7/2003 4:35:20 PM #
Aw Mike, you have to spoil everything! Why would anybody do a restore function?!?

Seriously, I'm about to do one now just to test... get back to you in a few minutes.

RE: Keep us posted!
Altema @ 11/7/2003 4:46:15 PM #
Did a backup to a 512MB SanDisk card using BackupMan, then did a hard reset, then a restore using BackupMan again. Smooth as silk, just like nothing happened. Restore was fast too, a 30MB restore in about 60 seconds... this thing is screamin'.


RE: Keep us posted!
abosco @ 11/7/2003 4:57:51 PM #
Wow... so you're saying you had a fried SD card, and after a format and the flashed ROM patch, you were able to use it again?

If that's true, palmOne won't get a class-action after all. A very professional way to handle this grim situation, and hopefully all hardware can be recovered. TT3 owners should be glad palmOne handled this in about a month, even though this never should have happened in the first place.

-Bosco
NX80v + Wifi + BT + T616

RE: Keep us posted!
mikecane @ 11/7/2003 5:37:40 PM #
>>>a 30MB restore in about 60 seconds... this thing is screamin'

Man, that is wicked fast!!

RE: Keep us posted!
icebalm @ 11/8/2003 1:05:14 PM #
Yeah, my T3 is half full, takes a little less than 2 min to back it up, restore is half that speed, very nice. Compare this to the H3870 ipaq I had which would take litterally 10 minutes to back up to an SD card....

RE: Keep us posted!
JonathanChoo @ 11/8/2003 5:19:08 PM #
I did not reformat my cards and it still works.

Psion 5 -> Palm Vx -> Palm m505 -> Sony N770C -> Sony T625C -> Sony NR70V -> Toshiba e310 -> Palm Tungsten T -> HP h2210 -> Palm Tungsten T3

Motorola StarTAC -> Ericsson T28m -> Ericsson T39m -> Ericsson T68m -> Ericsson T610

T3 update success!

a_nonamiss @ 11/7/2003 11:35:06 AM #
Well, Palm caught me just in the nick of time. I was so frustrated when my brand new T3 erased my SD card for the 4th time. (it never killed any cards, just kept corrupting them requiring a reformat) I had the T3 all boxed up and ready to go back on my lunch break today, when much to my delight, they fixed the problem! The update installed beautifully and without incident, and I have been beating up my T3 all morning to try to get a failure. I have finally reached palm computing nirvana!

Arhtur

Palm Pilot 1000 > Palm Pilot Professional > Palm III > Palm M100 > Sony Clié PEG-T415 > Palm T|T3

Man o man!

Strider_mt2k @ 11/7/2003 5:51:10 PM #
If Palm one really fixed this thing they might just have pulled their fat out of the fryer!

Make those engineers VPs immediately!

Oh Nooooooooooooo

AndyMunich @ 11/7/2003 6:48:23 PM #
Why did I install it...my 128 MB card worked fine before...if it will work now, I don't know (it is in the photolab until tomorrow) but what I know :

The Voice recorder button !!! When I press it, it makes a terrible ta-ta-ta-ta-ta machine gun like buzz and I get a fatal exception....I can't believe it...

Why did I install it....

RE: Oh Nooooooooooooo
Altema @ 11/8/2003 2:18:10 AM #
Make sure you have a current backup (your latest hotsync will do), and do a hard reset. Try the record function before doing any hotsync. If the voice recorder works fine, then there is a conflict with one or more third party programs you had on your Palm.

If it still has the problem, then it is a problem with the ROM update or hardware. Contact palmOne support if this is the case, and they will take you through a few more steps then authorize a return for you.

How about EFIGS or International TT3 ?

Konstantin @ 11/7/2003 7:08:47 PM #
I have one TT3 with international ROM, do I have to apply the same fix or there is a special fix for EFIGS TT3s ?

I've checked my local palm web page but there is no mention about the fix.

RE: How about EFIGS or International TT3 ?
tim_s @ 11/7/2003 7:24:36 PM #
The download contains language files as well. Just install the main update and the languaeg file that suits your device.
RE: How about EFIGS or International TT3 ?
bcombee @ 11/8/2003 2:45:20 AM #
All TT3 devices (except the Japanese version) use the EFIGS ROM, even the ones sold in the US. Since they added so many apps to the ROM, there was no advantage to them using a smaller Flash chip with the US version, so they only made one ROM image.

--
Ben Combee, CodeWarrior for Palm OS technical lead
Programming help at www.palmoswerks.com
RE: How about EFIGS or International TT3 ?
Garfie1d @ 11/10/2003 7:01:54 AM #
Actually Palm state that if you have the EFIGS Palm you should install all six files (ie all the language files) whereas if you have the US version you should only install the english language file.

This also implies that the ROMs are different.

"Stay On In Cradle" still not fixed...

tim_s @ 11/7/2003 7:22:42 PM #
Oh well... one thing at a time, I guess.
RE:
acaltabiano @ 11/7/2003 8:10:03 PM #
Stay on in cradle function is overridden by the Auto Off function. Check to see if you have the security settings on, and if the auto off function is activated (either immediately or after a set time), the Stay on in Cradle function will not work. It is a designed saftey feature to keep safe those people who want info secure but are too stupid to turn their Palms off while in the cradle if they walk away.

RE:
Rolando @ 11/7/2003 8:21:17 PM #
Are you sure you don't have it set to "auto lock" after a period of time? If any autolock features are set, stay on in cradle will not function.

Rolando

AutoLock
tim_s @ 11/7/2003 8:44:26 PM #
Yeah, it's the AutoLock. Mine's set to 30 minutes. If that's a "feature" it's a mighty stupid one. The only time I'd walk away from my Palm in its cradle is when it's desperate for a charge - and then I'd have it switched off anyway.

It still seems to be a bug to me. My Palm is set to turn off after 2 minutes, at which point it applies the keylock. The AutoLock doesn't kick in til 30 minutes later. I'd understand if it locked (or even turned off) in the cradle after 30 minutes of inactivity - but my 30 minute AutoLock is turning it off after 2 (and still not locking the device until 30).

Not well thought out...

RE:
Altema @ 11/8/2003 1:59:00 AM #
They set the security functions to override the stay on in cradle option to cover users that have their device set to lock at every power off. Not everyone would be as attentive as yourself, and of course they would point their finger at palmOne if the device did not lock because it remained on all the time in the cradle.

Stay On In Cradle Work Around
alistairI @ 11/8/2003 10:43:41 PM #
I also found that the Stay On In Cradle preference was no longer observed after installing the Security Update. However as I had recently upgraded from a Visor Prism, I tried OnCradleOn (available from PalmGear) which was created initially to provide the same functionality as the Stay On In Cradle preference for Prisms. It appears to override the security override when in the cradle and yet still preserve the AutoOff and Autolock when not being charged. The only downside is that it sometimes generates a softreset when exiting the program, however as that only occurs once it seems acceptable.

I also had some inconsistent results when security AutoLock was set for a couple of minutes and the AutoLock never activated occasionally when in the cradle. However it is worthwhile checking out at least.

RE:
tim_s @ 11/10/2003 2:13:49 AM #
Thanks AlistairI for the info... I'll check it out.

Altema, if what you say is right, and this really is a "feature" rather than a bug, then the Palm should lock or shut down (or whatever it's going to do) at the security time-out (in my case, after 30 minutes), not after 2 minutes.

TT3update FAILS

nzjss @ 11/7/2003 8:45:16 PM #
Hi - my international T3 runs the update through the Rom check cycle then gives the error message "This is an invalid ROM Please install the application again" and of course gives the same message when installed & run again.

Since buying the T3 on October 6 - my patience has run out - I have notified Palm & my retailer that the T3 goes back on Monday. Good Luck!

RE: TT3update FAILS
benixau @ 11/7/2003 10:29:26 PM #
did you donwload the updated updae file? If not - i found your problem. Dont go to a sony or PPC - the former will force you to buy MS cards and the later will make you want your Palm back real bad.

RE: TT3update FAILS
Altema @ 11/8/2003 2:05:32 AM #
John, pull down the current update. The first release made public had this error, and palmOne fixed it in a couple of hours. Matter of fact, I did my update by following their instructions to the letter, then broke all the rules and did the update on my wife's T3 from an expansion card and no hotsyncs. Both methods worked perfectly, but I made sure I did not have the bad first release. The T3 has been a great device for me, and it would be worthwhile to try it again unless you really miss your T665c.

RE: TT3update FAILS >> SUCESS
nzjss @ 11/8/2003 4:37:32 AM #
I was not dumping the T3 but swapping for a new one! I have my T3 Hard Reset & Restore routine perfected using BackupBuddy from a SimpleTech SD256 card. With McFile in Launcher on the card I delete Datebook & Graffiti Library from Ram then hit Restore in BackupBuddy V2.04 and with one pause on the PIMsSupportStatus file it's done

I'm Laughin out loud at the PalmOne web idiots - The TT3Update version that failed was downloaded after the download page has the "...The problem has been corrected" message.

The next download some hours later worked OK. Does not seem to be any different but the speed problem is "fixed" showing 375~380mHz in Speedy after poweroff.

I'll never go back to anything Sony with that toothpic stylus. My T665 had a fault with the audio (not playing MP3) on the first day and the Sony owned retailer wanted to send it away for a repair! I had problems with a Vx and M500 and Palm retailer swapped them for new both times. To get a replacement T655 I demanded my money back and just bought another one.

I have the good TT3Update files on a seperate SD32 card & I plan to go to a few local retailers & update the T3's on display.

Altema - your wife is spoilt - my darling is getting her Vx replaced with my old T|T. Have you tried the BlueChat together?

Cheers - John

RE: TT3update FAILS
Altema @ 11/8/2003 6:18:44 PM #
"Altema - your wife is spoilt - my darling is getting her Vx replaced with my old T|T. Have you tried the BlueChat together?"

I was planning on giving her my T|T. However, she used my T3 and fell in love, then promptly announced she did not want the T|T anymore! Fortunately I got a good price for the T|T which almost paid for the T3, so that helped minimize the financial damage.

We have tried BlueChat, but she liked the BlueBoard because her Graffiti skills are still being developed. Being able to commumicate silently is a bonus with a house full of kids. The BlueTooth games are kind of cool, and you don't have to line up the IR or even be in the same room (Biplane Ace, Pong2, Monopoly and RifleSLUGS-W). I'm sure the number of BT games will increase with most of the top end devices being BT equipped. I'm hoping that some those hi-res+ games will be useable on the T3 :)

RE: TT3update FAILS
sam_in_silver @ 11/9/2003 1:20:32 PM #
I waited a day before downloading the patch, it worked first time with no problems.

The SD card formatted fine, and I could once again reload data to it with no errors, so the patch eeems to work.

IF YOU USE KINOMA ~ the 1.5.1.1 version I had was re-installed on the hotsync. It crashed on some movies, and reverted to only playing a few seconds on others. I deleted Kinoma 1.5.1.1 from Ram and found that the ROM version in the Palm patch was version 2. It worked fine with all movies. MORAL ~ ~ if you used the old Kinoma, the Kinoma on the update in ROM works better.

RE: TT3update FAILS
WiG @ 11/10/2003 10:33:14 AM #
I haven't installed the T3Update, and Kinoma player in my T3 ROM is 2.0.


SDIO Cards...

fzywshr @ 11/8/2003 1:17:30 PM #
Does anyone knows if thie TT3 Update includes the SDIO support or does it still has to ve added after installing the upgrade?

Thanks in advance!


There is no spoon...

RE: SDIO Cards...
Altema @ 11/8/2003 6:41:03 PM #
SDIO support works fine with no extra intervention.

Grrr... no Thank You to PalmOne!!

mikecane @ 11/8/2003 4:34:05 PM #
This would have been a perfect time to include a PATCH TO INCREASE THE CLIPBOARD!!

I mean, 32K Memos and still that pathetic Clipboard?!

Well, come on, everyone. All of you were Just Too Happy. Now let's get back to demanding more of PalmOne!

RE: Grrr... no Thank You to PalmOne!!
JonathanChoo @ 11/8/2003 5:13:09 PM #
If you are desperate for a better clipboard try Clip Pro. Up to 10 different 64k clipboards.

Psion 5 -> Palm Vx -> Palm m505 -> Sony N770C -> Sony T625C -> Sony NR70V -> Toshiba e310 -> Palm Tungsten T -> HP h2210 -> Palm Tungsten T3

Motorola StarTAC -> Ericsson T28m -> Ericsson T39m -> Ericsson T68m -> Ericsson T610

RE: Grrr... no Thank You to PalmOne!!
Altema @ 11/8/2003 6:45:41 PM #
I use WordSmith which has ignored such limits for quite a while, so the limitation has rarely had an effect on me. I guess I didn't think too much about it because WS takes over the memo pad and does a beautiful job.

RE: Grrr... no Thank You to PalmOne!!
WiG @ 11/10/2003 10:36:41 AM #
Get CutPaste5 to get 32K clipboard on OS5.
http://www.freewarepalm.com/utilities/cutpaste5.shtml


RE: Grrr... no Thank You to PalmOne!!
Foo Fighter @ 11/10/2003 12:08:55 PM #
As a rule, I am against purchasing hacks and third party software to fix a problem that should never exist at all. That's PalmSource's responsibility.

-------------------------------
My blog: www.pocketfactory.com

Left Handed Operation

Howie_Penticon @ 11/8/2003 5:48:30 PM #
I just installed the T3 Update. I then went into LandScape mode, and I have the "Handedness" on my Palm configured for "Left-Handed". It looks like it's quite messed up. The screen is not displayed correctly, different parts of the forms are shifted and not displayed in the right place. In short - it looks pretty bad. I didn't use Landscape mode too much before, so I can't say for sure that this problem didn't exist before the update, but I never noticed it, and noticed it almost immediately after doing the update. Please check this out, and let me know if anyone else has noticed this problem. If you haven't done the update yet, then check out how it works in Landscape mode with Left-Handed before doing the update, and then check it again after doing the update.
RE: Left Handed Operation
Altema @ 11/8/2003 6:50:34 PM #
Mine does not look messed up, but I did notice that if you change from left to right handedness while in the landscape mode, it goes back to left handedness when you exit prefs. Everything works fine if you change handedness while in portrait mode. No corruptions though, and everything works properly. Can't comment on an unpatched device, little hard to undo a ROM update! I'll be updating a friend's T3 tomorrow and will check it out beforehand.

RE: finally I can relax
chinchorrero @ 11/8/2003 7:13:23 PM #
Like most of you, I went through a very frustrating month with my T3, but I can tell you that finally after the recent update I am running 100%. My new SanDisk 256mb card is running excellent. I've been playing around with it and I haven't experienced any hiccups.
Cheers

"Life is Too Short"
RE: Left Handed Operation
Howie_Penticon @ 11/8/2003 7:30:08 PM #
I think I've found the culprit - it's beta software that I'm using. I still don't know if it's related to the update or not, but I'll take that up with the developer.
RE: Left Handed Operation
Altema @ 11/8/2003 11:06:41 PM #
Funny you should mention that; I'm running beta software as well!

RE: Left Handed Operation
Patrick @ 11/9/2003 3:30:13 AM #
I don't get the messed up screens, but you might note that the built-in photo application blithely ignores the handedness setting. If you set landscape to left handed, your photos will appear upside-down.


Provide a REAL Update Palm...

ascian @ 11/9/2003 5:14:46 PM #
Well this is a welcome fix to to the T|T3, but should they not have included the most recent (bug fix) versions of Documents to Go, Kinoma player, Security, The App Rotate and Toolbar fixes, etc?

Also, has anyone noticed that installing the ISDK and/or Math libs from the CD cause the T|T3 to benchmark at half the speed? Is this just an anomaly based on "Speedy" and other app's usage of functions within these libs, does it really affect other apps?

Ciao,
Colin


Can someone please tell palmOne the update is still buggy

palmdoc88 @ 11/9/2003 6:26:33 PM #
I thought I was alone.
I have a T3Rom with a 8/25/03 19:32 date/timestamp.
The latest T3update files do not work for me as I still get the Device not recocognised error.
Everyone else I know can update except me. I thought I was alone in this until someone else

(see http://www.palmonecity.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=887&perpage=15&pagenumber=2 )

also posted that he has the same T3Rom and cannot update.

Why oh why palmOne did your Rom recognition algorithm have to be sooooooo buggy?? This is pathetic. :(

Can anyone help here? Emailing Palm Support only resulted in the standard reply. In the end they suggested I call Palm US support (that would be an International call for me)



RE: Can someone please tell palmOne the update is still bugg
nzjss @ 11/9/2003 11:56:04 PM #
Here's the reply I got from Palm with the Incorrect Rom error:
PALM SUPPORT MESSAGE:
Hi, please note that a revised version of the palmOne Tungsten(TM) T3 Update has been uploaded on the palmOne Web site as on November 8, 2003. Incase you have downloaded the update before this date, please
re-download it from the following URL to get the latest version of the Tungsten T3 card update:

http://www.palmone.com/us/support/downloads/tungstent3/t3_update.html

NOTE : Incase you experience the same issue, or you have downloaded the above update after the date mentioned above, then please refer to the instructions listed below.

However, if you already have the revised version of the update, then, I would like to inform you that the T3Update.zip file contain 6 compressed files. There are application files for all types of Palm OS(R). If you are using an international or non-US or multilingual version of Palm OS, then you need to ensure that you have all the 6 files installed on the Palm handheld via Quick Install Tool of Palm Desktop software.

However, if you have a US or English version of Palm OS on your Palm handheld, then you will need to install the T3Update.prc and T3Update_enUS.prc files on your Palm handheld. If you attempt to install any of the other files, then the incorrect error message or the Tool not compatible on this device will occur.

You may verify if you have an international version of Palm OS loaded on your Palm handheld or not by performing a hard reset. After a hard reset, all international version of Palm handhelds will prompt you an option to select a language.
***

The trick for me was to load all the language files and then it worked - the test seems to be matching your old T3 ROM to the update files you have in RAM.

You can put the 15M download file on a card with McFile in Launcher on the card - do the reset on the T3 and copy the TT3Update and language files to Ram and go.

If you have had any problems on your T3 recently dont do a restore from backup as something in there is the problem - reload everything again.

RE: Can someone please tell palmOne the update is still buggy
ricoh tek @ 11/10/2003 12:02:49 AM #
Okay, I have an iPaq 21xx that is giving me some problems (OS). I have a Sandisk 256 meg that has been in a Dell Axim, Palm Zire71 and a Toshiba e740 with no problems. All I use it for is mp3's. If I buy a T3 and do the updates should I be okay? I use an sd card reader/writer to write my mps3's anyway.
Thanks
RT

RE: PPC to T3? - You Bet!
nzjss @ 11/10/2003 1:44:58 AM #
YES! - If you do not have existing Palm "baggage" (ie an SD card loaded with your favourite Palm software from some model before the T3) your T3 will be as reliable as any other SD Card carrying Palm..

Before the Update my T3 was "reliable" after I bit the bullet and reloaded everything to the T3 from scratch + dumped some problem favourites like Avant Go. By "reliable" I mean that I have BackupBuddy VFS 2.04 being able to do 100% Backups to a card (Fat16 formatted in the T3) with no problems and Restore fully on demand. - for my BBVFS restores to be trouble free I need to delete Datebook on the Ram (using McFile in Launcher on the SD256 card) before clicking Restore.

Most 3rd party software has not caught up with the T3. When they say OS5 compatable that does not mean "will cause no trouble on a T3". Look for the words "Tested on the T3". The only software giving me hard Resets recently is Documents to Go v6.002 and v6.005.

One trick with the T3 when hit with a Hard Reset Failure is you can hold the UP button when pushing Reset and go back to working for long enough to copy your latest data to the card before having to do the hard reset.

Buy a T3 Now! My choice is to pay a few more $ from a smaller local retailer who will respect your business and solve problems promptly.

Update Worked Fine

julians @ 11/10/2003 1:16:26 AM #
The update worked fine for me. I didn't have any problems with my SD card, but it is only 32MB anyway.

My only problem was forgetting to disable TealLock first, so BackupBuddy corrupted TealLock and I had to delete it and re-install.

Nothing's ever as straightforward as it should be... sigh!


RE: Update Worked Fine
ChrisSpera @ 11/10/2003 10:43:58 AM #
My update also went off without a hitch. After having applied so many risky iPAQ ROM updates, this was refreshingly easy to do.


Kind Regards,


Christopher Spera

RE: Update Worked Fine
alexp @ 11/11/2003 1:07:48 PM #
Mine worked fine, too. I've been using a PNY card manufactured by Toshiba and a Lexar card by Panasonic. Both are 256mb and work fine, even before the update.

Graffiti 1 files overwritten

emotive @ 11/11/2003 8:39:03 PM #
be aware if you have gone back to using G1 on your T3 that the upgrade will overwrite your G1 files with the G2 files again.

RE: Graffiti 1 files overwritten
dunct @ 11/12/2003 10:25:42 AM #
This didn't happen when I applied the upgrade. I had G1 installed and it still is.
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