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Comments on: 600k webOS Devices Heading to Verizon

palm pre plus verizon An interesting new article has just been posted by D! All Things Digital's John Paczkowski discussing the ever-rampant rumor that Palm may be acquired within the next year or two. Citing Deutsche Bank analyst (and periodic Palm prognosticator) Jonathan Goldberg, Paczkowski's article is interesting not because of the hypothetical Palm acquisition speculation but rather because of a brief mention regarding how many webOS "Plus" units are in the Verizon channels.

Previous reports claimed that Verizon had purchased a 50/50 mixture of Pre Plus and Pixi Plus units for a total of 400,000 devices. I was told last week by a Verizon support rep who had just finished training on webOS that they had "closer to a half-million" due to a greater-than-anticipated Pre demand. If the 600,000 unit report is correct, than Verizon could be planning on giving WebOS a greater push than originally anticipated, especially given that two new Verizon Pre Plus Valentine-themed ads that have been plastered all over primetime television lately (here and here). Additionally, Verizon is still running their "buy one webOS phone, get a free Pixi" promotion.

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in the wild?

Gekko @ 2/4/2010 5:23:37 PM # Q

IMO speculation and/or channel stuffing.

because i have yet to see a pre or pixi in the wild except for the one i bought and returned.

demand is LOW.

RE: in the wild?
Ed Lin @ 2/4/2010 9:25:13 PM # Q
I have seen one other Pre in the wild, and have yet to see a Droid in the wild. My Pre is solid and has yet to develop any of the problems read about on the net. Demand for the Droid on Verizon is lower than Pre Plus? Palm build quality is high, even with the Sprint Pre? See, I can play the apocryphal evidence game too!
Reply to this comment

I should say

Ed Lin @ 2/4/2010 9:27:29 PM # Q
I should say that 600,000 is a drop in the bucket compared to the Droid, which sold a million devices in a month.
RE: I should say
jca666us @ 2/5/2010 6:00:31 AM # M Q
Within a year, PIC will post an article titled,"600k webOS Devices Heading to landfill"
Reply to this comment

Enough BULL. Palm can't even give WebOS phones away

Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/4/2010 9:33:53 PM # Q
No one is buying these phones. No one is buying Palm. How much longer can Palm keep up the charade of pretending to compete with real cellphone manufacturers?. No product, no stable OS, no customers. Way to go, Rubes!
RE: Enough BULL. Palm can't even give WebOS phones away
mikecane @ 2/6/2010 7:22:08 AM # Q
Eh. At least they're not Nokia. They have something *good* in webOS.
RE: Enough BULL. Palm can't even give WebOS phones away
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 9:41:03 AM # M Q
Nokia? Who dat?

Yes, Nokia may be persona non grata in America, but for reasons that escape me their phones still rule the roost in the land of Eurotrash.


3 years ago Palm could have been where Apple is today, with the same mobile OS running on 3 different device categories. Smartphone, PDA/entertainment pad ("PalmPad") and laptop/tablet ("PalmTop"). All 3 platforms syncing to a central server, allowing users to access their data at any time with any device. Global syncing could have helped make Windows redundant (Google's secret longterm plan). Instead, all we got was the Foleo debacle, a sacrificial Jeff Hawkins making a fool(eo) of himself in an attempt to cover for his inept development team's failure to deliver on his vision, two years of multi-colored Centros and the severely premature delivery of WebOS ("PreemieOS").


Elevation Partners is going to go down in flames unless they can flip their Palm investment before the market figures out that the emperor has no clothes. Does EP have the cojones to buy the rest of Palm in anticipation of The Deal? And who would buy? I wonder who it was that left Palm at the altar a couple of years ago when they ultimately balked at "Fast" Eddie Colligan's multi-billion dollar dowery? Did due diligence show that WebOS couldn't cut it in an impending Android world? Is Eddie C an electric sheep ****er?


Nokia's money could have allowed WebOS to develop into a platform worthy of competing with iPhone by now. Maemo's been a failure. Is it time for Nokia and Palm to get together?

RE: Enough BULL. Palm can't even give WebOS phones away
SeldomVisitor @ 2/6/2010 9:52:44 AM # Q
I doubt Elevation would buy any more PALM unless it was dirt cheap. Right now they're averaged in at $7-ish/share, I believe, so are sitting on a nice profit for the 2.5-ish years they've been "invested".

BTW - Elevation has a checkered investing history - ONE position, as far as I could figure out, has been closed out - that one was quite profitable. All the other positions are still in place and, at most I believe, two of four or five are in the green (on paper).

RE: Enough BULL. Palm can't even give WebOS phones away
Gekko @ 2/6/2010 10:03:18 AM # Q
RE: Enough BULL. Palm can't even give WebOS phones away
SeldomVisitor @ 2/6/2010 10:48:56 AM # Q
Yeah, that article does mention some of Elevation's positions but is rather wrong on how profitable (on paper) its Palm position is - about 40-ish% in the green is more correct (rather than 25% or whatever that article says).
RE: Enough BULL. Palm can't even give WebOS phones away
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 11:01:09 AM # M Q
All it would take to drive Palm's stock into the gutter would be a few well placed rumors about lack of sales for WebOS phones*. Someone yells "Fire!" and Rubes & Co sit back laughing as skittish investors/rats stampede and flee the sinking ship. Elevation Partners swoops in and "generously" offers the board (which they control) a buyout for $3. Then Badda Boom Badda Bing they flip to Nokia for 2 billion and walk away with 500 million profit. The SEC wouldn't bat an eyelash.

Palm is possibly the most manipulated stock in history. Untold millions have been made off Palm by a hundred or so insiders over the years. I gots mine! Gimmee more!

*Does no one find it odd that a company so desperately in need of a smash hit would choose to showcase its brand spanking new OS is such weak hardware as the Pre and the Pixi? One phonecall to any of half a dozen Taiwanese OEMs could have resulted in much better phones using off the shelf parts and designs. Could certain people at Palm be secretly trying to sabotage the company in order to force a buyout? Hmmmmmm?

Reply to this comment

This is an article with...literally...no basis in fact

SeldomVisitor @ 2/5/2010 4:09:31 AM # Q
Nuff said.

RE: This is an article with...literally...no basis in fact
jmchamblis @ 2/5/2010 8:13:59 AM # Q
They are taking the inventory knowledge given to a low-level support person as gosple on how many devices were ordered? Besides, if Verizon were to sell out, wouldn't the order more of a popular device?
RE: This is an article with...literally...no basis in fact
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/7/2010 8:05:58 AM # M Q
As usual the only thing that matters is how many phones are being sold each month to real people. Everything else is B.S.

Will Palm EVER announce its WebOS phone sales figures? What are they hiding?

Reply to this comment

damn

whiteasianrose @ 2/5/2010 2:45:22 PM # Q
the hate is out in full force today


RE: damn
SeldomVisitor @ 2/5/2010 4:40:52 PM # Q
Yes, apparently it has.

RE: damn
Scotland @ 2/5/2010 7:42:53 PM # Q
I don't know why half the people who come to this site and comment bother to come here anymore. They just seem to be negative about everything.

The irony is that, after years of Palm coming out with underwhelming PalmOS devices (remember how long it took Palm to come out with the 680 that had the major feature of being *slightly* thinner AND had an internal antenna...?) and no OS updates for YEARS, this negativity still continues now that Palm has a real OS, frequent updates, and competitive devices again (and, yes, they may not have features that satisfy everyone on this site but you'd be hard pressed to say they aren't competitive).

This site and the PalmOS stalwarts who frequent it are starting to remind me of OS/2 sites after IBM gave up on it in the mid-90s - where a steadily declining number of OS/2 fans denied reality, telling themselves that their OS was still better than Win95 (mostly true) and then NT 4.0 (iffy) and XP (definitely not true) while the marketplace moved on and left them behind.

Give it a break, people! The news that Palm is selling a bunch of devices on Verizon is actually good news. It's a pity that folks have to turn it around and say they should be selling more.

And, yes, I have seen Palm devices in the wild - 2 separate acquaintances of mine bought Pres without my knowledge and they love them. And complete strangers have asked me about mine on occasion.

I'm starting to wonder why I come here.

RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/6/2010 6:55:19 AM # Q

ok i'll point out the obvious to you. because right now i use a Palm Centro on Sprint. unfortunately, it represents the best value and usability right now for my needs. i'm waiting for something better to come. i value some of the opinions, news, humor, and insight here. our small band of brothers here have all known each other for many years - albeit virtually - and we've seen a lot together. we've lived through palm's successes and failures together. we have a long history together. the thrill of cool new Palm products at the time and the agony of disastrous ones. lots of long debates and analysis. as soon as a better alternative comes to Sprint, i'll probably get it - regardless of the OS. it may be an iPhone, Android, WinMob or whatever. yet i'll probably still chime in here from time to time to check on my "friends". understand?

RE: damn
mikecane @ 2/6/2010 7:24:23 AM # Q
>>>i'll probably still chime in here from time to time to check on my "friends". understand?

Friends?!!? You have friends here?! How the hell did THAT happen?

If YOU want a friend, Gekko, get a dog. Although then I'd have to call PETA on your ass.

Oh that is so Win! Get that dog!

RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/6/2010 7:58:17 AM # Q

do you have enough microwave pizzas and pepsi stocked up for the snow storm? or will they find your cold, lifeless, emaciated body huddled in the corner on the floor in the fetal position several weeks from now?

:-O
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 8:08:14 AM # M Q
Newsflash:


MC FTW!

Yet another classic PIC beatdown. Brings a tear to my jaundiced eye.

RE: damn
abosco @ 2/6/2010 8:47:27 AM # M Q
I think there's one thing we can all agree on. Nobody likes this guy ^^^, regardless of what username he's using this week. Or what random string of words he curiously decides to capitalize and trademark. I still haven't figured that one out.

Is he concerned someone is going to steal his brilliant phrases, write a book, and earn millions?

RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/6/2010 9:35:27 AM # Q

my guess is bipolar disorder combined with a cognitive dissonance alternating between highly inflated sense of self worth, importance, influence, intelligence vs. deep insecurities and personal failure.


RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/6/2010 9:37:01 AM # Q

scot - palm is like a slow motion car crash - you can't help but slow down and watch.

RE: damn
rpa @ 2/6/2010 10:54:20 PM # Q
Gekko: I am still using my Centro for the same reasons. The best we can hope for Garnet is an emulator running on Android or even the iPhone. Access did one for the Nokia 800 (?) but they have disappeared lately.

Where are the techies who can write an emulator so we can continue to enjoy the simplicity of Garnet and cool hardware at the same time?? There must be at least ONE who still frequents this site.

RE: damn
hkklife @ 2/7/2010 7:42:18 AM # Q
Dmitry Grinberg and his DGOS project is our best hope.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid
RE: damn
abosco @ 2/7/2010 8:07:09 AM # M Q
Guys, emulators and fringe OS projects are not the answers you should be looking for. The most important thing is to have an OS that fits your needs, has developer support, and is backed by a company large enough to provide continued updates to the software. Otherwise, you're going to run into the same exact problem next year.

Really, your only options are Apple and Google. The latest rumors on WinMob7 say it's a Zune version of the iPhone. Very creative. I could totally see Microsoft doing that. So take a minute, assess the platforms, and jump in. Leave the Centro behind.

RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/7/2010 8:21:00 AM # Q

of course. i don't want to pilot my life on some wobbly emulator. F that. too many other good alternatives. no need to be stuck out on some island trying to run wobbly incompatible legacy 1996 software on 2010 hardware. my jump from Centro will be clean, quantum, and complete.
The solution is simple. And it ISN'T WebOS
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/7/2010 8:29:59 AM # M Q
What people want is nice phone hardware and an attractive OS that provides the ability to use the apps we like. Since this is PALMinfocenter.com, most of us like PalmOS apps. The core PIM apps and third party replacements are simply the best available on ANY platform. It is fast, efficient, easy to use and has many (often unique) apps available for it that many of us have come to depend on.

Yes, PalmOS is not the most modern OS, but TealOS showed us all how easily a simple user interface refresh could modernize the PalmOS experience. The main problem is the fact that in 2010 PalmOS is running on primitive hardware compared to most other phones - especially Android phones and iPhone.

Put PalmOS - or a PalmOS emulator - on modern hardware and you would have an amazing, incredibly fast mobile platform.

Access can easily create an emulator for Android. Apple's control over app certification means a legitimate Access-derived emulator for iPhone is less likely. We need to show Access that there is interest in a PalmOS emulator for Android and see if they feel it makes business sense to release it ASAP.

RE: damn
abosco @ 2/7/2010 8:57:55 AM # M Q
So that's your solution? Beg Access to create an emulator for an abandoned platform on Android? I have a better idea. Buy an iPhone. The built-in calendar is weak, but it interfaces well with EAS. If you don't need Exchange, you can buy Pocket Informant and have it sync to Google Calendar. The reviews are very positive, the layout looks awesome, and it's $13.

No more time spent hacking your way to software compatibility. No more fumbling with shitty SD cards. No more underpowered hardware.

For the record, I love love love the lack of external storage. My media library comfortably fits on 16 GB, and I don't have to worry about software recognizing content on the card, managing/carrying/losing several cards, or mixing them up. It's always on my phone. I know some people on here will bitch about not being able to carry all 200 GB of their library, but too ****ing bad. This solution works for 95% of people, and I'm one of them.

Con
Gekko @ 2/10/2010 11:57:36 AM # Q

Con - are you ok? i'm worried that snow storm #2 has left you dead and bloated.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lM8dS51Rf-I

Caring is good
e_tellurian @ 2/10/2010 1:29:47 PM # M Q
Good to know people are caring about one another.

Peace,

E-T

RE: damn
mikecane @ 2/10/2010 1:31:13 PM # Q
RE: damn
abosco @ 2/10/2010 2:50:19 PM # M Q
Alice In Chains and STP are headlining a concert in Philly on May 23rd. Tickets go on sale for $50 on Friday. I'm there.

Stay warm, pricks. It is out of control over here.

RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/10/2010 5:11:24 PM # Q

bosco - shouldn't you be in the walmart parking lot right about now?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCXgE10dZE4

WTF happened to my posts in this thread?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/10/2010 6:25:47 PM # Q
hkklife, is there some new censorship policy now in place at Palminfocenter? The posts responding to the abosco child have been deleted. If that's the way PIC rolls now, please let me know. If I'm going to craft golden nuggets of posting poetry only to see them delated because abosco goes running to Ryan because he got his widdle nose bloodied then I'll return the forum to its regularly scheduled screed from E-tellurian. This site REALLY needs to figure out how it's planning to survive. Mike Cane can't have much time left on this planet...
hkklife: Nevermind - my Centro just wasn't loading the page
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/10/2010 6:31:23 PM # Q
Damn Blazer has to be refreshed every time to see new comments.

Nothing to see, folks. Move along now...

RE: damn
abosco @ 2/10/2010 7:07:50 PM # M Q
Idiot.
RE: damn
Docta G @ 2/11/2010 9:22:56 AM # Q
abosco wrote:
Alice In Chains and STP are headlining a concert in Philly on May 23rd. Tickets go on sale for $50 on Friday. I'm there.

Finally you've written something that sounds like a good idea!!

I'm jealous, enjoy.

RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/11/2010 9:42:01 AM # Q

AIC is not AIC without LS.

RE: damn
abosco @ 2/11/2010 11:43:18 AM # Q
Yeah, but Jerry can still shred. Layne stopped touring when I was 9, there's not a whole lot I could do there. I've already seen AIC twice in the last few years, but I've wanted to see STP for so long. Also, Soundgarden is back together, and STP is back in the studio working on a new album. It's been a good year to be a 90's fan.

Maybe Eddie Vedder will stop being such a pussy and make some good music again.

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/11/2010 11:49:46 AM # Q

IMO - STP was the best rock band of the 90s - well maybe a tie with Nirvana who were cut tragically short. i liked one AIC album - it maybe was the greatest hits one. i liked the first PJ album - now i can't stand them - especially that self-absorbed screaming asshole EV. i never liked SG.

alas, those days are gone. now i only listen to Bloomberg and Hot 97.

http://player.streamtheworld.com/liveplayer.php?CALLSIGN=WQHTFM

RE: damn
abosco @ 2/11/2010 12:04:02 PM # Q
...the hell is wrong with you? Tie with Nirvana? Nirvana had maybe a handful of good songs, but the media loved them. They were the most overrated band of the 90's. Soundgarden invented grunge - how can you not like them?

Go listen to AIC's Dirt album until you're normal. However, you are correct. Pearl Jam sucked after Ten.

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: damn
Gekko @ 2/11/2010 3:00:23 PM # Q

dirt was the album i liked. soundgarden's lead singer annoys the shit out of me - so one dimensional - every song sounds the same - and he's so earnest and takes himself way too f*****g seriously. i want to puke any time i hear that stupid black hole sun song.

i went to a motley crue concert a few years ago and had to leave after a few songs. wolfe was right - you can't go home again.

RE: damn
Docta G @ 2/11/2010 3:46:28 PM # Q
I have to agree and disagree with both of you, I like Nirvana *and* Soundgarden.

I vividly remember seeing Soundgarden in 1994, they played most of their songs off Badmotorfinger and they really rocked. Kim Thayil's legs were soooo far apart!!

Never saw Nirvana unfortunately.

RE: damn
mikecane @ 2/11/2010 3:53:21 PM # Q
>>>Mike Cane can't have much time left on this planet...

God punishes those of us who despise this pit of shit with longevity.

RE: damn
abosco @ 2/11/2010 4:16:45 PM # M Q
Badmotorfinger was probably their best album. Chris Cornell is awesome, except for when he decides to do folksy and hip-hop songs. Then it's shit. I also liked him in Audioslave and the various supergroups. You guys ever listen to Mad Season or Temple of the Dog? ****ing incredible.

Rage Against the Machine was another incredible 90's band that has recently gotten back together for a few shows. I would love to see that.

Reply to this comment

Standing up for the brand in the face of bad news

Gekko @ 2/5/2010 4:58:46 PM # Q

Standing up for the brand in the face of bad news is exactly what loyal customers do in these types of situations, says evolutionary psychologist Vladas Griskevicius of the University of Minnesota. "The initial reaction is not to switch but to like your product even more," he said. "When you have a favorable idea of a product and you hear negative things, you get defensive and counter-argue it."
RE: Standing up for the brand in the face of bad news
SeldomVisitor @ 2/5/2010 5:14:08 PM # Q
== "...When you have a favorable idea of a product and you
== hear negative things, you get defensive and counter-argue it."

Nonsense,

Instead:

== "...When you have a favorable idea of a product and you
== hear negative things, you get defensive and attack those
== speaking the negative things."

Empirically proven in the comment thread immediately preceding this one.

Reply to this comment

Remember Pepper she loved her palm

e_tellurian @ 2/5/2010 10:15:02 PM # M Q
People like Pepper believed in Palm they went to bat stuck their necks out wanted to make Palm great let's not let Pepper down or people like her. Pepper had great ideas and offered fantastic feedback.

We have been through much together. This journey has created many friends. Friendships are made and cherished. Great thoughts are never forgotten and on the Net, if you know where to look, they are always their to review to help the memory appreciate the thoughtful people.

Peace,

E-T

RE: Remember Pepper she loved her palm
writerscramp @ 2/6/2010 7:34:35 AM # Q
`I speak severely to my boy,
I beat him when he sneezes;
For he can thoroughly enjoy
The pepper when he pleases!'
RE: Remember Pepper she loved her palm
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 8:17:31 AM # M Q
Pepper passed on in 2009. Lovely young girl.


I remember her telling me about how creeped out she was by abosco and how she had to stop posting at the Palm sites.

I loved my Pepper. Do you?

RE: Remember Pepper she loved her palm
e_tellurian @ 2/6/2010 9:50:49 AM # M Q
What do you mean by "passed on"?

Peace,

E-T

Reply to this comment

Eh.

mikecane @ 2/6/2010 7:26:27 AM # Q
Look, neither the Pre nor the Pixi are for me. I hope they're for *someone* and Palm sells well. We need another brand out there to offer an alternative to iPhone and Android. Because none of us know when those two will turn around and bite us in the ass.
Meh. I trust Apple and Google COMPLETELY
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 12:54:17 PM # M Q
Why don't you trust Mr. Jobs and those nice young boys at Google? Mr. Jobs seems just splendid in his jeans and black turtlenecks. Not a ruthless, predatory, cutthroat scumbag at all. Why, EVERYONE loves the man who singlehandedly took on and had his ass beat silly by Microsoft until they decided that they needed to keep a "competitor" around to keep the DoJ off Billy G's jock beat Microsoft, right?

And Google gives you so much stuff for free - so what if they can easily read your email, track your movements and listen to your phone conversations? And so what if Mr. Brin is the greatest Russian spy since... well... EVER?

Does Mike Cane like (to) RIM?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 1:02:44 PM # M Q
"Because none of us know when those two will turn around and bite us in the ass."

Since when would that be a bad thing for "Rimmer" Cane? Everyone knows which way you swing, Mike. Don't be ashamed of who you are. Embrace it. Lick it. Love it.

RE: Eh.
mikecane @ 2/6/2010 5:17:33 PM # Q
Of course you couldn't stay on-message.

Up those meds.

Must be hell to be unemployed. Shouldn't you be sending out resumes instead of wasting time posting here? I can't imagine your brilliance not being snapped up by someone.

Someone blind, that is.

Pizza box tower builder man Mike
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 7:42:07 PM # Q
What flavor microwave pizza tonight, Mike?

And what wine goes best with you dinner of choice?:
Thunderbird?
Mad Dog?
Night Train?
Wild Irish Rose?

Or will you splurge tonight and get some Everclear Rohypnol for you and your "roommate", Larry Garfield?

RE: Eh.
mikecane @ 2/11/2010 3:54:41 PM # Q
>>>Larry Garfield?

Dear god. Next you'll be reprinting crap you once posted at Palmstation.

Reply to this comment

I FINALLY saw someone with a Pre today!

Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 10:23:39 AM # M Q
One problem - it was in a Sprint Store and the person was returing it.


I switched from an unlocked GSM Centro to a sweet little128 MB Sprint Centro 2. Best phone on the market, but it's hard to find a Sprint Store that still has any now that the Centro 2 has been discontinued. (Maybe I should have asked Claüs for one but he might have tried to slip me a Roofie.) I went to the local Sprint Store to get a replacement stylus after I lost mine within a couple of weeks. While I was there an Angry Pre Customer (APC) returned his Pre, a.k.a. "this piece of **** phone". Since this rare Pre sighting occurred in a Sprint Store I'll leave it up to the judges to decide if it counts as being in the wild.


Where the hell are all theWebOS phones? I probably see a dozen iPhones every day, but Pre and Pixi are M.I.A., possibly K.I.A.

Reply to this comment

I FINALLY saw someone with a Pre today!

Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 10:25:37 AM # M Q
One problem - it was in a Sprint Store and the person was returing it.


I switched from an unlocked GSM Centro to a sweet little128 MB Sprint Centro 2. Best phone on the market, but it's hard to find a Sprint Store that still has any now that the Centro 2 has been discontinued. (Maybe I should have asked "Claus" for one but he might have tried to slip me a Roofie.) I went to the local Sprint Store to get a replacement stylus after I lost mine within a couple of weeks. While I was there an Angry Pre Customer (APC) returned his Pre, a.k.a. "this piece of **** phone". Since this rare Pre sighting occurred in a Sprint Store I'll leave it up to the judges to decide if it counts as being in the wild.


Where the hell are all theWebOS phones? I probably see a dozen iPhones every day, but Pre and Pixi are M.I.A., possibly K.I.A.

Reply to this comment

see the Pre regularly

whiteasianrose @ 2/6/2010 11:39:11 AM # Q
FJH, i am unsure where you live, maybe never never land but i see WebOS phones with regularity. obviously i'm not going to see them with the same frequency as an iphone (in fact no phone is as ubiquitous as that masterpiece of marketing and hipster cred is).

love seeing a fellow pre owner or two on the trains, waiting to dash across the street when the white man says walk, and around and about the City.

oh and just sayin, 8 months in, same Pre, no oreo, no drama:)

btw, nyc is where i reside

I see dead people
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 12:17:02 PM # M Q
I live in a city - The City - that Palm would expect to be their biggest market. NO Pres to be seen. iPhone on the other hand is everywhere. So ubiquitous in fact that we could soon see the same backlash against it that hurt the Motorola RAZR: too common to be cool. I think Jobs knows this + will soon add a new iPhone form factor when Verizon launches iPhone.

Everyone wants to look "cool" and impress with their phone (watch how people display their phones while watching to see if anyone is looking at them and how they constantly size up everyone else's phone). My cheapass 128 MB green Sprint Centro 2 probably attracts more interest and compliments than most people now get from lugging around their widebodied common as dirt iPhones. The Centro 2 is also the pefect size - it's the ONLY smartphone that can fit in that vestigial small front pocket in Levis jeans.

RE: see the Pre regularly
whiteasianrose @ 2/6/2010 12:55:55 PM # Q
sorry the only 'the City' that is The City is Manhattan. so unless you live here; try again. unless of course you live in staten island or queens and then you don't count

btw, watch out for testicular cancer if you keep your phone there;-)

btw, your posts are quite entertaining. the factual quotient is on par with the typical audience of the keith olbermann show. which is to say quite non-existant.

but entertaining nonetheless. i do get a good laugh out of them:)

Saw the Pre regularly until I took my meds again
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/6/2010 1:29:58 PM # M Q
"sorry the only 'the City' that is The City is Manhattan. so unless you live here; try again. unless of course you live in staten island or queens and then you don't count"

Why are East Coast people (and New Yawkers in particular) so clueless? Manhattan is NOT "The City". "The Dump" is probably still available as a nickname, though. Ask your omniscient Governor or your ethical Mayor for Life to make it official with a proclamation.

"btw, watch out for testicular cancer if you keep your phone there;-)"

Are you SURE that warning is relevant? Even though I have the biggest cohones around, last time I checked I was not at risk.

"btw, your posts are quite entertaining. the factual quotient is on par with the typical audience of the keith olbermann show. which is to say quite non-existant.
but entertaining nonetheless. i do get a good laugh out of them:)"


Do I amuse you? Do I amuse you?

Rachel Maddow is more my type. I doubt you've ever seen her, though - the polysyllabic nature of the conversation on her show would probably strain your brain beyond its capabilities.


FJH
- Proud Foleo user since 2007

RE: see the Pre regularly
mikecane @ 2/6/2010 5:15:30 PM # Q
He likes his words so much, he inflicts them on us twice.

Well, at least this:

>>>- Proud Foleo user since 2007

... made me laugh.

Reply to this comment

Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?

Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/7/2010 9:09:53 AM # Q
Face it: we can NEVER expect to get cutting edge hardware from Palm and unless they get bought out by Nokia soon. And they just don't have the money to develop WebOS into something capable of competing with Android or iPhone OS (or even WindowsMobile 7).

Those of us who have been with PalmOS from the beginning (hkklife my Pilot 1000 is looking at YOU) appreciate its simplicity, intuitiveness, speed, core PIM apps, as well as its numerous (thousands of) clever applications. There's no need to throw out all of these PalmOS benefits (the baby) with the comparatively ancient hardware that runs PalmOS (the bathwater).

We could easily have the best of both worlds: modern hardware and (as needed) access to PalmOS apps. An emulator from Access is the obvious solution. The PalmOS was designed for a 16 MHz Motorola Dragonball processor. The 312 MHz Intel XScale on my Sprint Centro 2 gives snappy response similar to an old overclocked monochrome PalmOS device. PalmOS on a 1.0 or 1.5 GHz Snapdragon processor would be insanely fast.

While PalmOS apps are great, because the platform is so old (almost 14 years) there are modern apps that do thing that no PalmOS app ever could. Eventually, there may be enough third party apps for more modern OSes that even PalmOS users are able to be satisfied with native app replacements. Until that time, we need a PalmOS emulator for a modern OS. If you'd be interested in a PalmOS emulator for Android, iPhone OS or Windows Mobile 7, let Access know in this thread. If you don't think an emulator is needed, feel free to post why here as well. Just don't go cryin' home to mama when you get another Good Old Tyme Palminfocenter Beatdown!

- FJH
Proud Foleo user since 2007

hkklife: would you buy a PalmOS emulator for $30?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/7/2010 9:46:53 AM # Q
What do you think would be a reasonable price for Access to sell a PalmOS emulator for Android/iPhone OS/ Windows Mobile 7? I think $30 would be a fair price, but how many takers do you think they'd get? Palm and its licensees sold what, over 40 million PalmOS devices? Would a million people buy an emulator? Would Microsoft or Google be willing to pay Access for rights to an emulator so that they could advertise that devices running their OS offer "The best of both worlds™"?

While I'm happy with my Sprint Centro 2 and have all of my app needs well covered with unique PalmOS apps, it would be nice to have the option to run those same apps on more modern hardware with, say a Droid-sized screen or a 5 MP camera, etc. Right now I carry the Centro 2 and a little Sony MP3 player (I hate the Centro's headset adapter). If we never end up getting a PalmOS emulator for Android etc I would probably drop the MP3 player and carry the Centro for apps and an Android/iPhone OS (if the new phone has a hardware keyboard)/Windows Mobile 7 phone for phone/web/text/camera. One thing that never got stressed enough is how good the Centro is as a PDA only. Even if you don't use it as a cell phone, for $100 - $125 you can now pick up a device that has a compact size, a decent keyboard, a fast processor, the final version of PalmOS and runs tens of thousands of apps. Turn off the cell phone radio and battery life is pretty decent. And if you have an unlocked GSM Centro you can still just pop in a pay as you go SIM card anytime and have a phone available for emergency use. Too bad the unlocked Centros are sold out everywhere.

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
SeldomVisitor @ 2/7/2010 9:54:34 AM # Q
Awhile back Palm (probably inadvertently) published the number of WinMob licenses they bought for a certain amount of money - the math worked out to, I believe I remember, $17/device.

That would be an upper bound on your price, IMHO.

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/7/2010 10:43:27 AM # Q
"So that's your solution? Beg Access to create an emulator for an abandoned platform on Android? I have a better idea. Buy an iPhone. The built-in calendar is weak, but it interfaces well with EAS. If you don't need Exchange, you can buy Pocket Informant and have it sync to Google Calendar. The reviews are very positive, the layout looks awesome, and it's $13."

Wow, you've really become quite the iPhone cheerleader. Did Steve Jobs give you an iMiniskirt and iPom-poms when you bought your iPhone?

iPhone PIM is pathetic, whereas on PalmOS it is superb. I'll take my DateBk 6 (or even the native PalmOS Calendar app) over what passes for PIM on iPhone. And the last time I looked at Pocket Informant for iPhone OS it was a convoluted mess.

"No more time spent hacking your way to software compatibility. No more fumbling with shitty SD cards. No more underpowered hardware."

Hacking? How dramatic. As Access, StyleTap and MotionApps have shown us, PalmOS emulators can get the job done with very little drama. As owners of PalmOS I would expect that creation of a stable PalmOS emulator for Android, etc would be a fairly trivial exercise for Access.

Fumbling with "shitty SD cadrs"? You're starting to sound like that dim Geko poster. Please cut the hyperbole and the histrionics. An SD card is typically inserted into the phone ONCE. SD cards are one of the MANY advantages that other phones have over iPhone, and you know it. So in typical iPhone Apologist manner you try to turn an iPhone weakness into an advantage. "It's not a bug, it's a feature!" Sorry, but your Steve Jobs Reality Distortion Field doesn't work unless it's spewed directly from His Steveness' slimy maw.

SD cards offer huge *expandable* storage, flexible backups and easy recovery to a new device. Fixed memory offers lower cost due to economies of scale for the phone manufacturer. SD is clearly the better choice unless you're a cash-strapped stalker/iPhone apologist/Steve Jobs fanboi.

If a PalmOS emulator was available for Android, etc, PalmOS users would have access to modern hardware. That's sort of the point of asking for an emulator, in case you didn't notice.

"For the record, I love love love the lack of external storage. My media library comfortably fits on 16 GB, and I don't have to worry about software recognizing content on the card, managing/carrying/losing several cards, or mixing them up. It's always on my phone. I know some people on here will bitch about not being able to carry all 200 GB of their library, but too ****ing bad. This solution works for 95% of people, and I'm one of them.

You "love love love the lack of external storage"??? Gosh. You appear to be suffering from a florid case of Steve Jobs-induced Stockholm syndrome (look it up). Limited storage is not, I repeat NOT a good thing. Suppose you go on an extended trip and want to carry along 5 or 6 movies and 500 extra songs. Say this now bumps you to needing 18 GB of memory to store it all. What's your solution? You listen to Master Steve and buy a second iPhone, right? Well done, Grasshopper. Operating Thetan VIII will soon be within your reach if you buy just 3 more iPhones (32 GB in 2010, 64 GB in 2011 and 128 GB in 2011). Too bad your world will end in 2012.

- FJH
PalmOS user and Apple troll debunker since 1996

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/7/2010 11:48:57 AM # Q
"Awhile back Palm (probably inadvertently) published the number of WinMob licenses they bought for a certain amount of money - the math worked out to, I believe I remember, $17/device.

That would be an upper bound on your price, IMHO."

Last I checked Microsoft sells OEM Windows 7 licenses to HP, Dell, etc. for a lot less than what it would cost an end user to buy a license from a retailer. $30 would probably be a fair price for Access to charge end users for an emulator, but the market would decide that.

Access' primary source of profits has been NetFront web browser (which has been used by numerous cell phones, Sony PSP, Sony CLIE and Amazon Kindle. Now that we're seeing powerful mobile processors like the 1.0 and 1.5 GHZ Snapdragon, NetFront is increasingly irrelevant. Full-featured browsers based on Safari, Firefox, Opera and Chrome will eventually bury NetFront and NetFront will mainly be licensed at low cost to inexpensive feature phones. Goodbye profits.

Since you are an ultra-keen (wee bit obsessed?) follower of all things Palm, you would also remember that Palm/PalmSource/name-du-jour was getting around $10/license for PalmOS. If you check your filing cabinet containing your well-thumbed printouts of every SEC filing that Palm has made in the past 10 years, I'm sure you'll find the exact figure. Furthermore, with that desperate deal that Access cut with Palm a while back, they now no longer receive ANYTHING from Palm for any future PalmOS licenses. Access is probably currently selling less than 100,000 licenses/year to the few remaining companies that offer PalmOS devices. In other words, with the spectacular failure or ALP OS (an incredible ZERO phones or PDAs ever sold running ALP OS despite two years of availability) Access' PalmOS IP is essentially worthless to their company. This is precisely why Palm was able to play hardball with Access over the licensing fees. Charging end users $30/license for an emulator would be a smart way to monetize IP that will soon otherwise be completely worthless. Access kept hoping that ALP OS would find its niche, so I assume they held off on releasing an emulator for a more popular platform because they were afraid that doing so would undermine one of ALP OS' main selling points: PalmOS compatibility. At this stage Access has nothing to lose and everything to wn by releasing as many PalmOS emulators as they can.


http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/7497/samsung-i800-alp-handset-cancelled-by-orange/

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
richf @ 2/7/2010 12:59:29 PM # Q
Yep, I'd pay good money for an Android emulator just to salvage the 4gb sd card I have filled with Palm stuff. That would pretty well complete my conversion after all these years on Palm.
Thanks
Rich
RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
abosco @ 2/7/2010 2:27:30 PM # Q
You say that, but I guarantee you have an 8 GB SD card sitting in your Centro that hasn't been removed in over six months. And usually, it's the same exact issue with the battery. "Whaa whaa, no removable battery. Whaa, what happens in five years when the battery starts to wear out?" Meanwhile, your battery hasn't been removed or swapped in a year, except in the case of device resets, which occur regularly.

Also, look at the stats again. The 3GS with 32 GB was available last year. This year's iPhone will have 64 GB (and iPod Touch 128 GB). Mine is 16 GB because it's pushing two years old.

Bottom line - I don't need a removable battery or removable storage. The fact is that I simply don't want to carry around a bulky second battery or some sort of case or man-purse to carry some flimsy SD cards. I'll opt for a ton of internal storage and as few moving parts as possible. And it looks like I'm not the only one who decided that I can get by without either of those features. 40 million + said the same thing.

You would look at potentially a few thousand people buying a Palm OS emulator for Android. At best. To get either company to develop it, license it, support it, etc is too much of a pain for them. They did it on Nokia and it didn't pay off. They probably won't do it again. Find another platform and learn to adapt.

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
hkklife @ 2/7/2010 4:08:03 PM # Q
Bosco;

Pal, much as I like ya, I beg to disagree with your comments there. Removable batteries and memory cards are good for power users who don't care what people think/say and carry around a spare battery or have a card filled with media and another one filled with apps (or whatever). For everyone else, they just leave the card in place.

Example: The Nexus One comes with a 4GB microSDHC card pre-installed. The Droid has 16GB pre-installed as does the BB Storm2. 95% of users will leave those cards in place and/or never even know they are there. But I could definitey myself popping in a 32GB card when they finally come out and prices drop a bit.

As far as removable batteries are concerned: With my Treo 755p, I've got two Seidio extended batteries and 2 stock Palm batteries for it. It's easier for me to get home in the late afternoon, pop a fresh Seidio battery out of the cradle and into the Treo (and start recharging the old one) then keep on going instead of having to sit there tethered to my desk or the DV plug in my car with the charger plugged in.

@FJH/Voice:

An emulator would be nice but at this stage of the game I've mostly been able to wean myself off of the bevy of useful/handy Palm OS apps I used to use and really only cling to the superb Palm OS PIM apps (partially due to semi-comparable apps being available for Android and also partially due to being able to do a lot of stuff on the web due to the Droid's solid browser)

Personally, by FAR the weakest aspects of the Android OS are the stock e-mail client, the calendar and the contacts app. These feeble, brain-dead equivalents are more akin to something you'd find on a dumbphone. The ancient old Palm m500 that you can get for $20 from Newegg destroys any Android or iPhone device for basic PIM efficiency and ease. This shortcoming has aggravated me daily over the past 3 months, so I'd pay anything (within reason, of course--say up to $50ish) to have 854x480-friendly ports of the classic Palm OS calendar and contacts. Memos would be nice as well, as there is inexplicably no single best Android memos app. If they sync with Gmail, fine. If not, that's fine too. Give me some kind of alternate cloud-based sync or a wired synchronization to my PC. Just give me the classic Palm OS PIM apps + a way to seamlessly migrate ALL of my contacts/events with ALL fields/notes intact into Android. I'm actually working on a PIC piece now that is not only a head to head comparison of the Droid vs. the Pre/Pre Plus but also my experience going from Garnet to Android.

Hell, I'd pay Palm $20 for a a "migration utility" to flawlessly move my 14 years of Palm OS PIM data over to Android! Companionlink has a $40 tool that works decently but still has a number of shortcomings.


Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
hkklife @ 2/7/2010 4:08:03 PM # Q
Bosco;

Pal, much as I like ya, I beg to disagree with your comments there. Removable batteries and memory cards are good for power users who don't care what people think/say and carry around a spare battery or have a card filled with media and another one filled with apps (or whatever). For everyone else, they just leave the card in place.

Example: The Nexus One comes with a 4GB microSDHC card pre-installed. The Droid has 16GB pre-installed as does the BB Storm2. 95% of users will leave those cards in place and/or never even know they are there. But I could definitey myself popping in a 32GB card when they finally come out and prices drop a bit.

As far as removable batteries are concerned: With my Treo 755p, I've got two Seidio extended batteries and 2 stock Palm batteries for it. It's easier for me to get home in the late afternoon, pop a fresh Seidio battery out of the cradle and into the Treo (and start recharging the old one) then keep on going instead of having to sit there tethered to my desk or the DV plug in my car with the charger plugged in.

@FJH/Voice:

An emulator would be nice but at this stage of the game I've mostly been able to wean myself off of the bevy of useful/handy Palm OS apps I used to use and really only cling to the superb Palm OS PIM apps (partially due to semi-comparable apps being available for Android and also partially due to being able to do a lot of stuff on the web due to the Droid's solid browser)

Personally, by FAR the weakest aspects of the Android OS are the stock e-mail client, the calendar and the contacts app. These feeble, brain-dead equivalents are more akin to something you'd find on a dumbphone. The ancient old Palm m500 that you can get for $20 from Newegg destroys any Android or iPhone device for basic PIM efficiency and ease. This shortcoming has aggravated me daily over the past 3 months, so I'd pay anything (within reason, of course--say up to $50ish) to have 854x480-friendly ports of the classic Palm OS calendar and contacts. Memos would be nice as well, as there is inexplicably no single best Android memos app. If they sync with Gmail, fine. If not, that's fine too. Give me some kind of alternate cloud-based sync or a wired synchronization to my PC. Just give me the classic Palm OS PIM apps + a way to seamlessly migrate ALL of my contacts/events with ALL fields/notes intact into Android. I'm actually working on a PIC piece now that is not only a head to head comparison of the Droid vs. the Pre/Pre Plus but also my experience going from Garnet to Android.

Hell, I'd pay Palm $20 for a a "migration utility" to flawlessly move my 14 years of Palm OS PIM data over to Android! Companionlink has a $40 tool that works decently but still has a number of shortcomings.


Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/7/2010 8:06:07 PM # Q
"You say that, but I guarantee you have an 8 GB SD card sitting in your Centro that hasn't been removed in over six months. And usually, it's the same exact issue with the battery. "Whaa whaa, no removable battery. Whaa, what happens in five years when the battery starts to wear out?" Meanwhile, your battery hasn't been removed or swapped in a year, except in the case of device resets, which occur regularly."

As usual, your assumptions are dead wrong. I used to have a 4GB card in my unlocked GSM Centro but got sick of having to carry around the stupid 2.5 mm headphone jack adapter and bought a small MP3 player instead. I just switched to a Sprint Centro 2 a couple of weeks ago and now use the 2 GB card preloaded with the Garmin XT GPS mapping software. I have over 200 apps on the Centro, but with 128 MB RAM I could easily run them all from RAM if I wanted to. That's the beauty of PalmOS: small, fast, efficient apps that simply get the job done.

I don't watch movies on my Centro, but if I did I would invest in a big SD card to hold everything. I also prefer to use a dedicated MP3 player so I don't run my phone battery down all the time. That's one of the problems with using your phone as a do-everything device: not only is convergence always a poor compromise but you also run the risk of your phone battery dying in the middle of the day. Of course those of us who are smart enough to demand phones with removable batteries can easily swap in a fresh battery whenever their battery dies. iPhone on the other hand remains a prisoner of its crappy battery life. I have two extra batteries - one at home and one in the car and unlike the typical iPhone fanboi I never have to worry about running out of power. I usually end up swapping the battery out a few times a week instead of waiting around for the phone to charge, hoping that it's been topped up enough to last the night.

"Also, look at the stats again. The 3GS with 32 GB was available last year. This year's iPhone will have 64 GB (and iPod Touch 128 GB). Mine is 16 GB because it's pushing two years old."

You'd better upgrade to 32 GB tomorow if you still want Master Steve to grant you Operating Thetan VIII status. What you STILL don't grasp is that fixed storage will always be a compromise, in which you sacrifice flexibility for price and simplicity. If you're cheap and simple you prefer the iPhone route for storage.

"Bottom line - I don't need a removable battery or removable storage. The fact is that I simply don't want to carry around a bulky second battery or some sort of case or man-purse to carry some flimsy SD cards. I'll opt for a ton of internal storage and as few moving parts as possible. And it looks like I'm not the only one who decided that I can get by without either of those features. 40 million + said the same thing."

Bottom line (lie?) is you made compromises, limited your options and now are trying in vain to rationalize your foolish decision.
- Extra battery doesn't need to be carried anywhere. Keep it in the car or at home or in the office.
- A microSD card is tiny; it can fit in a wallet without being noticed. In fact it can probably fit under the battery cover if you're so desperate to try to find an reason why carrying one could be inconvenient.
- If you think you need to carry a "man-purse" in order to carry a microSD card then it looks ike you've got some serious "issues".
- "flimsy SD cards"??? Flimsy? No, flimsy is your arguments here - not the SD cards
- How many "moving parts" do you think there are in a microSD card? Hmmmmm?
- And the perfect argument: 40 million other trendoids and Apple zombies bought iPhone, so it must be good, right? You need to go back to (this time a real) school, or at least buy a copy of "Logic for Dummies".

"You would look at potentially a few thousand people buying a Palm OS emulator for Android. At best. To get either company to develop it, license it, support it, etc is too much of a pain for them. They did it on Nokia and it didn't pay off. They probably won't do it again. Find another platform and learn to adapt."

I believe the market for an Android or iPhone OS PalmOS emulator could be huge. First of all, how many of the people who got suckered into buying a Pre would be willing to move over to better non-Palm hardware? Probably a lot. Then there is the large group currently using Treo 600, 650, 680, 700p, 755p and Centros that are looking to upgrade to a new OS. Then there is the (huge) group that have owned or currently own PalmOS PDAs at some stage over the past 14 years and would welcome the chance to relive the PalmOS app experience. If almost every gaming platform seen in the past 15 years has seen emulators being released it's only natural that there would be demand for emulation of PalmOS as well.

The PalmOS emulator for Nokia's Maemo was basically a proof of concept and was not exactly promoted by Access, probably because they weren't sure how best to monetize their PalmOS IP.

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/7/2010 9:25:49 PM # Q
"An emulator would be nice but at this stage of the game I've mostly been able to wean myself off of the bevy of useful/handy Palm OS apps I used to use and really only cling to the superb Palm OS PIM apps (partially due to semi-comparable apps being available for Android and also partially due to being able to do a lot of stuff on the web due to the Droid's solid browser)

Personally, by FAR the weakest aspects of the Android OS are the stock e-mail client, the calendar and the contacts app. These feeble, brain-dead equivalents are more akin to something you'd find on a dumbphone. The ancient old Palm m500 that you can get for $20 from Newegg destroys any Android or iPhone device for basic PIM efficiency and ease. This shortcoming has aggravated me daily over the past 3 months, so I'd pay anything (within reason, of course--say up to $50ish) to have 854x480-friendly ports of the classic Palm OS calendar and contacts. Memos would be nice as well, as there is inexplicably no single best Android memos app. If they sync with Gmail, fine. If not, that's fine too. Give me some kind of alternate cloud-based sync or a wired synchronization to my PC. Just give me the classic Palm OS PIM apps + a way to seamlessly migrate ALL of my contacts/events with ALL fields/notes intact into Android. I'm actually working on a PIC piece now that is not only a head to head comparison of the Droid vs. the Pre/Pre Plus but also my experience going from Garnet to Android.

Hell, I'd pay Palm $20 for a a "migration utility" to flawlessly move my 14 years of Palm OS PIM data over to Android! Companionlink has a $40 tool that works decently but still has a number of shortcomings."

I have so many good/unique PalmOS apps that I have no interest in starting from scrarch with another OS.The PIM alone is reason to stick with Palm. If you use a Droid look into getting a Centro for Calendar/DateBk 6, Memos, To Dos, email with Chatteremail, Contacts, favorite/unique PalmOS apps, and backup phone use. The Droid (or whatever modern phone you choose) can be used for everything else. Two devices, but at least a Centro is smaller than, say a TX and it gives you a backup to the Droid.

If you really want to migrate from the Droid why not just sync your PalmOS device to Outlook and then export the data from that?

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
abosco @ 2/8/2010 5:30:42 AM # M Q
So you say I'm dead wrong, then go on to say you don't swap SD cards because your content fits on 128 MB and your GPS maps fit on a 2 GB SD card. So I was... uhh... correct. By the way, my phone has TomTom maps & GPS loaded. I'm not putting SD cards in my wallet or finding some place to hide it. This isn't 1988 - it's not a Gameboy. I want all my stuff on my phone at all times.

Then you talk about batteries littered across your house and office to swap when you run out of power. You know what else you can litter everywhere? Chargers. One in the car, one in my office, one by the bed, etc. If the battery runs low at work, I sit it on the charger for an hour. And I haven't bought a single spare charger since they were all legacy iPod cables. Pretty simple.

And then finally, you questioned my education and credentials. Unfortunately, I graduated from an engineering school with a $1B+ endowment. Where do you get off making blind assumptions that I'm some poor grad making peanuts?

Reading is fundamental
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/8/2010 7:44:12 PM # Q
"So you say I'm dead wrong, then go on to say you don't swap SD cards because your content fits on 128 MB and your GPS maps fit on a 2 GB SD card. So I was... uhh... correct. By the way, my phone has TomTom maps & GPS loaded. I'm not putting SD cards in my wallet or finding some place to hide it. This isn't 1988 - it's not a Gameboy. I want all my stuff on my phone at all times."

What part of this statement went over your low-lying head? Perhaps if you mouth the words as you read them you will understand better:

"I don't watch movies on my Centro, but if I did I would invest in a big SD card to hold everything. I also prefer to use a dedicated MP3 player so I don't run my phone battery down all the time."

I'll repeat (I'll type this slower this time since I realize you can't read very quickly):

"I don't watch movies on my Centro, but if I did I would invest in a big SD card to hold everything. I also prefer to use a dedicated MP3 player so I don't run my phone battery down all the time."

Large storage is needed for multimedia - mainly video and MP3. The Centro has a 1.5 inch square screen and is a horrible MP3 player. Only a masochist would use enough multimedia to warrant > 8 GB cards on a Centro. Those of us who can afford more than one device know when to choose better specialized tools. You, on the other hand wouldn't think twice about wiping your ass with your iPhone and then brushing your teeth (tooth?) with it too, as long as Steve Jobs-approved iToiletPaper and iToothBrush apps were available in the App Store.

So you have GPS software on your iPhone? Who cares? Do you want a medal? In any event, TomTom sucks compared to Garmin.

Go ahead and keep everything on your phone. When it crashes and wipes out all of your data or when you get it stolen you'll wish you had a device that had swappable SD cards that could be used to quickly recover data or recreate data on a new phone.

"Then you talk about batteries littered across your house and office to swap when you run out of power. You know what else you can litter everywhere? Chargers. One in the car, one in my office, one by the bed, etc. If the battery runs low at work, I sit it on the charger for an hour. And I haven't bought a single spare charger since they were all legacy iPod cables. Pretty simple.

"Bateries littered across..." My my my... what a drama queenie you are! You STILL don't get it. Let me dumb it down a little for you:

(Me) Get home after work and see Centro battery almost empty. No problem. Pop out depleted battery, put it in a charger, put fresh battery in Centro, leave house.

(You) Get home after work (as Homer Simpsons's trainee at the Springfield nuclear power plant) and see iPhone battery almost empty. Big problem. Put iPhone in a charger, sit and wait until phone charged, captive (as usual) of stupid Apple design decisions. Rationalize not being able to go out by saying Steve "My Lord and Master" Jobs kindly did this on purpose to keep you from going out and spending money you don't have so that you could then be able to save up enough pennies to afford a 32 GB iPhone... someday.

"And then finally, you questioned my education and credentials. Unfortunately, I graduated from an engineering school with a $1B+ endowment. Where do you get off making blind assumptions that I'm some poor grad making peanuts?"

You're trying too hard, Kiddo. You're a nerd who tried to remake his high school persona once he got to university. You probabably went to a second tier engineering school, got mostly B's for 4 years and are now working as a low-level grunt making 50 grand a year with a nuclear energy company. Congratulations. But at least you have an iPhone, right? That will make up for everything else, right? Stick with kicking the dog and getting into tedious, pathetic, cry for help pissing contests with that Spambot E-T freak. You're so far out of your league it's actually kinda sad.

Given the lack of reading comprehension/deductive reasoning/logic you've displayed here it looks like they're not teaching "engineers" much at your precious alma mater. Was it an online "school"?

http://www.phoenix.edu/programs/degree-programs.html

Amazing. A (semi)honest Palm Apologist!
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/8/2010 9:45:03 PM # Q
"In fairness to these guys, Classic on my Pre is pretty slow to start up and tends to slow down the device when it is running and even after it has been closed. I often find myself resetting my Pre after running Classic just to clean up its memory so it will run at full speed.

This was not always the case. The early versions of Classic under webOS 1.1 was very fast and MotionApps openly bragged that the emulator was twice as fast as native PalmOS devices. webOS 1.3.1 however broke Classic causing horrible instability in both Classic and webOS itself. While webOS 1.3.5 fixed the stability problems with Classic it did not fix Classic's sluggishness. MotionApps has been pretty responsive with the community at Precentral and will probably eventually get Classic back up to speed. Like webOS itself, Classic is very much a work in progress.

Classic has two other problems besides sluggishness. It emulates the Centro and is thus unable to take full advantage of the Pre's 480x320 screen. MotionApps has been uncharacteristically vague with the reasons for why this is the case but I suspect that Classic is too dependent on the underlying webOS infrastructure which Palm has put in place (almost every webOS update also contains an update for Classic) and Palm simply does not want to devote too many resources to supporting Classic beyond allowing it to exist at all.

The second problem is that Classic relegates PalmOS applications to second class status under webOS. It is impossible to copy and paste between webOS apps and PalmOS apps and this makes Classic frustrating to use. Finally, PalmOS apps are trapped inside Classic and cannot be multitasked as cards like normal webOS apps.

While Classic is flawed and lacks the robustness that it had even three months ago, it is here and it is usable on Palm's webOS devices. PalmOS emulators running on Android or the iPhone by contrast are mere pipe dreams by disgruntled users. It is unlikely that Apple would ever allow a PalmOS emulator onto the iPhone. And the growing versions of Android hardware and software promise to make it even more difficult to port a PalmOS emulator onto Android than onto webOS."

WebOS is a slow as molasses in January, so it's appropriate that the Pre's 600 MHz TI OMAP CPU would run legacy PalmOS apps slower than a 16 MHz Motorola Dragongall.

The fact that Palm had to farm out the production of a PalmOS emulator to MotionApps when Palm has the source code is either the biggest indictment of how incompetent Palm's coders are or else is related to legal wrangling between Access and Palm about what they as a company could do with the source code.

Your words sum up the current situation rather well:
"Like webOS itself, Classic is very much a work in progress."

Unfortunately for Palm, beta OS + beta legacy app emulation + third rate hardware is not exactly a good strategy for taking on iPhone, Android, Rim, etc. If iPhone was to come out on Verizon and Sprint in July, 2010 who would keep buying Pre and Pixi? Anyone?

Palm is failing to emulate PalmOS properly because they smply ran out of time in developing WebOS and consider supporting people who bought the company's initial 40 MILLION devices to be unimportant. Just like how they chased off all of the developers by treating them like pond scum. After all these years Palm is still run by stupid, arrogant people who say one thing while they do something entirely different. Classic should have been a CORE part of WebOS and should have been ROCK SOLID from Day 1. The fact that over 6 months after the Pre's debut diehard Palm supporters who bought the Pre on faith are finding that Classic is destabilizing their phones tells us Palm doesn't give a rat's ass about its customers.

I don't expect a legal PalmOS emulator to ever show up on iPhone, but I'd actually be surprised if Access doesn't have a working PalmOS emulator for Android right now. That Maemo work wasn't all for naught. Bring it on!

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
e_tellurian @ 2/8/2010 10:27:16 PM # M Q
Did Palm forget about the people that build their company? Did they get distracted by trying to be like Apple that they forgot how good Palm is? Does classic Palm work with all new Palm products? Can a Palm Classic communicate with the new palm products?

Peace,

E-T

emulator
e_tellurian @ 2/8/2010 10:54:41 PM # M Q
RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
hkklife @ 2/8/2010 11:24:52 PM # Q
To address your questions:

-Did Palm forget about the people that build their company? Yes. They also forgot about the customers that built the company and kept them afloat through the dark years (ie 2004-2008).

-Did they get distracted by trying to be like Apple that they forgot how good Palm is? Not distracted, really, but they definitely made a (presumptuous) decision to ape Apple in nearly all facets of the "new" Palm, removable batteries and physical keyboards aside.

-Does classic Palm work with all new Palm products?
No, not unless you count the flaky Classic emulator for WebOS that's actually supported by MotionApps (please someone, remind me again why Palm ponied up for that perpetual Garnet license. And is it doing hem ANY good right now?

-Can a Palm Classic communicate with the new palm products? Not unless you count the aforementioned Classic. Palm DOES offer the nice gesture of their Data Transfer Assistant for exporting Palm Desktop PIM data to WebOS or Google. Of course, that is a one-time, one-way transfer. Palm still sadly has no way to view one's PIM data within the Palm Profile via a web browser.
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
e_tellurian @ 2/8/2010 11:55:33 PM # M Q
hkklife, thanks for answering my questions.

Peace,

E-T

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
rpa @ 2/9/2010 3:23:18 AM # Q
hkklife: I still use the Centro for the Garnet PIMs and the ability to sync with Outlook running on my desk top. That's all. Garnet has the best PDA functions which makes sense as this is where Palm started.

On the Pre, I saw Pocket Mirror on the Palm website that claims to be able to link the WebO/S PIMs to Outlook running on the desktop (via a wifi connection). Has any on here tried this? I don't want to use the Cloud as I travel internationally all the time and would be killed with roaming data charges (not to mention we don't run Exchange).

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
abosco @ 2/9/2010 6:26:38 AM # M Q
Like usual, your guesses are wrong and your numbers are off. Second-tier private schools don't have first-tier sized endowments, and specialized engineers in their field get paid a premium.

Enjoy the Centro. At least that removable battery comes in handy for how many times you need to reset it. Hey, did you ever get The Great Palm Swindle (TM) published? If not, you should put links to your comments in your signature again. Or do you just take them down and switch username when you turn out to be blatantly wrong?

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
BaalthazaaR @ 2/9/2010 7:32:21 AM # Q
rpa wrote:
I don't want to use the Cloud as I travel internationally all the time and would be killed with roaming data charges (not to mention we don't run Exchange).

I didn't think you had a choice if you used the Pre. I remember an article about it phoning home too.

RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/9/2010 8:21:10 AM # Q
Wouldn't it be funny if after all these years Dmitry Grinberg succeeded in making an Android-based PalmOS emulator and released it as a final F U to Palm?
RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
rpa @ 2/9/2010 3:02:51 PM # Q
All I want is a PIM application: contacts, calendar, notes, memos; that is as good as Garnet's, that syncs seamlessly to Outlook running on my desktop and enables me to keep my data on my phone and PC and not in the Cloud. I don't care what platform it runs on but would prefer Android due to the many hardware options available. I need an APPLICATION and not an EMULATOR.
RE: Would you buy a PalmOS emulator for Android or iPhone?
e_tellurian @ 2/9/2010 3:31:14 PM # M Q
Innovation will be North America and our allies equalizer as we work to create a vibrant economy that can afford original applications not only emulated ones.

Peace,

E-T

Reply to this comment

PalmOS emulator

Ed Lin @ 2/8/2010 2:15:47 AM # Q
You guys know there's a perfectly good set of Palm WebOS devices that run the PalmOS emulator "classic", right? I have yet to find a PalmOS app that I ran on my Centro that doesn't work on Classic, which is said to run 30,000 of the 50,000 PalmOS apps. (A larger number than Access's emulator on the Nokia N8x0.) If what you want is a modern phone with a PalmOS emulator, Palm is already making one, or four of them rather. (The Pixis will be able to run Classic soon too according to Motion Apps, if they don't already, if you're too cheap to spend the extra $70 to get the OMAP processor of the Pre.)

If I only read this Palm board, I swear I think I wouldn't know that Palm introduced a modern phone that answers most of the gripes you guys make. You're still complaining about PalmOS dragging the company down from not being updated, for crying out loud! News flash: it has been updated, it's called WebOS, and it works pretty darn well.

It's all about the hardware
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/8/2010 7:51:52 PM # Q
"You guys know there's a perfectly good set of Palm WebOS devices that run the PalmOS emulator "classic", right? I have yet to find a PalmOS app that I ran on my Centro that doesn't work on Classic, which is said to run 30,000 of the 50,000 PalmOS apps. (A larger number than Access's emulator on the Nokia N8x0.) If what you want is a modern phone with a PalmOS emulator, Palm is already making one, or four of them rather. (The Pixis will be able to run Classic soon too according to Motion Apps, if they don't already, if you're too cheap to spend the extra $70 to get the OMAP processor of the Pre.)

If I only read this Palm board, I swear I think I wouldn't know that Palm introduced a modern phone that answers most of the gripes you guys make. You're still complaining about PalmOS dragging the company down from not being updated, for crying out loud! News flash: it has been updated, it's called WebOS, and it works pretty darn well."

You do realize, of course that the problem is not WebOS. There are several perfectly reasonable modern mobile OSes out there of which WebOS is one. The problem is that Palm's hardware is crap. The whole point of getting an emulator for Android/iPhone OS/Windows Mobile 7 is to be able to run PalmOS apps on GOOD HARDWARE. Now do you understand?

Helloooooooooooooooooo?

RE: PalmOS emulator
LiveFaith @ 2/8/2010 8:04:54 PM # Q
Pretty good Ed.

All that needs to happen here is for the dev community to get released fully onto WebOS. Looks like Palm took the final step a month or so ago, opening it up officially to core access.

A robust Cal+Contacts+e-mail is certainly in the worx right now. Forget the rest. I'm getting the Pre+ the day it hits ATT. It won't do everything my 680 does outta the box, but the foundation is plenty large for a good future.
Pat Horne

RE: PalmOS emulator
hkklife @ 2/8/2010 8:13:46 PM # Q
Pat;

Please go to VZW store and fondle a Pre Plus first. Please be CERTAIN you can live with the annoying lag and the dumbed-down e-mail and PIM capabilities in comparison to your trusty 680. And the reduced-size keyboard too!
Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->Verizon Moto Droid

RE: PalmOS emulator
DarthRepublican @ 2/8/2010 8:56:50 PM # Q
Ed Lin wrote:
You guys know there's a perfectly good set of Palm WebOS devices that run the PalmOS emulator "classic", right? I have yet to find a PalmOS app that I ran on my Centro that doesn't work on Classic, which is said to run 30,000 of the 50,000 PalmOS apps. (A larger number than Access's emulator on the Nokia N8x0.) If what you want is a modern phone with a PalmOS emulator, Palm is already making one, or four of them rather. (The Pixis will be able to run Classic soon too according to Motion Apps, if they don't already, if you're too cheap to spend the extra $70 to get the OMAP processor of the Pre.)

If I only read this Palm board, I swear I think I wouldn't know that Palm introduced a modern phone that answers most of the gripes you guys make. You're still complaining about PalmOS dragging the company down from not being updated, for crying out loud! News flash: it has been updated, it's called WebOS, and it works pretty darn well.

In fairness to these guys, Classic on my Pre is pretty slow to start up and tends to slow down the device when it is running and even after it has been closed. I often find myself resetting my Pre after running Classic just to clean up its memory so it will run at full speed.

This was not always the case. The early versions of Classic under webOS 1.1 was very fast and MotionApps openly bragged that the emulator was twice as fast as native PalmOS devices. webOS 1.3.1 however broke Classic causing horrible instability in both Classic and webOS itself. While webOS 1.3.5 fixed the stability problems with Classic it did not fix Classic's sluggishness. MotionApps has been pretty responsive with the community at Precentral and will probably eventually get Classic back up to speed. Like webOS itself, Classic is very much a work in progress.

Classic has two other problems besides sluggishness. It emulates the Centro and is thus unable to take full advantage of the Pre's 480x320 screen. MotionApps has been uncharacteristically vague with the reasons for why this is the case but I suspect that Classic is too dependent on the underlying webOS infrastructure which Palm has put in place (almost every webOS update also contains an update for Classic) and Palm simply does not want to devote too many resources to supporting Classic beyond allowing it to exist at all.

The second problem is that Classic relegates PalmOS applications to second class status under webOS. It is impossible to copy and paste between webOS apps and PalmOS apps and this makes Classic frustrating to use. Finally, PalmOS apps are trapped inside Classic and cannot be multitasked as cards like normal webOS apps.

While Classic is flawed and lacks the robustness that it had even three months ago, it is here and it is usable on Palm's webOS devices. PalmOS emulators running on Android or the iPhone by contrast are mere pipe dreams by disgruntled users. It is unlikely that Apple would ever allow a PalmOS emulator onto the iPhone. And the growing versions of Android hardware and software promise to make it even more difficult to port a PalmOS emulator onto Android than onto webOS.
Palm Apologist
Shouting down the PIC Faithful Since 2009
Screw convergence
Palm III->Visor Deluxe->Visor Platinum->Visor Prism->Tungsten E->Palm LifeDrive->Palm TX->Palm Pre
Visor Pro+VisorPhone->Treo 180g->Treo 270->Treo 600->Treo 680->T-Mobile G1->Palm Pre
http://mind-grapes.blogspot.com/

Reply to this comment

Anyone remember a guy named David Schlesinger from Access?

Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/8/2010 10:03:26 PM # Q
Remember this guy, Schlesinger who used to come around here yapping about how Access was the biggest thing since sliced bread? All talk, it seems. Turns out the big bad wannabeYokozuna was nothing but a little Geisha girl. Does he still work for Access, or did they let go all of the baka gaijin once their stock price crashed last year?

The Access site is advertising the newest version of NetFront and it looks like they're still trying to figure out what to do with ALP OS. What a waste.

RE: Anyone remember a guy named David Schlesinger from Access?
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/9/2010 8:17:54 AM # Q
http://alp.access-company.com/news/events.html


Looks like he's still alive but is being sent out by Access to try and find a way to make ALP OS still relevant in 2010. Too bad the world passed Access by in 2008.

Time to turn the lights out on ALP OS.

Reply to this comment

PIC has degenerated to this?!

ssid12 @ 2/9/2010 1:36:29 AM # Q
Is this whats left of the once mighty PIC?
Nothing but trolls (FJH, E-tellurian, Gekko & a smattering of SV...)

I keep hoping things will turn around in the comments sections and people will post constructive reviews, ideas, but all that's left are people pining for a Palm Centro, while when it was launched these were the exact same people bashing the device saying it was too little too late.

I for one am ready to switch to a PrePlus once it comes out on a GSM network in the USA. The iphone is a good machine but after playing with a friends PrePlus I was blown away with the little sucker. Build quality looks good to me... and I don't know where this cheesecutter edge people keep talking about is.... and multi-tasking... nuff said.

I am sad to say there is a lot of misinformation on this website and I would recommend all those people who haven't bothered to see a PrePlus in action to actually go find a real working unit with homebrew apps to see the real power of WebOS... give it a whirl, then post your honest assessments of it.

I'm not saying that the Pre is the be all and end all, but if WebOS1.4 delivers what it says it will, then Palm has a very competitive phone in its hands. The future of WebOS is in the balance and I think we here on PiC should be supporting it, not knocking it. WebOS has the potential to really make a splash.

Personally, I would love to see Palm round out their portfolio to add two more devices/form factors, one with a large screen but no slide out keyboard for the aesthetes among us and dare I say it a tablet or iPad sized machine. Can you imagine WebOS on something like the iPad hardware....?! now that would be a homerun... as long as it has a webcam for videoconferencing and at least one damn USB port...or a video out (HDMI even perhaps...)...


RE: PIC has degenerated to this?!
nastebu @ 2/9/2010 1:49:47 AM # Q
There is a very positive review of the Pre plus six articles below this one.

PIC is kind of cranky, but being a Palm user nowadays would be pretty crankifying. I'm a very minor voice on this board, but I hang around because I do actually enjoy the snarking of the regulars, and I've learned a lot and had many questions answered here.

RE: PIC has degenerated to this?!
rpa @ 2/9/2010 3:34:59 AM # Q
ssid12: OK, OK...I'll try a Pre as soon as I can get an unlocked GSM version in Hong Kong.
RE: PIC has degenerated to this?!
Gekko @ 2/9/2010 4:01:17 PM # Q

ssid - nobody here knows you from adam. either you never post here or you're forgettable. bring value - then criticize.
RE: PIC has degenerated to this?!
Ed Lin @ 2/10/2010 1:17:33 AM # Q
@ssid12

Here here! Thanks for negating the nattering bobs of negativity. A lot of the build problems of the early Pres have been addressed by Palm with Pres built after (reportedly) October '09, and especially the Pre Plus which essentially solves them completely.

I think build is overrated, as long as the darn thing doesn't malfunction, and mine never developed the "oreo problem" or others reported on forums that typified early production models who cares if it isn't as "rugged" and macho as another smartphone? Oh, by the way, if you drop an iPhone and it lands glass side first, it'll break just as easily as a Palm Pre if not easier. Simple solution, don't drop your phone! Otherwise, Sprint/Nextel will be willing to sell you a "ruggedized" milspec dumbphone that can be run over by a car without breaking.

@Gekko

You? Ask about people bringing something of value here first before criticizing? Don't make me laugh! "My user number is lower than yours and I've been trolling longer" is the oldest troll in the book.

Complaining about complaining
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/10/2010 1:39:40 AM # M Q
Why is it that it's always the drive by first time posters that complain the loudest about other posters? Almost invariably these poster-bashers contribute NOTHING to the site. If you disagree with others here, debate them point by point. But please be advised that saying things like "build quality is overrated" in an effort to cover for the Pre's cheap construction immediately shows you to be a Palm apologist (or Astroturfing employee) with little objectivity. Well done, and oh so predictable.
RE: PIC has degenerated to this?!
Ed Lin @ 2/10/2010 8:57:28 AM # Q
The reason why they're contributing nothing to the site is because there is nothing here but negativity. As for how long you've been posting, "Fake Jeff Hawkins" isn't exactly the oldest nick here, though I suspect you're probably the outlet of one of the deranged regular's multiple personality disorder rather than a new participant. ;-)
RE: PIC has regenerated to this?!
Fake Jeff Hawkins @ 2/10/2010 6:36:32 PM # Q
:-O

???

RE: PIC has degenerated to this?!
mikecane @ 2/11/2010 3:58:04 PM # Q
>>>"My user number is lower than yours and I've been trolling longer" is the oldest troll in the book.

LMAO!! Hey, Gekko, has the face of a troll to prove it too!

Go on, Gek. Use that Centro camera and post a TwitPic of that face of yours. Go on. Don't make us have to go to a Post Office to see it.

Reply to this comment
Reply to this comment

false alarm

Ed Lin @ 2/11/2010 9:45:32 PM # M Q
It's Chinese New Year, that's why production stopped.
RE: false alarm
SeldomVisitor @ 2/12/2010 3:36:01 AM # Q
"False"?

No.

Palm indeed confirmed the OTR Global report lock, stock, and barrel.

They've shut down production for the month due to inventory overstock (that's what "manage inventory" means), when they restart production is unknown ("after Chinese New Years ends" is, believe it or not, rather ambiguous), and Palm itself said they were going to "ramp" up production whenever they did start production again rather than go immediately into full production.

At least, that's what their official words say.

The Me-Too Media is once a-GAIN =WIDELY= repeating the words from Engadget, in particular that wonderful word "debunk" that just sounds so...you know...hard and solid and complete!, without actually considering what the original report said and what Palm then said back.

False?

Debunked?

No.

Confirmed.


RE: false alarm
SeldomVisitor @ 2/12/2010 5:06:03 AM # Q
Minor aside - Palm did not say they stopped production completely in their response. Nor did they comment on the Pixi production at Compal.


RE: false alarm
Ed Lin @ 2/14/2010 6:22:07 PM # Q
Read what I said carefully, "False alarm", not "false report". I never denied that Palm was doing anything other than shutting down the factory for the Chinese New Year, did I?

IOW, to be alarmed about a factory not producing goods in China during the Chinese New Year is a false alarm, as nearly *all* factories do this, as confirmed by someone I know who's a textile manufacturing executive who travels frequently on business to PRC. Their factories are closed for the major Chinese holiday, so are Palm's.

RE: false alarm
SeldomVisitor @ 2/15/2010 3:48:21 AM # Q
Yeah, this is probably also the first time in history that an American customer of a Chinese factory told the factory to shut down production so their employees could have some time off.

We always knew Palm management had a heart o' gold!

RE: false alarm
BaalthazaaR @ 2/15/2010 9:57:18 AM # Q
SeldomVisitor wrote:
Yeah, this is probably also the first time in history that an American customer of a Chinese factory told the factory to shut down production so their employees could have some time off.

We always knew Palm management had a heart o' gold!

Our China office always shut down for Chinese New Year. It was rather frustrating since we had to wait for two weeks before we'd hear back from them.

RE: false alarm
Gekko @ 2/15/2010 11:48:22 AM # Q

how dare they take time off for the holiday! they are getting paid 64 cents an hour! i want my cheap chinese products and i want them now!!!
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