Comments on: Palm Opens Flagship Retail Store in Rockefeller Center
Palm today announced a new Palm Retail Store, its largest store to date. The new flagship store, located in historic Rockefeller Center and facing Radio City Music Hall, is offering customers who purchase any Treo smartphone between Dec. 11 and Dec. 17 a free Palm Z22 handheld.
The store will carry Palm's entire product portfolio of smartphones, handhelds, mobile managers and accessories, it will also feature live demonstrations and activations on three major U.S. carriers.
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What a colossal waste of money.
It would also be nice to see Palm integrate easy access to trial versions of software into its devices. A 16 MB SD card loaded with freeware/shareware and an HTML catalog describing the software could probably be completely underwritten by software developers. Why does Palm ignore the obvious?
TVoR
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
Palm m125 > Palm Zire 71 > Tapwave Zodiac 1 > Palm Zire 72 > Sharp Zaurus SL-C1000 + 4gb MicroDrive + Palm Tungsten T|3 (1100mah)
My T|3 is too [i]sexy[/i] for me.
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
Actually, in a week or so Palm will probably post their worst quarter in a long time. If they had wanted to burn through their dwindling cash reserves they could have just specced 128 MB RealRAM™ and a tiny rechargable backup battery for the Treo series instead of the CrapRAM they inflicted upon us. Old timers remember when Palm was about functionality instead of Yankowski-style gold-suited "flash". Those were the days...
In a few months we'll see an underwhelming tablet from Palm that has served only to waste precious resources that could have been put to better use improving Palm's Treo and traditional PDA lineups. Much like the Palm VII, VIIx and i705 (and LifeDrive) showed, Palm is utterly clueless when venturing beyond its traditional, narrowly-defined product circles.
Palm needs to get back to basics: PDAs and Treos.
TVoR
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
What a colossal waste of money, indeed.
===
Note - PALM has a new marketing firm, sufficiently new that they probably did NOT arrange this store, and a new Marketing SVP (though they have yet to announce him...if they're going to at all).
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
> quarter in a long time...
We already have a pretty good idea how PALM is going to do for the reported quarter - they pretty much told (warned) us about it already.
What's gonna catch people's breath, however (and IMHO of course), will be their guidance for the future for whatever guidance they care to give (*). They already told us at last time's earnings call that they are going to concentrate on getting marketshare and topline growth rather than trying to be profitable or make the bottomline look good. I personally think people didn't really pay attention to that (**). The free TREO 680s available all over the place ALREADY suggest they're trying to do that (and also suggest the 680's intro sales were rather underwhelming, eh?).
> ...In a few months we'll see an underwhelming tablet from Palm...
I think The Next Great Thing - that may be a significant SUBset of what Hawkins' had originally tried to sell to PALM management (***) - will be an entire system but MOSTLY server-side software that serves up applications to PALM's connected devices. As far as a "tablet" out of PALM it doesn't appear to be cost-effective for them to significantly out-do the Lifedrive - they can rehash it instead (and their TREO line) - to have the client-side software necessary to get the served applications.
Bill Coleman had to have been retained on the BoD for SOME reason, right?
============
(*) PALM has yet to say ONE peep about stock option backdating yet they are part of the entire uber-overloaded stock-option-granting Silicon Valley set. I personally, without any backup evidence, think they will HAVE to say SOMETHING about that soon rather than nothing at all - even "We're clean - forget about it!". If they're not clean, or even if they're not sure about how clean they are, then their guidance may be withheld. But we don't know one way or another due to total silence at this point.
(**) Because I think people didn't really pay attention when PALM unambiguously said "Future quarters are gonna take a hit" there could be some "interesting" stock price action regardless what PALM reports for the reported-quarter.
Another interesting thing about this earnings call will be the fact that there are significantly fewer shares "out there" so the earnings per share will be higher simply due to that - the Naive Herd may think the higher EPS represents much more than simple math taking place.
Yin and Yang with those two thoughts, eh?
(***) Hawkins stopped being CTO in February - was that because The Next Great Thing had moved far enough along that his "skills" were no longer necessary? Was it because Colligan said "Ok, that's it - you want too much; we're not gonna do it"?. Was it because he wanted to concentrate on Numenta? Why is he out? Is there even a Next Great Thing-associated reason?
Palm's server-side play
I think The Next Great Thing - that may be a significant SUBset of what Hawkins' had originally tried to sell to PALM management (***) - will be an entire system but MOSTLY server-side software that serves up applications to PALM's connected devices.
Smart man. Except for the first part: Hawkins is known for being the guy who tirelessly applies the "can we leave it out" principle. His drive is always for simplicity, not full-featuredness.
For those who missed it, I called the server-side piece of this product back in May: http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/8551/palms-open-secrets-exposed/ . Palm had job postings for server-side developers that mentioned "working with device engineers," "future applications and web services," experience with "embedded device component integration of server side applications" and working "very closely with Device architect to jointly make design and implementation decisions for the product being developed."
Bill Coleman had to have been retained on the BoD for SOME reason, right?
He's a good guy to have on the Board regardless. Still... http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8843/#123959
David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog
RE: What a colossal Voice of Reason
It is true Palm had a bad couple of quarters, but they do have new products and will be selling a great deal of Treo's in the coming quaters. As for the yet unreleased tablet, you are probably right, it will be a flop, however Palm's Treo sales will be fine.
Palm's STB™ Secret Third Business: a craptastic flop?
Actually, TVoR is the one who cuts throught the B.S. and presents the FACTS. Disagree? Then try to refute anything TVoR has said here. Too bad you can't refute the truth, Bubba. Keep covering your ears, closing your eyes and singing La-La-La! La-La-La!
For those who missed it, I called the server-side piece of this product back in May:
Are you patting yourself on the back, Beersy? ;-O Instead of a pat on the back, may I offer you a boot to the a**?
Actually, that was a clever bit of detective work you did. Did you also search through Hawkins' garbage in the back lane behind his house this Fall? If you did you'd see memos revealing tragic problems with the new tablet's OS stability. The Palm STB™ (Secret Third Business) has already proved to be a drain on the company both financially and in terms of wasting resources that could have been better served ensuring that Palm could field a more competetive lineup of devices in its current core businesses: PDAs and smartphones.
The STB will fail much like the Palm VII/VIIx did, and for similar reasons: it's an answer to a question no one is asking (and they're not asking it for a good reason). Paradigm shifts don't shift just because a desperate company WANTS them to shift. They shift because they make sense in ways that people previously couldn't understand.
Hawkins struck gold with the original Pilot and again with the brilliant Treo 600. Unfortunately, his final roll of the dice came up snake eyes, ironically at the precise moment when Palm could not afford any more mistakes. You win some, you lose some... At least he's managed to cash out a lot of his stock already. Thank Allah for those stock options, eh Jeffy?
TVoR
LA-LA-LA-LA-LA ;)
Keep covering your ears, closing your eyes and singing La-La-La! La-La-La!
WHAT WAS THAT, VOICE? CAN'T HEAR YOU..... ;)
Actually, that was a clever bit of detective work you did. Did you also search through Hawkins' garbage in the back lane behind his house this Fall? If you did you'd see memos revealing tragic problems with the new tablet's OS stability.
Ouch. That's not encouraging. Where'd that little tidbit come from?
Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
Are you patting yourself on the back...?
Is the pot calling the kettle black?
I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
Is the pot calling the kettle black
You calling me a kettle, boy?
:-)
David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
I think The Next Great Thing...will be an entire system but MOSTLY server-side software that serves up applications to PALM's connected devices.
Those who don't know their history are doomed to repeat it.
Is this not reinventing the wheel?
Is this not the often stated thin client model but for mobile devices?
Computers of the 60s were huge mainframes with many users accessing it via a terminal, a thin client if you wish. Computing really took off when the "terminal" became powerful enough and small enough to be useful in its own right.
Now we have UMPCs and mobile devices with the computing power, memory and storage capacity of a mid 90s desktop. It's not computing power which is holding back mobile devices but battery life.
Considering:
1) the overall failure of the concept with the VII and i705, which with web clipping depended on server side software to do the work.
2) Sun has had little success with its thin client concept: it appears most computer purchasers still want full computer power in a desktop/laptop.
3) Google have been providing free server-side software and has an estimated 400,000 servers at its disposable - far more than Palm can ever hope for.
then I doubt Palm dabbling with server-client concepts will be a fruitful enterprise.
but I do hope the third business is real and truly revolutionary.
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
You calling me a kettle, boy?
I dunno. Were you spouting off?
:=)
(The double-wide nose is because I am stuck home with a cold today and my nose feels about twice as thick as usual.)
Now quit wasting time here and finish digging into that OpenMoKo story over at MobiltyBeat. If that FIC Neo1973 phone really does everything they say, I'm living in exactly the right place to get my hands on one.
I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
:-)
What you talkin' 'bout, Willis?
[Beersy leaps out of the frying pan, into the fire...]
TVoR
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
"Plinx™". Buggy, slow Plinx™.
Unfortunately a 3 year old European CLIE TH55 running the best PalmOS productivity apps and Bluetoothed to an EVDO celphone makes infinitely more sense than the STB. TVoR predicts the STB will be DOA, i705/LifeDrive-style.
UMPC and tiny ultraportable Windows laptops make a lot more sense than the STB.
TVoR
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
Is this not the often stated thin client model but for mobile devices?
Almost certainly not. Palm said the product involves web services, not web sites or web applications. Think native applications running on the device with local storage and processing for offline use but with access to web services that leverage heavy processing power or quantities/types of data that could only reasonably be found on a server farm. There's a lot of room there to explore things that no one has tried yet.
hkklife wrote:
what sort of OS is the STB "tablet" running here?
Supposedly it's Linux. Of course that's all rumor at this time. I have it on pretty good information that it's not Palm OS. It may very well not even include Palm OS emulation, but now that Palm has the keys to the Garnet kingdom the odds of that being in there have improved, I would suppose.
TVoR loves to give the impression he has inside info from someone at Palm (by rehashing stuff he's heard other people speculate) but judging by his dismal track record and his, shall we say, "unfriendly" relationship to Palm, I think it's safe to say he pulls this stuff out of the same dark place he pulls everything he posts here.
twrock wrote:
BTW David, I saw your picture, and unless it was taken 25 years ago, there's no way you can refer to me as "boy".
How about "smelly old man," then? :-p
Just playin' with ya, Ron.
David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog
RE: What a colossal waste of money.
How about "smelly old man," then?
Since I'm on my fourth day of having a cold, sitting around in my pj's again, and haven't yet showered this morning, that would be accurate, boy.
I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
Beersy
Indider info? Moi?
Beersy, everything TVoR posts is either what TVoR has been advised by those who know or else predictions from TVoR. Unlike you, TVoR isn't afraid of telling it like it is. But please keep bashing TVoR in a (vain) attempt to ingratiate yourself with the Palm/PalmSource employees, Bubba.
As usual, TVoR's predictions are right on the money. Stay tuned for the TVoR "Predictions" article comming Real Soon Now.
TVoR
Server-side functionality rules!...with the carriers...
> of what Hawkins' had originally tried to sell to PALM management (***)
> - will be an entire system but MOSTLY server-side software that serves
> up applications to PALM's connected devices...
>
> ...Bill Coleman had to have been retained on the BoD for SOME reason, right?...
Now that carriers may have to unlock your phone on request (I don't have a link to that particular discussion - maybe it's not locked in cement yet) and jumping off of thoughts about the iPhone's functionality largely being offloaded into Cingular's servers, one could guess that the above-ramblings about The Next Great Thing may have strong interest at the carriers, eh?
Who needs locked phones when the software to run the phones is not on your phone but on the carrier's servers - and your phone goes REAL DUH-MB when you leave that carrier for another...
That's One Empty Store
RE: That's One Empty Store... Not
Have no idea what Nokia makes on their Chicago flagship store after paying their astronomical "Magnificent Mile" rent (if anything) but it wasn't their first suce store (that was in Moscow) and neither was it their last (a NY store was later opened just off 5th Ave).
I doubt that "empty" will be the first word that pops into a visitor's mind when they visit this new Palm store. I wouldn't be so sure that this doesn't make money for Palm, either, even if it's not primarily from sales made in the store itself.
David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog
RE: That's One Empty Store
Not really. I saw thier store in the Pittsburg airport last year. It has all of thier accessories, and was quite full of goods and swag as well. It was also quite full of customers.
RE: That's One Empty Store
But it's more about whether or not the store makes money. They want to intro new people to the 680 and their other products and this is a great way to do it... I've been to that part of New York City and it is one of the MOST crowded places I've ever seen in my life (kind of like the Ginza...) so I'm sure their strategy of luring people in to this location will be a big winner...
RE: That's One Empty Store
Piggyback
Palm could simply have a "piggyback" store here like the do for many other "Palm" stores. This simply means the store is really just a general "Cellular" store with 90% of the stuff in the store being all kinds of accessories and actually phones from other brands and the other 10% is Palm-branded products. It's much cheaper for Palm to simply piggyback this way and supply some additional signage and call it a "Palm Store". Much, much different model than an "Apple Store".
RE: Piggyback
According to this:
-- http://www.rebny.com/pdf_files/RetailReportSpring06.pdf
it cannot be cheap.
RE: Piggyback
#1 Dedicated "Palm only" kiosks, usually found in shopping malls. I'd imagine these are similar to Dell's "try before you buy" kiosks at nearly every upscale mall in the country.
#2 Real "stores" with actual square footage that are, as Gekko sais, 90% an overpriced cell phone + accessories (plus some random luggage etc) shop with promiment Palm branding & product placement. These store formats are what Palm puts in airport locations (at least the two I've seen).
This flagship store would be the first and really only one of its kind as an exclusive
At any rate, I think these retail stores are a gigantic waste of money that could be used to refine Palm's current product line and to invest into something--anything---new other than constant Treo 600 rehashes.
P.S.
TVoR may really onto something. But I'd go with mass-duplicated CDs instead of the still-pricey (relatively 16mb MMC cards.
In fact, Palm should have PILES of freebie CDs in cardboard sleeves positioned prominently at each one of these stores. Users could have the pick of several generic categories: "Productivity", "Multimedia", & "Games" for starters, and offer a mix of trial software with the added bonus of one subsidized full version app per disc. Heck even if it was an older title or so that'd be fine--just as long as it was compatible with the current crop of FrankenGarnet deviceso out there.
Most of the people I know (especially Treo owners) are either using their devices BONE-STOCK or have installed ONLY the apps from the Palm Desktop install CD (Solitaire, VersaMail, Palm Voice Dialing etc). This kind of a freebie would be an ideal way for Palm to get new software in the hands of neophyte users wherever they have a retail location.
Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P
Terrible Customer Service
No, the people at this store has zero interest in selling you a Treo 680. I guess they figure since they sell out it doesn't matter.
RE: Terrible Customer Service
Were the doors full of customers leaving with large bags full of merchandise?
Inquiring minds wanna know!
Giggle.
RE: Terrible Customer Service
Friday I was in probably around 11 am. Today I was in at around 9 am.
Maybe it gets crowded over the weekend.
Personally, I think the store looks a little empty. Not much sitting around to draw you in. If you're looking for a new Palm you can go there to check it out, but if you weren't planning on going there I'm not sure walking past anything would draw you in.
They need to have more accessories or something around.
Ok only terrible at the store itself...
No Treo 680 for you! Now GET OUT!
Friday I was in probably around 11 am. Today I was in at around 9 am.
Maybe it gets crowded over the weekend.
Personally, I think the store looks a little empty. Not much sitting around to draw you in. If you're looking for a new Palm you can go there to check it out, but if you weren't planning on going there I'm not sure walking past anything would draw you in.
They need to have more accessories or something around.
Brilliant. Another EXCELLENT return on Palm's investment money. Whoever came up with this and failed to ensure staff were eager to bend over backwards to satisfy the customers should be fired. The ONLY potential use for this kind of store is to advertise Palm and create a buzz about Palm's products. Video + catchy live demos, working phones demonstrating web/email/SMS apps, PDAs with apps like TCPMP and Pocket Tunes running would go a long way toward showing the average Joe/Joanne what Palm can do for them. Palm needed to replicate the Apple Store experience and even go one step further. Instead, we'll probably see what amounts to a bigger version of one of those retarded Palm airport stores staffed by more clueless, indifferent 20 year olds who look like they'd rather be working elsewhere.
Like I said: "What a colossal waste of money."
Any bets on how long this store will be around? TVoR chooses July 12 2007 in the Palm Rockefeller Center store deadpool.
TVoR
RE: Terrible Customer Service
> July 12 2007 in the Palm Rockefeller Center store deadpool...
Realistically speaking, I'd think their lease is longer than that.
MikeCon Reconnaissance Mission
Sounds like a job for MikeCon.
Don't forget your spy camera and notepad.
RE: MikeCon Reconnaissance Mission
"Don't you mean a reCON-AiSSance mission?"
In all seriousness...has anyone seen this store live & in person yet? How about a quick cellphone camera shot of the facade & the interior layout? Anything unusual or different here?
Palm could REALLY create a frenzy by releasing a really limited edition (black tie 680 anyone?) product EXCLUSIVELY through these stores/kiosks...and trying their best to ensure solid availability through these outlets. And, no, the candy colored Treo 680s already out don't count.
Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P
RE: MikeCon Reconnaissance Mission
But only among diehard TREO fans already.
That's PALM's =big= problems - their customers are those who know TREOs already.
RE: MikeCon Reconnaissance Mission
If I make it up that way again soon I'll try to snap a picture. Though if it is after I get my 680 it won't be very high-resolution. :/
RE: MikeCon Reconnaissance Mission
RE: MikeCon Reconnaissance Mission
Why does it always have to deteriorate to this?
I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
RE: Mike CANE Reconnaissance Mission
See if I can go there today.
But no camera lately. Accidentally sent the fekkin Casio Exilim through the washer and dryer TWICE.
As if once wasn't stupid enough... (it still worked after the first time!).
RE: MikeCon Reconnaissance Mission
Someone already did it.
Now I don't have to waste my time.
Plus, I'm sure they have a fekkin poster of me somewhere.
And all those cameras? Probably tied to facial recognition.
I set off alarms at the Nokia Store too.
http://mikecane.wordpress.com/2006/12/12/nokia-770-gets-shittier/
Palm Sunday
noone sees the irony of this? a palm store inside a giant skyscraper shaped similar to a C***.
then again "its not like we can work in caverns underground, up is the only way to build, but femanists would like you to believe we could all be like "yeah lets have lunch...... come up to the diamond shaped door between the two bushes, and knock twice, i work twenty floors down"
this is a good thing, word of mouth is the fastest and best advertising.
thats what she said!
RE: Palm Sunday
-- http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&z=17&ll=40.759521,-73.979906&spn=0.00716,0.014709&t=k&om=1
RE: Palm Sunday
thats what she said!
What did I tell you?
Gods don't kill people, people with gods kill people.
RE: What did I tell you?
Gods don't kill people, people with gods kill people.
RE: What did I tell you?
And it looks like the posts above under the "Terrible..." Subject were right on w.r.t. number of customers in the store (based off the just-posted photo article).
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NYC
Palm m125 > Palm Zire 71 > Tapwave Zodiac 1 > Palm Zire 72 > Sharp Zaurus SL-C1000 + 4gb MicroDrive + Palm Tungsten T|3 (1100mah)
My T|3 is too [i]sexy[/i] for me.