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Comments on: Palm Treo 680 Review

Palm Treo 680The Treo 680 is the fourth and final new Treo promised by Palm prior to the start of 2006. When it was announced it was billed by Palm as a lower cost, more affordable Treo. Palm has hopes that more customers migrate from the realms of feature phones and choose a Treo. To date price, complexity and the larger form factor of smartphones have held back most average users from choosing a smartphone. The Treo 680 addresses these points and debuts with the lowest introductory price of any new Treo smartphone.

Read on for the full review...

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$449 from cingular or $399 from Palm

neuron @ 12/4/2006 6:48:37 PM # Q
Let's see:
$449 from cingular, one color only and locked.

Palm.com
$399 with four colors, unlocked and $135 music pack free.

Can't image what kind of people will buy from cingular.

RE: $449 from cingular or $399 from Palm
bsquare @ 12/4/2006 10:21:05 PM # Q

What exactly does this "mobile music kit" provide? I can see where they are offering it at Palm.com, but don't see where it says what it includes. A small SD card of some sort and some crappy ear-buds? I'm not trying to justify the Cingular model in any way here, just curious. The locked Cingular version makes zero sense.

RE: $449 from cingular or $399 from Palm
neuron @ 12/4/2006 11:04:27 PM # Q
The music pack does worth at least $50~70

1. 1GB SD, at least $15 to $20 if you don't want to deal with rebate.

2. hybrid headphone, $25 at least, never be cheaper. There are some generic hybrid headphone, but the quality (esp echo) is just too bad.

3. Pocket Tune deluxe: $24.99 (for treo 680 owners to upgrade).

4. One month yahoo music pass ($0)

Reply to this comment

680 blah blah...

surfmaniac @ 12/4/2006 6:58:33 PM # Q
Looks like a winner to me. I don't think most normal cellphone users care about the more technical aspects,all they are going to see is a nicely packaged 'smartphone' that lets them do a hell of a lot more than most 'regular; cells, with a price tag pretty comparable.

And could sell big into Christmas,with those groovy colors (I know my 19 year old cousin was pretty stoked about the orange one...)


RE: 680 blah blah...
atrizzah @ 12/4/2006 10:25:52 PM # Q
I have to agree. It doesn't blow my mind or anything, but it also doesn't have any major achilles heels like most of Palms recent products. I just wish it could do Wi-Fi. Is there a sled for that, by any chance?

Peace Out
Alan
RE: 680 blah blah...
joad @ 12/5/2006 12:07:41 AM # Q
I corresponded with Enfora (the sledmakers) and they seemed to have no intentions of bringing out anything past the Treo 600 and 650 wifi sleds. Probably fell into the reality that many manufacturers find - Palm makes so many nonsensical cosmetic changes between models that third-party manufacturers get stuck with a lot of expensive unsold inventory that's basically written off once the "new models" come out.

And the more complicated the device - such as a wifi sled - the further out in the Palm product cycle the devices get released. In other words, by the time the manufacturer gets the bugs out of the manufacturing process and gets them into the retail chain, Palm has released a "new and improved" model that's incompatible with the device they just made. Heck, the Treo has an SDIO slot but can't even handle Palm's own wifi card (for whatever reason).

Once again, through it's ham-handed approaches, Palm seems to work as hard as it can to discourage the third-party innovators that made PalmPilots the incredibly useful device they are/were.

RE: 680 blah blah...
cervezas @ 12/5/2006 12:33:54 AM # Q
There's nothing "ham-handed" about the fact that none of the Treos has WiFi. It's 100% intentional and is the price that Palm and its customers pay the wireless carriers for the right to use their networks.

Do you think Nokia was "ham-handed" for oopsie-daisy "forgetting" to put the WiFi radios in the American Nokia E61 (a.k.a the E62)? Even the mighty Nokia must bow and pay tribute if they want their handsets to be sold by the US carriers.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: 680 blah blah...
freakout @ 12/5/2006 6:13:22 AM # Q
There is a good point to be made about the lack of SDIO wifi. Why are the Windows Treos allowed to have it but not the Palm ones? Is it a Garnet issue? Or do the carriers think no one will buy a WinMob device if it doesn't support wifi?

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650
RE: 680 blah blah...
jfme @ 12/5/2006 6:54:26 AM # Q
"There is a good point to be made about the lack of SDIO wifi. Why are the Windows Treos allowed to have it but not the Palm ones? Is it a Garnet issue? Or do the carriers think no one will buy a WinMob device if it doesn't support wifi?"

I think it is just a matter of taking the effort to write the drivers. After all the SDIO hardware support is there in the Treo 680.

Maybe it is not a good business case to get an extra $100 from Treo customers for the Wifi card. Because you know everyone will run to buy those cards if they are ever supported in Palm Treos.

RE: 680 blah blah...
cervezas @ 12/5/2006 10:40:42 AM # Q
I don't believe for a minute it's because Palm didn't want to take the time to write the drivers. I think it's more a question of market segmentation. The Windows Mobile Treos are overwhelmingly going to be used in corporate situations where the carriers recognize they are going to have to be flexible on the networks they will let companies use. The Palm OS Treos (esp the 680) are probably seen as more of a cross-over prosumer device where the network will be used for downloading music, video clips, and other content that the carriers want you to buy within their walled gardens rather than over your home WiFi Internet connection.

Whatever the logic is that dictated the decision, you can be assured that it was the carriers' logic, not Palm's.

For what it's worth, if you read the job descriptions at Palm.com there's "WiFi this" and "WiFi that" so I expect to see the picture change on the WiFi front before long. 'Course that could be for Palm's secret "Third Business" device that's supposed to be out next year.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: 680 blah blah...
jfme @ 12/5/2006 11:09:14 AM # Q
Cervezas,
I see your point. However, If the reason is "carrier" based, I wonder why they decided to leave T-Mobile out. They have a paid Wi-Fi service.

I wonder how long it will be until a Palm OS Genius comes up with the drivers. I am sure there are several hundred thousand Treo owners wanting Wi-Fi.


RE: 680 blah blah...
jfme @ 12/5/2006 11:21:19 AM # Q
Oh..and another thing

Is Cingular subsidising the Unlocked Treo 680 also?
Do they have that much control over Palm as to prevent them the support of their own wi-fi add on?

Wow...

RE: 680 blah blah...
cervezas @ 12/5/2006 11:31:39 AM # Q
jfme wrote:
Do they have that much control over Palm as to prevent them the support of their own wi-fi add on?

You could call it control, but it really just comes down to negotiation. Palm wants the carriers to subsidize their devices heavily and the carrier is naturally going to ask "what are you going to do to help us recoup our subsidy." If Palm comes back and says "well, we were thinking about releasing an unlocked version with a WiFi driver that will free Cingular customers from having to buy their music and video clips from your store and from having to buy premium data plans" how well do you think that plays with Cingular? Think they're going to give Palm the nice subsidy they're asking for?

Bottom line: Palm figures they'll get more customers by negotiating better carrier subsidies to bring the price to the customer down than by adding WiFi. My guess is that the number of people that decision upsets is probably less than the number of customers who are happy to see a sub-$200 price tag on the subsidized Treo 680. Sadly, (from our power-user perspective) it's probably a lot less.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: 680 blah blah...
cervezas @ 12/5/2006 11:43:53 AM # Q
As for T-Mobile, the reason they're taking a chance on the WiFi service is because they're the smallest network and they're looking for any kind of differentiation that will help them compensate. Of course, being small (and having a lot fewer subscribers) also gives them less leverage than Cingular or Verizon. Cingular may actually make deals with Palm, for example, under which Palm promises not to release a WiFi-enabled Treo for any other carrier for a certain period of time... in exchange, again, for a generous subsidy on Cingular's Palm handsets.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog
RE: 680 blah blah...
buckeyetex315-2 @ 12/5/2006 1:52:36 PM # Q
cervezas wrote:

You could call it control, but it really just comes down to negotiation. Palm wants the carriers to subsidize their devices heavily and the carrier is naturally going to ask "what are you going to do to help us recoup our subsidy."


Good business analysis as usual, David. Just look at the business models of (the "new") AT&T and Verizon or any other carrier for that matter and remember they're in business to make money even though we want to pay less all the time.

With the price per minute of even wireless voice dropping, the wireless carriers have to make money somehow and that somehow is wireless data. Even the price per MB of that service is dropping. For example, Cingular (soon to be AT&T Wireless again - what goes around comes around) has unlimited EDGE data plans for $39.99 per month. Seems it wasn't too long ago that posters on this site were complaining that data plans were at least 2 or 3 times that price per month.

As far as exclusive releases, that does happen. One of the carriers usually has at least one or two new phones a year before any other carrier gets them. The carriers have even more pull with smartphones - thus the different versions for different carriers. Some of it has to do with the differing mobile technologies, but some of it is just cosmetic - look at the color differences on the 700p between Sprint and Verizon.

Yeah, wireless carriers have a LOT of pull...

Brent


Palm Vx -----> LONG WAIT -----> Palm T|X

RE: 680 blah blah...
hkklife @ 12/5/2006 2:22:59 PM # Q
Don't kid yourselves, folks...Palm's definitely preventing wi-fi SDIO cards from working on their devices. And you can be assured that out of utter fear of the carriers Palm'll squash any efforts to get a hacked wi-fi SDIO driver working on any POS Treos.

The same "trembling with fear" rationale is why Palm disabled CDMA BT DUN functionality on their final few handhelds (LifeDrive & TX). They want to sell higher-margin, hevily subsidized Treos and the carriers (especially the 2 CDMA biggies Sprint & Verizon) want to sell overpriced data plans to recoup those subsidies as Beersie points out.

Remember, folks, the domestic CDMA market essentially operates in a vacum and does not follow the same technology, pricing, styling trends seen in GSM markets globally.

Prediction time again:
Assuming Palm doesn't get acquired in the next 3-6 months, the know they have to do something to expand their product line past a handful of similar-looking Treo handsets. Since Palm's shiiit-canned the PDA line, expect something like a data-centric Nokia 770-style cellular "tablet", likely sold in 2 flavors (a pricier wi-fi/BT hybrid version and a EVDO/BT "carrier" version). That way, by keeping this secret "3rd business" looking decidedly unlike a standard candybar or flip phone, Palm can pick some of the legacy PDA business while keeping the carriers (mostly) happy & not cannibalizing Treo sales too much. The "bring yer own connectivity" wi-fi/BT model can be targeted towards the folks like Mike Cane who refuse to sign up for a cellular contract and/or don't need any voice functionality at all.

All of this, of course, could basically be done within something like a regular Palm TX formfactor right now but it'd be too much work/cost for FrakenGarnet and, given the resolution limit of 320*480, not worth the effort. I predict that Palm is going 100% WinMob after the 680.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

RE: 680 blah blah...
SeldomVisitor @ 12/5/2006 3:16:35 PM # Q
I think PALM easily could come out with (*) a flip phone that's DUHmb and a boatload of other stuff that smartens it up - like a server that serves applications on the fly to it...or a separate camera (or set of cameras - like a head-mounted one, too!)...that all communicate together.

======

(*) That is, I could easily envision PALM coming out with these, not that PALM could do anything easily given their small size.

RE: 680 blah blah...
hkklife @ 12/5/2006 3:25:00 PM # Q
SV;

That's too logical a move for Palm. Also, aren't Palm rather terrified of being a content/software solutions provider? Their track record so far is the huge palm.net VII/i705 debacle and offering VersaMail 3.5 upgrades.

I proposed ages ago that Palm rebrand & remarket their remaining PDAs as "phone companions" instead of "PDAs" or "handhelds". They could then push those "phone companions" to folks that might have a particular need or want not met by the very limited Treo line.

For example, I really prefer a 320*480 screen, 128mb, and wi-fi. I had that a year ago on my TX but no Treo currently offers any of those particular features. So why can Palm not sell a $20 downloable "plugin" driver (tied to device hardware ID or Hotsync-ID specific) for the E2/LD/TX tailored for whatever type of BT-enabled cellular handset someone owns? Imagine the Phone Link software updated on a bi-weekly or monthly basis and marketed much more aggressively.

So if I own a CDMA handset with BT that supports the DUN profile, I pay my carrier to turn on EVDO tethering and then "buy" the driver/init string from Palm. That way everyone gets their share of the pie and I don't have to be saddled with a Treo's lackluster featureset. Right now I have a $80 voice plan on my Verizon dumbphone & a $55 data-only package on my Treo. I'd rather carry a sleek BT phone + a TX or a Zodiac instead of a Treo and a dumbphone if the monthly charges are going to be the same and I'm going to have to fumble with two devices anyway!

It's just classic Palm shortsightedness. They'd rather disble something like BT DUN and feign ignorance than try and make a few bucks off of it & offer solutions tailored to fit each user's needs.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

RE: 680 blah blah...
joad @ 12/5/2006 4:53:52 PM # Q
>There's nothing "ham-handed" about the fact that none of the Treos has WiFi.

I agree with you here, and if you are responding to my use of that term you'll see that I said the exact same thing: it's the carriers dictating the "no wifi."

My use of the word "ham-handed" referred to Palm making it extremely difficult for third-party manufacturers to effectively develop and innovate with the Palm hardware (sleds, etc.) because by the time any innovative hardware product gets tested and packaged Palm seems to release a "new" model that is unnecessarily incompatible with the new hardware. If you don't believe me, I've got probably a thousand dollars or so of prematurely obsolete Palm-intended modems, GPS devices, cables, sleds, chargers, cradles, batteries.... I guess we'll be throwing out many tons of 650/700 batteries soon, too if the 680 size takes hold.

If I can't afford to invest in Palm add-ons, you can bet that most innovative manufacturers who want to stay in business have walked away also. And Palm seems to have forgotten (or resents?) just how much value the third-party add-ons made their devices over the years.

Maybe you're right Beersey- could be it's not "ham-handedness" that has Palm chasing away innovators. Maybe they are doing it with intention.

Reply to this comment

Palm releasing inferior products yet again.

dcsmith77 @ 12/4/2006 8:21:46 PM # Q
I've had my treo 650 since it came out, and the 680 (The only palm device my carrier provides) is not an upgrade in any way. When I look at the competition (HTC TYTN, Q, hp 6915, Nokia n93 and 95) I see megapixel or 2 megapixel cameras (the nokia has a 5 megapixel camera) and integrated gps. I love palm os, and the idea of ALP has kept me waiting to buy a new phone, but it seems that palm just wants to dissappoint it's loyal customers. The 680 is nothing but a 650 refresh, and the 700 and 750 are marginally better. Meanwhile the windows mobile crowd gets better and better devices. Even the blackberry pearl is starting to look appealing as it at least has a megapixel camera. I stay with palm because of maybe 4 apps, but I don't know how much longer I'm willing to wait.

RE: Palm releasing inferior products yet again.
freakout @ 12/4/2006 9:34:00 PM # Q
(HTC TYTN, Q, hp 6915, Nokia n93 and 95) I see megapixel or 2 megapixel cameras (the nokia has a 5 megapixel camera) and integrated gps.

The TYTN is huge and does not have an exposed keyboard. (sliding is more comfortable to type on, but much less convenient...)
The Q does not have a touchscreen, runs the awful WinMob Smartphone edition and by all accounts has an even more anemic battery than most smartphones.
Neither of the Nokias have an exposed keyboard, nor a touchscreen.

The Treo has its own advantages.

680 is a big improvement over the 650
cervezas @ 12/4/2006 9:45:50 PM # Q
dcsmith wrote:
I've had my treo 650 since it came out, and the 680 (The only palm device my carrier provides) is not an upgrade in any way....

That's funny. I've gone back and forth between the 650 and 680 for the last 5 weeks and think the 680 is a surprising upgrade in almost every way. The extra memory is a godsend, the slimmer, lighter body has finally resulted in a Treo that is comfortably pocketable, the new Phone app is well thought out, the browser is much better, and it just looks good and feels great in your hand. The only thing I care about that is a slight let-down is the shorter battery life, and even that gets me easily through the heaviest usage days I've been able to throw at it. The thing you complain the most about--the fact that the camera is crappy--is the thing I wish they'd just leave out completely. Don't need it, don't want it, don't care whether it sucks or not.

Nice review, Ryan.

Oh, and by the way, a little bird told me over the weekend that Cingular changed their mind and will have the color Treo 680 after all.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Palm releasing inferior products yet again.
lacharlie @ 1/21/2007 9:38:16 PM # Q
I've had my new Palm 680 for 7 days now. It locked up the first day...second day...third day..fourth day...fifth day...sixth day and now after a hard reset it's locked in the "target screen." What I thought would be a blessing since I'm a realtor has turned out to be a business losing nightmare. This has to be the biggest piece of junk I've ever had the misfortune to buy.

Reply to this comment

dbcache = 24 MB / dbheap = 10 MB

jfme @ 12/4/2006 8:37:27 PM # Q
Nice...
RE: dbcache = 24 MB / dbheap = 10 MB
hkklife @ 12/5/2006 9:54:25 AM # Q
I'm still glad to see Palm improving the amount of cache/heap even in this so-called "budget" device. So that leaves the camera & the battery as the only major concessions/crippled features in comparison to all other Treos.

Once Seidio gets their extended 680 battery out, this thing will stomp all over the laggy, poor voice quality 700p.

If I wasn't shackled to Verizon for several reasons I'd definitely consider a 680. I still say this one should've come out 6-12 months ago as a more timely successor to the 650 but hey, it's the best realized Treo (especially bang for the buck) to date.



Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

RE: dbcache = 24 MB / dbheap = 10 MB
kidsdoc @ 12/11/2006 8:58:32 PM # Q
what does all that tech stuff mean ? Bottom line , will it make the 680 more stable and less crash prone than the 700p ?

Reply to this comment

Upgraded from 650 to 680

welzofstel @ 12/4/2006 8:36:01 PM # Q
I gotta say, I love this phone. I got a crimson unlocked 680 from Palm. I loved my Treo 650, so this purchase was purely out of curiousity more than anything. It's much lighter. Looks even better. The graphics display is much more appealing to me which I thought was just the opposite on the 650. I like that they removed the stubby attenna as well. Being a Mac user, Palm OS works perfectly for me. While Windows Mobiles may be getting MORE devices, I don't agree that any of them are better. But, then again...I'm really not much of a complainer when it comes to my gadgets. If they do what I want them to do, I'm good to go. I would have kept my 650 for another few years as it worked perfectly. Being a world traveler and performer, I stay connected no matter where I am. While they made this less expensive, I don't think they took away from any of the features. If you check the comparison chart, this phone has the same if not more features than the 650 and 700.

- Frank
RE: Upgraded from 650 to 680
buckeyetex315-2 @ 12/5/2006 12:26:35 PM # Q
Great review, Ryan. This new device almost has me convinced to converge and dump my TX. WiFi would be great though. At least it is available on the right carrier, although I would probably buy an unlocked one (yeah - Crimson is close to Scarlet - Ohio State - Go Bucks!).

Haven't had a chance to see one of the color ones in person yet. The colors seem to have a metallic sheen to them on the website. The color IS molded into the plastic and is not just an applique or coating similar to the disastrous Zire 72 blue finish, correct?

Brent

Palm Vx -----> LONG WAIT -----> Palm T|X

RE: Upgraded from 650 to 680
surfmaniac @ 12/6/2006 1:55:41 PM # Q
Yes, you're exactly right. Do yourself a favor and check it out in person, the pics don't come close to doing it justice. It's really a cool sleek little phone... it feels nice and solid and the colors are awesome...


The 680 is sweet! The battery is *awful*!
freakout @ 12/12/2006 4:19:52 AM # Q
The good:

Having spent my first full day with my delicious new Crimson 680, I'm in love all over again; ready to climb on to my roof and shout to the world my undying devotion to the sexy lil' smartphone that could. (I need to get out more.) The new form factor is gorgeous; despite sharing nearly the exact same dimensions as earlier Treos, it looks and feels much smaller than it looks. Almost like a toy! Lopping off the antenna made a huge difference, as did hiding the SD slot and the shrunken battery.

I love the new phone app, Blazer is heaps faster, phone reception is better, there's more RAM than I know what to do with, RealPlayer has been banished to the depths of Treo hell and apps like Coreplayer that used to choke my 650 and sometimes crash it now run with nary a squeak. Did I mention the lovely new form factor?

Finally, it retains all the old Treo favourites: smooth & simple one-handed navigation, the best SMS/MMS messaging app on the planet, the pretty & shiny little (and yet, paradoxically, big!) screen, excellent media integration, robust email capabilities, the oh-so-convenient silent switch and the 2.5mm headphone jack. Okay, so the headphone jack isn't a favourite. Ditch it already Palm.


The bad:

*The battery life is crap-tacular. I was expecting it to be worse than the 650, but perhaps not this much worse. My usual daily usage pattern on my 650 normally saw me getting home with 70-80% power left; with the 680 it was 35%. (This is with the screen set to about 70% brightness, Bluetooth off and Beam Receive off) If I didn't go home and went out instead (as I usually do a couple of nights a week), I'm not sure I'd be able to trust it to hold a charge.

I'm still reserving judgment for the moment. I was fiddling with a lot today - it was more interesting than doing work - so maybe I was burning it up more than I realised. And sometimes batteries need breaking in before you can get a real idea of their performance, so I'll see how it is another week or two from now before I decide if it's really that bad.

*I quite like the new phone app - it's prettier than the previous version - but they should hide the big tab buttons when you're browsing through your contacts; it kinda sucks that it can now only display 4-5 contacts on screen at once. But on the flip side, the integration of Contacts into the Phone app has made contacts searches much faster. And the method of shuffling your Favourites around - Option+Navigator - is ill-conceived. They should have kept the previous method.

*The stylus is strange. Like a little flexy toy with a plastic tip. It's much less professional-looking than the 650/700 stylii. But I like unprofessional, so it gets a tick in the end.

*TomTom 6 doesn't work on the 680, and nor does Softick Audio Gateway, although both apps are supposedly going to be updated within weeks, according to their respective support teams.

*I'm not sure if this is common to all 680s or just mine, but the red Power/End button is recessed further than the green Send/Answer button. Where the green key gives a definite little click when I press, the red one doesn't - there's practically no feedback at all and it's hard to tell you've actually pressed the button. Not sure if I just got a dud or if this is a conscious design decision to stop the power button being pressed while it's in your pocket. It's weird but I'm already used to it.


Bottom line: the 680 can confidently wear the crown previously held by the 650 as world's best smartphone. It will do anything you ask of it, then laugh at you, beat you up and show you how to do it better.

Except wifi.

Here's to the new Treo! Best. Smartphone. Yet.

And here's to Seidio's soon-to-be-booming line of extended batteries! ;)

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

Beta version of Profiles for 680
freakout @ 12/12/2006 3:35:09 PM # Q
RE: Upgraded from 650 to 680
hkklife @ 12/12/2006 3:40:15 PM # Q
Tim;

Great review. I agree that while the formfactor isn't a huge change, it's a substantial improvement in aesthetics and in feel from both the 700 series and the 650/600 series. What are you going to do with your old 650? Sell it or keep it as a backup?

I thought the 700w/p made a nice change from the 650 just by the improved buttons and slightly curvier edges. But the ungainly antenna detracted considerably from the other improvements. Now that Palm's basically perfected the 320*320 candybar Treo formfactor with the 680 (adding a 3.5mm headphone jack would be the only logical improvement) it's time to come out with something new.

How about, for 2007 at least one of the following:

A data-centric Tablet style wi-fi + cellular device (LifeDrive tablet w/ gigs of flash?), a voice-centric flip Treo (Samsung i550 style), and a 320*480 Treo (either a flip, a slider or a keyboard-less candybar) for the T3/T5/TX diehards?


Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

RE: Upgraded from 650 to 680
freakout @ 12/12/2006 7:07:00 PM # Q
I'm going to keep the 650 as a backup, I think. Back when I was trying to get my hands on a Black Tie 650 I had someone lined up to buy it, but they've since gone and bought a new Treo of their own, so I'll hang on to it now. Never know when you may need a backup phone/GPS/media player! (Although, Mum has been dropping hints all over the place she might like it for Christmas. She's really taken a shine to her Z22.)

A data-centric Tablet style wi-fi + cellular device (LifeDrive tablet w/ gigs of flash?), a voice-centric flip Treo (Samsung i550 style), and a 320*480 Treo (either a flip, a slider or a keyboard-less candybar) for the T3/T5/TX diehards?

I reckon that's exactly what Palm should be shooting for. With the 680/750 form the Treo 600-style has reached its pinnacle; now it's time for some real innovation!

If Palm only have the resources to launch 4 new models a year, that's still room enough for two new form factor devices and hardware upgrades to both the WinMob and Palm Treos. I'm very curious to see what they come up with next....

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

680 battery life not so bad after all
freakout @ 12/14/2006 2:50:49 AM # Q
I've had much better results from my 680 battery after the rather pathetic first-charge results I got. I now return home with 60-70%.

Seems the battery meter may just have been a little screwy - I deliberately ran the battery down to zero last night, after reading the Treocentral thread on the battery issues. When it got to 0%, it kept going for another 45 minutes! :O

I then charged it back to full, and I seem to be getting a much more accurate picture of the battery life. Just needed to give it a little time...

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

RE: Upgraded from 650 to 680
christop @ 2/7/2007 5:19:59 AM # Q
Thanks buddy,.. I'll try that. I have to agree the 680 is great as long as you can sort the battery issue. I'm on fumes by 3pm on a light call load.


Christo

Reply to this comment

Available where?

randyg @ 12/4/2006 9:43:41 PM # Q
I'm a little confused. You mention the unlocked versions are only available at Palm.com, but i was under the impression they were also available at the Palm retail stores.

RE: Available where?
surfmaniac @ 12/4/2006 10:18:15 PM # Q
They are in the stores. I went to the one here in LA and I have to say, they look cool as hell. And as I mentioned, I was with my young cousin (who's EXTREMELY style conscious) and she actually asked for one for Christmas...

who would've thunk it...

RE: Available where?
neuron @ 12/4/2006 11:09:39 PM # Q
How many cousines do you have? :)

RE: Available where?
surfmaniac @ 12/5/2006 2:51:39 PM # Q
Only one, and she's a knock out. If I can work something out w/her mother, she might be finding something nice and orange in her stocking this year... ;-)

Reply to this comment

Voice memos with handsfree?

jasla @ 12/5/2006 12:42:41 AM # Q
Does it allow to make vice memos with handsfree regardless if wired or bluetooh. I need to record voice memos when driving. Any info would be appreciated.

Thtanx

JaSla

RE: Voice memos with handsfree?
Ryan @ 12/5/2006 12:18:45 PM # Q
You can't use a bluetooth headset to record voice memos with the included palm program. I'm not sure if there are third party recording programs that would provide this feature, but it is a possibility. Anyone know?
Reply to this comment

Battery reset?

horaceho @ 12/5/2006 5:59:07 AM # Q
I was so excited about the Treo 680 release and wrote a new launcher for it.. but why it needs to pull the battery to reset?

Is it _that_ stable? ;-)

Treo Launcher, to be a better launcher.

RE: Battery reset?
cervezas @ 12/5/2006 10:05:10 AM # Q
Apparently the narrow area just to the side of the battery where they put the reset button on the 650 is occupied by something that didn't permit them to install a switch there. From the interior design of the enclosure it looks like they intended to have a reset button but changed their mind.

Truthfully, it's a little easier and faster to reset the device now, since you don't need to pull the stylus and fidget with finding the hole. You don't even have to remove the battery: you just tip up the left-hand side about a quarter of an inch and set it back down. Hard resets are much, much easier now, whereas it was kind of a gymnastic maneuver with the previous Treos. Maybe they just decided the whole reset button thing was unnecessary.

FWIW, in five weeks with the 680 I've only had to perform a reset once and that was because of a problem in some of my own software that I was developing.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Battery reset?
LiveFaith @ 1/5/2007 1:28:36 PM # Q
Treos are easier to pull out and replace the battery, than pulling out the stylus and tapping the reset and replacing the stylus anyway. Either way the Treo requires the battery door to be removed. Quite a hassle compared to the easy Tungsten resets.

Pat Horne
Reply to this comment

Snappy or Sluggish vs. the 650?

Gekko @ 12/5/2006 7:18:13 AM # Q

Or the same?

Also, is it more stable due to bigger dbcache and dbheap?



RE: Snappy or Sluggish vs. the 650?
hkklife @ 12/5/2006 9:51:54 AM # Q
Gekko;

The 700p has larger cache/heap/more ram than the 650 and it's far more sluggish than a patched "rev B" Treo 650.

I seem to recall reading on TreoCentral or so that the 680 is better than the 700p but still not as snappy as a debugged 650.

Aren't you still on Sprint? If so it's a moot point since I doubt we'll see another POS Treo past the 700p for any CDMA carrier.



Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

RE: Snappy or Sluggish vs. the 650?
Ryan @ 12/5/2006 12:17:26 PM # Q
I didn't notice any performance change compared to the 650.

There is extra memory but the processors are the same.

RE: Snappy or Sluggish vs. the 650?
hkklife @ 12/5/2006 2:20:28 PM # Q
Ryan;

Did you notice ANY lag on the 680 at all? From what you recall about the 700p you reviewed, did the 680 lag more, less or about the same as the 700p?

Was the much-criticized SMS lag/lockup present in the 680? That drives me nuts on the 700p...

Also, did you ever encounter the "white screen of death" when launching Blazer?
How about the delay when switching from an app into phone mode?


Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

Reply to this comment

680 Visibility

buckeyetex315-2 @ 12/5/2006 11:35:30 AM # Q
There is a nice writeup on the Treo 680 over at NetworkWorld.

http://www.networkworld.com/columnists/2006/120406cooltools.html?vo=1204voices1

Sure, this is an industry rag by geeks for geeks, but except for a few curmudgeonly souls, they have a love/love relationship with Microsoft. Any good press they come up with for PalmOS products is a plus to me.

Brent

Palm Vx -----> LONG WAIT -----> Palm T|X

Reply to this comment

Palm Treo 680

bquin @ 12/5/2006 4:30:42 PM # Q
does anyone know if it does dial-up networking out of the box?

can you buy it from Cingular and still get the $135 package?

Bquin
...laughing at a world too absurd to take seriously...

Reply to this comment

Oh yeah! 680 available in NZ soon....

Docta G @ 12/5/2006 5:30:38 PM # Q
The 680 has shown up on the NZ Palm homepage www.palm.com/nz

So my wait may be over soon. The price it shows up at remains to be seen, and no choice in colours, just the standard old "Treo Grey"!!

But then, beggars--or people on the other side of the world--can't be choosers!!

Reply to this comment

Palm won't repair your new Palm 680

magdyreda @ 12/6/2006 9:35:27 AM # Q
Hi, my new Palm 680 crashed and the screen is broken.
Palm Europe answered that they cannot repair or change it, even with my payment of €180 as requested, because the product is too new and they didn't plan any customer service at the moment..."please try again after Christmas"...they said!!!
The customer service manager was out during last 3 days and the gentle lady at the phone said that she couldn't help because nothing was yet planned or organized.
NOW, Palm is supposed to sell to business...what the hell is their business if they cannot even plan or organize post-selling assistance to their product?
How can business people trust a company that cannot even answer to a customer request of support?
They are not only selling smart phones but services and support...none of them is actually working here in Europe...
Bad Palm, really bad.
I pretend to have an asnwer from Palm because they cannot sell a product without customer support to it...bad Palm, really bad...trust is out of business for Palm, right?
Magdy Reda

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
cervezas @ 12/6/2006 9:42:48 AM # Q
I didn't realize the 680 had been released in Europe. Thanks for cluing me in, and good luck with your smashed screen. It sucks to be an early adopter sometimes, doesn't it?

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog
RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
ChiA @ 12/6/2006 12:00:18 PM # Q
Beersy said
I didn't realize the 680 had been released in Europe

I think there are certain regulars here who'd say it's only one of many things you don't realize...

It has been hinted at in previous posts and a quick visit to Palm's European stores is all you need to keep you informed.

Sadly this lack of support for a newly released product could be indicative of just how much further Palm has slid.

I'm in the UK (which for the sake of keeping Beersy informed, is one of the members of the European Union) and I've not seen any advertising whatsoever for the Treo 680 beyond Palm's own website.

The two most prominent UK mobile phone dealers - the Carphone Warehouse and Phones4u don't even stock Treos and have no plans to do so!

How will Joe and Joanne Public buy Treo 680s when they can't even see it exists!
Credit where credit's due - there's been some promotion of the 750 by Vodafone - it only goes to suggest that Palm is pushing Windows Mobile ahead of Palm.

Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital. Aaron Levenstein

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 12/6/2006 4:03:32 PM # Q
^^Apparently, you snooty Europeans aren't interested in PalmOS.

I'd say you're seeing more 750 ads 'cause Voda and MS are helping Palm to bankroll the ad campaign...

I'm nearly driven to tears by the disgrace that is Palm now.
ChiA @ 12/6/2006 7:04:15 PM # Q
you're seeing more 750 ads 'cause Voda and MS are helping Palm to bankroll the ad campaign

Therefore you're implying that Palm doesn't even have money to advertise its own products in a market where its competitors (i.e. Nokia, Motorola, Sony Ericsson etc) advertise everywhere: TV, press and billboards etc. Sony Ericsson have even used a travelling exhibition dedicated to showing off its Walkman mobiles.

12 months later people like you will come and say, "Oh look, those snooty Europeans aren't interested in the PalmOS 680".

Well Europeans, be they snooty or not, can't buy what they don't know about.

I only know of the Treo 680 because I've been a long-term fan of Palm OS, one who has remained a fan despite all the nonsense Palm and Palmsource have done over the previous three years.

This latest revelation about not having support for the Treo 680 in Europe is an absolute disgrace. I wonder why has this company sunk so low now? What on Earth has Palm's European R&D smartphone centre in Eire been up to for the past year? What's happened to the visionaries that gave us the original Pilot, the III series, the V and the T3?

I'm really beginning to despair for Palm.

So you want to be a guinea pig, huh?
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 12/6/2006 10:41:56 PM # Q
Beersy said
I didn't realize the 680 had been released in Europe

I think there are certain regulars here who'd say it's only one of many things you don't realize...


Ahhhhhh... the sweet sound of Beersy getting biotchslapped... again...

^^Apparently, you snooty Europeans aren't interested in PalmOS.

Is that the case, or are there simply no PalmOS phones that offer the features, value, stability, style and voice quality that would sell to "snooty Europeans"? And as ChiA Pet said, Palm's lack of an intelligent marketing strategy isn't exactly going to help them in Europe either. I predict now that Americans are finally starting to see some products from other manufacturers that compete with the Treo you'll soon be complaining about "snooty Americans" also shunning Treos. Don't blame the victim, Timmmmmay.


TVoR

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
magdyreda @ 12/7/2006 3:20:14 AM # Q
Wll, it is my fault about the broken screen and I'll pay to repair it...but at the phone Palm couldn't give any solution. The gentle lady was repeating that she couldn't help...no assistance whatsoever until next year. Actually she suggested to say that the Treo was already broken when I received it and ask Palm Store to replace it...do you consider a professional solution? And her boss, Francesco, was out for business and no directive was left to her.
And now they are suggesting not to phone anymore because the matter has been moved to another office.
I doubt you can sell a product without providing assistance to it.

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 12/7/2006 4:15:02 AM # Q
ChiA:
Therefore you're implying that Palm doesn't even have money to advertise its own products in a market where its competitors (i.e. Nokia, Motorola, Sony Ericsson etc) advertise everywhere: TV, press and billboards etc. Sony Ericsson have even used a travelling exhibition dedicated to showing off its Walkman mobiles.

Hehe - I won't just imply it, I'll acknowledge it as fact. Palm are a much smaller company than the phone giants you cited, we all know that. They simply don't have the resources to mount huge global ad campaigns, so their U.S.-centric marketing is quite understandable.

That said, Palm is still in business and selling their devices in spite of the marketing clout wielded by Big Handset and has been doing so for years, so I don't think they're going to have any trouble selling reasonable numbers of 680s. If the 750v is the hit that they're hoping it will be then maybe they'll have some extra cash in the piggy bank to promote the PalmOS which, judging from their new licensing agreement with Access, is going to be around for awhile yet.

This latest revelation about not having support for the Treo 680 in Europe is an absolute disgrace. I wonder why has this company sunk so low now? What on Earth has Palm's European R&D smartphone centre in Eire been up to for the past year? What's happened to the visionaries that gave us the original Pilot, the III series, the V and the T3?

It's one incident of crap customer service; does it really mean the entire company has sunk to a new low? The European R&D centre mainly works with carriers to ensure compatibility, from what I remember about the announcements, so I suppose we'll see the results of that once Voda's exclusive on the 750v is over. And those visionaries you mention are apparently working on an all-new device. Patience! (easy for me to say since I'm happy with the Treo...)

TVoR:
Is that the case, or are there simply no PalmOS phones that offer the features, value, stability, style and voice quality that would sell to "snooty Europeans"? And as ChiA Pet said, Palm's lack of an intelligent marketing strategy isn't exactly going to help them in Europe either. I predict now that Americans are finally starting to see some products from other manufacturers that compete with the Treo you'll soon be complaining about "snooty Americans" also shunning Treos. Don't blame the victim, Timmmmmay.

I think it's as ChiA said; people won't buy what they don't know about. The marketing here in Oz is definitely lacking, I know that much. But it's not just the Treo; Europe doesn't seem all that interested in PalmOS PDAs either. Since they're still market leaders in that area in the U.S. it seems to indicate to me that marketing is the main problem.

And I was just kidding with the "snooty Europeans" comments! It's a stupid stereotype that amuses me, like the image of every Aussie living in tin sheds in the desert wearing Akubras, drinking Fosters (probably our most putrid beer), spouting "G'day" and "mate" every ten seconds and "throwing shrimp on the barbie". We don't even call it shrimp, FFS! They're prawns!

Lighten up, dawgs. :P

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650

This Palm Europe Customer Service Incident is Inexcusable
ChiA @ 12/7/2006 1:04:20 PM # Q
It's one incident of crap customer service

Yea, just like tricky diicky Nixon and Watergate is one incident of crap behaviour in government.

This incident is bad enough; it's not as if Palm Europe has tens and tens of current products to keep track of and support, especially when it refuses to provide any support for older devices. Let's spell it out now:

Treo 650
Treo 680
Treo 750

Zire Z22
Tungsten E2
TX
Lifedrive (still listed on Palm UK's website but probably in all effect missing in action)

It's not exactly a list of the Complete Works of Shakespeare.
The Treo 680 had been in the pipeline for at least nine months and was announced two months back in October - more than ample time for briefing and preparing the customer service and support in Europe. Alternatively are you suggesting Palm Europe has released the 680 for sale in Europe without realising it needs to put support in place?

This is bad whichever way you cut it - either Palm Europe is terribly disorganized, can't afford to provide after-sales support or simply doesn't care once it's got customers' money.

Credit where credit is due though, the woman suggesting swapping the unit at the store, the most pragmatic approach seeing this lack of support and repair facilities. She sounds like a sensible woman who has to deal with the consequences of the poor planning by those who manage the company she works for. How long will she last before she says enough is enough?

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 12/8/2006 6:01:05 AM # Q
Yea, just like tricky diicky Nixon and Watergate is one incident of crap behaviour in government.

ROFL. Palm are not crooks!

Until recently I worked in a call centre. Slipups happen all the time, especially when you can't get through to the supervisor as this guy described. It's ridiculous that he was told there was no support planned and I would attribute it to a bad/inadequately informed CS rep rather than Palm having no support strategy in place for one of their products.

magdyreda, maybe these links will help. Here is Palm Europe's Treo 680 Support page, including Service & Repair:
http://euro.palm.com/europe/en/support/treo680.html

And here is a link to start a repair ticket:
https://www.euroservice.palm.com/repair_service/GBR/EE

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650

And for my next trick, closed quote tags!
freakout @ 12/8/2006 6:01:05 AM # Q
Yea, just like tricky diicky Nixon and Watergate is one incident of crap behaviour in government.

ROFL. Palm are not crooks!

Until recently I worked in a call centre. Slipups happen all the time, especially when you can't get through to the supervisor as this guy described. It's ridiculous that he was told there was no support planned and I would attribute it to a bad/inadequately informed CS rep rather than Palm having no support strategy in place for one of their products.

magdyreda, maybe these links will help. Here is Palm Europe's Treo 680 Support page, including Service & Repair:
http://euro.palm.com/europe/en/support/treo680.html

And here is a link to start a repair ticket:
https://www.euroservice.palm.com/repair_service/GBR/EE

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
cervezas @ 12/8/2006 1:33:19 PM # Q
ChiA wrote
I'm in the UK (which for the sake of keeping Beersy informed, is one of the members of the European Union)

I've heard of this "European Union" thing of which you speak. And I'm glad to hear you have smartphones over there. It sounds like you need 'em. ;-)

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
ChiA @ 12/9/2006 6:10:20 AM # Q
I'm glad to hear you have smartphones over there. It sounds like you need 'em.

God have mercy on us all if you ever left home without yours Beersy.

:-)

Not going to let that Palm Europe CS Rep off the hook so easily
ChiA @ 12/9/2006 6:14:10 AM # Q
I would attribute it to a bad/inadequately informed CS rep

What's that rep been doing to be so poorly informed? They've certainly not been reading Palminfocenter or indeed any Palm site!

How can it be such a demanding job to keep track of support for three smartphones or even just the latest model?

Even at an auto dealership competent salespeople will keep track of not only the latest model but its engine and interior options as well.

Sounds like some people need to get with the programme or even walk from Palm Europe. It's either a rep who can't be bothered or is incapable of keeping with the programme, or it's the manager(s) who don't have a programme to give.

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
cervezas @ 12/9/2006 1:58:56 PM # Q
God have mercy on us all if you ever left home without yours Beersy.

Naw, you guys would be fine without me for a few hours. I'd have a big mess of drivel to clean up when I got back online, but I'm used to that. ;-)


David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 12/10/2006 6:05:00 AM # Q
^^ It's official then: we award you the official title of PIC Janitor.

Mop's in the closet. :P

Find a cure for Beersy's verbal diarrhea. Donate now. Please.
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 12/11/2006 2:49:11 AM # Q
I'd have a big mess of drivel to clean up when I got back online, but I'm used to that. ;-)

Is this the drivel of which you speak?

www.pikesoft.com/blog

Given the copious amount of verbal diarrhea present at the site listed above, check here for someone in your area to call for help:

http://www.rotorooter.com/

TVoR

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
cervezas @ 12/11/2006 11:13:30 AM # Q
Your self-loathing is showing, again, Voice.

Poor little fella.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

Wow, Palm REALLY won't repair your new 680
freakout @ 1/6/2007 4:18:36 PM # Q
Much to my horror, my 680 has crapped out on me. After returning from holidays yesterday, I noticed that it didn't make those pleasant "do-do-DOO" sounds during HotSync. Sure enough, it seems that my headset jack is broken - nothing will play through the internal speakers anymore. Can't access the speakerphone controls during a call, can't play music, can't use the BT headset. The Treo thinks that the jack is still plugged in.

So I rang Palm and was informed by the (friendly but completely clueless) rep that it would probably be a few weeks before they would be able to repair it, and even longer than that if I wanted it replaced and that since it was still working with a headset that I should try and get by until they were ready to FIX THE PRODUCT I PAID THEM FOR. (emphasis mine... obviously)

Ridiculous! Looks like I'll be switching back to the 650 for a little while.

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

Looks like Timmmmmmmay got pwned by Palm
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 1/6/2007 7:14:55 PM # Q
Paid $700 getting someone to ship him a shiny new Treo 680, only to have it break a month later. Wow. So much for quality control in Palm's products.

Who's yer Daddy, Timmmmmmmmay? Ed Colligan. Say it!

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
twrock @ 1/6/2007 7:17:43 PM # Q
Disclaimer: this may have nothing to do with it, but....

I had a similar experience with my TX, headphone worked but no speaker after I took them out.

A fairly standard headphone jack has a physical switch that is disconnected when you insert a plug. I don't know if Palm devices do that or have some kind of "electronic" system of sensing the insertion of the headphones or just what they do to turn off the internal speaker. (I'd guess it is a little more complicated than just a single switch since the speaker can be silenced via hotsync plug circuity as well which relies on electronics, not a physical switch.)

In any case, since my TX was out of warranty, and since I was so frustrated with it already (because of the failing power switch and the failing digitizer), I gave it a serious whack on the desk and it started to work again. It's worked ever since.

You might consider that the problem is not physical as well. Maybe you could remove the battery for an extended length of time (in the hope that the circuits all discharge and return to their default state). I'm truly just guessing here, not saying that any of this will work.

YMMV. I can't recommend intentionally whacking your Treo and possibly cracking the screen or doing some other damage, but my son also used the "whack it" method to fix a very expensive Sony camera a few months ago when it had an apparently "software" problem.

I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
Thinking about Vista? Think again: http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 1/6/2007 8:16:42 PM # Q
TVoR:
Paid $700 getting someone to ship him a shiny new Treo 680, only to have it break a month later. Wow. So much for quality control in Palm's products.

Who's yer Daddy, Timmmmmmmmay? Ed Colligan. Say it!

Ed Colligan. Ed Colligan! ED COLLIGAN!!! ;)

And it was $550 USD in total: $399 for the Treo, $68 in shipping costs (since I took the opportunity to buy some new accessories too), $50 for the lovely Oriana (personal shopper) and a one-time $35 price for setting up my U.S. mailing address.

I must admit that this has dented my faith in Palm's quality control and support process. The CSR I spoke with said that stock shortages were responsible for the long delay. Specifically, he said that most of the inventory was earmarked for the carriers. But that still doesn't explain why they can't take it back for repair. I've emailed some questions to their Smartphone PR person about the stock shortages (which aren't noted by the online store) and also as to why they can't repair their new flagship product.

I'll do an article once I hear back from her.

twrock:
You might consider that the problem is not physical as well. Maybe you could remove the battery for an extended length of time (in the hope that the circuits all discharge and return to their default state). I'm truly just guessing here, not saying that any of this will work.

I tried both hard and soft resets, but it didn't do any good. The tried-and-true Smack The Damn Thing Method is normally all it takes, but not this time. It's really odd, because it's not like I was putting any unusual pressure on the jack so I don't see how it could be physically broken, but all the evidence points to that being the case.


Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
twrock @ 1/7/2007 12:46:26 AM # Q
Bummer. Then in that case, the only other suggestion I would make is to get a 6.8k ohm resistor and temporarily connect (a few seconds) then disconnect pins 10 and 8 (TXD to DGND) on the Athena connector (hotsync connector; I assume the 680 has a standard Athena connector, right?). That is how to trigger the recognition of an external audio device being connected and disconnected from your Treo. If that doesn't work, then it may well be hardware and you will have to do it Palm's way (i.e. waiting forever for the repair). If you want more technical details, I can PM them to you.

I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
Thinking about Vista? Think again: http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt
RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 1/7/2007 6:29:37 AM # Q
My Seidio Innodock cradle has an audio-out jack that works via the Athena port. I tried connecting and disconnecting the audio that way, but still no luck.

I'm trying to look on the bright side: maybe my replacement unit won't have a dodgy power button. ;)

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
twrock @ 1/7/2007 7:31:11 AM # Q
I'm trying to look on the bright side: maybe my replacement unit won't have a dodgy power button. ;)

I wish I had encouraging words on that front. However, in my own case, I'm on my fourth TX, having been yanked around by Palm Asia Pacific via their "replacement" unit system. Two of those units had faulty power buttons, the first and then this current one which is no longer under warranty (but I fixed by replacing the power switch myself).

I can only suggest that you choose to have it fixed instead of "exchanged" if you have that option. Otherwise you might end up with someone else's junk that Palm didn't really fix before sending it to you. YMMV, and I certainly hope it does!

I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
Thinking about Vista? Think again: http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt

Battered Palm Customers sharing their SAD tales of abuse
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 1/7/2007 1:41:11 PM # Q
Minutes from the weekly Battered Palm Customers (BPC) "healing circle" meeting:


1) The weekly Battered Palm Customers "healing circle" meeting is called to order by President-for-life hkklife.

2) Timmmmmmmmmmay shares his woeful tale of spending 12 hours trying in vain to get someone to buy a red Treo 680 + send it to him in Australia. Eventually, he is forced to pay "$550 USD in total: $399 for the Treo, $68 in shipping costs (since [he] took the opportunity to buy some new accessories too), $50 for the lovely Oriana (personal shopper) and a one-time $35 price for setting up [his] U.S. mailing address." THEN HIS TREO 680 BREAKS A MONTH LATER. AND PALM WON'T REPAIR IT ANY TIME SOON.

- How does this make you feel, Timmmmmmmmmmay? What would you like to say to Ed Colligan? Imagine this pillow was Ed Colligan's face. What would you like to do? Empower yourself, Timmmmmmmmmmay.

3) Timmmmmmmmmmay breaks down, admitting he has been pwned by Ed Colligan:

>>>Who's yer Daddy, Timmmmmmmmay? Ed Colligan. Say it!

Ed Colligan. Ed Colligan! ED COLLIGAN!!!;)

4) Lifetime member ("lifer"), twrock suggests Timmmmmmmmmmay try the "whack it" method to fix his 1 month old broken Treo 680, forgetting that Ed Colligan has already whacked off all over poor Timmmmmmmmmmay's face, bukkake-style.

5) twrock attempts to console Timmmmmmmmmmay by relating his own incredible tale of sticking with Palm despite years of savage abuse:
I had a similar experience with my TX, headphone worked but no speaker after I took them out.

In any case, since my TX was out of warranty, and since I was so frustrated with it already (because of the failing power switch and the failing digitizer), I gave it a serious whack on the desk.

However, in my own case, I'm on my fourth TX, having been yanked around by Palm Asia Pacific via their "replacement" unit system. Two of those units had faulty power buttons, the first and then this current one which is no longer under warranty (but I fixed by replacing the power switch myself).

6) New member (and embarassed Treo 700p victim), TVoR asks twrock why he keeps sticking with the abusive Palm, especially when kind, dependable, respectful and loving partners like the CLIE TH55 are still available if one looks hard enough.

7) twrock replies stating that he wants to give Palm "just one more chance" because he's sure Palm "really loves" him and he knows "everything's going to be different this time."

8) - 2,000,149) Several hundred thousand other Battered Palm Customers share their equally-sad tales of savage abuse by Ed "The Ripper" Colligan and his gang of thugs. 18,000 boxes of Kleenex are used. Oprah and Dr. Phil give a group hug and make constructive suggestions about how to deal with abusive relationships. TVoR makes constructive suggestions about how Oprah can deal with her eating disorder and how Dr. Phil can deal with his problem of having the most annoying dumba$$ drawl on the face of the Earth.

2,000,150) Meeting concludes with a cleansing bonfire of malfunctioning Palm hardware and the burning of Ed "The Ripper" Colligan in effigy.

Copyright 2007
TVoR, Inc.

Schadenfreude isn't good but:
ChiA @ 1/7/2007 3:43:55 PM # Q
Last month magdyreda complained of the lack of repair support received for his Treo 680:
http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9134/#127797

I said this was an appalling state of affairs and introduction for a new product, a sign of how low Palm has sunk:
http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9134/#127817
http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9134/#127890

to which freakout rather glibly replied:

It's one incident of crap customer service; does it really mean the entire company has sunk to a new low?

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9134/#127861

Well freakout now has a second example of crap customer service - this time he now has personal experience of just how "good" Palm's customer service has become!
http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9134/#128729

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
twrock @ 1/7/2007 7:24:49 PM # Q
6) New member (and embarassed Treo 700p victim), TVoR asks twrock why he keeps sticking with the abusive Palm, especially when kind, dependable, respectful and loving partners like the CLIE TH55 are still available if one looks hard enough.

7) twrock replies stating that he wants to give Palm "just one more chance" because he's sure Palm "really loves" him and he knows "everything's going to be different this time."

LOL. Funny stuff TVOR.

However, I should at least say that the TX was my first Palm unit that I truly thought had QC issues either in manufacturing (i.e. completely crap power switches in the first place) or in customer care (completely unacceptable repair/exchange program, at least in Asia). I have only owned three Palm branded units, so my experience is not as extensive as others. HandEra and Tapwave devices have been nothing but rock solid for me. (My Zod is my backup at this point for when the TX won't function any more.) I wish Palm could do the same considering they really are the only ones putting out PalmOS devices at this point.

Hey, even you got suckered into buying the 700p. So it can happen to the "best" of us, can't it?

I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
Thinking about Vista? Think again: http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 1/7/2007 8:06:51 PM # Q
ChiA
Well freakout now has a second example of crap customer service - this time he now has personal experience of just how "good" Palm's customer service has become!

Indeed. It's not very encouraging. I thought about it a bit this morning; it still makes no sense to me that they wouldn't take it back especially considering it's within the 90-day warranty period, so I'm wondering if my CSR was just a moron. When the phases of the moon and time zones permit tomorrow, I'm going to speak to a supervisor instead.

TVoR
2,000,150) Meeting concludes with a cleansing bonfire of malfunctioning Palm hardware and the burning of Ed "The Ripper" Colligan in effigy.

Why not just make it Palm's Support team instead? >:-)

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
hkklife @ 1/7/2007 8:28:16 PM # Q
Tim;

Do ya remember when I asked you, oh, 2 months or so ago what you were gonna do with your old 650 now that the 680 had arrived? And recall that you told me you were NOT going to sell it and instead keep it around as a backup? To which I replied with something like, "Probably a good idea given the notorious reliability issues with recent Palm devices"

I bet you're feeling very relieved that the ol' 650 is still around!

Yet another example of the drawback of too much convergence: if it goes out, then you're totally out of luck phone-wise. Understandly, CDMA users here stateside are much worse off than GSM users everywhere else in the world, because at least y'all can just pop a SIM card into a backup device and keep on talking.

Is the 680 your primary phone?


Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 1/7/2007 9:24:21 PM # Q
It was my primary phone. I've since switched back to the 650 and yes, I'm very glad I didn't sell it off. It's very hard to do after toting the 680 for a week; it feels and looks like so much more of an ungainly brick to me now...

And yes, SIM swapping is the best thing for consumer choice in phones since number portability. You should consider switching to GSM once you're contract's up hk: as a bonus you'll be able to use your Treo overseas on the notoriously drunken, sex-crazed PIC press junkets. ;)

Treo 680 life expectancy = 3 WEEKS??? Good value.
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 1/8/2007 12:43:23 AM # Q
Well I re-read this thread and it looks like Timmmmmmmay got his Treo 680 on December 10 or 11. It died before January 6, taking his innocence with it. Now he knows how hkklife and I feel about our Treo 700p experiences. Palm keeps rleasing sh1tty hardware and taking advantage of the very people that previously were the company's biggest advocates. I wonder how many word of mouth sales have been lost by Palm because power users have been burned by its poorly-made hardware in recent years. It's a shame, but I recently recommended AGAINST a very large purchase of Treos by my company. I know several other PalmOS-favoring power users that have recommended Windows Mobile and Blackberry hardware for their companies after seeing (and being personally burned by) the lackluster hardware Palm is now spewing out. Samsung, RIM, etc. may end up winning not because they are inherently superior, but simply because Palm is incapable of offering a stable, reliable smartphone device. Pathetic.

TVoR

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 1/8/2007 7:18:19 AM # Q
Well, my 650 was a real trooper, so I'm not ready to completely write off Palm's QC. I wonder if Inventec are perhaps not as reliable manufacturers as HTC?

I'll wait and see if my repaired/replacement 680 has any problems. THEN I'll join the mob with the pitchforks and flaming torches. ;)

Mobs are fun™. Pitchforks, flaming torches! Right here, folks!
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 1/8/2007 2:39:14 PM # Q
I'll wait and see if my repaired/replacement 680 has any problems. THEN I'll join the mob with the pitchforks and flaming torches. ;)

I'll save you a pitchfork. Flaming torches are $12.99 each, two for $20.

TVoR

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
freakout @ 1/8/2007 6:22:10 PM # Q
(freakout inches closer to the pitchfork...)

Update: This time around, I called the Palm Store rather than the useless tech support people. Angie was more than happy to issue me with a return number as it was within the 30-day purchase period when it died, but the kicker? They can't just send me a replacement: they're going to have to refund the money and THEN I'll have to order a new 680.

Of course, this wouldn't be a problem, save for the fact that it wasn't purchased on my credit card but rather my personal shopper's. Why oh WHY can't they just accept international credit cards?* I'm tired of jumping through hoops... I'm almost tempted to get one of my electronics-geek friends to crack it open for me and see if they can have a go at it.


*Okay, I know why, but it still vexes me. It's probably because their US prices are a lot better than their overseas prices. For instance, it's $799 to buy an unlocked 680 in Snooze-tastic Graphite here, whereas for $399 USD (or $510 AUD) you can get an unlocked 680 from the US in your choice of colour AND the mobile music bundle. If people were given a choice, who in their right mind would purchase from anywhere else?

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

Palm won't repair your new Palm 680, but maybe they don't need to
freakout @ 1/10/2007 7:24:25 PM # Q
Took my 680 out with me last night for dinner and had it hooked up to the car charger on the way. One last hurrah before I shipped it to the Home for Sick Palms. When I got out of the car, I noticed (much to my delight) it was making noises again!

I'm embarassed to admit I had nothing better to do than sit in the car later that night, plugging and unplugging both the car charger and the audio jack, trying to isolate what had caused this. It appears the 680 has a bug where disconnecting the charger before the audio jack can cause the audio-out to become permanently fixed to 'on'. I was able to replicate it twice, and then fix it by disconnecting first the audio, then the charger.

Bizarre. Can anyone else replicate this?

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

RE: Palm won't repair your new Palm 680
twrock @ 1/11/2007 1:14:45 AM # Q
I can't replicate it since I don't have a 680, but this is the "kind of thing" that my TX has done. However, my first experience of that was back when I was testing for how to get sound out of the Athena port. I led me to believe that some of what would appear to be "hardware" problems (i.e. physical on/off switches) with Palm devices could be due to something being wrong with a transistor (?) being set incorrectly. (Excuse my ignorance of correct eletronic terms.) If you could somehow figure out how to get it to reset, you'd be back in business. Seems you accidentally figured it out similar to how I accidentally got my TX to "reset" as well. But it sounds like you know what steps you took, whereas I don't know what it was. Congrats! I hope it stays fixed.

I'm still waiting for the mythical color HandEra.
Thinking about Vista? Think again: http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt
Reply to this comment

All being said...

ChiA @ 12/6/2006 7:27:24 PM # Q
I do like the 680, it's an improvement but definitely evolution rather than revolution.

The thing is that there are so many companies coming out with handsets with the treo-style factor but with extra features.

All being said, I like (what's left of) the Palm OS so I probably will get a Treo 680, it ticks most but by no means all of my boxes.

RE: All being said...
cervezas @ 12/9/2006 2:11:04 PM # Q
I think what surprises me is how these small, evolutionary changes have accumulated into something that--as a whole--is so much better. As I've said before, I've never been a big Treo fanatic, but for the first time I'm actually falling for this little guy.

The battery life thing is an annoyance, I admit. I can't always count on two days, so to be safe I really have to remember to charge every night or keep an extra battery in my bag as insurance. Regardless, Palm finally crossed the size/weight threshold where it's comfortable (and unobtrusive) to carry a Treo in your pants pocket, and that's made a big difference.


David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: All being said...
freakout @ 12/9/2006 8:23:40 PM # Q
I think what surprises me is how these small, evolutionary changes have accumulated into something that--as a whole--is so much better. As I've said before, I've never been a big Treo fanatic, but for the first time I'm actually falling for this little guy.

Hehe. (knowing smile, zombie-cult voice) Join the Treonauts, David. Join us!

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

Reply to this comment

Versamail not working with Yahoo!

joelforman @ 12/13/2006 5:22:52 PM # Q
I have not been able to get Versamail to grab my yahoo mail. I have the Yahoo mail plus service and Snappermail works fine. I called Palm and they told me they were aware of this issue and were working on a fix for Jan or Feb. They also confirmed that there was an issue with bluetooth hotsync with a Mac (I have a powerbook G4); I have not been able to get this to work either.

I like Snapper but they have a problem with my corporate Goodlink that hijacks the contacts app and you are unable to pull addresses into snappermail from the good contact app. Versamail works just fine with Good but can't talk to yahoo.

I am forced to use snapper for Yahoo (but have to manually enter email addresses), Good for my corporate email, and Versamail for my Mac mail (works fine with .mac and with goodcontacts). I guess this is what I get as an early adopter.

Despite these quirks, the 680 is really the device I have been looking for for ages due to it's adequate memory (hold all my medical apps and references (PalmOS based), excellent phone functionality, compatibility with my corporate (Hospital) email via Good (finally supported in the last several months), reasonable price point (I got the crimson unlocked version to use with T-Mobile), and great music player (itunes with 1gb SD holds enough musit to suit me).

All it needs is better battery life. I hope Seidio comes out with an extended battery for the 680 soon. For now I picked up a spare one for $20 as a special deal when I ordered the Treo from Palm.

Has anyone else experienced the Versamail-Yahoo issue or the Bluetoth sync to Mac issue? Any inventive fixes?

Thanks!

Joel

Reply to this comment

Returning my 680

bytor1 @ 12/19/2006 12:38:01 PM # Q
I ordered my Treo 680 and after a week of usage I am returning it to Palm. Although I was not expecting a major upgrade from the 650, I can say that this is more of a step backward than forward. The single thing that disappoints me the most is the battery life which is dismal at best. I also do not like the functionality of the new interface. Its ok but not great. I also do not like the fact that some of the notification functionality regarding the LED was removed. All in all, its a mediocre upgrade at best. I am a real believer in Palm, I have been a user since the original Pilot came out. I still have my US made USR PalmPilot. Oh well, cest la vie. I guess I will have to wait for Apple's entry into the phone arena.



Peace & Love

RE: Returning my 680
cervezas @ 12/19/2006 1:32:50 PM # Q
I also do not like the fact that some of the notification functionality regarding the LED was removed

Really? In my book, the flashing network status light on the 650 was bar none it's most annoying feature (especially if you kept it on your nightstand when you sleep). It was so bright that even if you put the phone face down on the nightstand it was still like being "lulled" to sleep by a green strobe light. I even found it distracting when driving at night. I know you can install software to turn the damned thing off, but the default non-flashing behavior of the 680 is a huge improvement, IMO.

I'm surprised more people haven't mentioned the improvement in the browser caching in the 680. It's so nice to be able to flip back and forth between a web page and some other application without the page having to reload from the network. That and the extra memory (with the stability it produces) are the two reasons I could never go back to the 650.

One beef that I continue to have with the Treos: they *still* haven't sufficiently integrated the launcher and the phone application in my view. The new tabbed phone application is an improvement, but the PDA functionality still feels bolted on and always has. There should not be two "Homes" on a smartphone, one for all the applications and another for phone and phone-related applications. Time for a complete rethink on that.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Returning my 680
freakout @ 12/19/2006 4:23:37 PM # Q
bytor1:
I also do not like the fact that some of the notification functionality regarding the LED was removed.

I prefer the new LED behaviour. It still flashes red when you've got no signal, which was the important part for me, really. Apparently Palm have made changes to the LED software in such a way that it's no longer easily accessible by developers ( http://tinyurl.com/ymqmo5 ). I wonder why?

cervezas:
I'm surprised more people haven't mentioned the improvement in the browser caching in the 680. It's so nice to be able to flip back and forth between a web page and some other application without the page having to reload from the network.

Indeed. One of my greatest 650 annoyances would be browsing the web, then having an SMS drop in and force me to lose my place so I could go to the Messaging app and reply to it. It also makes cutting-and-pasting info from the web into email/msgs/contacts a lot more useful. The improved Bluetooth is great too - I can now tether my Treo to my PC's internet conenction via Bluetooth and use a headset at the same time without having to re-connect with either.

There should not be two "Homes" on a smartphone, one for all the applications and another for phone and phone-related applications. Time for a complete rethink on that.

I suppose it wouldn't be that difficult to just stick a "Home" tab into the new phone app, as they've done with Contacts. Actually, that'd be a great solution, 'cause then they'd have a free hard button to dedicate to, say, Play/Pause for media apps - something I feel is sorely lacking on today's multimedia-savvy Palms.

But it sounds like you're thinking of something more innovative than that. Any ideas?


Oh, and as for the battery, bytor1: mine seemed to get better after a few days. It was shocking out of the box. But don't forget that there will soon be longer-life batteries available.

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650 ---> Crimson Treo 680

Reply to this comment

support for MP3 attachments in e-mail

anandzhere @ 12/23/2006 7:45:52 AM # Q
Hi,

I plan to purchase a Treo 680 but it depends on a very important feature. Could someone using a treo 680 model let me know, if it is possible to receive MP3 attachments via e-mail and than listen to the same MP3 file using the built-in music player in Treo680.

This feature is imporatant to me since, if somebody leaves a Voice message in my landline, i immediately get the VM as a MP3 attachment via e-mail. So when I configure the 680 to receive e-mails with MP3 attachment, I will be able to know who is trying to reach my office desk while I am travelling.

Thank you for trying to help.


RE: support for MP3 attachments in e-mail
freakout @ 12/23/2006 7:54:11 AM # Q
Works like a charm. In a nice touch, it can even play it for you in the background while you read your other emails so you don't even have to go into pTunes to listen to it.
Reply to this comment

What SLOWS DOWN the Treos?

Gekko @ 12/25/2006 7:26:40 PM # Q

Traveling on holiday for the last two days, I had no access to my laptop - only my Treo. While exclusively using the device for everything, I quickly became frustrated that it moves so slow (Surfing, Docs to Go, etc.). Now I understand that a smartphone can never compete with a laptop - but what slows this pig down for everyday operations? Some of the possible answers seem like an easy fix.

1. Lack of REAL RAM?
2. Lack of MORE RAM?
3. Slow Processor?
4. Lack of a good Browser? (Blazer)
5. Poor Data Connection Capabilities from Carriers? (EVDO, etc.)
6. FrankenGarnet?
7. Other
8. All of the above.

Thoughts?

p.s. MERRY CHRISTMAS!


RE: What SLOWS DOWN the Treos?
freakout @ 12/25/2006 7:47:31 PM # Q
I'd venture that the 312mhz processor is the biggest problem there.
Reply to this comment

Battery life

jdekeij @ 1/13/2007 4:48:25 PM # Q
Great review thanks! ...Although the design of the palm 680 is great it must be said that the battery life is too short to make it a great phone. After reading many different reviews on the net in different languages, I can conclude that this is a general remark in the reviews. I seriously hope that these stories reach the marketing department of palm where they may decide to do something about this issue. Otherwise they force me and probably others to look for another phone of a different brand.


RE: Battery life
freakout @ 1/13/2007 5:54:55 PM # Q
If the battery's your main concern, you should know that Seidio have been promising to release a longer-life battery sometime in the near future that will hopefully fix the issue.
Reply to this comment

680 is not an improve product

weaningpig @ 1/29/2007 8:32:37 PM # Q
I have been using palm since 1995 the first palm pda came out and since then i have 600 650 680 750. the 680 cannot received long text and it has a synchronization problem.

I am disappointed.

palm user since 1995

RE: 680 is not an improve product
hkklife @ 1/29/2007 9:07:26 PM # Q
Considering that the first Palm Pilots didn't arrive until mid-1996 that's a VERY impressive feat!

Were you part of Hawkins' original design team? ;-)



Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

Reply to this comment

battery

akhil @ 2/13/2007 3:54:14 AM # Q
I have been using Treo 650 and very pleased with it and got 680 now but battery life is very bad with full charge its not even giving 10 hour with only half hour talk time . with full charge without using at all charge is droping by 30% in 10 hour. is it my instrument or what ??

RE: battery
Wayne@OZ @ 2/16/2009 6:50:23 PM # Q
I have found mine to use more power if it is constantly roaming. Its not unheard of ot get a dud battery however you can upgrage the battery for your 680. Cheers.

Reply to this comment

stuck buttons!

naynay278 @ 4/5/2007 7:04:35 PM # Q
my phone's buttons have been getting stuck lately on the right side...do you know any way to fix that?.....i am not sure what to do....i havent had my phone long?

Reply to this comment

subsidize > wifi

redcore @ 4/19/2007 8:29:22 AM # Q
You could call it control, but it really just comes down to negotiation. Palm wants the carriers to subsidize their devices heavily and the carrier is naturally going to ask "what are you going to do to help us recoup our subsidy." If Palm comes back and says "well, we were thinking about releasing an unlocked version with a WiFi driver that will free Cingular customers from having to buy their music and video clips from your store and from having to buy premium data plans" how well do you think that plays with Cingular? Think they're going to give Palm the nice subsidy they're asking for?

Bottom line: Palm figures they'll get more customers by negotiating better carrier subsidies to bring the price to the customer down than by adding WiFi. My guess is that the number of people that decision upsets is probably less than the number of customers who are happy to see a sub-$200 price tag on the subsidized Treo 680. Sadly, (from our power-user perspective) it's probably a lot less.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog


I would agree with this only if the unlocked full-price versions included WiFi. Unfortunately, they do not...so I think it's more of a "total contract" thing. They don't put WiFi in to appease their main distributors (cingular, sprint, etc) in order to land those huge contracts.

What is interesting to me is that Apple is not only going to have WiFi included in their iPhone, but the darn thing is going to have some sort of automated mechanism to detect wifi and the data cells. This just goes to show that Apple's negotiating power is superior to that of Palm's...but ultimately it creates a precedent that is positive for the users: Palm may never go back to WiFi-less phones again.

Seems like they got "yoinked" (haha...cartoon words rock!) in their contractual negotiations and didn't use their smartphone superiority to their advantage. Meanwhile Apple knew they were in a great position to negotiate what they want because of their brand name, user-base (iPod especially), and how the phone is generally pretty sweet...even though I don't believe they're as revolutionary as they say. Lots of things they included were pioneered by Palm, but the "revolutionary" thing is it's their FIRST phone, whereas Palm hasn't revolutionized much of anything for years...perhaps because they felt comfortable. Well now we'll start seeing something give, and WiFi support will be one of the issues addressed.

POSSIBLE new customer...too bad the lack of WiFi on the 680 bucks the hell out of me.

Reply to this comment

Music Ringtones?

its Lisa Bitch @ 1/30/2008 9:57:16 PM # Q
Can you save music as your caller ringtones? ?

RE: Music Ringtones?
Ryan @ 1/31/2008 1:38:48 AM # Q
Yes, with the new rom update you can use mp3 and other audio ringtones. See this for more details:

http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/9606/how-to-add-mp3-ringtones-on-your-treo/

Reply to this comment

Treo 680

JoeB @ 5/1/2008 11:39:50 PM # Q
I used to like the Palm OS. But now that I have bought a Treo 680, I see that Palm has worked hard to destroy their sensible OS. For example, in Contacts, there is no longer a compact form, but you must view all phone numbers on separate lines. No choice. Also, if you are not careful about entries, and put word descriptions with a phone number, you will just get a blank line. Finally, if you press a letter, such as "J" to see all the last name listing that start with J, you are out of luck. It finds, in some strange order, every bloody listing entry with a J, first name, last and gosh knows what, that you have to scroll through. The older OS did it sensibly. But Palm has apparently fired any developer with an IQ over 2 digits, and those left have made the expected "improvements". You will also find similar stupid changes in the calandar, but enough. You might as well use some other OS. Palm has ruined theirs.
Reply to this comment

Palm Treo 680 Accessories - SKU: 3238ML

Wayne@OZ @ 2/16/2009 6:45:35 PM # Q
Well Im onto my second Palm now after having the Palm Treo 650 and upgraded to the 680 but am finding it **** hard to get hold of the advertized accessories for the 680.
The part number for the car mount is SKU: 3238ML and all the advertized dealer locations cant supply this product. Where can I find it in Australia or do I have to get it overseas?

RE: Palm Treo 680 Accessories - SKU: 3238ML
freakout @ 2/16/2009 10:09:40 PM # Q
If you're just looking for a car cradle, wayne, I reckon you're best off getting one of the cheap generic car cradles off ebay. Like this one:

http://tinyurl.com/cwvt7t

Palm's are a bit pricey and don't do much different.

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