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Comments on: Palm Announces the Palm Pre Smartphone

Palm PrePalm has just announced their latest and greatest smartphone, the Palm Pre. Breaking away completely from the past, Palm's new WebOS and Synergy data integration are set to provide the foundation for Palm's future devices for the next decade, according to Ed Colligan at Palm's event earlier today at CES.

Sprint is going to be the exclusive carrier partner for the Palm Pre, and retail availability is expected "as soon as possible" within the first half of 2009. No mention has been made of pricing or additional carrier partners, but according to the spec listed below, a UMTS/HSDPA radio version is listed, so a GSM version will presumably be available once Sprint's period of exclusivity has lapsed.

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Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money

LiveFaith @ 1/8/2009 2:21:44 PM # Q
Bring that GSM version and I'm ready to roll. This is what we needed Palm. Looks like a home run from this distance. Very exciting if not shocking.

Pat Horne
RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
freakout @ 1/8/2009 2:25:42 PM # Q
Amen!
RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
LiveFaith @ 1/8/2009 2:25:57 PM # Q
Good news is that Sprint has it up on their site enlisting the interested. Palm says ASAP in 1st 1/2 and that it's still getting approvals (presumably FCC?). Maybe it really does come soon opening the door for the world phone and AT&T availability. Exciting.

Pat Horne
RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
dboehme @ 1/8/2009 2:27:03 PM # Q
Agreed. I got the Treo Pro before Christmas to hold me over - I can't wait to turn it into a paper weight and get the GSM version of the Pre!!!

I'm so excited. This could have gone extremely well or extremely poorly. It is an absolute win!!!!!

RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
LiveFaith @ 1/8/2009 2:40:18 PM # Q
I gladly hang my head in shame for doubting Palm. But every time I drop it I want to look at the Pre again. Excellent hardware design and OS. I gave such a scenario a 1% chance and Palm nailed it so far. Beautiful specs and the experience looks perfect. Legacy POS apps are not that big IMO, bc this platform is going to generate some serious excitement if it worx as we saw.

Slider will make one handedness more difficult I presume, but we shall see. 2003 may finally pass after all!

Pat Horne

RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
scstraus2 @ 1/8/2009 3:12:53 PM # Q
Wow. I can finally say the first nice thing I can say about palm in many years. This looks incredible! If it works half as good as it looks, I'm in for a GSM version!

Palm's back on the map. I never thought I'd see the day. Finally an iPhone competitor for the business market. I'm blown away!

Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!

Palm Pilot 5000->Palm Pilot Professional->Handspring Visor->Handspring Visor Prism->Handspring Visor Neo->Handspring Treo 180->Handspring Treo 270->Palm Treo 600->Tapwave Zodiac 2->Palm Treo 650->Palm Treo 680->...

Samsung i780!

Goodbye Palm

RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
kevinbgood @ 1/8/2009 3:20:39 PM # Q
YAHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. I'm in! Bring in on big "P", we are with you. Just open it up to more than Sprint.


Addicted to Palm

RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
nastebu @ 1/8/2009 8:43:25 PM # Q
I won't hang my head about doubting Palm. Truth be told, they were up against the wall with a huge and seemingly impossible task to perform. Doubt was and frankly still is realistic. The point is, Palm did something amazing-created a smart phone that actually stands out in an incredibly competitive market. Get it to market properly debugged before the competition takes two more leaps forward and we've got a serious competitor.

What a surprise, what a great surprise. :-)

RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
dustbunny44 @ 1/9/2009 9:26:42 AM # Q
I can't see where it butters my toast.
I don't know... I was really counting on that feature.

RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
gaines @ 1/10/2009 8:42:48 PM # Q
I'm a pretty loyal Windows Mobile user, however what I've seen so far is very impressive and may entice me to switch. We've even started a community over at http://www.SprintPre.net to chat about it.


RE: Bring GSM & I'll Show the Money
SDscotty @ 5/2/2009 3:14:41 PM # Q
GSM! GSM! GSM! Come on AT&T! You were caught snoozing on this one. I guess you want to focus on all things iPhone, but many of us are not so iClones and want to keep our beloved Palm/Handspring desk-tops and simple interfaces. Don't think I want to switch to Sprint, even for the Pri. I have too many friends who were burned by their goofy billing and contract issues--years ago. GSM! GSM! GSM!
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Power? how much?

vixensjlin @ 1/8/2009 2:36:02 PM # Q
Can this thing last for 3~4 days like my Treo? By the way, let's hope it's under $500 (unlocked).
RE: Power? how much?
LuisAngelCastillo @ 1/8/2009 4:24:32 PM # Q
I think that will be around 549 like PRO, but where are the specifications? processor? RAM? ROM? Size? Weight? etc...

RE: Power? how much?
bhartman34 @ 1/8/2009 7:22:23 PM # Q
Can this thing last for 3~4 days like my Treo? By the way, let's hope it's under $500 (unlocked).

I think there's almost no chance that you'll see it below $500 unlocked. At least, not initially. Even the Centro sold for $200 witha plan at first. If it can really do everything they say it can do, I'd say $300 with a plan would be the initial price. Somewhere around there.

RE: Power? how much?
nastebu @ 1/8/2009 8:35:04 PM # Q
I don't know. If Palm and Sprint are serious about competing with Apple and RIM than it will have to be $199 with a contract. I imagine Sprint will want this to be a huge hit and so they might be willing to fork over a big subsidy. Too bad Palm is so cash poor. They'll need to make good money on it.

But a big subsidy is the upside of the exclusive carrier agreement, no?

Reply to this comment

EVDO vs AT&T 3G

mikecane @ 1/8/2009 3:08:55 PM # Q
So, is EVDO Rev A faster than AT&T 3G?

And how much would this be per month vs the iPhone 3G?

Gekko, here's your cue!

RE: EVDO vs AT&T 3G
Gekko @ 1/8/2009 3:48:12 PM # Q

Sprint is your fastest, most cost effective option. i love it.

their pricing, speed, technology, phone selection blows everyone else away.

i love the $99/month "simply everything" plan. unlimited everything is a beautiful thing.



RE: EVDO vs AT&T 3G
otter @ 1/9/2009 3:28:38 AM # Q
I have to agree - I miss Sprint's service. AT&T 3G sucks big time... even when it's available.

Reply to this comment

Size vs Treo & Centro?

mikecane @ 1/8/2009 3:10:21 PM # Q
I've seen a pic of it next to an iPhone. It's wee!

It makes me wonder if it's actually Centro sized.

Has anyone seen pics of it next to a Treo or Centro yet?

RE: Size vs Treo & Centro?
buckeyetex315 @ 1/8/2009 4:20:49 PM # Q
http://www.palm.com/us/products/phones/index.html

Palm Vx -> Long wait -> Palm T|X
RE: Size vs Treo & Centro?
mikecane @ 1/8/2009 5:57:55 PM # Q
Thanks. I hadn't seen that page. Wow. It's SMALL!!

Reply to this comment

Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan

Gekko @ 1/8/2009 3:53:57 PM # Q

that's my guess.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
hkklife @ 1/8/2009 11:35:32 PM # Q
That's my edumacated guess too. But I was nearly run out of Vegas and into the desert today when I mentioned that. Everyone else is "hoping"for $199.99 w/ contract. I clearly see Palm trying to position this as an uber-Smartphone premium product that commands a premium price.

Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->?
RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
SeldomVisitor @ 1/9/2009 3:44:17 AM # Q
Colligan addressed the pricing issue already:

== "...The biggest unknown is price, which went unmentioned during
== the demo. My assumption is that Palm (PALM) would try to take market
== share by coming in significantly lower than the $200 or so Apple wants
== for its iPhone. But when I ran that theory by Palm CEO Ed Colligan,
== he looked at me liked I'd peed on his rug. "Why would we do that when
== we have a significantly better product," he asked, then walked away..."

- http://mediamemo.allthingsd.com/20090108/live-from-ces-palm-unveils-nova/

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Foo Fighter @ 1/9/2009 4:14:25 AM # Q
that's my guess ($299).

Let's hope not - too high. They need to hit $199 or less or they're screwed.

----
Web Designer,
Tech writer for weblogs inc. @ http://www.tuaw.com

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 5:43:49 AM # Q

remember, iphone is subsidized by the higher at&t service fees. sprint's "simply everything" unlimited voice/data/text/gps is $99/month. at&t is $149/month. you'd make up the difference in 4 months.

also, colligan thinks he has the superior premium phone and that it should command the superior premium price.

iphone
8GB = $199 + higher monthly fees
16GB = $299 + higher monthly fees


RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 6:23:32 AM # Q

error - i meant to say at $299 vs $199 phone cost youd make up the difference in two months of $99 vs $149 service charges.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
dmenahem @ 1/9/2009 7:30:35 AM # Q
RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
mikecane @ 1/9/2009 8:34:54 AM # Q
$400 is FAIL.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 8:51:13 AM # Q

stop being fooled by clever marketing. it's pay me now or pay me A LOT later with monthly fees. iphone is subsidized by at&t customers monthly fees.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
dmenahem @ 1/9/2009 9:01:00 AM # Q
Doesn't Sprint subsidize its phones via customer's monthly fee? @ $30/month for unlimited data ATT and Sprint are equal.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 9:06:08 AM # Q

all carriers subsidize their phones, it's just a matter of degrees. compare total voice + data pricing and you'll get your answer.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
dmenahem @ 1/9/2009 9:07:26 AM # Q
My point is that at $400 you are paying now and later with Sprint.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 9:10:26 AM # Q

do the math -

Sprint Pre = $399 + $99/month for 24 Months =

AT&T iPhone = $199 + $150/month for 24 Months =



RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
dmenahem @ 1/9/2009 9:22:56 AM # Q
I agree with your math on the unlimited everything comparision. I realize there are many people that need the unlimited voice minutes, but @ $399 (if thats really the price) I think Palm has its work cut out competing against the iphone on glitz/glamor/marketing AND price. Most people are not power users that require unlimited everything. My $100/month plan with ATT provides unlimited texts, data and 900 mins that I never fully use up(with rollover, free nights, free weekends).

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 9:29:06 AM # Q

you must not have an iphone then. iphone at&t plans are more -

Package: iPhone 3G - 8 GB $199.00
Phone: Apple iPhone 3G - 8 GB - Black Included

Plan: Nation 900 w/Rollover® Minutes $59.99
Services: Data Plan for iPhone 3G $30.00
iPhone Text Messaging Unlimited $20.00

$110/month total.

my pre vs. iphone comparison works on any apples to apples plan.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
dmenahem @ 1/9/2009 9:31:07 AM # Q
I do have the iphone (16GB, white); $50/month 900 mins, $30 data, $20 texts. Not sure if the voice plan is a carry over from before, but I'm at $100+taxes.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 9:31:31 AM # Q

Sprint Everything Data-900 Anytime Minutes Included2
$89.99/month


RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
dmenahem @ 1/9/2009 9:35:10 AM # Q
Gekko

We are comparing apples to apples with power users. For the Pre to achieve the scale of sales that the iphone has (close to 10 million units?) it has to appeal to the ave. joe. Average Joe walks into Best Buy and compares $199 to $399 (plus the added glitz/glamor of the iphone) and you can see which way it goes.

My point is that Sprint/Palm already have their work cut out for them if they want to become a mass consumer hit. Pricing at $399 is going to make the work that much more difficult.

Mind you I'm not an apple honk. I have an iphone, bberry and treo, and I'd love to see this succeed (in US GSM version, please, Palm), but for it to succeed they have to expand the market past the BB-HTC-Treo power users market.

DM.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 9:41:44 AM # Q

you are debating two issues. i simply am saying that you must pay a minimum of an APPLE TAX of $10/month extra for the luxury of using an iphone. and if you want an UNLIMITED plan, it's an APPLE TAX of $50/month.

you don't need to be a power user to see and want the value proposition of $99/month for unlimited everything.

whether or not Pre's pricing/positioning/marketing/product is enough to fight Apple is a whole other discussion.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 9:45:29 AM # Q
>and if you want an UNLIMITED plan, it's an APPLE TAX of $50/month.

that's a 50% tax!

$99 Voice+Data+Text
+$50 Apple Tax
+$20 Sales Tax/Federal Fees/Etc.



RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
dmenahem @ 1/9/2009 9:52:38 AM # Q
And people will still pay that tax to have the cool phone. Most people look and say "oh $199, thats $200 cheaper than the Pre, plus its the cooler, hipper phone"

Palm absolutely has to price this at 199 (or close, 249 like the Storm on VZW) to make it appealing to the mass market.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 9:56:15 AM # Q

i have gone through my monthly bills and eliminated even the smallest recurring item that does not provide value.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
nastebu @ 1/9/2009 11:42:35 AM # Q
I have unlimited text messaging on the iPhone for $5 a month. Where did you get $20?

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/9/2009 12:11:59 PM # Q

go price it out on att.com like a new user and then come talk to me.

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
mikecane @ 1/10/2009 9:04:41 AM # Q
I just read elsewhere the Pre Sprint plan will be closer to the Samsung Instinct plan.

So how does that differ from the current Centro plan you have, Gekko?

Colligan: "Why would we do that when we have a significantly better product?"

Oh Christ. Colligan is *again* a candidate for Dumbass of the Year, 2009. Pride goeth before the fall, Ed!! You want the Pre to wind up as the AMIGA OF CELLPHONES?!

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/10/2009 10:24:39 AM # Q

listen and listen good. the Sprint "Simply Everything" $99/month Unlimited Everything plan is for ALL of Sprint's phone. and i read that they will be pushing this plan for the Pre.

this plan is the best bargain out there!!!

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
SeldomVisitor @ 1/10/2009 12:06:43 PM # Q
Be Careful What You Tout Without Solid Proof.

The current set of rumors suggest Palm is going to be charging fees over and above regular plans for some of the feature of the Pre just like Visual Voicemail for the iPhone is an extra cost "feature"...

RE: Pricing Guess: $299 w/2 Year Service and Data Plan
Gekko @ 1/10/2009 1:20:14 PM # Q

im talking about unlimited core cellular functions (voice+data+text+gps) at $99/month, silly. everything else is just speculation.


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pra PRE pri PRO pru

LuisAngelCastillo @ 1/8/2009 4:01:14 PM # Q
Why PRE? what's mean PRE?

RE: pra PRE pri PRO pru
Gekko @ 1/8/2009 5:44:52 PM # Q

maybe because it made you pre-cum?

RE: pra PRE pri PRO pru
freakout @ 1/8/2009 7:45:34 PM # Q
No "pre" about it, Lizard Man. :P
Reply to this comment

I was hoping for IR Port

Vesparado @ 1/8/2009 7:53:57 PM # Q
I guess I won't be replacing my Treo 650 with the Pre. I need the IR port for unlocking the keyboxes on my listings. Dang. Maybe they'll add it on another version?
RE: I was hoping for IR Port
Gepeto- @ 1/9/2009 6:04:07 AM # Q
I wouldn't hold my breath for Palm to add IR on new devices. Maybe someone should make a Bluetooth to IR thing you could leave in front of IR controlled devices, so you could control them from any bluetooth device..

RE: I was hoping for IR Port
jptx @ 1/9/2009 7:05:05 AM # Q
I'll hate to lose infrared too, for novii remote- tv remote control-

Reply to this comment

Over/Under on Release Date

dmenahem @ 1/8/2009 8:29:30 PM # Q
If Palm's history is any indication, this thing does not get released before August 2009.

Reply to this comment

Mmmmmmmm....

sford @ 1/8/2009 8:29:36 PM # Q
Just...Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm. :)

Now, if it can truly either support or replace Adarian Money, ThoughtManager, Docs2Go, and Warfare Inc., I'm in!

Pilot Pro, III, IIIe, Nino (yeah...oops!), IIIc, VIIx, m505, NR70V, NZ90, NX60, T3, Zire 72s, NX80V, Treo 90, Treo 650

RE: Mmmmmmmm....
sford @ 1/10/2009 9:38:11 AM # Q
Ha! DataViz was on the Partners slide! Eeeexcelent!

Pilot Pro, III, IIIe, Nino (yeah...oops!), IIIc, VIIx, m505, NR70V, NZ90, NX60, T3, Zire 72s, NX80V, Treo 90, Treo 650
Reply to this comment

CES status report

hkklife @ 1/8/2009 11:33:40 PM # Q
Just got in from an entire day of hoofing it around CES and trying to glean every bit of info possible from Palm and "others". My EEE PC and its Atom CPU totally crumbled under the load of video editing, Ryan's MacBook Air stymied us time after time with its inadequate port selection and no Ethernet port, Palm let us down with no wi-fi for the press in the venue, My 755p and my EEE's wacky Bluetooth stack refused to play nice for a DUN connection, and my Canon digicam overheated from too much use and refuses to power on any more. Oh, and I lost my 8gb usb flash drive somewhere in the bowels of the Venetian press lobby. It was not a day when the hardware gods smiled upon us.

Let me get right to what everyone wants to hear about from someone who CARES about Palm's activities today. The Pre is SMALL. It's like a bit thinner and narrower version of the original HTC Touch. I touched it. They wouldn't let me hold it but I was able to lay a wee fingertip or two on it. I would've stayed longer fondling and asking questions but Palm kicked us out so they could bring in their VIP visitors. The Pre is a little slick and could use a dab of rubberized paint. It looks as if it appears EXTREMELY comfortable with the HTC G1-esque "bend" on it. The keyboard looks solid but I am sad to report that the spacebar as well as a few other keys are not backlit. Also, some buttons have been remmapped, such as the @ having its own dedicated key. A Palm rep exlained that this was due to @ being a much more frequently used symbol than it was even a few years ago. Also, the keys have wider spacing and not as much of a vertical smile. Build quality in general seems exemplary and the slider makes the action of the old Zire 71 and the T|T series looks like totally shoddy stuff. The power button in the top right corner looks awfully weak and may suffer from the dreaded T|E/T|5/TX power button sag over time...but maybe I'm just being a Palm pessimist again.

Several aspects of the OS and UI were clearly not yet ready for prime time, such as the phone app/dialer and the web browser. As far as its browser goes, I'd rate it somewhere below the iPhone and maybe slightly above the latest BlackBerry browsers. It definitely renders faster than the BB Storm's browser but doesn't display a page such as palminfocenter.com quite as nicely. There's so much more to say about the OS and how...clever it is but i'm far too tired to try to formulate my thoughts on that now. So I think I'll turn on my bitch & moan mode and point out what I think are a couple of essentially show-stopping flaws on the device (in MY opinion as a long-time POS power user). Casual users and/or those upgrading from an iPhone or a Centro shouldn't have any reason to complain. I am absolutely blown away by the device's performance. Nearly no lag at all, and near-instantaneous screen transitions and redaws. I am impressed. This thing is honestly T3/T|C fast, folks. I expecting hideous BB Storm-like lag but even the accelerometer seems up to par. A++ to Palm for finally getting rid of the hideous Garnet-era NVFS lag.

A HUGE, HUGE drawback is the pitiful 1200mAh battery capacity. That is simply unacceptable and a total joke and an utter insult to the power users in the "fat middle of the market" Palm is trying to targete. I made my feelings on that clear to Palm. Another utterly unacceptable move is dropping the microSDHC slot entirely. Palm's getting greedy and trying to be too much like Apple, IMO. I detest seeing anyone going backwards and dropping features. I can live with no IR, I can live with no stylus and I can even make do without the hard app buttons and Palm Desktop. But 1200mAh (my suspicion is that it's actually even less) battery capacity and a pitiful 8gb of fixed internal memory with no microSD slot is a slap in the face, as is Palm's bizarre devotion to Sprint. I can tell you this much: the international blogger/press members in attendance were REALLY pissed/depressed at the lack of info on a GSM version. Palm should have told Sprint to fluff off and launched CDMA & GSM variants simultaneously.

Folks, Palm's engineering staff did the impossible. They've produced a fast, beautiful, intuitive OS with a fastastic synergy between various various types of data and media. But once again, Palm's beancounters managed to snatch what could have easily been far and away THE best handset on the market and reduced it to a "nice try but not quite" effort that falls somewhere in the 2nd-tier devices epitomized by the G1 and the BB Storm.

Look at the Sony Xperia X1. That's got EVERYTHING known to man in it and it's been in the wild for quite some time. There's no excuse for Palm not trying just a little bit harder to make a more compelling device hardware-wise. A fraction more thickness to the device would be forgiven by everyone if it could share the Treo Pro's 1500mAh battery and microSDHC slot. Sigh...

Well, I'm off to bed. I'm exhausted and we have an early morning interview session with Palm. Thanks for all of the feedback and kind words today. You guys make it worth it!

The platform IS fantastic and has tremendous potential on so many levels. Had this thing hit the market 6 months earlier, the industry would be falling over themselves to copy WebOS. They still might, in fact. But Android has no doubt stolen a lot of crucial attention, sales, media attention and developer support. IMO, WebOS is what I had hoped Android would be. And Palm's hardware IS still better than the G1 and the iPhone, but the higher-end WM handsets like the X1 and the BB Storm still have Palm beat as far as hardware. Palm's new hardware, while a solid leap forward in some ways, is a sad step backwards in many others. It's going to need more tweaks and feature improvements in the 2nd generation to really make it shine. But good Asian ODMs are a dime a dozen nowadays. It wouldn't be too hard at all to quickly and cheaply improve on the Pre's hardware.

With the huge stumbling block of an antiquated OS out of the way, the sky appears to be the limit for Palm...IF THEY WANT IT BADLY ENOUGH. Right now, I am VERY, VERY tenatively awarding a grade of "C+" to the Pre hardware and an "A-" to the OS. Off to bed now! More tomorrow!

Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->?

RE: CES status report
SeldomVisitor @ 1/9/2009 3:36:07 AM # Q
> ...Several aspects of the OS and UI were clearly not yet ready for prime time...

I did not watch a video yet (do such exist?).

Did the device actually DO anything other than switch around windows in a fun way?

Did someone create a document, save it, open it again?

Copy-n-paste? (I imagine that's a fairly interesting thing to implement in a device where you already are flicking your fingers around to do other things...)

Anywho, was Wi-Fi up? Did they actually browse a site? Any site?

Sound - was it demoed?

Video?


RE: CES status report
mikecane @ 1/9/2009 8:41:49 AM # Q
>>>but the higher-end WM handsets like the X1 and the BB Storm still have Palm beat as far as hardware.

Really, that doesn't matter much. The G1 is plastic crap that *does* deter sales. OTOH, underneath the gorgeous Xperia is the Heart of Darkness known as WinMob. People won't buy the Xperia for its hardware to suffer its software! Xperia reviews have all been thumbs down on its software "xperience." It's the software that matters.

Palm has time to do a version of the Palm V later on.

Bad news, that, about the battery. Still, it's removable!

RE: CES status report
mikecane @ 1/9/2009 8:42:35 AM # Q
And oh, I *loved* your opening account of all the tech problems. Too bad I don't have a blog right now. I would have quoted that!

RE: CES status report
hkklife @ 1/9/2009 10:58:09 AM # Q
Look. Put WebOS in Xperia X1-esque hardware and you have the device that will finally not have a list of compromises as long as my arm. Will ANYONE ever get it right? Heck, take the BB Storm formfactor & specs, give it WebOS and a capacitive touchscreen instead of that nasty wobbly clickscreen, and you've got a world-beater.


I'm holding out for Pre2 or the Pre Pro!

Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->?

RE: CES status report
mikecane @ 1/10/2009 9:08:02 AM # Q
>>>Put WebOS in Xperia X1-esque hardware and you have the device that will finally not have a list of compromises as long as my arm.

Yeah, and probably an *un*subsidized price of $1,200 UNLOCKED. Hey, they did up to the Palm III before the sleek Palm V. Give them some time here. On their current budget, they can barely afford the plastic casing!

Reply to this comment

Screen?

NuShrike @ 1/9/2009 1:57:21 AM # Q
Nobody seems to have detailed but what kind of screen is that? OLED?

It looks bright and clear and never washed out in every single live picture of it. No flash glare, no reflections. Is it a render?!

There is NO Windows Mobile phone that looks that good right now, and I'm not sure the iPhone looks that good either.

If it looks just as good in sunlight, that's a smashing success for the screen, even if it's not WVGA.

Palm III -> Sony NR610C -> Sony NR70 -> Sony NX80 -> Palm T|X -> HTC Kaiser -> HTC Fuze

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all hail 'the cloud'

threephi @ 1/9/2009 2:33:41 AM # Q
I am a long, longtime Palm user who recently, reluctantly, bought an iphone after cracking the screen on my 680 because there were no attractive Palm OS products on the market. The iphone is flawed in many ways, some deeply-foremost in my opinion by Apple's self-defeatingly rigid and idiotic restrictions on software development for its platform. But IMO it was the best thing out there.

After using the iphone for a few months and, I admit, being largely happy with it (the iphone kicks the Treo line's butt up and down the block on hardware and web browsing), there are nonetheless many things about Palm OS that I miss. Palm OS apps were tools, and for the most part iphone apps are toys. The iphone PIM apps in particular are shockingly primitive, especially to anyone used to Palm OS. So I'm thrilled to finally see a shining new Palm product with compelling features, and I can't wait to check out the Pre.

What truly stood out in Palm OS was the PIM's. I was hoping for a great new device with modern hardware and a modern OS, with equally shining new brilliant PIM apps. A device to use every day and help me be more efficient. I haven't read the entire coverage about the new Pre, and maybe the PIM apps are everything I've been hoping for.

BUT and this is a deal-breaking BUT:

The apparent reliance on "the cloud" and the statement from the liveblog that desktop PC sync is "being phased out" is a HUGE, HUGE turnoff to me. I don't want ALL my most private and personal data in "the cloud" for any reason, at any time. Period.

I know there is a huge buzz about "the cloud" in computer geek land but nothing will ever replace the security and individual control over one's own personal data that desktop/flash card sync provides.

If "the cloud" is truly the only way to sync a Pre, I will never use one.

RE: all hail 'the cloud'
Big_Nemo @ 1/9/2009 5:47:01 AM # Q
While I am reading this, I am looking at my T|X sitting on the desk. I just synced before lunch (Central Europe Time here). While I hope the T|X is still going to serve me for a while, I started wondering about its replacement. Here are a few *very* random thoughts.

There is no way the company I work for is going to provide connection between the corporate Exchange server and a Pre - they only allow Crackberries from a strict compatibility list (I don't have one, I don't want one). The T|X PIM syncs with the things that are relevant to me: the agenda, the contact list, the to-do list.

I use the T|X to keep track of my expenses and payments, and of course I have that data synced to a desktop software (on my home PC); that is something I could hardly do without right now. I also keep track of car expenses.

I use the T|X to carry along relevant documents I need at hand - spreadsheets mostly, a few .doc and .pdf files. Most are business related - no way I would trust those to The Cloud without the blessing of Corporate IT (good luck with that). I also carry along a few reference textbooks in e-book format.

I am quite sure, what I paid for my T|X and my not-so-smart cellphone is less than what the price tag on an unlocked Pre will be. Sure, it also includes GPS which makes the bundle more attractive - but I hardly need GPS for my daily commute. And I am not stuck with a 24-months contract.

When I am away from home *and* office, I mostly end in places where you can only dream of a decent data connection. Maybe this is going to improve in the future. Maybe not. This depends on the network operators investing into coverage, of course. I'd guess we are more likely to get Wi-Max coverage or similar before that happens.

Maybe I just don't want a *phone* at all. While I may have to carry two separate gadgets around, I like the choice of leaving the T|X at home when I don't need it, and just carry my small, cheap cellphone. I also get pretty good battery life - since each device has its separate battery. The cellphone network operator has no say in what I run on the T|X. And I would never put the display of the T|X anywhere close to my sweaty, greasy ear in a hot summer day!

I am an engineer, so I am supposed to be a Star Trek fan, right? Have you ever noticed that Starfleet officers are issued communicators *and* datapads? (Yes, I *know* that is a TV show, thanks!)

I don't have a Facebook account yet. I am not even looking forward to it. I guess I will eventually cave in; I hope I will not regret it too much.

I am wondering now, whether I will eventually find a replacement for the T|X sometimes, or I will have to learn how to do things without it again. Maybe what I am looking for is a netbook of sorts, only much smaller and lighter, so to fit in my pocket, and with some kind of software allowing me to sync data with my desktop PCs at office and home.

Sorry if I sound sour. Maybe I am just out of the loop of a new generation of road warriors, nor I am looking forward to becoming one of them; I wish them well, anyway.

RE: all hail 'the cloud'
mikecane @ 1/9/2009 8:46:34 AM # Q
I understand completely, Big Nemo.

Geez, are we going to see ACCESS put out a frikkin *PDA* now to get our $$$?

RE: all hail 'the cloud'
hkklife @ 1/9/2009 10:45:16 AM # Q

I did not watch a video yet (do such exist?).
-I watched a video on it and it was SUPERB. Great color depth/richness, total edge to edge display, good viewing angle, and zero stutering whatsoever. H.264, among many other codecs are supported standard out of the box.

Did the device actually DO anything other than switch around windows in a fun way?
-Yes it did plenty. I'd say it's about 80% ready for primetime, perhaps even closer.


Did someone create a document, save it, open it again?
-Yes, flawless and zero lag.

Copy-n-paste? (I imagine that's a fairly interesting thing to implement in a device where you already are flicking your fingers around to do other things...)

-Yes, it's a bit complicated of a swipe/hold/drag sequence but it's there. It's Palm. Cut & paste has been there from 1996 and I had ZERO worries it wouldn't be present. I will still miss having a stylus, though.

Anywho, was Wi-Fi up? Did they actually browse a site? Any site?
-Yup, we did wi-fi extensively as well as EVDO (not sure if it was a Rev.A signal). Fast, stable (b & g) wi-fi. we looked at some news sites (reuters?) and in particular, PalmInfocenter. I'd rate the browser in its current build as below Safari on the iPhone (of course) and about slightly above google's chrome on the G1 and definitely faster than the BB Storm browser that i've spent a fair amount of time playing with.

Sound - was it demoed?
Yes at length. Tinny built in speakers but it sounded good when pumped out to external speakers. Media player is kinda barebones but who cares-it shows some nice CoverFlow-style album artwork (though it didn't "flow", I'm just talking about the layout onscreen) and quickly jumped from song to song.

Video?
Yes, see above. Video performance was fantastic. this thing has the potential (aside from the tragic lack of YouTube integration and flash support AT THIS TIME), to be the dark horse champ for mobile video playback. This makes the pathetic 8gb onboard with no microSD slot a crushing, nearly deal-breaking flaw.

Any more questions?

Pilot 1000->Pilot 5000->PalmPilot Pro->IIIe->Vx->m505->T|T->T|T2->T|C->T|T3->T|T5->Zodiac 2->TX->Verizon Treo 700P->Verizon Treo 755p->?

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It ain't here yet

Tuckermaclain @ 1/9/2009 6:42:20 AM # Q
Looks like it would be a good replacement for my T2 and Razr. We'll see when (if) it comes out. If I remember correctly, Cobalt was domo'd as well.

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so do they keep Garnet Centros around?

Gekko @ 1/9/2009 8:23:58 AM # Q

will it be three tiers available?

1. Centro Garnet
2. Treo WinMob
3. Pre WebOS

????????????

this pre and webos is fancy, but i'm far away from being a beta tester. i like my tried and true centro with garnet and palm desktop. i wanted an upgrade, but this Pre WebOS is a total radical change from what i'm used to for the last 10+ years. and i don't like too much change! who moved my cheese?

RE: so do they keep Garnet Centros around?
mikecane @ 1/9/2009 8:30:21 AM # Q
>>>palm desktop

WAFM! You were going around dissing me for wanting to migrate my legacy data. Yet YOU want Palm Desktop still? Wanker!

RE: so do they keep Garnet Centros around?
freakout @ 1/9/2009 8:34:02 AM # Q
I'm guessing they'll keep it round for awhile yet - maybe even do one or two more Garnet devices. They bought back the Garnet code for some reason, and it seems more and more likely that reason wasn't to do an emulator in webOS...
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Sprint exclusive: just 90 days

mikecane @ 1/10/2009 11:02:46 AM # Q
>>>The phone will be released by Sprint and is expected to retail around $199 - $249 with a two year contract. Sprint only holds the exclusive for the first 90 days, so you should expect to see other carriers announce support shortly thereafter.

http://bub.blicio.us/palm-pre-up-close-and-personal/

RE: Sprint exclusive: just 90 days
mikecane @ 1/10/2009 11:05:38 AM # Q
And there are more photos if you click through to his Flickr album.

Man, that Touchstone base is TINY!! What is that, maybe 3-inches diameter, tops?

Now what I want to know, what carriers after Sprint would be most likely to have it? Again, I am a drooling eejit when it comes to cellphones, so I know even less than NOTHING about which carriers have which radios and crap like that.

RE: Sprint exclusive: just 90 days
Gekko @ 1/10/2009 11:09:45 AM # Q

they need to make this puppy available soon!

RE: Sprint exclusive: just 90 days
Gekko @ 1/10/2009 11:23:09 AM # Q

sprint has the best, fastest, and most cost effective network.

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Palm Cloud Synergy Explained

Gekko @ 1/11/2009 4:24:36 PM # Q

Palm's webOS does not presume any sort of tether at all. The company has totally ditched the idea that you will use this phone in conjunction with a specific "main PC" that contains the canonical, authoritative repository of your data. Instead, webOS draws seamlessly on a variety of data services—not data repositories, but cloud-based services that actively feed the device both data and critical context.

This is a deep, fundamental break with both the iPhone and previous, repository-based smartphone usage models, and it's important enough that other smartphones are bound to follow.

Ultimately, the exact mechanism for moving changes of state between the device and the online information services to which it connects (cloud, IMAP e-mail, IM, Twitter etc.) will depend on the particular service. Some services ask the device to poll, while others push out updates—it all depends on the transport. But the user will never see any of that, since it all goes on behind the scenes under the heading of "Synergy."

Note that I should have asked about Synergy's impact on battery life, because from a power savings perspective, it's probably better to have a single, shared model for handling state changes (like batch updates) than to have the kind of free-for-all that Crowley seemed to be describing.

Ultimately, webOS acts much like what Daniels described in his interview; that is, it moves away from a repository datasource model to a federated query service model, where the device queries multiple services for state that it then caches locally, before invisibly propagating any changes back out to the cloud.

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20090111-of-clouds-palms-webos-and-cutting-the-cord.html


RE: Palm Cloud Synergy Explained
mikecane @ 1/11/2009 4:57:49 PM # Q
NO WONDER they won't talk about battery life! After "synergizing" all day, there's no battery power left!!

RE: Palm Cloud Synergy Explained
SeldomVisitor @ 1/11/2009 5:03:42 PM # Q
> ...After "synergizing" all day...

Optimist!

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Lack of existing Palm app support kills it for me

~j @ 1/17/2009 4:46:39 PM # Q
You have let me down, Palm.

Having been a loyal user of many Palm devices from the first PDA though my current Treo, I am completely disappointed that the Pre has no support for my existing Palm apps. Also one carrier. Sprint. Give me a break.

Remind me why exactly I should stay loyal to Palm? If I wanted something that doesn't run my Palm apps and doesn't work in the USA and Europe - I have a huge choice. I'd have moved to a modern phone ages ago. But I waited patiently, I had faith Palm would be back with a perfect Palm OS smartphone and wouldn't let me down. I feel like an idiot now.

When it can run my existing apps and there is a GSM version, maybe I'll look at it.

Given how slow Palm have been, I'm not holding my breath.

Oh and it's shiny. So it shows every smudge and fingerprint and will be slippery. The slide out keyboard is nice, but how do you skin the Pre?

Also, has it an SD slot? I don't see it mentioned.

I was beyond excited about Pre, but having found out what it's missing, I'm looking at alternatives. Thank goodness for StyleTap & Garnet. Perhaps if Palm work with them, so they can support their apps for them, Palm might lose fewer customers.

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