PalmSource Announces EuroDevCon Agenda

PalmSource today announced the speakers and sponsors of the annual PalmSource Euro DevCon taking place on September 28-29, 2004 in Munich, Germany. Hosted during the city's famed Oktoberfest celebration, the two-day conference is the forum to learn best practices for making applications smartphone-ready, uncover revenue-generating opportunities for wireless devices and over-the-air delivery of applications, and get a sneak peek at PalmSource's new smartphone OS.

The European conference will feature speakers from the PalmSource executive team and industry leaders including:

  • David Nagel, president and CEO, PalmSource, Inc.;
  • Larry Slotnick, chief products officer, PalmSource, Inc.;
  • Vesey Crichton, vice president of EMEA, palmOne, Inc.;
  • Tyler Nelson, vice president of global business development, RIM;
  • Richard Hanscott, vice president, business development and partnerships, Orange; and
  • Todd Moore, chief technology officer, pervasive computing, IBM.

Confirmed Euro DevCon 2004 sponsors include Palm OS licensees Aceeca, palmOne, Inc. and Tapwave; Palm Powered Mobile World partners Orange, PalmGear, RIM and Telefonica Moviles Espana; and mobile content partners Handango and Pdassi. Other sponsors include IBM, Techneos Systems and Palm OS Ready Partner Freescale; and media partners Der Entwickler, International Developer and PDA magazine.

"We are thrilled with the overwhelming enthusiasm and support from the Palm OS community around the upcoming 2004 Euro DevCon and look forward to another successful conference this year," said Larry Berkin, director of developer marketing, PalmSource. "We believe the PalmSource developer conferences are snapshots of the amazing things happening in the world of wireless application development for Palm OS and we will continue to further this effort and bring wireless innovation to a whole new level."

"PalmSource Euro DevCon 2003 was a great event for the entire Palm Powered economy," said Aaron Ardiri CEO, Mobile Wizardry. "The combination of information, partner interaction and of course, Oktoberfest, made it the perfect venue for conducting business. If you produce wireless Palm OS software, this is the event to attend in 2004."

Highlights of the PalmSource Euro DevCon 2004 include:

  • Pre-conference Palm OS Basic Training, a "boot camp" for developers new to Palm OS. The boot camp will take place the afternoon of Monday, September 27 with PalmSource engineers providing an introduction to programming for the Palm OS platform.
  • In-depth sessions on the Palm OS Developer Suite, the latest PalmSource development tools for 68K and ARM-native software development.
  • A state-of-the-art Hardware Lab, providing developers with "hands-on" access to a complete line of Palm Powered devices to test their applications.
  • Detailed presentations from senior PalmSource executives and other strategic partners covering technical and business trends in the wireless device and smartphone markets.
  • The Meet our Partners roundtable sessions, offering developers the opportunity to interact face-to-face with leading Palm Powered Mobile World operators and infrastructure partners, Palm OS licensees, and other PalmSource partners.
  • The New & Notables Program, providing a vehicle for developers to introduce new Palm OS applications and promote their solutions to key customers, partners and press.
  • The Euro Powered Up Awards, created by PalmSource to honor the most innovative and successful applications from the European Palm OS developer community. Winners will be announced at the conference and awards will be handed out in the following categories: Wireless/Over-the-air, Enterprise/Productivity, Games/Entertainment and Multimedia.

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So where's the first Cobalt device?

palmdoc88 @ 9/7/2004 7:18:57 PM #
First post at last hehe.
WHat I really want to know is when the first OS6 device will be released?
I was really hoping the T5 would be an OS6 Wifi + BT capable PDA but if that's not the case, I'll pass palmOne and Palmsource.
Get your act together. The world does not revolve around smartphones. :P

T3 user
RE: So where's the first Cobalt device?
hussain @ 9/7/2004 9:31:23 PM #
The first cobalt device is suposed to appear next year (sometime in the first quarter) according to rumors but then again pa1mOne could suprise everyone soon (like in the next month or two)

RE: So where's the first Cobalt device?
gfunkmagic @ 9/8/2004 1:59:00 AM #
>>>So where's the first Cobalt device?

There aren't any cuz Palmsource can't even find a lisencee to use it!! Quite a pathetic situation.... :(

I support http://Tapland.com/

--------------------
GNM

RE: So where's the first Cobalt device?
JonathanChoo @ 9/8/2004 2:58:14 AM #
I guess none of them anticipated that devices running OS5 to be so successful. When OS5 was announced many cried that it was just a stop gap OS before OS6. It would be slow since it won't run on native ARM code. Guess what? OS5 is a classic PalmOS. It was simple and fast just like previous PalmOSes. OS5 is probably cheaper too and I guess Palm is selling lots of OS5 devices (T3, Z72) that it makes sense to stick to OS5 while it is still has value.

And I think PalmSource learnt their lesson because in renaming OS5 to Garnet it means that there are now two OS on the PalmOS platform both operating differently. It creates a headache for normal consumers. Which is newer? Garnet or Cobalt? Will there be compatibility issues with softwares? And sh*ts like that.

My opinion is for Palm to use Garnet as a platform for smartphones (to compete with Series 60) and Cobalt for normal PDAs and PDAs with phone function (competitor to Series 90, UIQ and PPC PE).

--
Generic PDA > 5mx > Vx > m505 > N770C > T625C > NR70V > e310 > m550 > h2210 > T/T3 & h4150
StarTac > T28m > T39m > T68m > T610 > T630 > K700i (nxt week)

RE: So where's the first Cobalt device?
frauen1 @ 9/8/2004 11:32:22 AM #
Don't forget, Cobalt is really a 1.0 version of a new OS that is mostly backwards compatible with previous versions of Palm OS. Who is going to be first to put the new OS on their device? Given the support costs, either you have to have enough infrastructure to support both OS versions or you have to be a new licensee who is starting with Cobalt devices (has no legacy devices to support).

(This is the big place where PalmSource misses Sony - before pulling Clie's from the US/European market, Sony had stated that they were going to ship an OS 6 device. Who knows, they may still do it in Japan, but I'm doubtful about this...)

RE: So where's the first Cobalt device?
Gekko @ 9/8/2004 1:13:16 PM #

ahh...what's the rush for a Cobalt device??? It's not like PPC, RIM, or Nokia is any competition. Palm has *plenty* of time to sit back and relax.

http://www.pdaclub.pl/view.php?news_id=8697

http://www.forbes.com/personaltech/2004/09/08/cx_ah_0908tentech.html?partner=yahoo&referrer=



RE: So where's the first Cobalt device?
hussain @ 9/8/2004 3:54:23 PM #
PPC is big competition, palmone has lost 10% First Quarter '03 (figures are from Frist Quarter '04, to be more specific April), the number they have now is 30% and HP is right behind at 21.2% that's a 27% growth for them, Windows CE (wich includes the PPC) is right behind Palm OS, Palm OS has 40.9 % of the market share while Windows CE has 40.2%

Source:
http://www.windowsfordevices.com/news/NS8063885791.html

Slotnick & Nagel

mikecane @ 9/8/2004 11:24:57 AM #
Slotnick's talk will be, "Why I Am Too Stupid To Let You Have a Filesystem in PalmOS."

Nagel's talk will be, "After That Last OS Disaster I Headed, I'm Lucky To Be Working *Anywhere.* What's A Filesystem, By The Way?"

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
ardiri @ 9/8/2004 3:44:40 PM #
mike, why the hell do you bother. if you want a damn file system; write it yourself - or, buy a pocket pc device. its one thing you express your opinion, but its another to do it over and over again and end up sounding like a clueless idiot. your moving towards the latter right now.

---
Aaron Ardiri
PalmOS Certified Developer
aaron_ardiri@mobilewizardry.com
http://www.mobilewizardry.com/members/aaron_ardiri.php
RE: Slotnick & Nagel
RhinoSteve @ 9/8/2004 4:09:43 PM #
I second you Aaron. File systems are an anarchism of desktop computers.

It is called DOS for "Disk Operating System." There is not a disk in a PDA. Thus, flat file systems are anarchisms and the main reason why PPC isn't doing so well, it is trying to be too much like a desktop computer with a hard disk.

Mike, you still have punch cards lying around and bitch about not being able to do batch jobs on your Palm device too?


RE: Slotnick & Nagel
hussain @ 9/8/2004 4:11:59 PM #
I agree move to PPC, or buy one for PalmOS and without it PalmOS feels much simpler, there is no need to have the stuff put in a specific folder like PPC

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
Strider_mt2k @ 9/8/2004 5:00:09 PM #
Yawn.

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
mikecane @ 9/8/2004 7:34:53 PM #
ardiri: It's very effing simple: STOP reading the messages. But if they are slowly driving you to, say, commit suicide in a ghastly and bloody fashion -- by all means, CONTINUE to read!

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
ardiri @ 9/9/2004 9:03:46 AM #
i might ask ryan if he can have a property to filter messages based on username - your rumblings are total crap; you dont construct them in a way where it can be advantages to any form of discussion.

i am really surprised ryan even bothers letting you write an occasional article here and there - authors for press material should be objective, not subjective; as you obviously are. when can you accept things for the way they are? everyone else is.

continue rambling; not many people are listening.

i saw an article on slashdot recently about developments of a database driven file system; interesting stuff - and, it directly applies to handhelds.

http://linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/09/06/1235236
http://www.gnome.org/~seth/storage/

it seems people are moving away from a traditional file system and moving towards document/custom management solutions - which, is what palmos actually is to begin with.

on a side note, i actually saw the new motorolla pocket pc phone today (MPX) while visiting microsoft here in london. very nice phone; its a bit bulky - but, functions as advertised. i also saw the smartphone c500; while i like palm, i'm also open to accepting that there are other handhelds/smartphones out there.

it just annoys me that ryan can let clueless idiots run rampant during discussions - fun.

---
Aaron Ardiri
PalmOS Certified Developer
aaron_ardiri@mobilewizardry.com
http://www.mobilewizardry.com/members/aaron_ardiri.php

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
mikecane @ 9/9/2004 10:08:41 AM #
ardiri, stick to your thumbsterbation market. When it comes to doing proper *work* on a PalmOS device, you know as little as I know about games.

We don't need no stinkin filesystem, eh? From the Aeroplayer FAQ:

Q: AeroPlayer won't show me all of the songs I've installed. I can see that they're on the card, but they don't show up in the playlist window. What's going wrong?

A: This is limitation of the filesystem used on memory cards. You can avoid this problem by filing your songs in directories. Do not keep all of your songs in the root directory.

And let me remind you that the VFS abomination is a creation of SONY which Palm was dumb enough to roll into the OS.

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
ardiri @ 9/9/2004 10:21:06 AM #
*sigh*

what makes you think that i just develop games? if you cared to do a little bit of research, you'll find that the gaming side is a side project that we work on (well, we do put full time effort into it too). my "normal" job is as a consultant; working on non-gaming projects, and i have a company focusing on vertical market solutions using handhelds:

a) tapwave DRM (some game related issues)
b) www.drcompanion.com (256Mb+ of medical reference material)
c) consultant for vertical market (drilling, security applications)
d) multi platform development kit

unfortunately,

e) gaming

is the one that gets the least amount of my time. so, maybe you want to look into some background before you blurt out like that?

secondly, the bug you mention was a limitation of the "file system" - not the handheld, and your exact point was? if anything, it just identified limits of using a file system - FAT12 (what the cards use) are limited to containing 256 items in a directory if i recall correctly. so, isn't it natural to actually categorise them into directories?

or, how about asking aeroplayer to support one BIG mp3 file and use a cue sheet to jump to certain tracks? there are many solutions to the problem - and, most are the job of the developer. not the device manufacturer.

a good example - the medical project (www.drcompanion.com) accesses over 256mb of information instantly on your palmos device - to the user, the effort is minimal; it just works. why? because we programmed it that way.

---
Aaron Ardiri
PalmOS Certified Developer
aaron_ardiri@mobilewizardry.com
http://www.mobilewizardry.com/members/aaron_ardiri.php

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
mikecane @ 9/9/2004 10:42:01 AM #
ardiri, your rep is games and will stay that way. Not my fault. You need better PR.

Now if you other replies contained enlightenment like *this*, we could be more civil to one another.

I'm going to check out that drcompanion.

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
mikecane @ 9/9/2004 10:44:26 AM #
OMG. That drcompanion is HUGE. Is there a US version?

Everyone should go take a look just to see what it is.

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
ardiri @ 9/9/2004 11:04:40 AM #
ardiri, your rep is games and will stay that way.
well, if i publicized everything i did - people would hate me *g*

OMG. That drcompanion is HUGE. Is there a US version?
its my cash-cow, invested three years of my life into that project

US version? working on it.

i just got back from the USA last week and we are building a custom version with local content (PDR, ICD9, DSM, 5min clinical consult, Harrisons, Netter, et al) - we are working with very large publishers/partners :)

we have been exclusive on palmos - but, i really dont know how for how long. 50% of our calls ask for a pocket pc/smartphone version - which, wont take me long to fix.

---
Aaron Ardiri
PalmOS Certified Developer
aaron_ardiri@mobilewizardry.com
http://www.mobilewizardry.com/members/aaron_ardiri.php

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
mikecane @ 9/9/2004 2:10:28 PM #
Man, if I showed THAT to docs I know, they'd bloody jump on a PalmOS PDA!

Isn't there already something like for PPC -- and it takes 1 GIG?! (And probably has 1GIG of CRASHES too!)

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
Winter_ @ 9/9/2004 5:05:31 PM #
Sorry to jump in when everybody seemed to be friends, but...

It is called DOS for "Disk Operating System." There is not a disk in a PDA. Thus, flat file systems are anarchisms and the main reason why PPC isn't doing so well, it is trying to be too much like a desktop computer with a hard disk.

Macintoshes don't have "DOS", nor the word "disk" on the name of their OS. Neither does Linux. Thus we can safely assume that these OSes don't use disks.
UTTER CRAP, MAN.
(oh, and DOS didn't introduce the concept of folders - in fact DOS 1.0 didn't support folders, IIRC)

Oh, and it's SO nice to see that a way to ORGANIZE files is called "anarchism".
Well, unless you wanted to say "anachronism". (it would still be fun, but at least the thing would make some sense :D )
Next thing... you say PPC's have FLAT file systems? So, they don't have directories?? Sure about that?? Or are you again saying things you don't understand?
And next... you seem to believe that wanting to have a variety of files organized into directories is "trying to be too much like a desktop computer with a hard disk".
So stupid. Where should I begin? "If you want a set of organized files, get a desktop PC; if you can do with a heap of more or less related content humped by some kind of not-clearly-defined category, get a Palm OS device". Is that OK with you?
The way Palm OS works wrt files is great for alone-in-their-little-world apps; but it sucks big time when you have to work with the rest of the real world.

Ardiri, what would you suggest that we should do with our collections of MP3? Make each album a giant MP3?
But then I'd PLEASE want Queen albums to be in some place different than, say, David Bowie albums and The Cure albums.
Or should I make a doubly giant MP3 with the entire career of each singer?
What if tomorrow I have a new album of the same artist? Should I add the album to the giant compendium somehow?
Then, I'd like to have movies apart from music. What should I do now?
Wouldn't it be EASIER to use FOLDERS??

Now imagine a group of independent documents that are related. Like a set of web pages with their images and links.
Should that be a monolithic glob? WHY?

I dearly miss the proper use of metadata in OS X, and love the idea of a database driven filesystem. But I will need to PUT THERE my CURRENT files with their CURRENT organization. Palm OS won't let me. Now please tell me how that is supposed to be good and nice and user friendly and powerful and convenient.

(Once more, I'll stress that in fact perhaps I don't need a filesystem; the exact things I want are: capability to organize the data in the card from the desktop ["hey, after the hideously slow transfer the 3 folders of MP3 I tried to hotsync got into a messed heap in the AUDIO directory; the other files didn't even get transferred!"]; and capability to USE in whatever way I feel like the internal memory in the device ["I want to take with me this 100 KB Word document; there will be no problem because I have 20 free MB on the internal RAM. Uh? How do you mean that I need a card?"]. To me, a filesystem simply looks like the "expectable" way)

Oh, and just to nitpick a little bit: the pointed-to Slashdot thread talks about DataBase FileSystems, but... let me paste...
The DBFS does not actually store files, it holds references to files on the underlying hierarchy based file system.

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
ardiri @ 9/10/2004 6:29:11 AM #
Man, if I showed THAT to docs I know, they'd bloody jump on a PalmOS PDA! Isn't there already something like for PPC -- and it takes 1 GIG?! (And probably has 1GIG of CRASHES too!)

there is nothing as complete as this on pocket pc at this point in time - however, i am in the middle of providing a SHARK port of this. (so, it'll be palm, pocket pc, symbian and whatever comes out).

as for size, it'll be exactly the same size - if you take a look at our games that use SHARK, you'll actually find the ARM binaries for palmos are bigger than the pocket pc versions - this is because we need to add routines to call API's via PACE.

bloating on pocket pc is microsoft's fault - if you use MFC, you instantly gain 200 pounds :) we dont use MFC :)



---
Aaron Ardiri
PalmOS Certified Developer
aaron_ardiri@mobilewizardry.com
http://www.mobilewizardry.com/members/aaron_ardiri.php

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
ardiri @ 9/10/2004 6:32:07 AM #
Ardiri, what would you suggest that we should do with our collections of MP3? Make each album a giant MP3?

how about buying a device who's specific needs are to play mp3 files? do you have to have a 'complete all in one' solution? i use a jens of sweden (www.jensofsweden.com) mp3 player myself - best purchase ever. i prefer to save my pda battery life for real things like keeping track of my day and playing games.

---
Aaron Ardiri
PalmOS Certified Developer
aaron_ardiri@mobilewizardry.com
http://www.mobilewizardry.com/members/aaron_ardiri.php

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
Winter_ @ 9/10/2004 7:02:08 AM #
Ardiri, the conversation is not about MP3, but about organization of discrete files in a PDA.

You suggested that to play a folder full of MP3, which is JUST AN EXAMPLE of a logical way to group together a set of related discrete files, we could just make them a big glob and attach a cue sheet. So we should use MP3 differently than the rest of the world just because we are using a Palm OS device, right?
(then I'd like to know why use then a standard format like MP3...)

Interestingly, you seem to prefer a MP3 player device capable of use FOLDERS, and capable of storing ARBITRARY FILES -- even though it is just a MP3 player!!

And you still suggest that I should leave the PDA for "real uses"?
(like gaming, you say? ...is that a F joke??)

Look, I have with me this F piece of hardware (T3: 400 MHz, stereo sound, integrated battery, lots of memory, MP3 playing software INCLUDED). I have a hard case with belt clip. You mean that I should buy a NEW piece of hardware just to play MP3 - just to sidestep the fact that the OS of this thing is SO terrible organizing files?

Now let's see, I have this folder with Word and Excel files from Project 1, and this other folder from Project 2 with 3 subfolders with a few Word and Excel and HTML files in each of them. PLEASE, tell me how am I supposed to organize them without folders, and how "the Palm way" will make my life easier. Or will that also qualify as some kind of un-"real use"? Should I buy a dedicated device? Like what, PPC?

Next time I think about buying a PDA, should I ask you for the proper uses of it? (because I don't get the difference between "real uses", like gaming, and non-"real uses", like listening to MP3. Oh, and looks like some one should tell PalmOne to stop selling those PDA-MP3 packs)

OMFG.

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
Winter_ @ 9/10/2004 10:54:16 AM #
I just realized that I unknowingly made a secondary point. DOS 1.0 didn't have directories, but 2.0 did (IIRC). They realized that directories were a MUST HAVE! And that was almost 20 years ago.

And you know which kind of storage 1980's computers had, do you? My first hard disk had 40 MB, and it was about 1990... now, on 2004, we have 64 MB of storage on a device - and no directories!! Talk about "backward steps"...

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
mikecane @ 9/10/2004 12:29:03 PM #
Keep hammering at them!

Their heads can't be THAT hard. (waitaminnit... these are the PALM people we're talking about... never heard of "Listen to your customers!")

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
ardiri @ 9/10/2004 2:24:51 PM #
Winter:

your asking about being able to use a file system - so, use a damn external memory card. that is available right now, and you need to start nagging the developers to stop being so damn lazy and expecting everything to be in ram. the VFS API's let you access *all* of the items on the card - if a developer explains there are limits; he's talking about of his backside or is too lazy to work around them.

its not *your* responsibility to get it working - the developer should be doing this. i know it is possible, as i have done it with the medical project i have stated in previous posts.

palm should not be advertising "on device" storage; the memory used internally should be used primarially for simple data storage (PIM data) and applications. the rest should sit on an external memory card - with a PCMCIA adapter, its easy to synchronize between your handheld and your pc.

bitching about what you dont have doesn't mean it will come. you need to accept what you have, and learn to adapt to using it. if palmone/palmsource listened to everyone's bitching/moaning - they would never ever get a release out.

---
Aaron Ardiri
PalmOS Certified Developer
aaron_ardiri@mobilewizardry.com
http://www.mobilewizardry.com/members/aaron_ardiri.php

RE: Slotnick & Nagel
Winter_ @ 9/12/2004 2:19:45 PM #
palm should not be advertising "on device" storage;

Now, with that I can agree 200%. If they just left that out of the specs, it would be fair. (surely they'd have to hint the internal capacity in some way, but it absolutely should not be advertised as storage - at least as "consumer storage").

the developer should be doing this.

Again, I totally agree! But if the OS doesn't allow for easy user access to directories and arbitrary files on card... developers have an excuse to not support them.
(to me it just sounds like a lazy developer, if not something worse - particularly when they have a Pro version of the app suporting the use of directories. But then again, the OS is the easy excuse...)

bitching about what you dont have doesn't mean it will come. you need to accept what you have, and learn to adapt to using it. if palmone/palmsource listened to everyone's bitching/moaning - they would never ever get a release out.

That's why I'm currently using like 5 different ways to try to use the internal RAM and the memory cards in the ways I want to.

The thing I can't stand at all is watching some people trying to boast this crippledness in the OS, this unfulfilled promise, as some kind of advantage. "Palm OS is superior because it won't allow arbitrary files on internal RAM". SO incredible!



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