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Comments on: Sprint Preparing Two Possible Palm Pre Launch Windows?

Palm Pre Release DateRumor: A number of sites are reporting on some new Palm Pre release date speculation late today. PhoneNews has posted an article referencing an internal Sprint memo that states the company has implemented a so called vacation freeze during the month of May. The same report also claims to have details on two possible launch timeframes. The first could come as soon as the weekend of May 17th.

The second window involves Sprint receiving the same units in the aforementioned (5-17) timeframe, but depending on the unit level received for stocking and sales, the launch would then be postponed to June 29th if the initial shipments are deemed too low to begin initial sales in May.

Both accounts should be taken with the usual bit of skepticism, especially without any supporting documentation. They also report, along with PreThinking, that some Sprint employees have started to begin their Palm Pre sales and support training.

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Gotta be careful obout 'sourced' rumors

SeldomVisitor @ 4/10/2009 5:12:45 PM # Q
Most if not all of the "sources" for the current crop of rumors are all ultimately sourced at the same place - that is, though "widespread articles" are saying such-n-such, they're all based off one single site.

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The Pre is not "featured" in the ads. In fact, in the first run of the ads the Pre wasn't even named - it was simply a generic REALLY LONG phone with some text on it about Sprint's Network-to-be. Only in later similar ads were the words "The Palm Pre" below the subtlely below the phone image.

=========

Of course, it's getting real close to end of "1st half 2009" so the Pre will certainly be coming within the next couple months (*), so any real launch anytime now should not come as a surprise but I think a little more solid evidence, or perhaps a few more "grain of salt" words, might be prudent.

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(*) Apple just bought up the supply of 8Gb memory chips (maybe the entire supply?). I have no clue if this could effect Pre timetables but would not be surprised at all if it did.

RE: Gotta be careful obout 'sourced' rumors
freakout @ 4/10/2009 5:35:07 PM # Q
Thanks so much for your input, Mr. Guest Editor. Tell you what, why don't you just hack in to PIC's servers (using your famous copy-and-paste security exploit, of course) and write the articles yourself? Might save a lot of time.
RE: Gotta be careful obout 'sourced' rumors
SeldomVisitor @ 4/10/2009 5:39:46 PM # Q
Do you remember the total-bullshit "AT&T has a 5 year iPhone exclusive"? "Reported" far and wide over and over again until it was The Gospel, only to have the SINGLE source for that "fact", USA Today, quietly retract it completely two years later in an article about the iPhone 3G.

I'd say there's plenty of precedent , REAL precedent, for INSISTING that sites like PiC surround rumors with tons and tons of "but maybe not"s...


RE: Gotta be careful obout 'sourced' rumors
twrock @ 4/10/2009 6:36:41 PM # Q
SeldomVisitor wrote:
I'd say there's plenty of precedent , REAL precedent, for INSISTING that sites like PiC surround rumors with tons and tons of "but maybe not"s...

What, somehow the title with a question mark at the end, the first word being "rumor" and a whole sentence that said, "Both accounts should be taken with the usual bit of skepticism, especially without any supporting documentation." wasn't enough to make it clear?

How about holding your own "reporting" to an equally high standard?

Hey Palm! Where's my PDA with Wifi and phone capabilities?

RE: Gotta be careful obout 'sourced' rumors
vetdoctor @ 4/12/2009 7:07:06 AM # Q
*) Apple just bought up the supply of 8Gb memory chips (maybe the entire supply?). I have no clue if this could effect Pre timetables but would not be surprised at all if it did.

Bought the memory because they needed it or as an attempt to slow Pre?


In short, I had always believed that the world involved magic: now I thought that perhaps it involved a magician.
- Chesterton

RE: Gotta be careful obout 'sourced' rumors
SeldomVisitor @ 4/12/2009 8:29:22 AM # Q
> ...Bought the memory because they needed it or as an attempt to slow Pre?

No one has said, as far as I know.

The "purchase", as with everything else in this tech world, was "reported" in Digitimes INDIRECTLY via Samsung or some other memory-making entity.

http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20090409PD219/nand_flash_supply_to_tighten_after_apple_reportedly_places_large_order.html

BTW - that link WILL go stale, maybe soon, too. So read what's at its end soon if yer gonna read!

RE: Gotta be careful obout 'sourced' rumors
SeldomVisitor @ 4/12/2009 8:30:39 AM # Q
Oh yeah, here's the Engadget repeat of the Digitimes news:

http://www.engadget.com/2009/04/09/a/

That link won't go stale...

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Palm's Thinking

abosco @ 4/10/2009 7:34:12 PM # Q
Here's Palm management's thinking:

"iPhone 3.0 is set to launch at WWDC on June 9. We need to launch the Pre ahead of that."

Basically, the plan was to delay announcing a firm launch date until they knew for certain when Apple was ready to launch. They're calling the other hands before showing their own. Honestly, the best shot they have is to have an excellent launch and hope the new iPhone hardware is a dud.

Otherwise, they're in deep shit.

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: Palm's Thinking
jca666us @ 4/10/2009 8:06:00 PM # Q
abosco,

There is no otherwise - Palm is in a neck high pile of shit.

iphone os 3.0 undoes most of pre's tangible advantages - except multitasking.

based on people examining os 3.0, we can expect an iphone with a substantially faster cpu. better video, video capture, and a magnetometer.

Pre's remaining advantage - a real keyboard - woohoo!

RE: Palm's Thinking
twrock @ 4/10/2009 9:54:45 PM # Q
jca666us wrote:
based on people examining os 3.0, we can expect an iphone with a substantially faster cpu.

Will this hurt battery life even more? Are they doing anything to improve it?

Hey Palm! Where's my PDA with Wifi and phone capabilities?
RE: Palm's Thinking
abosco @ 4/10/2009 10:42:42 PM # Q
If I had to make a SWAG (scientific wild-ass guess), I would say Apple is planning on using OLED displays. That would probably increase usable battery life (not standby time) 30-50%. There was a rumor about OLED displays weeks ago, but I don't know about the reliability in terms of volume required by the iPhone. Sure, maybe Sony can manufacture an HVGA OLED display at three-sigma. But can they maintain that over ten million units?

If it's got a faster processor, faster Wifi, and faster HSDPA, then it would make a lot of sense to me to incorporate a technology that saves a tremendous amount of battery power.

How great would it look to have the iPhone 3.0 be faster in all respects, yet last longer, fit into a smaller frame, and cost the same price?

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: Palm's Thinking
jca666us @ 4/11/2009 5:55:41 AM # Q
Yeah, I read about the oled displays - f they go oled, it'll probably be higher resolution. It would also increase space for a slightly larger battery.

One thing Apple has shown with the ipod line, successive generations get more energy efficient - so it's safe to assume the same with the iphone.

RE: Palm's Thinking
palmato @ 4/11/2009 6:20:00 AM # Q
Based on what my friends tell me (I'm addicted to the pda +SE phone combination) the real battery killer on the iPhone is the 3g data transmission. Those who enable activesync have barely a day of battery life, and sometimes even less than that. Disabling 3g is not a solution of course, since updates need to be fast.

Since the pre is a web based phone, I wonder if battery life is going to be worse than that. Maybe CDMA has better power requirements than GSM, I don't know, but unfortunately it is irrelevant outside the US.
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Hey Admin: Why do we have to keep two profiles?

RE: Palm's Thinking
abosco @ 4/11/2009 11:20:02 AM # Q
Apple won't go with a higher resolution. They have a huge advantage over other platforms like Windows Mobile because everything is highly standardized. Developers don't have to worry about compatibility with different processors, OS versions, screen sizes (and orientations), and memory allocations. Apple will stick with HVGA for a while, I think.

It doesn't matter what the CDMA characteristics are. Nobody will buy that version anyway. At best, Palm can get a million units out the door on Sprint and hope it carries its success onto GSM. Either way, it still has to put up with the same 3G battery drain as all other GSM phones.

If this phone were released for Verizon or AT&T next month, it may have a shot at sustainable success. However, Sprint will hinder plenty of people from getting it. And by the time it comes out on a relevant carrier, a lot of customers will have moved on to the iPhone 3.0 and forgotten about the Pre.

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: Palm's Thinking
mikecane @ 4/12/2009 8:47:05 AM # Q
>>>iphone os 3.0 undoes most of pre's tangible advantages - except multitasking.

And yet I still want the Pre.

Go bite me.

No - yourself.

RE: Palm's Thinking
jca666us @ 4/12/2009 12:03:38 PM # Q
Just did - I taste great- LOL!

You'd best hope there are three million more fanatics like yourself - otherwise you can donate your Pre to the Smithsonian when you die for their "coulda-woulda-shoulda" exhibit.

RE: Palm's Thinking
abosco @ 4/12/2009 4:50:22 PM # Q
mikecane wrote:
And yet I still want the Pre.

Yes, now I remember. You want the Pre because of, "...some unknown, unforeseen software that will only be available on the Pre."

Because, you know, programmers will be flocking to develop applications for an unproven device on a third-rate carrier by a company with a track record of giving developers the finger. I'm sure they will be coming over in droves from the iPhone OS platform. Nobody is making money there.

Remember how Palm's new device wasn't going to be a phone? You're not quite the best barometer when it comes to rumors.

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: Palm's Thinking
jca666us @ 4/12/2009 6:36:32 PM # Q
>You're not quite the best barometer when it comes to rumors.

However, he's an excellent barometer for gauging the cluelessness of the few remaining Palm fanboys.

RE: Palm's Thinking
freakout @ 4/12/2009 7:56:37 PM # Q
bosco:
Because, you know, programmers will be flocking to develop applications for an unproven device on a third-rate carrier by a company with a track record of giving developers the finger. I'm sure they will be coming over in droves from the iPhone OS platform. Nobody is making money there.

Things:

*Palm claim a highly scientific "gazillion" applications for the SDK early access program: http://pdnblog.palm.com/?p=129

*You forget that Sprint's exclusivity agreement doesn't last forever, and a GSM model is coming. Pre is going to be available on a wider range of carriers internationally and domestically in the U.S. and will be able to potentially target many more potential customers than the iPhone.

*As for giving developers grief, the grass really ain't that much greener on the iPhone side of things. If at all. Complaints about Apple's app store approval process are rampant, not to mention that they control the one and only legitimate distribution channel.

Sure, some developers are making money from the Apple Store. What makes you so certain they won't be able to do so on Pre?

RE: Palm's Thinking
nastebu @ 4/12/2009 8:55:55 PM # Q
It's worth remembering that the iPhone exclusivity thing doesn't last forever either. One rumor had it only extended through 2009.

Also, developers might complain about Apple, but they're making money. Lots of money.

RE: Palm's Thinking
freakout @ 4/12/2009 10:43:41 PM # Q
^^ That's the whole point. What's going to stop those same devs making money off Pre? If it sells millions then it'll be an attractive platform to devs regardless of what's happening with Apple.

Devs didn't just up and stop making Windows Mobile applications when iPhone showed up. Blackberry apps didn't shrivel up and die. Heck, there's still new Palm OS apps being made. World don't revolve around Apple, and Pre will attract developers just fine.

RE: Palm's Thinking
jca666us @ 4/13/2009 4:38:33 AM # Q
>Sure, some developers are making money from the Apple Store. What
>makes you so certain they won't be able to do so on Pre?

Reality to freak:

Pre instaled base - zero
Iphone OS installed base: 30 million

Developers won't make decent money on the Pre if/until Palm has several million devices out the door. That would be (optimistically) 2010.

Unless Palm were to seed the developer community with cash the way Apple did - unfortunately cash is very hard to come by at Palm these days.

Also, the app store as a primary point of purchase is a great idea - it puts all developers on equal footing.

Sure there have been issues with various app. restrictions, Apple has consistently improved the process and greatly expanded app. store functionality in OS 3.0


RE: Palm's Thinking
abosco @ 4/13/2009 9:02:00 AM # Q
freakout wrote:
*As for giving developers grief, the grass really ain't that much greener on the iPhone side of things. If at all. Complaints about Apple's app store approval process are rampant, not to mention that they control the one and only legitimate distribution channel.

Sure, some developers are making money from the Apple Store. What makes you so certain they won't be able to do so on Pre?

You're missing the fact that Apple has had tremendous success with this software distribution model, and all other companies are scrambling to replicate it. Microsoft announced they're going to make WM more centralized, and they're coming forth with an app store. Blackberry's app store just went live. Android has one, but up until last month, developers weren't able to charge money for their software. Apple wasn't the first to come out with a centralized app store, but they perfected it. It seems like they have a history of doing that sort of thing.

Also, developers flock to the spot where they can make the most money. When the iPhone App Store went live last year, there were approximately 7-10 million users on the market that had direct access to applications. It exploded. When you look at the Android software library, you'll see it's a very short list. This shows you that programmers aren't just going after the easiest programming route, but rather the platform that exposes their application to the most amount of paying customers.

My point is that the Pre needs massive opening weekend sales, and months later you'll see some good applications for it. But barring that, the most creative ideas are coming out on the iPhone.

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: Palm's Thinking
freakout @ 4/14/2009 4:01:54 AM # Q
^^ Don't get me wrong - I recognise what the Apple app store has done for the mobile software community. heck, even before the App Store or the iPhone SDK came out, I was saying that a central app distribution channel was the future: http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/7891/#141626

So I'm not heaping dirt on the App Store. It's a deserved success and Apple have done a tremendous thing for entrenching the idea of personalising your phone with apps. But Apple are abusing their power by setting themselves up as the only distributor of apps, sole arbiters of what can and cannot legitimately be installed on your hardware. As Tealpoint told PIC...

http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/9689/tealpoint-normsoft-on-webos-its-great-but-we-want-c/

...we've been frustrated with Apple's Mac-only development environment, non-standard language (obj-c), and Orwellian product restrictions that allow it to block any product at any time for any reason, potentially wasting months of our development expense at their whim. Because of these reasons, if we can get hold of the WebOS SDK soon, we'll likely drop the iPhone in favour of it.

My point? It's not all sunshine and rainbows in the App Store and there's plenty of room for alternatives. We agree that Pre needs to sell big to make it attractive, but I don't reckon that'll be a problem.
Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 -> Treo 650 -> Treo 680 -> Centro

RE: Palm's Thinking
abosco @ 4/14/2009 11:41:12 AM # Q
I agree that Apple needs a department that serves to be a developer point of contact. Large companies should be able to contact Apple, list off the features and object of their intended application, and get a pass/fail answer within the week.

Like you said, Tealpoint doesn't want to spend a month of programming time if it won't get them any sales. However, it remains to be seen if Palm will be any less strict, or if Apple will relax their standards over the coming months.

Apple's App Store may seem mature, but in reality, it's been live for less than a year. They're continually improving things (rating schemes, developer contracts, pay-in-app capabilities, etc).

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G

RE: Palm's Thinking
abosco @ 4/14/2009 11:42:58 AM # Q
For the record, I like it better when I don't agree with you and get to call you a moron.

-Bosco
m105 -> NX70v -> NX80v -> iPhone -> iPhone 3G
RE: Palm's Thinking
jca666us @ 4/15/2009 4:29:18 AM # Q
>Heck, even before the App Store or the iPhone SDK came out, I was
>saying that a central app distribution channel was the future:
>http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/7891/#141626

>But Apple are abusing their power by setting themselves up as the only
>distributor of apps, sole arbiters of what can and cannot legitimately be
>installed on your hardware.

OK Nostradamus - how can you say that central app distribution is the future in one sentence, but then chide Apple for being the sole distributor of apps? Isn't that the same thing?

Actually Apple isn't deciding what can or cannot be installed on your hardware, but rather what can or cannot be developed for their platform. There have been issues and growing pains - and Apple is improving - and as long as Apple does a better job of communicating to the developer community, then everyone is better off.

>We agree that Pre needs to sell big to make it attractive, but I don't
>reckon that'll be a problem.

We'll see how well your reckoning is in another month or so. They'll need to sell an awful lot...

RE: Palm's Thinking
freakout @ 4/15/2009 5:52:24 AM # Q
bosco:
For the record, I like it better when I don't agree with you and get to call you a moron.

I miss that too*. Good times, good times. But if you want to save up a free kick for later on, I'm already regretting what I said about mobile games not being killer apps. (i'd dig up the link but I really can't be bothered.) iPhone gaming seems less and less of a fad each day. Palm - or somebody - really need to step up to the plate there.

*At least yours was an entertaining rivalry. jca666us bores me to tears, except for a slightly morbid curiousity into just how dull the Internet can be.

troll:
how can you say that central app distribution is the future in one sentence, but then chide Apple for being the sole distributor of apps? Isn't that the same thing?

No. (You idiot.) See comments from developers on app distribution here: http://pdnblog.palm.com/?p=50#comments

First-party app distribution is essential for mass adoption of mobile software. That doesn't mean that you shouldn't let people go elsewhere if they so choose.

RE: Palm's Thinking
jca666us @ 4/15/2009 5:02:37 PM # Q
Freak,

Instead of behaving (as usual) like a pompous jackass, explain exactly how you would like to see app. distribution handled.

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Skype anyone?

I_want_me_pre @ 4/11/2009 12:42:20 AM # Q
The pre has wifi capabilities so I am guessing skype will be available, right? I mean they are droping the lite version for BB curve and storm.

And yeah June 29 to spite Apple, it's the Iphone's orginal launch date and my B-day, Yah!

RE: Skype anyone?
palmato @ 4/11/2009 6:12:01 AM # Q
Based on what has been publicly released by Palm, the current SDK will not allow building applications like skype. MotionApp had the chance to use the right tools (namely a native SDK) to build the classic emulator. However Palm has said that this is a one time event and currently has no (known) plan to release a native SDK.
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Hey Admin: Why do we have to keep two profiles?
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Skype and Games native sdk

Quixel @ 4/11/2009 8:25:10 AM # Q
currently has no (known) plan to release a native SDK.
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hmmm i guess we are playing games of semantics. What i read is they are not releasing it at aunch but that it would find its way soon to the table as they have also stated there will be high end gaming down the road. I know some want to give a negative reaction towards Palm Pre so they make it soun like no native apps are coming but that is not true at all.
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TV ad

palmit @ 4/13/2009 6:38:32 AM # Q
"A new 1 minute video commercial on YouTube, throws up a Pre at the end."

This ad is not only on YouTube, its been running on TV also.

palminfocenter
frankhamil @ 4/15/2009 12:10:09 PM # Q
My first time here. I'm a long time Palm user, starting with the 300, moving up through the new releases and now using a Centro. I am anxiously awaiting the Pre.

I have a question.

This is a "Palm info center". Why are the iPhone guys here trying to enlighten us to their ways? We obviously have some reason for staying with Palm smartphones. Seems their time would be better spent posting in their own Apple info center and sharing useful information with those who share their zeal for the iPhone.

There's a reason that Baskin Robbins has 31 flavors, and there's a reason there are at least that many smartphones out there.

Seems that, as great as I admit the iPhone is, it does not meet everyone's needs. It doesn't meet mine.

Frank Hamilton


RE: TV ad
AdamaDBrown @ 4/15/2009 12:14:12 PM # Q
Welcome Frank. A lot of the iPhone users here are former Palm users who were long-time frequenters of the site before going over to use the iPhone. As such, they want to share their experiences with other Palm users.
RE: TV ad
twrock @ 4/15/2009 7:49:37 PM # Q
AdamaDBrown wrote:
As such, they want to share their experiences with other Palm users.

Funny way some of them have of "sharing" it. I think there are at least some who tend toward "mocking" vs. "sharing". And believe me, I know about mocking! :-)

I also think that some of them aren't really so sure they made a good choice, so they feel the need to hang around here to try and prove it to themselves (and everyone else). All I can say to those is, "Move on already!" It's just a phone. You don't really need to have someone else be "wrong" about it in order for you to be "right" about it. If the new device is really that good for you, just be happy and join some new group where you can "share" about your new device. It really is ok to move on to a new stage in life.

It's almost like someone who went through a divorce and now feels compelled to rag on their ex all the time to their mutual friends. Dude, get over it and move on. (And just because she didn't work out for you doesn't mean someone else won't find her very attractive still.)

Hey Palm! Where's my PDA with Wifi and phone capabilities?

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'...Pre Launch Windows'?!?

joad @ 4/21/2009 10:13:29 PM # Q
That headline reads a little weird.
Palm "Preh": as in "eh, where's the microSD and Garnet emulator?"
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