Comments on: Treo 680 Image Turns Up

I think if Cingular can do Treo 650s for $50, then there's a good chance this one's going to have similar pricing and specs to the 650. I doubt they're going to put a lower-quality screen than the 650 in this 680, based on Colligan's recent interview response:

What technologies do you see as important to incorporate into future devices?
Probably the biggest thing hardware-wise is better and better displays. That's the "face" of the device and is what appeals to people a lot.

Which is fine with me.

It's lookin' good. Everything I love about my 650, but less ugly. It'd be nice if they'd use the black keys and dark colouring of the 750v, though.

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650

To many people, a phone is a fashion. Why can't Palm provide phones of different styles? While Palm do offer different smartphones with different OS and wireless networks, customers also want choices on their phones' outlook!

Look at how Apple is so successful with their ipods and how Nokia is so successful on their phones.

--
With great power comes great responsiblity.

At conferences, etc, it's quicker to pull a card out of a pocket than to have two people digging out their handhelds. Then again, I'm in the "social sciences" and, as a group, we tend to lag behind the rest of the professional world on technology implementation.

--
PalmPilot Pro (1997) -> III (1998) -> Vx (1999) -> m500 (2001) -> m515 (2002) -> ???

I just can't understand why Palm doesn't build a top end smartphone. Why do they make these small treos with a tiny screen and a keyboard at the buttom. What I would like is:

- 320 * 480 brilliant screen.
- No keyboard (if I want that silly thing i can get it up on the screen)
- IR, BT and most absolutely WI-FI
- I want GSM and most absolutely 3G
- There should be a VOIP sullution as default
- loads of harddisk space but still it should be fast.
(Iv'e had the Lifedrive but it was terrible slow and unstable)
- Processor that kick soma a**.
- Build in microphone
- Build in GPS with tomtom
- Camera well maybe... if they put in there it should be at least 3 mp?
- Long lasting battery

I guess that's about it. But everytime I surf the web in search of propper smartphones I end up looking at Ipaq, Eten, HTC, mio, Qtek or some other brand.
But that doesn't help me when I want a Palm OS soullution does it?

What do you guys want? Do you really like that tiny-screen of treo? :-)

Sincerely
Rune

palm m105, IIIc, zire71, T1, T3, lifedrive, T5, TX

That said, Palm really do need to diversify the Treo line. Ideally, it would come in three flavours:

1) Classic Treo candy-bar style with QWERTY
2) Classic Palm tablet-style PDA with a 320x480 screen but keeping the same overall size as the classic Treo, 'cause a PDA is a bit too big to use as a phone without looking like a complete dork - the Treo's pushing it as it is. ;)
3) Most importantly, a small Treo flip-phone with the standard cellphone keypad. Bung an mp3 player in it, keep the messaging app, make it look pretty. Sell millions.

I don't believe Palm are stupid - naive, maybe - so I think they know all this already. I imagine next year's Treos are going to be a very different-looking bunch; almost certainly they won't be running the "classic" PalmOS.

Or maybe everyone here is right, Palm is doomed, and we won't see anymore new Treos at ALL. How's that for depressing...

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650

As the Treo is on the "cutting edge" of technology, I'm sure Palm would not hesitate to include it in a $650.00 "smart phone" if there were any possible uses for it. Just like they overloaded the Treo 650 with RAM - thinking ahead that their customers might want to load a few databases and programs beyond the basic PIMs.

It's this "looking ahead" philosophy that has made Palm the hands-down champion of the PDA and cell phone market today, and they are unstoppable!

Never forget: just because it's your money paying for that Treo doesn't make you Palm's customer. The carriers are the customer. You will get the features the carriers let you have. They've dipped their toe in the Wi-Fi pool, didn't like the temperature, and now it's no Wi-Fi for you, buddy.

This sad state of affairs may change some day, but for now we need to suck it up or carry two devices.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

Not necessarily, Beersie.

http://tinyurl.com/f75fd

Excuse me, but ultimately *I* am the customer, and it's *my* decision whether to embrace (read 'accept') what they are offering; nobody can force me to "have the features the carriers will let me have". Thus, I *chose not* to buy any Palm device that doesn't have Wifi, and consequently they just lost one customer; the carriers can offer anything they wish, but it'll only do them good if *I* (and everyone else) buy it. What matters at the end of the day is number of units sold, and unsold phones collecting dust on the shelves are of zero use to the carriers, and to Palm.

So one thing is what the carriers wants me to have, another thing is what I decide to have.

Palm Vx (a classic) -> Palm 505 (*yawn*) -> Dell Axim (slooow...) -> Palm TE (great) -> Qtek 9090 (great idea, lousy platform) -> Nokia 6630 (a toy) -> iMate SP3i (not bad) -> Nokia 9300 (can't sync notes!!) -> Treo 650 (awesome) -> hw6915 (almost perfect)

If you plan to be a frequent Wi-Fi user instead of using the carrier network then they are quite happy to see you go. They make their money off their pricey data plans, not off selling you the handset. In fact they take a loss on the phones in hopes of getting you into one of those plans.

freakout, Cingular (largest US carrier) still sells one Wi-Fi enabled phone, a Cingular branded HTC Wizard, but since releasing that they have brought out no others to market that I'm aware of. I think we have seen the same pattern with the others. Now that Cingular is releasing the Nokia E61 with the Wi-Fi cut out and calling it the E62 I believe the story has been told: they consider Wi-Fi to be more of a loss than a leader.

I think the US carriers may be spooked about the free/cheap municipal Wi-Fi buildouts starting to occur in some major US cities (as well as some small ones: http://www.pikesoft.com/blog/index.php?itemid=111). The Verizon CEO has delivered some surprisingly shrill and frightened-sounding statements against municipal Wi-Fi that let on what a concern this trend is for his company.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
www.pikesoft.com/blog

Don't forget the mostly ignored Samsung i730 on Verizon. Good CDMA performance and a decent 240*320 screen. Integrated wi-fi and BT, even though Verizon has done their usual bit of crippling the BT profiles. A shame the slider has mnay of the same issues that plagued the Palm T|T series. I prefer the Treo keyboard over the Samsung's.

But yes, to answer your question, you have at least one other smartphone offered by the US telcos with integrated wi-fi.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

At T-Mobile's, the data plan for my Treo 600(250MB) costs 18€. Afaik, 1.5GB cost 75...and theres no unlimited plan available.

Compare that to the chesap 30$ plan a friend reported me from the states and you see why people want wifi here...

Best regards
Tam Hanna

P.s. Data prices are falling here, too nowadays..finally!

Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog:
http://tamspalm.tamoggemon.com

http://www.sprint.com/business/products/phones/ppc6700_allPcsPhones.jsp

With available cheap EVDO plans (500 anytime minutes + unlimited EVDO for as low as $30/month!) + the ability to run Skype + impending government-sponsored Wi-Fi networks, it's obvious that having a lot of phones like this would quickly bankrupt Sprint. Either way, I can't see the carriers surviving the VoIP "paradigm shift". Expect to see several carriers merge in the next year or two (it's already started), but their heyday is over. People are sick of being fleeced.

The timing is just about perfect for Google to introduce its free portable VoIP service...

The carriers are fcuked and I don't think anyone will shed a tear for them. Bwahahahaha!

TVoR

I did a quick Google on i730. The Verizon page that pops up at the top of the list makes no mention at all of the wi-fi capabilities. Amusingly. Seems even when they do offer wi-fi they don't go out of their way to advertise it...

They are TERRIFIED of anyone figuring out that Verizon OR Sprint have any wi-fi integrated smartphones currently in their lineups.

I would also assume that's why everyone is so silent to the fact that the 700w/wx have drivers for Palm's wi-fi SDIO card built in. On the 700wx, with its extra RAM, giving up SD storage is ALMOST possible in order to keep an SDIO wi-fi card installed. ALMOST. I'd much rather have one of the newer low-profile, minimally protruding wi-fi SDIO cards in my smartphone that the enormous brick of a card Palm currently offers under their branding.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

Now that's stretching the truth a little: no company is happy, not even indifferent, at a customer leaving; as soon I change carriers Vodafone will call me up and try to convince me to stay with them. They've done this in the past and they'll do it again. That's hardly the behavior of an indifferent company. And when they do call I'll certainly let them know the reason for me leaving. Do I expect things to change because of that? Of course not. But contrary to what you say I don't need to, nor will I, "suck it up". That's why I got the hw6915.

Having said that, it is true that they do make the money off data plans. But that also includes phone calls and not only 3G, hence their concern when a customer leaves, regardless of them selling me the handset or not.

Palm Vx (a classic) -> Palm 505 (*yawn*) -> Dell Axim (slooow...) -> Palm TE (great) -> Qtek 9090 (great idea, lousy platform) -> Nokia 6630 (a toy) -> iMate SP3i (not bad) -> Nokia 9300 (can't sync notes!!) -> Treo 650 (awesome) -> hw6915 (almost perfect)

Although. A question I don't think I've seen asked*: if wifi does become ubiquitous and everyone has a device that uses it, won't we start to see free wifi networks become overloaded and next to useless? After all, if everyone is using them then the costs for the operators of these free networks will start to add up. They might be able to beat that with ad-supported access or something, or charging fees for service with no ads, but then you're pretty much back where you started: if you want unfettered on-the-go access, you have to pay.

*possibly because it's a stupid one

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650

Completing the e-com circle with a people driven we-com solution
WiFi & BT? No strings attached
we_tellurian@canada.com

Surur

They said I only argued for the sake of arguing, but after an hour I convinced them they were wrong...
Hey!! I made associate writer at PDA247. Come see my nattering over there!!
www.clieuk.co.uk/wm.shtml

But we still have GSPDA. Good, classic 2G machines without video calling crap...

Best regards
Tam Hanna

Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog:
http://tamspalm.tamoggemon.com

You're missing out on the integration between PIM and Phone which 2 devices can't replicate. You're also missing out on fast, seamless, integrated Internet features.

Sprint is pretty good in NYC. But their big attraction is the cheap unlimited data plans.

http://www.sprint.com/

One good thing to come from this release is it appears the external antennas are finally going away in Treo designs. As the Treo with the stub was already at the maximum radiation release allowed by US law, they must have finally cracked the secret to keeping it under the wire.

The Samsung i550 would have been a great phone. But you'll never get to buy one because a couple years ago the idiots at Sprint decided to go with the Treo 650 instead. Unless Samsung releases a PalmOS i650 with EVDO (dream on) we'll never see a good PalmOS smartphone again.

I've had a $20 Tracfone for about two months now. I finally had to cave in and get a phone.

Why? Did you lose one of your tin cans? Or did the string finally break? Is it in case you fall and can't get up, Old Boy? Do what I did Cane: dump your land line and sign up for a SERO phone plan (unlimited EVDO, unlimited nights + weekends, free roaming (onto Verizon, etc), clear voice quality, around half the usual rate price) with Sprint. Do a Google searh for SERO plan for the details. And if you want to save on long distance and Internet charges, just use a Sprint EVDO phone as your broadband modem and Skype on a laptop or desktop for long distance. ipevo makes a high quality USB phone called the Free-1 that is specifically designed for Skype and it only costs around $30. http://www.ipevo.com/v2/prod/p000005.htm The Free-1 sounds almost as good as a land line if you have a decent high speed connection with Skype. Even works with those dumba$$ Apple computers that wankers like you seem to feel the need to abuse themselves with. ("How come you don't make a Mac version of that program? Waaaaaaaaaa! Waaaaaaaaaa!)

The regional Bells and other traditional long distance providers must be crapping their diapers (I'm sure you know what that's like, Cane) right around now. With Skype already carving out a HUGE chunk of the world's long distance in just 3 years of existence, VoIP is already turning the telephone industry upside down. The paradigm officially shifted in 2006. All that matters now is the Internet backbone and having portable broadband access to it. Since switching to Sprint's SERO plan and using Skype I'm already saving over $100/month compared to what I used to pay for equivalent services.

I went cheeeep to get some experience.

No, you went cheap because you ARE cheap.

I still love PalmOS (fek WinMob!)... will this new cheeep Treo be my upcoming *real* phone? Or will I stay with my ancient Clie and go Samsung?

1) Get a Samsung A920 EVDO Bluetooth dumbphone from Sprint.
2) Enable tethering mode (do a Google search for Modem NAI).
3) Pray you find a European (Bluetooth-capable) CLIE TH55 for sale.
4) Ask yourself why you took so long to upgrade to a modern color-screened PalmOS device.
5) Biotch endlessly because with this setup you finally have nothing to biotch about.

Decisions...

The RIGHT decision is pretty simple. If you can't find a European TH55, see if Zodiac 2 are still available (for only $125) from Olympic Systems.

TVoR

P.S. Welcome to the reality of cellphones. Biotch.

They have cool candybar hardware!

Best regards
Tam Hanna

Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog:
http://tamspalm.tamoggemon.com

You're missing out on the integration between PIM and Phone which 2 devices can't replicate. You're also missing out on fast, seamless, integrated Internet features.

Sprint is pretty good in NYC. But their big attraction is the cheap unlimited data plans.

http://www.sprint.com/

(reposted in correct place)

They have cool candybar hardware!"

Uh..Tam, aside from the fact that GSPDA phones are garbage they also aren't available State-side. Any person intent on selecting a PalmOS-powered Smartphone would have to be desperate to choose GSPDA, and will pay a exorbitant premium in doing so. Provided you can even find one for purchase. Have you looked at the specs on the M68 for example? 160x220 display. I rest my case.

QOOL labs makes some "interesting" PalmOS phones, or did at one time. But there again, in so choosing you are burdened with a low-res display. And in the case of both GSPDA and QOOL, the GUI has been so heavily customized with proprietary extensions it scarcely resembles the typical Palm experience. Neither company made serious inroads into the market, even in Asia. Buying either phone offers its own set of dangers in the form of lack of support and obsolescence.

My advice, is to go with the Treo 680 if you want a full PDA experience on a phone. One thing I will say about the Palm-based Treo, inferior though it is, it does at least provide access (no pun intended) to a library of all your favorite Palm apps. There is something to be said for that.

Which device you choose; a Samsung dumb-phone or Treo, has a much to do with your usage habits and requirements as the carrier you use. For example, if all you really intend to use the phone for is voice calls, then a dumb phone is a perfectly acceptable choice. When combined with a Bluetooth radio you can connect your Nokia 770 to the web by pairing the two devices.

On the other hand, if you really want a seamless sync experience in managing your contacts, calendar, notes, tasks, etc., the Palm is definitely the way to go. Speaking as someone who made the transition from common plebe phone to a Smartphone; once you go Smartphone it is difficult to go back. Once you've used a Treo or Windows Mobile phone you immediately have an epiphany. A realization that this is the way mobile computing should be. Simple, integrated, converged. What makes a smartphone even more compelling is the QWERTY keyboard. If you ever attempt texting from a typical phone keypad, you're in for quite a "treat" once you experience T9 input first hand. How anyone finds text input on cell phones to be tolerable I will never understand. Nothing compares to QWERTY. That's a tough combination to beat.

Good luck with your choice.

P.S. one last piece of advice: if you decide on a dumb phone, look at Nokia, Sony-Ericsson, and Samsung (which you already have). Those are the ONLY handsets that I endorse based on hardware design and software ease of use. Whatever you do stay away from Motorola. They have the absolute worst software platform in the industry. I have the SLVR L7, and I rarely use the damned thing in no small part to the wretched interface and clunky user experience. Symbian S60 is the simplest interface. Followed by Sony-Ericsson, followed closely by Samsung.

-------------------------------
PocketFactory, www.pocketfactory.com
Elitist Snob, www.elitistsnob.com

I'll use a *real* device for web still, like the Nokia 770 (which has gotten better). The initial appeal of a cheap Treo is combining the CLIE and Tracfone. One less device to carry. I'm convinced the web on phones, right now, is as useful (read: useLESS) as WAP was. This isn't Japan with DoCoMo...

That is the case with the Nokia E61, which right now stands as the pinnacle of mobile web browsing on cellular devices. Built upon Apple's Safari rendering engine (WebKit), it even features mouse pointer navigation; something I had not seen or experienced on a mobile device until now. With just the movement of my thumb I can point and click on any link, or navigate to any web page even while driving (kids, don't try this at home..or in the car). So the next time you are behind some guy swerving all over the road, forcing pedestrians into the bushes..that will be me.

Even Pocket IE isn't too bad, when used in landscape. Screen orientation plays a large role in the value of web browsing a a small screen. Square Palm screens I find to be miserable. On the Nokia E61, which has a widescreen (landscape) display, it is fantastic. Pocket PC phones like the HTC TyTn, combined with Opera for Windows Mobile can be pretty damn sweet, especially on a WiFi connection or 3G data network.

However, a PalmOS-based Treo represents the bottom of the barrel in terms of web browsing. Blazer is a toy, the Playschool among mobile browsers. When you combine that with a brain dead OS like Garnet, the results are extreme disappointment.

Note to PalmOS users: Don't look at the Nokia E61..it will spoil you!

-------------------------------
PocketFactory, www.pocketfactory.com
Elitist Snob, www.elitistsnob.com

The Internet on the Treo is actually very usable. There are a lot of good sites that have "mobile-enhanced" little brothers - ie Google, Yahoo, CNN, MSN, etc. This makes surfing fast and efficient. Add EVDO and you're really cooking. The world at your fingertips fast - anytime, anywhere.

There's no reason to buy/manage/charge/carry/sync/fight/fumble with 2+ devices when ONE Smartphone can do it all.

http://politicalhumor.about.com/od/bushvideos/v/bushfoolme.htm

It's obvious from the advice certain posters are giving you that you are hated here at Palminfocenter.

look at the GSPDA folks!!!

They have cool candybar hardware!

GSPDA has some egregious crap for sale. And good luck finding support for this hardware that isn't even officially sold in the USA.

My advice, is to go with the Treo 680 if you want a full PDA experience on a phone. One thing I will say about the Palm-based Treo, inferior though it is, it does at least provide access (no pun intended) to a library of all your favorite Palm apps. There is something to be said for that.

Go with an unproven Treo that hasn't even been released yet? W T F??? After seeing all the quality control and NVFS disasters we've been treated to by Palm/Handspring with the Treo 600/650/700p? Amazing.

Yes it's nice to have an all-in-one device, but only if it actually does "all" fairly well. Even then, there are numerous compromises in choosing a smartphone over a dumbphone/PDA combo (size, weight, battery life, loss of data redundancy, loss of easy/cheap upgradability (admittedly probably not an issue for someone like Cane who is still using a 7 year old monochrome PDA), screen size/readability (likely a HUGE issue for someone like Cane with 70 year old eyes), voice quality, reception, integration with Bluetooth headsets/handsfree kits (probably not an issue with someone like Cane who doesn't own a vehicle and has never even learned how to drive), etc.)

The only - and I mean ONLY - advantage I see in buying one of the current crop of Palm branded smartphones is compatibility with the PalmOS app library, assuming a user already has a lot of old, familiar PalmOS apps accumulated over the years. Unfortunately, the fly in the ointment for that argument is the presence of the dreaded NVFS/CrapRAM™ instead of RealRAM™. CrapRAM™ savagely butchers compatibility with old programs and causes severe instability of PalmOS devices that use it. Stability, speed and ease of use USED to be the three defining features of PalmOS. That is why we paid premium prices for underspecced hardware and turned a blind eye over the years to software that other platforms got before PalmOS like multimedia, Skype, Slingbox, etc. If PalmOS devices featuring NVFS are now slow and unstable, what exactly is the point of using PalmOS? I've seen more crashes in a month of using my (NVFS-crippled) Treo 700p than I have in 10 YEARS of using literally dozens of non-NVFS PalmOS devices. Go figure. The only use I have for the Treo 700p is as a broadband EVDO modem, backup phone and - hopefully - eventually a device I can use for long distance calls around the world using a REAL Skype client.

Which device you choose; a Samsung dumb-phone or Treo, has a much to do with your usage habits and requirements as the carrier you use. For example, if all you really intend to use the phone for is voice calls, then a dumb phone is a perfectly acceptable choice. When combined with a Bluetooth radio you can connect your Nokia 770 to the web by pairing the two devices.

Yes.

On the other hand, if you really want a seamless sync experience in managing your contacts, calendar, notes, tasks, etc., the Palm is definitely the way to go.

Wrong. An unstable Treo is not worth the headaches of having an all-in-one device. And last time I checked, traditional PalmOS PDAs were pretty good at presenting "a seamless sync experience in managing your contacts, calendar, notes, tasks, etc". I don't understand how people blindly ignore all the compromises that have to be made in using a smartphone. Just because smartphones are fashionabe everyone seems to be jumping on the smartphone bandwagon and forgetting how useful the traditional PDA form factor is.

Speaking as someone who made the transition from common plebe phone to a Smartphone; once you go Smartphone it is difficult to go back.

Yes, but (for me) unless a smartphone is as small as a (tiny) dumbphone, it quickly becomes a pain in the a$$ (literally) lugging it around all the time. And then there's the (horrid) voice quality issues with Treos...

Once you've used a Treo or Windows Mobile phone you immediately have an epiphany. A realization that this is the way mobile computing should be. Simple, integrated, converged.

Yes, Kent. But once you've used a Samsung i500 you'll have ANOTHER epiphany. A realization that THIS is the way mobile computing should be. Simple, integrated, converged, tiny size, light, superb build quality and voice quality that sounds like a land line. There's a good reason why so many people that worked for Palm/PalmSource and as Palm developers still use this 4 year old phone every day...

What makes a smartphone even more compelling is the QWERTY keyboard. If you ever attempt texting from a typical phone keypad, you're in for quite a "treat" once you experience T9 input first hand. How anyone finds text input on cell phones to be tolerable I will never understand. Nothing compares to QWERTY. That's a tough combination to beat.

Agreed. But the original Treo 600 keyboard was easier to use than later "improved" versions.

Good luck with your choice.

You know Cane. He'll never actually BUY anything. Instead he'll keep yapping and agonizing on a dozen PDA sites for YEARS over trivial details while continuing to use his 7 year old monochrome Sony CLIE S320 and the phone booth a block from his dingy New York tenament apartment.

P.S. one last piece of advice: if you decide on a dumb phone, look at Nokia, Sony-Ericsson, and Samsung (which you already have). Those are the ONLY handsets that I endorse based on hardware design and software ease of use.

Exactly. Sony Ericsson only did one CDMA (Sprint) phone - the legendary T608 - but unless someone only wanted a simple phone with good voice quality, I'd avoid trying to track one of them down. The Samsung A920 is probably the best EVDO-capable phone Sprint has right now. If someone is willing to go with GSM the phone selection improves (several slick Sony Ericssons and a few decent Nokias). GSM also allows phone whores to easily change between phones by swapping out SIM cards, but reception, voice quality and data plans are generally vastly inferior to Sprint (CDMA).

Whatever you do stay away from Motorola. They have the absolute worst software platform in the industry. I have the SLVR L7, and I rarely use the damned thing in no small part to the wretched interface and clunky user experience. Symbian S60 is the simplest interface. Followed by Sony-Ericsson, followed closely by Samsung.

Agreed.

MikeCon - get a 650 or 700p from Sprint for cheap.

Stay FAR away from those pieces of crap, Caney.

Treo 650 - obsolete, 23 MB pathetic CrapRAM™, buggy email, crappy camera, big, heavy, poorly made, crappy voice quality.

Treo 700p - CrapRAM™, unstable, S L O W, big, heavy, crappy camera, etc.

You're missing out on the integration between PIM and Phone which 2 devices can't replicate.

Integration isn't worth putting up with substandard equipment to achieve.

You're also missing out on fast, seamless, integrated Internet features.

It only takes a few extra seconds to connect a traditional PDA to a tiny Bluetooth dumbphone. But those "Internet features" are a He11 of a lot more enjoyable/readable on a traditional 320 x 480 tablet PDA than a tiny 320 x 320 Small Square Screened Treo.

Sprint is pretty good in NYC. But their big attraction is the cheap unlimited data plans.

The ONLY reason to put up with the imbeciles at Sprint (possibly the most pathetic customer service reps on the planet) is the excellent voice quality and their cheap data plans. And if you get a SERO plan (e.g. $30 for unlimited EVDO data, 500 anytime minutes, free nights + weekends, free roaming onto Verizon etc., free long distance, free picture mail, etc) Sprint is IMPOSSIBLE to beat right now.

I'll use a *real* device for web still, like the Nokia 770 (which has gotten better).

Yes someone your age would have a lot of difficulty viewing the tiny Treo screen for long periods of time.

The initial appeal of a cheap Treo is combining the CLIE and Tracfone. One less device to carry. I'm convinced the web on phones, right now, is as useful (read: useLESS) as WAP was. This isn't Japan with DoCoMo...

Yes, Internet on a Treo is an exercise in frustration. But Nokia's E61 does show that Internet on a smartphone is doable - provided you have the right software and hardware.

The Internet on the Treo is actually very usable.

Bull. Internet on a Treo is for emergency use only. The tragic formatting "issues" Blazer has makes most web pages almost unreadable. Not to mention all the content that won't display on a Treo. If you want REAL browsing on a small device, for now the BEST solution is getting a UMPC like the VAIO UX50 and a tiny Broadband EVDO + Bluetooth-capable phone like the Samsung A920.

There's no reason to buy/manage/charge/carry/sync/fight/fumble with 2+ devices when ONE Smartphone can do it all.

Unfortunately "ONE Smartphone [CANNOT] do it all". Choose a smartphone over a good separate PDA + dumbphone combo and you give up PDA screen size/readability, battery life, voice quality, data redundancy, etc., etc.

Cane, dumba$$ Geeko is trying to fcuk you up, as usual. It's unfortunate that Ryan can't automagically killfile his screed.

TVoR

I wonder if I should stop in a Cingular store to see if I can snag specs and price...

The *price* is the thing. Got that, Palm?

Cingular is what again -- GSM?

GSM = hardware freedom.
CDMA = hardware confinement

-------------------------------
PocketFactory, www.pocketfactory.com
Elitist Snob, www.elitistsnob.com

Anyway, off to Cingular...

http://home.triad.rr.com/rlwhitt/palm/

http://treocentral.com/content/Stories/911-1.htm

Someone like you isn't going to switch phones three times a day, so the point of GSM and their SIM cards is moot. You should look for good coverage, good voice quality, cheap voice plan and cheap data plan. (Don't underestimate how useful a fast data plan is. Like 480 x 320 color screens, memory expansion, OLED screens, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, and Astroglide, once you've used them you'll wonder how you ever did without them.)

1) Coverage - depends on where you live who gives the best coverage. You have to either ask other people living near you or borrow phones and test for yourself. And remember there can be HUGE differences in reception between various phones ON THE SAME CARRIER. Ideally you want a plan that allows free roaming onto another network and a phone that allows you to force roaming.

2) Voice quality - CDMA (Sprint, Verizon, etc) blows GSM (Cingular, T-Mobile) away.

3) Cheap voice plans - Sprint's SERO plans currently are untouchable.

4) Cheap data plans - Sprint's SERO plans currently are untouchable. (SERO plans include FREE unlimited EVDO Broadband access.)

Don't be a sucker, Caney. Go to a site like howardforums and edumacate yourself (preferrably by READING rather than posting a series of dumba$$ questions and pi$$ing everyone off).

http://www.howardforums.com/

TVoR

500min $30 (includes unlimited vision data, unlimited nights and weekends, unlimited mobile to mobile, pic and video mail, long distance, voicemail, caller id, call waiting)

http://discussion.treocentral.com/showthread.php?t=106778

I am seriously thinking about going back to my standby TX + whatever Verizon's best performing SMALL flip phone of the moment is (V3m, KRZR k1m, Samsung something or another)

I hate the Verizon UI but their coverage in my part of the world is simply untouchable. I have never had a bad experience with a Verizon phone reception-wise UNTIL the 700P.

Since Palm refuses to allow CDMA BT DUN/tethering, I may end up having to sync/fumble/fight with THREE devices just to do everything I need to do with no compromises;

#1 RAZR/KRZR for voice calling
#2 Palm Treo 700P for e-mail anywhere/everywhere (no voice plan, just a data plan)
#3 Palm TX for PIM/e-books/media/gaming.

Pathetic, huh?

I haven't been to NYC that recently but Verizon's coverage there is understandably very good. Cingular is pretty good but it tends to be spotty in the boonies as well as in congested metro areas.

Cane;

Get the refurb'd Zod 2 + an older CDMA phone (Moto E815 or LG VX8100 would be ideal) that is proven to support PDA BT DUN and knock yourself out. Then stick a wi-fi SDIO card in one Zod slot and a 2gb SD slot in the other and go nuts.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX-->Treo 700P

1) Zodiac 2 from Olympic Systems: 128 MB RealRAM™, dual SD slots = $125

2) Sprint SERO plan: 500 anytime minutes, unlimited EVDO broadband access, free nights + weekends calling, free roaming, free long distance, free calling to other Sprint users, etc. etc.

http://www.sprint.com/sero
enter john.smith@sprint.com and your zip code to get access to the SERO site...

3) Samsung A920 phone = $137 with SERO plan

4) Kingston 2 GB SD card from Amazon.com = $40

5) SD Wi-Fi card from Amazon.com (if Caney gets an extra paper route) = $82

______________________________________________________________________________

FROM THE SERO SITE:

Sprint Employee Referral Offer 500 See More Plans >>
Sprint Vision or Power Vision Included Free
Transform your wireless experience from functional to fantastic with features and content that are very visual, extra entertaining, and perfectly personalized. Customers who choose a Power Vision(sm) or Sprint PCS Vision(sm) phone will also receive:

- Unlimited Web access
- Unlimited email and instant messaging - AOL, MSN and Yahoo
- Unlimited Sprint PCS Picture Mail(sm) with Video Mail

Power Vision(sm) Phones available: Samsung A940, Samsung A900, Sanyo MM-9000, Sanyo MM-7500

Sprint PCS Vision(sm) Phones available: LG VI-125, LG PM-225, Samsung VI-A820, Sanyo VI-2300, LG PM-325, Samsung PM-A840, Sanyo MM-8300, Samsung MM-A880, PalmOne Treo 650

Unlimited Night & Weekend Minutes
Night & Weekend Minutes are used from 9 p.m. to 7 a.m., Monday through Friday and all day on Saturday and Sunday. If your Sprint PCS Service Plan does not include Night & Weekend Minutes, then minutes used during this time would count towards your Anytime Minutes. Night & Weekend Minutes are also shared between all phones on a Sprint PCS Add-a-Phone account.
Unlimited Mobile To Mobile Calling
Make and receive calls directly to and from Sprint PCS and most Nextel subscribers while on the Nextel national Network without using your service plan minutes. Excludes Nextel subscribes in certain markets.
Nationwide Long Distance
Long distance calls made on the Sprint Nationwide PCS Network are included in your minutes for no additional charge. International calling is not included.
Crystal-Clear Calls
Because Sprint has the largest all-digital, all-PCS nationwide network, you will enjoy crystal-clear calls while on the Sprint Nationwide PCS Network.
Voice Mail
Voicemail answers your calls and takes messages when you're not available. Voicemail allows you to retrieve your messages quickly and easily. Just press one button, check your voicemail, then press a button to return a call.
Caller ID
Caller ID shows you the numbers for most incoming calls, so you know who's calling before you answer. If you don't want to answer your Sprint PCS Phone, you can let the incoming call roll to your voicemail box. Caller ID works whenever your phone is on. It even works when Call Waiting alerts you of an incoming call. What's more, Caller ID safeguards your wireless calling privacy with Caller ID Block. When you initiate a call, you can decide whether your phone number is shown to the person you're calling. For maximum flexibility, you can activate Caller ID Block on a call-by-call basis or choose permanent call blocking.
Call Waiting
Call Waiting helps ensure that all your important calls get through when you're talking on another call. When you hear the distinct Call Waiting tone, glance at the Caller ID on your Sprint PCS Phone's digital display to see who's calling. Then you can decide whether you want to switch to the new call.
Numeric Paging
You can receive numeric pages on your Sprint PCS Phone instead of voicemail messages. When Numeric Paging is turned on, your voicemail will prompt callers to either leave a voice message or send a numeric page.
Three-Way Calling
Three-Way Calling lets you talk to two people at the same time. You can use Three-Way Calling even if you didn't start the phone call. (Airtime and long-distance charges apply for both of the calls in your Three-Way Calling party.)
Call Forwarding ($0.20/min)
With Call Forwarding, all your incoming calls will be forwarded to the phone number you specify—not your Sprint PCS Voicemail box—and you won't hear a single ring on your Sprint PCS Phone. You can activate and deactivate Call Forwarding as you need it—changing the forwarding number when the need arises. Each forwarded call costs $0.10 per minute, plus any additional long-distance charges.
Sprint PCS Directory Assistance ($1.40 per call, plus airtime)
Just dial 411 on your Sprint PCS Phone to access a variety of convenient services - phone numbers, driving directions, show times, restaurant reservations and more! For only $1.40 per call, plus airtime charges, you can receive up to three requests per call and be automatically connected at no additional charge.
Casual Text Messages ($0.10 per message)
Text Messaging is a global phenomenon which has changed the way people communicate. Utilizing the keypad of your phone as a "typewriter," you can create short messages from your phone or our website and send them to almost any phone in the United States while on Sprint PCS network! Learn the lingo... For example, "see you later" is commonly sent as "C U L8R." Whether your phone uses Short Mail or SMS to send text messages, it is a simple, fun, discreet way to get your message delivered, and the easiest way to communicate. Snd a txt 2day!
Plan minutes are anytime minutes
Plan minutes are anytime minutes

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Anytime Minutes Per Month 500
Weekend Minutes Unlimited Night & Weekends
Contract Term 2 years
Monthly Service Charge $30.00**
Additional Minutes $5 for every 50 minutes for 501 - 1000; Above 1000 minutes, $0.10/min
Long Distance Charge $0.00
Roaming Charge $0.00/min - Included
Activation Fee $0.00
Early Termination Fee $200.00

Treo 650 - obsolete, 23 MB pathetic CrapRAM™, buggy email, crappy camera, big, heavy, poorly made, crappy voice quality.

Just to provide the usual counterpoint from a satisfied 650 owner: the Treo has a superb phone UI, the best messaging system of any phone on the market, superior one-handed usage, a beautiful screen, perfectly adequate phone reception (the GSM one does, at least) and a large range of third-party apps that can make it do pretty much whatever you want. Except wi-fi. ;) The build quality on mine is excellent; it has survived more falls than I can remember and lived to till the tale. It feels nice in the hand and isn't awkward to hold and maneuver unlike a lot of the tiny, thin phones that force you to perch your fingers around them like the talons of some kind of demented, vengeful chicken.

It is also cheap. I've seen on Treonauts that you can get the 650 for $50 on Cingular with rebates. Although whether the plans are a good deal or not, I have no idea.

Tim
I apologise for any and all emoticons that appear in my posts. You may shoot them on sight.
Treo 270 ---> Treo 650

Don't want any of that. I have voicemail and that other stuff turned off on the Tracfone.

It's too bad this thread has become yet another sewer. Hey, Ryan, you've become lower than a pimp. At least a pimp will *admit* beng a pimp.

Don't want any of that. I have voicemail and that other stuff turned off on the Tracfone.

Who cares if you think you want it now or not? Whether you want it or not you get it - all for an amazing price with the SERO plans. (There are no plans offered by ANY carrier that come even slightly close to matching Sprint's SERO plans). If you don't need a feature, simply ignore it or turn it off. While you're at it, maybe you could turn off the color on the screen and set it to black & white. Real bright, Cane. Maybe next you'll complain that you don't need the sound quality to be as good as it is. Or that you don't need 500 anytime minutes. Or that you don't need free nights & weekend minutes. We've tried to help you get a clue in this thread, but as per your usual M.O. it's obvious that you're just "looking" and will never actually sign up for (and keep) a cellphone contract or even buy another PalmOS PDA. Begone troll.

It's too bad this thread has become yet another sewer.

Tends to happen when you're around, Caney. Speaking of which, WHY are you back? I thought (hoped) you'd said you were leaving, never to return. But like a mangy cur you keep dragging your fleabitten hide back to the site. Hmmm...

Hey, Ryan, you've become lower than a pimp. At least a pimp will *admit* beng a pimp.

Wow. Nice words for Ryan - a man that provides so much to so many people all around the world FOR FREE. What have you EVER done for the PalmOS community, Caney? Nothing. If Ryan is "lower than a pimp", what does that make you? Go back to the Village and hang out by the tracks some more, you pervert.

TVoR

TVoR

You are pathetic beyond example.

You are also the biggest coward ever to post anywhere.

No, Mike, we won't.

Ryan, the editor of this tabloid, does not want reasoned conversation and discourse.

Ryan wants the vicious, vulgar posts from TVoR and Gekko.

Their posts attract readers. Ryan does not care about the damage it does do the Palm community.

You see what you've done to yourself, Ryan?

Very sad.

Whew!

Please don't lump me in with the help desk pervert.

>>>500min $30 (includes unlimited vision data, unlimited nights and weekends, unlimited mobile to mobile, pic and video mail, long distance, voicemail, caller id, call waiting)

Are you getting by with just 500 minutes? I guess the free nights/weekends and m2m help a lot.

Check out this link to see a sample of Mobile sites you can hit on the fly:

http://www.pdaportal.com/category.php?category=All+Categories&language=All+Languages&sortoption=Name

"The World is Yours!"

Ah, he's the one to blame!!

Thanks.

Car, driver and handheld device communicate
Intel CEO Paul Otellini introduces colleague Anand Chandrasekher, vice president of low-power platforms, at the Intel Developer Forum, Sept. 26, in San Francisco. The two chipmaker execs look at a new tablet and how it communicates with a Wi-Fi-equipped car.

Sep 26, 2006 1:15:00 PM

http://news.com.com/Car,+driver+and+handheld+device+communicate/1606-2_3-6119744.html?

One day we will be rid of you. In the mantime, everyone can laugh as your flood of stupid words are scrolled by and ignored. In all these yeats, you've never been right about a single thing (don't drag out your URLs; more words to ignore), and unlike everyone else, you've been banned and had messages deleted from multiple sites. You're not wanted or welcome anywhere.

You are pathetic beyond example.

You are also the biggest coward ever to post anywhere.

Wake up, Cane. You DEFINE the word pathetic. How's your CLIE S320 holding up? After the 100,000 or so manic posts you've made to every PDA site over the years and the endless ranting about every perceived flaw about EVERY PDA released this decade I would have thought you'd have already saved enough pennies from your paper route to buy a color screened device. Even a used m505 from your local flea market. And so now we're to be treated to your latest obsession: cellphones. This from the dullard that ranted for years about how he hated cellphones. Here's a newsflash, Caney: stick with your Tracphone and spare us all the angst and drama as you blather endlessly on about cellphones, only to (years later) claim that you'll keep using your local phone booth instead. Put up or S T F U, Caney. You are the worst kind of troll: all (idiotic) talk and NO action.

You see what you've done to yourself, Ryan?

Very sad.

No. Sad is your pathatic attempt to manipulate Ryan. Too bad you're as obvious as a two year old child trying to steal the cookie jar.

mikecane said, "One day we will be rid of you."

No, Mike, we won't.

Ryan, the editor of this tabloid, does not want reasoned conversation and discourse.

Ryan wants the vicious, vulgar posts from TVoR and Gekko.

Can ANYONE post a link to a useful post EVER made by relyons? EVER?

Here's a clue:

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8630/#122455 (Dumba$$ comment attacking me)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8630/#122477 (Thread with poor relyons getting biotchslapped unconscious)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8659/#122613 (Dumba$$ comment with relyons blaming DEVELOPERS for apps being broken by new versions of PalmOS! Hmmm...)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8659/#122623 (Dumba$$ comment attacking me)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8659/#122660 (More B.S. from relyons - a pattern is emerging here...)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8702/#122919 (feeble defense of Treo 700p by relyons)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8722/#123272 (relyons insulting Palminfocenter)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8921/#124593 (relyons insulting Palminfocenter, Gekko and TVoR)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8921/#124599 (relyons making yet another feeble attempt to have my posts here censored)

http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/9004/#125615 (relyons attacks Gekko and TVoR yet again. Wow.)

Click on The_Voice_of_Reason's user name on the other hand and you're greeted with links to post after post of BRILLIANT PROSE overflowing with useful information and insightful commentary.

Who is this "relyons" and why do they hate TVoR? Perhaps it's time for relyons to be outed...

TVoR

TVoR

But it is also hilarious. That eejit really thinks I'm going to read ANY of his drivel? He has the nerve of the very sociopath that he is. Keep up the sick effort. The only time you waste is your own.

Scrolling on...

Smart people can figure out why that was posted here:

http://www.allaboutpalm.com/forum/printthread.php?t=44&pp=40

and here

http://www.allaboutpalm.com/forum/printthread.php?t=44&page=2&pp=40

and here

http://www.allaboutpalm.com/forum/printthread.php?t=44&page=3&pp=40

Notice especially there:

>>>...moderated - yes we regard this post as offensive...

Words sadly missing at PIC!

Now just how pitiful is that?

I'm sure following this post will be another flood of stupid words seeking my validation and approval. Pathetic, pathetic.

Treocentral, 1source, etc have all gone downhill because of their ridiculous moderating practices. Many of the most interesting posters have left in disgust. TVoR would immediately leave Palminfocenter should similarly-oppressive policies be instituted here. No doubt Palm would LOVE to see TVoR silenced. As always, it's Ryan decision whether or not any posts are deemed to have merit.

With you being a former regular here, I've taken pity on you and tried to help you get a clue. Since biotchslapping is the only method of communication that mangy curs like you understand, in the future you'll get precisely what you deserve.

Take care, Caney.

TVoR

Stop thinking you're so clever.

How's that phone booth going? Have you figured out how to pair up the payphone to your CLIE S320 yet? Congratulations, Auntie Mike. You're precious. Really.

Don't ever change, Girlfriend.

TVoR

P.S. What it a "supid cartoon characer"? It it the thing in your mirror? Run quickly to the mirror and have a look, Caney.

But what makes that fact go from pathetic to hilarious is that he can't even get sex with *himself*.

Self-loathing is Skippy. And he loves to share.

Ew.

Inquiring minds want to know. And please post some more fascinating details about your new cellphone and your new PDA.

Hugs & Kisses,
TVoR

Call me on that shiny new cellphone of yours. You did buy one, right?

TVoR

TVoR

We-com trade will enhance the investment in military trade by offering more to do than dodge bullets.

A complete global package is waiting to do more with Sam too.

E-T

e-tellurian

Completing the e-com circle with a people driven we-com solution
WiFi & BT? No strings attached
we_tellurian@canada.com

Caney's not(wo)man enough for me.

;-O

TVoR

Are you threatening Uncle Sam, E-T?

If Men In Black show up at your place tonight claiming to be delivering a pizza...

RUN!

It is unfortunate people are being banned. Now we have people that can choose to read poorly ... very poorly.

The trade package i am working on is huge. In Canada's case trade with the US is a historical event. Some are working hard to assure we have stuff to trade.

The Winter Olympics will be celebrated in 2010 that is less than four years away. Thankfully some have come up with a way to house all these people in a very ecologically sensitive area. These unique ideas will offer much for all industries including the technology and energy industry.

Pizza is a good all round source of food as it covers all the major food groups in a single slice.

E-T

e-tellurian

Completing the e-com circle with a people driven we-com solution
WiFi & BT? No strings attached
we_tellurian@canada.com

Pizza is, almost without exception, nonKosher.

Thus eliminating a major segment of the population not just over here on the east coast but worldwide - I believe Muslims and more observe the same dietary mandates.

[just was reminded of this by an ancient sports collegue who declined din-din during a reunion since we're pizza munching]

========

But more on-topic - the el-cheapo "next TREO" sure had better be el-cheapo or it will be washed away by the flood of sub-$100 very-smart-phones The Competition will have contemporaneously.

Ya think the Q is gonna be $100 forever?

Ya think the Pearl is gonna be $50 forever?

In my religion we eat everything except people. This phrase was coined in 1972 by a seven year old child asked by classmates what was eaten "where he came from". Perhaps this phrase has more purpose today.

Peace,

E-T

e-tellurian

Completing the e-com circle with a people driven we-com solution
WiFi & BT? No strings attached
we_tellurian@canada.com

If only it were true for all...

Today the same determination is seen in interactive innovative offerings. One of the reasons the world offshore much of it's building is because their is not the desire to remove old building to make room for manufacturing. Emerging economies offer open space without displacing people or history.

The world can build on the sea if off shore choices become an issue. Environmentally sound mobile manufacturing facilities offer good access for shipping with plenty of cool water all around.

E-T

e-tellurian

Completing the e-com circle with a people driven we-com solution
WiFi & BT? No strings attached
we_tellurian@canada.com