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Faster Versions of Bluetooth Under Development

The Bluetooth Special Interest Group is working on a couple of new versions of the wireless networking standard which will feature faster access. In the near term, the SIG is working on Bluetooth 1.2, which will offer communication rates of 2 Mbps to 3 Mbps. Longer term, it is also working on Bluetooth 2.0, which will have rates of 4, 8 and 12 Mbps. The current version, Bluetooth 1.1, is limited to 1 Mbps. Bluetooth 2.0 may not be available until 2004.

Neither of these versions of the wireless standard will offer more range than the current one, about 10 meters. Bluetooth 2.0 will require about twice as much power. The new chip sets are expected to be about 20% more expensive.

Bluetooth 2.0 will also do away with the master and slave relationship used in the current standard, which causes problems when a master leaves a networked group of devices. In the new one, all devices will be equal.

The new version isn't intended to be a replacement for the current version of Bluetooth.

Jaap Haartsen, a scientist at Ericsson Technology Licensing and the original developer of Bluetooth, revealed this information in speech this week to the Bluetooth Congress meeting in Amsterdam and it was reported in EE Times.

Bluetooth is facing competition from other wireless networking standards, like 802.11, also called Wi-Fi, which has won converts because it already offers a communication rate of up to 10 Mbps and greater range. However, according to Mr. Haartsen, Bluetooth is the best option for small, mobile devices because of its low cost and low power requirements.

Bluetooth was originally developed to be a way for computer peripherals to communicate with each other wirelessly, freeing users from the rat's nest of wires behind their computers. Recently, however, companies have begun to release products that use it for connecting to networks and the Internet.

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low cost ??

I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 4:19:39 PM #
A bluetooth CF for my PDA costs 80% more than the 802.11 equivalent...
RE: low cost ??
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 5:42:09 PM #
lol. What an idiot. A BT CF costs $100. Try to find a 80% less Wifi card that is new. Moron...
RE: low cost ??
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 6:08:25 PM #
Well, I've seen some 802.11b CF cards for $70-$80, so 70-80% of the cost would be more accurate. CF Bluetooth cards should be $50 or less.
RE: low cost ??
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 11:51:07 AM #
To the person that called me idiot and moron:

I am happy to know that not everyone in this world is as pathetic as you are. If you have IQ enough to understand my point (which I think you don't) an add-on that costs around 35% of the main device's price cannot be considered low cost ($127 for a BT CF at buy.com and $340 for a PPC at buy.com). If the selling point for BT is low cost they better have it for real.

Bluetooth Over Hyped

I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 4:20:21 PM #
Many of us have been hearing about Bluetooth for a number of years now, and there is still a lack of useful BT devices available. I just can't get excited about Bluetooth anymore, when I now wonder if it will ever gain critical mass in the market place.
RE: Bluetooth Over Hyped
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 4:25:34 PM #
I could care less to spend like $210 US for ONE, YES ONE, bluetooth MS. I pay $50CDN a month on a BB connection at home that is much more worth the money.

How do people do this cost/benefit on these things? $210US so you can read emails and MAYBE surf dumbed down pages??? Plus paying per minute to connect using your phone. Don't you have a desktop at work?

If you really need to get emails wirelessly and do it often than I can see that, but that's not very many people. Which is probably why BT in NA is a wash.

Tell me if I'm way off base here because that just doesn't seem very smart IMO.

That's a ridiculous price.

RE: Bluetooth Over Hyped
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 5:21:42 PM #
In Answer to your question, maybe consumers don't. Business users on the other hand can very easily justify mobile connectivity to the network.

And I've done a number of installs for people with BB connections who chose to use those over wireless ethernet cards rather than wired ones. The then have the flexibility to use their desktops and laptops in any room of the house. Further, they don't have to run ethernet to multiple rooms and leave that investment behind when they move. If you already have that investment, it follows that you'd consider adding a 802.11b card to their PDA as well. Would I spend that much on BT instead/as well? Probably not. At least not yet. On the other hand it becomes attractive when more devices come with bluetooth. For example I spent $80Can on a data cable for my cellphone. That cost will have to be repeated if/when I replace my cellphone. I spent another $30 on a data cable for my GPS. If you add that up and perhaps another future device or two, then you've arrived at the cost of a BlueTooth card. If we shift into a future where BT is ubiquitous enough to be included in those cellphones and GPS's as we're starting to see, then I'll end up saving money in the long run because I don't have to keep purchasing new cables (or buy them in the first place). Unlike Palm's non-universal "Universal Connector", BT stands the chance to actually become that UC. OTOH, it also remains to be seen if 802.11b couldn't serve some/all of that in ad-hoc mode. We can already make PDA to PDA connections via 802.11b ad-hoc, there's just not much you can do with it. With PalmSource hinting at improved support for 802.11b in OS5, maybe there'll be something there. For now, 802.11b is the first use I've found for that PalmOS web server app that's been around for ever ;-)

RE: Bluetooth Over Hyped
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 9:09:22 AM #
> there is still a lack of useful BT devices available.

There is a phrase you left out of this: "in the United States". Over here in Europe Bluetooth is catching on well. There are plenty of Bluetooth phones to choose from and other devices, too.

You Yanks need to catch up.

RE: Bluetooth Over Hyped
swinginjonny @ 6/25/2002 3:35:08 PM #
"How do people do this cost/benefit on these things? $210US so you can read emails and MAYBE surf dumbed down pages??? Plus paying per minute to connect using your phone. Don't you have a desktop at work?

If you really need to get emails wirelessly and do it often than I can see that, but that's not very many people. Which is probably why BT in NA is a wash.

Tell me if I'm way off base here because that just doesn't seem very smart IMO."

You're way off base. Your thinking is way too limited. Bluetooth is not just for surfing the web on you palm--although it does that well. It can replace ALL your cables at once. Hotsync, Web/network access, printing, Powerpoint presentations, direct access of documents from desktop, keyboard/mouse and other periferals, and so much more. The possibilities are endless. Bluetooth, fully implemented, would be like buying one cable that connects every electronic device you own--from playing mp3's through your car stereo from your palm to having your refridgerator automatically add "buy milk" to your task list. The future of Bluetooth is exciting, and it has to start somewhere. You just need to widen your vision!

(Self-confessed Palm Geek)

can i still use an exisiting blue tooth device with a new on

I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 5:29:17 PM #
i use a t39 and nr70v with bluetooth stick.

when the new phones eventually come out - will i still be able to use it with my existing sick?

RE: can i still use an exisiting blue tooth device with a new on
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 5:59:06 PM #
Newer versions of BT should be able to scale back the speed as required - like 802.11 devices do today. I've got an old 2mbs WaveLAN card talking to a brand new Apple Airport basestation...

Bluetooth 1.0 in 2004

Nate @ 6/19/2002 6:05:42 PM #
"Bluetooth 2.0 may not be available until 2004."

...it'll practically be 2004 when Bluetooth 1.0 is actually accessible to the masses!

:)


_________
Syncplicity. Redefining Simple. www.cognitiveroot.com

Talk about shooting yourself in the foot!

I.M. Anonymous @ 6/19/2002 6:26:30 PM #
BT 1.0 is struggling desperately to get a foothold, and the end-user costs aren't going to come down until the quantities go up. Now you come along and give the OEM non-adopters another reason to procrastinate?

"Gee... our BT-enabled models weren't going to be ready until mid-2003. Since they've announced the next version to be just a few months later, maybe we ought to wait."

Idiots.

RE: Talk about shooting yourself in the foot!
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 12:53:53 AM #
I guess you can call Sony an idiot too. However they are still around. :)

Bluetooth is real and it works wonderfully

I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 1:03:10 AM #
I am a telecommuter. Bluetooth has become an invaluable part of my professional life.

I use a Palm m515, an Apple iBook and an Ericsson T68i. All connect to each other via BT numerous times a day.

Thanks to BT I can connect to the Internet wirelessly, anywhere. Thanks to GPRS, I can even remain online for prolonged periods without having to pay through the nose.

All the money I have invested in this technology is money well-spent (the Apple BT USB dongle by D-Link cost me only US$50, brand new).

All you pundits should experience this wonderful technology before you speak ill of it.

***sent from an iBook via Bluetooth and GPRS***

RE: Bluetooth is real and it works wonderfully
iain.collins @ 6/20/2002 6:42:44 AM #
Hear hear!

I could not agree more.

My T39m, Palm m500, Wireless head said and PowerBook all happily talk to each other and I can quite happily web browse at ISDN speeds on my Palm or PowerBook.

BlueTooth is only struggling in the US (because of the much lower takeup of mobile phones). Here in Europe and Japan it's a popular and fast growing technology.

Once again it seems like someone needs to point out the US is *NOT* the entire world! Technology like GPRS and BlueTooth is quite happily taking off with you and you'd do well to remeber that.

RE: Bluetooth is real and it works wonderfully
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 9:16:32 AM #
Well before you guys talk ill about guys talking ill about BT maybe you should consider we've been talking ill about it as a REAL value to our lives with it's lack of NA product inclusions and adoption of the wonderful world you describe as bluetooth. Sure if you're willing to pay for the BT MS, devices and peripherals to get them all talking, it's gravy. But you guys are 2 out of how many people in NA who have truly adopted BT? Not very many more. Why would I care about what kind of popularity and usage the BT is getting in Japan when I live in Canada? I don't think NA is the entire world, but it is the continent that I live on.

Seems like by the time NA reaches where Japan and Euro are now there'll be better BT devices and faster BT MS available that would begin to trade-off the massive difference between cost and benefit.

PALM OS5 or 6 Devices with a 4Mbps BT... that's what I'm talking about.


RE: Bluetooth is real and it works wonderfully
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 11:41:06 AM #
"Once again it seems like someone needs to point out the US is *NOT* the entire world! Technology like GPRS and BlueTooth is quite happily taking off with you and you'd do well to remeber that."

I think we all agree those of us on this side of the pond are not the "entire world" but you should note that we are a MAJOR part of it.

There is very little BT technology over here and to be honest I can't see it going anywhere at this point with current pricing. BT was also meant to be in printers, scanners, and other simple devices that communicate with PC's, cell phones, etc. The phones just being a small part of the overall plan.

Here we are years later with not much progress in North America. What has BT in Europe/Asia besides cell phones?

RE: Bluetooth is real and it works wonderfully
mtg101 @ 6/20/2002 11:54:09 AM #
It's true that most available Bluetooth devices are phones - but then again that's what is was originally designed for!

For a quick overview of what's out there already see:
www.expansys.com/d_bluetooth.asp

Also check the following for camcorders:
http://blueunplugged.com/main.asp?option=productrange&catID=11

---
russ@russb.fsnet.co.uk

america sucks
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 12:08:53 PM #
why did america invent the light bulb, telephone, and numerous other things and were way ahead of the rest of the world until japan took over. nothing cool ever happens in america. on the subject of bluetooth why is it virtually non-existent in america. america is one step above honduras in the technological race. something popular in europe is popular in Urined States 6 years later. why are we so far behind in technology. Ill tell you why. while in europe the governments are funding technology, Dubya and the rest of those corrupt politicians are funding stupid things like Censorship criminals this "Homeland security crap" and wasting their money and time on !@#$%^ Enron. hurry up Dubya. For a country that calls itself the most powerful country in the world they sure as hell dont act like it. **** the crooks the bums and the rich, lets get high tech.
RE: Wireless Tech in the US
iain.collins @ 6/20/2002 1:42:48 PM #
In answer to someone's question in Europe we have pretty much the same range of Bluetooth products as in the US, it's just that more people have them (due to the differences in the state of the commercial Cellphone networks, wireless networks being the 'killer app' behind Bluetooth as once you have a Bluetooth phone you suddenly get a desire to go looking for other Bluetooth devices because most of the other devices are designed specifically to talk to BT enabled phones :).

Apart from Cell Phones: Palms, Win CE devices, printers, laptops, wireless in-ear headsets, video camera's, PCI and PCMICA cards are all avalible from every town's high street in UK (though we in the UK are ahead of most of Europe). Of course Japan is much farther ahead - I have no idea what their take up is like.



RE: Bluetooth is real and it works wonderfully
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 11:05:00 PM #
By now we've heard mostly from brits. Lets hear from a good ole' american about this issue
RE: Bluetooth is real and it works wonderfully
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 11:07:36 PM #
What is all this talk about OS6. OS5 isnt even out yet! you don't even know what os6 will be like and you talk like your gettin it tomorrow. I bet os6 will be to os5 as what os4 is to os3.5. OS6 Might not even be out until a few years and then still cost a shizzload of money. I, being a avid Palm freak still like upgrading palms but not every 2 months. There's something that stops me from getting new palms and BT etc. and its the money The only reason I bought the overpriced M130 is because i get an employee discount at best buy. You guys sound to me like millionaire$ and to those of you who aren't not to sound offensive but don't spend it on a pricey palm. Be happy with what you have.
RE: Bluetooth is real and it works wonderfully
mtg101 @ 6/21/2002 5:38:19 AM #
When people refer to OS6, they're refering to what PalmSource call "the next major upgrade" of the PalmOS. This will have a totally new development model, with one major difference to be support for multi-tasking / threading.

---
russ@russb.fsnet.co.uk

Obsolete before it even arrived...

I.M. Anonymous @ 6/20/2002 5:28:16 PM #
Maybe the BT consortium should take a lesson from Sony and hold off announcing new developments until people have had a chance to blow all their $$$ on the earlier versions. Then again, nobody does creaping featuritus like our good friends at Sony's Clie division so I might be expecting too much from the BT folk.
RE: Obsolete before it even arrived...
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/24/2002 8:21:45 AM #
here here
what use is a standard that changes every few years

I dont know all the details and I dont pretend to, but in a few years I could picture the 'operate everything through bluetooth' ideal getting shot in the foot, with different appliances using all kinds of different 'standards' and versions of bluetooth.

"what version is the TV?" "bluetooth 1.2" "damn I have bluetooth 1.3.442.21.1"

RE: Obsolete before it even arrived...
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/24/2002 9:26:59 AM #
It's going to be backwards compatible. You'll be able to use your BT 2.0 handheld with a BT 1.1 network access point or a BT 1.1 SD card with a 2.0 access point.

If updating the standard is going to kill Bluetooth, then 802.11 is dead, too. Look for the 802.11g stuff to hit stores soon.

Why, oh why, do people compare Bluetooth and 802.11?

I.M. Anonymous @ 6/21/2002 6:43:11 PM #
Why, oh why, do people compare Bluetooth and 802.11?

That'd be similar to article titles such as "Firewire in competition with Gigabit Ethernet!"

One is for connecting peripherals and the other is for connecting computers. Admittedlly, peripherals and computers have a rather fuzzy dividing line but still...

RE: Why, oh why, do people compare Bluetooth and 802.11?
I.M. Anonymous @ 6/24/2002 9:33:45 AM #
It doesn't matter what people invented Bluetooth or 802.11 for, people are using both to connect to the Internet. Turns out 802.11 doesn't work very good in a PDA because it takes way too much power. Bluetooth is slower but draws like 1/10th the current.

Bluetooth works just fine to connect to a network. Check out the PicoBlue Internet Access Point
www.pico.net/products.html

Only purists care that Bluetooth was only supposed to be for keyboards and such. Everyone else has moved on.

Bluetooth on SD??

PIC mobile user @ 6/22/2002 3:56:49 PM #
Any of u people know any detail of a good SD based bluetooth card
RE: Bluetooth on SD??
twizza @ 6/22/2002 4:02:10 PM #
check out toshiba's pda site [dont know da address] and palm's accessories site to get more info on sd bluetooth.

RE: Bluetooth on SD??
Ed @ 6/22/2002 4:17:02 PM #
You can read about Palm's Bluetooth SD card here:
www.palminfocenter.com/view_Story.asp?ID=3127

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