Comments on: It's Official: m500 and m505 Released

What some people have been waiting for since Palm's CEO hinted about it last fall is finally here. The Palm m500 and m505 are all over Palm's website.

As was learned yesterday, almost all the rumored specs are confirmed. Both devices run Palm OS 4.0 on a 33 MHz Dragonball VZ processor and have 8 MB of memory and Secure Digital (SD) slots. The m500 is $400 and the m505 is $450.

Both are available for sale now on Palm's webstore. The m500 is scheduled to be delivered in the US in late April, with the m500 coming in May. Also, orders made during yesterday's unofficial "sneak peak" are being honored by Palm.

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M505 Order

scouter075 @ 3/19/2001 7:47:37 AM #
I was able to place and order on the web yesterday (Sunday) and today it shows up in order status. I called and talked to customer service today to add an item. I was given a 4/2 ship date. (That's also the date they should be in stores I was told.)
Interestingly enough, the young lady said that the only reason we were able to place orders on the web yesterday was because someone hacked into the web site yesterday morning and created a link to place orders for the new products. She said that csutomer service started taking orders at midnight.
Ed. thanks for the heads up.

scouter075@mindspring.com
RE: M505 Order
philmair @ 3/19/2001 8:12:23 AM #
I've spent most of the day trying to place an order -- and get some straight answers from the various bits of Palm. I'm in the UK. Palm Europe know nothing about the m505. Speaking to Palm Inc they say the info should be on the Euro web site today (Mon) .. not so. I tried to place an order direct with US .. they say they won't ship to the UK (although I got my Palm V direct when it was launched). Palm Europe say the m505 won't be available until mid-June, yet Palm Inc say it is their policy to 'go global' at the same time as the US. So ..... how/when DO I place my order ??? Anyone out there with some accurate info ??


RE: M505 Order
Ed @ 3/19/2001 8:16:51 AM #
I also just got off the phone with Palm Customer Service who confirmed that they are honoring my m505 order. However, I was quoted a shipping date of somewhere in middle to late April.

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter
RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 8:20:03 AM #
The order status page shows a ship date of 3/19 on my order!!!! Sure it is an error but can't help hoping that it is right!!

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 8:40:25 AM #
What is the lowest order number that anyone has seen? I ordered around 5:45pm Eastern on Sunday and got a number in the high 500s.
010318-2275xx.

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 8:51:18 AM #
Mine is in the low 500's.

RE: M505 Order
Ed @ 3/19/2001 9:00:38 AM #
I ordered early Sunday morning and my number is in the low 300s.

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter
RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 10:16:56 AM #
FWIW, my order went in just after 10pm PST Sunday (1am EST Monday), and my order number is in the high 800's.

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 12:23:44 PM #
ordered sunday noon..my number high 500

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 12:28:17 PM #
Ordered around noon Sunday and order is in high 400s

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 11:07:05 AM #
The order gal told me I was order # 131 . . .

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 11:42:39 AM #
Just to get a feel for the Pre-orders of the M505, can someone that pre-ordered the M505 Today (March 20, 2001, from the Palm site,please post your ORDER #?

RE: M505 Order on Credit Card
Ed @ 3/20/2001 12:09:08 PM #
I just talked to Palm Customer Service and confirmed that credit cards aren't being charged until the device is actually shipped.

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter
RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 12:11:52 PM #
I ordered on 3/19 and just called Palm to add another USP cradle to my order. The girl taking the order told me that the 505's would not ship before sometime in May, regardless of when they were pre-ordered. I don't know if this is accurate or not. The CNET article suggested that some 505's would be available in limited quantaties in Mid April and more generally available in May. Perhaps the rep I spoke to was simply quoting the company line for general availability. I hope so. It was hard enough to wait till 4/2!

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 1:27:24 PM #
I've called Palm 5 times so far since Sunday and am still hearing 4/2 consistently from them as a shipping date. My order number is in the 500's. Hopefully these reps are being told to give the 4/2 date because it is somewhat correct?

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 2:38:46 PM #
how do you guys get the order number? I placed mine through web (Monday) and all I have is 010319-2287**. I guess that I have to wait until year 2002 :) (but the order webpage says that the shipment date is 3/30/2001 --- another joke?)

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 3:29:21 PM #
Depending on who you talk to, you get a different answer on shipping. I just got off
with a girl at Palm who swears mid-MAY is the ship date. I have also heard Apr 2,
beginning of May and end of April. Anyone else want to place a bet? :)

RE: M505 Order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 9:52:39 PM #
I just spoke with a Palm rep regarding the m505 and the accessories that I ordered on Sunday. She told me that as of today, the ship date has been moved back to mid-May for the m505 and she couldn't even guess when the accessories might be available to ship. BUMMER!!!

m500 and m505 NOT available on 4/2: press release

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 8:19:02 AM #
Here's a quote from the official press release regarding the m500 and m505. Thought that those of us who were expecting a 4/2 ship date would find this interesting :)

. The m500
handheld, weighing just four ounces, is scheduled to be available in the
United States in late April for an estimated street price (ESP) of $399
(U.S.).(1) International availability is expected in May. The m505 handheld,
the lightest expandable color-screen handheld computing product ever designed,
is scheduled to be available in the United States in May for $449 (ESP).
International availability is expected in June.

RE: m500 and m505 NOT available on 4/2: press release
I.M. Anonymous @ 4/2/2001 5:33:34 PM #
Well any newer info than this on M500 delivery dates? Its 4/2 and I am getting impatient :-)



m500 and m505 on 4/17?
I.M. Anonymous @ 4/5/2001 12:51:52 AM #
Geek.com is reporting that Sparco.com is saying that it expects to have the Palm m505 ready for shipping by 4/17/01.

RE: m500 and m505 Availability
I.M. Anonymous @ 4/5/2001 10:20:45 PM #
Geek.com says Palm's online store would be shipping the Palm m505 in 4-6 weeks. Meanwhile, Staples, Office Depot, and others would be getting their first shipments of the 500 next week.

RE: m500 and m505 NOT available on 4/2: press release
I.M. Anonymous @ 4/6/2001 12:55:14 AM #
Does anyone know when the Palm m500 will be available in retail stores (e.g. Best Buy, Circuit City)?

Some Palm M505 Questions.

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 8:26:31 AM #
I am in Australia and we dont really have a HUGE PDA market downhere. Heck, we dont even see Handspring or Sony Clie here at all.

But i would like to know :

1) Can The M505 load applications from SD memory cards ?

2) Is 64MB really the upper limit an Palm SD reader handle? THe Press release claims 256Mb or 128mb i think
but the Palm site says upto 64mb.

3) Does the new Palm m505 have a better speaker than the older models ? My IIIc has a terrible speaker, when i play sound files, movies with TealMovie they sound horrible and the alarm is weak.

4) I hear that there will be an MP3 SD module, how will songs be played back IF the speaker is still the same or will it be head phone jack only?

5) Also i have read about SEGA developing games for PALM. Is that going to be inform of SD card or software ? And how will sound be handled if speaker is still the same?

6)Is the resolution still 160 x 160 ? What is better for viewing photos ? 160 x160 - 16BIT or 320 x 320 - 8 bit?

7) Any international release dates? I was under the impression that it would have a world wide release date rather than USA getting it 3 months earlier.

Thanks very much in advance for any input.



RE: Some Palm M505 Questions.
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 8:32:46 AM #
To my knowledege, its not the palms that limit up to 64mb, it's the SD cards themselves. The cards and palms can support more mem. but right now, the biggest card you can buy is a 64mb card

RE: Some Palm M505 Questions. (Screen Resolution)
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 9:11:40 AM #
My guess is that if the screen wasn't 160x160 that Palm would put it in the announcements.

RE: Some Palm M505 Questions.
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 7:46:31 PM #
Keep an eye on Vodaphone for distributing Handspring products downunder...

Proc speed?

jayhawk88 @ 3/19/2001 9:30:26 AM #
I'm not seeing anything on Palm's site talking about what processors these units have in them. I'm assuming 33Mhz Dragonballs, but can anyone confirm this?

RE: Proc speed?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 4:50:42 PM #
What processor does the m500/505 come with?

The m500 and m505 use the Dragonball VZ processor by Motorola, running at 33 Mhz.

Palm m505 FAQ: http://www.palm.com/support/m505/m505_faq.html

m505 order

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 9:45:23 AM #
Has anyone who ordered the m505 on Sunday checked their order status on Palm's site? When I check for my order status, it gives me a message saying that my order number and last name do not match. Then it asks me to call Palm's 800 number. The representative on the phone is of no help. Does anyone get this same message when checking their order status?

RE: m505 order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 10:20:15 AM #
I ordered Sunday, and got the same runaround from the order status page ("order number and last name don't match"), then I tried just leaving the "last name" field blank and that made it happy.

RE: m505 order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 3:19:33 PM #
No problem checking my order this morning. Wish I could believe the ship date of 3/19 that it displayed!!!!!!!!!!

RE: m505 order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 4:43:14 PM #
I too got the last name and order do not match, but then I capitalized the first letter of my last name (my brower auto loaded it as lower case), hit submit, and showed that I too have a ship date of 3/19/01 and that my Palm 505 is backordered. My order number is xx892.


RE: m505 order
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 6:03:56 PM #
yes, it did say that the name had to be entered exactly as entered on the order - should have just said that it was case sensitive! Duh!

waiting for updated VIIx

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 10:05:49 AM #
They sound terrific and It will be dificult to restrain myself. However I read about an updated VIIx coming in the fall with the SD slot and in in a thinner V style body, (hopefully in color at that) so I'll wait until years end, until then I'll plug along with my VIIx and my IIIc

RE: waiting for updated VIIx
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 1:54:39 PM #
The m500/m505 is definitely not the Blackberry "killer" I had been hoping for. I guess I will have to wait for the updated VIIx a/k/a m700.

Is the m700 just over the Horizon?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 7:39:56 PM #
Per today's WSJ:

"In the second half of 2001,[Michael Mace,Palm's chief competitive officer] says Palm will likely announce next-generation integrated wireless devices that support real-time e-mail reception and delivery, as well as higher resolution screens."

It appears that Palm is going to introduce its long-rumored Blackberry "killer" in the near future.

Apps from SD?!

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 10:15:45 AM #
This worries me ("they hold information for upload or download onto a handheld"). I wish they would just come out and say..."you can run apps from them" or "you cannot"!:
--
From http://www.palm.com/products/accessories/expansioncards
--

What's behind the expansion card slot?
The expansion card slot is a dual-purpose slot that can hold two types of cards: Secure Digital and MultiMediaCard. Both types of cards are small, inexpensive, and easy to plug in. Much like computer diskettes, they hold information for upload or download onto a handheld. With them, you can instantly add software programs, e-books, large databases, graphics, or even video files to your handheld without sacrificing memory space.

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 11:13:09 AM #
A Palm sales person told me that you could run apps off of the memory. She said that it doesn't have to be moved over to RAM first but these are the sales people on the first day of a product release so I'm not sure how much I believe.

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 1:10:18 PM #
SD is a bit-serial interface... it acts like a high speed
hard drive, not like memory. There is no way to run programs
directly out of SD... they have to be copied one way or
another (either explicitly like on the Sony, or automatically
like on the TRG).


RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 4:12:11 PM #
I've talked to 3 sales reps now and they all said that you can run apps and databases directly off of the card without copying them over to main memory (you don't need to keep memory free on the 8MB to run a 4MB database for example). Are they just plain wrong? Thanks.

RE: Apps from SD?!
mikecane @ 3/19/2001 4:37:59 PM #
OK, everyone into the CLIE pool!

CLIE owners have been struggling with the inadequacies of PalmOS file handling since day one. (OK, so have TRGPro owners... but I'm being CLIE-centric here!)

CLIE owners use 3rd-party programs such as PowerLauncher, which allows you to arrange your files in categories, save them on Memory Stick, and *run* them from MS. PW copies the program to RAM and deletes it (from RAM only, not MS!) upon exiting. However, this is for apps only, not DBs that need to be modified.

Search the discussion board over at http://www.palmblvd.com/boards/SonyClie/

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 5:44:07 PM #
Ok, for those who still don't seem to get it...

YES, you CAN run an app right off the card. Go get the developer information if you don't believe it.

The copying / deleting necessary parts in RAM is automatic. This is nothing like the nightmares some of us endured with the CLIE.

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 7:51:14 PM #
I spoke to a Palm sales rep today at 4 PM CST and asked if I could run an 8 MB dictionary app from an SD card if I had only 1 MB of RAM left on the M505. She said yes but not with much confidence. I asked her if she was 100% sure. She said, well, you better talk to tech support. I talked to a tech support rep who again said yes it could be done. I asked him the 100% confidence question and he said, "well, let me check". Two minutes later he said no it couldn't be done that there needed to be space on the device to download the app.

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 9:10:55 PM #
Here is the deal:

Right now, with older reader / database type programs, they are going to have to be all copied in to RAM. That's just the way life is, and the same as any other device using software with an older architecture.

However the PalmOS4 provides for functions to read information directly from the card. They are also extremely easy to implement.

I can almost guarantee you that when these PalmOS4 devices start shipping, you'll see revisions of all the popular applications that natively support expansion.

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 11:18:29 PM #
Thanks for your reply. If true, that is very good news indeed. Maybe the M50x series will be worth buying.

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 1:03:04 AM #
My main purpose for the palm is medical reference. At a company called Handheldmed.com, they will have a compatible reader on RAM which will read the huge textbooks right off the SD.....available within a month. If it is that easy then it will probably be available for any databases as well in the near future.


RE: Apps from SD?!
mikecane @ 3/20/2001 9:04:20 AM #
OK, perhaps it is true they have set up PalmOS to launch apps from SD -- but I really don't think this is the case with DBs that are going to be *altered*. And if this is so, it really is not much better than what CLIE owners have been doing for months. This is not the virtual filesystem we had all been hoping for; it is not as user friendly (on the file handling level) as Pocket PC, unfortunately, which is what I think everyone was hoping for.

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 10:17:54 AM #
Here's the lowdown:

You can't "completely" run an app from an SD card. It IS copied into the Palm's memory to actually execute. However, this is completely transparent -- as far as the user knows, he/she IS running it from the SD card. It's copied to the Palm, run, and then deleted when you exit, all invisibly. Like loading a Windows program from a hard disk.

HOWEVER--you can access databases directly from an SD card without copying them over. So while you may load your dictionary PROGRAM into main memory, the actual dictionary data never has to lave the SD card.


RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 11:34:52 AM #
Actually, it is exactly the virtual file system we had all hoped for. You can read and write to your hearts content using the SD cards. It will take some simple modifications to existing apps to do.

Go read the Palmsource slides, specifically the ones on expansion. They'll give you a quick understanding of how the new APIs work. Specifically, look at the VFS (Virtual File System) calls :)

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 7:05:08 PM #
Quick question:
So basically, if the programs are written correctly, a database can be accessed on the card even if there isn't any room left on the main memory. So is this like the TRGpro which is pretty much seamless? If this is the case, why isn't Palm advertising this fact all over their site? Thanks.

RE: Apps from SD?!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 8:37:13 PM #
It is seamless like the TRG - much more so in fact.

If you have enough memory for the reader app, and it is written properly, you don't need any memory at all dedicated to loading a huge database. The database can sit on the card and be read from and written to just fine.

It is unfortunate that most people don't realize that PalmOS4 offers this kind of expansion flexibility with its Virtual File System access. There was a lot of excitement about it when it was first announced.

As far as the marketing of it goes, Palm is marketing it as just generic expansion. In the non-techno-palm-nerd, it probably makes sense.

Relatively speaking, those of us who really know and/or care about the differences in expansion techniques between a CLIE/TRG/Palm are a complete minority.

Rest assured, it is 100% real, usable expansion plain and simple. As I said earlier, if you want to know for yourself, sign up for Palm's developer program. I am not by any means a programming genius but even I eventually cranked out a program that reads data from an expansion card! :)

What's the deal on running apps from SD slot

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 10:56:42 AM #
It appears that apps will not run from SD slot as stated by the guy which had signed non-disclosure agreement. What does that means? Anyone? If you run a memory intensive app say the 4MB Noah Dictionary from SD, but you only have 500KB of free ram on your handheld. Do you have to transfer some apps to SD Expansion first? (like Sony's memory stick)

M505 disappointment.

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 11:11:40 AM #
I think the biggest disappointment about the new M505 is its resolution, which is still 160x160!!! SO what it is now 16bit and 65K color... Just look at Visor Prism which is also 16bit and 65K. So what's new?? The OS 4.0 didn't make a bid difference at all! I was hoping that the new OS would support the higher resolution. Have you compared the display of Visor Prism to PocetPC?? Night and day difference is it not?? The single reason why Visor Prism won't sale is it crappy display. It makes me nauseous looking at the lines of coarse resolution; it's like staring at my TV screen close range. I am SOOOO disappointed that Palm after 2 years of head-budding only to come out with a smaller, thinner Visor Prism equivalent.

RE: M505 disappointment.
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 12:29:52 AM #
Yes, the m505 may be a disappointment from the inside specs, but take a gander at this: The visor prism is about .6 inches thick, the m505 is .44" (I believe) So it's definitely thinner. And with that thinness comes weight-loss, the weight of the m505 is around 4.8 oz, the prism is 6.x oz.....

And since they're have the same price, the real issue comes down to whether you'd rather have a springboard slot which is larger, but there's lots of devices already out for it, or whether you'd like the sd slot, which is smaller, but I imagine it'll be like the sony MS, so it'll be REALLY small, but you can't run stuff off of it (the visor has a 16 meg memory module, that you can run stuff off of!! :-)

However, the SD cards are noticably cheaper, I believe 16 megs is $50 us, while the visor module is $130.

Thx...but my final thought, the size and weight of the m505 really is luring, however, the sony-clie-like attributes of the SD card are frightening...But if I had the money to burn, I'd probably get the visor prism, it's color, 16bit, and can run stuff off of it's memory modules, and it can be a GPS, MP3 player, cell phone, modem (like all of 'em), camera, and anything else creative minds can come up with...

RE: M505 disappointment.
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 1:18:38 PM #
Yeah and then stuck with the 3.5 OS forever. Don't forget that the biggest flaw in the handspring units are their lack of flashable ROM

OS 3.x to OS 4.0 Upgrade?

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 11:43:42 AM #
Anyone know or want to speculate if and when OS4.0 will be available as an upgrade for OS3.x devices with flash?

Hoping not to start a thread on paying for it.

Speaker

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 12:00:08 PM #
Is it better then past models?


RE: Speaker
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 12:17:17 PM #
Nope - AFAIK

Article Updates

Ed @ 3/19/2001 12:23:35 PM #
If you read this article early this morning and haven't looked at it since, you should read over it again. I've been updating and adding to it as I learn new information about the m500 series.

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter

160X160

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 1:30:33 PM #
They can do better than that.......


RE: 160X160
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 11:41:42 AM #
I couldn't agree with you more. I can't believe that it takes Palm 2 years, but only to come out in the end a "slimmed down" Visor Prism. Let's not be fooled by this "new technology" of color display. People need to get it... The M505 display is IDENTICAL to that of Visor Prism: 16bit, 65K colors and 160x160. In another words, same CRAPPY display!!! The single most important improvement that needs to be made is the RESOLUTION!!!! People are going to pick up the device and immediately notice how the display looks! And yes, Palm and Handspring need to understand that it's not the # of colors but the RESOLUTION that matters! If you think about it, Visor Prism and M505 are nearly identical: Same display (160x160, 16bit, 65K colors), same expandability, same rechargibility, same USB connection. The essential difference is only the size...wow, what a noble and smart invention; after 2 years of head-budding, that's all Palm can do??? So what that it runs on new OS 4.0., there's no immediate real and practical benefits to the users.
Have you seen the display on Visor Prism? It's like staring at your TV screen at close range; you see the coarse lines of resolution…(yeak!) Compare that to PocketPC...(wow!!!) BIG difference is it not.
Now let imagine having the SAME Visor Prism display on the new M505...It makes me nauseous and upset just thinking about it... Believe me, those who pre-ordered the M505 will be VERY DISAPPOINTED and REGRETFUL once they realize how crappy and "Prism-like" the display looks. I strongly believe that the sales of M505 will soon drop like a rock, similar to the experiences of the IIIc and Visor Prism... Hopefully, after that Palm will decide to really put their brains together and roll out the 320x320 color displays (like the Sony Clie N700) to really rival the PockePC... Let's hope it will not take another TWO years to do so...


RE: 160X160
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 12:05:15 PM #
There is no comparisons here... the Prism and IIIc shared the
same display but the M505 DOES NOT. The M505 uses a
reflective side-lit display (same technology as the IPAQ).
Please check your facts before posting.

RE: 160X160
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 7:52:52 PM #
maybe same technology but a 160x160 screen res is woeful. These devices are used to access information, in order to effectively see the enormous amount of information we have to deal with these days, you need a hell of a lot more then this poor excuse of a display...

RE: 160X160
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 9:05:41 PM #
160X160 sucks. I was still using Palm Prefessional and hoping for a worthy upgrading. What a dispointing. Good-bye Palm. I am for Pocket PC now. That OS is crap, but at least the screen is usable.

RE: 160X160
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 9:39:35 PM #
It's amazing that someone would want high res screen with a "crap" OS.

The Palm OS is one of the most well designed operating systems out there, and
makes excellent use of the available screen real estate. Maybe I'm getting old
but I would prefer a mature product that makes the best use of screen real estate
possible. Sure, higher resolution would be great, but not if it diminishes the end
user experience. The Pocket PC is getting better and better, but I think the OS
needs just a little more user interface reworking -- bottom line is Palm still gets
the job done in less operations.

Until Palm goes ARM next year, I think 320x320 is a waste. I just can't see the
Dragonball VZ delivering enough speed to drive a snappy user experience at any
higher than 160x160 resolution. I know the Clie is doing it, but I'm not convinced
it will be fast enough.


m505 multilangual?

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 4:11:17 PM #
I've read, that the m505 is a multilangual device. That does obviously mean, that I can purchrase it online at the U.S. Palm Store and choose my language (German) when it's shipped and I turn it on the first time, right? Will it then work just like my Vx, which i bought in Germany or are there any problems I could encounter?
My only problem then is, that I can't order from Germany right now - it's not working... :-(

BTW: Though the m505's Graffitit Area isn't "soft" yet, it has at least a BACKLIGHT! Great improvement IMO.

RE: m505 multilangual?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 4:43:04 PM #
Where do you see that the graffiti area is backlit?
From the pictures that I have seen it looks like the graffit area on my IIIc

RE: m505 multilangual?
Ed @ 3/19/2001 5:55:33 PM #
No, it doesn't work like this. You must buy the Palm with the OS version in your language already on it. Trying to reflash the OS with a different language is either very difficult or impossible, depending on who you ask.

Also, the United States Palm Store will only ship handhelds to addresses in the U.S. You must buy yours from a store or website located in your country.

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter

RE: m505 multilangual?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 6:50:02 PM #
I've read on several german News-Sites, that the m505's Graffitti Area is backlighted (one of these sites also mentions a speaker, but I don't know, what they exactly mean...).

It seems to me as if the Graffitti Area is actually not *back*lighted, but *front*lighted. In Palm's m505-FAQ it is said, that the reflective Display of the m505 is frontlighted to be readable also in rather bad light conditions. Obviously the Graffitti Area is lighted, too - when this frontlight is turned on...

If there is a good light condition, you nor need the frontlight for the Display, neither for the Graffitti Area, of course.

RE: m505 multilangual?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 7:02:31 PM #
http://www.palmblvd.com/articles/2001/3/2001-3-19-Palm-m500-Series.html also talks about a backlit Graffitti Area, but for the m500 and not for the m505...

Well, let's wait and see until the first Reviews arrive. :-)

RE: m505 multilangual?
vgz @ 3/19/2001 9:35:53 PM #
If you go here http://www.palm.com/products/family.html you can see that the m505 is the only one listed with a backlit graffiti area.

Matt
RE: m505 multilangual?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 3:16:38 AM #
Apparently, Palm Europe marketing people don't have a clue about their own new products.
If you want to have a few laughs, check out the Spanish product index:
http://www.palm.com/europe/es_spanish/products/index.html and you'll see the IIIxe is listed as "NUEVO!" :-P

I'd like to be wrong, but if demand for the m500 and m505 is very high in the US, those models will arrive in Europe much later than announced (and, of course, at a much higher price). Remember the now famous $635 in France for the m505?

YOU CAN RUN APPS DIRECTLY OFF THE SD CARD

Telengard @ 3/19/2001 7:40:13 PM #
It seems this question keeps comming up.... You can run applications directly off the SD card. It is posted on Palm's site. Go to Palm's Expansion card FAQ.

http://www.palm.com/support/sdcards/faq/sd_faq.html

I hope this helps clear things up....

RE: You Can Run Apps Directly Off the SD Card
Ed @ 3/19/2001 8:54:52 PM #
Here is a quote from a Palm Expert on the Community Discussion Boards on Palm.com:

Yes, you absolutely can run applications from either of the card types. Pop in the card and any apps available will be shown in a category with the same name as the card. Applications can even be setup to auto launch.

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter

RE: YOU CAN RUN APPS DIRECTLY OFF THE SD CARD
mikecane @ 3/20/2001 9:09:00 AM #
Hey, thanks *very* much for that SD FAQ. It managed to escape my attention in the blizzard of info yesterday. It was very helpful and very revealing. (Grrr... I wish Palm had a link to it from the one FAQ I *did* see yesterday.)

It makes my point, however: forget about DBs that must be altered residing seamlessly on SD. This is CLIE territory all over again. This is not the transparency in file handling everyone had been hoping to see in PalmOS 4.

Backlit graffiti area

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 9:06:42 PM #
The Comparison matrix notes that the m505 has a Backlit graffiti area whereas the m500 does not.

As has been said before...a soft graffiti area would rock, but this is a step closer!

Apps on SD - woo hoo!

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 9:06:42 PM #
Yes. Palm OS v4.0 loaded on the Palm m500 enables copying of Palm OS applications to and from cards. Palm OS v4.0 also enables running of applications stored on cards with a single tap.

Resolution must increase

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 10:14:35 PM #
The resolution on these palms has got to increase, heck I'd give up color which is just a gimick in 80% of the cases for a nice, crisp clean black and white HIGH RESOLUTION screen, something like 320x320. Wish we could get the rational (cost, compatability) for sticking with 160x2

RE: Resolution must increase
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 9:42:58 AM #
I couldn't agree with you more. I can't believe that it takes Palm 2 years, but only to come out in the end a "slimmed down" Visor Prism. Let's not be fooled by this "new technology" of color display. People need to get it... The M505 display is IDENTICAL to that of Visor Prism: 16bit, 65K colors and 160x160. In another words, same CRAPPY display!!!The single most important improvement that needs to be made is the RESOLUTION!!!! (Oh god, please help me so that this message can be heard by Palm and Handsrping !!!) People are going to pick up the device and immediately notice how the display looks! And yes, Palm and Handspring need to understand that it's not the # of colors but the RESOLUTION that matters! If you think about it, Visor Prism and M505 are nearly identical: Same display (160x160, 16bit, 65K colors), same expandability, same rechargibility, same USB connection. The essential difference is only the size...wow, what a noble and smart invention; after 2 years of head-budding, that's all Palm can do??? So what that it runs on new OS 4.0., there's no immediate real and practical benefits to the users.
Have you seen the display on Visor Prism? It's like staring at your TV screen at close range; you see the coarse lines of resolution…(yeak!) Compare that to PocketPC...(wow!!!) BIG difference is it not.
Now let imagine having the SAME Visor Prism display on the new M505...It makes me nauseous and upset just thinking about it... Believe me, those who pre-ordered the M505 will be VERY DISAPPOINTED and REGRETFUL once they realize how crappy and "Prism-like" the display looks. I strongly believe that the sales of M505 will soon drop like a rock, similar to the experiences of the IIIc and Visor Prism... Hopefully, after that Palm will decide to really put their brains together and roll out the 320x320 color displays (like the Sony Clie N700) to really rival the PockePC... Let's hope it will not take another TWO years to do so...


???

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/19/2001 10:34:20 PM #
CAN THEY USE MP3S?

Cradle

Colormeweb @ 3/19/2001 10:55:04 PM #
I just have to say that that has to be the ugliest looking cradle I have ever seen!

Though Im thrilled about the M505, since I'll be upgrading from my "USRobotics" labled PalmPilot Pro with the 2 meg upgrade. Im long over due for the upgrade.

RE: Cradle
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 1:19:51 AM #
agreed. . . looks like a fat, high-heeled shoe.

RE: Cradle
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 1:23:00 PM #
Do you carry the cradle out with you? What the heck are you worrying about the looks of the cradle for? Griping for griping sake it sounds like.

Ugly

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 2:06:10 AM #
What's with the hideous "modem sled" ( https://store.palm.com/Catalog/productdetails.asp?productnr=P10821U&parent=) With the Palm modem they're get uglier than both the Edge with its sled or the Prism with the Thinmodem. In fact, the Prism with Thinmodem+ (w/8M flash) is actually a fairly sleek combination by comparison.

RE: Ugly
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 7:12:57 AM #
Long live to Prism! :)

RE: Ugly
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 7:59:20 AM #
I don't think it's bad looking at all, but it IS bulky. I also have a bad feeling that Novatel's m50x-compatible wireless modem is going to follow this type of design, resulting in a larger overall wireless solution than their existing Palm V wireless modem.

Scott

RE: Ugly
mikecane @ 3/20/2001 9:15:32 AM #
Why so fat? Looks like it probably uses 4 AAs! Nice of Palm not to mention the little things -- like how it draws its power!

Im confused...

Rchan @ 3/20/2001 7:45:36 AM #
The article first says that the m5xx are available now, then goes on to say that the 500 will be available in April, and the 505 in May. Which is it?
RE: Im confused...
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 11:40:07 AM #
They'll be available in a couple months, but not now.

RE: Im confused...
Ed @ 3/20/2001 1:25:30 PM #
Sorry, I didn't phrase that very well, did I? I'll go back and change it. They are available for sale now on Palm's webstore but won't be shipped until later.

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter

m505 sidelight not adjustable

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 8:02:02 AM #
According to the FAQ, the sidelight will be turned on in the typical fashion (holding down the power button). This means that it won't always be on or self-adjusting (like the iPaq). Unless I'm using my iPaq with lots of outside light (rare), I always have the sidelight on (though I use the auto mode which keeps it fairly low to conserve battery power). I'm a little disappointed with Palm's design here. If you leave it as-is, it's going to look like a Gameboy. If you have to turn on the backlight nearly every time you turn on the device, not only will it be an extra hassle, I'm betting their claimed battery life will drop dramatically. I'll wait till some actual reviews come in, but it sounds to me like it really was too good to be true to have a device this small with a color screen and decent battery life.

Scott

How is the SCREEN...?

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 9:48:33 AM #
The quality of the screen is my biggest question.

I like most every other big Palm OS lover ordered this thing already but I still have doubts. I have never seen a reflextive TFT screen done correctly EXCEPT in the Compaq iPAQ. It was the first BRIGHT screen, indoors and out, that looked almost like it was backlit. All the other reflextive TFT screens I have seen make colors look dark and muddy, esp. white which almost likes like a brown mud in anything but the brightest sunlight. This includes the HORRIBLE color Sony Clie screen which was painful to look at as you could barely see it was color.

I had high hopes that the screen in the m505 would be able to match the new high water mark of the Compaq iPAQ. A review of the m505 screen (shown without the m505 body) back in December seemed good calling it, "bright, better than the IIIc, and much better than the Sony Clie." Now a reviewer of the m505 on MSNBC.com is stating that in his preview build of the m505 the screen was "dark, looked like a color gameboy, and similar to a color Sony Clie." Ouch.

Also the Palm FAQ is stating that the sidelit is ALWAYS off unless selected on for a short period of time just like today's B&W backlighting (using the power key). Most people even on a Compaq iPAQ need to leave the sidelit on in all but the brightest sunlight to get a good image. What does this say about Palm's expected battery life?

I hope some people get to have their hands on the color m505 soon, before they are released. I don't mind a slightly dimmer screen than my IIIc but I won't stand for what the old Sony Color Clie has.

My questions:

1) If I leave the sidelight on all the time on my m505 what will be the battery life? (I am VERY scared to know.)

2) How does this screen comapre with the sidelit on to the Compaq iPAQ and old Sony Color Clie screens?

I miss my Palm V so badly after I purchased the tank that is a Palm IIIc. I have already ordered the m505... but if the screen is horrible I intend to perhaps change my order. We'll see... Palm has usually delivered in the past.

Dave


RE: How is the SCREEN...?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 12:08:35 PM #
Cnet has a video clip of the 505 in use. Although the clip was pixilated, the screen of the 505 did look very much like the IPAQ. Check for yourself at:

http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1006-200-5173397.html?tag=st.tv.toc.top.0-1006-200-5173397

RE: How is the SCREEN...?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 1:07:20 PM #
This doesn't sound good:

http://www.msnbc.com/news/546477.asp

Author campares the new screen to a Color Gameboy and say it is no comparison to Pocket PC, Prism, or the IIIc screens...ugh. Hope they've improved it.

RE: How is the SCREEN...?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/21/2001 1:33:55 AM #
note. . . mr. krakow - the author - works for MSnbc. . . that's not MS as in Moral Scruples. in this "review" of the "somewhat underwhelming" palm m505 i counted no less than six references to pocket pcs, one of which was in umpteen point font. also, the last two references bring up new pocket pc models to be on the lookout for. . . whee-hoo! mr. krakow is also quick to point out the virtues of pocket pc color screens. . . i assume that by this he didn't mean the stunning fewer-colors-than advertised jornada screen? not content to leave it there, mr. krakow also made at least six references to handspring and four references to the sony clie as well. what was the subject of this review again? palm who?

who knows, the screen might actually suck, but i wouldn't base my final judgement on this guy's article.

RE: How is the SCREEN...?
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/21/2001 2:40:10 AM #
I just checked out the video on this website, the Palm M505 looks very good. Good work Palm

http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1006-200-5173397.html?tag=st.tv.toc.top.0-1006-200-5173397

New m505 Pictures!

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 3:25:48 PM #
Hi, I've captured Pictures of the m505 from a german News Program realated to CeBIT 2001. As you can see it's not yet labeled as m505. The Pictures are showing PhotoSuite, so you can judge over the quality of the display for yourself.

URL: http://www.c-s-n.net/digitalcreativity/m505/

RE: New m505 Pictures!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 6:58:52 PM #
Well the digital quality of that looks poor (no offense, often these close ups are) so since you actually saw it... are the colors really that washed out? Did you have the side light on at the time the photo was taken? How much ambient light was there? Thanks,

Dave

RE: New m505 Pictures!
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/20/2001 9:04:26 PM #
Whoa! He's captured these pictures from a video of a German news program? I don't think a video frame is going to be a good indicator of quality, especially as they are off-axis relative to the display. I guess I appreciate the time taken to grab the clip, but I'm going to reserve judgement until a reviewer reviews a final unit or I see my ordered unit in person (30 day return period!)

Bluetooth

kikan @ 3/21/2001 7:16:54 AM #
Hi,

I've read bluetooth would be managed by PalmOS 4, but how about devices ?

Does someone know if there will be a SDCard providing bluetooth or will we have to wait for the next generation palm (ARM, PalmOS 5...) to do it ?

RE: Bluetooth
Ed @ 3/21/2001 8:21:27 AM #
The new OS is supposed to be "Bluetooth-ready,'' but it doesn't actually include the software needed. A Bluetooth-related upgrade is scheduled for this summer.

After the software support is ready, Palm intends to release a case with its own processor, an RF module, and serial chipset that draws power from the Palm. This should be available in early 2002. Don't expect to see a Palm with built-in Bluetooth hardware until later in 2002.

Part of what is holding Bluetooth back is that the hardware costs haven't gone down as much as the Bluetooth SIG had hoped they would. They have a target cost of $10 for the hardware but most estimates have it in the $30 to $50 range by the end of 2001.

Anyway, there still aren't a lot of other devices to connect to. Windows won't support Bluetooth until the next major release.

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter

RE: Bluetooth
kikan @ 3/21/2001 8:55:00 AM #
Thank you very much for your very interesting answer.

Christian.

When will the new Palm m505 be released in the UK??

I.M. Anonymous @ 3/21/2001 8:00:04 AM #
:)

RE: When will the new Palm m505 be released in the UK??
I.M. Anonymous @ 3/21/2001 8:19:18 AM #
At some point during June 2001. The m500 will arrive at some point during May 2001. (International Dates)

[ No Subject ]

Franco Lusetti @ 3/22/2001 1:03:22 PM #
When will be possible to by m505 in Europe?

Screen Size

Visornut @ 3/22/2001 2:31:38 PM #
Palm missed the mark again. The m505 comes with a reflective screen which is on par with the IPAQ. However, why does Palm insist on not utilizing the full screen the way the IPAQ does? This waste of screen space by Palm will now make me switch over to the PocketPC. Thanks Palm, you made my switch to color easier.

7 years between comments!

Tuckermaclain @ 3/15/2008 5:18:23 PM #
Those were the days. The 505 preorder fiasco was getting ready to happen. MSMount, PowerRun and McFile were the must have apps. PiDirect was soon to appear giving us a pretty good VFS integration. Mike Cane was already a prolific contributor. Whatever happened to I.M.Anonymous ans Satan and those guys? No doubt talking happily away on their iphones. Nice article.

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