Comments on: Sony Posts Info on OS 4.1 Upgrade

Sony has posted details on their site for the program to upgrade the N710C from Palm OS 3.5 to OS 4.1. For the most part, this confirms the information the company released earlier on the upgrade.

In order for a N710C to be upgraded, it will need to be shipped to Sony who will install the new OS and return it, along with the same CD of apps that comes with the N760C. This program will be available on Nov. 20 and cost $50.

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upgrade - and warranties?

ardiri @ 11/5/2001 10:06:56 AM #
Many people have performed an unauthorized upgrade to OS 4.1 which made them ineligible for this upgrade and violated their warranties. As its site says, "Sony Handheld Service Center will not be able to service products which have been upgraded using unauthorized upgrade software."

actually, i dont see what their problem is? as a palm developer, i have reflashed nearly every one of my units with the seeding roms that are available for download from - we dont "void" our warranty there - and come on, whats the worse that can happen? do a debug reset of the unit! and, reflash again.

the "illegal" (if you call it that) upgrade of course doesn't provide a back door such as a debug reset - but, what is so illegal about owning jashflash yourself, and then doing the rom restore after getting a n760c rom from sony's website? how can they guarentee it was an illegal upgrade or not?

just seems like a marketing ploy by sony to get $50 out of people for something they can do themselves (not that i recommend it, if you dont know what your doing - cough up the $50). play it safe. for me, if my n710c crapped itself, i'll just go out and get a new one. the n710c works great now - so, why do i care?

i have send many units back to palm due to hardware error, even when they have 4.0 dr 3 or something on them (even with debug roms) - never had a problem. flashing the rom wont "kill" your unit, and there will be no damage to the hardware..

// az

RE: upgrade - and warranties?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/5/2001 11:32:57 AM #

I've talked to Sony about this. They're only doing the upgrade themselves because they're afraid of "average users" losing their data in the upgrade. (You'd be surprised how stupid "average" users can be.)

At $50, with a box, shipping both ways, and the labor involved, plus probably a small licensing fee to Palm, surely you realize they're NOT making money on this. It's just lack of faith in their customers, not a profit center.

What Sony SHOULD do is give folks a choice. Your typical suit who doesn't know what he's doing (who probably isn't seeking the upgrade anyway) could send his in. More savvy users could pay $10 and download an update themselves.

RE: upgrade - and warranties?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/5/2001 11:47:54 AM #
Anonymous - now you're talking. You get my vote to be Sony VP of Clies (if such a position exists).

RE: upgrade - and warranties?
digilaw @ 11/5/2001 1:35:34 PM #
You had it there in the end Aaron but its more than a marketing ploy its a company mantra. They really don't care about the customer. They seem to only care about profits and liability. I mean have you called Sony customer service for anything besides the Clie (TVs, dvd players etc)? Or gone to a service station? You realize it up and personal that they really don't care about you. The thing is that they care about their products though which is why they keep coming out with quality items. What I would like to know is how large a profit Sony makes with these $50 charges? It would seem that they do since labor and shipping would come to less than $20 maybe even less than $10.

RE: upgrade - and warranties?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/5/2001 2:39:28 PM #
It's not so easy to flash a Sony device. I don't know of any ways to flash it over USB, and CLIEs don't come with serial cradles (and if you're going to spend money for a serial cradle, why not spend the $50 and just send it in to Sony?)

The pirate upgrade that's been circulating around in various forums flashes the ROM using a Memory Stick. If this fails, I doubt you simply can reset the device and try again.

RE: upgrade - and warranties?
polymath @ 11/5/2001 3:45:23 PM #
That's not true. There are ways to do this. Sony is just concerned that they would end up with all the repair requests and phone supports which would cost them money.

So, in a sense, they are trying to make money. Software ROM upgrade is both safe and effective. Handera has been offering this for their units for awhile.

Jacksprat and other programs have shown that Flash upgrade is entirely possible via software.

RE: upgrade - and warranties?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/5/2001 5:17:21 PM #
I wasn't saying that a flash upgrade via software isn't possible--that's what I was referring to regarding the Memory Stick method. But what happens if something goes wrong in the process (battery dies, whatever)? Can they try again if they corrupt their ROM?

RE: upgrade - and warranties?
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/6/2001 8:17:50 AM #
You mentioned in your post about an 'n760c rom' that is posted on Sony's website. Could you provide the link to this? I've searched the site, but nothing comes up. Thanks.

Sony's fumble continues

mikecane @ 11/5/2001 10:21:45 AM #
It would help their case if they took the bloody time to explain *why* they prefer people to have Sony do the ROM upgrade (aside from getting an extra $50!). If Palm has allowed users to do it, why does Sony want it otherwise? I expect there is much more to this than meets the eye. I suspect Sony used several sources for ROM chips -- and some cannot be flashed at all; they must be physically replaced.

RE: Sony's fumble continues
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/5/2001 10:43:06 AM #
I would hardly call this a fumble. Many people posted when Sony started selling Palm OS handhelds that this is exactly the type of support you should expect from them.

RE: Sony's fumble continues
mikecane @ 11/5/2001 10:48:06 AM #
I've been on the boards and the List from before the N710C. The people who said Sony would charge were in a minority -- and *no one* ever thought the unit would have to be mailed in!

RE: Sony's fumble continues
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/5/2001 11:09:33 AM #
I should have been more clear in my statement. Not that Sony would specifically expect you to send a unit in. More that from their view, they see these as disposable devices (like a CD player, VCR, etc.). I'm actually surprised they're offering any upgrade options. Probably too many developers were complaining.

Doesn't extend the warranty??

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/5/2001 10:09:19 AM #
Now, I am glad that I performed my own N710C upgrade to the N760C, even though it voided my warranty. The fact that there will be a $50.00 charge and Sony reps are going to work on it and not extend the warranty ridiculous.

RE: Doesn't extend the warranty??
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/6/2001 8:31:26 AM #
Why many peple so hate this sony way?

For upgrade OS from 3.X to 4.X will have some charge not only for sony, Palm Inc also plan to charge for upgrade their Palm from 3.X to 4.X.

RE: Doesn't extend the warranty??
I.M. Anonymous @ 11/6/2001 9:39:53 AM #
You go without your PDA for an indefinate period of time. Not me.

What's on the CD??

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/5/2001 1:54:34 PM #
"Sony who will install the new OS and return it, along with the same CD of apps that comes with the N760C. "

What is on the CD for the 760 that isn't on the 710?


RE: What's on the CD??
Kaitou @ 11/5/2001 3:39:28 PM #
Mainly an updated version of picture gear that lets you save in high color, and some media player skins

Day light robbery

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/7/2001 1:26:48 AM #
Lets all be honest here, this sucks!!!

I paid 35% more for my unit than the cheaper N760C, and by eight weeks. And they have the audacity to tell me it will cost 50 USD plus a loss in time to update it.

Sony, this is how every other large brand has lost customers in the past, Xerox, HP, etc classic examples of companies attempting to cover flaws in their product development by cheap underhanded tricks such as this.

If my unit breaks, i will never purchase another sony, i will not update it and I will tell everyone who listens to me that SONY sucks, an expensive 50 USD I would say.

The CLIE upgrade center

I.M. Anonymous @ 11/7/2001 1:34:43 AM #


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