Comments on: Palm Lowers Revenue Outlook

Palm, Inc. today announced that its third-quarter fiscal 2003 results will be less than previously expected because of lower than anticipated sales of high end devices inlcuding the Tungsten T.
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Next Quarter?

mikecane @ 3/3/2003 12:27:47 PM #
OK, let's get NEXT quarter's news out of the way right now:

1) Palm does additional layoffs
2) Palm lower revenue expectations

-- half of this is Palm's fault, but the other half really *is* the rotten economy.

the good news

hotpaw4 @ 3/3/2003 12:33:23 PM #
The good news is that Zire sales are going according to forecasts. This means that the value end of the PalmOS palmtop category is meeting customers needs.

The bad news for Palm is that very few people seem to be buying at the luxury goods end of the product line in this down economy.

Point being...

painted_dog @ 3/3/2003 12:47:41 PM #
... that they are facing increased competition from PPC [esp. lower cost color PPCs (ie. dell)]. To get a desirable color PDA from Palm you must look to the Tungsten T ~$400 ! Palm needs a good midrange color [16 bit color w/ high res screen] ASAP. Sony has got the idea.

:: dk ::

RE: Point being...
hotpaw4 @ 3/3/2003 1:02:54 PM #
> Palm needs a good midrange ...

According to the statements in the warning, Palm's midrange products are meeting forcasts. The problem is with their high-end products in this economy, not with their low or midrange.

We don't know yet whether anyone elses high end products (hires+ Sony NX, etc.) are meeting forecasts this quarter.

RE: Point being...
Cap @ 3/3/2003 1:18:46 PM #
Having just bought my Tungsten | T (and loving it) I can think of one thing that might have let me convince a friend who recently decided to go with a Pocket PC recently. He wanted easy 802.11b not built in but at least available in a wireless card like so many Pocket PC's.

:-/

RE: Point being...
BlueAnon @ 3/3/2003 1:50:52 PM #
If they think they could introduce a 16MB 2.5inch PDA at $499, they were definitelys moking something.

and if they are projecting $299 T|T will last until midQ3 without update, they are smoking something really good.

Once Palm enters the ARM market, consumer expectation will be just like PPC's. New product, ever cheaper price, higher performance and ever more features.

RE: Point being...
Altema @ 3/3/2003 2:06:20 PM #
"He wanted easy 802.11b not built in but at least available in a wireless card like so many Pocket PC's."

Yea, that is a valid point, especially with the Xircom 802.11b sled so expensive. The have come down some (from 299.00 to 239.00 I think), but still in the "not unless I HAVE to have it" category.

RE: Point being...
Altema @ 3/3/2003 2:11:11 PM #
"Palm needs a good midrange color [16 bit color w/ high res screen] ASAP. Sony has got the idea."

They could put hi-res and a 66Mhz Dragonball in the M515 and hit this target pretty well. Oh well, Sony already did it except for the size.

RE: Point being...
hotpaw4 @ 3/3/2003 2:13:55 PM #
someone wrote:
> Once Palm enters the ARM market, consumer expectation will be just like PPC's.

Why would the CPU architecture change a typical consumers expectations? They don't develop software. If PalmSG put an ARM MXL in a Zire for around same price, I would expect sales to be the same or higher.

It's price that affects consumer expectations more, not CPU architecture. Palm's problem was entering the luxury end of the market in a down economy.

RE: Point being...
BlueAnon @ 3/3/2003 3:12:35 PM #
Palm's problem is trying to paddle a has been technology as a luxury item and find out the hard way consumer isn't stupid.
RE: Point being...
navomaal @ 3/3/2003 4:20:36 PM #
Blueanon - I completely agree with you my friend :)

AH - my predictions finally came true

navomaal @ 3/3/2003 2:03:29 PM #
Oh boy - I believe last year I predicted the palm company's policy - hide your head in the sand and pretend there is nothing going around. Since then they have done nothing else but that.

Seriously, any RETARD can think that if the same or better product with better options is available months before palm comes out with anything, there IS a problem. And to top it off - our beloved palm desigeners go out of their way to introdue an extremly poor quality control issue( probably "gross neglect" would be a better term) with TT. Now as if this had not done enough damage (gotta love those palm decision makers) they went ahead and overprice it.

Palm is on a sucide mission.

Now they have a new product coming out - lets see if these "smart" people have learned their lesson. Simple math - its more profitable to sell MORE units at a LOWER price than LESS units at a higer price.


http://www.brighthand.com/article/Weak_Tungsten_T_Sales_Hurt_Palms_Bottom_Line

Ah - yes it will be a spectacular show - palm people making yet another sucidal decission.

Enjoy dear friends.


RE: AH - my predictions finally came true
EdH @ 3/3/2003 2:12:03 PM #
So, anyone thing the $550 Tungsten W with OS4 technology will save Palm's bacon in their 4th (Mar-May) quarter?

RE: AH - my predictions finally came true
BlueAnon @ 3/3/2003 2:14:53 PM #
They shouldn't have ever released that T|W. It contributes to the image that Palm is loosing touch with market pace, instead of the so called "grinding teeth for the phone arena"

Proper price line up for Palm product
$99 Zire
$130 Zire2 (refresh of m105)
$150 m500
$180-200 Color Zire (update of m130)
$199 m505
$299 T|T
$399 T|T2 with 64MB and bigger screen no wireless
$499-$599 T|T with WiFi
$599 T|T with 128MB (plus one wireless)

RE: AH - my predictions finally came true
Altema @ 3/3/2003 2:15:31 PM #
"So, anyone thing the $550 Tungsten W with OS4 technology will save Palm's bacon in their 4th (Mar-May) quarter?"

It may help IF they include the Mic/Speaker flip cover, AND they get more carriers than just AT&T, AND people become interested in doing voice and data simultaneously, AND they bundle SnapperMail...

Of course, they SHOULD be advertising it at the lower price WITH a service plan, which is how most of them will be sold. My current phone would have cost an arm and a leg if I bought it alone, but because I bought it with a plan, it only cost an arm :)

I myself might be drawn away from buying a T|T if they had it available through Cingular. I don't feel like changing my wireless provider, ISP, and email in one shot. Kind of takes the fun out of dual processors and killer battery life.

RE: AH - my predictions finally came true
hotpaw4 @ 3/3/2003 2:33:50 PM #
someone wrote:
>Proper price line up for Palm product
...
>$399 T|T2 with 64MB and bigger screen no wireless
>$499-$599 T|T with WiFi
>$599 T|T with 128MB (plus one wireless)

My suspicion is that nothing over $349 is selling well in this economy. So I wouldn't do any of the above, and instead freshen the m515 (lores color + OS 5 ?) and m500 (hires monochrome maybe?) levels, and maybe find some vendor to make low cost ($100) wifi or bluetooth sleds.

RE: AH - my predictions finally came true
BlueAnon @ 3/3/2003 3:14:11 PM #
Spin it anyway you want, but PDA is still about feature one gets at what price. It is not completely about style and marketing as in luxury goods. High end PDA is not a Gucci handback. It needs features to demand high price, not just kitsch.

Tungsten is all kitsch. Where is the meat?

RE: AH - my predictions finally came true
abosco @ 3/3/2003 9:18:01 PM #
"Spin it anyway you want, but PDA is still about feature one gets at what price."

No it's not. PPC is like that. Palm OS isn't close to that.

-Bosco
Proud Member of the Top Non-Mods
Members: abosco and ImpReza M3

RE: AH - my predictions finally came true
Mike Scott @ 3/5/2003 10:58:27 PM #
I know plenty of people, who, like me, would like to upgrade their Palm but who are underwhelmed by the T|T. I don't think that the economy has anything to do with it--we could be in a boom economy and people would find it unreasonable to pay what they want for the T|T when their Pocket PC competitors are offering so much more hardware (by the numbers) for less money.

I'm currently planning to go with Garmin's iQue 3600 when it ships. It lists for nearly $200 more than the T|T and lacks built-in Bluetooth or Wi-Fi, but has a virtual text-entry area (they aren't using Graffiti anymore, are they?), a much bigger screen and twice the built-in memory. Since I want the GPS features, it's a huge bargain compared to any dashboard GPS map device and a new PDA.

I could care less what happens to Palm, now that they've split off PalmSource. It's the OS that matters to me, not their hardware. If Sony succeeds in a bid to buy PalmSource, things may be screwed up.

No great shock...

93LE @ 3/3/2003 2:57:17 PM #
I guess Palm has to blame the economy for their poor products, now that they can't blame their old CEO. I wonder who they will blame next quarter (if they are still around), when the economy is warm again, and their products STILL won't sell...
RE: No great shock...
hotpaw4 @ 3/3/2003 3:44:53 PM #
someone wrote:
> and their products STILL won't sell...

Their low-end products seem to be selling quite well according to reports.

RE: No great shock...
BlueAnon @ 3/3/2003 4:12:51 PM #
Blame Saddam next duh' !

OS 6 *very* late?

mikecane @ 3/4/2003 7:23:01 PM #
According to Palmstation:

"The next PalmSource Developer's Conference is scheduled for December 9th through December 11th in Santa Clara. We'll post more details as they become available."

-- DECEMBER?!!? So much for OS 6 being a mid-year 03 thing. Look for it in mid-year **04**!!

Meanwhile, it has been said that the next OS of PPC will be out mid-03...

...Palm: One Step Behind. As Usual.

RE: OS 6 *very* late?
abosco @ 3/4/2003 8:52:31 PM #
According to PalmStation? You actually read that? Come on, you can't take it seriously. They update their page once a month! They just recently took down the poll that was asking about breaking the 8 MB barrier.

-Bosco
Proud Member of the Top Non-Mods
Members: abosco and ImpReza M3
RE: OS 6 *very* late?
mikecane @ 3/5/2003 11:44:12 AM #
Oh, and this is the guy who doesn't mind "FeliCa" as "Felicia." Go away, troll.

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