Comments on: Discussion: Should Handspring Make a Non-Palm Handheld?

Most of us chose a Visor not only for the expandable Springboard but also because of the large number of files in the Palm system. Just because Palm's system is out of date & their stock is dropping is certainly no reason to drop out on the company that has gotten them where they are.

I think it would bring a lot to the PDA community if Handspring made another PDA. I'm sure it's a complicated question...
How hard would it be to support Springboards under other OS's?
Would it help the larger Palm Springboard market if Springboard manufacturers could sell to a larger market? I bet the answer to that is yes. If Linux Handspring's were a hit then Xircom would sell more Springboards; lowering the price of Springboards, and making Palm Handsprings more desirable, etc.
I think they should stay a hardware company and let Palm be an OS company though. If they stick to hardware they wouldn't spread themselves too thin.

Whoever posted this doesn't really understand the relationship between Handspring and Palm. It's not like Palm has complete control over PalmOS which Handspring licenses. Handspring works with Palm on PalmOS, and has their own versions of PalmOS.

I think it would be great if they did expand to other OS'es in the PDA market. I think they have done alot to "waken" Palm up with their expansions, more color on the screen, more memory with the springboard technology, and even the first to bring a faster processor to the Palm family. I think they do have an eye for intuition and could expand that to other OS'es, (not just WinCE but also to Linex realm). Though I don't know if comming up with their own OS would be the best thing. I would take alot of resources, time, and money for that to happen. And though it is my own opinion, I think part of what makes the Palm OS so incredible at this time and has helped to lead to Handsprings success is the fact that there are literally thousands of programs that can be loaded on to Palm devices. To come up with their own OS I think would lack that twist that makes Palm's OS so versitle.

...of course not. Have you forgotten who's running the company?

The only reason why people think Palm OS is behind the times is because of Microsoft and their marketing. Palm OS isn't behind the times, because the "missing features" aren't necessary for this market segment YET. So with all the marketing hype gone, what's missing from Palm OS?

C'mon - many of the innovations in Palm OS 4.0 were done by Handspring. If Palm has problems advancing the OS, then Handspring can just take the ball and run with it. For Handspring to go to another OS now would require enough of a change that it might just be too costly for them in the short term. (And I'm not sold on Linux handhelds yet - I've yet to see a compelling desktop on Linux or any Unix variant, usability is where it's at on a handheld. I should add that I'm a Linux/Unix fan - better/easier development environment than from the Redmond crowd).

Handspring should jump on the Pocket PC bandwagon. They might want to look into creating a replacement for the Compaq Aero 1550 -- that is, a unit that would appeal to people who have outgrown their Palms and (yes!) Visors. Hawkins & Dubinsky are in business to make $$$, not to start or perpetuate a cult. Going with PPC makes more sense than for them to create an entire new OS or hardware architecture.

At PalmSource, Mr. Hawkins did great demos of how robust the Palm OS is currently.
It does multimedia by running an Activesky video clip on his Prism.
It does telephony with 3-way conferencing and SMS on the Visor Phone.
The Palm OS is great because developers have...well, developed it.

Nevertheless, Mr. hawkins did say his company was a Hardware company, period.
Other past reports indicate that Handspring is not a one Palm Pony and
I suspect that other platforms will be supported.
I think this is a good idea. It will show how great the Palm OS when
it still remains popular over the other Handspring supported platforms.

I think Handspring's mission is in handheld computing and not limited by the world of Palm.
That said considering their stock and low margins on hardware.
They most likely should move to other spaces.

Cheers,

a Palm/Handspring fan

i don't use a palm or hand spring, but i read about them. thats a really dumb idea.

should pc makers make their own os because microsoft is slow? has delays? isn't the best? of course not. its not so much the os but the programs that are made for the os. windows is great b/c there are millions of developers, and so is palm. the more programs = better the os, so in short this idea is flawed.

-matt
flame me @ y2kmatthew@yahoo.com

Correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't Jeff Hawkins Create the palm OS? and Grafitti? He started up Palm but needed some money to do it, so US Robotics helped him out, then 3com bought US robotics and didn't care about palm that much until they saw how well it was doing, but Jeff didn't like the way 3com were doing things so he asked if they would spin off palm and they said never so he and 3 other employes left and started up handspring then they went with the visor prototype to 3com's plam head boss guy and showed him out of good manners and the next day Palm got spun off to a seperate compan

SO Jeff Hawkins could very well redesign HIS OS and make modifications update it ETC

If I had the choice to by an OS based on what Jeff Hawkins learned today as opposed to what he learned 4 years ago (original Palm). I would pick the OS that he is most proud of, the one he would be developing (or is) today based on the success of the past. Most likely, using the ARM processor and licensing some voice recognition software from a leading software developer in this category.

Afterall, what could possibly be better than Graffiti? Yep, not having to type at all (but make it an option for those times when you don't want to talk outloud, say in a meeting, etc.). Using voice data entry offers many advantages, mostly speed of entry. It would be faster to say "A", "B" "C" rather than type it (as long as the interpreter does a good job at the recognition). Not much horspower or storage space would be required either. 2MB and a 50Mhz Processor should just about do it. The 2MB could be stored in Flash RAM and not impact the Palm OS Storage.

So, the way I look at it if Jeff can get "VoxFitti" out of his head an onto a slab of plastic, I would think this would be a really cool device. It would have one up on Palm and Microsoft. Neither of which have a Voice Recognition system. The key here is, it doesn't have to recognize every word in the English alphabet, just 26 letters, 10 numbers and a handful of other symbols. Not too much to ask and quite possible today.

So, if Jeff has this idea in mind (I don't know, I'm only speculating on what I would be researching if I were Jeff), then if his own OS is the only way to deliver, than I say go for it (It will be 1-2 years before Palms ARM Version of the Palm OS is ready). I'm sure Jeff could beat them to the punch and then license the OS back to Palm. No doubt it would be more advanced than anything that Palm comes up with.

Or, I'm an idiot. One of the two will happen. It either will or won't happen in the next 2 years. My bet is that it will...

See ya!

Jon W.
Harvest, AL

The PalmOS is currently expandable, and Palm has made it quite clear that they don't object to companies expanding on it. Just look at the products out there. PalmOS didn't have support for Springboard, so Handspring added, and Palm did nothing to stop them, they encouraged them. The PalmOS didn't have support for external expansion, so TRG added it for CompactFlash cards and Palm never stopped them. PalmOS didn't have support for a jog-wheel so Sony added it, and Palm never stopped them.

Just because Palm's implementation of PalmOS on their devices isn't filled with dozens of features and lots of glitz doesn't mean that all PalmOS devices have to stay that way. Notice Handspring made a killing in the marketplace with a PalmOS device. Why spend money now on something else when they are doing quite well and the market is growing? And if they feel there is a feature lacking, they can add it, just like every licensee company has already done.

And do not forget, Palm isn't sitting still. They have a host of new features on their roadmap, that are designed to complement, not replace, the existing system, thereby building on the huge installed base. Plus, they are already planning a move to more powerful hardware (ARM chips) and more flexible development (multiple sizes and resolutions). They are not resting on their laurels, but moving forward in an evolutionary, not revolutionary manner. Why should Handspring forsake a booming market and a successful product with years of life left to it for..... what?

--GrouchoMarx

;) Yeah ! They went out of Palm OS philosophy.

Like Anonymous said, if Palm doesn't update the OS, Handspring will. It's not too hard to do that. I will soon have a pocket pc to play with, but my palm Vx is still my companion.

Eston Bond
CEO Pine Tree Software
http://www.pinetreesoftware.net/

What I don't understand is? Why a handheld? Handspring has the potential to be a 3rd party hit. Why not make Web Devices? Or how about this. 3com recently came out with a Web Device. Handspring could have no problem doing this aswell. Many oses are available for them to use, WinCE(PLEASE DON'T USE WINCE GUYS), QNX(I-opener uses them, great micros that can be great in handhelds also), Mobil Linux+Transmeta Processor, and maybe even Palm OS :) In my humble opinion, Handspring needs to spread themselves a little thinner, but not too much.

I think consumers are SICK of different platforms and OS's. We have enough problems trying to get the proper conduits to the Desktop computer. Add ANOTHER OS and I think you'll be among the different odd ball OS's out there.

Stick with Palm, but IMPROVE on it.
- Add a Photo feature to the Address Book.
- Improve processor speed.
- Improve battery life.
- Keep it CHEAP. Keep it SIMPLE.
- Add the T9 keyboard.
- Improve on the Handspring Calculator.
- Buy out somboday like Iambic, and incorporate features from Iambic Software (or any other good third party software company)
- Continue to develop/expand Springboard modules.

And the list can go on and on....

Palm has the greatest number of shear palmtop users. I think Handspring can capitalize on the Palm customer base by continuing to IMPROVE the OS (if they are allowed) rather than take the chance to develop a OS from scratch OR liscense the PocketPC OS. I say, BANK on a SURE THING rather than trying to start a new FAD.

Hawkins is still influential on PalmOS development, despite differences between him and Palm. And if he did decide to use a different OS, it certainly wouldn't be CE, which is far too different from his vision of what a handheld OS should be.

Most (but not all) crticism of PalmOS originates from M$'s marketing, which is trying to paint PalmOS as crippled and WinCE as powerful and robust; I'm shocked at how much people are buying into M$'s FUD campaign. PalmOS does deserve critisicm. But a more accurate statement is that it's limited while CE is crippled.

Let's remember a few things here:

1) WinCE multitasks, but it's so bad that you can't even play an MP3 and scroll through a document without the MP3 skipping. Hello!?! Why can't I prioritize CPU tasks and set their individual CPU%?

2) WinCE requires an enormous amount of memory compared to other handheld OSs.

3) WinCE require a very fast CPU compared to other handheld OSs (both #3 and #4 require a bigger battery).

4) WinCE slows down for no reason and/or crashes periodically (ver3 is better than older versions, but still does it).

5) CE is still much buggier than PalmOS.

6) You can buy a *usable* PalmOS device for $130. In order to get a CE device with enough memory and a fast enough CPU so that you don't tear your own limbs off in frustration using it, you have to shell out $400+.

I'm not anti M$ and I want MP3s, higher resolution, and color. However, I'd rather use a task-switching device with a 160x160 pea-soup-green screen than use an unstable and buggy OS with unusable multitasking.

PalmOS can grow from where it is.

Like many others, I'm concerned the PalmOS is improving too slowly, but unless M$ does a total rewrite from the ground-up, CE will never evolve past it's problems, which are tied to the fact that they ported a desktop OS to their handhelds. Basing CE on the NT kernal was a short-sighted decision, made because M$ wanted to jump on the market before Palm got too much of a head start.

It's too bad, because M$ had the opportunity to start fresh and do something truly innovative. I have no doubt that in 3 or 4 years, M$ will take over the handheld market (M$ knows that bells and whistles sell better than stability and functionality). But unfortunately, like the desktops we use today, our handhelds will be crash-prone and buggy because they will be bloated at the core.

hey, don't attack the pocket pc. i have a cassiopeia and l love it, but the palm is much lighter and easier to use. stick with palm os, Handspring. You'll sell more.

Eston Bond
CEO Pine Tree Software

http://www.pinetreesoftware.net/

How come noone is mentioning EPOC? They're Microsoft's real competitors, as PalmOS is a totally different beast from Wince.

This is the main reason Microsoft is trying so hard to position themselves as PalmOS competitors. They want to be seen as #2, when they are actually #3 or #4.

HandSring should license the Newton OS and make it color. It was by the far the best handheld OS. It just had a crappy form factor. A newton in a Palm size enclosure would rock!

200mhz cpu
640x640 screen
emulated 68k palm os

asap

This is from an article posted yesterday on Cnet:

[Giga Information Group Vice President Rob] Enderle said rumors are flying in Silicon Valley that Handspring and Sony, which license Palm operating system, are shopping for a new OS. "No one is ever comfortable licensing from a competitor," he said.

http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/zd/20010116/tc/cto_resigns_will_palm_lose_its_grip__1.html

---
Plenipotentiary
Palm Infocenter