Treo 700w Getting Push Email Update

Palm has just announced a software update for the Treo 700w smartphone that will enable the Windows Mobile Messaging and Security Feature Pack (MSFP), which includes Direct Push Technology. The free update, which is expected to be available later this month, gives Treo 700w smartphone users automatic wireless updates of their email, calendar items, contacts and tasks, allowing IT managers to deliver this information directly from Exchange Server 2003 SP2 without incurring additional third-party infrastructure costs.

Direct Push email increases the number of choices for enterprise customers looking to deploy secure, push mobile email solutions on the Palm Treo platform. This cost-effective solution allows businesses to increase productivity by satisfying the real-time information needs of mobile professionals, without having to spend additional IT budget on new email servers or licensing fees.

"Direct Push Technology helps Palm Treo 700w customers stay on top of their jobs by quickly receiving and sending email and all other Microsoft Outlook information while they are on-the-go," said Suzan DelBene, corporate vice president of marketing, Mobile and Embedded Devices Division at Microsoft Corp. "The strong integration between Palm and Microsoft is an example of our commitment to build solid partnerships, creating a thriving mobile-industry ecosystem and raising the mobile experience to great heights."

Key Features of MSFP for the 700w

  • Direct Push Email Technology that enables the Treo 700w to automatically receive email, calendar, contacts and tasks wirelessly as soon as it arrives on Exchange Server 2003 SP2;
  • Over-the-air lookup of a company's Exchange Global Address List (GAL), providing employees with quick access to colleagues' email and contact information; and
  • Added security features for IT administrators, such as over-the-air device password policy enforcement and remote wipe of the device in case it is lost or stolen

Availability
The update for the Palm Treo 700w will be available later this month on Palm.com as a free download and included in subsequent Treo 700w smartphones and future Treo smartphones based on Windows Mobile.

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Where is BB for Treo 650??

Tamog @ 4/6/2006 1:54:43 PM # Q
Hi,
first post, lets try to get it meaningful..

WHERE IS THE FREAKING BLACKBERRY APP FOR OS5? It runs, we all know it, but why tha heck doesnt Palm go ahead and releases it?

I talked to a rep of the austrian T-Mobile carrier, and he said that one of the main reasons they dont run Treos is the lack of BlackBerry support. Face it, everyone loves Blackberry(most of them ,anyways)...

Best regards
Tam Hanna

Find out more about the Palm OS in my blog:
http://tamspalm.tamoggemon.com

RE: Where is BB for Treo 650??
Ryan @ 4/6/2006 1:56:57 PM # Q
BB Connect for Palm OS is still in that mythological place called "in carrier testing"

It is finished, but just waiting for the wireless carriers to finally approve and deploy it.

Reply to this comment

Already available for Palm OS smartphones

cervezas @ 4/6/2006 2:40:18 PM # Q
Microsoft is behind the ball with this long-awaited update.

Funambol (http://www.funambol.com) has delivered free push email and OTA PIM sync for Palm OS smartphones since the beginning of February. Only with Funambol you also get remote device management capabilities. An admin who can update your applications or perform other system management tasks (like disabling the device and clearing the data in the event it's stolen or lost).

Fortunately, if Microsoft's belated solution isn't complete enough for the 700w fleet in your company, Funambol should work with those, too. :-p

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
Software Everywhere blog
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Already available for Palm OS smartphones
AdamaDBrown @ 4/6/2006 5:06:49 PM # Q
FYI, the update was "released" last November or December (can't remember which), but most manufacturers have been rather slow to pick it up. Yet another reason to move towards manufacturer-independent upgrade. 700w users should simply be glad it didn't get stuck on the same shelf as the Blackberry client.

RE: Already available for Palm OS smartphones
drw @ 4/6/2006 9:02:52 PM # Q
yea, but it applies to exchange server clients. What if your mail server is yahoo?

---
David
RE: Already available for Palm OS smartphones
neuron @ 4/6/2006 9:20:30 PM # Q
Yahoo is a pop3 server, so there is no way to push without automatically forwarding to a push account.

Reply to this comment

Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.

VampireLestat @ 4/7/2006 1:31:04 AM # Q
You know what? Pocket PC users have tons of sites for Windowzzz devices. I would greatly appreciate it if PIC would stick to Palm OS stories. They do whatever the hell they want, but it just rubs me the wrong way everytime I see that Treo 700W stories.

Is the site Palm Inc related or Palm OS community related?

Why not start, PocketInfocenter.com so we can ignore it?



RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
VampireLestat @ 4/7/2006 1:36:04 AM # Q
And I feel that every bit of Treo 700w exposure on this site hurts the Palm OS community.

Bit by bit by bit...

RE: Leenuxx Tree-Os.
Surur @ 4/7/2006 2:12:54 AM # Q

And what will you say when the Linux Treo comes out?

Surur

They said I only argued for the sake of arguing, but after an hour I convinced them they were wrong...

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
AdamaDBrown @ 4/7/2006 2:56:21 AM # Q
And I feel that every bit of Treo 700w exposure on this site hurts the Palm OS community.

Isn't that overstating things a bit?

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
Surur @ 4/7/2006 5:22:35 AM # Q

He's quite right. The main message, despite all the spin Palm is putting on it, is that Windows Mobile is good enough for Palm, and should be good enough for anyone. If you accept that message, suddenly the whole constellation of WM devices becomes available to you, and it makes it that much harder to justify staying with PalmOS.

Basically by Palm using POS is a WM anti-FUD campaign, and being exposed to the truth weakens POS.

Surur

They said I only argued for the sake of arguing, but after an hour I convinced them they were wrong...

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
cervezas @ 4/7/2006 11:08:07 AM # Q
I can't see how discussion on PIC about the 700w could be damaging to the Palm OS. For one thing, the general consensus even outside this forum is that the 700w is a step down from the 650 in most respects--not a flop, by any means, but certainly not a big improvement. Also, the fact that we're only now seeing this Microsoft update for the 700w while more powerful and flexible solutions have been available for free on Palm OS since almost the beginning of the year doesn't exactly reflect well on Microsoft, does it? It's emblematic of the trouble they have keeping pace with smaller, more agile companies.

Not that Palm itself has been very agile, mind you, but at least they have a business model that fosters an ecosystem of great solution-providers like Funambol.

My bit of Palm OS boosterism for the day. ;-)

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
Software Everywhere blog
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
hkklife @ 4/7/2006 11:19:28 AM # Q
A wise man not named Gordon Gekko but equally ruthless once said "Know thy enemy"

I am not speaking for Ryan/PIC but I think that's the site's general stance on WinMob-related news & products from *PALM*.

"PALM" is a catch all term for one (well, currently two companies in theory but that's going to change soon) company, an OS, a brand and a general segment of the mobile marketplace.

PALM the company does offer one (and counting) WinMob device so Ryan feels that coverage of Palm the company's products is justified by the PALMinfocenter site.

However, keeping tabs on the 700w & Palm's support for it does not mean that we are going to see a slew of PPC software reviews & articles on PIC. Anything but...we're trying to keep PIC fresh & constantly updated with info & reviews of POS software & hardware whenever possible.

PIC is 99% Palm news & reviews with the occasional blurb about the 700w *ONLY* because it's a product offerd by Palm Inc. Other sites like Brighthand PDABuzz etc. offer maybe 90% WinMob coverage and just the token Palm OS announcement or review.

If you are unhappy with the direction of PIC then please go/post elsewhere. This is Ryan's site through and through and he makes no bones about it. If you want to do your part to enhance the Palm OS coverage on the site then by all means chime in. Guest contributions & reviews are always appreciated and can be submitted at any time.

I currently have *ZERO* interest in abandoning POS unless it no longer becomes a viable option for me. Yet I still keep the (very) occasional eye on news & devices from RIM, Dell, HP, Nokia and other players just because I don't want to keep my head in the sand completely. BTW I'm still trying to figure out why the usually harsh Engadget called the Nokia 770 the handheld of the year when Mike Cane & CNET call it the year's biggest mobile flop.

I doubt the occasional 700w item in moderation will hurt PIC or its readership. If and when Palm starts to field a wider variety of WinMob devices perhaps he can add a self contained section to the site specifially for "Palm Inc's WinMob Treos"

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
Ryan @ 4/7/2006 11:34:20 AM # Q
You guys do bring up a good point. It has been a dilemma for me since the announcement of how I was going to approach covering the w. My thoughts are that I want to keep PIC a Palm OS focused site and that is my intention going forward.

However, it is good to keep up to date on all that Palm Inc is doing, even if it is related to windows mobile. If anything the 700w brings smartphones to customers that Palm previously could not reach, and once they compare the Palm OS and WinMob Treo's I'm pretty sure the best device will win out in the long run... maybe even one day we could see a treo that dual boots operating systems, boot camp for smartphones!

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
cervezas @ 4/7/2006 12:09:46 PM # Q
maybe even one day we could see a treo that dual boots operating systems, boot camp for smartphones!

I got to see one at the DevCon last year: dual-boot Palm OS Cobalt and Windows CE.NET. Not a Treo, though. You can still see that pretty little phone with the Cobalt application launcher prominently displayed on Oswin's web site: http://www.oswintech.com/services.htm What teases they are: they used to only show pictures of it running WinCE.NET.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
Software Everywhere blog
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
Surur @ 4/7/2006 12:52:29 PM # Q

Its funny, the Apple situation is very similar.

Surur

They said I only argued for the sake of arguing, but after an hour I convinced them they were wrong...

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
slinky @ 4/7/2006 2:22:19 PM # Q
The 700w is yet another black mark on Palm's name in a suspect product line since the 600. It's got tons of bugs, some of them pretty serious and the latest which I'm sure Verizon is loving (doesn't automatically hang up when one caller hangs up on call waiting calls, owner gets charged for both calls until he hangs up on both.) The 32MB RAM thing yet again. Wow. Who would have thought Palm would be that stupid and create a phone that some love but create more customer support calls than the other PDAs combined... the 700p will be underpowered but will probably be far more usable than the 700w...

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
hkklife @ 4/7/2006 3:24:07 PM # Q
700p is underpowered compared to the 700w?

More "usable" RAM and a higher resolution screen are definite improvements over the "dubya".

The 700p also has the potential for better battery life and fewer bugs (as impossible as it sounds), especially with all of that lovely heap memory.

About the only major omission I forsee on the 700p is Palm intentionally *NOT* releasing wi-fi SDIO drivers for the P in order to give the W some measure of exclusivity. Well, that and not being available on any carriers other than Sprint.

On top of all that you have the usability factor.

So, yeah, considering the better usability over the 700w, better screen resolution over the 700w, and more RAM than the 650, the 700P is still the lesser of all smartphone evils.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
AdamaDBrown @ 4/7/2006 4:31:23 PM # Q
in a suspect product line since the 600.

Huh? I'd have thought that almost anyone would agree that the Treos have improved greatly since the 600. The switch to HTC for manufacturing, resulting in the drastic drop in hardware defects from the 600 to 650; the improvements in the display and memory (even with some of the dubious qualities of NVFS); and the wider array of available add-ons.

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
hkklife @ 4/7/2006 5:22:03 PM # Q
"suspect product line"?

(I missed it upon my initial read)

Regardless of the DUBIOUS build quality & benefits of NVFS, mediocre features/specs, and middlin' audio quality, there's no doubting that Palm would be GONE today if it were not for the Treo line...specifically the 650.

I'd like to see somewhere, maybe on the Slam blog, a breakdown of units sold through to carriers and/or as unlocked direct sales, divided up between "All pre-600 Treos by HS" "All Handspring & Palm 600s" and "All Treo 650s" to-date.

I wonder if the 600 or the 650 is ultimately the more successful of the two...I'd definitely claim the 600 had higher margins than the 650 due to the switch early on from the almost passable CSTN screen HS used to the really washed out CSTN Palm switched to.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX

RE: Windozzzzzz Tree-Os.
slinky @ 4/7/2006 11:28:39 PM # Q
32MB of RAM... 4 years later. Unfortunately with the 700w Palm is the latest underpowered piece of equipment and Verizon is dealing with the calls... The Treo 650 was timely in the sense that Palm still had created a superior form factor and case and figured they could make one last go and suck up as much consumer money and provide less. But the hardware gap has narrowed considerably and what once was a unique item -- Palm with its Palm OS -- is now becoming one of the many offerings. If I didn't get a free "upgrade" to the 700w I wouldn't have bothered. Lots more coming down the pipe that makes it the crippled joke that it is unfortunately - even more than the 650. The Motorola Q has a lot of people excited, even as a Smartphone. There are many others in the works and the competition is heating up... love it. If PPCTechs ever get that fix to work.. wow... that would be beautiful, both to have my device work as it should (sans wifi) and it would really stick it to Palm...

Until the announcement is officially made, there is no 700p. It seems like people didn't learn their lesson from last time, lol.

Reply to this comment

Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...

The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/8/2006 2:42:19 PM # Q
Slamblog recently posted a reasonably-accurate summary of cumulative Treo sales:

http://www.slamblog.com/2006/03/all_time_treo_s.html#more

March 31, 2006
All Time Treo Sales
This post keeps track of the all time Treo Sales. These numbers start with the Treo 600 and includes the Treo 650 and Treo 700w. The data below includes some estimates and actual data given by Palm, Inc. from its quarterly earnings reports and various company presentations. This post is updated as of March 31, 2006.

Fiscal Quarter Calendar Quarter Sell In Sell Thru Channel Fill Total Channel Inventory
Q204 November-03 100,000 70,000 30,000 30,000
Q304 February-04 137,000 115,000 22,000 52,000
Q404 May-04 151,000 126,000 25,000 77,000
Q105 August-04 273,000 179,000 94,000 171,000
Q205 November-04 340,000 190,000 150,000 321,000
Q305 February-05 280,000 282,000 (2,000) 319,000
Q405 May-05 395,000 442,000 (47,000) 272,000
Q106 August-05 491,000 470,000 21,000 293,000
Q206 November-05 602,000 435,000 167,000 460,000
Q306 February-06 564,000 569,000 (5,000) 455,000

Total 3,333,000 2,878,000


More explanation of this information after the jump:

The Sell-in numbers are the number of Treo units that Palm has sold to its channel partners. The carriers are the primary partners but Palm also sells about 10-12% of its phones into the general distribution channel in the US. The above numbers are not broken out by Treo version or by geography.

The Sell-Thru number is the number of Treo's sold to end user customers. Palm has reporting agreements with its customers (carriers and distributors) that enable it to track that amount of Treos selling to end user customers. Palm has focused on this metric to determine the success of its sales efforts for the Treo. Palm has stated that this information is relatively accurate at near real time.

The cumulative difference between the Sell-in and Sell Thru represents the current amount of Treos assumed to be in channel inventory.

Note: Palm periodically reports on total Treos sold. These reports allow us to refine our estimates and adjust the accuracy of our information. When Palm reports the total number of all Treos shipped they also include versions prior to the Treo 600. Total shipments of previous Treos are assumed to be around 250,000 to 300,000. Since this blog began commenting on Palm with the release of the Treo 600, we generally do not include that data.

Some general notes:

Q204 - The Treo 600 first shipped
Q304 - Palm was backorderded on screen parts for Treos during this Quarter
Q205 - Estimate of 20,000 "Sell-in" are Treo 650, Product transistion (600 to 650)
Q305 - Estimate of 180,000 "Sell-in" are Treo 650
Q206 - Possibly a few Treo 700W but most likely all Treo 650
Q306 - Fresh estimate (to be revised) of 200,000 Treo 700w shipped, possibly more.


***************************************************************************

A couple of suggestions for Ryan:

- You might want to ask at Slamblog if he would let you post his article at Palminfocenter.

- Please don't let Palminfocenter get PalmStationed. The comments here have nosedived recently and besides the discussion over Beersy's loose lips chatter about Palm's in-house Linux plans, the posts here are eerily starting to resemble the drivel at Brighthand, 1src, etc.

- Creating "contests" designed to get people to register and post more isn't going to work. As with your previous attempt, all we'll see is a few sleazy twits registering under a dozen "new" Palminfocenter UserNames to SPAM the contest thread, never to be heard of again once the contest is over.

- As you may now be aware, traditional PalmOS PDAs are almost extinct, and PalmOS has been effectively killed off by Access. (Access is about as relevant to our interests here as Symbian would be - despite the endless whimperings of PalmSource manager David Schlesinger to the contrary.) Palm is about to throw more of its resources behind Windows Mobile as it scrambles to survive the onslaught of superior hardware that will be available from most of Palm's competitors. Palminfocenter needs to decide if it will evolve to also become a Windows Mobile site or if it will be PalmOS-only/PamOS-mainly. As much as I'd like to see Palminfocenter become the site where PalmOS users make their last stand, I'm not sure if you're prepared to do what it takes to achieve this goal. I've previously made several suggestions on how you may continue to develop Palminfocenter, but I fear your current strategy will result in an inexorable decline into oblivion.


TVoR

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
Surur @ 4/8/2006 3:38:51 PM # Q
I wish he quoted his source for the 200 000 Treo 700w sales. I actually find that hard to believe, but if true its rather amazing. It actually goes against my perception that POS users are very tied to their OS, as a large number must have switched. Notice that total sales are not up hugely, which indicated to me that its not all new customers, but a large part cannibalization.

(Actually I just noticed that the 200 000 is shipments, not sell through. They may just be forming part of the 455 000 thats sitting in inventory).

Surur

They said I only argued for the sake of arguing, but after an hour I convinced them they were wrong...

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/8/2006 5:31:10 PM # Q
I wish he quoted his source for the 200 000 Treo 700w sales. I actually find that hard to believe, but if true its rather amazing. It actually goes against my perception that POS users are very tied to their OS, as a large number must have switched. Notice that total sales are not up hugely, which indicated to me that its not all new customers, but a large part cannibalization.

(Actually I just noticed that the 200 000 is shipments, not sell through. They may just be forming part of the 455 000 thats sitting in inventory).

Surur

Remember that the Treo 700w was only released in the past quarter (January, 2006) and that Treo sales growth will likely come from sales to businesses rather than end users. The unified solution of Microsoft Exchange Server + Windows Mobile devices for "free" push email is a LOT more appealing than the amateurish, cobbled-together, roll-your-own solutions offered by various independent companies and hobbyist hackers that Beersy keeps ranting about. Palm dropped the ball - big time - when they failed to integrate Seven or Good Technology with their email client to offer a "free" turn-key, out-of-box push email solution for the Treo 600 in 2003. Had Palm delivered the goods, they would have had a 2 year lead with which they could have tried to push PalmOS as a solid rival to Blackberry for corporate customers. Palm's internal confusion and angst also lead to the comedy of errors known as the FUBARed introduction of the PalmOS Blackberry client software.

I believe a lot of Treo sales have been to former owners of standalone PalmOS PDA that were discouraged by the lack of compelling traditional PalmOS PDAs on the market. I predict these upgraders will be less inclined to buy new hardware at the fast rate that they did when they were upgrading their standalone PDAs. Cannibalizing traditional PDA sales by selling smartphones to a (formerly) captive market amounts to sacificing the future to make current numbers look good. [Of course, if the Treo 700w becomes a smash hit with corporate customers, the fate of Palm's PalmOS devices is academic.] It all comes down to whether or not Palm's product mix has what it takes to GROW their market. Based on what the competition has announced for 2006, Palm's future looks bleak. Incremental upgrades that take 2 years to release won't cut it if Palm intends to be a player in the mobile handset world in the same league as heavyweights like Nokia, Sony Ericsson, Samsung, Motorola, etc.

I think most people now realize that Palm has (eagerly) become both the carriers' biotch and Bill Gates' biotch. Sorry, Melinda but Colligan swallows. (Am I the only one who saw Gates smirking at the Treo 700w press conference in S.F. while he made Ed Colligan act like a puppy/biotch anxious to do new tricks for his master/pimp? Bending over to please the carriers is a change that will probably come back to bite Palm in the a$$. As we saw with Sprint's asinine decision to not carry the Samsung 1550, Palm's success now depends more on satisfying the whims of carriers than it does on making end users happy. Verizon and Sprint customers know all too well how annoying it is dealing with hardware that has been crippled to meet the demands of carriers. This does not bode well for the future creativity of what was once a vibrant platform.


TVoR

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/8/2006 5:40:23 PM # Q
I wish he quoted his source for the 200 000 Treo 700w sales. I actually find that hard to believe, but if true its rather amazing. It actually goes against my perception that POS users are very tied to their OS, as a large number must have switched. Notice that total sales are not up hugely, which indicated to me that its not all new customers, but a large part cannibalization.

(Actually I just noticed that the 200 000 is shipments, not sell through. They may just be forming part of the 455 000 thats sitting in inventory).

Surur

Remember that the Treo 700w was only released in the past quarter (January, 2006) and that Treo sales growth will likely come from sales to businesses rather than end users. The unified solution of Microsoft Exchange Server + Windows Mobile devices for "free" push email is a LOT more appealing than the amateurish, cobbled-together, roll-your-own solutions offered by various independent companies and hobbyist hackers that Beersy keeps ranting about. Palm dropped the ball - big time - when they failed to integrate Seven or Good Technology with their email client to offer a "free" turn-key, out-of-box push email solution for the Treo 600 in 2003. Had Palm delivered the goods, they would have had a 2 year lead with which they could have tried to push PalmOS as a solid rival to Blackberry for corporate customers. Palm's internal confusion and angst also lead to the comedy of errors known as the FUBARed introduction of the PalmOS Blackberry client software.

I believe a lot of Treo sales have been to former owners of standalone PalmOS PDA that were discouraged by the lack of compelling traditional PalmOS PDAs on the market. I predict these upgraders will be less inclined to buy new hardware at the fast rate that they did when they were upgrading their standalone PDAs. Cannibalizing traditional PDA sales by selling smartphones to a (formerly) captive market amounts to sacificing the future to make current numbers look good. [Of course, if the Treo 700w becomes a smash hit with corporate customers, the fate of Palm's PalmOS devices is academic.] It all comes down to whether or not Palm's product mix has what it takes to GROW their market. Based on what the competition has announced for 2006, Palm's future looks bleak. Incremental upgrades that take 2 years to release won't cut it if Palm intends to be a player in the mobile handset world in the same league as heavyweights like Nokia, Sony Ericsson, Samsung, Motorola, etc.

I think most people now realize that Palm has (eagerly) become both the carriers' biotch and Bill Gates' biotch. Sorry, Melinda but Colligan swallows. (Am I the only one who saw Gates smirking at the Treo 700w press conference in S.F. while he made Ed Colligan act like a puppy/biotch anxious to do new tricks for his master/pimp?) Bending over to please the carriers is a change that will probably come back to bite Palm in the a$$. As we saw with Sprint's asinine decision to not carry the Samsung i550, Palm's success now depends more on satisfying the whims of carriers than it does on making end users happy. Verizon and Sprint customers know all too well how annoying it is dealing with hardware that has been crippled to meet the demands of carriers. This does not bode well for the future creativity of what was once a vibrant platform.


TVoR

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
cervezas @ 4/8/2006 6:40:05 PM # Q
The unified solution of Microsoft Exchange Server + Windows Mobile devices for "free" push email is a LOT more appealing than the amateurish, cobbled-together, roll-your-own solutions offered by various independent companies and hobbyist hackers that Beersy keeps ranting about.

Wow, so you've bought yourself a 700w, got an advance copy of the update, and had a chance to compare Microsoft's push email with Funambol. You really should write a review because you'd certainly be the first.

As for Funambol being "hobbyist hackers," you might be interested to know they got $10M in first round VC last year and had their technology licensed by Computer Associates for use within CA's enterprise device management products. What have you done lately?

I agree that from a marketing standpoint it might be hard to beat the Microsoft machine. It's just that it's a little embarrassing when a giant like Microsoft gets shown up by a bunch of "hobbyist hackers" delivering a product with twice the features.

David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
Software Everywhere blog
www.pikesoft.com/blog

Beersy: Get a clue.
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/8/2006 7:00:30 PM # Q
Wow, so you've bought yourself a 700w, got an advance copy of the update, and had a chance to compare Microsoft's push email with Funambol. You really should write a review because you'd certainly be the first.

As for Funambol being "hobbyist hackers," you might be interested to know they got $10M in first round VC last year and had their technology licensed by Computer Associates for use within CA's enterprise device management products. What have you done lately?

I agree that from a marketing standpoint it might be hard to beat the Microsoft machine. It's just that it's a little embarrassing when a giant like Microsoft gets shown up by a bunch of "hobbyist hackers" delivering a product with twice the features.


Beersy, what dumba$$ geeks like you fail to understand is that products succeed because of marketing more than they do because of any (arguable) perceived technical merit. How long has Good Technology been offering push email for Treos? How are their sales compared to Blackberry? Anyone who thinks Good Technology will survive much longer please raise your hand [no one moves...].


When Bubba Joe - lead monkey in IT - is told by the CEO "I want push email for Treos" do you think he's going to put his neck on the line by recommending your geeky little Funambol "solution" (that's probably provided by some teenage whiz kid hacker in Moscow that could disappear after next weekend's rave, never to be heard from again), or is Bubba Joe going to recommend that familiar, SAFE "Windows" solution? Add in "FREE" to the equation along with the uncertainties swirling around the future of PalmOS and suddenly it's a rout for Microsoft. As long as Microsoft doesn't completely botch its push email package its hard to see how they won't quickly become the defacto standard. RIM must be pi$$ing their pants as they wait to see if Microsoft will ship without any showstopping bugs.

Keep dreaming, Beersy. Your innocence is touching. I hope Gates doesn't party on your a$$ TOO hard before your company goes bankrupt.

TVoR

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
Simony @ 4/8/2006 10:29:31 PM # Q
Gee, our little friend, The Vat of Refuse seems to be really exited by these numbers. (Amazing, for someone who is financially innumerate.)

Let's all hope, like she does, that Palm will drop Palm OS forever, so that she can achieve nirvana at last.

Ryan, please don't let PIC become 'palmstationed' by allowing trolls to run riot with offensive posts (as happended over at palmstation.com all those years ago). Also, please keep up the competitions and software reviews - the more new members you can bring here the better for the PIC community.

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
hkklife @ 4/8/2006 10:53:18 PM # Q
Simony;

if you like the reviews you'll be pleased to know I have one in the can to be published in the next day or so and another two in the works for later in the week.

I'm primarily reviewing games & entertainment titles for the time being but will do the occasional non-game app and hardware/accessory review should the occasion arise.

Again, anyone who feels the need can gladly submit a guest review to Ryan. More content keeps PIC fresh and more of an actual resource for Palm owners.

Pilot 1000-->Pilot 5000-->PalmPilot Pro-->IIIe-->Vx-->m505-->T|T-->T|T2-->T|C-->T|T3-->T|T5-->TX

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
Simony @ 4/8/2006 10:58:16 PM # Q
Thanks, hkklife, your reviews are always interesting. If I had a vote, I'd like to see a review of the Madden football game (although I believe you said once that you don't go for that type of game).

Personally, I only have two games on my palmpilot - ChessGenius & Giraffe. The latter was a real life-saver - I played a game a day for about a week, when I was making the transition from G1 to G2. It really helped a lot. I still fire it up every once in a while when I need to brush up on my G2 punctuation and special characters. With the help of Giraffe, I think I am now nearly as proficient with G2 as I ever was with G1.

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
SeldomVisitor @ 4/9/2006 8:58:47 AM # Q
The sell-through numbers for the most recent quarter were accompanied by big huge warnings that they were (paraphrased) "only as good as the entities reporting them".

That was an unusual thing for PALM to do.

The cynical out here might suggest PALM itself had little faith in them relative to the past.

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
cervezas @ 4/9/2006 10:59:38 AM # Q
TVoR wrote:
Beersy, what dumba$$ geeks like you fail to understand is that products succeed because of marketing more than they do because of any (arguable) perceived technical merit.

I see. So that explains why you criticized the alternatives to Microsoft on the basis of their "amateurish, cobbled-together" technical merit and I pointed out that "from a marketing standpoint it might be hard to beat the Microsoft machine." It's all coming clear to me which of us is the dumba$$.


David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
Software Everywhere blog
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/9/2006 11:36:19 AM # Q
I see. So that explains why you criticized the alternatives to Microsoft on the basis of their "amateurish, cobbled-together"...

Beersy, any solution that is not a turkey solution from a single provider is "cobbled together". And sorry to hurt your feelings, but several of the homemade, garage-coded "push" email solutions for PalmOS are by definition amateurish compared to a Microsoft-sponsored solution that integrates seamlessly with Microsoft Exchange.

and I pointed out that "from a marketing standpoint it might be hard to beat the Microsoft machine."

Very good. Perhaps there's hope for you yet.

It's all coming clear to me which of us is the dumba$$.

Finally. Excellent. Go to the dumba$$. He's waiting for you in the mirror. Run.

Beersy, it's time for you to get back to licking the boots of PalmSource employees and begging Marty "Loose Lips" Fouts for even more dirt on the disgraced PalmSource.

Take care, little buddy.

TVoR


------------------------
Sony CLIE UX100: 128 MB real RAM, OLED screen. All the PDA anyone really ever wanted.
------------------------

The Palm eCONomy = Communismô

The Great Palm Swindle: http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/7864/#108038

NetFrontLinux - the next major cellphone OS?: http://www.palminfocenter.com/comments/8060/#111823

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
cervezas @ 4/9/2006 12:12:09 PM # Q
any solution that is not a turkey solution from a single provider is "cobbled together".

Perhaps, but getting back to the point which you are now back-tracking from, it's not this that will account for Microsoft push being dominant, it's Microsoft's marketing muscle. Muscle that Palm does not suddenly have simply by licensing Good's solution and including it in ROM.

Fortunately for Funambol (and Palm) their product doesn't have to "dominate" to be profitable. Some companies need more than just email pushed. Some are smart enough to realize that TCO has more to do with long-term maintainance and administration of a mobile deployment than the time it takes to install the software. Can Microsoft's solution push backend SQL Server data changes out to custom software running on the mobile clients? Can it update the software on the device to a new version? Can it push out firmware updates? Can an admin remotely delete sensitive data on a lost device with Microsoft push? No. So a company that needs these features will have to deploy a 3rd party solution anyway. Microsoft isn't innovating fast enough to dispense with 3rd party software "cobbling" so the issue is irrelevant in many cases.

And sorry to hurt your feelings, but several of the homemade, garage-coded "push" email solutions for PalmOS are by definition amateurish compared to a Microsoft-sponsored solution that integrates seamlessly with Microsoft Exchange.

You're changing the subject. I was talking about Funambol.


David Beers
Pikesoft Mobile Computing
Software Everywhere blog
www.pikesoft.com/blog

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/9/2006 12:55:39 PM # Q
Perhaps, but getting back to the point which you are now back-tracking from, it's not this that will account for Microsoft push being dominant, it's Microsoft's marketing muscle. Muscle that Palm does not suddenly have simply by licensing Good's solution and including it in ROM.

Having not used Microsoft's push email solution I can't comment on how good it is. The only "back-tracking" going on is when the lumberjacks party on your a$$ in the woods, Beersy. Microsoft could very well have the best technology, but the bottom line is that Microsoft does need the best technology to win. Your irrational hatred of Microsoft has blinded you to the possibility that they have the ability to produce code as good as - if not better than - the underdog companies you champion. Microsoft haters/Apple Cultists/Linux Fanboys like you are a tiresome bore.

Had Palm simply made Good Technology's solution a standard component of their devices 3 years ago they may have been able to achieve the critical mass of users needed to withstand the onslaught of Blackberry and Microsoft. Now it's too late for Palm to try to compete.

Fortunately for Funambol (and Palm) their product doesn't have to "dominate" to be profitable. Some companies need more than just email pushed. Some are smart enough to realize that TCO has more to do with long-term maintainance and administration of a mobile deployment than the time it takes to install the software. Can Microsoft's solution push backend SQL Server data changes out to custom software running on the mobile clients? Can it update the software on the device to a new version? Can it push out firmware updates? Can an admin remotely delete sensitive data on a lost device with Microsoft push? No. So a company that needs these features will have to deploy a 3rd party solution anyway. Microsoft isn't innovating fast enough to dispense with 3rd party software "cobbling" so the issue is irrelevant in many cases.

Are you sure that Microsoft won't be able accomplish any of the things you mentioned? Do you really believe remote deletion of devices won't be part of Microsoft's package? Or are you spreading your usual anti-Microsoft FUD? And what percent of companies do you think will be willing to actually PAY for features beyond what Microsoft offers? 25%? 10%? 5%? 1%? 0.0001%? The competition will be fighting over the tiny scraps that fall from Microsoft's + RIM's table. Not a good business model. Dreamers like you fail to understand that despite being able to attract VC from delusional investors, without a realistic business model that takes into account the harsh realities of competition from the bigger dogs, even companies with decent products fail. See Tapwave, AlphaSmart and HandEra for examples to help edumacate you, Bubba.

>>>And sorry to hurt your feelings, but several of the homemade, garage-coded "push" email solutions for PalmOS are by definition amateurish compared to a Microsoft-sponsored solution that integrates seamlessly with Microsoft Exchange.

You're changing the subject. I was talking about Funambol.

Who cares? Good Technology and Seven have been touted as the next big thing for YEARS and where are they today? Will Good even still be in business next year? Keep dreaming, Beersy. Microsoft wins again:

- Desktop OS
- Word processor
- Email app
- PIM app
- Spreadsheet
- Presentation app
- Project planner
- Mobile OS
- Internet browser
- Database app
- Financial planning app (tie with Quicken)
- etc., etc.

Resistance is futile. Join The Collective. We are The Borg.


TVoR


P.S. If you're going to keep trying to debate here I would suggest you get help. It's almost painful seeing you get your a$$ kicked daily.

Looks like Beersy is full of sh!t (as usual)...
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/9/2006 1:58:57 PM # Q
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsmobile/business/5/default.mspx

http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/exchange/2003/sp2mobility.mspx

http://www.microsoft.com/exchange/evaluation/bettertogether/bt_mobile.mspx


"Remote Wipe
Remote wipe is a new feature added in SP2 that enables administrators and help desk professionals to erase sensitive data from a lost or stolen mobile device. After the remote wipe has been completed, the administrator will receive acknowledgement that device has been wiped.

This feature is enabled via a Web application that is restricted to Exchange Administrators by default. Other individuals can be added as necessary. This delegation model is useful in that it allows administrators to delegate the remote wipe operation to the help desk, thus reducing the elapsed time and operational costs."

Ooops!

Keep it coming, Beersy. You're a source of endless amusement for us all, much as Bozo The Clown was "back in the day".

Take care.

TVoR


RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
Simony @ 4/9/2006 2:24:25 PM # Q
^ Gekko's immortal phrase 'you're a hack and shill' comes to mind, doesn't it?

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
AdamaDBrown @ 4/9/2006 2:57:09 PM # Q
Can an admin remotely delete sensitive data on a lost device with Microsoft push?

Actually, the answer to that is yes. The MSFP includes the ability to remote wipe lost devices. I'm not sure about the other things you listed.

RE: Some interesting numbers on Treo sales...
AdamaDBrown @ 4/9/2006 3:03:43 PM # Q
Whoops--replied before I saw TVOR's addition.

To all the dumba$$ Palm Apologists (you know who you are):
The_Voice_of_Reason @ 4/9/2006 6:20:31 PM # Q
Gekko's immortal phrase 'you're a hack and shill' comes to mind, doesn't it?

Since the arrow in your previous post was pointing to YOUR name, I would have to agree. You and Dr Opinion/Jeff Kirvin are two of the most pathetic hacks/shills posting to PDA sites these days. Pity you both lack the intelligence to be capable of formulating cogent arguments to support your (flimsy) positions.

I've tried to be nice to you in the past because it was evident that you didn't have the mental abilities to debate here, Simony. Don't force me to stop playing Ms. Nice Girl... Remember what happened to Jeff Kirvin? It wasn't pretty.


TVoR

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