Rumor: More Evidence for the Tungsten X and Zire 22

New evidence has been posted regarding the Palm Tungsten X and Zire 22. Signs of the new devices were found within the recently pulled release of the Palm Desktop v4.2.

Rumor: Palm Tungsten XXAccording to a posting at Tamspalm, there are references to the Tungsten X and Zire 22 within the Palm Desktop v4.2 for Windows. Shortly after Palm released the Palm Desktop update it was pulled and rereleased as the Palm Desktop v4.1.4E.

According to Tamspalm, the release contained two files: TX.html and Z22.html. These files contained information on how to locate the reset pin for the two devices and includes images of the backsides of the two models.

Tungsten X
The Tungsten X will run Palm OS Garnet v5.4.9. It will have a 312MHz XScale processor, a 320x480 pixel display, 128MB of non-volitile memory, 802.11b WiFi, Bluetooth 1.2 and an SDIO expansion slot. It will have a $299 USD MSRP.

PalmInfocenter's source claims the Tungsten X may come with a digital camera. It is possible that Palm will release a version without a camera as well.

Zire 22
The Zire 22 will have a 160x160 pixel color screen, 32MB of RAM and no SD slot. It will retail for $99. This will be the first color handheld released under the $100 mark.

The rumored release date for both devices is October 11th.

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Voice Recorder

flevy @ 9/19/2005 4:12:57 PM # Q
The first rumors had the Tungsten X having a voice recorder as well as a camera. Are you saying that the voice recorder is now off the table?

RE: Voice Recorder
InsGuy @ 9/19/2005 4:20:44 PM # Q
That sounds about right for Palm. *^$#@^$%!!!

All good things...
RE: Voice Recorder
AdamaDBrown @ 9/19/2005 4:53:43 PM # Q
Can't say I'm surprised. Palm doesn't seem to view the VR as an important feature, and a camera on a business model is a non-starter.

RE: Voice Recorder
userwaldo @ 9/19/2005 5:00:13 PM # Q
BT v1.2. Maybe we'll see BT Audio suport now.

And I'm still not convinced that the mini-usb isn't the way to go for the connector. I wouldn't be suprized if they end up changing the connector in a year or 2 because it can't do Audio and Video. Oh and by the way has anywone see any hardware for the special capbilites that the new connect is suppose to suport?

The price does sound pretty reasonable for the first time in a long time.

RE: Voice Recorder
palmato @ 9/19/2005 5:09:35 PM # Q
Down at someone who claims to have a T(X+) in his hands, started a thread and is answering questions. Since Friday.

Bottom line: no voice recorder, no vibrating alarms, no internal drive. But the storage heap is 114MB, which would make this the first Palm(one) pda to break the 64M barrier.
Other imprtant details:
Garnet 5.4.9, Fat32 (large SD support), wlan and BT

This is the thread link:
viel Spass ;-)

Moreover: giving credit where it's due...
The info on the palm desktop program having pictures of the Tx and zire, was first reported on the forums on September 5. The guy at tamspalm should have given due credit.

Waiting for a TT successor

RE: Voice Recorder
sr4 @ 9/19/2005 5:10:57 PM # Q
While Palm appears to be reducing their price to match the value of their devices, WM devices add features to justify their higher prices, such as the new VGA Acer n311, which is smaller than the Palm m505, with VGA, WIFI, bluetooth 1.2, USB host, SDIO, 400Mhz processor, 64Mb ram and 128Mb ROM, WM5.

I expect it to sell for >$300 (but then its worth it).


RE: Voice Recorder
neuron @ 9/19/2005 5:24:34 PM # Q
Of course it is more than $300 (x30 without VGA was $399.00), I am afaid it will be more than $400, so that it is not in the same level as TX.

RE: Voice Recorder
AdamaDBrown @ 9/19/2005 5:36:38 PM # Q
A little correction: the X30 never sold for $399. SRP at launch was $349 for the highest end model, $249 for the mid-range, and the "going rate" for Dell's sales was $270/$235.

Two versions?
hkklife @ 9/19/2005 5:36:59 PM # Q
I have been maintaining for the longest time that Palm should tidy up their line and offer about four "core" models @ retail. Then they should have one or two "special editions" in black casings that add *SOMETHING* extra (under the hood, not just cosmetic fluff)---more RAM, faster CPU at the expense of battery life, a voice recorder...just something to differentiate them from the meat'n potatoes models and stir up some interest.

Another example would be for next spring having an 8gb LifeDrive with a larger HD & more RAM cache when the 6gb LD2 is on store shelves. Or like PIC's article says, a T7 with or without a camera like they did the Treo 600s.

The limited models could be Palm webstore-only and have a nice markup from the standard models---kinda like how some carriers & resellers have done with the black & silver RAZR cell phones.

I'd rather see $ put into this than (pick any number of the following) gimmicks/scams: Palm Press, Palm retail stores, Palm Pays Back, Michael Jordan & Claudia Schiffer endorsements, etc etc.

RE: Voice Recorder
twrock @ 9/19/2005 6:09:52 PM # Q
WM devices add features to justify their higher prices....

I've long lusted after any number of WM devices. But every single one of them is missing one critical feature: the Palm OS. Now if they could just add that....

The TX looks like my next device, even with the "missing features." No camera is expected in the Tungsten line. But no VR is a bummer. No charging light and vibrating alarm is maddening! Even my cheapy cell phone has vibrating alarm and a charging light.

I'm still waiting for the mythical "color HandEra."

RE: Voice Recorder
tthiel @ 9/19/2005 7:27:51 PM # Q
"While Palm appears to be reducing their price to match the value of their devices, WM devices add features to justify their higher prices, such as the new VGA Acer n311, which is smaller than the Palm m505, with VGA, WIFI, bluetooth 1.2, USB host, SDIO, 400Mhz processor, 64Mb ram and 128Mb ROM, WM5."

First we don't know that the new Palm will be $299. Secondly you are obviously out of touch with Pocket PC prices if you think they are higher.

RE: Voice Recorder
tthiel @ 9/19/2005 7:34:19 PM # Q
"Down at someone who claims to have a T(X+) in his hands, started a thread and is answering questions. Since Friday."

This website is in German...duh. Babelfish isn't working with it.

RE: Voice Recorder
sr4 @ 9/19/2005 7:36:22 PM # Q

I know about Dell, but wireless PDA's command higher prices, and the ASP's for PPC's are traditionally higher. If you don't believe me google a bit.


RE: Voice Recorder
sr4 @ 9/19/2005 7:41:32 PM # Q
"Down at someone who claims to have a T(X+) in his hands, started a thread and is answering questions. Since Friday."

This website is in German...duh. Babelfish isn't working with it.

For your delectation.


RE: Voice Recorder
AdamaDBrown @ 9/19/2005 9:23:50 PM # Q
I've long lusted after any number of WM devices. But every single one of them is missing one critical feature: the Palm OS. Now if they could just add that....

Given the number of Palm users I've seen say this same thing, I'm shocked that nobody has yet produced a UI replacement for PPC that mimics Palm.

RE: Voice Recorder
twizza @ 9/19/2005 11:47:08 PM # Q
You know Adama, that is a really, really good question. Heck, the ZZTechs guys could probably have a field day with a shell replacement that mimics the PalmOS. Whew...almost like PPCs for a sec there ;)
RE: Voice Recorder
ashirusnw @ 9/21/2005 9:30:32 AM # Q
"new VGA Acer n311, which is smaller than the Palm m505, with VGA, WIFI, bluetooth 1.2, USB host, SDIO, 400Mhz processor, 64Mb ram and 128Mb ROM, WM5."

yes but its thicker than the m505 1.4cm vs. 1.1cm. Big difference as the width is what you feel in your pocket.

Waiting for the day Palm makes 1.1cm-thick devices again. I just bought a E2 which I assumed was the same thickness as my old Tungsten E (1.3cm) turns out its 1.5cm which makes a mockery of the whole idea of the V/Vx/m5xx/E range - i.e. it should be THIN.


RE: Voice Recorder
sr4 @ 9/21/2005 10:24:54 AM # Q
The Palm M505 was thicker than you thought.

NC311........ 110mm x 70mm x 13.7mm
Tungsten T5 121mm x 78mm x 15.0mm
Palm M505...114mm x 77mm x 12.7mm

With only a 1 mm difference, the real difference is only 8%, vs your numbers, which place it at 27% thicker. Ironically I was able to confirm the numbers from the Palm site only because I can open downloaded PDF's directly on my pocketpc, which you would not be able to on Palm handhelds (besides stolen software of course).


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Almost official

lvoky @ 9/19/2005 7:28:49 PM # Q
These two rumored devices are almost official now. The press release will be everywhere around tomorrow I think, but Palm today announced the end of the production of Tungsten|T5 and Zire 31. So its obvious there must be some followers going onto the market in next few weeks.
Reply to this comment

Tungsten X GREAT but a LITTLE LATE!!!

jlbunting @ 9/19/2005 7:37:44 PM # Q
The Tungsten X sounds like the perfect handheld for the year 2001 but not for 2005! I am sorry but just can't believe how slow Palm is on getting this "dream" handheld to market. For years we have all wanted a PDA like the T|3 but with WiFi and more Memory. Now we get it and its like 100 years later. I like Palm and have been using them for years, owned on of the first Color Sony Clie 710. But Why are they so SLOW to respond to market demand. We should be seeing OLED, OS6, BT2.0, WIFi a,b,g and Like 1GB memory with 600 mzh. Just look at the evil PPC.. now they are inovative with hardware but their OS is total crap!

RE: Tungsten X GREAT but a LITTLE LATE!!!
twizza @ 9/19/2005 7:49:25 PM # Q
Innovative isnt the word that you want to use. Innovative would denote that they are not only forward thinking, but doing it in a way that is acceptable to the most amount of people; if you will progress and execution. By your own post, you state that the OS isnt good, therefore they are not innovative, but forward thinking towards hardware. Innovative hardware would be faster, smaller, and something else that hasnt been done before.

Concerning Th TXX rumored device; it would be innovation if in the majority of users, they have a better user experience than similarly equipped items that have come out before. Like apple with iPod, its only innovative when someone did it before, but you do it better.

RE: Tungsten X GREAT but a LITTLE LATE!!!
jlbunting @ 9/19/2005 7:54:57 PM # Q
OK, I concede I used the wrong word "innovative" to describe PPC. PPC is flavorful. They were the first to combine BT and WiFi. It just seems hardware wise they have left PalmOS handhelds in the dust, especially since the death of the Clie. I have a T|3 which I use constantly. I love the PalmOS but its driving me nuts seeing just a reincarnation of the T|3 over and over again. I want to be impressed with a real PDA for 2005 not 2001.

RE: Tungsten X GREAT but a LITTLE LATE!!!
twizza @ 9/19/2005 11:43:33 PM # Q
Sorry to disappoint, but PDAs as a whole are going the way of connected tablets. The revolution in PDAs wont come until screens go OLED and batteries get more power for more time.

But seriously, the Treo lineup is as close to a revolution in innovatoin PDAs have seen in a while. Its not by any means perfect, just an all around good execution that none of its competitors have gotten right. One cannot knock that. In fact, Palm probably should be applauded for not messing up the Treo with the 650 (no comment on what I think of a WM Treo).

RE: Tungsten X GREAT but a LITTLE LATE!!!
LiveFaith @ 9/20/2005 1:59:16 PM # Q

Man, I was just thinking nearly the same thing. This thing would have been a yawner last year when the T5 disaster was released. Twizza's right about connected devices, but boy Palm must have relegated about 3 fresh out of college engineers to refresh the T|E again and not do anything crazy.

I can understand sticking with a successful form factor, but dropping IMPORTANT features that have already been developed and tested boggles my mind. I'm not even talking WiFi g or OLED here. Just vibralarms and charging/alarm LEDs and the VR. Unbelievable to me and this aint no RAZR thin form factor that has kept them from benig able to pack these in.

Don't get me wrong WiFi + BT is better late (real late) than never on a decent sized Palm, and I'm grateful. But the incompetence of throwing away these features tells me that Palm has given up on the PDA and is doin little more than miling what they veiw as the last remaining dollars out before their done away with.

I hope that my T3 will hold out until 2014. This is sad, unless a worthy flagship is in the wings? Just saddened for another season.


Pat Horne;

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The Turtle @ 9/19/2005 7:45:00 PM # Q

I thought this would have voice memo!! Forget about a stupid camera, i have enough of those!!

Oh well, i wasn't really holding my breath anyway.

Plus, it still has these problems:
1. Home is only on a button
2. Garnet 5.4.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999
3. 312 Mhz??

I may still get one of these though, because i can still use one of those stand-alone digital recorders. I also like the way it looks and the built in Wi-Fi.

But, i already carry a cell phone and PDA. I would prefer that my PDA has voice memo.

Still waiting for Cobalt...Garnet 5.99999999999999999999999 will not cut it in 2006.

RE: No...Voice...MEMO?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?
joad @ 9/19/2005 8:14:38 PM # Q
Palm is just trying to save us all some hard-earned cash by putting out stuff that isn't much of an upgrade.

Give them a break - I was tired of upgrading twice a year anyhow, and with the snail's pace of marginally upgraded handhelds it means the 3-year old PDAs aren't at all obsolete.

Palm - if it works, it'll work (for now) .

RE: No...Voice...MEMO?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?
ozz @ 9/20/2005 10:16:40 AM # Q
Isn't there a hack or software that will emulate a voice recorder that could be added to the TX? I think I read about one somewhere????
RE: No...Voice...MEMO?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?
hkklife @ 9/20/2005 10:19:31 AM # Q
Without a mic (and adjacent mic cutout built into the casing) onboard, what'd be the use?

I am sure you could do an SDIO mic or USB interface mic via the Athena connector but what'd be the point in a kludge like that?

Remember, as Kirvin says, VR isn't that important on a new Palm device as most new cell phones & some MP3 players have that feature built in!

I still cannot fathom how they saw fit to put a voice recorder in the Zire 72 but not in any Tungsten released in the past two years.

RE: No...Voice...MEMO?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?
twizza @ 9/20/2005 10:36:15 AM # Q
The 72 had a video recorder, it needed a mic.
RE: No...Voice...MEMO?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?
hkklife @ 9/20/2005 11:20:58 AM # Q
Sorry Twizza, I have a Zire 72 sitting in my desk drawer at home and it most certainly has a voice recorder as well as audio AND video capture. It has a side VR button very similar to the LifeDrive's as well as a mic on the back panel.
From Ryan's PIC review of the 72:

The Zire 72 has a rear mounted speaker in the metal mesh below the camera lens. The speaker is quite loud and mp3's and voice memos sound very clear, though most will opt for using headphones (not included) for listening to music. For listening to music files, the Zire 72 ships with the RealOne player. The microphone is also hidden behind the rear grill, which is used for the voice and movie recorder."

RE: No...Voice...MEMO?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?
twrock @ 9/20/2005 12:40:24 PM # Q
hkklife, I think twizza meant SINCE it had a video recorder, SO it needed a mic. I don't think he was suggesting it didn't have one, just that there is a special reason why it would have one vs. the Tungsten line.

I'm still waiting for the mythical "color HandEra."
RE: No...Voice...MEMO?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?
twizza @ 9/20/2005 1:00:29 PM # Q
twrock is right. the z72 needed a mic since it had a vr. the tungsten line doesnt have a cam, and doesnt 'need' a mic. though some might argue otherwise on both counts.
RE: No...Voice...MEMO?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?
hkklife @ 9/20/2005 2:55:16 PM # Q
Ok, thanks for clearing up that one, twrock. Twizza, I figured your knew yer PDAs better than that ;-)

But remember---no one REALLY needs a VR in their PDA as that functionality is built into most modern cell phones & many MP3 players! ;-)

Reply to this comment

where's the update for the tungsten C?

drw @ 9/20/2005 1:20:38 AM # Q
How long must I wait for the update to the tungsten c? I want a full featured bluetooth plus wifi pda with a thumbpad. Handspring already did the test with the treo 180 and 180g models and guess what? USERS PREFERRED THE THUMBPAD 180 OVER THE 180g GRAFFITI MODEL. I really liked my treo 300 till the hinge broke. The treo 6xx series thumbpad I don't like because the buttons are too close together.

Wish I had enough money to buy the PALM company. I would go in first day and tell them exactly what to build. They wouldn't need to THINK or INNOVATE at all, only EXECUTE or be FIRED.


RE: where's the update for the tungsten C?
LiveFaith @ 9/20/2005 2:12:17 PM # Q
Dreaming seems to work better than reality since 2003:

Pat Horne;

RE: where's the update for the tungsten C?
Be_True @ 9/20/2005 11:44:22 PM # Q
Yes, I want one of those TC2's.

With 128MB memory or more,
I'd even put up with needing bigger pants pockets!


Tungsten C, Palm IIIxe, Wizard OZ-9520

"Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati"

RE: where's the update for the tungsten C?
Gekko @ 9/21/2005 12:32:12 AM # Q

it's in the landfill where your antique T/C belongs.

Reply to this comment

Sell Palm to Apple...

Manicorp @ 9/20/2005 8:36:13 AM # Q
If you want innovation, they should just sell Palm to Apple and be done with!
If apple had the hardware, they'd innovate and produce a beautiful PDA with all the bells and whistles.

I'll probably upgrade to T/X but this won't be my ideal PDA. I'm upgrading from T3 because of support for larger SD cards. I'm tired of switching card to watch movies and listen to MP3 files. I'll consider LD2 or LD3 in feature. Hopefully LD3 will strike a nice upgrade like T3 was for Tungsten line.

RE: Sell Palm to Apple...
whydidnt @ 9/20/2005 2:08:52 PM # Q
Hmm, I agree that Apple produces beautiful, easy-to-use hardware. But they would not be leaders as far as innovation is concerned. Look at the MP3 players out there that offer a lot more feature/functionality than the iPod - things like built in encoder, FM stereo, movie playback, etc. The problem is none of them have figured a way to top Apples great interface. Most POS users I know already love the interface, it's the hardware/software combo that's an issue.

I don't think Apple would help Palm innovate at all as far as features such as voice recorder/etc. are concerned.

RE: Sell Palm to Apple...
LiveFaith @ 9/20/2005 2:14:35 PM # Q
Innovate VR etc! Whaddayamean? The work was done on VR, LED, SelectButton-clock and vibralarms from 2 - 4 years ago! This is what baffles me so. They just throw this all away.

Dollar general store toys have most of this stuff and they are huge benefits on a PDA, but nope. My old Nokia sludge-phone had vibralarms and my kids battery toys have LED ... I'm bewildered.

Sorry. ... then I see the X51v is announced. Uggggggggh.

Pat Horne;

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